Chubb or Barkley at #3?

[corgi]

2 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

I didn’t even know who Chubb was at the end of the CFB season but I guarantee you Everyone knew who Saquon Barkley was. Barkley instantly makes us a top 5 offense (with Luck obviously) while Chubb can’t gaurantee to be a top 20 Defense.  

 

No matter what our Colts decide with that 3rd pick, there will always be a debate on what was the correct decision so we shall see.  Go Colts

If you lived anywhere close to ACC country you knew who Chubb was.

[Boiler_Colt]

3 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

I didn’t even know who Chubb was at the end of the CFB season but I guarantee you Everyone knew who Saquon Barkley was. Barkley instantly makes us a top 5 offense (with Luck obviously) while Chubb can’t gaurantee to be a top 20 Defense.  

 

No matter what our Colts decide with that 3rd pick, there will always be a debate on what was the correct decision so we shall see.  Go Colts

Nobody knew who Mario Williams was and everyone knew who Reggie Bush was in 2005. Houston made the better call with Williams there. 

[NDcolt]

If you lived in Big Ten country we wouldn’t be having this convo.  Didn’t see his name pop up all yr but I will take your word for being #3 worthy!

 

Mario Williams is the exact reason I’m against this pick, really?  Reggie Bush didn’t have the body to scare anyone at the pro level, Barkley is a beast.  Next

[corgi]

5 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

If you lived in Big Ten country we wouldn’t be having this convo.  Didn’t see his name pop up all yr but I will take your word for being #3 worthy!

 

Mario Williams is the exact reason I’m against this pick, really?  Reggie Bush didn’t have the body to scare anyone at the pro level, Barkley is a beast.  Next

I will admit I never watch a Big 10 game unless UVa happens to be playing on of their schools. Im pro drafting either.

[NDcolt]

Please trust my eyes then, Saquon Barkley is a Game Changer!  I compare him to a Lavean Bell, Zeke Elliot or Todd Gurley meaning when you play them ALL attention goes to stopping him from reaking havoc.  Imagine what this would do for Luck?  Can’t believe I’m in the minority with most colt fans being from Big Ten country.

[Smonroe]

29 minutes ago, corgi said:

If you lived anywhere close to ACC country you knew who Chubb was.

 

I’m a Buckeye living in SEC country, so to be honest I didn’t watch much ACC football.  And I don’t think I saw any NCST games. 

 

That being said, I never heard that he was a game wrecker like Suh or Clooney.  I’m wondering if he’s getting the top 5 hype simply because there weren’t too many great Edge players this year. 

 

I’m looking forward to seeing him in the Combine.  

[krunk]

19 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

Please trust my eyes then, Saquon Barkley is a Game Changer!  I compare him to a Lavean Bell, Zeke Elliot or Todd Gurley meaning when you play them ALL attention goes to stopping him from reaking havoc.  Imagine what this would do for Luck?  Can’t believe I’m in the minority with most colt fans being from Big Ten country.

Are any of those guys you named going to be playing in the Superbowl? The answer is no. Can you tell us who the Patriots RBs were tonight and what they contributed on the ground? What about the Eagles? Any 1st round runners there? And guess what that didnt stop them from advancing and playing effective offense.

 

 

 

 

 

[NDcolt]

1 hour ago, GoColts8818 said:

The more I think about it the Colts need to take Chubb.  The difference between the two in terms of overall talent is not that great.  You can’t win in the NFL today without a pass rush which the Colts don’t have. You can win with an okay running game if you have a franchise QB who plays like it.  I also think the Colts can still get a really good running back later in the draft.  

Let me ask you this, did at any point in the Season did Chubb get recognized as a Heisman candidate or Defensive player of the yr?  Is the ACC talent better than the Big Ten?  Does Chubb return kickoffs or is he just a rush the qb specialist that used his speed to take advantage in a lackluster conference?  Did you at any point during the CFB season hear nationally what Saquon Barkley was doing at Penn State with no qb?  

[krunk]

13 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

Please trust my eyes then, Saquon Barkley is a Game Changer!  I compare him to a Lavean Bell, Zeke Elliot or Todd Gurley meaning when you play them ALL attention goes to stopping him from reaking havoc.  Imagine what this would do for Luck?  Can’t believe I’m in the minority with most colt fans being from Big Ten country.

Tell me youre not making this argument after watching all those years of Peyton Manning and Edgerrin James. Marvin Harrison, Dallas Clark and Reggie Wayne. How many times were they stopped by strong defensive teams? The Pats were not known for offense during those years.

