Colts offseason discussion / Ballard Grievances (merge)

[stitches]

Just now, ColtStrong2013 said:

 

You say that he pursued the right positions with top picks, but TY was not a top pick. Parris Campbell, Alec Pierce, Josh Downs and Michael Pittman were all drafted higher than TY. Three of those are still on roster, and while they are no TY Hilton, I think we all know what TY had that those three have not... 

TY was drafted in the 3d... in the year he picked Luck in the 1st. He used one of his best remaining picks for TY. And then followed hitting on TY with picks of WRs in the 3d and the 1st in 2014 and 2015 and he picked up Andre Johnson as one of his big vet acquisitions. 

Just now, ColtStrong2013 said:

He picked an edge rusher that did absolutely nothing. Guess what? Ballard picked a 1st round edge that at least has produced and still has opportunity to grow on this team. Again, Grigson didn't have to target the "right positions" because he already had them filled when he stepped into this role. In fact, I would argue that had anyone but Grigson been GM, we would have experienced much greater success. He was that bad... His first day on the job, he walked up to the best punter in the league and a fan favorite and told him right to his face he would cut him, but Irsay wouldn't allow it. Those are facts. He was bad and he was a *. It's a large reason why I cringe at the thought of firing Ballard and potentially hiring Ryan Grigson. He was awful. The only year that Ballard had Luck, he won a playoff game. That told me everything to know about Grigson's success... Free-rider on the coattails of #12. Sure, he tried. Man, did he try. He just sucked at it... 

Please don't make me defend Grigson... it pains me more than you can imagine. Yes, I agree with most everything - this post was not meant as a defense of Grigson... It was meant as an example for how investing in the most important positions(in 2024, not in 1984) and hitting big on them can mask a lot of bad decisions and how hitting on the least important positions don't really bring you much of anything besides mediocrity. Yeah, we hit on a RB and guard and linebacker(a few of them actually)... and 4th round run-stuffing DT, and what did we get for that? How does that translate to wins on the field? Well... it translates into what we see nowadays... mediocrity and an incredibly boring team. 

[Defjamz26]

49 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

I get the theory behind what he wants to do, I just don’t think it works for the reasons you mentioned. 
 

In any given draft how many guys do you get that really move the needle for your team? 1 maybe 2? What happens if you don’t hit on the premium positions?

 

You basically have to string together 2+ 2018 level drafts and hit on all premium positions in them. 

You figure that anyone drafted between rounds 4-7 is a long shot to make the roster. So that gives you picks 1-3. It’s likely that one of those players won’t work out so you’re down to two. And again, if the two players that you’re targeting are the traits based players, you’re less likely to hit. 

[stitches]

34 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

The trade for Davis was brilliant. -  but then he turns around and trades for Richardson.  SMH. Yeah, like you, I won't pile on the man, I have took it easy on Ballard for the most part (mainly because Luck retired shockingly) but my patience with Ballard is wearing thin I have to admit. No Division Titles in 7 years under Ballard isn't pretty. We should have won it last year but didn't, close doesn't count. 

Luck retired in Ballard's 3d year... we are entering year 8 of his tenure. I think it's long been time to stop using the Luck retirement as an excuse. Sure, it was horribly timed, it was incredibly unlucky for Ballard... but A TON of time has passed since. 

 

The Bengals have a new QB since Luck has retired and made the SB. 

The 49ers have switched a few QBs since Luck retired and have made multiple SBs. 

The Eagles have a new QB since Luck retired and have made the SB. 

The Rams have a new QB since Luck retired and won the SB. 

The Bucs took a new QB after Luck retired and won the SB. 

 

The Jaguars have a new QB since Luck retired and have won the division.

The Texans have a new QB since Luck retired and have won the division

 

 

We cannot keep getting back to that Luck thing. 

 

[ColtStrong2013]

6 minutes ago, stitches said:

TY was drafted in the 3d... in the year he picked Luck in the 1st. He used one of his best remaining picks for TY. And then followed hitting on TY with picks of WRs in the 3d and the 1st in 2014 and 2015 and he picked up Andre Johnson as one of his big vet acquisitions. 

Please don't make me defend Grigson... it pains me more than you can imagine. Yes, I agree with most everything - this post was not meant as a defense of Grigson... It was meant as an example for how investing in the most important positions(in 2024, not in 1984) and hitting big on them can mask a lot of bad decisions and how hitting on the least important positions don't really bring you much of anything besides mediocrity. Yeah, we hit on a RB and guard and linebacker(a few of them actually)... and 4th round run-stuffing DT, and what did we get for that? How does that translate to wins on the field? Well... it translates into what we see nowadays... mediocrity and an incredibly boring team. 

