Polian: Kyle Orton Could Have Been A Colt

[#12]

This is not true, especially the bolded.. The majority of Polian's tenure, we were a very good running team.

I suspect we differ on the definition of "very good." During Polian's tenure, the Colts averaged 3.9 YPC, placing them near the bottom of the league over that period. They averaged 4.0 YPC, or more, only 6 times in 14 years. "Substandard" was probably a bit generous.

Face it, outside of anything Manning could control, the Colts were near the bottom of the league in practically every aspect of the game during Polian's reign.

[Buck Showalter]

Not impressed with Polians comment, whats the point in saying this??? So Peyton fans will still favor Polian... I don't get it, or Polian for that matter... & I don't think Bill was that miraculously better at drafting than so many other GMs... He got lucky on some late rounders but also whiffed on some first rounders, just like every other team in the NFL...

the difference was Peyton...

[IndyTrav]

It's as if no other team in the NFL has marginal NFL starters that they got in the late rounds or undrafted. Only Bill Polian could do that.........

[NWGirl227]

those ifs and buts will drive you nuts -- or not.

one thing is clear, had things worked out just a little better for the Colts last season, they would not have drafted Andrew, and this Stanford student would have never joined the site. she's glad she did!

[HarassedOffTheSite]

Woooooooowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

[Gavin]

Since Polian took over as GM in 1998 he was responsible for 109 draft picks 20 of those have worked out to this point or have worked out in the past

Peyton

Marvin

Reggie

Angerer

Diem

Thornton

Mcafee

Collie

Garcon

Addai

Bethea

Hayden

Clark

Jake Scott

Mathis

Freeney

Peterson

Edgerrin James

Hunter Smith

this does not include undrafted free agents he picked up

[Gavin]

I suspect we differ on the definition of "very good." During Polian's tenure, the Colts averaged 3.9 YPC, placing them near the bottom of the league over that period. They averaged 4.0 YPC, or more, only 6 times in 14 years. "Substandard" was probably a bit generous.

Face it, outside of anything Manning could control, the Colts were near the bottom of the league in practically every aspect of the game during Polian's reign.

Edge James did have 5 1000 plus yards rushing seasons while he was with the Colts so we have had a running game just at no point could we stop the run or pass

[Superman]

I suspect we differ on the definition of "very good." During Polian's tenure, the Colts averaged 3.9 YPC, placing them near the bottom of the league over that period. They averaged 4.0 YPC, or more, only 6 times in 14 years. "Substandard" was probably a bit generous.

Face it, outside of anything Manning could control, the Colts were near the bottom of the league in practically every aspect of the game during Polian's reign.

Yards per carry doesn't determine whether a team is good at running the ball or not, not by itself. We were always able to run the ball before 2008. Calling the run game "substandard" is crazy talk. You don't have the most deadly play-action fake if you don't have a threat in the run game, and we always did.

[#12]

Yards per carry doesn't determine whether a team is good at running the ball or not, not by itself.

What does?

You might be able to make that argument if the Colts were a power running team, which they weren't... if they could run the ball when they needed to, which they couldn't.

Calling the run game "substandard" is crazy talk.

No, ignoring facts is crazy talk.

[Jaric]

That's cold...jaric!!

'Zero in July' cold

I'm here all night. Try the veal.

[Superman]

What does?

Nothing does, not by itself. Whether a team is good running the ball can't be determined by one stat. What it comes down to is that the Colts had a good rushing attack practically every year up til 2008, and that rushing attack was a significant piece of what was a top notch offense for several seasons.

You might be able to make that argument if the Colts were a power running team, which they weren't... if they could run the ball when they needed to, which they couldn't.

I don't see how being a power running team is relevant, but how are you determining that they couldn't run the ball when they needed to?

No, ignoring facts is crazy talk.

I agree.

[IndyTrav]

Since Polian took over as GM in 1998 he was responsible for 109 draft picks 20 of those have worked out to this point or have worked out in the past

Peyton

Marvin

Reggie

Angerer

Diem

Thornton

Mcafee

Collie

Garcon

Addai

Bethea

Hayden

Clark

Jake Scott

Mathis

Freeney

Peterson

Edgerrin James

Hunter Smith

this does not include undrafted free agents he picked up

And 11 of those guys are average and 2 are punters.

