Update: Charges against Drew Ogletree dismissed with prejudice (merge). **Ogletree reinstated pg4 updated**

[Superman]

14 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Again….  It’s worth noting….   For all the regression over the course of the season, he ended ranked 24th out of 73 graded tight ends.   Top third of his class.   
 

I find the talk of him getting released over any issue other than his legal problems to be preposterous.   The argument for cutting being made by some is AO was an A student, but he slumped to being only a B Student.   Does that make any sense? 
 

The kid was mostly a wide receiver in college and put on weight to be a tight end.  He's literally learning how to be a TE in the NFL.   Playing wise, so far so good.  His legal problems are the only real problem.   

 

Yeah I don't get it either. I'm not crowning him as a potential star or anything, but he was playing reasonably well before legal stuff came up. Not setting the world on fire, but he looked like a decent option for our TE room. That doesn't guarantee him a spot on the final roster in September, but there's no reason to think that the Colts would want to move on from him before then.

[NewColtsFan]

7 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Yeah I don't get it either. I'm not crowning him as a potential star or anything, but he was playing reasonably well before legal stuff came up. Not setting the world on fire, but he looked like a decent option for our TE room. That doesn't guarantee him a spot on the final roster in September, but there's no reason to think that the Colts would want to move on from him before then.

I’m not crowning him either.   I’m only saying it’s too soon to pass judgement on the kid in a negative way based on his performance.    His performance was good.   So he’s got plenty of upside at this early stage of his career.  

If there are still legal or moral issues for Irsay, Ballard, Steichen and the NFL that’s an entirely different story.   
 

But to be top third of all tight ends in his first real year of playing I find very encouraging.   Hope he sticks.  

 

[AwesomeAustin]

1 hour ago, shasta519 said:

It’s also PFF. Two of those weeks where he  graded top 5, I don’t think he caught a pass (JAC and CLE).

 

He’s also a STer, so I wonder if these were overall grades, or just his grade as a TE. Or if that gets separated (don’t have PFF sub).
 

Noticed too that his PFF grades regressed as his ST snaps decreased. Could just be a coincidence though.

It also looks like there were three games he recorded zero snaps.  Weeks 2, 10 and 12. The last four games he played he dropped from 5th to 24th. Would have to dig in deeper to see what caused that. I have no idea if ST props overall grades. 

[compuls1v3]

8 hours ago, MikeCurtis said:

 

I have no idea what they will do with MAC

 

I was putting him in the cut category in my mock drafts. 

 

CB was giving glowing thoughts on “MOE” in the  offseason 

 

My guess is as good as yours

He's given other ppl glowing reviews, then cut them.   I won't be sad to see him go, but I won't be mad if he stays.   He's JAG to me.

[Smonroe]

Any word on Ogletree? 

 

I believe he's still on the Commissioners Exempt list, but that means he's allowed to workout and get treatment at the facility.  And they still get paid if they're under contract.

 

So I guess that means we'll know how he stands in the eyes of the Colts if he's working out there next week?

 

Of course, he may still be suspended or even cut.  

 

 

[MFT5]

On 3/5/2024 at 11:50 AM, PRnum1 said:

If she had marks on her body, he probably hit her.

 

The NFL has a code of conduct and he should be fined.

 

there are other ppl en the world that exist that also could’ve hit her. 

[NewColtsFan]

I think there news is very good for the Colts and Drew….

 

BUT….

 

The NFL reserves the right to hand down its own discipline even if Drew has been cleared by the legal system.  They could still hand down some level of suspension citing in the best interest of the League. 
 

In other words, the NFL jury is still out until they issue their decision.   

[Smonroe]

1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

I think there news is very good for the Colts and Drew….

 

BUT….

 

The NFL reserves the right to hand down its own discipline even if Drew has been cleared by the legal system.  They could still hand down some level of suspension citing in the best interest of the League. 
 

In other words, the NFL jury is still out until they issue their decision.   

 

I agree.  And I don't want to debate what he did or didn't do.  I'm just curious as to if anyone has heard anything about him.

 

The only podcasts I listen to regularly are Bowen and Chappell.  I don't think either have mentioned him.

