PFF Offensive Grades Through 4 Games

[Superman]

20 hours ago, bigt said:

Taylor Lewan of TN is ranked 1st.  And Conklin is ranked 4th.  I'm jealous.

 

Picked 8th and 11th, respectively. The closest the Colts have come to that kind of pick in the last decade, aside from 2012, is #18. 

[Superman]

9 hours ago, GoBlue12 said:

I think Mewhort is a very good  pass blocker more than a run blocker. He isn't very athletic and seems to trip himself up getting to the second level when run blocking.

 

He's not great in space, but he can move to the second level, if he does so with purpose. He's also not 100%, but has still been our best lineman so far.

[bigt]

Curious thing with the Titans.  Even thought they have the best offensive tackle tandem in the NFL.  Mariotta is ranked dead last among QB's.

[bigt]

It also helps that the Titans have Russ Grimm as their OL coach.

 

[AZColt11]

14 hours ago, cjrichard said:

I was livid when the Colts traded down and missed the opportunity to draft Whitehair.

From PFF "Outside of four penalties now in four games, there’s not much Bears fans can complain about with their new center. Whitehair has surrendered only five pressures, and currently owns the seventh-highest run-blocking grade at the position."

Another reason why Grigs needs to go.

Joseph

I respectfully disagree on this one.  Kelly was rated BY FAR the best center in the draft.  EVERYONE I saw in the mock drafts had Kelly going well ahead of Whitehair.  Hindsight is always 20/20 and we still don't really have enough of a body of work on either guy yet to say one should have been picked over the other.  But nearly everybody thought Kelly should have been selected ahead of Whitehair.  I have been critical of Grigs and I don't know that he's the man for the job, but if we're being truthful here we have to recognize when he's done something right as well.  IMHO that was one of them, at least thus far.

[NewColtsFan]

17 hours ago, dudeski said:

They don't know the play call.   What else do you need?  That is all you need to know about their rankings.

 

that was easy

 

Everything is easy to you.     And that's just a small part of the problem,  because the truth is,  in real life,  almost NOTHING is easy.      Surprised you haven't figured that out yet.

 

When you can beign to grasp that most NFL teams subscribe to PFF,  and that NFL teams part with their money about as easily as you give Coby Fleener compliments,   then you'll begin to get that if the NFL teams are subscribing to them then they have real, honest to goodness value.

 

If you don't understand that --- then you just don't get it.     And I doubt you ever will.

 

As I've stated in the past,  it's not 100% accurate,  it's a useful tool to NFL teams.    But the fact that they pay for the service should end the conversation right here.

 

[Smoke317]

3 hours ago, Superman said:

 

 

I don't understand what you guys have against Ferguson. He has a couple drops and he was tripping himself in the first couple games, but he's a rookie. I don't blame him for the protection issues, that's coaching. He's the only back the Colts have that is good in space. Go watch him break down the Chargers LB on an angle route, and explain to me why you're so upset about having a guy with scatback potential getting reps.

 

This "Grigson medding" nonsense is just that. Everyone on the staff likes Ferguson.

I don't necessarily dislike Ferguson as a player. I dislike the overuse of him over our other backs who I believe could give us a more physical presence.  He may be the only scatback on the team but I'd still like to see what Turbin or Todman can do with more of those catches out of the backfield.  He's averaging just under 7 yards per catch. With a long of 14 I believe. Not exactly lighting the world on fire. His numbers may be better than Gore or Turbin but I think that's just from more reps. They both have longest receptions of 12. Not too far off of his long of 14. I just don't see the justification of Ferguson getting so many reps at the moment.  Other scat type backs like Sproles, Ware, Johnson are all averaging 12-15 yards per catch. Of course that's because they probably broke one for a long gain.  Ferguson hasn't broken one yet and really hasn't been to close. So give him a few chances. But no way should he be getting the 2nd most reps out of our RB's. 

[JPFolks]

7 hours ago, Superman said:

 

 

I don't understand what you guys have against Ferguson. He has a couple drops and he was tripping himself in the first couple games, but he's a rookie. I don't blame him for the protection issues, that's coaching. He's the only back the Colts have that is good in space. Go watch him break down the Chargers LB on an angle route, and explain to me why you're so upset about having a guy with scatback potential getting reps.

