The Issues of Trent Richardson are Not his Fault...

[Gavin]

Im gonna try to drop the issue, The ypc speaks for itself

[jvan1973]

Hated the trade when it happened and have seen nothing to change my mind. Ballard and Bradshaw are both better runners than Richardson and they cost next to nothing. It's the only move Grigson has made that i dislike. Still hoping Richardson proves me wrong though.

Ballard and Bradshaw are on ir. Is a good thing he made the trade when he did

[BOTT]

Whenever he's not getting gang-tackled he gets pretty good YAC, but it seems like there are at least 6 guys on him by the time he hits the LOS. Hard to get much going when that happens repeatedly.

I don't blame him when he is getting hit near the line of scrimmage....the line and play calling def aren't doing him a lot of favors ....but even when he gets a little open space he seems to get stood up quite easily as opposed to bouncing off tacklers like Bradshaw or Ballard.

[HtownColt]

For now he moves the chains in short yardage and Goalline situations, as long as he can continue to make progress while he gets more and more comfortable im ok with him not thrilled just ok...I know he better look way better in December than he does now

[jvan1973]

Im gonna try to drop the issue, The ypc speaks for itself

so you think alfred Morris is the best back in the nfl this year

[BOTT]

Ballard and Bradshaw are on ir. Is a good thing he made the trade when he did

I realize that, but it was still a bad trade imo....his talent doesn't justify a first round pick. Delone Carter could have come in and averaged under 3 yards per carry.

[dudeski]

Im gonna try to drop the issue, The ypc speaks for itself

not really. Our Oline is pretty horrible

[NewEra]

Trent the new whipping boy. It's been Fleener, satele, McGlynn, DHB, Vaughn, Toler, Werner, walden just to name a few. Unreal sometimes...

[Gavin]

so you think alfred Morris is the best back in the nfl this year

I think he has shown better instincts as a running back then Richardson, Both are getting close to the same amount of carries per game  this year but there production comparison is like night and day, Now I have said before its not all on Richardson but just watching the two its clear Morris is the better rb to this point

[a06cc]

I can bet money that we'll be able to run the ball after our bye week. I see what their trying to set up with our offense. WR's need to catch the ball now that Wayne is gone. I think we'll be fine if we're able to run the ball

[Jeffrey Jeff]

       Trent R. Yes he scares me he has not been the back we thought or hoped he would be thus far,,,,,,,,,,,I know its early to be making quick judgment,,,,,,,,,,,I feel that our OLine realy is not that great,,Luck makes the Oline look or seem a lot better than they actually are...........Trent has the speed ,strength, and ability to make things happen but we have to give hime a lane a hole to go thru,,,,,,,a crease,,,,,,,,,,,,So that being said,,,,,,,,,,,,we'll all have to wait & see if our Oline improves before the finally judgment  or TR.........If our passing game gets better and it needs to than we can run off the passing game intead of passing off a strong run game,,it'll have to happn in reverse,,,, Also get TR the ball on screens and short passes -get him in space and then he can use his moves speed etc,,,,,,,,,,,,it'll work Colts got to try it!!!!        

[jvan1973]

I think he has shown better instincts as a running back then Richardson, Both are getting close to the same amount of carries per game this year but there production comparison is like night and day, Now I have said before its not all on Richardson but just watching the two its clear Morris is the better rb to this point

There is a lot more to it than ypc. Morris has the best ypc in the nfl. Do you really think he is the best back?