 

But as I said, a player is allowed to work out when he's on the CE list, so we'll probably know something next week.

[MikeCurtis]

There used to be a thing called presumption of innocence.

 

Who knows what happened?  I don't

 

The legal system let him go. That's VERY important.

 

I think the Colts (and NFL) should allow a time served situation and let him compete for a spot on the roster.

 

I think he was a really good TE that was JUST starting to develop.

 

 

[Moosejawcolt]

On 3/5/2024 at 10:12 AM, adubb84 said:

Glad the Colts waited on a potential release before making a decision. Will be interesting to see what happens next. 

This could take their need to draft a TE off the board, as I think they were pretty high on him.

[Smonroe]

17 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

This could take their need to draft a TE off the board, as I think they were pretty high on him.

 

If he and Woods are healthy, along with Mallory and Granson, I don't think there's a need for Bowers as much as there is for a WR like Thomas Jr.  Shane can do a lot with that diverse group.

 

We should know how the Colts feel about him if he shows up next week for workouts.  If he's not there, then they'll probably release him.  I understand that the commissioner will probably still suspend him for a few games.

[Superman]

1 hour ago, Smonroe said:

 

If he and Woods are healthy, along with Mallory and Granson, I don't think there's a need for Bowers as much as there is for a WR like Thomas Jr.  Shane can do a lot with that diverse group.

 

We should know how the Colts feel about him if he shows up next week for workouts.  If he's not there, then they'll probably release him.  I understand that the commissioner will probably still suspend him for a few games.

 

I don't know anymore than anyone else, but I don't see why he would be suspended, based on what's been reported. I can't think of any other player who was accused of something, had all charges dismissed -- with prejudice, in this case -- and then was still suspended by the league.

[csmopar]

41 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I don't know anymore than anyone else, but I don't see why he would be suspended, based on what's been reported. I can't think of any other player who was accused of something, had all charges dismissed -- with prejudice, in this case -- and then was still suspended by the league.

I can’t either and honestly, I think it’d open the league up to a lawsuit. 
 

bottom line is this: the charges were dismissed with PREJUDICE. Not just dismissed. The Prejudice part is very key here. It’s the same thing as being fully acquitted. The charges can never again be brought against him.
 

which based on my nearly 20 years of law enforcement experience, means they found out that the evidence proved A:  he either did not do it as claimed or B: acted in self defense, or C, was completely made up. 

[Smonroe]

45 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I don't know anymore than anyone else, but I don't see why he would be suspended, based on what's been reported. I can't think of any other player who was accused of something, had all charges dismissed -- with prejudice, in this case -- and then was still suspended by the league.

The commissioner can make the decision no matter what the legal outcome happened to be.

 

Not exactly the same, but Zeke Elliot was suspended six games after not being found guilty in a similar situation.  (I want to emphasize that I know it was different)
 

Again, I really don’t want to get into his guilt or innocence.  I’m just curious on how the Colts will handle it.  I think he’s a very good TE.  (And I’m not just saying that because he went to one of my Alma’s)

[Superman]

12 minutes ago, Smonroe said:

The commissioner can make the decision no matter what the legal outcome happened to be.

 

Not exactly the same, but Zeke Elliot was suspended six games after not being found guilty in a similar situation.  (I want to emphasize that I know it was different)
 

Again, I really don’t want to get into his guilt or innocence.  I’m just curious on how the Colts will handle it.  I think he’s a very good TE.  (And I’m not just saying that because he went to one of my Alma’s)

 

I think the nature of the difference is important. In this case, it seems to me that the investigation of Ogletree casts serious doubt on the validity of the accusation. If the NFL investigation leads them to believe that he actually did engage in domestic violence, then that's a different story. None of us knows the details, so I guess we'll see.

 

In Elliott's case, he was not found not guilty. He was never charged, apparently because prosecutors didn't think they had enough to bring a winnable case. The NFL investigated and found what they called credible evidence to support the allegations. If that's the case with Ogletree, then a suspension is likely. I'm just assuming, based on the charges being dismissed with prejudice, that there's no credible evidence, and the evidence they used to charge him was later shown to be not just insufficient, but inaccurate. Otherwise, the charges would have been dismissed without prejudice, in case they decide to refile charges in the future. With prejudice seems close to an exoneration. 

