Colts have the 15th pick in the draft. (MERGE)

[DattMavis]

2 hours ago, Superman said:

 

Before you jump to a conclusion based on that salacious headline -- not saying you did -- take a closer look at the article. 

 

"When his blood sugar’s off, he’s rude, he’s abrasive, he doesn’t pay attention in meetings. It's why you get really, really * character reports coming out of Georgia and Texas. But when his stuff is normal, and they get him normal by lunch time, he's out at practice high energy, best practice player, loves football...""

 

He has Type 1 diabetes. Maybe he needs to do a better job of managing it, but I thought the headline was misleading. I'm not totally disregarding the character stuff though.

 

Further context here:

 

Thanks for the extra information. I'll be honest, I was working so I just glanced at the headline and didn't have time to read the article. Definitely a little misleading, but it was my bad for not actually reading it.

He has all the talent in the world. If the Colts can draft him and keep his health in check and ensure there aren't real character concerns, I'd be happy.

[DattMavis]

3 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

No one will get any real answers.   He won't give anything away,  nor should he

*Regardless of the question asked*

 

"Now that's a loaded question! Listen, you guys know me. I'm not gonna flinch. Nothing is off the table, and we're gonna do our due diligence. Look, I like the position our roster is in. We've got real talent here. Would you like to be a little better at some positions? Sure. But I also think there's a lot of talent in this draft, and I think we can add a few difference makers on both sides of the ball."

[wig]

42 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Your previous comment was that he's shown no positional bias. I think his bias toward the trenches is a practical bias away from the outside positions. And my thinking is based on a considerable amount of evidence that I think paints a discernible picture of Ballard's team building philosophies. I'm not saying I'm absolutely right about this, you might not find that evidence as compelling as I do. But I think Ballard has shown/told us what he values, and in what order.

 

Yeah I was unclear on that, my bad. To me there's a difference between total resources and 1st round picks. Meaning we'll have a high end cap hit on the lines typically. But I don't think he's shown he's opposed to drafting any position group in the first

[Superman]

34 minutes ago, wig said:

 

Yeah I was unclear on that, my bad. To me there's a difference between total resources and 1st round picks. Meaning we'll have a high end cap hit on the lines typically. But I don't think he's shown he's opposed to drafting any position group in the first

 

I don't know if I'd say he's opposed to WR or corner in the first. This is where my bias comes in. I think the value at WR is on Day 2, generally speaking. And I think part of the attraction to this defensive scheme is that zone based corners are easier to find and less expensive, which speaks to draft value being after the first round. That takes us back to my earlier comment -- Day 1 corners play man, which is why the Colts draft corners on Day 2. Maybe overly simplistic, but I think the point is obvious.

[wig]

5 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I don't know if I'd say he's opposed to WR or corner in the first. This is where my bias comes in. I think the value at WR is on Day 2, generally speaking. And I think part of the attraction to this defensive scheme is that zone based corners are easier to find and less expensive, which speaks to draft value being after the first round. That takes us back to my earlier comment -- Day 1 corners play man, which is why the Colts draft corners on Day 2. Maybe overly simplistic, but I think the point is obvious.

 

And I'd argue the top 4 WRs under 25 were all first round picks. 

[Superman]

9 minutes ago, wig said:

 

And I'd argue the top 4 WRs under 25 were all first round picks. 

 

I acknowledge that. I'm definitely not saying you can't get a good WR in the first round. And I'm not opposed to doing so. I'm just talking about draft value at a position with a ton of really good prospects every year. 

[Moosejawcolt]

8 hours ago, Indeee said:

I'm going to respectfully disagree here. I think, regardless of what the fans might think, their lack of FAs and re-signing all our own means the Colts believe this team is truly capable of making waves in 2024, being only 1 play away from a playoff birth/division title. 

 

I think they believe that they are a couple pieces away but clearly need a top skill position wideout to pair with Pittman and Downs. Every pick after that is fillers, depth, and/or less important needs in their minds. 