I know when he was picked. What I stated was not incorrect. Ballard has 3 receivers on roster that were drafter higher than TY was. And they don’t have Luck throwing them the ball… I remember how TY looked wide open when Wentz was overthrowing him the ball with the playoffs on the line,all too well. 
 

im not sure you can defend him man. the argument you are trying to make is not one I’m going to ever agree with. He did nothing that Ballard hasn’t done. He paired an explosive receiver with a generational qb. 👏. He already had Reggie Wayne on roster… If it weren’t for Robert Mathis on roster, he would have had worse edge rushers than Ballard has. If it weren’t for Castonzo already on roster, his offensive line (somehow) would have been even worse. The only good pick he made past 2012 in my opinion was Ryan Kelly, and it was far too late for that. 
 

I understand the hitting on positions of lesser importance. What is Ballard supposed to do? Not draft those positions? I understand the Nelson pick being highlighted. But he got three 2nd round picks (and put a few to good use) to work with in addition to Nelson… At the end of the day, he didn’t luck (no pun intended) to the Andrew Luck sweepstakes and a roster with premium positions filled… He inherited a broken Luck and trash roster. What he’s done in 8 years should be more impressive than what Grigson did with Andrew Luck carrying the team. But for some reason, people cry over the difference in record… as if it’s that far apart and those wins actually resulted in anything. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

9 minutes ago, stitches said:

Luck retired in Ballard's 3d year... we are entering year 8 of his tenure. I think it's long been time to stop using the Luck retirement as an excuse. Sure, it was horribly timed, it was incredibly unlucky for Ballard... but A TON of time has passed since. 

 

The Bengals have a new QB since Luck has retired and made the SB. 

The 49ers have switched a few QBs since Luck retired and have made multiple SBs. 

The Eagles have a new QB since Luck retired and have made the SB. 

 

The Jaguars have a new QB since Luck retired and have won the division.

The Texans have a new QB since Luck retired and have won the division

 

 

We cannot keep getting back to that Luck thing. 

 

I do agree, I guess to clarify Ballard deserved a break in 2019 and 2020, 2 years of his tenure. I think signing Rivers was still good despite coping with Luck leaving but trading for Wentz was awful! I remember when we traded for Wentz I went bonkers on here and said it was a terrible mistake. Then again, I didn't mind the Ryan move (we gave the Falcons a bag of chips is why) because in 2022 the QB draft class was weak, and I thought Ryan would be better than Wentz.

[ColtStrong2013]

9 minutes ago, stitches said:

Luck retired in Ballard's 3d year... we are entering year 8 of his tenure. I think it's long been time to stop using the Luck retirement as an excuse. Sure, it was horribly timed, it was incredibly unlucky for Ballard... but A TON of time has passed since. 

 

The Bengals have a new QB since Luck has retired and made the SB. 

The 49ers have switched a few QBs since Luck retired and have made multiple SBs. 

The Eagles have a new QB since Luck retired and have made the SB. 

 

The Jaguars have a new QB since Luck retired and have won the division.

The Texans have a new QB since Luck retired and have won the division

 

 

We cannot keep getting back to that Luck thing. 

 

 

i don’t disagree. We should have drafted a qb in 2020… 

 

the 49ers and Eagles are the anomalies of that group. And you know what they both were focused on roster wise? dominating the trenches… the others had either a #1 draft pick (with similar rated qbs as Luck in Burrow and Lawrence) or draft (or lucked into- whichever way you want to look at it) CJ Stroud. We have a new qb too, he just tore his shoulder his rookie year. So we’ll see regarding qb… 

 

[Jason_]

6 minutes ago, stitches said:

Luck retired in Ballard's 3d year... we are entering year 8 of his tenure. I think it's long been time to stop using the Luck retirement as an excuse. Sure, it was horribly timed, it was incredibly unlucky for Ballard... but A TON of time has passed since. 

 

The Bengals have a new QB since Luck has retired and made the SB. 

The 49ers have switched a few QBs since Luck retired and have made multiple SBs. 

The Eagles have a new QB since Luck retired and have made the SB. 

 

The Jaguars have a new QB since Luck retired and have won the division.

The Texans have a new QB since Luck retired and have won the division

 

 

We cannot keep getting back to that Luck thing. 

