Jonathan Taylor comments on his contract/Request trade (Merge)

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, coltsva said:

The math works fine. 

 

250 x 10 = 2500 (the extra yardage for each year he played)

1000 x 3 = 3000 (estimated yardage for each additional year, if he had played 3 more years) 

TOTAL = 5500 additional yards in his career. 

 

 

See my post above, problem is, Emmitt didn't have a great Line for 13 years.

[2006Coltsbestever]

18 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

You are digging a hole really deep on this subject. Also the narrative that Emmitt Smith had a great Offensive Line his whole career is nonsense. His Line was great from 1992-1996, basically 5 years in his 15 year career. Those 5 years standout because the Cowboys were dominant as a team. In 1997 the Cowboys O.Line struggled big-time, and several years after that that line had new faces and was injury prone. Larry Allen was great most of his career and he wasn't even on the team in 1992 or 1993. He was a rookie in 1994. The Cowboys basically had the greatest O.Line ever for a period of 3 years from 1994-1996.

 

Barry Sanders had Lomas Brown almost his whole career, he is a top 10 LT of all-time (arguably top 5 ever) so it is not like he played with doo doo his whole career either. Brown made all-pro in 1995 and 2nd team all-pro 4 times while with the Lions.

He would not have had 5000 yards more, no way no how. 

[coltsva]

1 minute ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

See my post above, problem is, Emmitt didn't have a great Line for 13 years.

Hey, I was just doing my math homework. Leave me out of the debate part of this! 

[2006Coltsbestever]

Just now, coltsva said:

Hey, I was just doing my math homework. Leave me out of the debate part of this! 

[Moosejawcolt]

On 7/3/2023 at 7:28 AM, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Emmitt and Walter had a lot of the same intangibles is why I said they were clones. Clone may have been too strong of word. 

 

Going to a Top 10, I would say:

1. Jim Brown

2. Emmitt Smith

3. Walter Payton

4. Barry Sanders

5. Eric Dickerson

6. Adrian Peterson

7. Tony Dorsett

8. Marshall Faulk

9. Franco Harris

10. Earl Campbell

 

RB's/FB's/Runners.

 

So you tell me that if have Emmitt playing with the Chicago teams that supported Payton and/or the Rams teams that OJ played for, Emmitt is still a top 10 back? I dont and it aint close. All those backs you listed were superior runners, greater physical talents, faster  players than Emmitt ever was. PS, I think ranking rbs one to 10 is kind of silly as they all played with different teams, talents and schemes.  

[Moosejawcolt]

On 7/3/2023 at 7:28 AM, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Emmitt and Walter had a lot of the same intangibles is why I said they were clones. Clone may have been too strong of word. 

 

Going to a Top 10, I would say:

1. Jim Brown

2. Emmitt Smith

3. Walter Payton

4. Barry Sanders

5. Eric Dickerson

6. Adrian Peterson

7. Tony Dorsett

8. Marshall Faulk

9. Franco Harris

10. Earl Campbell

 

RB's/FB's/Runners.

 

When i watched some of the great backs, AD, Sanders, Bo, OJ, and Earl just to name a few, I walk away amazed by their talent. It maybe just me but when i watched Emmitt, I came away thinking man what a dominant offensive line and personnel. I was never wowed by him.  I always thought he maybe one of the most over rated players

[Nickster]

5 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

When i watched some of the great backs, AD, Sanders, Bo, OJ, and Earl just to name a few, I walk away amazed by their talent. It maybe just me but when i watched Emmitt, I came away thinking man what a dominant offensive line and personnel. I was never wowed by him.  I always thought he maybe one of the most over rated players

Emmitt was great he was just very subtle and efficient super non flashy runner.  He didn’t look like much but he’s a football coaches wet dream.  He had superior vision and was very shifty, great at keeping his shoulders square to the LOS.  He was like Marcus Allen in that respect.  Those dudes found cracks and hit them .  Coaches dreams.  Very low percentage of negative runs.  Chain mover.  TD maker.

 

I agree with @2006Coltsbestever about the line.  He had great lines early but not at all later.