 

This "Grigson medding" nonsense is just that. Everyone on the staff likes Ferguson.

Nobody is upset with his receiving skills (though big drops often aren't tolerated when receivers do it either), the problem is running him into the line and getting nothing as he bounces backwards off defenders. He's not a viable running back.   If we're forced to overplay Gore to keep him happy (there's plenty of reports about him being unhappy) can we at least use the real running backs with power to get us tough yards like Turbin and Todman (though it's hard to know exactly what we have in him with almost no seasonal play, he did at least look good in Pre-Season, and I don't think Ferguson looked as good).   There were several times they ran Ferguson for no gain putting behind the chains making it all tougher and this isn't the first time they've done it.  Sure, he's a check down back, but we need full blown RB's in there keeping the pounding going on the Defense so when we inevitably have try and win late, they are softened up.  Turbin can catch a check down too and then run over people.  As for the "nonsense" there has long been a pattern of forcing inferior/underperforming players down the teams throats no matter the result.  I see the same pattern with Ferguson.  I don't think it is nonsense to bring it up.  In the past, it has been reported this was Grigson's insistence.  If the pattern repeats, a reasonable question can be raised.  

[akcolt]

On 10/4/2016 at 9:24 PM, Superman said:

 

We have four guards besides Mewhort. Thornton got hurt (probably could have seen that coming, but I bet he comes off IR in the second half of the season), Good has been decent, Haeg had the injury but has been decent (and I liked him as a guard prospect coming out), and Harrison has been less awful than he was at center. Everybody can't be a five star recruit, especially when you're talking about depth. Blythe is a luxury, I guess, as a backup center. I don't like him at guard at all.

 

Having an experienced guard for depth would be good, but those guys are hit and miss. I thought Herremans was a good add last year, and he was awful. I say roll with the young guys, and I think there's a good mix there. Don't know why you're down on Clark; he's not my favorite prospect, but he has the tools to be a good RT, he's just not ready yet.

 

Not a fan of Morrison, but he's basically a younger version of Jackson and Irving, and that's the kind of LB this staff apparently likes. That's one of my biggest issues with this staff, but at least Morrison plays hard. Moore really let me down.

 

I don't know who's excited about Butler.

 

I'm not going to criticize the staff for Ngakoue, because I wasn't a big fan, and I thought he went too high. I think you liked, him, though, so good call, because he's been pretty good.

I realize every guy can't be a five star player but Supe Grig's and Pagano went on and on about the focus of the offseason being the interior of the OL. Am I the only one that remembers this?

 

Then we don't even bring in an OG and even worse we are carrying a 3rd string rookie C that can only play C. I'd call that a wasted roster spot more than a luxury when we only have 2 back ups to cover all 5 OL spots. We have 4 players we call OG's but Mewhort is it. Harrison is a C never played G. Good and Heag were T's never played G in their careers. I know T's kick in everyday but the focus of the offseason I expected something more than handing the job to Good. I guess I thought they'd focus on upgrading the interior of the OL. 

 

If they were counting on Thorton that's shocking. I am at a loss with what these guys are doing. We are rostering 2 OL that can't help us this year. I hope they knew that when they took Clark but after watching Blythe run out at RG I'm not sure. 

 

I liked Ngakoue but I had him in the 4th I liked Jenkins in the 3rd. I'm not a fan of Morrison I think he's another wasted pick a 4th rounder at that. There were players there too a couple of CB's and we had our pick at RB minus Elliott and Henry. I have supported Grig's but I'm losing confidence quickly

 

 

[dudeski]

6 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Everything is easy to you.     And that's just a small part of the problem,  because the truth is,  in real life,  almost NOTHING is easy.      Surprised you haven't figured that out yet.

 

When you can beign to grasp that most NFL teams subscribe to PFF,  and that NFL teams part with their money about as easily as you give Coby Fleener compliments,   then you'll begin to get that if the NFL teams are subscribing to them then they have real, honest to goodness value.

 

If you don't understand that --- then you just don't get it.     And I doubt you ever will.

 

As I've stated in the past,  it's not 100% accurate,  it's a useful tool to NFL teams.    But the fact that they pay for the service should end the conversation right here.

