Gosder Cherilus signing

[BProland85]

Of all the signings we made day 1, this one is probably my least favorite. Walden was a close second. I went with Cherilus mostly because of the money we gave up. He recieved basically the same contract that LT Jermon Bushrod recieved from Chicago. And I didnt even consider Cherilus the best RT out there. That title belonged to Sebastian Vollmer to me. I hope he proves me wrong though and turns out to be a beast at RT for us.

 

Who was your least favorite signing?

 

 

[Everyone]

ask me after next season

[tydontlie]

I'm excited to see what Toler can bring as a #2 corner. I haven't seen him play yet, but hear a lot of great things. Another thing, kinda off topic, but what ever happened to Cary Williams? I haven't heard a peep about him all day.

[BProland85]

I'm excited to see what Toler can bring as a #2 corner. I haven't seen him play yet, but hear a lot of great things. Another thing, kinda off topic, but what ever happened to Cary Williams? I haven't heard a peep about him all day.

Yeah I know Grigs has kinda went with guys not many of us predicted. Not that I really wanted Cary Williams anyways. But Toler has had injury issues so Im not super stoked about him either. Would have rather had Keenan Lewis or Antoine Cason.

[tydontlie]

Yeah I know Grigs has kinda went with guys not many of us predicted. Not that I really wanted Cary Williams anyways. But Toler has had injury issues so Im not super stoked about him either. Would have rather had Keenan Lewis or Antoine Cason.

Well I hope he leaves that injury bug in AZ and plays up to his potiential with us.

[BPM_Colt]

the more I think about it, I dislike them all. We may be better, but with the money we paid, I feel like we could have gotten better. I could be wrong though. Frustrated at this point

Of all the signings we made day 1, this one is probably my least favorite. Walden was a close second. I went with Cherilus mostly because of the money we gave up. He recieved basically the same contract that LT Jermon Bushrod recieved from Chicago. And I didnt even consider Cherilus the best RT out there. That title belonged to Sebastian Vollmer to me. I hope he proves me wrong though and turns out to be a beast at RT for us.

 

Who was your least favorite signing?

[NewColtsFan]

The more I think about it,  I like each and every one of them.

 

Why?

 

Because these signings tell me Grigson was only interested in performance and not for any marquee names that attract headlines.

 

He doesn't care that the fan reaction will be mostly negative.    And neither does Irsay or Grigson.   And that's how good franchises are run.    They don't care about fan reaction, they only care about winning.   If you win,  the fans will love you and won't care that you didn't sign the sexy names.   But if you don't win....   then all Hell breaks loose.

 

So, props to Grigson/Pagano/Irsay for having a disciplined plan and sticking to it.    I'm looking forward to several more signings in the days to come....

[Gavin]

There is a reason guys like for example Vasquez was one of the sexy names in FA this year, he is one of the better Guards in the league, not the best but better then anything we have on the roster currently including Thomas, I simply think Grigson blew a big chance here, spending what sounds like a fair amount of money on what are mostly no namers, when ya got the money you cant be afraid to spend the money on a big name or two, now FA is not over so we could still make a big splash but day 1 was a huge let down, I know some are excited about Thomas (simply because he came from the Pats in my opinion, guess they dont realize he was with the Dolphins and Lions before that)but Im far from sold on him. Hoping for the best but I dont expect much from our FA pickups

[NewColtsFan]

There is a reason guys like for example Vasquez was one of the sexy names in FA this year, he is one of the better Guards in the league, not the best but better then anything we have on the roster currently including Thomas, I simply think Grigson blew a big chance here, spending what sounds like a fair amount of money on what are mostly no namers, when ya got the money you cant be afraid to spend the money on a big name or two, now FA is not over so we could still make a big splash but day 1 was a huge let down, I know some are excited about Thomas (simply because he came from the Pats in my opinion, guess they dont realize he was with the Dolphins and Lions before that)but Im far from sold on him. Hoping for the best but I dont expect much from our FA pickups

 

Given that Grigon's background is OL,  I think he knows how to scout the position.  

 

I loved Vasquez too and wanted him very much.    But, it's now my view that he viewed Levitre getting $8 Mill per year and Vasquez at nearly $6 Mill per year as too expensive for the guard position.   He thinks he can get a good enough player for a much more reasonable price (my guess is $3-4 Mill for Thomas) and that leaves Grigson more money to spend elsewhere.    I don't think Grigson will pocket that money,  he'll channel it elsewhere.   And I don't think you can ask for more than that.