[NDcolt]

3 minutes ago, krunk said:

Are any of those guys you named going to be playing in the Superbowl? The answer is no. Can you tell us who the Patriots RBs were tonight and what they contributed on the ground? What about the Eagles? Any 1st round runners there?

 

 

 

 

 

I’ll counter with did any of the games today affected by an outside lb or de pass rush?  I seen a top rated Defense not able to stop the Patriots & the # 1 Defense overall get destroyed because the offense couldn’t move the ball.  Every sack i saw today came from the DL not the so called pass rusher.

[NDcolt]

5 minutes ago, krunk said:

Tell me youre not making this argument after watching all those years of Peyton Manning and Edgerrin James. Marvin Harrison, Dallas Clark and Reggie Wayne. How many times were they stopped by strong defensive teams? The Pats were not known for offense during those years.

Those same teams had Dwight Freeney & Robert Mathis arguably the best pass rush tandem correct?  Where did that great pass rush get us?  Is our defense that bad or is everyone overreacting?

[BleedBlu8792]

1 hour ago, NDcolt said:

Reason # 1:  Did PS have a Generational QB to stop teams from stacking the box?  NO.

 

I stopped reading right after this... You obviously didn't watch Penn State AT ALL this year. GTFOH, Barkely wasn't playing against stacked boxes, he was playing on one of the better passing teams in CFB (#1 in the Big Ten, #23 Nationally). He's good, but damn some of you are overrating the * out of him.

 

1 minute ago, NDcolt said:

I’ll counter with did any of the games today affected by an outside lb or de pass rush?  I seen a top rated Defense not able to stop the Patriots & the # 1 Defense overall get destroyed because the offense couldn’t move the ball.  Every sack i saw today came from the DL not the so called pass rusher.

 

Are you really this dense... The Eagles are a top 5 defense, across the board. They also have one of the better offensive lines in the NFL as well. 

[GoColts8818]

15 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

It’s darn near impossible to win the the Heisman as a defensive player but yes he was

https://247sports.com/college/north-carolina-state/Article/Bradley-Chubb-listed-on-Heisman-watch-list-by-The-Athletic-108744303

 

he also won a defensive player of year award and defensive end of year award.

 

http://www.espn.com/college-football/awards

 

id say yes the ACC is better than the Big 10 but it’s close and frankly they are pretty close to equal we aren’t talking the MAC and SEC.  

 

when was the last time a DE returned kicks?  That’s not what they are drafting them for.  It won’t be what they drafted Barkley for either if they do.  It would be an added bonus.  Honestly I doubt he would return kicks very long if at all.  If the Colts wanted a star that could return kicks TY would still be doing it but they don’t want to expose him to injury.  My guess is Barkley would follow suit in relative short order.

 

Should the Colts have passed on Andrew Luck for a “once in a generation” runningback in Trent Richardson because Luck couldn’t return Kicks?  If a player can be dominant at their position rather they can return kicks or not is a very minor factor if a factor at all depending on the position.

 

The ACC is not a lackluster conference.  They are one of the top three conferences in America.

 

yes I heard Chubbs name quite a bit because he was getting to the QB and making plays on defense.  

[krunk]

1 minute ago, NDcolt said:

I’ll counter with did any of the games today affected by an outside lb or de pass rush?  I seen a top rated Defense not able to stop the Patriots & the # 1 Defense overall get destroyed because the offense couldn’t move the ball.  Every sack i saw today came from the DL not the so called pass rusher.

Answer the question. You are not a good dancer! So we need a first round runner to do exactly what? Ive already showed you that neither of the Super Bowl teams needed one. I also showed you that none of the top rushers carried their team to the Super Bowl. I know for a fact Jacksonviles Defense carried them all season long. Seattles defense carried them to their first title. Baltimores defense single handedly took them to their first title. Oh and what about the New York Giants when they ousted New England twice. Did that have anything to do with pass rush. Hell Yes

 

 

 

 

 

[corgi]

26 minutes ago, Smonroe said:

 

I’m a Buckeye living in SEC country, so to be honest I didn’t watch much ACC football.  And I don’t think I saw any NCST games. 

 

That being said, I never heard that he was a game wrecker like Suh or Clooney.  I’m wondering if he’s getting the top 5 hype simply because there weren’t too many great Edge players this year. 

 

I’m looking forward to seeing him in the Combine.  

I don't think its a great class, but I've seen Chubb compared to Bosa. We could do way worse than Chubb. I think hes going to be special. All that said Barkley shoukd be fantastic barring injury.

