Emmanuel Sanders is so much better than Eric Decker

[Blue Horseshoe]

Manning's throws are worse than Brady's these days. Lots of ducks yesterday. And he is able to get many of those players lined up and plays converted because his skill guys are volumes better than Brady, always have been with the exception of 2007 when Brady had Moss and Welker and broke all the passing/points records.

 

How is that Manning's fault?  Brady's so called bad receivers are entirely the fault of those doing the drafting.

You could almost build a Pro Bowl receiving corps with the guys they have left on the board such as Antonio Brown and Vincent Jackson. 

 

http://www.bostonsuperblog.com/2014/10/new-england-patriots-continue-to-miss-on-drafting-wide-receivers-further-frustrating-tom-brady-4632

[amfootball]

How is that Manning's fault?  Brady's so called bad receivers are entirely the fault of those doing the drafting.

You could almost build a Pro Bowl receiving corps with the guys they have left on the board such as Antonio Brown and Vincent Jackson. 

 

http://www.bostonsuperblog.com/2014/10/new-england-patriots-continue-to-miss-on-drafting-wide-receivers-further-frustrating-tom-brady-4632

I agree. Bill has done him no favors at the WR position over his career other than getting Moss.

[GoPats]

I agree. Bill has done him no favors at the WR position over his career other than getting Moss.

 

It's not just the WR position. 

 

How many first round picks have the Patriots used on offense since 2001?

 

(The answer is 3. Soldier, with the 17th pick in 2011; Maroney, with the 21st pick in 2006; and Mankins, with the 32nd pick in 2005). 

 

The only year they loaded up, they went 16-0. 

[amfootball]

It's not just the WR position. 

 

How many first round picks have the Patriots used on offense since 2001?

 

(The answer is 3. Soldier, with the 17th pick in 2011; Maroney, with the 21st pick in 2006; and Mankins, with the 32nd pick in 2005). 

 

The only year they loaded up, they went 16-0. 

I think it is all coming to head to be honest. Brady is finally fed up with the lack of talent and I think Bill may want to move on with Jimmy as soon as next season. I really hope not but at this point, I don't blame Brady if he wants better protection and weapons at age 37. And in a way, I don't blame Bill if he feels like he wants to begin with the new kid. But you know if he forces Brady out and Jimmy is not successful, it will cost him his job especially if Brady goes on to have success with another team.

[GoPats]

I think it is all coming to head to be honest. Brady is finally fed up with the lack of talent and I think Bill may want to move on with Jimmy as soon as next season. I really hope not but at this point, I don't blame Brady if he wants better protection and weapons at age 37. And in a way, I don't blame Bill if he feels like he wants to begin with the new kid. But you know if he forces Brady out and Jimmy is not successful, it will cost him his job especially if Brady goes on to have success with another team.

 

The old phrase "winning cures everything" comes to mind. If the Patriots can be competitive and make a deep playoff run, I don't think Brady will go anywhere. If they finish 10-6 and go one-and-done or don't win the division (unlikely), then maybe that's coming. Hard to say. 

[amfootball]

The old phrase "winning cures everything" comes to mind. If the Patriots can be competitive and make a deep playoff run, I don't think Brady will go anywhere. If they finish 10-6 and go one-and-done or don't win the division (unlikely), then maybe that's coming. Hard to say. 

I don't think Bill would be able to move on from Brady if the team wins the division and is back in the playoffs. The uproar would be deafening. I am really interested to see how they perform this week which is more like a normal week vs last's week media storm. If they look similar to the first four weeks vs how they looked vs Cincy then I think it could be an up and down season. I am most focused on the Oline who handled a very good Bengals Dline well. They should be able to do the same vs the Bills I hope.

[GoPats]

I don't think Bill would be able to move on from Brady if the team wins the division and is back in the playoffs. The uproar would be deafening. I am really interested to see how they perform this week which is more like a normal week vs last's week media storm. If they look similar to the first four weeks vs how they looked vs Cincy then I think it could be an up and down season. I am most focused on the Oline who handled a very good Bengals Dline well. They should be able to do the same vs the Bills I hope.

 

They've had some early-season struggles, especially on the road, in some recent years. Buffalo has a very good pass rush so this will be a test for that line. 

[dgambill]

I agree. Bill has done him no favors at the WR position over his career other than getting Moss.