[Gavin]

not really. Our Oline is pretty horrible

at times no question it has but a running back has to  be able to have the patience and vision to run to where the hole is open (usually on Castonzos side) instead of always trying to force it where a hole is not open even if the play design is calls for that hole to be open, Thats just what running back vision is

[CR91]

This is the same as vontae last year. Struggled early and now look at him. The difference being is he knows the playbook so he can react instead of thinking. Once t-rich starts reacting instead of thinking, we'll call grigs a genius again

[dudeski]

This is the same as vontae last year. Struggled early and now look at him. The difference being is he knows the playbook so he can react instead of thinking. Once t-rich starts reacting instead of thinking, we'll call grigs a genius again

vontae didn't struggle that bad last year. Really don't get why people always say that

[dudeski]

at times no question it has but a running back has to be able to have the patience and vision to run to where the hole is open (usually on Castonzos side) instead of always trying to force it where a hole is not open even if the play design is calls for that hole to be open, Thats just what running back vision is

the major issue is our line and play calling

[CR91]

vontae didn't struggle that bad last year. Really don't get why people always say that

He was nothing like he is now

[Gavin]

There is a lot more to it than ypc. Morris has the best ypc in the nfl. Do you really think he is the best back?

of course there is more to it, No of course I dont think he is the best rb but at this point he has shown to be better then Richardson and stats are not needed to show that, they are only 1 indicator because it shows consistency not the raw stat itself

[In Luck We Trust]

..... at least,  that's my opinion....    and here's why I think that....

 

 

He's got no where to run.

 

When he carries the ball,  not only are there no holes to run through,  our OL is getting blown-up by the DL.   

 

What that tells me is that when Trent is in,  we are entirely predictable, based on....

 

-- Personnel groupings

-- Down and Distance

-- Formation

-- Tendencies

 

 

Sorry,  but it feels like we are well scouted by every opponent and that Trent simply has no where to run.   I chalk his fumbling up to his great frustration that he's not able to do much for us and he's trying to fight for every yard he can, and things back-fire.   I'm not worried he's a fumbler at all.

 

I'm much, much more worried that we're not using him properly and don't have any idea of how to get the most out of him.

 

That's a Pep issue.....   I hope the coaches re-think their approach for Trent.....

 

Just my two cents......

not only what you said is true but he loves hitting people and he doesnt use his speed to change direction instead he goes right into the pile of people. 

[Gavin]

the major issue is our line and play calling

well it wasn't for Ballard, Brown or  Bradshaw, The play calling is a poor excuse and Im tired of it, we have used Richardson on pitch outs, to get him in space, 1 back sets, with a FB, even lining him up in the slot, 3 wide as well

[NewEra]

well it wasn't for Ballard, Brown or Bradshaw, The play calling is a poor excuse and Im tired of it, we have used Richardson on pitch outs, to get him in space, 1 back sets, with a FB, even lining him up in the slot, 3 wide as well

Yeah, and he has been breaking off bigger runs. Not really sure what you expect?

[azcolt]

I agree with some of what you are saying, but I think there's more to it. You have to ask yourself, "what makes one running back better than others?"

 

You cannot deny Trent Richardson's physical gifts-- he's fast and strong and able to make guys miss. That's what he has going for him.

 

Where I see he is lacking is his vision, which is very important for a running back. We cannot simply say that the O-line is not blocking for him. If that's the case, then we can plug any RB in there and let him gain the yards that our O-line can afford him. It's also not the play calling. We saw Richardson used in various ways last night, and still did not get the results we were looking for.

 

When Brown has been in recently, I've noticed that if the play is to the left, he starts going left and notices immediately if there is no hole. He is able to find the hole to the right side of the line and gain positive yards, sometimes large gains. Richardson on the other hand, on similar plays he continues towards the pile-up to the left of the line and gains minimal yards. This is where it will appear to be the O-line's fault (and to a certain extent, it may be), but we expect a 1st round RB to have great vision and find the holes, whether an intended hole or not.

I agree with most of what you said. This guy could gain about the same number of yards by just aiming at the hole he is supposed to run through and then closing his eyes. He runs like he is blind and that's not something he is going to unlearn. 

[NewEra]

well it wasn't for Ballard, Brown or Bradshaw, The play calling is a poor excuse and Im tired of it, we have used Richardson on pitch outs, to get him in space, 1 back sets, with a FB, even lining him up in the slot, 3 wide as well

Yeah, and he has been breaking off bigger runs. Not really sure what you expect?