 

 

Well the thing is, the Luck retirement was just the starting point.  At that point, they felt they'd built a team that was ready to compete, so they brought in Rivers.  From that point, they kept going the FA route for a new QB rather than draft one (which has been reported to have been Ballard's preference, but not that of Reich.  I know some will say that Ballard should have overruled Reich but two points....1, Irsay could have very well been in agreement with Reich at that time as well in regards to trying to "win now" rather than start over with a new rookie QB and 2, a GMs job is to get the kind of players his HC wants.  When the GM has an offensive minded HC, especially one that used to be a QB himself, then QB is the one position where that HC should get who he wants and then either sink or swim with said QB. That's what happened to Brian Billick.  He convinced the front office he could turn Kyle Boller into a franchise QB.  Billick was wrong and that's what got him fired.  Same situation with Reich.  He got the QB he wanted (multiple times in fact) and ultimately sunk himself.

 

I know a lot of people are unhappy with the lack of results in the past 8 years, but there are reasons for the lack of results that need to be understood.  

[richard pallo]

I’m glad we brought all of our guys back.  I’m glad we are returning all 25 starters.  We are now going to find out this year if AR is our franchise quarterback.  We have a solid roster with no major holes that need to be filled.  And the draft is still in front of us.  Ballard’s main objective was resigning our own but we shouldn’t lose sight of where he took swings to upgrade the roster with outside FA.  Hunter was an ER who would have been an expensive upgrade.  That’s with Paye and the other ER on the roster.  The second was corner with our interest in Sneed.  So for me I would not rule out Ballard adding a veteran upgrade at either of those two positions.  It doesn’t have to be just FA.  He still could pull off a surprise trade like he did with the Buckner acquisition.  It doesn’t necessarily have to be with our first pick either.  It could be a second or third or future pick.  The fact he saw those two positions as major needs he was willing to consider paying for should not be forgotten.  There is still plenty of time and teams circumstances are constantly changing.  Brandon Beane said the Bills received the call from the Texans on Monday.  Anything can happen.  Especially this time of year.  So I think Ballard is still open for business.  We have our core back. Now we will see if he can still find a way to improve the roster.  And hopefully add another veteran or two.

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, Jason_ said:

 

Well the thing is, the Luck retirement was just the starting point.  At that point, they felt they'd built a team that was ready to compete, so they brought in Rivers.  From that point, they kept going the FA route for a new QB rather than draft one (which has been reported to have been Ballard's preference, but not that of Reich.  I know some will say that Ballard should have overruled Reich but two points....1, Irsay could have very well been in agreement with Reich at that time as well in regards to trying to "win now" rather than start over with a new rookie QB and 2, a GMs job is to get the kind of players his HC wants.  When the GM has an offensive minded HC, especially one that used to be a QB himself, then QB is the one position where that HC should get who he wants and then either sink or swim with said QB. That's what happened to Brian Billick.  He convinced the front office he could turn Kyle Boller into a franchise QB.  Billick was wrong and that's what got him fired.  Same situation with Reich.  He got the QB he wanted (multiple times in fact) and ultimately sunk himself.

 

I know a lot of people are unhappy with the lack of results in the past 8 years, but there are reasons for the lack of results that need to be understood.  

This is true. Had we known Luck was going to retire after 2018, we could have easily drafted Josh Allen who was there at #6 in 2018. We drafted Nelson at #6 for the purpose of protecting Luck for the next 10 years. 

[smittywerb]

After sitting on the Diggs trade for a day, listening to the podcasts and radio shows, here are my thoughts:

 

- We are not in the same position as Houston.  Houston had a fire sale, acquired resources, and made this happen.  We’ve built the foundation using our own resources.  Houston’s rookie QB played a full season and shocked the entire league.  Our rookie showed flashes but couldn’t get through 4 games.  Houston is doing what we should do next year if AR shows he can play a full season at an All-Pro level like Stroud.

 

- Ballard seat is hot.  If AR shows what he has and meet the expectations, we need to go into win now mode.  We’d have probably 2 or 3 years left on his rookie contract.  We need to spend the resources and do whatever it takes to support AR.  Imo, when he gets his contract, we won’t be able to hold onto everyone.  So yes, what Houston is doing will hurt them in the long run, but there’s no better time to use resources and money when you have your answer at QB on a rookie deal.  If Ballard is once again hesitant to do that, then he needs to go.

 

- It is time for Ballard to start taking risks. Every GM has to do it.  It’s fine to play it safe when you’re building the team. But when it’s time to build a contender, you can’t have the same philosophy.  This year, I’ll give Ballard a pass because of the people we had to resign.  Next year, there isn’t a pass.  Spend the money, make the trades and use draft picks if necessary.  But no matter what, build AR a winning team while he’s on his rookie deal.

