Which of these 4 retired QBs would you most prefer to build your franchise around in the current NFL?

[GoPats]

On 7/1/2017 at 0:23 PM, jvan1973 said:

I.can't find anything that says he didn't know the plays

 

Me neither. And I looked pretty thoroughly, because it sounded like it was a possibility, given that Marino bombed the Wonderlic and was not widely regarded as the sharpest tool in the shed. But, nothing. If he really did say something to that effect it would appear that remarkably it's escaped the Internet somehow. 

 

 

[Jason_]

On 6/30/2017 at 0:03 PM, BloodyChamp said:

That's just not true. If they can't do that they can just dump it off like Brady or go deep like like Rodgers. Not that they aren't smart quarterbacks, but that's been what's kept them under center with every year that they become less athletic and defenses become more athletic (which doesn't matter as much as you suggest since defenses aren't allowed to put all of it to work for themselves anymore).

 

Brady and Rodgers are 2 of the smartest QBs in the game today.  it takes far more than an arm and there are probably thousands of examples of guys with big arms that couldn't make it in the the NFL because they simply did not have a high enough football I.Q.  Jamarcus Russell is the most popular example because rarely do those type of guys make any headlines at all.  

[Jason_]

On 6/29/2017 at 9:55 PM, BloodyChamp said:

 

Dan Marino has said more than once that he never even knew the plays. Maybe not Jmarc but I doubt you can name anoter. Jeff George, Bobby Douglas, Doug Williams and all those guys would ball today. 

 

Jeff George's attitude likely wouldn't be any different now than it was back then.  But you doubt I can name another?

 

Daunte Culpepper (flamed out of the league when he no longer had Moss to throw to)

Colin Kaepernick (had what, one truly successful year with Harbaugh but has done nothing since)

Byron Leftwich (big arm but zero touch and very inconsistent accuracy)

Drew Bledsoe (had the most successful career out of these guys but still...the big arm simply wasn't enough)

Logan Thomas (huge arm that made him so successful he converted to TE)

 

so there you go, 5 more examples just off the top of my head.  No googling required.  A big arm simply is not enough, and like 21issuperman said, that's more true now than it probably ever has been due to the complexities and athletic ability of today's NFL defenses.

[BloodyChamp]

I wouldn't be surprised if Jeff George balled out there in today's game. He might not win a SB but neither has Brees lately, who has been given a free pass because of stats in spite of 3 straight losing seasons. Meanwhile Bledsoe never had 3 straight losing seasons. And I don't know where you ever saw Leftwich, Kaep, or Culp have half the arm any gunslinger ever had, let alone Marino.

[BloodyChamp]

2 hours ago, J@son said:

 

Brady and Rodgers are 2 of the smartest QBs in the game today.  it takes far more than an arm and there are probably thousands of examples of guys with big arms that couldn't make it in the the NFL because they simply did not have a high enough football I.Q.  Jamarcus Russell is the most popular example because rarely do those type of guys make any headlines at all.  

 

Is that not what those guys do every time the heat is on though? And in the case of Rodgers it's after 7 years of sliding for 2 on 3rd and 4. I'll take today's Rodgers and his slightly messier stats than the 1 and done QBR God every time.

 

Thousands...couldn't even name 5.

[jvan1973]

1 hour ago, BloodyChamp said:

 

Is that not what those guys do every time the heat is on though? And in the case of Rodgers it's after 7 years of sliding for 2 on 3rd and 4. I'll take today's Rodgers and his slightly messier stats than the 1 and done QBR God every time.

 

Thousands...couldn't even name 5.

Name 5 big arms that flamed out in the nfl?

 

Without mentioning those above.

 

Todd maronovich

David klingler

Ryan leaf

Heath shuler

Joey Harrington

 

 

There are tons more

[Jason_]

2 hours ago, BloodyChamp said:

 

Is that not what those guys do every time the heat is on though? And in the case of Rodgers it's after 7 years of sliding for 2 on 3rd and 4. I'll take today's Rodgers and his slightly messier stats than the 1 and done QBR God every time.

 

Thousands...couldn't even name 5.

 

Can you not count?

[BloodyChamp]

If I trolled this right, I could get ya'll to name every quarterback that ever failed. MAN that David Carr had a rocket arm!

[Jason_]

1 minute ago, BloodyChamp said:

If I trolled this right, I could get ya'll to name every quarterback that ever failed. 

 

Uh...no. You couldn't. 

[BloodyChamp]

10 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

Uh...no. You couldn't. 

 

Look at who ya'll tried to associate with Marino already. Heck some of those names are an insult to George if we're just talking arms. 

[jvan1973]

31 minutes ago, BloodyChamp said:

If I trolled this right, I could get ya'll to name every quarterback that ever failed. MAN that David Carr had a rocket arm!