 

You could wind up being correct but I'm sticking with my trade up scenario where the only way I'm wrong is that we find out later, the Colts could not find a trade partner or that the trade partners really wanted to much in compensation.

 

I'm sticking with Colts trade to with Chargers and take Nabers at pick 5.

 

 

 

 

I agree with a possible trade up. I just don't think u move up from 15 to number 5 to get a wr.  Teams moving up that far is always for a qb. Also, it is a rich wr draft. U r going to have to give up a haul to get him. I would rather a scenario fo maybe sliding back a little and getting Worthy if they are intent on getting that explosive wr with their 1st pick. Also, I would like to know what u think the Colts would have to move up that far? I got my own idea but wondering what u think.

[jvan1973]

41 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I agree with a possible trade up. I just don't think u move up from 15 to number 5 to get a wr.  Teams moving up that far is always for a qb. Also, it is a rich wr draft. U r going to have to give up a haul to get him. I would rather a scenario fo maybe sliding back a little and getting Worthy if they are intent on getting that explosive wr with their 1st pick. Also, I would like to know what u think the Colts would have to move up that far? I got my own idea but wondering what u think.

The Falcons and Julio Jones disagree

[Indeee]

52 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I agree with a possible trade up. I just don't think u move up from 15 to number 5 to get a wr.  Teams moving up that far is always for a qb. Also, it is a rich wr draft. U r going to have to give up a haul to get him. I would rather a scenario fo maybe sliding back a little and getting Worthy if they are intent on getting that explosive wr with their 1st pick. Also, I would like to know what u think the Colts would have to move up that far? I got my own idea but wondering what u think.

We need a WR1, not just another receiver no matter how deep it is. If the Colts believe that Marvin, Malik, or Rome is a true WR1 then it does not matter the cost. You go get him and stop wasting time trying to see if guys picked out of round 1 will pan out. Sometimes they do, but it's rare they become elite ones. 

[Moosejawcolt]

6 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

The Falcons and Julio Jones disagree

I knew someone would bring that up. Julio Jones was seen as a freak of nature. In terms of physical  traits, Marvin and Nabers r not quite there. Jones was just a man amongst boys and that is a very rare trade to go up that far.

[Moosejawcolt]

2 minutes ago, Indeee said:

We need a WR1, not just another receiver no matter how deep it is. If the Colts believe that Marvin, Malik, or Rome is a true WR1 then it does not matter the cost. You go get him and stop wasting time trying to see if guys picked out of round 1 will pan out. Sometimes they do, but it's rare they become elite ones. 

I juat don't think with how this draft is loaded, they need to throw all their resources at one guy when u could get one at 15 who could be that guy and still retain your picks. Just not a smart move. 

[Indeee]

6 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I juat don't think with how this draft is loaded, they need to throw all their resources at one guy when u could get one at 15 who could be that guy and still retain your picks. Just not a smart move. 

If they stay at 15 and grab a guy like Thomas, then they should take 2 more right after in case they miss. At this point, we need receivers so go get some.  

[Moosejawcolt]

8 minutes ago, Indeee said:

If they stay at 15 and grab a guy like Thomas, then they should take 2 more right after in case they miss. At this point, we need receivers so go get some.  

The one thing that scares me about elite wrs is that 4 years later u r paying them 30 mill plus. U have to consider that if u going to trade up for one of the elite guys. I would prefer a role wr who can be replaced if and when his  2nd contract comes around. Say get a guy like Worthy and u r scheming him to get open. That's where a guy like Bowers is in some ways a better pick if u want to move up. Not nearly as expensive long term based on te salaries and he  is a true weapon.

[richard pallo]

13 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I juat don't think with how this draft is loaded, they need to throw all their resources at one guy when u could get one at 15 who could be that guy and still retain your picks. Just not a smart move. 

If we stay at 15 and pick a player I would expect that player to be one of 19 he graded as a 1st rd talent.   The only WR’s I have seen in the top 20 of the entire draft are Harrison, Nabors and Odunze.  He can sit and hope if he wants but when he’s that close to possibly getting elite seems like it would be smart to move up and get one of them.  And who cares if we have to pay him a big second contract.  You should be happy you hit on a pick.  You really prefer a role player instead of elite?  Because of money.  Omg that’s an unbelievable take.  I can’t believe it.  Wow!