 

- This just reiterate me wanting Stroud last year.  I’ve gone on record and said we should’ve traded up to number one, even if it costed us some serious draft capital.  I just knew stroud was the real deal.  But we have AR who I think can be just as good if not better.  AR has a lot of pressure on him this upcoming year.  Our future is really dependent upon if he has a good season.  If he struggles and play the full season, I’d say hit the rebuild button.  If he balls out, I’d say hit the win now button

[stitches]

9 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

This is true. Had we known Luck was going to retire after 2018, we could have easily drafted Josh Allen who was there at #6 in 2018. We drafted Nelson at #6 for the purpose of protecting Luck for the next 10 years. 

I don't think missing on Josh Allen is reasonable gripe to have with Ballard. Luck played one of his best seasons in 2018... AFTER the draft that included Josh Allen. I'd heave healthy Luck 100 times out of a 100 over any version of Josh Allen... and for the second part of that season Luck looked healthy and he looked like he was getting his mojo back. 

 

The real mistake is not going for Herbert in 2020. Ballard is on the record that they were considering moving up in the draft in 2020 for QB before they traded the pick for Buckner. My strong suspicion is that the QB they were thinking about was Herbert(he fits what Ballard likes more than any other QB in that draft). 

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, smittywerb said:

After sitting on the Diggs trade for a day, listening to the podcasts and radio shows, here are my thoughts:

 

- We are not in the same position as Houston.  Houston had a fire sale, acquired resources, and made this happen.  We’ve built the foundation using our own resources.  Houston’s rookie QB played a full season and shocked the entire league.  Our rookie showed flashes but couldn’t get through 4 games.  Houston is doing what we should do next year if AR shows he can play a full season at an All-Pro level like Stroud.

 

- Ballard seat is hot.  If AR shows what he has and meet the expectations, we need to go into win now mode.  We’d have probably 2 or 3 years left on his rookie contract.  We need to spend the resources and do whatever it takes to support AR.  Imo, when he gets his contract, we won’t be able to hold onto everyone.  So yes, what Houston is doing will hurt them in the long run, but there’s no better time to use resources and money when you have your answer at QB on a rookie deal.  If Ballard is once again hesitant to do that, then he needs to go.

 

- It is time for Ballard to start taking risks. Every GM has to do it.  It’s fine to play it safe when you’re building the team. But when it’s time to build a contender, you can’t have the same philosophy.  This year, I’ll give Ballard a pass because of the people we had to resign.  Next year, there isn’t a pass.  Spend the money, make the trades and use draft picks if necessary.  But no matter what, build AR a winning team while he’s on his rookie deal.

 

- This just reiterate me wanting Stroud last year.  I’ve gone on record and said we should’ve traded up to number one, even if it costed us some serious draft capital.  I just knew stroud was the real deal.  But we have AR who I think can be just as good if not better.  AR has a lot of pressure on him this upcoming year.  Our future is really dependent upon if he has a good season.  If he struggles and play the full season, I’d say hit the rebuild button.  If he balls out, I’d say hit the win now button

I am not Jim Irsay so I have no idea what he is thinking right now. I put that in bold on purpose for many reasons. Having said that, I am thinking the only thing that saves Ballard's job is if we win the Division in 2024 meaning AR pans out as well. As of now I just don't see it, Texans are better, and the Jags are even with us + we haven't won in Jacks since Andrew Luck had his best season in 2014!

[cdgacoltsfan]

1 hour ago, BeanDiasucci said:

Let's wait until someone declares that the season is over before asking everyone to wait before declaring it. 

Oh...you haven't been reading. It's been declared as over by some.

[2006Coltsbestever]

2 minutes ago, stitches said:

I don't think missing on Josh Allen is reasonable gripe to have with Ballard. Luck played one of his best seasons in 2018... AFTER the draft that included Josh Allen. I'd heave healthy Luck 100 times out of a 100 over any version of Josh Allen... and for the second part of that season Luck looked healthy and he looked like he was getting his mojo back. 

 

The real mistake is not going for Herbert in 2020. Ballard is on the record that they were considering moving up in the draft in 2020 for QB before they traded the pick for Buckner. My strong suspicion is that the QB they were thinking about was Herbert(he fits what Ballard likes more than any other QB in that draft). 

I would take Luck over Allen as well all-time but my point is, had we known Luck was only going to play in 2018 and then retire, drafting Allen would have been the way to go. IMO Allen is better than Herbert. 

