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Did Manning knowingly hurt his team in pursuit of stats?

Esquire59

By Esquire59
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Esquire59 Walk On

Esquire59

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Looking for objective, unemotional analysis here. 

 

Peyton Manning was the worst QB in the NFL, 2015 season, yesterday.  He looked absolutely abysmal.  He knew at the end of pre-game that his PF was incredibly painful and limiting.  Staring down the barrel of a divisional match-up, he didn't tell Kubiak and went out and single-handedly last the game.  5-25, 2 sacks, a fumble, and FOUR INTs. 

 

But, hey, he got that second-to-last-most-coveted statistical record.  If I'm a Broncos fan I'm absolutely furious.  Now he's apparently p.o.'d at Kubiak for benching him.

 

Denver goes 1-6 or 2-5 over last 7 games and misses the playoffs.  Watch.  Why did he play yesterday? Was the record worth it?

 

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dw49 Team Captain

dw49

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Looking for objective, unemotional analysis here. 

 

Peyton Manning was the worst QB in the NFL, 2015 season, yesterday.  He looked absolutely abysmal.  He knew at the end of pre-game that his PF was incredibly painful and limiting.  Staring down the barrel of a divisional match-up, he didn't tell Kubiak and went out and single-handedly last the game.  5-25, 2 sacks, a fumble, and FOUR INTs. 

 

But, hey, he got that second-to-last-most-coveted statistical record.  If I'm a Broncos fan I'm absolutely furious.  Now he's apparently p.o.'d at Kubiak for benching him.

 

Denver goes 1-6 or 2-5 over last 7 games and misses the playoffs.  Watch.  Why did he play yesterday? Was the record worth it?

 

 

Naa.. he's like all great athletes . He probably still thinks he can play well if given the chance next week. 

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Esquire59 Walk On

Esquire59

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Are you sure about some of your claims?

No surety to any of my claims.  Its my opinion.  I'm just shocked by the whole situation.  It sucks seeing him play so poorly over the last 1.5 seasons.  I wish he would have retired last year after getting destroyed by our Colts (his record 9th one-and-done).  But, I can't get over the fact that he knowingly went out there with the injuries and is fighting Kubiak as of today to play against the Bears. 

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Susie Q Walk On

Susie Q

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No surety to any of my claims.  Its my opinion.  I'm just shocked by the whole situation.  It sucks seeing him play so poorly over the last 1.5 seasons.  I wish he would have retired last year after getting destroyed by our Colts (his record 9th one-and-done).  But, I can't get over the fact that he knowingly went out there with the injuries and is fighting Kubiak as of today to play against the Bears.

Do you have a link of Peyton fighting with Kubiak ? If not it's hearsay or just your opinion.

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Esquire59 Walk On

Esquire59

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Do you have a link of Peyton fighting with Kubiak ? If not it's hearsay or just your opinion.

All the outlets reporting Kub's decision to bench him quote Kub's as saying Peyton's very unhappy about the decision to bench him.  So there's that.  Technically, it's all hearsay unless we were there. 

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Esquire59 Walk On

Esquire59

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Where does it say in there that he and Kubiak are fighting?

Well, ya know, the whole part about being angry about the benching decision and disagreeing with Kubiak about his ability to play.  And, you surely noted that I didn't claim they were "fighting."  I repeated the quotes that Manning was fighting to play (i.e., urging, asking, lobbying, advocating..).  What's next question(s)?  Or care to discuss the content of my questions?

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Nesjan3 Ring of Honor

Nesjan3

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lol this is funny, I highly doubt that in any way at all manning played injured just so he could break the record, its pretty bad that people would assume that, these athletes are like every athlete they want to win bottom line, im pretty sure he thought he could still be effective. Its also funny how even though Kubiak has already sayd when Manning is healthy he is our QB but all the analysts and "experts" are just bashing this topic, saying things like "he is benched for good", "get used to the sidelines", "he wont get a shot to break the Favres win record" etc etc, he is still far better than Brock and more than half the starting QBs in the NFL, so cool it Broncos fans how would like to be Houston who has never had a quality QB in their existence, or even worse the Brown, where QBs go to die

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NewColtsFan Ring of Honor

NewColtsFan

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Looking for objective, unemotional analysis here. 