 

he was a really good pass catcher and superior pass protector.

 

I don’t think he’s top 3 but is top 10 IMO.  

[crazycolt1]

1 hour ago, Nickster said:

Emmitt was great he was just very subtle and efficient super non flashy runner.  He didn’t look like much but he’s a football coaches wet dream.  He had superior vision and was very shifty, great at keeping his shoulders square to the LOS.  He was like Marcus Allen in that respect.  Those dudes found cracks and hit them .  Coaches dreams.  Very low percentage of negative runs.  Chain mover.  TD maker.

 

I agree with @2006Coltsbestever about the line.  He had great lines early but not at all later.

 

he was a really good pass catcher and superior pass protector.

 

I don’t think he’s top 3 but is top 10 IMO.  

Smith benefited hugely by having one of the best blocking fullbacks with Dayrl Johnson. 

[Moosejawcolt]

1 hour ago, Nickster said:

Emmitt was great he was just very subtle and efficient super non flashy runner.  He didn’t look like much but he’s a football coaches wet dream.  He had superior vision and was very shifty, great at keeping his shoulders square to the LOS.  He was like Marcus Allen in that respect.  Those dudes found cracks and hit them .  Coaches dreams.  Very low percentage of negative runs.  Chain mover.  TD maker.

 

I agree with @2006Coltsbestever about the line.  He had great lines early but not at all later.

 

he was a really good pass catcher and superior pass protector.

 

I don’t think he’s top 3 but is top 10 IMO.  

I actually think there are about 20 backs that r kind of inter changeable. I could take anyone od them and be happy

[jvan1973]

9 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

So you tell me that if have Emmitt playing with the Chicago teams that supported Payton and/or the Rams teams that OJ played for, Emmitt is still a top 10 back? I dont and it aint close. All those backs you listed were superior runners, greater physical talents, faster  players than Emmitt ever was. PS, I think ranking rbs one to 10 is kind of silly as they all played with different teams, talents and schemes.  

When did OJ play for the Rams?

[2006Coltsbestever]

11 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

So you tell me that if have Emmitt playing with the Chicago teams that supported Payton and/or the Rams teams that OJ played for, Emmitt is still a top 10 back? I dont and it aint close. All those backs you listed were superior runners, greater physical talents, faster  players than Emmitt ever was. PS, I think ranking rbs one to 10 is kind of silly as they all played with different teams, talents and schemes.  

That is what I am saying regarding your first sentence. Backs like Frank Gore and Curtis Martin carried teams for years. If those 2 could do it, I know Emmitt could. Those type of backs have the durability and toughness to do it for a long time. By the way OJ carried the Bills not the Rams  

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

 

[Moosejawcolt]

3 hours ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

 

There the market has been set. The Giants offered 13 mill and that is a fair offer as they know the market. Barkley is a better overall back than Taylor, so I am thinking maybe 11 a year but I am all for letting it play out and franchising for another. 

[Moosejawcolt]

16 hours ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

 

https://twitter.com/_MLFootball/status/1679502111157911555?t=iZVs5s16zwH87dxQBXJBLw&s=19

[Moosejawcolt]

On 7/12/2023 at 5:02 PM, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

 

https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/10082754-colts-jonathan-taylor-not-a-creative-rb-who-can-do-it-on-his-own-nfl-exec-says.amp.html

[NewColtsFan]

28 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/10082754-colts-jonathan-taylor-not-a-creative-rb-who-can-do-it-on-his-own-nfl-exec-says.amp.html

That’s the view of one exec.   One.   That’s one more than none.  Let’s not pretend this is the consensus viewpoint. 

[Moosejawcolt]

8 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

That’s the view of one exec.   One.   That’s one more than none.  Let’s not pretend this is the consensus viewpoint. 

Never said it was but that's kind of how I view him. Straighline runner. Great size and speed. Average pass catcher and below average blocker.  Not a lot of wiggle.  Am I missing something? He is actually a throw back rb. The only issue is today's elite backs need to be elite in  all areas to warrant an elite contract. If they are not , you have the committee approach. Honest question. Do u view Tsylor as being elite in all areas? 

