Reich not Ballard

[AustexColt]

I honestly believe that Ballard relied alot on Frank's judgment regarding the Colts QB situation. Frank is a very nice Christian man but he is extremely biased to the "old" way of offense. He does not have the creativity to design plays to his QB strength. It took all these rethread QBs for Irsay to finally step in and shake the Ballard dependancy on Reich. It was also a very smart political move because Ballard could not have fired Reich without having all the old guards (Dungy Polian Levi and Pederson) scarring his reputation. I believe that this time: the Ballard/Shane partnership will be how we turn our team around. Sorry Frank, and I wish you the best with the Panthers.  
 

[r a y s k i]

I’ve posted this before, Reich has regressed the offense, playbook and his playcalling every year unfortunately, people hating on Ballard are just not looking at statistics and history realistically in my humble opinion 

[Peter Nova]

7 minutes ago, AustexColt said:

I honestly believe that Ballard relied alot on Frank's judgment regarding the Colts QB situation. Frank is a very nice Christian man but he is extremely biased to the "old" way of offense. He does not have the creativity to design plays to his QB strength. It took all these rethread QBs for Irsay to finally step in and shake the Ballard dependancy on Reich. It was also a very smart political move because Ballard could not have fired Reich without having all the old guards (Dungy Polian Levi and Pederson) scarring his reputation. I believe that this time: the Ballard/Shane partnership will be how we turn our team around. Sorry Frank, and I wish you the best with the Panthers.  
 

 

I don't follow exactly what you mean by "old way" of offense. I'm assuming you think elite passing QBs are going to be a thing of the past and running QBs are going to dominate the position moving forward. History isn't on those types of QBs side, and if I were an NFL owner I don't want to pay my running QB huge money contracts to potentially miss lots of ball games. See Lamar, Cam and Murray for that. 

[r a y s k i]

3 minutes ago, Peter Nova said:

 

I don't follow exactly what you mean by "old way" of offense. I'm assuming you think elite passing QBs are going to be a thing of the past and running QBs are going to dominate the position moving forward. History isn't on those types of QBs side, and if I were an NFL owner I don't want to pay my running QB huge money contracts to potentially miss lots of ball games. See Lamar, Cam and Murray for that. 

Game and rules have changed significantly tho

but I’d say whats important is significant mobility like Allen Herbert  or Mahomes any extra is bonus but you got to be able to extend plays when play broken down, that extra time is so important, look where someone like Mac Jones will be ranked in the AFC this year, would have been bettern than average 20 years ago, probably projected to be bottom 5 in the afc now 

[Nesjan3]

Blaming Reich for all the QB and offensive failures is an easy way for Ballard supporters to give him a free pass.

 

At the end of the day its Ballards job to infuse the team with talent including at the QB position.

 

Its also his job to listen and evaluate what he is told by the coaches and choose how much he is going to allow those peoples opinion to sway his decisions.

 

In short, if Frank wanted Wentz but Ballard didnt like was reported. Ballard should have told Reich to kick rocks. Not given in to him.

 

We are going see now how this roster performs going forward with a brand new HC that everyone says is an offensive, QB developing genious. No more excuses and free passes for Ballard.

[Peter Nova]

32 minutes ago, rayski said:

Game and rules have changed significantly tho

but I’d say whats important is significant mobility like Allen Herbert  or Mahomes any extra is bonus but you got to be able to extend plays when play broken down, that extra time is so important, look where someone like Mac Jones will be ranked in the AFC this year, would have been bettern than average 20 years ago, probably projected to be bottom 5 in the afc now 

Elite passing QBs who can extend plays is a bonus. Like Mahomes, Allen, Herbert and Lawrence. Putting them in the same category as Lamar, Fields, Vick and Murray and saying they're all duel threat QBs is ignorant.  One group are limited as passers. The QBR masked that vs passer rating.

[throwing BBZ]

51 minutes ago, Peter Nova said:

 

I don't follow exactly what you mean by "old way" of offense. I'm assuming you think elite passing QBs are going to be a thing of the past and running QBs are going to dominate the position moving forward. History isn't on those types of QBs side, and if I were an NFL owner I don't want to pay my running QB huge money contracts to potentially miss lots of ball games. See Lamar, Cam and Murray for that. 

 

 I believe you missed the point entirely.