[21isSuperman]

Since Polian took over as GM in 1998 he was responsible for 109 draft picks 20 of those have worked out to this point or have worked out in the past

Peyton

Marvin

Reggie

Angerer

Diem

Thornton

Mcafee

Collie

Garcon

Addai

Bethea

Hayden

Clark

Jake Scott

Mathis

Freeney

Peterson

Edgerrin James

Hunter Smith

this does not include undrafted free agents he picked up

There are many things to say about that. Bob Sanders won a DPOY award and without him, we certainly wouldn't have won our Super Bowl. Can you blame Polian for injuries to Bob? What about injuries to Gonzo, who was also a good player when healthy? Pollak was getting better and better each year despite being forced to play out of normal position. Jamey Richard substituted well for Saturday when he was injured in 2008.

[Vinny BoomBatz]

Edge James did have 5 1000 plus yards rushing seasons while he was with the Colts so we have had a running game just at no point could we stop the run or pass

Or get a 3rd and short by running the ball ;)

[Vinny BoomBatz]

And 11 of those guys are average and 2 are punters.

Excellent point! It's true Polian gets a ton of credit for his drafting but really PM was the reason the team was so good for so long, despite Polian's drafting. Heck, I have heard and read a few times BP wanted Leaf and Irsay overruled him...not sure if it is 100 percent correct but if true it says alot.

[Gavin]

Or get a 3rd and short by running the ball ;)

Well my point being we did have a running game for a few years at least, we just never had the defense to compliment our offense.

[Vinny BoomBatz]

Well my point being we did have a running game for a few years at least, we just never had the defense to compliment our offense.

Oh very true! Unfortunately 3rd and short was Indy's nemisis when it came to the run.

[Gavin]

Oh very true! Unfortunately 3rd and short was Indy's nemisis when it came to the run.

Didnt have the Defensive Tackles that can get a good jump on the ball, they were it seemed 2 steps slow just by breaking down a few plays in slow motion, O Linemen were out of there stance and ready to block while our defensive linemen were late getting out of their stance multiple times, combine that with them being undersized and that led to our problems I believe, the thing is I believe it was really as simple as breaking it down in slow motion, I hope our coaches realize that

[Vinny BoomBatz]

Didnt have the Defensive Tackles that can get a good jump on the ball, they were it seemed 2 steps slow just by breaking down a few plays in slow motion, O Linemen were out of there stance and ready to block while our defensive linemen were late getting out of their stance multiple times, combine that with them being undersized and that led to our problems I believe, the thing is I believe it was really as simple as breaking it down in slow motion, I hope our coaches realize that

Hopefully the new regime can fix that problem on both sides of the ball as it is Football 101.

[Superman]

Or get a 3rd and short by running the ball ;)

I bet you're thinking about one game against a very good defense where we failed on 3rd and short. But as a matter of fact, we were always efficient on third down in general, including 3rd and short.

[Vinny BoomBatz]

I bet you're thinking about one game against a very good defense where we failed on 3rd and short. But as a matter of fact, we were always efficient on third down in general, including 3rd and short.

Nope...Indy stunk running on 3rd and short even back when Faulk was the running back.

[Superman]

Nope...Indy stunk running on 3rd and short even back when Faulk was the running back.

Since you say so, it must be true.

[Vinny BoomBatz]

Since you say so, it must be true.

Wow did you watch the Colts back in those days because if you did you would know that it was actually somewhat of a league joke how they had to pass on 3rd and short because they were terrible at running on it? This happened at the end of Faulk's tenure, carried through during Edge's and continued through last year. Even a casual fan knows that.

[Gavin]

http://www.stampedeblue.com/2010/6/27/1539954/inside-3rd-down-run-vs-pass IF we are going by what Stampede Blue has then we were 6th best in the league in 2009 when running the ball on 3rd and short and 9th when passing the ball, but once again it is Stamped Blue so I dont know how well they are at keeping stats

[Vinny BoomBatz]

Those stampede blue numbers are interesting regarding 2009, thanks for sharing.

[Gavin]

I dont know how much truth they hold, there is plenty of other sites out their I would trust before them but, thats the only thing I could find

[Vinny BoomBatz]

Even still thanks for taking the time.

[subvet]

Thank the Football Gods that things played out the way they did.

I prefer to imagine it differently.