I agree....we talked about their offense and how that could be the issue as well. I mean Amendola (when healthy) was a very good receiver in STL, Lloyd was really good before coming and has show flashes of brillance in SF too. Chad Johnson was very good before getting there. He has brought in some very good players...for whatever reason they haven't picked up the offense or clicked with Brady....so I don't think he has been a terrible judge of talent...just unlucky or more likely imo that Mcdaniels hasn't done a great job of getting Brady and his receivers on the same page.

[oldunclemark]

Once they start playing weaker teams..

Sanders' numbers are going to jump up and stand out

[LordHelpOurColts]

Same as Sanders was in Pitt. How about that.

 

 

Sanders was playing third fiddle to Mike Wallace at first, and then Antonio Brown after Wallace left. Pretty elementary.

[LordHelpOurColts]

You are making my point. Sanders is a guy for between the 20's. He helps you get in the red zone. Decker scored double digit TDs in each of his two seasons with Denver. He was a guy Manning would go to in the red zone and he also had the ability to catch the ball and take it to the house as well. Both are great for different reasons. If I had to choose, I would take the guy that scores TDs but that is just me.

 

In terms of the Denver offense, I would put Julius Thomas ahead of Sanders. He has 7 TDs so far and 20 catches and averaging 11.3 per catch. He has been their most valuable player on O so far.

 

 

So in your world, Jerricho Cotchery and Marvin Jones were both top 10 WR's last year, right?

[sweetsurrender]

Sanders was playing third fiddle to Mike Wallace at first, and then Antonio Brown after Wallace left. Pretty elementary.

He came onto the Broncs as their third fiddle as well to the Thomas' and even Welker for that matter. Denver has a better role for him than Pitt had and also a much better line to protect Manning then Ben had.

[sweetsurrender]

So in your world, Jerricho Cotchery and Marvin Jones were both top 10 WR's last year, right?

What?

[LordHelpOurColts]

What?

 

Your argument is TD's. And I believe that is an asinine argument because both Cotchery and Jones had double digit TD's last year....but that doesn't make them amongst the best WR's in the league.

[sweetsurrender]

Your argument is TD's. And I believe that is an asinine argument because both Cotchery and Jones had double digit TD's last year....but that doesn't make them amongst the best WR's in the league.

Huh? Did you watch Eric Decker at all the past two seasons? He caught 85 and 87 balls for 1,064 and 1,288 AND had 11 and 13 TDs those two years. He caught a lot of balls between the 20s AND scored TDs. He was the better player for Denver by a lot. Sanders may have more receptions and yards at year end but doubt he comes anywhere close to double digit TDs this year. So yeah, I will take the guy with the catches, yards AND TDs over the guy with just catches and yards. And so would every GM and coach in the NFL.

[amfootball]

Huh? Did you watch Eric Decker at all the past two seasons? He caught 85 and 87 balls for 1,064 and 1,288 AND had 11 and 13 TDs those two years. He caught a lot of balls between the 20s AND scored TDs. He was the better player for Denver by a lot. Sanders may have more receptions and yards at year end but doubt he comes anywhere close to double digit TDs this year. So yeah, I will take the guy with the catches, yards AND TDs over the guy with just catches and yards. And so would every GM and coach in the NFL.

It is no use, they are convinced Sanders is the second coming of Rice with zero TDs ...

[chad72]

It is no use, they are convinced Sanders is the second coming of Rice with zero TDs ...

 

True dat.

 

Player 1 - Yards, catches AND TDs

 

Player 2 - Yards, catches without much TDs but does it with more speed

 

 

Bottom line - production while playing with Peyton and Decker has plenty while comparing apples to apples which would be playing under Peyton.

 

Like I said before, Peyton is not the kind to sit back and not get Sanders involved in the red zone, so the TDs will happen sooner or later, I feel. However, Decker was a more polished route runner than Sanders when Peyton got there. So, the red zone ability baseline was higher with Decker when Peyton got there.

[Dustin]

TDs are pretty meaningless for evaluating players. They're a matter of opportunity.

[Dustin]

TY has caught a pass at the one-inch line (which could have been called a TD if reviewed) had another TD called back by penalty, had a walk in TD but Luck threw it at his feet, and had another TD called back because he was barely grazed before he got to the endzone.

That would give him 5 TDs. He currently has 1. Is he a worse player because of these factors that worked against him?

[Narcosys]

No i am not.

