Jones low-balling Murray....

[NewColtsFan]

I don't know if this is the current offer, or only the last offer....

 

But as of right now,  the Cowboys DeMarco Murray has only a $16 Million dollar offer from the Cowboy.

 

When I saw that, I thought to myself....   "Hmmm....  2 years,  $16 MIll?   Seems to short a contract."

 

And it is....   I was wrong.....    it's a 4-year, $16 Mill contract.    $4 Mill per.

 

It's bizarre because Murray will get a bigger offer in Free Agency.   And at his age,  he's got to take the much better offer.   This will be his first and last big contract.

 

Here's the story.....

 

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000458473/article/demarco-murray-dallas-cowboys-disagree-on-value

[shakedownstreet]

Jones low-balling 

 

that'll happen when one gets to be his age

[akcolt]

there was talk last year if Murray was the cowboys back of the future. They have a good O Line I would let someone else pay him draft a cheaper option. He has difficulty staying on the field Cowboys will have some tough calls to make.

 

Please don't start saying we should make a run at him. No way do you want to spend big bucks on a RB

[Derakynn]

Don't really believe it is Murray honestly. So I get the sentiment. I'd think most backs could produce with that OL. I don't see running backs getting much more than 5m anymore. Most of those contracts that are were signed in the past and they are going away. 

[snkdy]

I know the line deserves a lot of credit, but he still had an amazing year. 1800 yards is no joke.

 

If that's the amount of money they're offering, he'll probably leave Dallas.

[Bluefire4]

Everybody will low ball him.. well maybe expect the Jags and Raiders. Teams just don't pay for RBs anymore.

[mintor]

colts take him need exp rb 

[oldunclemark]

Don't really believe it is Murray honestly. So I get the sentiment. I'd think most backs could produce with that OL. I don't see running backs getting much more than 5m anymore. Most of those contracts that are were signed in the past and they are going away.

I agree.,.that is a very good run blocking line

..They have to sign Dez, too...//Take what you can get D-Marc

[esmort]

I wouldn't offer him a big contract either. The writer said it all when he referenced the devaluation of the RB position.  Teams regularly get serviceable to great production out of low draft picks and UDFAs, and with the OL the Cowboys have they can easily find RB that will give them a good running game, especially with so many good RBs coming out in the draft.  Add that to the fact that it is no secret that Jones is looking at AP, who will bring the publicity that Jones lives for and its no wonder they are letting Murray walk.

[esmort]

colts take him need exp rb 

 

No, that would be a terrible move ... we would be going from overspending a draft pick on one, to overspending on salary.  RBs are not a scarce resource in the modern NFL.

[COLTS449]

As we all know RB's are basically a dime a dozen anymore. No smart GM is going to give him a 60 million dollar contract. In no way should we make a run at him either. We need to draft a RB in the 2nd or 3rd and possibly sign Spiller too if the price is right.

[oldunclemark]

You can draft a strong young back with young legs..in the 2nd or 3rd round

[braveheartcolt]

As we all know RB's are basically a dime a dozen anymore. No smart GM is going to give him a 60 million dollar contract. In no way should we make a run at him either. We need to draft a RB in the 2nd or 3rd and possibly sign Spiller too if the price is right.

I still chuckle to myself about a RB called 'spiller'. Childish.

[mintor]

As we all know RB's are basically a dime a dozen anymore. No smart GM is going to give him a 60 million dollar contract. In no way should we make a run at him either. We need to draft a RB in the 2nd or 3rd and possibly sign Spiller too if the price is right.

 waste draft pick on rb ?  we need draft rg and rt ?  on offense line then need a cb , olb and mlb .

[NewColtsFan]

As we all know RB's are basically a dime a dozen anymore. No smart GM is going to give him a 60 million dollar contract. In no way should we make a run at him either. We need to draft a RB in the 2nd or 3rd and possibly sign Spiller too if the price is right.

 

Who in the world said anything about a $60 Million dollar contract?

 

There are lots of numbers between $16 and $60.    The 20's,  the 30's, the 40's and even the 50's.

 

I'm not even suggesting most of those.    But no one talked about a $60 million dollar deal.

 

This is what is known as a Strawman argument.    Throwout a ridiculous argument that no one is making and then knock it down.

[New Zealands #1 Colts Fan]

 waste draft pick on rb ?  we need draft rg and rt ?  on offense line then need a cb , olb and mlb .

dont forget safety

[akcolt]

He'd have been putting up big numbers long before this they just never handed him the ball carries went from 160 his first 2 yrs then 270 to 390 this year health has always been a concern

[New Zealands #1 Colts Fan]

It is typical these days though.  Run a guy absolutely ragged for a season then say thanks and good luck with your new team. While they do the same to someone else next year.  Boom, Forsett, CJ Anderson are just some examples of what a low drafted or udfa player can perform like.  So why waste money or a high pick and get someone like Trich in return

[mintor]

It is typical these days though.  Run a guy absolutely ragged for a season then say thanks and good luck with your new team. While they do the same to someone else next year.  Boom, Forsett, CJ Anderson are just some examples of what a low drafted or udfa player can perform like.  So why waste money or a high pick and get someone like Trich in return

 

 

why waste a picks in the first 4 rd's is  a waste on RB's

[COLTS449]

Who in the world said anything about a $60 Million dollar contract?