[RollerColt]

Just now, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I would take Luck over Allen as well all-time but my point is, had we known Luck was only going to play in 2018 and then retire, drafting Allen would have been the way to go. IMO Allen is better than Herbert. 

Hindsight is fun... 

 

I'm sure most of the league would love a do-over for the 2000 draft and pick up Tom Brady. 

[chad72]

5 minutes ago, smittywerb said:

After sitting on the Diggs trade for a day, listening to the podcasts and radio shows, here are my thoughts:

 

- We are not in the same position as Houston.  Houston had a fire sale, acquired resources, and made this happen.  We’ve built the foundation using our own resources.  Houston’s rookie QB played a full season and shocked the entire league.  Our rookie showed flashes but couldn’t get through 4 games.  Houston is doing what we should do next year if AR shows he can play a full season at an All-Pro level like Stroud.

 

- Ballard seat is hot.  If AR shows what he has and meet the expectations, we need to go into win now mode.  We’d have probably 2 or 3 years left on his rookie contract.  We need to spend the resources and do whatever it takes to support AR.  Imo, when he gets his contract, we won’t be able to hold onto everyone.  So yes, what Houston is doing will hurt them in the long run, but there’s no better time to use resources and money when you have your answer at QB on a rookie deal.  If Ballard is once again hesitant to do that, then he needs to go.

 

- It is time for Ballard to start taking risks. Every GM has to do it.  It’s fine to play it safe when you’re building the team. But when it’s time to build a contender, you can’t have the same philosophy.  This year, I’ll give Ballard a pass because of the people we had to resign.  Next year, there isn’t a pass.  Spend the money, make the trades and use draft picks if necessary.  But no matter what, build AR a winning team while he’s on his rookie deal.

 

- This just reiterate me wanting Stroud last year.  I’ve gone on record and said we should’ve traded up to number one, even if it costed us some serious draft capital.  I just knew stroud was the real deal.  But we have AR who I think can be just as good if not better.  AR has a lot of pressure on him this upcoming year.  Our future is really dependent upon if he has a good season.  If he struggles and play the full season, I’d say hit the rebuild button.  If he balls out, I’d say hit the win now button

 

Should we? Could he have gotten players at the same position that were better than what we re-signed? The key factor is, they fit his budget. Kenny Moore wasn't breaking the bank for guaranteed money like Sneed, for an example. 

 

I don't expect Ballard to change his stripes even if he knows AR needs just a little help. "Explosive" was the term Ballard used - have we gotten any more explosive after free agency? 

[ColtStrong2013]

9 minutes ago, smittywerb said:

AR has a lot of pressure on him this upcoming year.  Our future is really dependent upon if he has a good season.  If he struggles and play the full season, I’d say hit the rebuild button.  If he balls out, I’d say hit the win now button

 

I don't think everyone on this forum, nor in the organization feel that way. It's not this year or never. I can't imagine having that mentality with a guy that is basically a rookie under center. "if he doesn't play a full season, or struggles, hit the rebuild button." That's interesting... 

[stitches]

14 minutes ago, Jason_ said:

 

Well the thing is, the Luck retirement was just the starting point.  At that point, they felt they'd built a team that was ready to compete, so they brought in Rivers.  From that point, they kept going the FA route for a new QB rather than draft one (which has been reported to have been Ballard's preference, but not that of Reich.  I know some will say that Ballard should have overruled Reich but two points....1, Irsay could have very well been in agreement with Reich at that time as well in regards to trying to "win now" rather than start over with a new rookie QB and 2, a GMs job is to get the kind of players his HC wants.  When the GM has an offensive minded HC, especially one that used to be a QB himself, then QB is the one position where that HC should get who he wants and then either sink or swim with said QB. That's what happened to Brian Billick.  He convinced the front office he could turn Kyle Boller into a franchise QB.  Billick was wrong and that's what got him fired.  Same situation with Reich.  He got the QB he wanted (multiple times in fact) and ultimately sunk himself.

 

I know a lot of people are unhappy with the lack of results in the past 8 years, but there are reasons for the lack of results that need to be understood.  

I think a lot of what people have been doing last few years has been excuses. Most of the teams in the league have their own set of setbacks and reasons why they should not be achieving great success. But this league doesn't wait for anybody... it's the Not For Long league. You either compete or you are left in the dust. And for the most time since Luck's retirement we've been in the dust. And it's on the GM to snap this team out of it and it's for him to point the ship in the general direction he thinks it needs to go. This includes all the personnel and player decisions... especially the QB decision. If Ballard wanted to draft a QB in 2020 or 2021 or 2022 he should have done it, despite what Reich wanted. Ultimately the buck has to stop with him when it comes to the personnel decisions on this team. 

