The Athletic: Colts disarray, Irsay "a one man crew"

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

6 minutes ago, stitches said:

I guess we will start receiving some answers after the end of the season. To start with - we probably will hear relatively early whether Ballard is staying. And then I expect pretty quickly for us to begin our coaching search if Ballard stays... or GM search if he's let go. 

 

Oh yeah.. .sorry... I mixed up the draft class... it was indeed Fields in the draft when we got Wentz. But yeah... you get my point though. It was indeed oversimplification, but that's the general point - you do take the coach's input, but you still have to decide if that's the path you want to go. 

You don’t think whether Ballard stays or goes could be tied with Harbaugh? Could Ballard stay with another guy  but get fired if Harbaugh wants his own GM.  Could that not take a little while?  I am sure Irsay has already had talks with Harbaugh about if he wants his own GM or not. But maybe you wait until he is actually signed on the dotted line?

[stitches]

1 minute ago, DougDew said:

 

Sorry to butt into youz twoz conversation, but the issue of GM vs HC in roster construction needs some convo on this board.

 

I don't see anyway that the HC is running the draft white board come draft day.  The list of players ranked by positions and ranked in total.  The GM looks at the white board and makes the pick.  He talks to the scouts and analysts in the room.  IIRC, I've never seen Reich pics or video of Reich in the draft room during the draft.

 

Reich tells the GM he wants a deep threat, weeks before the draft reviews film with the GM and the scouts and says AP is "his guy" and helps to rank other players too.  But if AP is not there at 53, what does Ballard do, draft Skye Moore or moves to the TE Jelani Woods?  Then what player is picked with the pick Woods was selected....a lesser speed guy or the BPA defensive player? 

 

I don't think there is anyway that the HC is making those decisions.  The specific players that are picked is based upon who is remaining on the white board and then its the GM who has to navigate player selection on draft day...often only having minutes to decide.   Then the HC has to coach the specific players he gets, under a two, three, or four year contract.  I don't see how the HC is responsible for the specific players on the roster.

 

Does it work some other way then that?

There are plenty of videos of Reich in the draft room. Have you seen the "With the next pick" series that the Colts release every year? He was super happy with the Parris Campbell pick I remember. He seemed to be a proponent for the Granson pick too. 

 

It's not about the coach making those decisions or setting the board. It's about him influencing it. For example, lets say the scouts and FO people had 3 WRs in the same range... coaches at some point join the process and have their favorites and start pushing for them. so by the end it's not 3 guys in the same range... it's 1 guy above the other 2. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 minutes ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

Its not anything that we didn't really know or suspect. I only read the few highlighted excerpts from page 1 of this thread. 

But what I'd like to know, if its in the actual article or not, is why did irsay  dislike wentz  so much?? It was apparent when he started publicly criticising him in about week 5?? 

Was it because he wasn't vaxed? Was it something personal? It was apparent that wentz was going to be the scapegoat first chance irsay  got. The debacle in Jacksonville was more than what was needed.

It makes you wonder. The Oline were also the big position group that didn’t get vaxxed. They seem to be the position group that has been playing the least inspired  since that raiders game last season. Did Irsay start blaming players for the outbreak because they weren’t vaxxed ? I know it sounds wild  but vaccines debate ruined a lot of close relationships in this country. 

[RollerColt]

26 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Yes, I think he hired Jeff "before" firing Frank, and doing it midseason, so he could give Jeff time to figure out what was wrong, but my personal opinion is that I don't believe it is better to do it that way than it is to wait until the end of the season..   I also think he overvalued his team and is handling it poorly.

 

I was running with RollerColt's speculation about emotion, and I can also see where that could be the case.

 

 

 

For the record, I don’t think firing Reich was ever a knee jerk reaction based on emotion. I just think by the Patriots game Irsay decided he needed to expedite the change quicker than normal. 

[DougDew]

2 minutes ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

Its not anything that we didn't really know or suspect. I only read the few highlighted excerpts from page 1 of this thread. 

But what I'd like to know, if its in the actual article or not, is why did irsay  dislike wentz  so much?? It was apparent when he started publicly criticising him in about week 5?? 

Was it because he wasn't vaxed? Was it something personal? It was apparent that wentz was going to be the scapegoat first chance irsay  got. The debacle in Jacksonville was more than what was needed.

Good question, because if Frank convinced Irsay that he could fix Wentz enough to get Ballard to trade for him, then there was something Wentz did early in the season that made Irsay regret the decision to give Frank his way.   