 

There are lots of numbers between $16 and $60.    The 20's,  the 30's, the 40's and even the 50's.

 

I'm not even suggesting most of those.    But no one talked about a $60 million dollar deal.

 

This is what is known as a Strawman argument.    Throwout a ridiculous argument that no one is making and then knock it down.

 

 It was the first number off the top of my head and I never said anyone mentioned that number but you should know what I meant, it was an example. No smart GM is going to give him a ridiculous contract. Next time I wont make an exaggerated example... ;)

[COLTS449]

 waste draft pick on rb ?  we need draft rg and rt ?  on offense line then need a cb , olb and mlb .

 

To get a RB with fresh legs. Think if we could get a Le'veon Bell or Jeremy Hill type RB in the 2nd or 3rd. I think we should address the O Line through FA too. You could argue it both ways though, that's just my opinion.

[pacolts56]

To get a RB with fresh legs. Think if we could get a Le'veon Bell or Jeremy Hill type RB in the 2nd or 3rd. I think we should address the O Line through FA too. You could argue it both ways though, that's just my opinion.

LOL.....well, we coulda drafted Bell instead of Werner at #26 in 2013.

 

But we're not allowed to draft a RB in the first round.

 

Ever...EVER....EVER!!!!

[COLTS449]

LOL.....well, we coulda drafted Bell instead of Werner at #26 in 2013.

 

But we're not allowed to draft a RB in the first round.

 

Ever...EVER....EVER!!!!

 

Well if you want to look at it like that we could have traded down and still got Bell plus got like Jamie Collins or Warford. LOL, but I was saying we could draft a RB in the 2nd or 3rd to give us similar production as those two guys, and obviously we shouldn't draft one in the 1st, we basically already did with T-Bust.

[NewColtsFan]

 It was the first number off the top of my head and I never said anyone mentioned that number but you should know what I meant, it was an example. No smart GM is going to give him a ridiculous contract. Next time I wont make an exaggerated example... ;)

 

Thanks....  and agreed.    He's not going to get an Adrian Peterson contract.

 

But while 90% of the RB's are getting 3-5 Mill per,  I still think there is room for a higher year per for guys like Murray who had, I believe,  449 touches in the 16 regular season games this year.     That's 28 per game.   That kind of production can't just be replaced by anyone....     Murray is a special talent,  even if he's not AP...

[Superman]

I think that's probably the standing offer that's been on the table for months now. Maybe it hasn't changed, but I don't think it's the offer that they've made recently.

 

I think he'd get $5m/year on the open market. But not too long ago, he was the injury prone, fumble prone, timeshare RB who couldn't be trusted with a full load. Even this year, he got hurt and fumbled six times. How long can he put up top tier numbers? He'll be 27 in a month...

 

And as we know, the Cowboys have a great offense and a great line. Joseph Randle averaged 6.7 yards/carry behind that line. They can put together a backfield to get similar production on the ground. The Pats are the Pats, I know, but they had similar production last season with an assortment of JAGs, and a less talented offensive line. He plays the least value-added / wins above replacement position on offense. 

 

So I'm good with them low balling him. As great as he was this season, he's replaceable, and it makes zero sense to sink prime money into a non-prime position. With rollover, they start the league year with about $5m in cap space, assuming a cap of $140m. They have to add players on defense. They have to keep Dez Bryant. I'm sure they want to keep Rolando McClain and Sterling Moore. They can restructure some guys to create cap space, and will probably have to, but Murray might very well wind up being a free agency casualty. 

[esmort]

Thanks....  and agreed.    He's not going to get an Adrian Peterson contract.

 

But while 90% of the RB's are getting 3-5 Mill per,  I still think there is room for a higher year per for guys like Murray who had, I believe,  449 touches in the 16 regular season games this year.     That's 28 per game.   That kind of production can't just be replaced by anyone....     Murray is a special talent,  even if he's not AP...

 

He's not that special ... IMO the only reason you would ever give a RB premium money is if a team somehow managed to have acquired top talent at every other position, plus a good 2nd string, and no cap issues  ... or he was some AP mixed with B Sanders and a dash Bo Jackson.... which would mean pretty much never.

[Sting]

 waste draft pick on rb ?  we need draft rg and rt ?  on offense line then need a cb , olb and mlb .