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Never said it was but that's kind of how I view him. Straighline runner. Great size and speed. Average pass catcher and below average blocker.  Not a lot of wiggle.  Am I missing something? He is actually a throw back rb. The only issue is today's elite backs need to be elite in  all areas to warrant an elite contract. If they are not , you have the committee approach. Honest question. Do u view Tsylor as being elite in all areas? 

I view Taylor as elite as a runner.  He’s the opposite of a straight line runner who has no wiggle.   I have no idea where you even got that idea?   That’s astounding! 
 

I think he’s at least average as a receiver, maybe above average.   It’s hard to know with the offense the Colts have had for the last three years.   And I’d describe him as “willing” as a blocker.   I don’t know how you arrived at your conclusions?
 

As to the “committee approach” you talk about….  When healthy, do the Colts use him that way?   No.  He’s the featured back.  So I’m comfortable saying the Colts do not share your evaluation of Jonathan Taylor. 

Taylor is the fastest player on the offense.  He’s the most elusive.  He’s the most explosive.   In his 2021 season, Taylor led all RBs in most runs over 10 yards, most over 20 yards, over 30 yards, 40 yards, most over 50, 60, and 70 yards.   I don’t know what more anyone could want. 
 

I think you should go to YouTube to see the videos the Colts put out around the draft and what they liked about JT back then.  I think they’ve been proven right.  
 

Sorry, we disagree. 

[w87r]

Joe Mixon took a pay cut to stay with Bengals this season.

 

RB value continues to drop.

[Yoshinator]

Just now, w87r said:

Joe Mixon took a pay cut to stay with Bengals this season.

 

RB value continues to drop.

Yep. Part of that may be because he's on a contender, but the RB position is very devalued these days. It's going to be interesting to see if Barkley and Jacobs holdout or not. 

[w87r]

12 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Yep. Part of that may be because he's on a contender, but the RB position is very devalued these days. It's going to be interesting to see if Barkley and Jacobs holdout or not. 

They need to put themselves in check.

 

After this move by Mixon. Barkley, Jacobs and Pollard are all tied for 3rd highest paid RBs this year(cap hits). Behind only Henry and Chubb.

 

 

Hopefully the Giants and Raiders hold strong and don't give in.

[Yoshinator]

13 minutes ago, w87r said:

They need to put themselves in check.

 

After this move by Mixon. Barkley, Jacobs and Pollard are all tied for 3rd highest paid RBs this year(cap hits). Behind only Henry and Chubb.

 

 

Hopefully the Giants and Raiders hold strong and don't give in.

I agree. Although I wouldn't mind them overpaying at the RB position, I also don't want to have to overpay Taylor either. If Barkley and Jacobs get huge deals, that could set the precedent for RBs holding out to get paid.

[w87r]

2 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

I agree. Although I wouldn't mind them overpaying at the RB position, I also don't want to have to overpay Taylor either. If Barkley and Jacobs get huge deals, that could set the precedent for RBs holding out to get paid.

[w87r]

6 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

I agree. Although I wouldn't mind them overpaying at the RB position, I also don't want to have to overpay Taylor either. If Barkley and Jacobs get huge deals, that could set the precedent for RBs holding out to get paid.

Good thing is the clock is ticking.

 

Monday 4pm is deadline for new contract, if not they have to play on the tag or not sign it at all and set out.

 

Giants and Jacobs could also pull the offers if they wanted to, until they are signed.

 

Could probably sign Cook for under that $10.1m tag number.

 

 

Just hoping Taylor doesn't act like these guys(probably more their agents). Read the room and take a deal that works for him(security )and the team. $12m a year and move on.

[Yoshinator]

15 minutes ago, w87r said:

Good thing is the clock is ticking.

 

Monday 4pm is deadline for new contract, if not they have to play on the tag or not sign it at all and set out.

 

Giants and Jacobs could also pull the offers if they wanted to, until they are signed.