Peyton has 12 TDs in 4 games. 48 TDs for 16 games. He doesn't need Decker to score TDs.

But if he doesn't have Sanders to move the chain, there is no TDs, heck there is not even a field goal.

So Julius and demaryius can't move the chains? Welker either?

[amfootball]

TDs are pretty meaningless for evaluating players. They're a matter of opportunity.

Without Gronk in the line up last year the Pats were horrible in red zone efficiency. When he came back they went to number one. There are players built for the red zone and they are key to any offense.

[sweetsurrender]

TY has caught a pass at the one-inch line (which could have been called a TD if reviewed) had another TD called back by penalty, had a walk in TD but Luck threw it at his feet, and had another TD called back because he was barely grazed before he got to the endzone.

That would give him 5 TDs. He currently has 1. Is he a worse player because of these factors that worked against him?

No ifs in football. Either you score or you don't. There are great players on every offense but you need the guys that can get the ball in the end zone. Not every player has the skill set to be a red zone target. 

[YOUR GM]

Huh? Did you watch Eric Decker at all the past two seasons? He caught 85 and 87 balls for 1,064 and 1,288 AND had 11 and 13 TDs those two years. He caught a lot of balls between the 20s AND scored TDs. He was the better player for Denver by a lot. Sanders may have more receptions and yards at year end but doubt he comes anywhere close to double digit TDs this year. So yeah, I will take the guy with the catches, yards AND TDs over the guy with just catches and yards. And so would every GM and coach in the NFL.

 

Eric Decker had 1 touchdown after 4 weeks of each season in both 12' and 13'... He had 4 touchdowns in week 12 against KC last season. What's to stop Sanders from having a similar game to boost his TD totals? He certainly has the QB to make it possible

[sweetsurrender]

Eric Decker had 1 touchdown after 4 weeks of each season in both 12' and 13'... He had 4 touchdowns in week 12 against KC last season. What's to stop Sanders from having a similar game to boost his TD totals? He certainly has the QB to make it possible

Sure, he might but right now Manning is going to the Thomas' for scores. Plus the discussion was IS Sanders better than Decker. He is certainly having a great year and he could end up with TDs. We can evaluate again but right now I still say they are two totally different receivers which they are and bring different things to the table. This idea that Sanders is better is silly. He is playing a different role than Decker.

[chad72]

Sure, he might but right now Manning is going to the Thomas' for scores. Plus the discussion was IS Sanders better than Decker. He is certainly having a great year and he could end up with TDs. We can evaluate again but right now I still say they are two totally different receivers which they are and bring different things to the table. This idea that Sanders is better is silly. He is playing a different role than Decker.

 

Let me paraphrase that. This idea that Sanders is SO MUCH better is silly.

 

Decker happened to be another big bodied wide out just like DT and JT that they had, too much of the same kind. So, Elway decided that he needs to mix size with speed and that is exactly what he got with Sanders and Peyton showed he could use speed just as well as he can use size. It is not that hard to understand.

 

Plus, as far as the Seahawks are concerned, if people did not notice, their push in the middle is not the same this year thus reducing the QB tendencies to side step them to get in the path of their DEs thus reducing their sack count. What they lost in inside push for pass D, they gained in run D with Kevin Williams, IMO and the numbers reflect that exactly, whether they play the Broncos or the Redskins. That fact should not be lost while accounting for why Peyton put up better numbers on pass O against the Seahawks plus the fact the health on D/quality on D was better for the Broncos than the SB making for a closer fight.

[Shane Bond]

So Julius and demaryius can't move the chains? Welker either?

Topic is with Decker and Sanders.

 

Now that you have brought up others, lets talk.

 

DT is error prone. He can be anybody he wants to be. JT is capable of bad route running.

 

Watch the Seattle game.

[krunk]

The funny thing is I repeated over and over again during the off season that the Colts should pick up Emmanuel Sanders.  Every time I said it I kept hearing things like "Meh" and "He's just average".  They kept clamoring for Hakeem Nicks who I do like, but it seems that the better and more explosive choice really was Emmanuel Sanders. You think our offense is good now, imagine what it would look like with Sanders, Hilton, Wayne, Moncrief, Fleener, Allen.  I don't think you could stop us from putting up 40 points a game with that lineup.  

[amfootball]

Let me paraphrase that. This idea that Sanders is SO MUCH better is silly.