 

I can think of the vax and the foot surgery (where it seemed like Wentz had the issue for a while) that could have been the root.  It was described as "leadership"  IIRC, and it seems to have had to happen early in the season.

[stitches]

7 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

You don’t think whether Ballard stays or goes could be tied with Harbaugh? Could Ballard stay with another guy  but get fired if Harbaugh wants his own GM.  Could that not take a little while?  I am sure Irsay has already had talks with Harbaugh about if he wants his own GM or not. But maybe you wait until he is actually signed on the dotted line?

I wanted to say no, but who knows... with the way Irsay handled firing Frank, can he do the same with Ballard? Fire him only if he gets the OK with Harbaugh? My intuition is saying no. Meaning - this is a more long-term decision. IMO Frank was gone either way... whether during the season or after the season, he was a goner. Saturday's availability just accelerated it. I don't think the decision about the GM in the off-season is similar. I think it's more of a long-term commitment. IMO if Ballard is gone, we will hear it early. Maybe as early as Sunday night. 

[DougDew]

19 minutes ago, stitches said:

There are plenty of videos of Reich in the draft room. Have you seen the "With the next pick" series that the Colts release every year? He was super happy with the Parris Campbell pick I remember. He seemed to be a proponent for the Granson pick too. 

 

It's not about the coach making those decisions or setting the board. It's about him influencing it. For example, lets say the scouts and FO people had 3 WRs in the same range... coaches at some point join the process and have their favorites and start pushing for them. so by the end it's not 3 guys in the same range... it's 1 guy above the other 2. 

Yes I have seen videos, but I have never seen Ballard really consult Frank when it comes to making the pick.  I see Ballard consulting with the scouts.  I just don't think a HC is going to understand the entire pool of players listed on the white board and then measure which player will be there later over the others.  That is about making priorities.  So when it comes to choosing one player over the other, somebody has to manage the pick keeping in mind the options for the next round...or trade ups, and I don't think the HC is doing that.

 

Frank being happy that he got PC and wanting Granson and getting him is one thing.  The fact that Ballard chose those players there over other options or possibly turning down a trade for more picks is his job.  Did Frank want an different TE in round two when Ballard took a DE?   So the fact that he's happy when Ballard selects Granson does not mean Frank is responsible for the Granson pick.    At least I don't see it that way.   

 

 

[Superman]

19 minutes ago, DougDew said:

 

Sorry to butt into youz twoz conversation, but the issue of GM vs HC in roster construction needs some convo on this board.

 

I don't see anyway that the HC is running the draft white board come draft day.  The list of players ranked by positions and ranked in total.  The GM looks at the white board and makes the pick.  He talks to the scouts and analysts in the room.  IIRC, I've never seen pics or video of Reich in the draft room during the draft.

 

Reich wants a deep threat and he reviews film with the GM and the scouts weeks before the draft and says AP is "his guy" .  He helps to rank other players too.  But if AP is not there at 53, what does Ballard do, draft Skye Moore or moves to the TE Jelani Woods?  Then what player is picked with the pick Woods was selected....a lesser speed guy or the BPA defensive player? 

 

I don't think there is anyway that the HC is making those decisions.  The specific players that are picked is based upon who is remaining on the white board.  Its the GM who has to navigate player selection on draft day...often only having minutes to decide.   Then the HC has to coach the specific players he gets, under a two, three, or four year contract.  I don't see how the HC is responsible for the specific players on the roster.

 

Does it work some other way than that?

 

If you watch the draft video, when Reich was so fired up -- "four for stinking four!" -- it becomes obvious that the HC was heavily involved in setting the board. By the time the draft starts, most of the decisions are already made. I assume that they had Pierce ahead of Moore because of the input from all parties, including the preferences of the coaching staff. But I do think the GM runs the board and makes the final decisions. 

[CheezyColt]

31 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I don't see anyway that the HC is running the draft white board come draft day.  The list of players ranked by positions and ranked in total.  The GM looks at the white board and makes the pick.  He talks to the scouts and analysts in the room.  IIRC, I've never seen pics or video of Reich in the draft room during the draft.

Deleted:  Already been answered/addressed.  I'm just late to the party, lol.