 

Could probably sign Cook for under that $10.1m tag number.

 

 

Just hoping Taylor doesn't act like these guys(probably more their agents). Read the room and take a deal that works for him(security )and the team. $12m a year and move on.

Yeah, I've been doing a ton of football bestballs on draftkings and fanduel ($137 worth so far), I've been keeping track of my ownership of Barkley and Jacobs until the 17th to see what they do before I draft either of them again. Right now, I'm under the field on both, so I'm going to stay that way until I hear otherwise. Hoping that both just report to training camp.

[MB-ColtsFan]

On 7/2/2023 at 3:42 PM, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Fun trivia: Only 2 RB's have won League MVP 2 years in a row. Jim Brown did it 1957 and 1958. Earl was the other in 1979 and 1980. They were both like FB's the way they played. 

Another great back that hasn't been mentioned in this thread with a similar style as Czonk and Campbell is Christian Okoye.  Can't imagine how many more TD's or yards he would have had if he didn't have injury problems.  That guy was a human wrecking machine.

[Moosejawcolt]

14 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

I view Taylor as elite as a runner.  He’s the opposite of a straight line runner who has no wiggle.   I have no idea where you even got that idea?   That’s astounding! 
 

I think he’s at least average as a receiver, maybe above average.   It’s hard to know with the offense the Colts have had for the last three years.   And I’d describe him as “willing” as a blocker.   I don’t know how you arrived at your conclusions?
 

As to the “committee approach” you talk about….  When healthy, do the Colts use him that way?   No.  He’s the featured back.  So I’m comfortable saying the Colts do not share your evaluation of Jonathan Taylor. 

Taylor is the fastest player on the offense.  He’s the most elusive.  He’s the most explosive.   In his 2021 season, Taylor led all RBs in most runs over 10 yards, most over 20 yards, over 30 yards, 40 yards, most over 50, 60, and 70 yards.   I don’t know what more anyone could want. 
 

I think you should go to YouTube to see the videos the Colts put out around the draft and what they liked about JT back then.  I think they’ve been proven right.  
 

Sorry, we disagree. 

https://www.stampedeblue.com/2023/7/15/23754883/projecting-jonathan-taylors-next-contract

[teganslaw]

Isn't tomorrow, July 17, the deadline for contracts? We should be hearing something soon. 

[w87r]

3 hours ago, teganslaw said:

Isn't tomorrow, July 17, the deadline for contracts? We should be hearing something soon. 

No, tomorrow is the deadline for players that were franchise tagged, to agree on long term deal.

[jvan1973]

3 hours ago, teganslaw said:

Isn't tomorrow, July 17, the deadline for contracts? We should be hearing something soon. 

I don't think Taylor will get a new contract until this season is over.   

[GoColts8818]

3 hours ago, teganslaw said:

Isn't tomorrow, July 17, the deadline for contracts? We should be hearing something soon. 

For franchised players.  Taylor is going into the last year of his rookie deal so this deadline doesn’t apply to him.

[Moosejawcolt]

On 7/2/2023 at 4:20 PM, CR91 said:

 

Size and power yes, but not speed. Peterson was just an athletic freak of nature.

U could argue based on physical talent and his lack of weapons on offense that he could have been the greatest rb. This guy could have played coming out of high school

[Moosejawcolt]

8 hours ago, w87r said:

No, tomorrow is the deadline for players that were franchise tagged, to agree on long term deal.

Ballard maybe starting to put his whistle in his pocket and let these players play it out before signing.  I think Nelson's last contract stings a lot and I think even Irsay may be pulling Ballard in a little.

[NewColtsFan]

17 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Ballard maybe starting to put his whistle in his pocket and let these players play it out before signing.  I think Nelson's last contract stings a lot and I think even Irsay may be pulling Ballard in a little.

Ballard doesn’t have to tag Taylor this year.   His rookie contract has one more year, this year.   JT is not on the same clock as Barkley.    
 

Ballard can tag Taylor in 24, and again in 25.   I don’t believe there’s any deadline pressure for Ballard to get a deal done quickly.   Maybe there is for Taylor, but I don’t think there is for Ballard. 