Who.named David Carr?  Your argument is wrong,  just own it

[jvan1973]

18 minutes ago, BloodyChamp said:

 

Look at who ya'll tried to associate with Marino already. Heck some of those names are an insult to George if we're just talking arms. 

Which of the guys mentioned had questionable arms coming out of school?  

[BloodyChamp]

Nobody named Carr, but you would have if I wouldn't have let the cat out of the bag with that comment (they really need to give you a sarcasm chip).

 

The ones mentioned.

 

Maybe not Culpepper. He had some pretty ace throws to Moss that 1 year but even he's not considered a lightning arm quarterback compared to guys like Marino and Favre.

[Jason_]

12 hours ago, BloodyChamp said:

 

Look at who ya'll tried to associate with Marino already. Heck some of those names are an insult to George if we're just talking arms. 

 

The only way those guys are associated with Marino is that they had "big arms".  None of the guys I brought up are an insult to either Marino or George in terms of arm strength.  

[BloodyChamp]

If only they had big arms.

[jvan1973]

15 minutes ago, BloodyChamp said:

If only they had big arms.

They had far better than average arms

[Myles]

I'm a little confused on this conversation.   Are people really comparing Jeff George with Dan Marino?

[jvan1973]

1 hour ago, Myles said:

I'm a little confused on this conversation.   Are people really comparing Jeff George with Dan Marino?

Just arm strength.  Certainly not ability to play qb

[RockThatBlue]

On 6/29/2017 at 4:39 AM, SteelCityColt said:

I went with Marino just because I'd love to see what numbers he'd put up in the more pass happy modern game. Especially if in this fantasy world he's landed on a team with some talent around him. Imagine Marino with a true top tier WR? 

 

Steve Young would probably be more in line with the prototype "modern" QB. Good arm, mobile, can make plays on the run when required. 

Steve Young would play a lot like Luck, IMO. Very similar styles.

[jvan1973]

1 hour ago, RockThatBlue said:

Steve Young would play a lot like Luck, IMO. Very similar styles.

Luck wants to go deep most of the time.  I don't see the comparison to young at all

[The Fish]

People got around to talking about Jeff George and no one picked Montana?

 

Well, I guess he's my guy then.. 

[Valpo2004]

I'd take Marino... Dude put up modern QB stats in the 80's.  Put up 5000 yards in a year where 4000 yards was rare.

 

Montana to me seemed like a QB who succeeded heavily due to the talent around him and the talent of his coaching staff.  Not that he was bad, but he always played with a good team around him.  

 

My picks would be 

1. Marino

2. Elway

3. Young

4. Montana

[GoColts8818]

Give me Elway more mobile than Montana or Marino and I think better than Young.

[oldunclemark]

GoC is right..

Of these 4..Elway was the best runner-passer combo.

I would take him over Marino and Montana on mobility. Elway's arm was stronger than Marino's. His release wasnt as quick 

 

..and Id take Elway over Young on pure passing ability.

[oldunclemark]

On ‎6‎/‎28‎/‎2017 at 11:56 PM, crazycolt1 said:

I would go with Steve Young. Not only did he have a strong accurate arm he might have been the best running QB in history outside of Cunningham and Vick.

Elway was just as good a runner as Steve Young..didnt do it as much in his 30s but he was very effective

[oldunclemark]

On ‎7‎/‎5‎/‎2017 at 3:39 PM, J@son said:

 

Brady and Rodgers are 2 of the smartest QBs in the game today.  it takes far more than an arm and there are probably thousands of examples of guys with big arms that couldn't make it in the the NFL because they simply did not have a high enough football I.Q.  Jamarcus Russell is the most popular example because rarely do those type of guys make any headlines at all.  

Do we call low interception QBs 'smart'

..because guys like Alex Smith gets low interception numbers by being very 'safe';

 

I would say Phillip Rivers is one of the smartest QBs..But he throws interceptions because his team is always behind.  Russell Wilson is very smart..he just isn't that accurate and doenst have an O-line.

 

Hard to define 'smart' isn't it?   he How is Andrew not smart....? Interceptions? Because he played 2 years with an injury he should have that limited him?

 

Just asking

Edited July 22, 2017 by oldunclemark
spell

[oldunclemark]

On ‎6‎/‎28‎/‎2017 at 8:30 PM, chad72 said:

I have 4 QBs listed - Dan Marino, John Elway, Joe Montana, and Steve Young.

 

Who would you have liked to build your franchise around the most in the current NFL? 

Good question..Chad......and good choice to leave out Peyton.

 

John Elway's ability to stay alive in the pocket would make him Rodgers-like today

[crazycolt1]

4 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

Elway was just as good a runner as Steve Young..didnt do it as much in his 30s but he was very effective

I also have to give kudos to Steve Young because he did sit behind Montana when he could and should have been a starter a couple of years earlier IMO.

A lot of fans don't give him credit for being more successful with Jerry Rice than Montana was. Not as many rings but quite a bit more stats for sure.

