The Better QB

[Qwiz]

They were established starters. Manziel isn't

What does being established have to do with anything? Point is they didn't lose their jobs just because they got hurt.

[Qwiz]

Plenty, and then some But it all worked out. Were in the playoffs for the third straight year, two years in a rowin the divisional round. All is well in Indy

Yeah, all bow down to the mighty wild card slayers.

[jvan1973]

Yeah, all bow down to the mighty wild card slayers.

How are the Texans doing in the playoffs?

[jvan1973]

What does being established have to do with anything? Point is they didn't lose their jobs just because they got hurt.

Johnny won't be named the starter until late in the preseason, if at all

[Qwiz]

How are the Texans doing in the playoffs?

Just as well as the Colts have the past three seasons. We're even in the Andrew regime. Two wild card wins.

[Qwiz]

Johnny won't be named the starter until late in the preseason, if at all

We'll see. They don't have many other options.

[jvan1973]

Just as well as the Colts have the past two seasons. We're even in the Andrew regime. Two wild card wins.

i don't recall the Texans being in the playoffs last year or this year. Certainly not twice since Andrew has been here

[Qwiz]

i don't recall the Texans being in the playoffs last year or this year. Certainly not twice since Andrew has been here

We went once since Andrew landed in Indiana. We barely missed this year. Doesn't change the fact that neither of our teams has done anything special in the postseason recently. Winning wild card games is not the main goal of any team.

[jvan1973]

We went once since Andrew landed in Indiana. We barely missed this year. Doesn't change the fact that neither of our teams has done anything special in the postseason recently. Winning wild card games is not the main goal of any team.

winning the division and making the playoffs is the first goal for every team

[Colts_Fan12]

Peyton Manning blew when he was a rookie. You know, because, more often than not, rookies blow.

this is a joke right? You didn't just compare Johnny tool to Peyton manning the GOAT??

[Qwiz]

winning the division and making the playoffs is the first goal for every team

Of course it is. But every team is looking to take it further. You don't get the Lombardi for winning your division.

[Qwiz]

this is a joke right? You didn't just compare Johnny tool to Peyton manning the GOAT??

Does it look like I'm laughing? Yeah, I did compare them. And Manning isn't a goat. He's a man.

[Colts_Fan12]

What does being established have to do with anything? Point is they didn't lose their jobs just because they got hurt.

they don't suck tho soooo....

[Qwiz]

they don't suck tho soooo....

Do you speak English?

No player is a Hall of Famer when they come into the league. And they definitely aren't busts when they only start for two games.

[Colts_Fan12]

Does it look like I'm laughing? Yeah, I did compare them. And Manning isn't a goat. He's a man.

that's just funny

[Qwiz]

that's just funny

I know, I'm known for my humor. ;)

[Colts_Fan12]

Do you speak English?

No player is a Hall of Famer when they come into the league. And they definitely aren't busts when they only start for two games.

your trying to use really good players as an example for keeping their jobs players like bowman and Foles they WIN and had done it many times what the hell has Johnny done to be guaranteed the starting job

[BOTT]

So the OP likes Winston and then compares him to Byron Leftwich. High praise, high praise indeed

[GoPats]

Neither of them will be anything special. Mariota will be the better of the two by far.

 

Some years with QBs in the NFL draft...

 

It's like going into a butcher shop right before they close. Just because that's the last steak they've got in the case, doesn't mean that it's actually a good steak. It's just the best one they've got left. 

 

More often than not, these first-round QBs strike me that way. Teams reach because the position is so important. 

 

I'm not sold on either of these guys. I think Mariota will be more serviceable than savior. And it wouldn't surprise me if Winston is out of the league in three years. 

[BlacknGold77]

your trying to use really good players as an example for keeping their jobs players like bowman and Foles they WIN and had done it many times what the hell has Johnny done to be guaranteed the starting job

 

to play devil's advocate, what did Peyton do to keep his in year one?

 

3-13

26 TD

28 INT + 3 Fumbles

56.7 Comp %

71.2 QB Rating

 

Pretty pedestrian at best.  Point being you can not judge a quarterback on year one, period.

 

One more for good measure.

 

Troy Aikman:

 

0-11

9 TD

18 INT + 6 Fumbles

52.9 Comp %

55.7 QB Rating

[Qwiz]

your trying to use really good players as an example for keeping their jobs players like bowman and Foles they WIN and had done it many times what the hell has Johnny done to be guaranteed the starting job

The grander point I was making is that a player doesn't automatically lose his job just because he got hurt. Manziel doesn't have any wins yet, no doubt, but he was the Browns first round pick and is such supposed to be looked at as the future.