[shasta519]

22 minutes ago, stitches said:

Oh, OK. I understand what you meant now. But I still disagree... I don't think anything of what has transpired suggests that Irsay is thinking that. If anything to me it seems like he doesn't trust Ballard and is going over his head to still make important decisions. If he thought "we should have done it your way, here... start fixing this"... he wouldn't have gone with Saturday. He would have let Ballard pick the guy he thinks deserved the spot. What Irsay did is the complete opposite. 

 

Well, yeah... I just think his philosophy is outdated and antiquated. I think he's building a team to win the 1983 Super Bowl. And not really doing great even with that. 

 

GM listens. Weighs pros and cons. Weighs things like "if I bring in a player my coach hates, he's just not going to play him" or "my coach seems to really like this guy and seems to have a good idea how to use him". And still makes his own decision... because it would still be the job of the GM to make the decision of whether he actually he thinks the guy the coach likes for a certain job will be able to do that job. Maybe the GM just doesn't believe he has the physical tools... or he thinks the player is a trouble maker who won't fit in... or... numerous other things... So when Frank tells him "I can fix Wentz", he should ask himself - Ok, I like my coach's self-belief, but how realistic is that? How many similar cases of players playing as bad as Wentz did that previous year turning themselves around exist? Or is going for the Justin Herbert guy with that amazing arm and that athleticism a better option? Weigh the options... weigh the coach's input... but then YOU MAKE THE DECISION. Not the coach. It's YOUR decision. 

 

Agree re: his overall approach. And all you have to do is look at his career leading up to coming to Indy. If Ballard's philosophy (like it is for most people) was shaped through his career, then the decisions over the past few years seem track with that. And there are clear parallels to how this team was built with the orgs that Ballard worked in (CHI from 2002-12 and KC from 2013-17). I don't think it's coincidental at all.

 

The difference was that those teams didn't have Andrew Luck to build around. And once this team lost Andrew Luck, the job that Ballard was hired for changed. However, the personnel and QB approach did not. So maybe Ballard was the one calling to draft a QB, but it's a tough sell for me. Admittedly, I am a bit biased, so skepticism is natural. But clearly Ballard did not have that strong of a conviction (for the one calling the shots).

 

And after the Wentz trade, Ballard had no issue talking about how "WE wanted Wentz," whether it was on a podcast or a Colts PR video. And that included wanting him at that moment and when he was working with KC prior to the 2016 draft. And there was plenty of praise by the local media for trading for Wentz and beating Roseman in that negotiation, and Ballard was front and center.

 

Then the trade backfires somewhat spectacularly, Reich is fired the next season, and now we hear this narrative that Ballard really had no say in that move. That he actually wanted to draft Justin Fields, a QB who was projected top 5 in many circles. This is the same "I like them picks" GM who has consistently cautioned about not forcing it at QB and making sure he gets it right. He holds that belief...only to agree to trade for a QB he wasn't convinced could solve the problem?

 

Of course the alternative to that is that he doesn't really make any decisions, which doesn't really help his cause either.

 

I don't really know how we can look at this season and not want to go in a new direction. But that's JMO.

 

[Nickster]

2 hours ago, RollerColt said:

Get me a media badge, and I'll ask him myself for the greater good. 

[cdgacoltsfan]

Irsay is unhinged.

[RollerColt]

6 minutes ago, Nickster said:

“Hi Mr. Irsay, could you explain to us how you came to the conclusion of calling Jeff Saturday for a head coaching job that technically wasn’t even available yet? Did you consider anyone else or was it just Jeff?”

[Nickster]

2 minutes ago, RollerColt said:

“Hi Mr. Irsay, could you explain to us how you came to the conclusion of calling Jeff Saturday for a head coaching job that technically wasn’t even available yet? Did you consider anyone else or was it just Jeff?”

Get that man a badge!   bet there’s a tech nerd somewhere on here that could get you in.

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

I didn't expect that firing Reich would make the team play better this season. Nine times out of ten, when you fire the HC during the season, things get worse, not better. And I still thought it was the right move.

 

I also blame the lack of a playcaller on Reich. He should have delegated that responsibility all along, and I felt that way for a long time. Then he fires Marcus Brady -- no indication that move was made by anyone but him -- which didn't help the offense at all. I don't blame Milanovich or Montgomery for not wanting the job, given the circumstances. Although I agree, Milanovich holding out for more money is a bad look on his part... 

 

And I don't think Parks has done any worse as a playcaller than Reich was doing.