 

Pff puts out more information than their rankings.  Nobody in the nfl cares about their rankings.

[Gavin]

6 minutes ago, dudeski said:

Pff puts out more information than their rankings.  Nobody in the nfl cares about their rankings.

I don't think anyone is insinuating the NFL cares about their rankings. What they care about for example is such and such corner gave up so many yards per coverage snap or such and such running back gained so many yards after contact or that such and such team is blitzing a certain percentage of time and on what down. their individual cover grades and run defense grades and pass rush grades are more a metric for the fans to say that such and such player is actually playing well without actually giving out the info that NFL teams pay for. They are pretty accurate with their grades as some coaches have acknowledged but not perfect. But the closest to it. They really are the most elaborate in their approach I'm pretty sure

[TigerColt]

8 hours ago, AZColt11 said:

I respectfully disagree on this one.  Kelly was rated BY FAR the best center in the draft.  EVERYONE I saw in the mock drafts had Kelly going well ahead of Whitehair.  Hindsight is always 20/20 and we still don't really have enough of a body of work on either guy yet to say one should have been picked over the other.  But nearly everybody thought Kelly should have been selected ahead of Whitehair.  I have been critical of Grigs and I don't know that he's the man for the job, but if we're being truthful here we have to recognize when he's done something right as well.  IMHO that was one of them, at least thus far.

 

I love the Kelly pick.  I correctly predicted (for the first time) the Colts would take Kelly and i gave a standing O for the pick.  THEN the colts trade down in the second and let Whitehair get picked by the Bears one pick ahead of us and then we picked Green.  I think Green could be a good player with his skillset but was considered a reach pick by most publications (ie could have been had in the third).  

We could have had the BEST C in the draft  AND the BEST G in the draft. We would have solved our biggest problem the Colts have had in a while, the interior line. 

 

Joseph

[dudeski]

1 hour ago, Gavin said:

I don't think anyone is insinuating the NFL cares about their rankings. What they care about for example is such and such corner gave up so many yards per coverage snap or such and such running back gained so many yards after contact or that such and such team is blitzing a certain percentage of time and on what down. their individual cover grades and run defense grades and pass rush grades are more a metric for the fans to say that such and such player is actually playing well without actually giving out the info that NFL teams pay for. They are pretty accurate with their grades as some coaches have acknowledged but not perfect. But the closest to it. They really are the most elaborate in their approach I'm pretty sure

It is still wrong information.  You never seem to mention how polian called their rankings complete nonsense.  Same with Belichick.  

 

A grade of a player is worthless if it isn't accurate.  Their explanation of how they grade explains how wildly inaccurate they are.

 

not to mention they grade a CB poorly if his completion rate against him is high.  With zero context to the actual play.  

 

[colts8718]

Pagano POOR Grigson POOR

[theanarchist]

On 10/4/2016 at 4:10 PM, bigt said:

Offense:

QB

Luck                            87.4       High Quality

 

WR

Ty Hilton                      81.1       Above Average

Donte Moncrief            74.6      Average

Phillip Dorsett              56.1       Poor

Chester Rogers           46.7       Poor

 

TE

Jack Doyle                   71.6       Average

Eric Swoope                 57.9       Poor

Dwayne Allen               52.1       Poor          Run blocking is worst by far of TE's.  Next cut?  I vote yes

 

RB

Robert Turbin               64.8       Below Average          His pass blocking is much better than Gore and Ferguson

Frank Gore                   62.6      Below Average          His pass blocking is graded worst among RBs by sizeable margin

Josh Ferguson             55.1       Poor                           Best receiver - Worst runner

 

OT

Anthony Castonzo        81.5        Above Average        Pass and run blocking are graded about the same

Joe Haeg                      67.0        Below Average         Best run blocking OT, not so much on pass

LeRaven Clark              60.2       Below Average          Pass and run blocking are graded about the same

Joe Reitz                       43.5        * Poor                 Worst at pass and run.  Please cut him Grigson.  He sucks.