[Colts_Fan12]

The grander point I was making is that a player doesn't automatically lose his job just because he got hurt. Manziel doesn't have any wins yet, no doubt, but he was the Browns first round pick and is such supposed to be looked at as the future.

I don't mind if they let him keep it it's the browns they have made stupid decisions for as long as I can remember

Hell picking Manziel over Bridgewater was not to bright

[ztboiler]

Ha, I'm actually a Cutler fan, so I wouldn't mind that at all! But I don't think he's leaving Chicago, especially since they just cut ties with Trestman.

True, it's hard to see them not giving him one more year in Chicago....but I don't see how anyone could reach a conclusion other than that Cutler is the problem there.  Where Cutler goes, losing or at best Mediocrity, will follow.  

 

Would absolutely love to have him in the division.

[Qwiz]

I don't mind if they let him keep it it's the browns they have made stupid decisions for as long as I can remember

Hell picking Manziel over Bridgewater was not to bright

Tell that to the Jaguars too, then.

[chad72]

This should be in the draft section, right?

[Qwiz]

True, it's hard to see them not giving him one more year in Chicago....but I don't see how anyone could reach a conclusion other than that Cutler is the problem there.  Where Cutler goes, losing or at best Mediocrity, will follow.  

 

Would absolutely love to have him in the division.

Hey, if anyone can coach quarterbacks it's BOB ;)

[dw49]

If only Mariota had decided to come out last year...

 

 

Usually these guys get an idea of where they would be drafted if they come out early. Not sure that Mariota was viewed as an elite prospect last year. I'm not even sure he goes 1.1 this year. But all it's all conjecture at this point. That's a crazy offense he plays in and a lot of teams are looking for pocket passers that can make the reads.

[Colts_Fan12]

Tell that to the Jaguars too, then.

they suck too? Lol

[Qwiz]

Usually these guys get an idea of where they would be drafted if they come out early. Not sure that Mariota was viewed as an elite prospect last year. I'm not even sure he goes 1.1 this year. But all it's all conjecture at this point. That's a crazy offense he plays in and a lot of teams are looking for pocket passers that can make the reads.

If I'm not mistaken, he was viewed as the number quarterback over all the other guys. True teams are looking for pocket passers but they also want competitors and playmakers, which will work in Mariota's favor.

[Surge89]

After watching the semi-final match-ups in college football, one thing was clear Mariotta and Winston were the best QB's. For the draft coming up which of the two will get picked first? Which of the two will have a better NFL career?

I think it'll be Winston, to both questions. He reminds me a lot off Byron Leftwich. Not only because he looks like him, but they also have similar styles of play. What do yo all think?

 

I see Winston being taken first overall.  Which imo is about the dumbest thing anyone could do in this draft.  I have a low 2nd to high 4th grade on him.  Mariotta will be number 2 off the board I assume which could very well be a smart pickup.  I see Mariotta in comparison to Colin Kaepernick.  IF he goes to a team that has a strong run game he will thrive in the NFL just like C.K.  If he is asked to carry a team I'm not sure how well he will do.  I see Winston as Manziel 2.0.  Not in play style but in attitude and I see him out of the league by the end of his rookie contract.  Winston has the capability to be a very good QB, just don't see him reaching even 50% of his potential.

[dw49]

If I'm not mistaken, he was viewed as the number quarterback over all the other guys. True teams are looking for pocket passers but they also want competitors and playmakers, which will work in Mariota's favor.

 

 

 Pretty much all we see is "talking head stuff." I've been following the draft for around 40 years and I know of nothing that would give you accurate info to support anything concrete that he would have been worthy of him being taken 1.1 last year. 

[Superman]

This should be in the draft section, right?

 

It should actually be in the trash, by now, but yeah, this is Draft section material, if anything. Moving...

[Qwiz]

Pretty much all we see is "talking head stuff." I've been following the draft for around 40 years and I know of nothing that would give you accurate info to support anything concrete that he would have been worthy of him being taken 1.1 last year.

Yeah, if there was a science to it then there would certainly be fewer flameouts. I guess we will never know Marcus would have gone first unless the Texans come out and say it was what they were planning or something.

[dw49]

Yeah, if there was a science to it then there would certainly be fewer flameouts. I guess we will never know Marcus would have gone first unless the Texans come out and say it was what they were planning or something.

If I had to guess , I would say around 12-25. But you could be right . Who the heck knows .. All we hear is the talking head stuff. The NFL people that have the opinions that count aren't going to divulge what they think for obvious reasons. I think there are a few guys that stayed in school that we know would have been heavily considered for 1.1 if they had come out. Strange but the only two I can think of are both Colts.. PM and AL.