[BleedBlu8792]

Just now, krunk said:

Answer the question. You are not a good dancer! So we need a first round runner to do exactly what? Ive already showed you that neither of the Super Bowl teams needed one. I also showed you that none of the top rushers carried their team to the Super Bowl. I know for a fact Jacksonviles Defense carried them all season long. Seattles defense carried them to their first title. Baltimores defense single handedly took them to their first title. Oh and what about the New York Giants when they ousted New England twice. Did that have anything to do with pass rush. Hell Yes

 

 

 

 

 

Literally, you could go back through every Superbowl in the last 20 years and show how defenses played a HUGE part in winning those Superbowls, and he'd still be arguing about how a RB is needed.

[GoColts8818]

1 minute ago, krunk said:

Answer the question. You are not a good dancer! So we need a first round runner to do exactly what? Ive already showed you that neither of the Super Bowl teams needed one. I also showed you that none of the top rushers carried their team to the Super Bowl. I know for a fact Jacksonviles Defense carried them all season long. Seattles defense carried them to their first title. Baltimores defense single handedly took them to their first title. Oh and what about the New York Giants when they ousted New England twice. Did that have anything to do with pass rush. Hell Yes

 

 

 

 

 

The last time a super star running back played a major factor in his team winning the Super Bowl was Marshall Faulk in 1999 and even then they won that game because of their defense and Kurt Warner doing just enough to beat the Titans.  

[NDcolt]

8 minutes ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

 

I stopped reading right after this... You obviously didn't watch Penn State AT ALL this year. GTFOH, Barkely wasn't playing against stacked boxes, he was playing on one of the better passing teams in CFB (#1 in the Big Ten, #23 Nationally). He's good, but damn some of you are overrating the * out of him.

 

 

Are you really this dense... The Eagles are a top 5 defense, across the board. They also have one of the better offensive lines in the NFL as well. 

Obviously we have different thoughts & player evaluations but I could have sworn Barkley was the best player in the Nation according to ESPN & the national pundits at some point?  

 

Name me the Eagles pass rush specialist that impacted the game today?  Does that top 5 Defense have a QB counting 25 Mil against the salary cap?  We are an offensive team w/ Luck & will never be a top 10 Defense.

[GoColts8818]

7 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

Obviously we have different thoughts & player evaluations but I could have sworn Barkley was the best player in the Nation according to ESPN & the national pundits at some point?  

 

Name me the Eagles pass rush specialist that impacted the game today?  Does that top 5 Defense have a QB counting 25 Mil against the salary cap?  We are an offensive team w/ Luck & will never be a top 10 Defense.

Mel kipper who works for ESPN and is a draft expert said Chubb might be the best player in this draft.  I’d rather have the best player in the draft than the best player in college.  Honestly the Colts are probably picking between the best two players in this draft between Chubb and Barkley.  This isn’t a huge devide either way.

 

http://www.nfl.com/stats/team?seasonId=2017&seasonType=REG&Submit=Go

 

The Steelers were a top five defense this year and they had a QB with a big cap number, well not 25 million but still $18 million.  Worth mentioning Luck wasn’t a 25 million cap hit this year either, he was $19 million.

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/indianapolis-colts/andrew-luck-9811/

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/pittsburgh-steelers/ben-roethlisberger-3595/

[krunk]

13 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

Those same teams had Dwight Freeney & Robert Mathis arguably the best pass rush tandem correct?  Where did that great pass rush get us?  Is our defense that bad or is everyone overreacting?

Were we ever a top 5 defense? No we were not but the finger could never be pointed at the pass rush. You have to be good on each level of the Defense. Not just on the D line. Your argument however says we should be carried by offensive pieces but theres much evidence to the contrary. We have seen more than a couple defensive teams win it all though. What we are really wanting is a balanced football team that does both things well.

[BleedBlu8792]

10 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

Obviously we have different thoughts & player evaluations but I could have sworn Barkley was the best player in the Nation according to ESPN & the national pundits at some point?  

 

 

Who gives a * what they say. They overrate/overhype people every year. The same * was said about Trent Richardson. If they were calling Chubb the next LT/Bruce Smith/Von Miller, I'd call B.S on that too.

 

10 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

Name me the Eagles pass rush specialist that impacted the game today?  Does that top 5 Defense have a QB counting 25 Mil against the salary cap?  We are an offensive team w/ Luck & will never be a top 10 Defense.

 

Who gives a *. That top 5 Eagles defense impacted the game. It's a TEAM game. I'd drop Luck in a heartbeat to the highest bidder, and continue building the TEAM. The Eagles with their "no name" QB and top 5 defense are going to the Superbowl. 