 

OG

Jack Mewhort                82.6        Above Average         Pretty good at both pass and run blocking

Jonotthan Harrison        48.3        Poor                          Horrible pass blocker

Denzelle Good               47.9       Poor                          Much better run blocker than pass

Austin Blythe                  36.6       Puke                          Enough said

 

C

Ryan Kelly                     71.6        Average                     Pass block = 75.5  Run Block = 53.3

 

So, looks like we are pretty well set at QB,  (2)WR, LT, LG, C

Need to cut veterans that are suppose to be setting the tone for rookies, but are failing miserably (Allen and Reitz)

At least start Doyle over Allen

Offensive line should probably be  Castonzo  Mewhort  Kelly  Good  Haeg

See if Good and Haeg get better.  If not, switch positions.  If that doesn't work.  Its back to draft and FA.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I agree. Time to cut our losses with this guy. Nice guy. Just not living up to his potential on the field. Im sick and tired of watching him drop passes he should catch. Time to move on. Doyle is playing well and blocking TE's are not hard to find.

 

The RB position as a whole is just a head shaker. I'm not a fan of this Ferguson kid and I hear people singing his praises. IDK why, he can catch a pass but his ability to run out of the backfield is deplorable. I think Gore does a fine job but beyond him there's nothing you couldn't find walking the streets right now not on anyone's roster. This whole roster is just frustrating. This is the best that Grigson can do in the time that he's been here?

[theanarchist]

On 10/4/2016 at 6:01 PM, Somewhere ovr the Waynebow said:

I watched some All 22 today.  Kelly is good and only going to get better.  He's incredibly athletic.  Some of their best run plays are when he pulls. That being said, he makes his fair share of mistakes,  especially on the run  game.  But he's a good one.  

I still think he's dinged a little too with that shoulder buggin him.

[theanarchist]

11 hours ago, Superman said:

 

 

I don't understand what you guys have against Ferguson. He has a couple drops and he was tripping himself in the first couple games, but he's a rookie. I don't blame him for the protection issues, that's coaching. He's the only back the Colts have that is good in space. Go watch him break down the Chargers LB on an angle route, and explain to me why you're so upset about having a guy with scatback potential getting reps.

 

This "Grigson medding" nonsense is just that. Everyone on the staff likes Ferguson.

He has 17 receptions with the longest being 14 yards. Not a lot of big play there yet. I realize he's a rookie and all but I just havent been as impressed with him as you have I guess. He has had a few drops and that is frustrating. He can't run the ball and that is frustrating. Not trying to turn this into a Dwayne Allen bashing session either but he needs to start catching the ball. He mouthed off last season because he wasnt getting targeted. Gee, maybe if you caught the ones that hit you in the hands I could understand your point Dwayne? Time has come for these guys to start playing up to their potential or it's time to move on from them. JMO

[Gavin]

1 hour ago, dudeski said:

It is still wrong information.  You never seem to mention how polian called their rankings complete nonsense.  Same with Belichick.  

 

A grade of a player is worthless if it isn't accurate.  Their explanation of how they grade explains how wildly inaccurate they are.

 

not to mention they grade a CB poorly if his completion rate against him is high.  With zero context to the actual play.  

 

I didn't know Polian said that. I knew Belichick said that but he couldn't even name the site when he called them out. That tells me he knew nothing about the site in my opinion. Sure there are some coaches that don't like the site but you also have plenty of teams that do. Gunther Cunningham is a coach for the Lions that pays a lot of attention to them. Not necessarily for grades though he even goes through those with the site leaders which names escape me at the moment

[dudeski]

1 hour ago, Gavin said:

I didn't know Polian said that. I knew Belichick said that but he couldn't even name the site when he called them out. That tells me he knew nothing about the site in my opinion. Sure there are some coaches that don't like the site but you also have plenty of teams that do. Gunther Cunningham is a coach for the Lions that pays a lot of attention to them. Not necessarily for grades though he even goes through those with the site leaders which names escape me at the moment

I take issue with their rankings and grades.  Let's stick to the argument.

 

have you ever heard a coach talk about them without it coming from pff?  

 

 polian went on a long rant on the radio about how pff rankings were a complete joke.  Said nobody in football would ever consider a pff grade to be accurate.  