[w87r]

4 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Having said that, I am thinking the only thing that saves Ballard's job is if we win the Division in 2024

So if we don't win the division this year you think Ballard will be fired?

[2006Coltsbestever]

7 minutes ago, RollerColt said:

Hindsight is fun... 

 

I'm sure most of the league would love a do-over for the 2000 draft and pick up Tom Brady. 

Chargers drafted Ryan Leaf in 1998 instead of Randy Moss - Gotcha 

[stitches]

3 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I would take Luck over Allen as well all-time but my point is, had we known Luck was only going to play in 2018 and then retire, drafting Allen would have been the way to go. IMO Allen is better than Herbert. 

That's the point... you cannot know that. Nobody knew that. Not Ballard... not Reich... not Luck... not anybody. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, w87r said:

So if we don't win the division this year you think Ballard will be fired?

Not 100% sure but should he be in your opinion? I mean he has been given a lot of chances to get our team to a contender over the years and it hasn't happened. Not saying it is all his fault, but I think he is on the hot seat - no Division Titles in 7 years under him.

 

I have defended him more than most on here, so I am far from a Ballard hater. 

[RollerColt]

Just now, stitches said:

I think a lot of what people have been doing last few years has been excuses. Most of the teams in the league have their own set of setbacks and reasons why they should not be achieving great success. But this league doesn't wait for anybody... it's the Not For Long league. You either compete or you are left in the dust. And for the most time since Luck's retirement we've been in the dust. And it's on the GM to snap this team out of it and it's for him to point the ship in the general direction he thinks it needs to go. This includes all the personnel and player decisions... especially the QB decision. If Ballard wanted to draft a QB in 2020 or 2021 or 2022 he should have done it, despite what Reich wanted. Ultimately the buck has to stop with him when it comes to the personnel decisions on this team. 

I think there's a difference between making excuses and accepting things for what they are. 

 

I'm not happy about us not winning the division in years. Yeah I'm tired of it. But what can we do? Boycott the team until Ballard gets fired? 

[stitches]

7 minutes ago, w87r said:

So if we don't win the division this year you think Ballard will be fired?

Not 100%, but if AR is not showing signs of being a franchise QB and the team misses the playoffs again... IMO it's very likely Ballard is gone. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

5 minutes ago, stitches said:

That's the point... you cannot know that. Nobody knew that. Not Ballard... not Reich... not Luck... not anybody. 

Of course nobody knew, that is where Ballard gets a break instead of drafting Allen and drafting Nelson. Ballard had no clue that Andrew was going to retire.

[smittywerb]

13 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I am not Jim Irsay so I have no idea what he is thinking right now. I put that in bold on purpose for many reasons. Having said that, I am thinking the only thing that saves Ballard's job is if we win the Division in 2024 meaning AR pans out as well. As of now I just don't see it, Texans are better, and the Jags are even with us + we haven't won in Jacks since Andrew Luck had his best season in 2014!

Id say if we make the playoffs or come close, I can see Ballard saying to irsay “look how close we are.  Give me this off-season to make some big moves” and he’ll do his usual and get fired midway through 25 :’(

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, stitches said:

Not 100%, but if AR is not showing signs of being a franchise QB and the team misses the playoffs again... IMO it's very likely Ballard is gone. 

Sort of what I was saying. Makes sense unfortunately. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

It's tough to hate Ballard because IMO he has a great football mind, he is a good family man, and good for the city, but after a while it is about winning.

[smittywerb]

10 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

Should we? Could he have gotten players at the same position that were better than what we re-signed? The key factor is, they fit his budget. Kenny Moore wasn't breaking the bank for guaranteed money like Sneed, for an example. 

 

I don't expect Ballard to change his stripes even if he knows AR needs just a little help. "Explosive" was the term Ballard used - have we gotten any more explosive after free agency? 

Honestly, I everyone we resigned was worth it.  Pittman, he’s our WR1.  Moore, he’s probably the best nickel corner in the game.  Grover, one of the best run stopping DTs.  Blackmon, we could’ve gotten better but fumbled getting better by waiting on the sneed deal.  JT, no brainer, top 5 RB in the league.

 

so with that said, I do think our best bet was to resign to those players.  I do think we had a chance to get better at FS (still can) but we stayed in the sneed negotiations too long.  
 

I always thought our explosiveness needed to come from the draft.  The player we select will be cheap and provide an immediate impact.  

[stitches]

1 minute ago, RollerColt said:

I think there's a difference between making excuses and accepting things for what they are. 