 

Peyton Manning was the worst QB in the NFL, 2015 season, yesterday.  He looked absolutely abysmal.  He knew at the end of pre-game that his PF was incredibly painful and limiting.  Staring down the barrel of a divisional match-up, he didn't tell Kubiak and went out and single-handedly last the game.  5-25, 2 sacks, a fumble, and FOUR INTs. 

 

But, hey, he got that second-to-last-most-coveted statistical record.  If I'm a Broncos fan I'm absolutely furious.  Now he's apparently p.o.'d at Kubiak for benching him.

 

Denver goes 1-6 or 2-5 over last 7 games and misses the playoffs.  Watch.  Why did he play yesterday? Was the record worth it?

 

 

I think you've spectacularly misread pretty much EVERYTHING.

 

He didn't "knowingly" do anything except try to help his team win.

 

And he didn't do it in the pursuit of "stats".....   he decided to play to try and help his team WIN.

 

And I don't think he's PO'D at Kubiak.

 

So,  as best I can tell,  you're oh for 3.   

 

Great players think they can help their team win.    

 

That's why some guy named Andrew Luck continued to play with a bad shoulder,  bad ribs,  a lacerated kidney and a torn stomach muscle.     Not for stats,  but to try and help the Colts win.        Same with Peyton.

 

Wow.       That's pretty sad that you actually wrote that.......               :facepalm:

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oldunclemark Walk On

oldunclemark

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Looking for objective, unemotional analysis here. 

 

Peyton Manning was the worst QB in the NFL, 2015 season, yesterday.  He looked absolutely abysmal.  He knew at the end of pre-game that his PF was incredibly painful and limiting.  Staring down the barrel of a divisional match-up, he didn't tell Kubiak and went out and single-handedly last the game.  5-25, 2 sacks, a fumble, and FOUR INTs. 

 

But, hey, he got that second-to-last-most-coveted statistical record.  If I'm a Broncos fan I'm absolutely furious.  Now he's apparently p.o.'d at Kubiak for benching him.

 

Denver goes 1-6 or 2-5 over last 7 games and misses the playoffs.  Watch.  Why did he play yesterday? Was the record worth it?

Media cares much more about the stats that he does...Peyton had to play Sunday...and here's why

After his 2 best games of the season, he knew he was hurt but he also knew that his team was down 2 defensive starters.....Peyton started 55 Denver games in a row and this is a Super Bowl or bust team,. They are going for a top seed and a bye.

On a team where half the veteran players said they came to Denver to play with him, he had to get out there if he possibly could.

If the team leader does not play coming off 2 good games because he's hurting, what does that say about him?

If this was Big Ben Rothlisberger (who has played with limits and big pain), we'd talk about hw tough he is.

He played hurt because that's what the QB does on all teams

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amfootball Walk On

amfootball

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I had thought there was a good chance he would get benched after breaking the record as he has the worst passer rating of all QBs that have started all games this season. That being said, he seemed to find himself vs GB but then regressed again vs Indy although he had a decent second half. The issue is he is 39 and a half and Elway knew that keeping healthy was priority number one which is why he had him on a pitch count and gave him Weds off but apparently it was not enough. He seems to be laboring to me almost every game. Wincing and trying to find himself.

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oldunclemark Walk On

oldunclemark

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No surety to any of my claims.  Its my opinion.  I'm just shocked by the whole situation.  It sucks seeing him play so poorly over the last 1.5 seasons.  I wish he would have retired last year after getting destroyed by our Colts (his record 9th one-and-done).  But, I can't get over the fact that he knowingly went out there with the injuries and is fighting Kubiak as of today to play against the Bears.