 

Just my view of things....

[BPM_Colt]

I am with you on this. I understand Grigs and co run the franchise and we don't.. But I think we missed big on Vasquez

There is a reason guys like for example Vasquez was one of the sexy names in FA this year, he is one of the better Guards in the league, not the best but better then anything we have on the roster currently including Thomas, I simply think Grigson blew a big chance here, spending what sounds like a fair amount of money on what are mostly no namers, when ya got the money you cant be afraid to spend the money on a big name or two, now FA is not over so we could still make a big splash but day 1 was a huge let down, I know some are excited about Thomas (simply because he came from the Pats in my opinion, guess they dont realize he was with the Dolphins and Lions before that)but Im far from sold on him. Hoping for the best but I dont expect much from our FA pickups

[BOTT]

There is a reason guys like for example Vasquez was one of the sexy names in FA this year, he is one of the better Guards in the league, not the best but better then anything we have on the roster currently including Thomas, I simply think Grigson blew a big chance here, spending what sounds like a fair amount of money on what are mostly no namers, when ya got the money you cant be afraid to spend the money on a big name or two, now FA is not over so we could still make a big splash but day 1 was a huge let down, I know some are excited about Thomas (simply because he came from the Pats in my opinion, guess they dont realize he was with the Dolphins and Lions before that)but Im far from sold on him. Hoping for the best but I dont expect much from our FA pickups

I guess. When I first mentioned Vasquez several months ago nobody knew who the hell he was. Does anyone on this forum really know who the better player is between Vasquez and Thomas? I doubt it.

[schwamm]

Given that Grigon's background is OL, I think he knows how to scout the position.

I loved Vasquez too and wanted him very much. But, it's now my view that he viewed Levitre getting $8 Mill per year and Vasquez at nearly $6 Mill per year as too expensive for the guard position. He thinks he can get a good enough player for a much more reasonable price (my guess is $3-4 Mill for Thomas) and that leaves Grigson more money to spend elsewhere. I don't think Grigson will pocket that money, he'll channel it elsewhere. And I don't think you can ask for more than that.

Just my view of things....

I'm a fan of Thomas. I started reading about him several weeks ago when a poster threw his name out as a value prospect, and I've liked what I've read. It's just a shame to me that Ramon Foster resigned with the Steelers. I thought he could have added something special at the LG spot, too.

[NewColtsFan]

I guess. When I first mentioned Vasquez several months ago nobody knew who the heck he was. Does anyone on this forum really know who the better player is between Vasquez and Thomas? I doubt it.

 

I agree with those who think Vasquez is the better player.   I suspect Grigson thinks that too.   But at potentially double the cost?  My guess is 'no'.    At some point there's a time to factor in price.   And I suspect that Grigson thinks paying $6 Mill for Vasquez is too pricey for a guard.    So, he went to the next rung down the ladder. 

 

What can I tell you.    It's a 'salary cap'...   there are some restrictions.   

[funktacious2]

I'm a little disappointed we could not get Levitre or Vasquez, but at the end of the day they're just guards. Your team isn't going to ruin if you have an 'average' guard. Furthermore, free agency isn't over yet. Who knows, a day or so from now it may be a lot easier to rationalize not signing these guys if it meant we got some other positions filled.

[Gavin]

I agree with those who think Vasquez is the better player.   I suspect Grigson thinks that too.   But at potentially double the cost?  My guess is 'no'.    At some point there's a time to factor in price.   And I suspect that Grigson thinks paying $6 Mill for Vasquez is too pricey for a guard.    So, he went to the next rung down the ladder. 

 

What can I tell you.    It's a 'salary cap'...   there are some restrictions.   

Vasquez got 13 million in guaranteed money, we forked over 14 million to Freeney for him to play in a new scheme for 1 year, I dont think it was money, perhaps Vasquez just either was not looked at (major mistake by Grigson in my outside view looking in point of view) or we just did not offer what he wanted, it will be interesting to know the parameters of the deal

[FightLikeSin]

Vasquez got 13 million in guaranteed money, we forked over 14 million to Freeney for him to play in a new scheme for 1 year, I dont think it was money, perhaps Vasquez just either was not looked at (major mistake by Grigson in my outside view looking in point of view) or we just did not offer what he wanted, it will be interesting to know the parameters of the deal

 

The other thing to keep in mind is that PLAYERS choose where they go. Maybe he wanted to go win a Super Bowl and he thought Denver offered him enough and felt like he had a better shot/better fit there. It's not always a lack of effort on the Front Office's part. 