 

I'm not happy about us not winning the division in years. Yeah I'm tired of it. But what can we do? Boycott the team until Ballard gets fired? 

It's not about what we can do. It's about what Ballard should have been doing for the last 5 years and what he should be doing going forward. We, as random fans on a message board, are not very significant part of the team's braintrust considerations... and pretty much all we can do is voice our frustrations and find camaraderie with other fans over the misery of being a fan of a team that seems to be left behind right now.... and hopes that things might change

[RollerColt]

Just now, stitches said:

It's not about what we can do. It's about what Ballard should have been doing for the last 5 years and what he should be doing going forward. We, as random fans on a message board, are not very significant part of the team's braintrust considerations... and pretty much all we can do is voice our frustrations and find camaraderie with other fans over the misery of being a fan of a team that seems to be left behind right now.... and hopes that things might change

Misery does love company. 

[w87r]

3 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Not 100% sure but should he be in your opinion? I mean he has been given a lot of chances to get our team to a contender over the years and it hasn't happened. Not saying it is all his fault, but I think he is on the hot seat - no Division Titles in 7 years under him.

 

I have defended him more than most on here, so I am far from a Ballard hater. 

Which is why I was surprised to hear you make such a proclamation.

 

 

I don't think Ballard is going anywhere, regardless what happens this season.

 

I don't care how long ago Luck left, he left the team in no man's land, with a roster that could compete. So there was tough choices to make on vet QB or start over, which would of been full fledged start over, all the other talent we had accumulated would of likely moved on as we groomed the young QB.

 

Like has been mentioned, first year Luck retired, we brought in Brisssett and competed. Had we not completed in that season as much, maybe a case could of been made to reset through draft. Wasn't the case, Rivers took us to almost a playoff victory. Reich wanted to bring in Wentz, we know how that went. Reich has been fired twice since then. Still was 1 win on last 2 weeks of season to making the playoffs. So reset now? No one more vet option, Ryan which clearly didn't pay off. 

 

Now we are here.

 

 

However, I just took some meds, because I have a dental procedure this afternoon, so I'm not in the full state of mind at the moment.

 

Will catch up later or next day or so 

[smittywerb]

15 minutes ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

 

I don't think everyone on this forum, nor in the organization feel that way. It's not this year or never. I can't imagine having that mentality with a guy that is basically a rookie under center. "if he doesn't play a full season, or struggles, hit the rebuild button." That's interesting... 

 

Well tbh, not much to rebuild from.  I guess what I really mean we should start looking for another qb to build around.  Which may require some different personnel to exploit his talents.  I maybe misspoke when I said “hit the rebuild”.  Don’t actually mean an entire fire sale.  But I’d be down for kicking Bradley to curb and revamping this defense and also finding a QB.  Like i said though, if AR struggles and/or can’t survive.  Maybe give him third year but that would be the max because then it’s almost contract time.

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, w87r said:

Which is why I was surprised to hear you make such a proclamation.

 

 

I don't think Ballard is going anywhere, regardless what happens this season.

 

I don't care how long ago Luck left, he left the team in no man's land, with a roster that could compete. So there was tough choices to make on vet QB or start over, which would of been full fledged start over, all the other talent we had accumulated would of likely moved on as we groomed the young QB.

 

Like has been mentioned, first year Luck retired, we brought in Brisssett and competed. Had we not completed in that season as much, maybe a case could of been made to reset through draft. Wasn't the case, Rivers took us to almost a playoff victory. Reich wanted to bring in Wentz, we know how that went. Reich has been fired twice since then. Still was 1 win on last 2 weeks of season to making the playoffs. So reset now? No one more vet option, Ryan which clearly didn't pay off. 

 

Now we are here.

 

 

However, I just took some meds, because I have a dental procedure this afternoon, so I'm not in the full state of mind at the moment.

 

Will catch up later or next day or so 

Despite the Meds, you made some good points as usual. I just don't know anymore what to think.

[stitches]

2 minutes ago, w87r said:

 

However, I just took some meds, because I have a dental procedure this afternoon, so I'm not in the full state of mind at the moment.

 

Will catch up later or next day or so 

Good luck with your procedure. 

[tfunky14]

56 minutes ago, stitches said:

Luck retired in Ballard's 3d year... we are entering year 8 of his tenure. I think it's long been time to stop using the Luck retirement as an excuse. Sure, it was horribly timed, it was incredibly unlucky for Ballard... but A TON of time has passed since. 

 

The Bengals have a new QB since Luck has retired and made the SB. 

The 49ers have switched a few QBs since Luck retired and have made multiple SBs. 