Peyton isnt fighting with Kubiak from what I read. Of course, he is upset with being sat down

What QB would be Okay with it...?

.

Peyton played well most of last year..and now he's hurt. Jay Cutler plays hurt..Tom Brady plays hurt.

Peyton did what NFL QBs all do..no more, no less

The leader ALWAYS knowingly does out there with injuries. That's the NFL.

I'd be shocked if Peyton did not play with injuries.

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Esquire59 Walk On

Esquire59

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I think you've spectacularly misread pretty much EVERYTHING.

He didn't "knowingly" do anything except try to help his team win.

And he didn't do it in the pursuit of "stats"..... he decided to play to try and help his team WIN.

And I don't think he's PO'D at Kubiak.

So, as best I can tell, you're oh for 3.

Great players think they can help their team win.

That's why some guy named Andrew Luck continued to play with a bad shoulder, bad ribs, a lacerated kidney and a torn stomach muscle. Not for stats, but to try and help the Colts win. Same with Peyton.

Wow. That's pretty sad that you actually wrote that....... :facepalm:

This is awesomeness. Love the graphics. I think you've spectacularly misread everything too. Oh, and you misspelled zero. Ha! Good stuff.

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oldunclemark Walk On

oldunclemark

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All the outlets reporting Kub's decision to bench him quote Kub's as saying Peyton's very unhappy about the decision to bench him.  So there's that.  Technically, it's all hearsay unless we were there.

Of course, Peyton is very unhappy with the decision to bench him. Think about that sentence.

I accept that hearsay as fact

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Esquire59 Walk On

Esquire59

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I had thought there was a good chance he would get benched after breaking the record as he has the worst passer rating of all QBs that have started all games this season. That being said, he seemed to find himself vs GB but then regressed again vs Indy although he had a decent second half. The issue is he is 39 and a half and Elway knew that keeping healthy was priority number one which is why he had him on a pitch count and gave him Weds off but apparently it was not enough. He seems to be laboring to me almost every game. Wincing and trying to find himself.

Thanks for the objective discussion. Good points all around.

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oldunclemark Walk On

oldunclemark

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Its hard to bench a guy on a 7-0 team ad Peyton played well at Indy.

When an older player hangs on, he is always assigned a motive as if being a champion isn't enough.

Ray Lewis hung on to win a title..so did Jerome Bettis...

In some respects, so did John Elway..

...The idea that Peyton came back this season to break records instead of to win a title is a spin.

The Broncos aren't the LA Lakers and Kobe

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southwest1 Walk On

southwest1

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Actually, I was more ticked off at TJ Ward for being dirty & getting ejected out of the game yesterday. Why does Denver's defense & secondary loose it mentally when they are down on the scoreboard? 

 

A huge sign of immaturity, unprofessionalism, & lashing out hurting your team at the worst possible time. That's all I remember from that game: Picks & an arm hit on a tackle that was completely unnecessary. 

 

John Elway needs to hire psychologists to get Wade Phillips squads head screwed on right. Talib, Ward, Wolfe, what the hades is going on gentlemen?! Learn to lose with dignity just like NY did @ Metlife last night. 

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southwest1 Walk On

southwest1

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Regarding Manning, clearly yesterday was not his finest hour. I would have taken him out after his 2nd interception because his accuracy was way off. I did like Favre's well wishes message about breaking his record from his tree stand. Very classy on #4's part. Kudos Brett! Well done. 

 

I hated when the stadium crowd booed #18 yesterday. Come on guys, Peyton & company took the Broncos to a SB in 2013 don't be colossal jerks okay. Brock threw turnovers yesterday as well & he had reps this week in practice too. Manning's turnovers are a problem yes, but Brock isn't gonna carry this team to a ring. No way in hades. In addition, if you sit Peyton for the rest of the season, you're basically telling all your veterans on the field that the years totally over now. Let's not forget that KC stuffed Denver's running game like a Thanksgiving turkey yesterday as well. 