[Gavin]

http://wp.advancednflstats.com/teamOL.php?year=2011&season=reg I thought this was interesting, stats over the last 10 years according to advancednflstats.com, whether they are 100 percent accurate I dont know but given how good our offensive line has been at protecting Peyton during his career, I found them to be pretty accurate

[MIColtsFan]

glad we didn't... although when Orton lead that defeat over the Packers for KC, I wondered if Colts could of aquired him on waivers... for a minute..... but, Orlovsky did a good job, just wish he had been given the chance much earlier in the season....

[Gavin]

glad we didn't... although when Orton lead that defeat over the Packers for KC, I wondered if Colts could of aquired him on waivers... for a minute..... but, Orlovsky did a good job, just wish he had been given the chance much earlier in the season....

that and a healthy offensive line, I know its an assumption but its a pretty safe one that we wouldnt have Luck or likely even RGIII right now if he played from the start, Dare I say we have Ryan Tannehill if Orlovsky plays the whole season lol

[Jules]

Speaking of running the ball I always wished the Colts stuck to the run more against the Saints in the SB. I don't know the number of attempts but I felt Addai was tearing it up at times and instead we just went back to being completely pass happy against a team who thrived on getting key interceptions all year. Oh wait......and it happened.

When the Colts won the SB they ran the ball well, in all 4 games. I believe even though the yards per carry were not super high vs. the Ravens the Colts ran for more yards against that top ranked Ravens D then any team had all season. The runs by Rhodes to ice that game will never leave my mind. In all 4 of those postseason games I recall the running game being useful and consistent when needed.

[crestmount]

Take off 30 years and about 100lb, plus add a fair dose of speed and a shoulder and arm that aren't totally shot and I could have taken over from Peyton Manning--there's an awful lot of 'coulda, woulda, shoulda' there.

[IndyTrav]

Take off 30 years and about 100lb, plus add a fair dose of speed and a shoulder and arm that aren't totally shot and I could have taken over from Peyton Manning--there's an awful lot of 'coulda, woulda, shoulda' there.

That's because he's on TV now, working for that dreaded media he always said had no clue about anything. Now he can say outrageous things, and revise history to make himself look better.

[Superman]

Wow did you watch the Colts back in those days because if you did you would know that it was actually somewhat of a league joke how they had to pass on 3rd and short because they were terrible at running on it? This happened at the end of Faulk's tenure, carried through during Edge's and continued through last year. Even a casual fan knows that.

I had prepared a breakdown of the Colts' advanced rushing stats from 1998 on, but the post got lost. Had network issues yesterday and this morning, so all that is done. Here's the link to FO's website that shows the rankings, and you can check them for yourself. I think you'll see the Colts weren't as bad in short yardage as you "remember." They were even in the top five a couple times. They were more up and down than I remembered, but they weren't terrible in short yardage.

And by the way, while this discussion has become more about short yardage, you'll note that my initial comment was that the Colts weren't always bad running the ball. That's undoubtedly the case, both based on the raw numbers and the advanced stats at FO.

http://footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol1998

Power success percentage / ranking is an aggregate stat showing a team's ability to run in short yardage situations. Adjusted line yards / ranking and 10+ yards / ranking show how much of an impact the offensive line had on the run game, compared with the running back. All these metrics should be looked at together to get a good idea of how the line performed, which is what the discussion has been about. We know we had good backs (Faulk, Edge, early Addai, early Rhodes).

[GoColts8818]

I suspect we differ on the definition of "very good." During Polian's tenure, the Colts averaged 3.9 YPC, placing them near the bottom of the league over that period. They averaged 4.0 YPC, or more, only 6 times in 14 years. "Substandard" was probably a bit generous.

Face it, outside of anything Manning could control, the Colts were near the bottom of the league in practically every aspect of the game during Polian's reign.

Yeah minus those two years lead the league in rushing and the fact that up threw 2007 the colts had a 1000 yard back every season but one...

Peyton was by far the most important part of the team but he wasn't our only good player during that time.

[oldunclemark]

I'm here all night. Try the veal.

Two shows?......2 drink minimum?

[oldunclemark]

It's as if no other team in the NFL has marginal NFL starters that they got in the late rounds or undrafted. Only Bill Polian could do that.........

True words..check the Bears..offensive 'talent'

How many playoff games have THEY won in the last 20 years..?

[IndyTrav]

True words..check the Bears..offensive 'talent'

How many playoff games have THEY won in the last 20 years..?

4 since 2001....To our 9......They also had 16 QBs start a game for them over that time span as well.....

[Ryan Pelley]

I really don't know why this is newsworthy.... Plenty of players could have been on other teams. The end.