[olemiss756]

I actually wouldn't be surprised to see Winston hold out on the draft this year. I feel like he has a lot of potential with his career especially if he can hold out on the draft one more year. 

[Qwiz]

If I had to guess , I would say around 12-25. But you could be right . Who the heck knows .. All we hear is the talking head stuff. The NFL people that have the opinions that count aren't going to divulge what they think for obvious reasons. I think there are a few guys that stayed in school that we know would have been heavily considered for 1.1 if they had come out. Strange but the only two I can think of are both Colts.. PM and AL.

Don't forget Jake Locker. There are probably others but I'm too tired to think too hard about it right now lol.

[NewColtsFan]

Peyton Manning blew when he was a rookie. You know, because, more often than not, rookies blow.

 

Sorry,  I stayed out of this as long as I could.....

 

But while Manning put up some very poor numbers,   there is no comparison -- none, nada, zip, zero -- between Manziels rookie year and Peyton's.

 

Just lumping them into the same category of "rookies blow" is not just wrong,  it's spectacularly wrong.

 

Manning played for a poor team and yet most everyone around him or who observed him thought he eventually was going to be great.

 

Who thinks that about Manziel.

 

And the beginning of Peyton's career was at a time where the rules were much more favorable to the defense than they are now...  all the rules changes of the last 15 years or so favor offense.     So this works against your Manziel argument.

 

Manziel may make it,  but he may also be a spectacular bust.    No one thought that about Peyton Manning.   No one.

[NewColtsFan]

 Pretty much all we see is "talking head stuff." I've been following the draft for around 40 years and I know of nothing that would give you accurate info to support anything concrete that he would have been worthy of him being taken 1.1 last year. 

 

I'm not sure if Mariotta would've been the first player picked last year.

 

But I feel confident that he would've been the first quarterback picked overall if he had come out.   

 

And, while I doubt I could find stories that said that, I'm pretty sure I read stories saying just that......

[Qwiz]

Sorry,  I stayed out of this as long as I could.....

 

But while Manning put up some very poor numbers,   there is no comparison -- none, nada, zip, zero -- between Manziels rookie year and Peyton's.

 

Just lumping them into the same category of "rookies blow" is not just wrong,  it's spectacularly wrong.

 

Manning played for a poor team and yet most everyone around him or who observed him thought he eventually was going to be great.

 

Who thinks that about Manziel.

 

And the beginning of Peyton's career was at a time where the rules were much more favorable to the defense than they are now...  all the rules changes of the last 15 years or so favor offense.     So this works against your Manziel argument.

 

Manziel may make it,  but he may also be a spectacular bust.    No one thought that about Peyton Manning.   No one.

Ayiyi. I am not saying that anyone thought Manning was going to be terrible or a bust. That was not what I wanted people to get out of what I posted my friend. I'm just saying, even Manning had his stinkers when he was a rookie. In fact, he even had a game where he threw zero TDs and two picks-not too dissimilar from Manziel's zero TD, no pick performance. You mention Manning was on a bad team...when have the Browns ever been considered good? They managed to become the same old Browns towards the end of the season, their running game vanished and they had to send several players on defense to IR. Yes, the rules favored the defense more back then, but defensive players are also bigger, smarter and faster now in today's NFL. Offenses wouldn't know what to do against guys like JJ Watt or Gerald McCoy if they played in the 80s or 90s. I'm not saying Johnny is going to be a surefire thing in the NFL. I'm just disputing the all too common notion that he is already done in the NFL. And everything about Manning was meant to, like I said, illustrate a larger picture. I'm not saying Manziel is going to come close to what Manning's status is.

[southwest1]

Mariota is more of a read-option style qb and Winston is the better pocket passer, however, Winston's baggage will kill him in the NFL and shorten his career. He is very immature and can't stop doing stupid things. He reminds me of Johnny Manziel in that respect. Mariota reminds me of a Luck, RGIII mix. He has the skills of a RGIII with the smarts and maturity of a Andrew Luck. He also doesn't have RGIII's injury history. I think Mariota will be the best qb since Luck, and maybe the best qb to come out since Luck and Wilson since Rodgers in 2005. Mariota is a winner, I pray he doesn't end up in the AFC South to the Titans.

I read ya man. Quietly, our competition in the AFC South is getting better. Blake Bortles in Jacksonville can move the ball. The Texans, if Ryan Mallett is the answer, are poised to do some damage especially since Romeo Crennel is a capable DC. If the Titans get Mariota, our division just got a hades of a lot more challenging. 

 

Nice breakdown BTW.