[NewColtsFan]

On 7/15/2023 at 10:28 AM, Moosejawcolt said:

https://www.stampedeblue.com/2023/7/15/23754883/projecting-jonathan-taylors-next-contract

The person who wrote this projection used to be a regular here.  I don’t believe he’s a regular here anymore.   Not sure if he ever posts here at all.  
 

Back then, he wanted to be a journalist so he could cover the NFL. 
 

He was a teenager when he was here..,   15 and 16.    I’d guess he’s roughly 25 now.  
 

Andrew writes for Stampede on a variety of topics ranging for the draft, free agency and contracts.   I’ll try to be diplomatic in case he lurks here….  I don’t find him to be a very effective writer.    And we’ll leave it at that.    
 

 

By the way, for the record….   I’m on record as saying I’m fine if we tag Taylor twice if need be.   But if we hope to sign him,  I’d try for 3 years, $40 mill…. $13.3 mill per, which would make him the 3rd highest paid RB.  
 

The bigger question is….  How much would be guaranteed?   That’s typically the biggest hurdle in negotiations.  

[Moosejawcolt]

1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

The person who wrote this projection used to be a regular here.  I don’t believe he’s a regular here anymore.   Not sure if he ever posts here at all.  
 

Back then, he wanted to be a journalist so he could cover the NFL. 
 

He was a teenager when he was here..,   15 and 16.    I’d guess he’s roughly 25 now.  
 

Andrew writes for Stampede on a variety of topics ranging for the draft, free agency and contracts.   I’ll try to be diplomatic in case he lurks here….  I don’t find him to be a very effective writer.    And we’ll leave it at that.    
 

 

By the way, for the record….   I’m on record as saying I’m fine if we tag Taylor twice if need be.   But if we hope to sign him,  I’d try for 3 years, $40 mill…. $13.3 mill per, which would make him the 3rd highest paid RB.  
 

The bigger question is….  How much would be guaranteed?   That’s typically the biggest hurdle in negotiations.  

Taylor won't be happy but I don't think the Colts want to give him a contract. I think Steichen has a lot of influence and is thinking wrs talent. 

[NewColtsFan]

40 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Taylor won't be happy but I don't think the Colts want to give him a contract. I think Steichen has a lot of influence and is thinking wrs talent. 

I think Steichen would LOVE to sign Taylor.  He is BY FAR our best offensive weapon.   A weapon the defense must account for on every play he’s on the field.  You don’t get rid of guys like that easily unless you stumble into a very good replacement.  The Colts have no one on the roster anywhere near as good.  You cannot replace Taylor easily.   
 

There are two issues.   Talent and salary.  Each has to be considered.   Remember, Ballard says he and Steichen share many viewpoints,  so I’m not sure if your view of Steichen wanting to shed Taylor like unwanted baggage holds much water.  
 

The Colts could offer JT a contract much bigger than you’d like, but Taylor and his agent could still reject it as unacceptable.  Odds are none of us will know about the offer unless the two sides agree to a contract.  

[jvan1973]

1 hour ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Taylor won't be happy but I don't think the Colts want to give him a contract. I think Steichen has a lot of influence and is thinking wrs talent. 

Taylor is a Ballard guy.  He loved him pre draft and was ecstatic to get him.    He will be offered a market value contract this year or next barring a major injury

[Nickster]

On 7/14/2023 at 9:52 PM, NewColtsFan said:

view Taylor as elite as a runner.  He’s the opposite of a straight line runner who has no wiggle.   I have no idea where you even got that idea?   That’s astounding! 
 

You don’t think Taylor is a straight line downhill type runner.

 

umm.  Ok.  

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, Nickster said:

You don’t think Taylor is a straight line downhill type runner.

 

umm.  Ok.  

I think Jonathan Taylor is capable of being any type of runner he wants to be.   He can be a straight line down hill runner, and he can also be a zone runner capable of hitting any hole the blocking gives him.    I don’t think there are any restrictions to what JT can do.