 

Brock is no savior. Trust me. 

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Fx Stryker Walk On

Fx Stryker

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I had thought there was a good chance he would get benched

 

Since when has Manning lost the starting job? He is injured. Was he taken out of the game yesterday, yes. Wasn't Brady taken out last year too for poor play?

 

The only difference is Manning is too banged up to play the next week. He hasn't been benched.

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chad72 Ring of Honor

chad72

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The enemy's enemy is my friend, the saying goes. An enemy of Peyton is the friend of those who are in a mood to despise Peyton or he-ll bent on despising him whenever they get the chance (they know who they are). So I will take their opinions with a grain of salt when those Peyton haters come to pour gas on this Peyton benching fire.

 

Ever given your all to anything you are passionate about? Ever had to come to terms with the fact that you couldn't do it at the same level anymore? Every man, living or crawling has a sense of pride in what he does and it will hurt when you are faced with the reality of coming to terms that you couldn't do something you were good at, as well as before. I am not going to dump on Peyton when he is down. I am just glad that when I cannot do what I do at a good level i.e. my job, the whole world won't be watching and deriding me.  :dunno:

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southwest1 Walk On

southwest1

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Its hard to bench a guy on a 7-0 team ad Peyton played well at Indy.

When an older player hangs on, he is always assigned a motive as if being a champion isn't enough.

Ray Lewis hung on to win a title..so did Jerome Bettis...

In some respects, so did John Elway..

...The idea that Peyton came back this season to break records instead of to win a title is a spin.

The Broncos aren't the LA Lakers and Kobe

Yeah, I agree with that notion totally OUM. Neither John Elway or Peyton Manning will continue this partnership in Denver if they both determine 18's body is breaking down or it's taking longer to heal once this season is over. It was a tough game to watch yesterday because I admire everything Manning stands for: Tremendous work ethic, dedicated film study enthusiast, fantastic comedian & TV pitchman, & a smart field general who gets the most out of teammates around him. I took zero pleasure in seeing Peyton's face on the sideline's with his helmet on as he watched from the sidelines. It was hard to witness that. 

 

Let Peyton sit out 2 weeks & see what he feels like after that. Yes, I know he wants to play against the Patriots but if Peyton's foot & ribs hurt how well can he scramble against Chandler Jones? I would still let Peyton finish out the regular season because he's earned that right to me. You don't yank a HOF QB permanently unless Peyton says I can't do what is necessary to win games. I ride with the dude that got me 7 wins this year. Okay yes, his defense made some incredible plays this year that's true. Let 18 rest for 2 weeks & see how he's moving & throwing passes with his lower hips vs pure arm strength. 

 

Brock will only keep the QB seat warm not take Manning's job. He's not that exceptional to me. I want Peyton healthy for the playoffs. That's why I'd be doing this minor 2 week R & R treatment. 

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oldunclemark Walk On

oldunclemark

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Brock is filling the Matt Hasselback role to me..

If he can win one game on the road...he's proven something for the future and kept his team securely in 1st place .

But you are right...You then go back to Manning because Brock dosent have the experience for the playoffs and that's where you're going Peyton is down but Id bet he's not out.

I'm hoping Peyton can go against the Patriots. Denver needs a bye week to have a chance in the post-season.

To get it, they have to beat NE and Cincy

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southwest1 Walk On

southwest1

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"Did Manning knowingly hurt his team in pursuit of stats?" 

 

Your headline to this thread is misleading E-59 because it creates the false impression that all Manning cares about is padding records for HOF Jacket. 18 only need 4 yards I think to pass Brett Favre. 

 

You're making it sound like Peyton got the game ball, bowed to the crowd, & said to Coach Kubiack "I done now man. I gonna chill on the bench over there & sip Gatorade for over 2 hours. Thanks." 