I think I agree with most of this…. But with that said, I think it points back to Ballard.   This is his team.   Built his way with whatever constraints the Colts have, yet for some odd reason the Colts whiffed BIGLY at LT and RG.   I mean monumental whiffs.    Astonishing that we couldn’t see it coming. 
 

Nor did we see the fast falloff from Ryan.  Irsay spent the off-season and pre-season saying Ryan looked so good he wanted him as the QB for 3-4 more years.   6-7 games in Irsay says “Check please!   I’m done!”

 

Everything seemed to go wrong in ways that were just astounding.  

[DougDew]

50 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

And after the Wentz trade, Ballard had no issue talking about how "WE wanted Wentz," whether it was on a podcast or a Colts PR video. And that included wanting him at that moment and when he was working with KC prior to the 2016 draft. And there was plenty of praise by the local media for trading for Wentz and beating Roseman in that negotiation, and Ballard was front and center.

 

Then the trade backfires somewhat spectacularly, Reich is fired the next season, and now we hear this narrative that Ballard really had no say in that move. That he actually wanted to draft Justin Fields, a QB who was projected top 5 in many circles. This is the same "I like them picks" GM who has consistently cautioned about not forcing it at QB and making sure he gets it right. He holds that belief...only to agree to trade for a QB he wasn't convinced could solve the problem?

Yeah, agree.  The article suggests that the Wentz trade kept the Colts from using a first round draft pick...that year....on a long term "grow your own" QB.   That Wentz was thought of as a long term answer himself.  

 

 It was only a 2022 1st rounder they gave up ..not the end of the world if you are looking for a 10 year QB and you have an out in Wentz' contract after year 2.  If Wentz doesn't work out, draft your QB the next year then.

 

Did they really like Fields or Jones that much?  Remember, the thought was that SF traded up to three to get Jones.    At the time the Colts traded away their first rounder, those Qbs were projected to go pretty high.  They traded Wentz when they thought those QBs could be gone by pick 8, for example.

 

Now it sounds like hindsight.  We wish we didn't trade away our 1st because it turns out we had a much better chance of getting a QB than we thought we would have at the time.    A big part of this issue seems to be that somebody misread the draft board. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Seems to me we had too many people having a say in QB decisions. Reich wanted wentz. Ballard and Irsay wanted to draft fields. Then Reich wanted hurts and Ballard did not like him. Can someone please be the sole voice and make a decision. In a way Ballard is the GM and should of been that voice. I also understand wanting to give your coach what they ask for. It’s just all a mess.

[DougDew]

3 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Seems to me we had too many people having a say in QB decisions. Reich wanted wentz. Ballard and Irsay wanted to draft fields. Then Reich wanted hurts and Ballard did not like him. Can someone please be the sole voice and make a decision. In a way Ballard is the GM and should of been that voice. I also understand wanting to give your coach what they ask for. It’s just all a mess.

People always defer to the highest authority in the room.  It never works any other way despite intentions.  If the top dog doesn't want the blame, then don't get involved.

 

Until the proper time and under the proper circumstances.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Just now, DougDew said:

People always defer to the highest authority in the room.  It never works any other way despite intentions.  If the top dog doesn't want the blame, then don't get involved until the proper time and the proper circumstances

They needed to all sit down and say the best way to have long term success is to draft a QB. Then they should of sat  down as a group and figured out how to do that. That should of been done as soon as Luck retired. 

[Superman]

18 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

I think I agree with most of this…. But with that said, I think it points back to Ballard.   This is his team.   Built his way with whatever constraints the Colts have, yet for some odd reason the Colts whiffed BIGLY at LT and RG.   I mean monumental whiffs.    Astonishing that we couldn’t see it coming. 
 

Nor did we see the fast falloff from Ryan.  Irsay spent the off-season and pre-season saying Ryan looked so good he wanted him as the QB for 3-4 more years.   6-7 games in Irsay says “Check please!   I’m done!”

 

Everything seemed to go wrong in ways that were just astounding.  

 

I think we agree that the coaching staff isn't great. I don't think it's that hard to replace Mark Glowinski. I don't understand why things went so wrong with Matt Pryor. But I think some of this really shows a problem with player development.

 

Still, and I'll include @stitches because I want to be clear... It's easy to pin everything on Reich in hindsight, convince myself that everything wrong was because of him, and then pretend that since he's gone everything is fine. It might sound like I'm trying to do that, and I'm definitely not. There are other issues at play, for sure. 