 

 

[krunk]

17 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

Obviously we have different thoughts & player evaluations but I could have sworn Barkley was the best player in the Nation according to ESPN & the national pundits at some point?  

 

Name me the Eagles pass rush specialist that impacted the game today?  Does that top 5 Defense have a QB counting 25 Mil against the salary cap?  We are an offensive team w/ Luck & will never be a top 10 Defense.

So we should just settle for a mediocre defense? Despite all the evidence to the contrary? You want to tell us Tampas defense and specifically their pass rush had nothing to do with beating Oakland? There are many examples. There ain't many Chubbs or Barkleys in this draft but if I had to miss on one it would be Barkley. And that is because You can still create a very effective ground game with a committee system. On the contrary if you don't get good to great players for your front its hard to scheme around that. You can blitz a lot but you're exposing your defense.

[csmopar]

6 minutes ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

 

Who gives a * what they say. They overrate/overhype people every year. The same * was said about Trent Richardson. If they were calling Chubb the next LT/Bruce Smith/Von Miller, I'd call B.S on that too.

 

 

Who gives a *. That top 5 Eagles defense impacted the game. It's a TEAM game. I'd drop Luck in a heartbeat to the highest bidder, and continue building the TEAM. The Eagles with their "no name" QB and top 5 defense are going to the Superbowl. 

 

 

Why so angry

[BleedBlu8792]

1 minute ago, csmopar said:

Why so angry

Hard to be angry at comical dialogue.. 

 

why so concerned...

[csmopar]

5 minutes ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

Hard to be angry at comical dialogue.. 

 

why so concerned...

Just wanted to check on you buddy. Seemed tense, do you need a Snickers?

[NDcolt]

3 minutes ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

 

Who gives a * what they say. They overrate/overhype people every year. The same * was said about Trent Richardson. If they were calling Chubb the next LT/Bruce Smith/Von Miller, I'd ball B.S on that too.

 

 

Who gives a *. That top 5 Eagles defense impacted the game. It's a TEAM game. I'd drop Luck in a heartbeat to the highest bidder, and continue building the TEAM. The Eagles with their "no name" QB and top 5 defense are going to the Superbowl. 

 

 

I don’t care what anyone else says my opinoins are based what I saw during the yr & that is Barkley is the best player in this draft. Everyone’s knew 2 yd Trent was a product of Alabama Just like all the other rbs.

 

that top 5 Defense is not based on one playmaker it is a group of individuals making plays.  How many Eagles defenders were drafted 3rd overall?  

 

Dense?  Calling me dense for making an argument for Barkley at 3?  Please!  Wait until the combine when Barkley is projected 1 overall, oh wait some already have him at 2!  Wheres your Chubb?

[BleedBlu8792]

Just now, csmopar said:

Just wanted to check on you buddy. Seemed tense, do you need a Snickers?

 

Is this Dr. Phil?

 

[NDcolt]

8 minutes ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

Hard to be angry at comical dialogue.. 

 

why so concerned...

Who you calling comical?  

[BleedBlu8792]

Just now, NDcolt said:

Who you calling comical?  

 

Oh you've been killing it....

[NDcolt]

1 minute ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

 

Oh you've been killing it....

Lol, killing it by claiming Barkley to the Colts?  Your right I’m so far off I should just announce BleedBlu8792 as the next Bill Belicheck.  He knows everything about football & everyone else knows squat.  Talk to you on draft day BleedBlu

 

1 minute ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

 

Oh you've been killing it....

 

[Four2itus]

Why do people keep starting draft threads in the Colts section?

[BleedBlu8792]

4 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

I don’t care what anyone else says my opinoins are based what I saw during the yr & that is Barkley is the best player in this draft. Everyone’s knew 2 yd Trent was a product of Alabama Just like all the other rbs.

 

They did? Those same sources hyping Barkley were the same one's saying Richardson was a can't miss player. i Saw a guy who looked really average against Ohio State, IU, and Rutgers.

 

7 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

that top 5 Defense is not based on one playmaker it is a group of individuals making plays.  How many Eagles defenders were drafted 3rd overall?  

Captain Obvious moment?

 

11 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

Dense?  Calling me dense for making an argument for Barkley at 3?  Please!  Wait until the combine when Barkley is projected 1 overall, oh wait some already have him at 2!  Wheres your Chubb?