[krunk]

1 minute ago, richard pallo said:

If we stay at 15 and pick a player I would expect that player to be one of 19 he graded as a 1st rd talent.   The only WR’s I have seen in the top 20 of the entire draft are Harrison, Nabors and Odunze.  He can sit and hope if he wants but when he’s that close to possibly getting elite seems like it would be smart to move up and get one of them.  And who cares if we have to pay him a big second contract.  You should be happy you hit on a pick.  You really prefer a role player instead of elite?  Because of money.  Omg that’s an unbelievable take.  I can’t believe it.  Wow!

When did he consult you about who they think is elite?

[jvan1973]

47 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I knew someone would bring that up. Julio Jones was seen as a freak of nature. In terms of physical  traits, Marvin and Nabers r not quite there. Jones was just a man amongst boys and that is a very rare trade to go up that far.

Lmao.  Yeah.   I know you think you are this great evaluation guy.  Look at the numbers.  

[Moosejawcolt]

10 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

If we stay at 15 and pick a player I would expect that player to be one of 19 he graded as a 1st rd talent.   The only WR’s I have seen in the top 20 of the entire draft are Harrison, Nabors and Odunze.  He can sit and hope if he wants but when he’s that close to possibly getting elite seems like it would be smart to move up and get one of them.  And who cares if we have to pay him a big second contract.  You should be happy you hit on a pick.  You really prefer a role player instead of elite?  Because of money.  Omg that’s an unbelievable take.  I can’t believe it.  Wow!

I think u r missing my point. Pick a player that fits and excels in your scheme. Guys like Nabers and MJH are freaks and r not scheme dependant. Think of the Rams. Kupp is good, but they dipped into the draft and amazingly draft another stud because he fits their scheme and does not have elite triats. It is similar to the way they draft corners. They r typical zone corners. U can let one-way if they want to much as u can go back into the draft and hopefully get another in the 2nd. That is my point.

[Moosejawcolt]

2 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

Lmao.  Yeah.   I know you think you are this great evaluation guy.  Look at the numbers.  

MJH does not have elite speed. He didn't even run a 40. Nabors has elite speed but not size. Jones would have been a combination of both of them if u picked out their elite traits. Jones was like Calvin Johnson. Just  absolute freaks of nature that shouldn't be able to do what they do at that size.

[DattMavis]

1 hour ago, Moosejawcolt said:

The one thing that scares me about elite wrs is that 4 years later u r paying them 30 mill plus. U have to consider that if u going to trade up for one of the elite guys. I would prefer a role wr who can be replaced if and when his  2nd contract comes around. Say get a guy like Worthy and u r scheming him to get open. That's where a guy like Bowers is in some ways a better pick if u want to move up. Not nearly as expensive long term based on te salaries and he  is a true weapon.

I've been saying, I won't be shocked if WR (outside of the elite of the elite) starts to become like RB. Teams draft them and let them walk after the first contract. These guys are so good coming out of college these days. It seems every year you can draft a guy in the 3rd round that will have 1000 yards a year.

[richard pallo]

48 minutes ago, krunk said:

When did he consult you about who they think is elite?

Huh?  Lol

[Moosejawcolt]

33 minutes ago, DattMavis said:

I've been saying, I won't be shocked if WR (outside of the elite of the elite) starts to become like RB. Teams draft them and let them walk after the first contract. These guys are so good coming out of college these days. It seems every year you can draft a guy in the 3rd round that will have 1000 yards a year.

Then begs the question. Do u want to say draft a MJH at 4 and turn around in 4 years or would u say draft Turner and pay him 30mill in 4 years? All day every day for the franchise rush end. I am not a big believer in 30 mill for a wr. Reid is a fantastic coach and look what he did with Hill.

[AwesomeAustin]

2 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I knew someone would bring that up. Julio Jones was seen as a freak of nature. In terms of physical  traits, Marvin and Nabers r not quite there. Jones was just a man amongst boys and that is a very rare trade to go up that far.