I wish I could like this 100 more times.  I don't mind using a 6th or 7th round pick on a rb, but not a 2nd or 3rd rounder.  I would take a safety over a cb though.  

[amfootball]

I don't know if this is the current offer, or only the last offer....

 

But as of right now,  the Cowboys DeMarco Murray has only a $16 Million dollar offer from the Cowboy.

 

When I saw that, I thought to myself....   "Hmmm....  2 years,  $16 MIll?   Seems to short a contract."

 

And it is....   I was wrong.....    it's a 4-year, $16 Mill contract.    $4 Mill per.

 

It's bizarre because Murray will get a bigger offer in Free Agency.   And at his age,  he's got to take the much better offer.   This will be his first and last big contract.

 

Here's the story.....

 

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000458473/article/demarco-murray-dallas-cowboys-disagree-on-value

That is the market right now for RBs not named AP. And he did run behind the best Oline in football and also has an injury history. Not sure he will get a lot more from another team.

[SilentHill]

I think it's a fair deal considering his injury history.

 

That being said, devaluation at the RB position is happening. Unless you are Jamaal Charles, or Adrian Peterson you are not getting paid.

[Valpo2004]

I don't know if this is the current offer, or only the last offer....

 

But as of right now,  the Cowboys DeMarco Murray has only a $16 Million dollar offer from the Cowboy.

 

When I saw that, I thought to myself....   "Hmmm....  2 years,  $16 MIll?   Seems to short a contract."

 

And it is....   I was wrong.....    it's a 4-year, $16 Mill contract.    $4 Mill per.

 

It's bizarre because Murray will get a bigger offer in Free Agency.   And at his age,  he's got to take the much better offer.   This will be his first and last big contract.

 

Here's the story.....

 

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000458473/article/demarco-murray-dallas-cowboys-disagree-on-value

 

It's gonna be a hard hit to the leagues RB's but teams are realizing they lack value because they can find a lot of solid RB's.  Honestly a really good RB is only going to be a bit more valuable then a good kicker or punter.  

 

Also I wouldn't want to get the league's leading rusher from last year.  Historically speaking they tend to disappoint the next season.

 

I'd offer Murray maybe 5 mil a year.  4 years 20 mil, 2 mil guaranteed

[Valpo2004]

LOL.....well, we coulda drafted Bell instead of Werner at #26 in 2013.

 

But we're not allowed to draft a RB in the first round.

 

Ever...EVER....EVER!!!!

 

There are a lot of other players besides Bell we could have grabbed there too that are better then Werner.  

 

And we could have signed Justin Forsett to a pretty small contract too.  Could have gotten CJ Anderson as a UDFA.

 

RB's arn't worth a 1st round pick.  

 

I'd have to dig pretty deep but I once posted some of the stats in terms of YPC and # of 1000 yard seasons that showed that only 2 out of like 16 in the last 10 years or so where really worth a 1st round pick in terms of production.  (I defined that essentially as posting 1000 yard seasons the majority of their seasons in the league)  

[Narcosys]

colts take him need exp rb

You fail to realize that there is not a single running back in the league that could produce consistently behind our Oline.

[Valpo2004]

LOL.....well, we coulda drafted Bell instead of Werner at #26 in 2013.

 

But we're not allowed to draft a RB in the first round.

 

Ever...EVER....EVER!!!!

 

Ok found my old post so here it is explaining why I'm opposed to drafting RB's in the first.  The information is a little dated, I think by a month, 2 at most.  It should be noted that Mark Ingram did not rush for 1000 yards this season.  

 

"Every RB selected in the 1st round in the last 5 drafts that actually saw one drafted in the first round.

 

2007 

Adrian Peterson - 5 1000 yard seasons, 1 2000 yard season - 5 ypc career

Marshawn Lynch - 6 1000 yard seasons, 4.2 ypc career

 

2008

Darrien McFadden - 1 1000 yard season - 4.1 ypc career

Jonathan Stewart - 1 1000 yard season - 4.6 ypc career

Felix Jones - No 1000 yard seasons - 4.7 ypc career - OUT OF THE NFL, LAST PLAYED 2013

Rashard Mendenhall - 2 1000 yard seasons - 3.9 ypc career - RETIRED, LAST PLAYED 2013

Chris Johnson - 5 1000 yard seasons, 1 2000 yard season - 4.6 ypc career 

 

2009

Knowshon Moreno - 1 1000 yard season while playing with Peyton in 2013 - 4.1 ypc on his career.