[deedub75]

Lay off of the guy.  He is in his 3rd offense in a season and a half.  He has been thrown into the Colts offense with a patchwork offensive line.  He rarely has a hole to run through yet he drags 5 or 6 defenders and still manages 3.5 ypc with no hole to run through.  It may not be this year but in the future he will be very valuable to the Colts offense.  Brown is a different kind of back.  You can't even compare them to each other. 

 

How many times have people wanted to give up on Brown.  Now that Bradshaw is out and Brown has had a couple of good runs, he is suddenly the best thing since sliced bread.  Brown is in his 5th year and still hasn't lived up to being a first round draft pick.  Richardson is in his 2nd year following a decent 1st year.  Richardson rushed for 950 yards and 13 TDs in his rookie year.  He also lost no fumbles.  Brown has never even come close to 950 in any of his 4 seasons. 

[azcolt]

Lay off of the guy.  He is in his 3rd offense in a season and a half.  He has been thrown into the Colts offense with a patchwork offensive line.  He rarely has a hole to run through yet he drags 5 or 6 defenders and still manages 3.5 ypc with no hole to run through.  It may not be this year but in the future he will be very valuable to the Colts offense.  Brown is a different kind of back.  You can't even compare them to each other. 

 

How many times have people wanted to give up on Brown.  Now that Bradshaw is out and Brown has had a couple of good runs, he is suddenly the best thing since sliced bread.  Brown is in his 5th year and still hasn't lived up to being a first round draft pick.  Richardson is in his 2nd year following a decent 1st year.  Richardson rushed for 950 yards and 13 TDs in his rookie year.  He also lost no fumbles.  Brown has never even come close to 950 in any of his 4 seasons. 

It's a discussion forum. Who are you to direct us to lay off the guy?

[TheJACKCOLT]

I think Richardson's skill set is not going to be consistently good, or reliable, at the NFL level.  It is unfortunate that Grigs gave a 1st round pick for him.  Call a spade a spade. 

 

His vision after the handoff is below average.  His horizonatal movement once he gets to the line of scrimmage is below average to poor, as his two basic moves to get left or right is to A. jump up with both feet in the air, or B. to spin in the direction he wants to go.  Lastly, his explosion thru the hole is average and his toughness is above average.  It is really the first two things that doom him as a reliable runner.

 

Great backs have vision right after the handoff of where the hole WILL be, and they then use their feet to shift left or right effortlessly, without having to hop with both feet in the air, or spin.

 

I think Richardson needs the following if he is going to be successful:

 

A.  He needs to line up about 1 yard deeper (further back), and get the ball alittle further back then he normally would so he can have an extra step forward while using the marginal vision he has.

 

B.  I think he needs some finely tuned cone drills, that get his feet moving better then they do now.  He has terrible feet right now, always jumping up instead of shifting and cutting.  His feet don't look like a natural running back at this point. 

 

The talk of formations, schemes, etc. is complete hog wash.  They have tried him as a 1st and 2nd down back, they have tried him as a 3rd down back.  He has been in on 1st and 10, and 3rd and 1, and he is not showing any ability to succed in any situation right now as a runner.

 

I am not talking about his blocking ability or catching ability as that isn't the glaring issue right now.  

I hate to go negative like this, but I am just calling a spade a spade. 