 

And it seems like people expect the NFL to issue a suspension simply because he was accused and charged, so they have to do something. But if there's no credible evidence, I don't think there will be a suspension. Again, I don't know any of the details, and I could be wrong, I just think dismissed with prejudice is an important factor here. And I don't think the league will default to a suspension if there's no credible evidence.

[csmopar]

16 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I think the nature of the difference is important. In this case, it seems to me that the investigation of Ogletree casts serious doubt on the validity of the accusation. If the NFL investigation leads them to believe that he actually did engage in domestic violence, then that's a different story. None of us knows the details, so I guess we'll see.

 

In Elliott's case, he was not found not guilty. He was never charged, apparently because prosecutors didn't think they had enough to bring a winnable case. The NFL investigated and found what they called credible evidence to support the allegations. If that's the case with Ogletree, then a suspension is likely. I'm just assuming, based on the charges being dismissed with prejudice, that there's no credible evidence, and the evidence they used to charge him was later shown to be not just insufficient, but inaccurate. Otherwise, the charges would have been dismissed without prejudice, in case they decide to refile charges in the future. With prejudice seems close to an exoneration. 

 

And it seems like people expect the NFL to issue a suspension simply because he was accused and charged, so they have to do something. But if there's no credible evidence, I don't think there will be a suspension. Again, I don't know any of the details, and I could be wrong, I just think dismissed with prejudice is an important factor here. And I don't think the league will default to a suspension if there's no credible evidence.

Completely agree. 

[csmopar]

49 minutes ago, Smonroe said:

The commissioner can make the decision no matter what the legal outcome happened to be.

 

Not exactly the same, but Zeke Elliot was suspended six games after not being found guilty in a similar situation.  (I want to emphasize that I know it was different)
 

Again, I really don’t want to get into his guilt or innocence.  I’m just curious on how the Colts will handle it.  I think he’s a very good TE.  (And I’m not just saying that because he went to one of my Alma’s)

I think the colts have handled it already. If they were going to do anything different, it’d already have been done. 
 

they usually are quick to act if they think there’s credibility to the offense. See Rogers for example. Or the two they cut/suspended last season. The fact they’ve not done anything publicly tells me that the issue is over for them. Now, does that mean he’ll be on the team come September, no, but if he’s not, it’ll be because of a performance issue and likely not related to this now dismissed charge

[Superman]

8 minutes ago, csmopar said:

I think the colts have handled it already. If they were going to do anything different, it’d already have been done. 
 

they usually are quick to act if they think there’s credibility to the offense. See Rogers for example. Or the two they cut/suspended last season. The fact they’ve not done anything publicly tells me that the issue is over for them. Now, does that mean he’ll be on the team come September, no, but if he’s not, it’ll be because of a performance issue and likely not related to this now dismissed charge

 

The Colts waited for the league to make a decision with Rodgers. It appears they're doing the same with Ogletree. IF the league suspends Ogletree, it wouldn't surprise me if the Colts release him.

[w87r]

2 hours ago, Superman said:

 

The Colts waited for the league to make a decision with Rodgers. It appears they're doing the same with Ogletree. IF the league suspends Ogletree, it wouldn't surprise me if the Colts release him.

Idk?

 

There is value in a guy suspended for the first 2,3,4 weeks.

 

Free roster spot at cut downs, gives insurance in case someone gets hurt in first few weeks.

 

Look what it did for Lammons last year, ended up getting him a spot on the roster for a while 

 

I don't think the Colts will release him, even if he is suspended.(Which I will be shocked if that happens).

 

 

Side note: I did see something about players being able to be out on the IR before final cut down and being eligible to return during the season (this year, change from the last)(very nice addition).

[Superman]

7 minutes ago, w87r said:

Idk?

 

There is value in a guy suspended for the first 2,3,4 weeks.

 

Free roster spot at cut downs, gives insurance in case someone gets hurt in first few weeks.

 

Look what it did for Lammons last year, ended up getting him a spot on the roster for a while 

 

I don't think the Colts will release him, even if he is suspended.(Which I will be shocked if that happens).