It was also 13yrs ago. The trend since  has been to trade for an established receiver. Hill, Adams, Diggs, Jones, Brown, Hopkins, Cooks, Beckham Jr etc all have been blockbuster trades. The Falcons trading two 1st, a 2nd and a 4th for a rookie is by far the exception. 

[Moosejawcolt]

Just now, AwesomeAustin said:

It was also 13yrs ago. The trend since  has been to trade for an established receiver. Hill, Adams, Diggs, Jones, Brown, Hopkins, Cooks, Beckham Jr etc all have been blockbuster trades. The Falcons trading two 1st, a 2nd and a 4th for a rookie is by far the exception. 

And it's not really working out for the teams that do make that trade. To me, u make a trade for a receiver if u have most of theteam behind u to make a push. Colts have holes on defense.

[AwesomeAustin]

1 minute ago, Moosejawcolt said:

And it's not really working out for the teams that do make that trade. To me, u make a trade for a receiver if u have most of theteam behind u to make a push. Colts have holes on defense.

I agree. Unless an offensive weapon is BPA, I would prefer the Colts go defense or OL if everyone is graded really close 

[Moosejawcolt]

18 minutes ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I agree. Unless an offensive weapon is BPA, I would prefer the Colts go defense or OL if everyone is graded really close 

I wouldn't mind a draft of  Higgins and Cooper if they were able to pull that off lol

[Moosejawcolt]

3 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I wouldn't mind a draft of  Higgins and Cooper if they were able to pull that off lol

That off course if Ballard traded back and cannot get my initial favs

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Then begs the question. Do u want to say draft a MJH at 4 and turn around in 4 years or would u say draft Turner and pay him 30mill in 4 years? All day every day for the franchise rush end. I am not a big believer in 30 mill for a wr. Reid is a fantastic coach and look what he did with Hill.

That trade also had a little something to do with the QB Reid has and the TE as well.  Forget their names but both are said to be well above average.     

[AwesomeAustin]

6 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

That trade also had a little something to do with the QB Reid has and the TE as well.  Forget their names but both are said to be well above average.     

I do believe the Chiefs offered Hill a decent amount of money. Dolphins were willing to offer 30m a year plus draft capital. I can’t remember but I thought Hill was willing to take less from the Chiefs until the Dolphins went big and he couldn’t say no. 

[KB]

So who do you think are the 19/21 players with first round grades?

[w87r]

3 minutes ago, KB said:

So who do you think are the 19/21 players with first round grades?

QB:

Williams 

Daniels 

Maye

McCarthy 

 

WR:

Harrison 

Odunze 

Nabers

 

TE:

Bowers

 

OT:

Alt

Fuaga

Latham

Fashanu

Fautanu

 

DL:

Latu

Turner

Verse

Newton 

Murphy 

 

CB:

Mitchell 

Wiggins

Arnold

 

[Moosejawcolt]

22 minutes ago, w87r said:

QB:

Williams 

Daniels 

Maye

McCarthy 

 

WR:

Harrison 

Odunze 

Nabers

 

TE:

Bowers

 

OT:

Alt

Fuaga

Latham

Fashanu

Fautanu

 

DL:

Latu

Turner

Verse

Newton 

Murphy 

 

CB:

Mitchell 

Wiggins

Arnold

 

The only one I may dispute is Arnold. He has  lot of good tape just the 4.5 fourty for a corner is not a time that gets him into the 1st round

[wig]

4 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I knew someone would bring that up. Julio Jones was seen as a freak of nature. In terms of physical  traits, Marvin and Nabers r not quite there. Jones was just a man amongst boys and that is a very rare trade to go up that far.

 

That wasn't it. AJ Green was above him. But the drop-off was HUGE. There were two absolutely elite dudes and then nobody. This draft is similar but different in my opinion. There's 3 guys in the Julio/AJ tier but the drop-off isn't anywhere near the same, though in my mind it's still significant. But in that draft it was Julio or nobody. 