I agree with a lot of what you said, his vision seems to be lacking and his horizontal movement is not fluid. A couple of times last night he tried to bounce it outside and it looked like a very uncomfortable movement for him, instead of planting and popping it outside, he looked very slow and unnatural with this movement. That is the first time I noticed him trying to pop it outside when the hole was not there, usually he just runs it into the hole no matter what is there. This leads me to believe that the coaches are trying to get him to pop it outside when the hole is not there, but he looks really uncomfortable doing this and that really concerns me. There are a lot of plays where if he could just pop it outside the big yards are there. Its also true that on a lot of his carries he is met in the backfield when he gets the ball and there is not much he can do about that. He has got to learn that when the hole is not there, bounce it outside, I don't know if you can teach that or not, but it looks like the coaches are putting an emphasis on it. He has the speed, quickness and power you need, he just wants to duck his head and run up in the hole no matter what, and that will not get it done. I hope with more time and coaching he can get more comfortable with this movement, maybe he's never had to do this and that's why he looks so uncomfortable doing it. If you can't be taught this, until we get a dominant O-line this is going to look like a bad trade. Lets hope with this bye week, the coaching staff can work with him and get him more comfortable with the offense and help him to better use the talents that he has. The heart and desire is obvious, and he seems to be very coachable. He can really move the pile, and is very tough, physical and hard to bring down, but he has got to learn to read the flow of the play, if he can't learn this, we have made a big mistake.   "GO COLTS"

[Gavin]

I agree with a lot of what you said, his vision seems to be lacking and his horizontal movement is not fluid. A couple of times last night he tried to bounce it outside and it looked like a very uncomfortable movement for him, instead of planting and popping it outside, he looked very slow and unnatural with this movement. That is the first time I noticed him trying to pop it outside when the hole was not there, usually he just runs it into the hole no matter what is there. This leads me to believe that the coaches are trying to get him to pop it outside when the hole is not there, but he looks really uncomfortable doing this and that really concerns me. There are a lot of plays where if he could just pop it outside the big yards are there. Its also true that on a lot of his carries he is met in the backfield when he gets the ball and there is not much he can do about that. He has got to learn that when the hole is not there, bounce it outside, I don't know if you can teach that or not, but it looks like the coaches are putting an emphasis on it. He has the speed, quickness and power you need, he just wants to duck his head and run up in the hole no matter what, and that will not get it done. I hope with more time and coaching he can get more comfortable with this movement, maybe he's never had to do this and that's why he looks so uncomfortable doing it. If you can't be taught this, until we get a dominant O-line this is going to look like a bad trade. Lets hope with this bye week, the coaching staff can work with him and get him more comfortable with the offense and help him to better use the talents that he has. The heart and desire is obvious, and he seems to be very coachable. He can really move the pile, and is very tough, physical and hard to bring down, but he has got to learn to read the flow of the play, if he can't learn this, we have made a big mistake.   "GO COLTS"

well said, I dont mean to be so negative of the guy, you just put it far better then I could

[Flash7]

I had stated in another thread that we will find out who T-Rich really is at the end of this season. By then we will have enough of a sample size of him used in various ways. If he is still averaging around 3.6 yards per carry, then we will know that's who he is.

[OffensivelyPC]

Never in my life, have I met such a large group of people that thought running back vision made the offensive line block better.  Only Barry Sanders could get a 4.6 YPC with our OL in a 2TE/2RB set.  Fact of the matter is, when you've got 8 guys blocking in the box, you're going to have 8 or 9 defensive guys in the box.  I trust what Pep is doing because we are winning, but I'm with the OP, it's not like Pep is really trying to showcase Richardson's abilities anymore than he would if Ron Dayne were in our backfield in the same set.  And before you go barking off what Donald Brown has "done with the same line", remember that he is in almost exclusively with 3 WR sets and spread looks.  Last night, when he actually played in the 2TE/2RB set in the second half after the fumble, he didn't do any better than Trent.

[dudeski]

well it wasn't for Ballard, Brown or Bradshaw, The play calling is a poor excuse and Im tired of it, we have used Richardson on pitch outs, to get him in space, 1 back sets, with a FB, even lining him up in the slot, 3 wide as well

when did he have most his success?