[stitches]

11 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I think we agree that the coaching staff isn't great. I don't think it's that hard to replace Mark Glowinski. I don't understand why things went so wrong with Matt Pryor. But I think some of this really shows a problem with player development.

 

Still, and I'll include @stitches because I want to be clear... It's easy to pin everything on Reich in hindsight, convince myself that everything wrong was because of him, and then pretend that since he's gone everything is fine. It might sound like I'm trying to do that, and I'm definitely not. There are other issues at play, for sure. 

Oh, there is plenty of blame to go around. It definitely is not just on Ballard or just on Reich. Ballard, Reich, Strausser... some of the players themselves... Irsay. You don't become one of the worst teams in the league from being "the team noone wants to see in the playoffs", because of a simple fault of 1 person. There are multiple points of failure in this program. 

[DougDew]

23 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

They needed to all sit down and say the best way to have long term success is to draft a QB. Then they should of sat  down as a group and figured out how to do that. That should of been done as soon as Luck retired. 

Its still won't work if Irsay discusses QBs with them at any time near the actual decision making.  They will still not want to go opposite of what he thinks.

 

In about a month after a HC and possibly a GM is hired, Irsay should give his broad thoughts of what attributes he wants in a QB, including things like leadership and marketability, then go on a vacation to the African interior where he has no social media connection until May

[Superman]

34 minutes ago, DougDew said:

People always defer to the highest authority in the room.  It never works any other way despite intentions.

 

I don't agree, particularly with the bolded. For example, if this were true, we probably never would have traded for Wentz in the first place.

[joeb]

5 hours ago, Superman said:

 

Did you read the article?

 

 

Admittedly, this is something I've been wondering aloud for a couple months now. Maybe the reason Reich is gone and Ballard is not is because Irsay holds Reich more responsible for the QB strategy than he does Ballard. This reporting supports that idea. 

 

And you can call it finger pointing or scapegoating or whatever. Irsay has always supported his guys, and now he's fired Reich in midseason, which is unprecedented. We know that supporting his guys doesn't mean he's always agreed with everything they've done. Irsay said recently he sees value in letting his people chart their own course, even if he sees them making what he believes to be a mistake. I don't necessarily think Irsay would stand idly by while Ballard and Reich trade a first and a third for a QB if Irsay feels they're making the wrong choice. However, I could easily see them all having a discussion in which Irsay says he thinks they should draft guy, Reich says 'Wentz should be our guy,' and Irsay trusts him and gets on board. 

I think your right, maybe. I think Reich wanted both Qb's and they both failed. This is why Irsay lost it and fired Reich and the Offensive coordinator. I really don't blame Jim as much as others do. If i were the owner and watched this disaster I would probably lose it too. Oh! he's medling. Yes and with good reason. If they had left Reich there the season would things have been better?  I don't think so.

[RollerColt]

5 minutes ago, joeb said:

I think your right, maybe. I think Reich wanted both Qb's and they both failed. This is why Irsay lost it and fired Reich and the Offensive coordinator. I really don't blame Jim as much as others do. If i were the owner and watched this disaster I would probably lose it too. Oh! he's medling. Yes and with good reason. If they had left Reich there the season would things have been better?  I don't think so.

The way I see it, with Reich we possibly could have won another 2-4 games, putting us right in the middle yet again for the draft and most likely stuck on the QB carousel for at least another season. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

16 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Its still won't work if Irsay discusses QBs with them at any time near the actual decision making.  They will still not want to go opposite of what he thinks.

 

In about a month after a HC and possibly a GM is hired, Irsay should give his broad thoughts of what attributes he wants in a QB, including things like leadership and marketability, then go on a vacation to the African interior where he has no social media connection until May

Well it seems Irsay is the one that wanted to draft a QB. Tell  Reich and Ballard that’s what we are doing and have them work towards doing that. Irsay could of been the voice and put his foot down  if he wanted to draft.  Irsay to a fault is maybe to trusting and he trusted Reich. I do agree with some that is why Reich was fired. 

[Shive]

3 hours ago, stitches said:

It scares me that the guy everybody is blaming for the disarray and chaos with this team seems to have the most clear picture and best philosophy for this team. It scares me that it's Irsay that wanted us to "grow our own" QB after Luck retired and it wasn't the guy who actually should be the one making those decisions with the input of the other guy... Those are the guys that actually wanted a retread after retread at QB. 