 

 

Side note: I did see something about players being able to be out on the IR before final cut down and being eligible to return during the season (this year, change from the last)(very nice addition).

 

There might be value for roster mechanics. I'm just thinking about whether the league would suspend a player who is all but exonerated. I don't think they would. (That's my opinion of the situation. The league might uncover credible evidence that Ogletree was perpetrating some domestic violence. I'm assuming they don't uncover anything that the criminal investigators couldn't find.)

 

Would the Colts release him if he's suspended? I think so. Rodgers was a critical piece of the roster. They waited for the outcome of the investigation, and when the league suspended him, they cut him immediately, even though it severely impacted one of our most precarious position groups. I know that was for gambling, and they took a zero tolerance stance for obvious reasons. I think they'd have a zero tolerance stance for domestic violence as well. 

 

To your side note, yeah I saw that as well. Common sense change, I'm happy to see it. I think the league could stand to loosen up even more roster restrictions. It would be good for player development and roster stability. 

[w87r]

15 hours ago, Superman said:

Would the Colts release him if he's suspended? I think so. Rodgers was a critical piece of the roster. They waited for the outcome of the investigation, and when the league suspended him, they cut him immediately, even though it severely impacted one of our most precarious position groups. I know that was for gambling, and they took a zero tolerance stance for obvious reasons. I think they'd have a zero tolerance stance for domestic violence as well. 

 

I think there are a couple differences.

1. Rodgers was suspended for the whole season. So even though it was a precarious position last year, he supplied zero help either way.

2. Rodgers violations were premeditated. He knew what he was doing was wrong and he did it time and time again(more than 100 times). That had to break any trust the FO had in him. 

 

 

This response, in no way, excuses Ogletree's actions. As I, like I'm sure almost everyone here, thinks DV is way worse than gambling. I'm sure, and I hope the Colts do have a zero tolerance stance on DV, just not sure the proof is there. I imagine they will have a sit down with him and talk about what happened once he comes off the commissioners list.

 

 

Don't want to get into what did or didn't happen with Ogletree, as we just don't know what happened. Only have the police report, then the subsequent acquittal(essentially) to close case forever.

 

 

This response was more about one guy planning to break rules and doing it over and over again, and another guy, potentially having a heat of the moment incident occur. Again, I'm not condoning Ogletree's actions.

[JediXMan]

It’s looking like he’ll stay on the team but might get a 2-4 game suspension that’s my prediction.

[MikeCurtis]

52 minutes ago, JediXMan said:

It’s looking like he’ll stay on the team but might get a 2-4 game suspension that’s my prediction.

I hope he can just play, no suspension

 

 

[w87r]

Seems as if the NFL is getting around to clearing the books, hopefully we have an answer in next couple days.

 

 

 

They just ruled that they didn't have enough evidence to suspend Zay Flowers in his domestic case.

 

https://nfltraderumors.co/nfl-finds-insufficient-evidence-to-suspend-ravens-wr-zay-flowers/

 

 

 

I'm anticipating the same with Ogletree.

 

 

Police just decided not to bring charges, Ogletree's was dropped with prejudice.

[Superman]

 

 

Whoa, just came out. He's off the commissioner's list. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, Superman said:

 

 

 

Whoa, just came out. He's off the commissioner's list. 

Justice is served. He wasn't found guilty of anything and the kid can move on with his life being a Colt. 

[w87r]

28 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

 

Whoa, just came out. He's off the commissioner's list. 

Was hoping with Flowers coming off list, this was just a formality. Although every case isn't the same 

[Superman]

2 minutes ago, w87r said:

Was hoping with Flowers coming off this was just a formality. Although everything case isn't the same 

 

I did not hear Ballard say Ogletree is off the exempt list, but that's what Holder's tweet says. Maybe there's something missing...

[w87r]

14 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I did not hear Ballard say Ogletree is off the exempt list, but that's what Holder's tweet says. Maybe there's something missing...

I haven't seen him be officially removed from the list, but seemed to be what Ballard was putting out there. Although he is allowed to work out while on the list.