He spoke of designing plays to strength's.

 And lack of creativity.

  We lived through Frank being a fuddy duddy, his predictable runs, Hines Ugh!

 His message became as stale as his playbook/play calling.

 Frank got the chance of a lifetime and tried his best. Ballard and his personnel people had plenty of fails too.

 Irsay failed too, especially approving Frank's contract extension. Otherwise, Frank would have been looking for a job after our 2021 season ending debacle!

 I am giddy with renewed optimism with our change to Steichen.

[throwing BBZ]

26 minutes ago, Nesjan3 said:

Blaming Reich for all the QB and offensive failures is an easy way for Ballard supporters to give him a free pass.

 

At the end of the day its Ballards job to infuse the team with talent including at the QB position.

 

Its also his job to listen and evaluate what he is told by the coaches and choose how much he is going to allow those peoples opinion to sway his decisions.

 

In short, if Frank wanted Wentz but Ballard didnt like was reported. Ballard should have told Reich to kick rocks. Not given in to him.

 

We are going see now how this roster performs going forward with a brand new HC that everyone says is an offensive, QB developing genious. No more excuses and free passes for Ballard.

 

 Actually, all QB info is fed and ok'd by Irsay.

Frank would have pitched both of them on our path forward. Irsay bent to Preacher Frank a few important times. Such is Life!

[Peter Nova]

1 minute ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

I am giddy with renewed optimism with our change to Steichen.

I think we're all excited for a change and hope it works out with the new HC. However,  I remember the same feeling of optimism when Ballard was hired, so I won't anoint him as great until we see some playoffs.

[FanFromtheWasteland]

18 hours ago, Peter Nova said:

 

I don't follow exactly what you mean by "old way" of offense. I'm assuming you think elite passing QBs are going to be a thing of the past and running QBs are going to dominate the position moving forward. History isn't on those types of QBs side, and if I were an NFL owner I don't want to pay my running QB huge money contracts to potentially miss lots of ball games. See Lamar, Cam and Murray for that. 

Don't forget RG3 and what Wash gave up for him

[shasta519]

19 hours ago, AustexColt said:

I honestly believe that Ballard relied alot on Frank's judgment regarding the Colts QB situation. Frank is a very nice Christian man but he is extremely biased to the "old" way of offense. He does not have the creativity to design plays to his QB strength. It took all these rethread QBs for Irsay to finally step in and shake the Ballard dependancy on Reich. It was also a very smart political move because Ballard could not have fired Reich without having all the old guards (Dungy Polian Levi and Pederson) scarring his reputation. I believe that this time: the Ballard/Shane partnership will be how we turn our team around. Sorry Frank, and I wish you the best with the Panthers.  
 

 

I have no idea how one came to this conclusion. Sounds like something that Colts Twitter would come up with.

 

Reich had a top 10 scoring offenses in 3/5 seasons (with a different QB each year). He was constantly designing his scheme to his QB's strengths. It just turned out that the most recent ones had no strengths left.

 

That's not to say it wasn't time for a change, but blaming Frank for the QB situation or offensive woes is a tired narrative. 

[shasta519]

19 hours ago, Nesjan3 said:

Blaming Reich for all the QB and offensive failures is an easy way for Ballard supporters to give him a free pass.

 

At the end of the day its Ballards job to infuse the team with talent including at the QB position.

 

Its also his job to listen and evaluate what he is told by the coaches and choose how much he is going to allow those peoples opinion to sway his decisions.

 

In short, if Frank wanted Wentz but Ballard didnt like was reported. Ballard should have told Reich to kick rocks. Not given in to him.

 

We are going see now how this roster performs going forward with a brand new HC that everyone says is an offensive, QB developing genious. No more excuses and free passes for Ballard.

 

Yep. Irsay said he was waffling on giving Reich that extension in August of 2021.

 

So it's very hard to believe that, six months earlier (Feb of 2021), Irsay would have sided with Reich over Ballard (if Ballard actually didn't want to trade for Wentz, which I don't buy).