It is not all or nothing. There are multiple factors in his lack of productivity. I just named the biggest two reasons

[dudeski]

I had stated in another thread that we will find out who T-Rich really is at the end of this season. By then we will have enough of a sample size of him used in various ways. If he is still averaging around 3.6 yards per carry, then we will know that's who he is.

or it could be the line

[dudeski]

Never in my life, have I met such a large group of people that thought running back vision made the offensive line block better. Only Barry Sanders could get a 4.6 YPC with our OL in a 2TE/2RB set. Fact of the matter is, when you've got 8 guys blocking in the box, you're going to have 8 or 9 defensive guys in the box. I trust what Pep is doing because we are winning, but I'm with the OP, it's not like Pep is really trying to showcase Richardson's abilities anymore than he would if Ron Dayne were in our backfield in the same set. And before you go barking off what Donald Brown has "done with the same line", remember that he is in almost exclusively with 3 WR sets and spread looks. Last night, when he actually played in the 2TE/2RB set in the second half after the fumble, he didn't do any better than Trent.

he did worse

[OffensivelyPC]

he did worse

I assume you mean Donald? If so, then I agree.

[Anonymous]

f

 

And? One game doesn't mean anything.

Can  you be any more ignorant? He had over 1,000 yards and 5.0+ YPC his rookie year.

[Flash7]

or it could be the line

Ask Vick Ballard who averaged 4.6 yards per carry or Ahmad Bradshaw who averaged 4.5 yards per carry behind the same line and in the same system. They'll tell you it wasn't just the O-line that allowed them to have a much better YPC.

[BOTT]

Never in my life, have I met such a large group of people that thought running back vision made the offensive line block better.  Only Barry Sanders could get a 4.6 YPC with our OL in a 2TE/2RB set.  Fact of the matter is, when you've got 8 guys blocking in the box, you're going to have 8 or 9 defensive guys in the box.  I trust what Pep is doing because we are winning, but I'm with the OP, it's not like Pep is really trying to showcase Richardson's abilities anymore than he would if Ron Dayne were in our backfield in the same set.  And before you go barking off what Donald Brown has "done with the same line", remember that he is in almost exclusively with 3 WR sets and spread looks.  Last night, when he actually played in the 2TE/2RB set in the second half after the fumble, he didn't do any better than Trent.

Yeah, those 2TE sets might be more effective if DA was healthy.....he's not only a excellent blocker, but he would also be a serious receiving threat the defense would have to respect. Bringing in Joe Reitz just tells everyone they are going to run.

[dudeski]

Ask Vick Ballard who averaged 4.6 yards per carry or Ahmad Bradshaw who averaged 4.5 yards per carry behind the same line and in the same system. They'll tell you it wasn't just the O-line that allowed them to have a much better YPC.

how many carries did Ballard have?

If you are actually claiming this line is good then we are done here

[Narcosys]

Great players find holes.Even Donald Brown finds holes. Trent was great when he worked behind a dominant Alabama line but he needs a cavern to run through. Our GM has done a good job but even he can make a terrible decision like trading a Number #1 for this stiff who obviously has terrible vision.

Idk how you can say terrible vision.  Ive seen numerous times hes jumped one way or another through small holes to get more yardage.  Its not that he doesnt have vision, but rather there are no run lanes.  Donald isnt really finding holes, they are just wide open for him because noones sure if hes running or receiving.  Trent is primarily a run only back.  Its pretty obvious what kind of play were going to run.

[Ohio Colt]

Forgive us if we have more faith in Grigson than you. You should change you're screen name to doom and gloom. Have you gone back too every thread where you proclaimed we were gonna get creamed last night?

Is life in Canada that miserable? Do you ever have anything positive to say?

 

I am not from canada, but I think that the reference section is more fun than fiction and also think that objectivity is important.

 

http://deadspin.com/trent-richardson-just-plain-sucks-1449011871

 

Read the advanced metrics. Like I told you yesterday the math doesn't lie. The numbers don't lie. The eye test, on this; does not lie. Your opinion that "Richardson is good" doesn't have a lot of supporting information at least right now, to this point. Not in the future or intangibles you think he has, etc. Right now, he's average to below average.

[Colts_Fan12]

Yeah, those 2TE sets might be more effective if DA was healthy.....he's not only a excellent blocker, but he would also be a serious receiving threat the defense would have to respect. Bringing in Joe Reitz just tells everyone they are going to run.

DA is a beast I sure miss having him out there