Chris "Beanie" Wells - 1 1000 yard season in 2011 - 4 ypc on his career - OUT OF THE NFL - LAST PLAYED IN 2012

 

2010

CJ Spiller - 1 1000 yard season in 2012 - 5.1 ypc on his carerr

Ryan Matthews - 2 1000 yards season - 4.4 ypc on his career

Jahvid Best - No 1000 yard seasons - 3.7 ypc on career - OUT OF THE NFL - LAST PLAYED IN 2011

 

2011

Mark Ingram - No 1000 yard seasons but may have a chance this year.  4.2 ypc on career

 

2012

Trent Richardson - No 1000 yard seasons - 3.3 ypc on career

Doug Martin - 1 1000 yard season - 4.1 ypc on career

David Wilson - No 1000 yard seasons - 4.4 ypc on career - RETIRED DUE TO INJURES

 

So on that list I see 3 players who's production matched their first round draft status because they consistently put up 1000 yard or more seasons.  Adrian Peterson, Marshawn Lynch and Chris Johnson.

 

5 out of 16 have NEVER had a 1000 yard season.  Maybe it's due to sucking, maybe it's due to injuries, maybe it's due to rotation, but they just arn't doing it.  Also 5 of the 16 are out of the NFL now.  

 

Sure injuries and rotation arn't their fault but here is the thing. . . IT DOESN'T MATTER.  If you make a first round pick and he rarely plays because of injuries, it's still a bust and a waste of a 1st round pick when better selections could be made.

 

Likewise if he plays in a rotation you are wasting a 1st round pick on a ROTATIONAL PLAYER!!!  You don't want to spend a 1st round pick on a guy unless you can see him playing all 3 downs.  

 

This is why you don't spend a 1st round pick on a RB.  If you say of these 16 players only Adrian Peterson, Marshawn Lynch and Chris Johnson where worth it. . . that's an 18.75% success rate. . . which means that 81.25% of the RB's selected in the first round are legitimate busts. . . it's only a question of how badly and why they busted.  And for every Marshawn Lynch there is a Arian Foster who's had 4 1000 yard seasons since 2009 and 4.5 ypc on his career.

 

If you are spending a 1st round pick on a RB I personally would expect to see them get at least 1000 yards rushing on the majority of seasons they play in.  I don't think that's too much to ask considering how high you are picking them. 

[NewColtsFan]

It's gonna be a hard hit to the leagues RB's but teams are realizing they lack value because they can find a lot of solid RB's.  Honestly a really good RB is only going to be a bit more valuable then a good kicker or punter.  

 

Also I wouldn't want to get the league's leading rusher from last year.  Historically speaking they tend to disappoint the next season.

 

I'd offer Murray maybe 5 mil a year.  4 years 20 mil, 2 mil guaranteed

 

Nobody,  but absolutely nobody offers a 20 mill deal...   with only 2 mill guaranteed.

 

The guarantees will be much more substantial.    I'm sure they're more substantial in the deal that Jones is offering right now.

[Valpo2004]

Nobody,  but absolutely nobody offers a 20 mill deal...   with only 2 mill guaranteed.

 

The guarantees will be much more substantial.    I'm sure they're more substantial in the deal that Jones is offering right now.

 

Revis got a contract if I remember right worth more then 10 million per year with zero guarantees in it from Tampa Bay.  It does happen.

 

I would be very careful about the amount of guaranteed money I give an RB. 

 

Although I will say it wouldn't bother me if it was 7 mil guaranteed by simply guaranteeing the first year's salary and giving a 2 mil signing bonus.  

[jvan1973]

Revis got a contract if I remember right worth more then 10 million per year with zero guarantees in it from Tampa Bay. It does happen.

I would be very careful about the amount of guaranteed money I give an RB.

Although I will say it wouldn't bother me if it was 7 mil guaranteed by simply guaranteeing the first year's salary and giving a 2 mil signing bonus.

6 years 98 million no guarantees with the bucs

[Superman]

Revis got a contract if I remember right worth more then 10 million per year with zero guarantees in it from Tampa Bay.  It does happen.

 

I would be very careful about the amount of guaranteed money I give an RB. 

 

Although I will say it wouldn't bother me if it was 7 mil guaranteed by simply guaranteeing the first year's salary and giving a 2 mil signing bonus.  

 

Not to go off on a tangent, but the first year was guaranteed, practically speaking.

[Scully]

Rb's don't have as high of a value anymore. I remember when they use to get drafted in the 1st round every year

[NewColtsFan]

Revis got a contract if I remember right worth more then 10 million per year with zero guarantees in it from Tampa Bay.  It does happen.

 

I would be very careful about the amount of guaranteed money I give an RB. 

 

Although I will say it wouldn't bother me if it was 7 mil guaranteed by simply guaranteeing the first year's salary and giving a 2 mil signing bonus.  

 

I believe the entire first year of Revis' salary was guaranteed.   So, I think the figure was about $16 Mill.

[jvan1973]

I believe the entire first year of Revis' salary was guaranteed. So, I think the figure was about $16 Mill.

all first years of contracts are fully guaranteed. You just have to show up