 

It scares me that the looney owner was the one with the clear mind who had the clearest picture that this team has serious issues with coaching and that Reich was losing it and changes needed to be made at HC... and it wasn't the GM whose job it is to see this. 

 

It scares me that it was the merchant of chaos who saw that Matt Ryan is done and we actually need to see what we have in Sam Ehlinger. It wasn't the coach. The coach wanted Ryan... and then FOLES before he even gave a thought to Ehlinger. This is freaking insane to me. 

 

Why the hell are those people in those positions? If the GM cannot have a good strategy for the QB position, cannot see that his HC has lost it... if the HC cannot see that Matt Ryan and freaking Nick Foles are done, then what chance do we even have?

One thing that I think has made all of this very murky is the structure and dynamic that we had up top. A lot of teams have an owner who is completely removed from the day to day operations, so the HC reports directly to the GM, who reports to the owner. From what we've heard over the years, Ballard, Reich and Irsay would meet and collaborate on most major decisions, so the hierarchy wasn't as linear as most teams. A decision about Reich wasn't necessarily Ballard's to make if that dynamic stands true and some of the decisions we would typically attribute to a GM making also may not have been his to make.

 

I think Ballard is absolutely at fault for botching the LT situation. I do have to wonder how much Reich and his staff had input in that decision, but from Fisher over Leno to forgoing a FA option in favor of Pryor, I can't help but place most of that blame on Ballard.

 

The QB decisions really have seemed like there was a heavy Reich influence and Ballard trusting his HC a bit too much (which generally is a good thing, but we now know in this case it wasn't a good idea), then going with Ryan as a best worst case scenario.

 

3 hours ago, philba101 said:

I agree. Harbaugh doubled-down today on his statement from December saying he will enthusiastically be coaching Michigan in 2023 so we will see. My worry is if Harbaugh stays and Payton goes elsewhere, a volatile Irsay will hire Saturday. I like Saturday as a player and as a person, but I don't think he deserves this job.

With the NCAA announcing potential violations against Harbaugh, he may end up pulling a Pete Carroll and jumping back to the NFL to avoid the actually consequences of those violations if there is indeed punitive actions taken.

 

2 hours ago, OLD FAN MAN said:

harbaugh cant fix this team unless he is given full control to pick players, he cant fix it with ballards bargain bin talent

I'm curious why so many people think that Harbaugh is some sort of FO genius that will bring in top tier talent. In his time with SF, Trent Balke was the GM and their drafts were borderline terrible. Harbaugh inherited a VERY talented team that just didn't have a good HC before he got there. I don't want Harbaugh having full control to pick players, because if his stint in SF tells us anything, its that they didn't draft well and brought in a handful of good FAs, but nobody too top tier.

 

Harbaugh isn't the savor of this team as HC & GM. He may be a good HC, but I think you let a true GM handle player aquisition.

 

1 hour ago, stitches said:

Well, yeah... I just think his philosophy is outdated and antiquated. I think he's building a team to win the 1983 Super Bowl. And not really doing great even with that. 

I don't disagree with that. I don't think this team is that far away talent-wise though. I think our offensive scheme and personnel usage decisions have squandered what offensive talent we have to this point and led to a drastically underperforming unit that an even mediocre OC should be able to get a lot of production out of.

 

I don't expect Ballard to completely shift his philosophy, but do I hope to see him adjust some to the modern NFL roster construction.

[CoachLite]

6 hours ago, chad72 said:

@DougDew @Nickster and so many of us were calling it. There is your proof. Where there is smoke, there is fire.

 

Irsay should let Ballard completely take the reigns or any new HC/GM combo completely take the reigns and stay out of the way for the Colts to get back in contention, IMO. No more knee jerk meddling. 

The front office and coaching staff should listen to Irsay the same way as they listen to the fans. Every once in a while a good idea comes through, but not often. A major role of the GM is insulating the rest of the front office and coaching staff from owners and fans.

[CoachLite]

6 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

It’s a very long article….   Superman has just pulled out a few excerpts….  And I think your imagination has filled in the rest.  
 

You write:  “Reich too soft and may have corrupted the entire locker room”.  
 

The article says Reich was loved by the players and they were not happy to see him fired.   Remember, Frank being a players coach has mostly been viewed as a good thing.   Now you’re viewing it as a bad thing.   All based in a small sampling of a very large story. 

Sorry, no. Some of the best bosses and team members I've worked with could be called 'difficult people'. The objective is building a winning football team, not a group of friends for dinner parties.