[oldunclemark]

Just now, crazycolt1 said:

I also have to give kudos to Steve Young because he did sit behind Montana when he could and should have been a starter a couple of years earlier IMO.

A lot of fans don't give him credit for being more successful with Jerry Rice than Montana was. Not as many rings but quite a bit more stats for sure.

No doubt...Obviously these are 4 Hall-of-Famers..

I just think that, especially early in his career, Elway carried/ a much lesser team than the 49ers had .

 

..and the question again is ///who would excel today..who would be the best under the rules of today

....Elway could get the ball so far down the field so quickly..and he escaped the rush so well.

 

...he'd be Aaron Rodgers today

[ColtStrong]

On 6/29/2017 at 2:13 AM, AZColt11 said:

I always thought Elway was the best of those, even though he could've been a Colt and spurned them.  He could still play.

Sure, Elway could play (ya think?). But I would take Marinos arm in today's NFL in a heartbeat. In a way, he was ahead of his time and should have played in the 2000's.

[ColtStrong]

5 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

Do we call low interception QBs 'smart'

..because guys like Alex Smith gets low interception numbers by being very 'safe';

 

I would say Phillip Rivers is one of the smartest QBs..But he throws interceptions because his team is always behind.  Russell Wilson is very smart..he just isn't that accurate and doenst have an O-line.

 

Hard to define 'smart' isn't it?   he How is Andrew not smart....? Interceptions? Because he played 2 years with an injury he should have that limited him?

 

Just asking

You made a couple good points until that part.

[Jason_]

5 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

Do we call low interception QBs 'smart'

..because guys like Alex Smith gets low interception numbers by being very 'safe';

 

I would say Phillip Rivers is one of the smartest QBs..But he throws interceptions because his team is always behind.  Russell Wilson is very smart..he just isn't that accurate and doenst have an O-line.

 

Hard to define 'smart' isn't it?   he How is Andrew not smart....? Interceptions? Because he played 2 years with an injury he should have that limited him?

 

Just asking

 

Football smart, not general intelligence. 

[AZColt11]

3 hours ago, ColtStrong said:

Sure, Elway could play (ya think?). But I would take Marinos arm in today's NFL in a heartbeat. In a way, he was ahead of his time and should have played in the 2000's.

I get that.  Marino was probably the best pure thrower of the ball I've ever seen.  Granted, I didn't see Unitas or Starr or guys from that era.  But Elway's arm was no slouch either and I give him that little extra because he could move in the pocket and would run when needed.  But you certainly couldn't go wrong with either guy.

[dgambill]

Wow...some great quarterbacks there! I think coming out of college just about every GM looks for the prototypical qb...and most compare them to John Elway. The size, arm, mobility, the fire. Can't go wrong with any of these guys. I think they all had that special qualities that they would succeed no matter what. One might say well Marino and Elway have the arms but Tom Brady doesn't have a cannon arm and he has won 5 SBs in this modern NFL with mostly a short/timing/accurate throws. Certainly a guy like Montana with his poise and accuracy could do the same. I just feel if you want prototypical size and ability you are looking at Marino and Elway who are the bigger qbs with the stronger arms that would hold up to more hits and make any pass you want them to make. Montana and the athletic and deadly accurate Young both would still excel though. Knowing what each would turn into I'd probably go with Elway just because of his longevity and all his skills. Marino was the greatest passer I've ever seen but there is something to be said for Johns drive, athleticism, arm, and longevity. I'm not saying Dan wouldn't be the best but with the way John kept himself in shape and avoided injury I think he would get more miles out of him than any of the others. Can't go wrong for sure with any. The numbers some of these guys could have put up is ridiculous. To think that a guy like Matthew Stafford is putting up all time numbers and what these others would do is just astounding.

[ColtStrong]

On 7/23/2017 at 2:34 AM, AZColt11 said:

I get that.  Marino was probably the best pure thrower of the ball I've ever seen.  Granted, I didn't see Unitas or Starr or guys from that era.  But Elway's arm was no slouch either and I give him that little extra because he could move in the pocket and would run when needed.  But you certainly couldn't go wrong with either guy.

I understand your choice, and wouldn't complain with Elway either. You can make a case for any of the QB's from the 4 choices we have. I guess I leaned towards Marino because he is the most Manning-like out of all of them. I  miss the glory days of Peyton, but still happy with Luck. I believe with a proper O-line, Luck can be very special.

 

Btw AZ, it's good to see you're still around the message boards after all these years. We go way back even though you wouldn't realize because I had a different screen name back then. Peace bro.

[ColtStrong]

I would say that out of the 4 QB's we have to choose from, that Montana is the least physically gifted QB. And therefore may not be the best choice in today's NFL. I'm by no means saying he was a slouch, just that out of the 4, he's probably last on my list of those 4. That being said, he is a winner and I would take a QB like him in a heartbeat. Guys like that don't come around very often.