 

Decker happened to be another big bodied wide out just like DT and JT that they had, too much of the same kind. So, Elway decided that he needs to mix size with speed and that is exactly what he got with Sanders and Peyton showed he could use speed just as well as he can use size. It is not that hard to understand.

 

Plus, as far as the Seahawks are concerned, if people did not notice, their push in the middle is not the same this year thus reducing the QB tendencies to side step them to get in the path of their DEs thus reducing their sack count. What they lost in inside push for pass D, they gained in run D with Kevin Williams, IMO and the numbers reflect that exactly, whether they play the Broncos or the Redskins. That fact should not be lost while accounting for why Peyton put up better numbers on pass O against the Seahawks plus the fact the health on D/quality on D was better for the Broncos than the SB making for a closer fight.

Your last paragraph is great analysis. Goes to show that even a great secondary will not look great if the Dline is not pressuring the QB. It all starts up front.

[amfootball]

Topic is with Decker and Sanders.

 

Now that you have brought up others, lets talk.

 

DT is error prone. He can be anybody he wants to be. JT is capable of bad route running.

 

Watch the Seattle game.

Are you seriously now trying to say Sanders is better than the Thomas'?

 

Do you also believe Welker was better than Moss in 2007 because he had more catches than him between the 20s?

[Shane Bond]

Are you seriously now trying to say Sanders is better than the Thomas'?

 

Do you also believe Welker was better than Moss in 2007 because he had more catches than him between the 20s?

I dont want to get into who is the best WR for Denver.

 

We will stick to Decker and Sanders. 

 

However, i will say this. If i need a clutch 3rd down conversion i will go only to 2 players. I said this before Seattle game. It will be Sanders and Tamme.

[amfootball]

I dont want to get into who is the best WR for Denver.

 

We will stick to Decker and Sanders. 

 

However, i will say this. If i need a clutch 3rd down conversion i will go only to 2 players. I said this before Seattle game. It will be Sanders and Tamme.

What does your illustration have to do with Decker and Sanders?

[Shane Bond]

What does your illustration have to do with Decker and Sanders?

It means Decker is not a clutch catcher as Sanders.

[Narcosys]

Topic is with Decker and Sanders.

Now that you have brought up others, lets talk.

DT is error prone. He can be anybody he wants to be. JT is capable of bad route running.

Watch the Seattle game.

I know. But they were basically acting like sanders was the only person who could move the chains.

[amfootball]

It means Decker is not a clutch catcher as Sanders.

What are you basing that on exactly?

[YOUR GM]

Peyton Manning apparently doesn't like Sanders today. The only time he throws to him is when he's in traffic, but when he's wide open he doesn't even look his way. He's taken some hits today. Lucky to still be in the game

[Shane Bond]

What are you basing that on exactly?

Performance on the field.

[amfootball]

Performance on the field.

The Thomas' outperformed him by a lot today. They again scored all the TDs. Even Decker had a TD today his third of the season.

[sweetsurrender]

Performance on the field.

lol. Demarius was a monster today.

[chad72]

Peyton Manning apparently doesn't like Sanders today. The only time he throws to him is when he's in traffic, but when he's wide open he doesn't even look his way. He's taken some hits today. Lucky to still be in the game

 

Peyton said something like one of his players made a joke if they were wearing leather helmets when he threw his first TD and that he did not appreciate that and to cancel that guy off your fantasy line up because he won't be getting much looks. Most people felt that jokester could be Wes Welker.

 

If that really happened today with Wes Welker and Peyton intentionally did not look someone's way because of a joke, I would be really disappointed in Peyton because he has to do everything in his power to help his team win, even if he did not like what a teammate said.

 

Here is what I am referring to:

 

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2014/10/peyton-manning-age-500-touchdowns-joke-leather-helmets

[jvan1973]

Peyton said something like one of his players made a joke if they were wearing leather helmets when he threw his first TD and that he did not appreciate that and to cancel that guy off your fantasy line up because he won't be getting much looks. Most people felt that jokester could be Wes Welker.

If that really happened today with Wes Welker and Peyton intentionally did not look someone's way because of a joke, I would be really disappointed in Peyton because he has to do everything in his power to help his team win, even if he did not like what a teammate said.

Here is what I am referring to:

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2014/10/peyton-manning-age-500-touchdowns-joke-leather-helmets

The most ridiculous thing I've heard in awhile. Peyton wouldn't change a gameplan over a joke. He and welker prank each other all the time