[Gavin]

The other thing to keep in mind is that PLAYERS choose where they go. Maybe he wanted to go win a Super Bowl and he thought Denver offered him enough and felt like he had a better shot/better fit there. It's not always a lack of effort on the Front Office's part. 

true

[Valpo2004]

I havn't read about all the financials involved with all of them, but I'm not at this moment a fan of the Cherilus signing.  Everything I've read about this guy says that he isn't much of an upgrade over Justice who we where paying 1.5 million.  Now we are giving this guy nearly 7 million a year?  

 

I don't understand why we do that when we could have probably given Vollmer a million or 2 more and had him.  

 

Maybe Grigson knows something I don't.  I sure hope so.  

[jvan1973]

Vasquez got 13 million in guaranteed money, we forked over 14 million to Freeney for him to play in a new scheme for 1 year, I dont think it was money, perhaps Vasquez just either was not looked at (major mistake by Grigson in my outside view looking in point of view) or we just did not offer what he wanted, it will be interesting to know the parameters of the deal

I'm sure the gm of an NFL team looked at him . Maybe he thinks Thomas is better. I'm guessing he knows how to evaluate oline talent

[throwing BBZ]

Cherilus has been a big disappointment his entire career. Sacks and penalties.
Locked into two guys (Castonzo) now that many consider just OK.  
 Now it is about working as a Unit. Go Colts!

[Gavin]

I'm sure the gm of an NFL team looked at him . Maybe he thinks Thomas is better. I'm guessing he knows how to evaluate oline talent

Im not taking that as a given that he knows how to evaluate talent, He has not shown to this point that he can, signing an undersized Guard to play in a Man Blocking scheme? Im trying to withhold judgement on him because were not even a full 24 hours into FA but so far he has overpaid a rotational OLB, added depth at Corner in Toler even though a #2 is what is really needed and picked up a guy who graded well but is 29 coming off of a right knee issue 

[Stewart Cole]

Based on spending money we got 3 picks whom I thought and posted in previous threads. Figured we would take 2 corners and Cherilus which still leaves us some room to grab a safety and a WR.

First pick in draft looks more like a DT but if Rams and Cowboys pasd on guard Cooper strongly think we go that route.

[Dustin]

Im not taking that as a given that he knows how to evaluate talent, He has not shown to this point that he can, signing an undersized Guard to play in a Man Blocking scheme? Im trying to withhold judgement on him because were not even a full 24 hours into FA but so far he has overpaid a rotational OLB, added depth at Corner in Toler even though a #2 is what is really needed and picked up a guy who graded well but is 29 coming off of a right knee issue

Toler is our #2.

[BOTT]

I havn't read about all the financials involved with all of them, but I'm not at this moment a fan of the Cherilus signing.  Everything I've read about this guy says that he isn't much of an upgrade over Justice who we where paying 1.5 million.  Now we are giving this guy nearly 7 million a year?  

 

I don't understand why we do that when we could have probably given Vollmer a million or 2 more and had him.  

 

Maybe Grigson knows something I don't.  I sure hope so.  

I would guess it has something to do with Vollmer having two back surgeries and not wanting to pay a RT that much money

[Gavin]

Toler is our #2.

Ouch

[Balzer40]

Im not taking that as a given that he knows how to evaluate talent, He has not shown to this point that he can, signing an undersized Guard to play in a Man Blocking scheme? Im trying to withhold judgement on him because were not even a full 24 hours into FA but so far he has overpaid a rotational OLB, added depth at Corner in Toler even though a #2 is what is really needed and picked up a guy who graded well but is 29 coming off of a right knee issue 

 

 

 

Toler was ranked ahead of DRC, Keenan Lewis, and Cary Williams in the top 100 free agents available.  Think you maybe underestimating him.

 

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/transactions/free-agents

[Balzer40]

I havn't read about all the financials involved with all of them, but I'm not at this moment a fan of the Cherilus signing.  Everything I've read about this guy says that he isn't much of an upgrade over Justice who we where paying 1.5 million.  Now we are giving this guy nearly 7 million a year?  