[Moosejawcolt]

13 hours ago, adubb84 said:

 

Everyone quick! What are some questions you guys would like answered? I’ll reply to him 

Why do u still have a job after 7 years?

[Stephen]

3 hours ago, w87r said:

QB:

Williams 

Daniels 

Maye

McCarthy 

 

WR:

Harrison 

Odunze 

Nabers

 

TE:

Bowers

 

OT:

Alt

Fuaga

Latham

Fashanu

Fautanu

 

DL:

Latu

Turner

Verse

Newton 

Murphy 

 

CB:

Mitchell 

Wiggins

Arnold

 

Replace Arnold with Brian thomas jr  and I'll agree

[stitches]

On 4/19/2024 at 12:35 AM, NewColtsFan said:

Yes….  From Jeremiah. 
 

8 out of 10

 

6 out of 10

 

6 out of 10

 

5 out of 10

 

5 out of 10

 

Ill see if I can do the same from other analysts in the days to come. 
 

By the way, I tried to send you a private message.   It was blocked to me.   Would you like all of our discussions public, or would you be willing to open PMs to me?

 

Either is fine.   Up to you.  

No idea why you can't PM me. I did pm u a week or two ago. No idea if u received it.

[Stephen]

5 hours ago, DattMavis said:

I've been saying, I won't be shocked if WR (outside of the elite of the elite) starts to become like RB. Teams draft them and let them walk after the first contract. These guys are so good coming out of college these days. It seems every year you can draft a guy in the 3rd round that will have 1000 yards a year.

Sure alot can get a 1000 yards, but what makes wrs elite are the ones who score alot and catch first downs. Colts don't have a wr on the roster that scores alot. Pittman is a wr 2 in my opinion. Pierce a wr 4 with wr 2 potential. Downs wr 2/3. Neither one of those guys are marvin Harrison  or Reggie Wayne. None of our safeties are Bob sanders. None of our edge rushers are freeney or Mathis. No Nick harpers, Kelvin Hayden, marlin Jackson, or vontaome Davis at cb So we can stand to improve  at wr, s, pass rush,and cb. We have alot of solid  guys sprinkled across the roster but very few I'd consider  elite. Buckner, Nelson, and a healthy Taylor  are among the elite. That is why I'm hoping for a game changing player in the first round. Most rookie corners aren't  that.

[jvan1973]

11 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

MJH does not have elite speed. He didn't even run a 40. Nabors has elite speed but not size. Jones would have been a combination of both of them if u picked out their elite traits. Jones was like Calvin Johnson. Just  absolute freaks of nature that shouldn't be able to do what they do at that size.

MHJ doesn't have elite speed?  

 

 

[csmopar]

13 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I agree with a possible trade up. I just don't think u move up from 15 to number 5 to get a wr.  Teams moving up that far is always for a qb. Also, it is a rich wr draft. U r going to have to give up a haul to get him. I would rather a scenario fo maybe sliding back a little and getting Worthy if they are intent on getting that explosive wr with their 1st pick. Also, I would like to know what u think the Colts would have to move up that far? I got my own idea but wondering what u think.

Houston says hi… they moved up for big Anderson last year and traded a fortune to do it. 

[csmopar]

9 hours ago, w87r said:

QB:

Williams 

Daniels 

Maye

McCarthy 

 

WR:

Harrison 

Odunze 

Nabers

 

TE:

Bowers

 

OT:

Alt

Fuaga

Latham

Fashanu

Fautanu

 

DL:

Latu

Turner

Verse

Newton 

Murphy 

 

CB:

Mitchell 

Wiggins

Arnold

 

Based on Ballards presser yesterday, I’m thinking it’s WR or CB. Depending on how you look at his comments, was he deflecting, or was he being sincere or both when discussing our young CBs? If he truly does think we’re good there, I think it’ll be WR.

[Solid84]

10 hours ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I agree. Unless an offensive weapon is BPA, I would prefer the Colts go defense or OL if everyone is graded really close 

If we go OL in the 1st I’d be extremely disappointed.