[Archangel]

On 10/4/2016 at 5:10 PM, bigt said:

Offense:

QB

Luck                            87.4       High Quality

 

WR

Ty Hilton                      81.1       Above Average

Donte Moncrief            74.6      Average

Phillip Dorsett              56.1       Poor

Chester Rogers           46.7       Poor

 

TE

Jack Doyle                   71.6       Average

Eric Swoope                 57.9       Poor

Dwayne Allen               52.1       Poor          Run blocking is worst by far of TE's.  Next cut?  I vote yes

 

RB

Robert Turbin               64.8       Below Average          His pass blocking is much better than Gore and Ferguson

Frank Gore                   62.6      Below Average          His pass blocking is graded worst among RBs by sizeable margin

Josh Ferguson             55.1       Poor                           Best receiver - Worst runner

 

OT

Anthony Castonzo        81.5        Above Average        Pass and run blocking are graded about the same

Joe Haeg                      67.0        Below Average         Best run blocking OT, not so much on pass

LeRaven Clark              60.2       Below Average          Pass and run blocking are graded about the same

Joe Reitz                       43.5        * Poor                 Worst at pass and run.  Please cut him Grigson.  He sucks.

 

OG

Jack Mewhort                82.6        Above Average         Pretty good at both pass and run blocking

Jonotthan Harrison        48.3        Poor                          Horrible pass blocker

Denzelle Good               47.9       Poor                          Much better run blocker than pass

Austin Blythe                  36.6       Puke                          Enough said

 

C

Ryan Kelly                     71.6        Average                     Pass block = 75.5  Run Block = 53.3

 

So, looks like we are pretty well set at QB,  (2)WR, LT, LG, C

Need to cut veterans that are suppose to be setting the tone for rookies, but are failing miserably (Allen and Reitz)

At least start Doyle over Allen

Offensive line should probably be  Castonzo  Mewhort  Kelly  Good  Haeg

See if Good and Haeg get better.  If not, switch positions.  If that doesn't work.  Its back to draft and FA.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Where exactly did you come up with this analogy 

[Superman]

7 hours ago, theanarchist said:

He has 17 receptions with the longest being 14 yards. Not a lot of big play there yet. I realize he's a rookie and all but I just havent been as impressed with him as you have I guess. He has had a few drops and that is frustrating. He can't run the ball and that is frustrating. Not trying to turn this into a Dwayne Allen bashing session either but he needs to start catching the ball. He mouthed off last season because he wasnt getting targeted. Gee, maybe if you caught the ones that hit you in the hands I could understand your point Dwayne? Time has come for these guys to start playing up to their potential or it's time to move on from them. JMO

 

I'm not exactly impressed with Ferguson, I just see that he has potential as a scatback player. They should stop running him up the middle, and I said that in preseason. Just one of the many gripes I have with the coaching right now.

 

But playing Ferguson in certain situations is a good idea, IMO. You guys are acting like he's awful and shouldn't even have made the team. 

 

I haven't been impressed with Todman or Turbin, either, and we know exactly what those guys are. 

 

Allen didn't mouth off, either. He came to work and did his job, even though he wasn't being used in the best capacity. 

 

I get the frustration, for sure. Neither guy has been perfect. But all the 'it's time for them to go' is outrageous. 

[aaron11]

7 hours ago, theanarchist said:

Not trying to turn this into a Dwayne Allen bashing session either but he needs to start catching the ball. He mouthed off last season because he wasnt getting targeted. Gee, maybe if you caught the ones that hit you in the hands I could understand your point Dwayne? Time has come for these guys to start playing up to their potential or it's time to move on from them. JMO

completely agree about allen.  I wouldn't have signed him for 7 mil a year that is for sure. 

 

at one time he was a good receiver but I think those days might be over.  he has had a bunch of injuries and missed time, so I don't think he is the same player anymore

 

he can still block, but blocking TEs are cheap and you can find udfa or late round picks to do that

[Superman]

10 hours ago, akcolt said:

I realize every guy can't be a five star player but Supe Grig's and Pagano went on and on about the focus of the offseason being the interior of the OL. Am I the only one that remembers this?