 

I don't understand why we do that when we could have probably given Vollmer a million or 2 more and had him.  

 

Maybe Grigson knows something I don't.  I sure hope so.  

 

 

I would guess it has something to do with Vollmer having two back surgeries and not wanting to pay a RT that much money

 

 

 

Cherilus also graded out better than Vollmer did last yr..

[Gavin]

Toler was ranked ahead of DRC, Keenan Lewis, and Cary Williams in the top 100 free agents available.  Think you maybe underestimating him.

 

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/transactions/free-agents

Yep he did but he started two games last year, the other 9 games he was in he played Nickel, I think are thinking way to highly of the guy with so few starts, Im not saying he cant be #2 material but I think the odds of him being picked on as a #2 are significantly higher, Dont wann sound so negative, Im hoping for the best, but there are better options out there then someone that we dont know can be a #2

[schwamm]

Ouch

I'd think "ouch" would be Gavin as GM...

6'-4" 305#s isn't that small. There were years when the entire Colts OLine was below the 300# mark. Thomas has a very solid rep among Pats fans, from everything I've read.

As for Toler, while I still suspect to see another CB added in the near future, I think the Colts just picked up a solid value player, and I think fans will be happy with his play. I have no issue with him teaming with Vontae, and he's a substantial improvement over anything we saw at 2 last year.

[Balzer40]

Yep he did but he started two games last year, the other 9 games he was in he played Nickel, I think are thinking way to highly of the guy with so few starts, Im not saying he cant be #2 material but I think the odds of him being picked on as a #2 are significantly higher, Dont wann sound so negative, Im hoping for the best, but there are better options out there then someone that we dont know can be a #2

 

 

 

I have seen several articles about free agency stating that Toler was one of the best corners available, especially for a press man coverage scheme, which is supposed to be his strong point. Said he's a very physical CB and one of the most under rated guys available. 

[Balzer40]

I'd think "ouch" would be Gavin as GM...

6'-4" 305#s isn't that small. There were years when the entire Colts OLine was below the 300# mark. Thomas has a very solid rep among Pats fans, from everything I've read.

As for Toler, while I still suspect to see another CB added in the near future, I think the Colts just picked up a solid value player, and I think fans will be happy with his play. I have no issue with him teaming with Vontae, and he's a substantial improvement over anything we saw at 2 last year.

 

 

I would be more worried about Thomas' size if he hadn't already proven he was very good in a man blocking scheme, which he did in Miami and NE last yr.. I also think he is bigger than his listed weight, most of the time, those listed weights are never updated since they weighed in at the combine. One of the things scouts like when he came out of college was how strong he is.

[PatMcAfeeFan]

Yep he did but he started two games last year, the other 9 games he was in he played Nickel, I think are thinking way to highly of the guy with so few starts, Im not saying he cant be #2 material but I think the odds of him being picked on as a #2 are significantly higher, Dont wann sound so negative, Im hoping for the best, but there are better options out there then someone that we dont know can be a #2

Toler is a big physical corner. I look at this as a Pagano signing. If he believes he can be a #2 and so does Grigs then I trust them.

[Gavin]

I would be more worried about Thomas' size if he hadn't already proven he was very good in a man blocking scheme, which he did in Miami and NE last yr.. I also think he is bigger than his listed weight, most of the time, those listed weights are never updated since they weighed in at the combine. One of the things scouts like when he came out of college was how strong he is.

NE was a Zone scheme

[coltsfanatic24]

Cherilus was the 2nd best RT in FA only behind Smith in Tier A this was a great signing.

[Balzer40]

NE was a Zone scheme

 

 

They switched last yr. to a power blocking scheme.

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1410041-breaking-down-the-new-england-patriots-revitalised-running-game

[NewColtsFan]

Im not taking that as a given that he knows how to evaluate talent, He has not shown to this point that he can, signing an undersized Guard to play in a Man Blocking scheme? Im trying to withhold judgement on him because were not even a full 24 hours into FA but so far he has overpaid a rotational OLB, added depth at Corner in Toler even though a #2 is what is really needed and picked up a guy who graded well but is 29 coming off of a right knee issue 

 

Holy ****.     Now you're camping out in crazy town.    And with these posts you're saying you're "trying to withhold judgement"?!?

 

That ship has sailed.     You're beginning to scare me.......