The Eagles have a new QB since Luck retired and have made the SB. 

The Rams have a new QB since Luck retired and won the SB. 

The Bucs took a new QB after Luck retired and won the SB. 

 

The Jaguars have a new QB since Luck retired and have won the division.

The Texans have a new QB since Luck retired and have won the division

 

 

We cannot keep getting back to that Luck thing. 

 

I agree with that.   With Steichen as our coach the Colts are on the rise. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

4 minutes ago, w87r said:

Which is why I was surprised to hear you make such a proclamation.

 

 

I don't think Ballard is going anywhere, regardless what happens this season.

 

I don't care how long ago Luck left, he left the team in no man's land, with a roster that could compete. So there was tough choices to make on vet QB or start over, which would of been full fledged start over, all the other talent we had accumulated would of likely moved on as we groomed the young QB.

 

Like has been mentioned, first year Luck retired, we brought in Brisssett and competed. Had we not completed in that season as much, maybe a case could of been made to reset through draft. Wasn't the case, Rivers took us to almost a playoff victory. Reich wanted to bring in Wentz, we know how that went. Reich has been fired twice since then. Still was 1 win on last 2 weeks of season to making the playoffs. So reset now? No one more vet option, Ryan which clearly didn't pay off. 

 

Now we are here.

 

 

However, I just took some meds, because I have a dental procedure this afternoon, so I'm not in the full state of mind at the moment.

 

Will catch up later or next day or so 

Wisdom teeth? I remember when I got mine yanked out, the Doc gave me some good stuff 

[w87r]

1 minute ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Wisdom teeth? I remember when I got mine yanked out, the Doc gave me some good stuff 

I don't even take Tylenol anymore. Probably going to Lala land for a while? Im a big guy(6'3" 240), almost an hour in, and don't feel much, supposed to take another one in at 12:30. Procedure at 1. Guess we will see.

 

 

Halicon or something like that. Supposed to make me sleepy? 

 

I just wanted to actually be put out. I hate being awake during dental work.

[RollerColt]

1 minute ago, w87r said:

I don't even take Tylenol anymore. Probably going to Lala land for a while? Im a big guy(6'3" 240), almost an hour in, and don't feel much, supposed to take another one in at 12:30. Procedure at 1. Guess we will see.

 

 

Halicon or something like that. Supposed to make me sleepy? 

 

I just wanted to actually be put out. I hate being awake during dental work.

My 4 year old son a few months ago had an entire tooth pulled without any numbing or meds... His pain tolerance is insane. I'm always opting for at least the novocain before any work done. 

 

But yeah, besides that stuff I try to stay away from pain medication. I come from a long line of family addicts ranging from alcohol to prescription meds to friggin' meth... It's always in the back of my mind even when taking excederin for my migraines... 

[Superman]

2 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

I’m fine with him constantly bringing guys in via the draft. That’s what you should do. My issue is that with the current pace to improving the roster (not really using FA) we’ll always be in the same spot. Having enough talent to be competitive, but never enough to make a run, because the rookie class is always going to make or break the team.

 

By the time your young players become vets ready for extensions, you’ll have another 3-4 core players who will be on the way out. For example, it’s great if JuJu Brent’s becomes a lockdown corner in year 3, but by that time you’re back needing a new center and WR1. This business model of relying exclusively on young players to perform early isn’t sustainable because it’s a constant chasing of the tail. You basically always have holes.

 

 

This is a valid point. I don't think the Colts are relying exclusively on young players to perform -- the team's core is a good mix of young players and established vets -- but at some point the roster building needs to be accelerated. 

 

As a counter, I think the primary force multiplier for any contention level team is the QB. (Coaching as well. We're talking about the roster, but I think Steichen made a huge difference for the offense last year, and I think the biggest problem on the defense is Gus Bradley.)

 

If we have really good QB play, it probably changes how we feel about the young TEs, or Downs/Pierce. If the offense is more effective, that can boost the pass rush, which can help the secondary, and then Brents' timeline is different than you're anticipating. There's no question we need difference makers at multiple positions, but I think we've been patchwork at QB for so long -- along with some questionable coaching and development -- that we haven't really reaped the benefits of the young players performing. I'm not suggesting that Alec Pierce is going to perform like Nico Collins, but look at what having a good QB can do for a young player. 

 

So again, yeah the roster building needs a boost, no question. But I think the potential of some of our young players is being overlooked. And I think we have some veteran players who can perform at a higher level than we've seen over the last two seasons -- MPJ, JT, Buckner, Moore, etc.