[indyagent17]

Reich has the offense so 'vanilla" it was hard to watch no matter which QB was in. Defenses just pinned their ears back and destroyed us. Thank goodness he is gone for a younger and hopefully more innovative coach 

[Peter Nova]

2 hours ago, indyagent17 said:

Reich has the offense so 'vanilla" it was hard to watch no matter which QB was in. Defenses just pinned their ears back and destroyed us. Thank goodness he is gone for a younger and hopefully more innovative coach 

 

And if he prospers in Carolina and the Colts continue to be below average mediocre, maybe he just didn't have the personnel with the Colts. 

[sb41champs]

I agree - to an extent - with the Frank Reich criticism.  

 

He did NOT design the offense to the strengths of his QB - whichever one was currently on the QB carousel.

 

I also - FIRMLY - believe that Matt Ryan might have sufficed for the two years of his contract - IF - the Colts hadn't played "musical chairs" with his offensive line the first half of the season.

 

"QB carousels" - and - "O-line musical chairs" don't bode well for a team in the modern NFL world.

 

I have always believed in Ballard.  I am looking forward to believing in Shane Steichen.

[hoosierhawk]

I never have understood why Reich got the tag of a "Quarterback Whisperer". I saw nothing from him in Indy that he even remotely deserved that title. I was OK with the hiring even thought he did make the first round of cuts before the job was offered to McDaniel. I started to sour in year 2 mainly because he spent 100% of his time during games concentrating on play calling rather than being the head coach and spending time with both the OC and DC and ST coaches.  He was the COO of the team on the field but only concentrated on one thing which incidentally he was not good at. What Carolina sees in him is a mystery to me other than he seems to be a really good guy.

Steichen has to prove himself but I like his attitude and demeaner so far. The front office took a great deal of time and effort in this hire and he wasn't a hasty choice. He has defined his qualifications for his ideal QB candidate. I can only guess what Frank's ideal candidate would be but may get an inkling tomorrow night at 8:01 pm. As I stated, Frank is a good guy but it takes so much more then that to be a good coach. There are many great coaches I might add that doesn't seem to have that good guy demeaner.

[Hawkeyecolt]

I found it interesting that Carolina came to their conclusion on who their pick would be then filled Frank in afterward. 

[Jackie Daytona]

12 hours ago, shasta519 said:

 

Yep. Irsay said he was waffling on giving Reich that extension in August of 2021.

 

So it's very hard to believe that, six months earlier (Feb of 2021), Irsay would have sided with Reich over Ballard (if Ballard actually didn't want to trade for Wentz, which I don't buy).

Ballard has been scared to pick a QB high, I am starting to think there's something to the idea that he doesn't want to "start the clock" when he picks one....and that's been great for his job preservation ...he's survived longer than any GM does with this track record....  How many are around for 3 coaches, ok....2.5.   6 opening day starting QBs.... And what....2 playoff wins and a losing record?  Zero division titles in over half a decade?  Yeah....those are firing number... But he's been able to point at whatever it is to keep himself here.... And he knows missing on a QB high.... Especially in light of all that, ends it.

[SR711]

9 hours ago, Jackie Daytona said:

Ballard has been scared to pick a QB high, I am starting to think there's something to the idea that he doesn't want to "start the clock" when he picks one....and that's been great for his job preservation ...he's survived longer than any GM does with this track record....  How many are around for 3 coaches, ok....2.5.   6 opening day starting QBs.... And what....2 playoff wins and a losing record?  Zero division titles in over half a decade?  Yeah....those are firing number... But he's been able to point at whatever it is to keep himself here.... And he knows missing on a QB high.... Especially in light of all that, ends it.

I agree with this post a lot and in the end, I can’t help but feel that Ballard’s lack of aggressiveness in moving up in this draft will ultimately come back to haunt us.

 

Again, I may be shown I am wrong by what happens tonight, but as it stands right now we are at the mercy of three teams ahead of us as to who our choice of QB will be at pick 4.

 

From larger view, logical standpoint it’s hard for me to believe that the organization is truly getting the QB they feel the strongest about/have graded the highest when that is the situation.

 

So unless the Colts evaluation methods are so vastly different and better than others, they will end up with “leftover” choices….which is never ideal IMO

[CoachLite]

Trying to assign blame to one person between the owner, head coach and GM is silly. It is ultimately a team collaboration, and you never know who contributed most to those decisions. You win as a team, and you lose as a team.

 

Let's just hope the composition of the "new" team does better, and that the GM and owner have learned some valuable lessons on making better group decisions.