 

I called you dense because you were clamoring about defense, but you were obviously unaware of how good the Eagles were defensively. Barkley is your strawman rebuttal, and I hope he does go number 1 so we can drop this topic for good. 

[NDcolt]

We’ll Bleed at the end of the day we’re not the ones faced with the decision but for our sake let’s hope they get it right.  Go Colts no matter what.

[BleedBlu8792]

8 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

Lol, killing it by claiming Barkley to the Colts?  Your right I’m so far off I should just announce BleedBlu8792 as the next Bill Belicheck.  He knows everything about football & everyone else knows squat.  Talk to you on draft day BleedBlu

 

 

What have I claimed to be all knowing about? All I've done is given you FACTUAL information. I'm not the one claiming Barkley is the next Jesus in cleats. I don't even have a favorite at #3, but I will admit I despise taking a RB that early. To be honest, I'm of the opinion we should trade back and and continue building the team with better, younger talent. 

 

 

[NDcolt]

5 minutes ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

What have I claimed to be all knowing about? All I've done is given you FACTUAL information. I'm not the one claiming Barkley is the next Jesus in cleats. I don't even have a favorite at #3, but I will admit I despise taking a RB that early. To be honest, I'm of the opinion we should trade back and and continue building the team with better, younger talent. 

 

 

FACTUAL?  Pretty sure you given me your opinion & it’s obvious you have a strong opinion against Barkley.  If I’m wrong on this guy I will be the first to admit but where would Troy Aikman be w/o Emmit & Irvin?  Joe Montana w/o Rice & Craig?  Kurt Warner w/o Bruce & Faulk?  Again this is just my opinion 

[BleedBlu8792]

9 minutes ago, NDcolt said:

FACTUAL?  Pretty sure you given me your opinion & it’s obvious you have a strong opinion against Barkley.  If I’m wrong on this guy I will be the first to admit but where would Troy Aikman be w/o Emmit & Irvin?  Joe Montana w/o Rice & Craig?  Kurt Warner w/o Bruce & Faulk?  Again this is just my opinion 

I've never been a good liar, and making up statistics isn't something I find entertaining. I'd much rather just research and pass it on to the unknowing. 

 

I've got complete confidence in Ballard passing on a RB with the 3rd overall pick. I expect there to be a few "Fire Ballard threads" when Barkley is possibly there for the taking and Ballard takes another player or sells it off to the highest bidder. 

 

[NDcolt]

18 minutes ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

I've never been a good liar, and making up statistics isn't something I find entertaining. I'd much rather just research and pass it on to the unknowing. 

 

I've got complete confidence in Ballard passing on a RB with the 3rd overall pick. I expect there to be a few "Fire Ballard threads" when Barkley is possibly there for the taking and Ballard takes another player or sells it off to the highest bidder. 

 

If Ballard passes on Barkley, I will be ok because I trust his evaluation over mine, until Barkley tears it up & is offense rookie of the yr lol!  I’m pretty sure the guy lol in your meme gets buried 6 ft deep later unless I got my flicks confused?  Sure you straighten me out 

[GoColts8818]

1 hour ago, Four2itus said:

Why do people keep starting draft threads in the Colts section?

Because even though there is a section for it it’s the off-season and it’s the main thing going on with the Colts right now since they pretty much have their next head coach lined up.  

[stitches]

9 hours ago, ricker182 said:

I'm just judging for the few full games I've watched.  

  

His technique just isn't impressive to me and he takes plays off.  

That's a big red flag for me personally.

WoW! That's quite impressive. It's like you've decided to describe the complete opposite player of what Chubb is. One more absolute opposite to what his strength is - his motor. It's like you are doing it on purpose or trolling. I don't know what to think? He has non-stop motor and pursues everything. 

[ClaytonColt]

3 hours ago, NDcolt said:

that top 5 Defense is not based on one playmaker it is a group of individuals making plays.  How many Eagles defenders were drafted 3rd overall?  

Nobody was drafted #3 but Fletcher Cox was taken #12 and he's a pretty good individual to build around.

 

However you're quite right that it's about more than just 1 pick so let's just look at how they're built compared to us.

 

Since 2010 they've spent 10 first or second round picks out of 16 (62.5%) on the defensive side of the ball. 

 

Since 2011 we've spent 4 high picks out of 12 (33%) on that side of the ball.  

 

The Eagles have committed to building a team of talented defenders. As have most of the successful teams in the league but we keep trying to build an offensive juggernaut.

 

We have to stop and follow what makes other teams successful and that sure as hell isn't taking a running back at #3 when our defense is so neglected and starved of talent regardless of how "generational" he may be.