[Superman]

2 minutes ago, w87r said:

I haven't seen him be officially removed from the list, but seemed to be what Ballard was putting out there. Although he is allowed to work out while on the list.

 

Yeah the fact that he's working out with the team isn't really newsworthy, though. It would have been newsworthy if they told him not to come in.

 

I wonder if Holder jumped the gun with that tweet.

[w87r]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

Yeah the fact that he's working out with the team isn't really newsworthy, though. It would have been newsworthy if they told him not to come in.

 

I wonder if Holder jumped the gun with that tweet.

Listening back, Ballard definitely said he was off the list.

 

Thought that was what he said when listening love, but it was a lot to take in in short amount of time 

[Superman]

The roster page has now been updated, Ogletree is no longer listed as on the exempt list. So my bad, Holder was right. 

 

Good news.

[Indyfan4life]

31 minutes ago, Superman said:

The roster page has now been updated, Ogletree is no longer listed as on the exempt list. So my bad, Holder was right. 

 

Good news.

This has me kind of happy. I’m glad Ogletree was cleared and he showed some great flashes during the season, but this *probably* rules out any thought of Bowers. I’m also assuming Woods will be back and healthy this season. 

[Solid84]

20 minutes ago, Indyfan4life said:

This has me kind of happy. I’m glad Ogletree was cleared and he showed some great flashes during the season, but this *probably* rules out any thought of Bowers. I’m also assuming Woods will be back and healthy this season. 

We don't have anyone on the team that rules Bowers out for the Colts as a draft pick. A guy that could do that would be Kelce or Kittle.

[Smonroe]

14 hours ago, Solid84 said:

We don't have anyone on the team that rules Bowers out for the Colts as a draft pick. A guy that could do that would be Kelce or Kittle.

Third and fifth round picks….just for reference.   
 

While I’d love to see what Shane would do with Bowers, I feel the TE room as a collective is pretty good.  
 

I’m hoping for a breakaway WR like Thomas Jr.   That room is pretty thin.  

[Solid84]

1 hour ago, Smonroe said:

Third and fifth round picks….just for reference.   
 

While I’d love to see what Shane would do with Bowers, I feel the TE room as a collective is pretty good.  
 

I’m hoping for a breakaway WR like Thomas Jr.   That room is pretty thin.  

True, but where they were drafted has no relevance to how they play now which is what would keep a team from drafting Bowers. 
 

I’d like if we got another weapon for AR, but I feel we have a lot of needs - especially on defense. OL is probably the only choice I’d be really disappointed with. 

[Smonroe]

23 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

True, but where they were drafted has no relevance to how they play now which is what would keep a team from drafting Bowers. 
 

I’d like if we got another weapon for AR, but I feel we have a lot of needs - especially on defense. OL is probably the only choice I’d be really disappointed with. 

 

I couldn't agree more with the bolded statement.  Once a player is on the team, the only thing his draft position does for him (aside from the money) is maybe give him a little more time to develop.  Mainly because teams are reluctant to admit that their research didn't pan out and they want to see their guy succeed.

 

As far as defense, I feel the number one responsibility of the GM and the coach is to help the franchise QB be the franchise QB, if you get what I mean.  And until that's proven, if it means sacrificing a need on defense in order to enhance the QB's arsenal, so be it.  But that's just me...

 

 

[wig]

20 hours ago, Indyfan4life said:

This has me kind of happy. I’m glad Ogletree was cleared and he showed some great flashes during the season, but this *probably* rules out any thought of Bowers. I’m also assuming Woods will be back and healthy this season. 

 

Nope. 

[Indyfan4life]

21 hours ago, Solid84 said:

We don't have anyone on the team that rules Bowers out for the Colts as a draft pick. A guy that could do that would be Kelce or Kittle.

I mean, yeah. But I feel like Ballard is 100% in on those two, so unless he can’t trade up and Bowers is just SITTING there, I personally don’t expect it. 

[rock8591]

IMO, still a candidate for release.

 

*So far, only 147 receiving yards in the league.

*Injury prone, including missing 17 games in rookie season, 5 last year.

 

There's a reason why he was a late 6th rounder, and not a 1-3rd rounder.