[Jason_]

9 hours ago, Jackie Daytona said:

Ballard has been scared to pick a QB high, I am starting to think there's something to the idea that he doesn't want to "start the clock" when he picks one..

 

I don't buy this at all.  Ballard hasn't picked a QB high because they instead chose to go after Rivers, Wentz and Ryan.  After signing those guys, it made more sense to do everything possible to maximize their chances of a SB with those QBs.  That, and Wentz was signed with the assumption that he would be the franchise QB for the foreseeable future.

[Mitch Connors]

On 4/25/2023 at 3:51 PM, AustexColt said:

I honestly believe that Ballard relied alot on Frank's judgment regarding the Colts QB situation. Frank is a very nice Christian man but he is extremely biased to the "old" way of offense. He does not have the creativity to design plays to his QB strength. It took all these rethread QBs for Irsay to finally step in and shake the Ballard dependancy on Reich. It was also a very smart political move because Ballard could not have fired Reich without having all the old guards (Dungy Polian Levi and Pederson) scarring his reputation. I believe that this time: the Ballard/Shane partnership will be how we turn our team around. Sorry Frank, and I wish you the best with the Panthers.  
 

 

When will Ballard ever be responsible with this logic?  I can hear it now....the QB they choose this year (draft or otherwise) will be Steichen's fault when it fails because his new way of thinking didn't work with Ballard's old-school approach.

 

I get it. You like Ballard. Like him for the things you believe he does/did right and accept that hes responsible for the QB mistakes over the last 5-6 years regardless of what Frank is or isn't as a coach. The bottom line is Ballard is responsible for making those decisions and if he took in bad information and ran with it, thats his fault too. 

[Jason_]

2 minutes ago, Mitch Connors said:

I get it. You like Ballard. Like him for the things you believe he does/did right and accept that hes responsible for the QB mistakes over the last 5-6 years regardless of what Frank is or isn't as a coach. The bottom line is Ballard is responsible for making those decisions and if he took in bad information and ran with it, thats his fault too.

 

And yet Ballard is still here and Reich is not.  That should tell you that Irsay does not agree with your take. 

 

If there's any one position on the team where the HC should get 'his guy' it's at QB.  And none of the QB decisions over the past 6 years have been Ballard's alone.  

[shasta519]

10 hours ago, Jackie Daytona said:

Ballard has been scared to pick a QB high, I am starting to think there's something to the idea that he doesn't want to "start the clock" when he picks one....and that's been great for his job preservation ...he's survived longer than any GM does with this track record....  How many are around for 3 coaches, ok....2.5.   6 opening day starting QBs.... And what....2 playoff wins and a losing record?  Zero division titles in over half a decade?  Yeah....those are firing number... But he's been able to point at whatever it is to keep himself here.... And he knows missing on a QB high.... Especially in light of all that, ends it.

 

Yes. I believe it was time for a change. Not just the QB approach, but the fact that the Colts were a 4-win team in his first year and were once again a 4-win team in his 6th year...with hardly any success in between.

 

But that's all on paper. Irsay clearly loves him...or is just stubborn to admit his Michael Jordan of NFL GMs might actually be Derrick Rose.

 

But now Ballard is going to put his stamp on a QB.

[AustexColt]

Reich chose Bryce Young. Ballard picked Richardson. If you look at the picks you can see the difference in philosphy. Reich could never coach a guy like Richardson. He is of the Old Mold just like Jim Caldwell. 

Ballard is taking us to a new generational football world. A game that is made with a QB that is generational in RPO skill talent. Ballard and his scouts always pick the "freaks" that stands out in their position. He has one in Richardson. To match his pick he has an offensive coaching staff that plays to this wide open football. Like Shane says: " We will throw to score and run to win "  Reich was more focused on a balanced attack by the number and that boxed us in. Richardson's mobility inside and outside the pocket will make our OL smile ear to ear. JT is going to see openings to gash the defense who will have to respect Richardson's elusiveness. 

I believe that (Shane, Cooter and Turner) the coaching staff is salivating to get their hands on Richardson. The kid is young, moldable and physically skilled. I would love to hear what RG3 has to say about him. 

[Superman]

I think 2021 was the break point. Seems pretty obvious now that Ballard wanted to draft Fields, and Reich wanted Wentz.