 

Then we don't even bring in an OG and even worse we are carrying a 3rd string rookie C that can only play C. I'd call that a wasted roster spot more than a luxury when we only have 2 back ups to cover all 5 OL spots. We have 4 players we call OG's but Mewhort is it. Harrison is a C never played G. Good and Heag were T's never played G in their careers. I know T's kick in everyday but the focus of the offseason I expected something more than handing the job to Good. I guess I thought they'd focus on upgrading the interior of the OL. 

 

If they were counting on Thorton that's shocking. I am at a loss with what these guys are doing. We are rostering 2 OL that can't help us this year. I hope they knew that when they took Clark but after watching Blythe run out at RG I'm not sure. 

 

I liked Ngakoue but I had him in the 4th I liked Jenkins in the 3rd. I'm not a fan of Morrison I think he's another wasted pick a 4th rounder at that. There were players there too a couple of CB's and we had our pick at RB minus Elliott and Henry. I have supported Grig's but I'm losing confidence quickly

 

1) They added interior linemen. You and I disagree with the staff about Blythe, obviously, because they keep using him at guard and we think that's stupid. But in their minds, they brought in a C/G combo player. Same for Harrison; doesn't matter that he's never played guard, they felt he could compete at the position, and he's actually been not bad (still not good). Good and Haeg have guard skillsets, just like Mewhort did, even though he was a tackle in college. I think you're being a little stubborn about what they did on the interior. 

 

2) The biggest move on the interior was Kelly. Let's not gloss over that. They said the interior of the OL, and really they meant 'we've sucked at center for most of the last four years, we're gonna do something about that.' And they did. 

 

3) I'm fine with waiting on Clark. Lots of good OL need time coming from college, especially at tackle. He has the skillset, so he's worth the roster spot, IMO. 

 

4) Right now, you seem to be right on Ngakoue. 

[AZColt11]

10 hours ago, cjrichard said:

 

I love the Kelly pick.  I correctly predicted (for the first time) the Colts would take Kelly and i gave a standing O for the pick.  THEN the colts trade down in the second and let Whitehair get picked by the Bears one pick ahead of us and then we picked Green.  I think Green could be a good player with his skillset but was considered a reach pick by most publications (ie could have been had in the third).  

We could have had the BEST C in the draft  AND the BEST G in the draft. We would have solved our biggest problem the Colts have had in a while, the interior line. 

 

Joseph

OK that I could endorse more than selecting hm over Kelly.  But I doubt they had a mindset to pick OL every pick.  They have SO many holes to fill they had to go another direction.  Perhaps they didn't see Green as the reach that everyone else did.  I mean the guy has played fairly well when he's been in and can only get better.  I know the experts thought he was a reach but it doesn't look like the Colts' brass thought he was.  So far they are right on him.  Now LeRaven Clark.......?  Yes, it would be nice to have Whitehair.  That is 20/20 at this point.  But it is also too soon to rip them for picking Green over Whitehair at THIS point due to Green playing fairly well in limited time so far.  Let's give this one a couple of years.

[theanarchist]

16 hours ago, Superman said:

 

I'm not exactly impressed with Ferguson, I just see that he has potential as a scatback player. They should stop running him up the middle, and I said that in preseason. Just one of the many gripes I have with the coaching right now.

 

But playing Ferguson in certain situations is a good idea, IMO. You guys are acting like he's awful and shouldn't even have made the team. 

 

I haven't been impressed with Todman or Turbin, either, and we know exactly what those guys are. 

 

Allen didn't mouth off, either. He came to work and did his job, even though he wasn't being used in the best capacity. 

 

I get the frustration, for sure. Neither guy has been perfect. But all the 'it's time for them to go' is outrageous. 

I'm not trying to start an argument, but you tell me what other team Ferguson is going to make the roster on? I suppose that is over stating but I have yet to see "scat back" potential. I don't see quickness or top end speed and his hands have been OK but not great. He's had several drops.

 

As for Allen, he has had ample time to 1) be reliable 2) be healthy 3) play at the level of his contract. He has done none of those things. He's the 11th highest paid TE in the league and he's being outplayed right now by one Jack Doyle and he's being paid in the same neighborhood as Jason Witten, Kyle Rudolph, Greg Olsen, heck he's making 1.5 mil less than Rob Gronkowski. The last straw for me with him was Sunday. Wide open, ball hits him in the hands and it bounces off his hands and chest for a big 3rd down drop. Outrageous? Probably is to let him go during the season. If nothing changes by the end of this season? You damn right I'd let him go faster than you can say BUST.