 

I recall in 2009 when under Coach Caldwell he sat down with the rest of the starters vs the NY Jets under Rex Ryan which ended INDY's winning streak that year so I wouldn't imply that 18 is selfish or self centered. JMO. 

 

I know in the past I have been strict on Peyton, but I know he's a fantastic QB despite his post season hiccups from previous years. Like Chad72 said, I don't believe in kicking someone down when he merely had a bad day at the office. I'm also proud of Peyton for admitting he played poorly last night. That takes guts & I respect that kind of honesty immensely. 

 

He will finish strong. Not ring worthy, but a lasting impression that makes his fans go "Yep, there's the game changer that I remember" & smile. 

 

Chew on this food for thought E-59: If Peyton was so consumed by stats, then he would have said something like this at his post press conference: 

 

"Okay, I threw 4 picks but who cares I broke Favre's passing record in the NFL. Lead with that headline boys alright? Thanks fellas." Wink. Wink. 

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HiltonTD Walk On

HiltonTD

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Philip Rivers having a great year statistically, 2-7.

 

Peyton Manning having a down year statistically, 7-2, currently have a playoff bye.

 

QB wins.

 

Its the Broncos defense that has won them games despite Manning.  Manning has been the 2nd worst QB in the league this year, ahead of only Ryan Mallet who is no longer on an NFL roster.  Its pretty astonishing to see his skills diminish so quickly.. but it started the 2nd half of last year and has continued to be bad throughout this entire year. 

 

9 TDs, 17 Interceptions?  Absolutely horrible... and it stinks to see him end on this kind of note, he should have retired.. you don't want to be remembered like this.

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HiltonTD

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I had thought there was a good chance he would get benched after breaking the record as he has the worst passer rating of all QBs that have started all games this season. That being said, he seemed to find himself vs GB but then regressed again vs Indy although he had a decent second half. The issue is he is 39 and a half and Elway knew that keeping healthy was priority number one which is why he had him on a pitch count and gave him Weds off but apparently it was not enough. He seems to be laboring to me almost every game. Wincing and trying to find himself.

 

Yea, it pains me to admit it but Manning looks like a shell of his former self... literally the worst active QB in the NFL right now statistically... that is shocking

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HiltonTD Walk On

HiltonTD

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Since when has Manning lost the starting job? He is injured. Was he taken out of the game yesterday, yes. Wasn't Brady taken out last year too for poor play?

 

The only difference is Manning is too banged up to play the next week. He hasn't been benched.

 

I think a big difference is that Brady was pulled during a blowout loss early in the season and played great the rest of the way, all the way to a Super Bowl.  Manning has played poorly (literally the worst QB in the league this year statistically other than Ryan Mallet, who is no longer on a roster) and he played pretty poorly the 2nd half of last year.. There has been little to no improvement, just consistently bad.  There were a lot of games that the broncos should have lost because of Manning's interceptions and poor performance, but the defense has been so elite they have bailed him out repeatedly.

 

Really is sad to watch a great one like Manning be reduced to this..  this should be his last year in the NFL

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Surge89 Walk On

Surge89

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Looking for objective, unemotional analysis here.

Peyton Manning was the worst QB in the NFL, 2015 season, yesterday. He looked absolutely abysmal. He knew at the end of pre-game that his PF was incredibly painful and limiting. Staring down the barrel of a divisional match-up, he didn't tell Kubiak and went out and single-handedly last the game. 5-25, 2 sacks, a fumble, and FOUR INTs.

But, hey, he got that second-to-last-most-coveted statistical record. If I'm a Broncos fan I'm absolutely furious. Now he's apparently p.o.'d at Kubiak for benching him.

Denver goes 1-6 or 2-5 over last 7 games and misses the playoffs. Watch. Why did he play yesterday? Was the record worth it?

Lol maybe you should just stop talking.

The irony is you claim you want objective conversation yet have 0 depth to your statements lol.

But yea bud keep claiming you're looking for a mature objective conversation.

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