[Valpo2004]

On 10/4/2016 at 8:14 PM, Gavin said:

As a person that is high on PFF such as myself I'd have to agree about the Castonzo grade. I know PFF has their reasons for the grade Castonzo has and they most likely are credible and us fans just are not taking something into account that they are. We have to remember those grades given are checked multiple times by their staff as well as individuals who have either played the game or coached the game.

 

I don't always agree with PFF grades. Some from time to time are down right eyebrow raising such as Castonzos grade. I do however think they are the best out there and are pretty accurate overall

 

In defense of PFF, we might be biased because the only time we often notice an OL, especially a LT is when he gives up a sack.

 

 

[Valpo2004]

So looking at those numbers, it seems to me that if you move Haeg inside to RG, his pass blocking issues won't be as much of a problem and his run blocking could shine better.

 

I don't think we've seen much of Clark but if he's the highest graded guy besides Mewhort, AC, Kelly, and Haeg then I would say maybe we should move him into RT.  I mean at this point how much worse can he do then what we already have??

 

With time maybe Haeg and Clark could improve and we could have ourselves a decent OL.  If they are both just below average right now, since they are rookies one could expect that they would hopefully at least develop into average players.  

 

I think giving Allen all that money was a huge mistake and we now really need a good TE.  He's had a lot of drops.  That's something we have to consider in the draft.  

 

RB is also something we need. 

 

Dorsett has been a bit of a disappointment thus far.  I'm afraid he might be a draft bust.  But I would say we can afford to give him another year if we have Moncrief and Hilton.

 

Of course none of that addresses our multiple needs on defense.  

[Superman]

5 hours ago, theanarchist said:

I don't see quickness or top end speed and his hands have been OK but not great. He's had several drops.

 

I see quickness, don't know why you don't. The best example I can think of off the top of my head is the angle route he ran against the Chargers. Yes, he's had drops, and that's not good (I only remember two). He's also slipped and fallen down too much. But the potential is there.

 

I don't know what other teams he'd make, it depends on what they think of their current stable of backs. That's irrelevant to me, though; the question is whether he has anything to add to the Colts stable of backs, and I think he does. He has plenty to work on, and he can't keep dropping passes, that's for sure. 

 

Quote

As for Allen, he has had ample time to 1) be reliable 2) be healthy 3) play at the level of his contract

 

Four games is ample time? He's been healthy since 2014, save for a couple games. 

 

Quote

The last straw for me with him was Sunday.

 

Yes, that's outrageous. He has a body of work. He's had three substandard games this season. He's still a well rounded TE who can make plays, based on his entire body of work. You're talking about getting rid of a 5th year guy because he's had a couple bad games.

[theanarchist]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

I see quickness, don't know why you don't. The best example I can think of off the top of my head is the angle route he ran against the Chargers. Yes, he's had drops, and that's not good (I only remember two). He's also slipped and fallen down too much. But the potential is there.

 

I don't know what other teams he'd make, it depends on what they think of their current stable of backs. That's irrelevant to me, though; the question is whether he has anything to add to the Colts stable of backs, and I think he does. He has plenty to work on, and he can't keep dropping passes, that's for sure. 

 

 

Four games is ample time? He's been healthy since 2014, save for a couple games. 

 

 

Yes, that's outrageous. He has a body of work. He's had three substandard games this season. He's still a well rounded TE who can make plays, based on his entire body of work. You're talking about getting rid of a 5th year guy because he's had a couple bad games.

He's averaged 2.2 rec's and 25 yards a game over his career. Well worth the 7.5 million per he's getting

[dudeski]

2 hours ago, theanarchist said:

He's averaged 2.2 rec's and 25 yards a game over his career. Well worth the 7.5 million per he's getting

They aren't paying him for his his career.  They are paying him for what he will do.

[theanarchist]

23 hours ago, dudeski said:

They aren't paying him for his his career.  They are paying him for what he will do.

And he's doing great so far...