 

[bluebombers87]

33 minutes ago, joeb said:

I think your right, maybe. I think Reich wanted both Qb's and they both failed. This is why Irsay lost it and fired Reich and the Offensive coordinator. I really don't blame Jim as much as others do. If i were the owner and watched this disaster I would probably lose it too. Oh! he's medling. Yes and with good reason. If they had left Reich there the season would things have been better?  I don't think so.

No they got worse.

[cdgacoltsfan]

1 hour ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Seems to me we had too many people having a say in QB decisions. Reich wanted wentz. Ballard and Irsay wanted to draft fields. Then Reich wanted hurts and Ballard did not like him. Can someone please be the sole voice and make a decision. In a way Ballard is the GM and should of been that voice. I also understand wanting to give your coach what they ask for. It’s just all a mess.

It starts at the top. Dysfunction because of Irsay.

[bluebombers87]

I for one remember when Irsay was handling GM duties. We’re better off letting him sign checks and staying quiet during the season.

[CoachLite]

35 minutes ago, joeb said:

I think your right, maybe. I think Reich wanted both Qb's and they both failed. This is why Irsay lost it and fired Reich and the Offensive coordinator. I really don't blame Jim as much as others do. If i were the owner and watched this disaster I would probably lose it too. Oh! he's medling. Yes and with good reason. If they had left Reich there the season would things have been better?  I don't think so.

It wasn't Jim Irsay's job to fire anyone (except Ballard). Firing the HC and OC was on Ballard. Ballard has some very good points, but he needed to take control, and didn't.

[shasta519]

1 hour ago, DougDew said:

Yeah, agree.  The article suggests that the Wentz trade kept the Colts from using a first round draft pick...that year....on a long term "grow your own" QB.   That Wentz was thought of as a long term answer himself.  

 

 It was only a 2022 1st rounder they gave up ..not the end of the world if you are looking for a 10 year QB and you have an out in Wentz' contract after year 2.  If Wentz doesn't work out, draft your QB the next year then.

 

Did they really like Fields or Jones that much?  Remember, the thought was that SF traded up to three to get Jones.    At the time the Colts traded away their first rounder, those Qbs were projected to go pretty high.  They traded Wentz when they thought those QBs could be gone by pick 8, for example.

 

Now it sounds like hindsight.  We wish we didn't trade away our 1st because it turns out we had a much better chance of getting a QB than we thought we would have at the time.    A big part of this issue seems to be that somebody misread the draft board. 

On 1/14, Ballard said he doubted a QB would be there when he picked. Talked about them being pushed up.
 

Of course Ballard wouldn’t give away that he was targeting QB, but either at the time, or within a couple days, he is negotiating with Roseman for Wentz (per Ballard’s own timeline). Eventually they trade for Wentz in mid Feb. 

 

TBF to Ballard, that hindsight argument about Fields ultimately being there has been used quite often. 
 

I just can’t imagine a scenario where that wasn’t a consensus call on Wentz.

[DougDew]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

I don't agree, particularly with the bolded. For example, if this were true, we probably never would have traded for Wentz in the first place.

I would say that it depends on how authoritative he has been recently.  Before Wentz, it may have been more sunshine and roses and the intimidation vibes weren't there.  Now that he seems to be public about his dissatisfaction (since the reported blow up after that JAX game) the intimidation and deference level is higher.

 

Maybe he is in charge and wants people to know it.  He addresses the media like he is.  If he doesn't want to be, I think less visibility would be helpful.  

[Superman]

1 hour ago, Shive said:

I'm curious why so many people think that Harbaugh is some sort of FO genius that will bring in top tier talent. In his time with SF, Trent Balke was the GM and their drafts were borderline terrible. Harbaugh inherited a VERY talented team that just didn't have a good HC before he got there. I don't want Harbaugh having full control to pick players, because if his stint in SF tells us anything, its that they didn't draft well and brought in a handful of good FAs, but nobody too top tier.

 

Harbaugh isn't the savor of this team as HC & GM. He may be a good HC, but I think you let a true GM handle player aquisition.

 

I really don't get the Harbaugh thing, especially not the eagerness to give him roster control. 

[Solid84]

I don’t think any of this is new? We’ve already learned this though multiple different tweets and minor articles. Not in so many words of course, but it’s not really new to me. 
 

The thing that makes the Reich firing knee jerk is Irsay himself has said Reich wouldn’t have been fired (at that point) if Saturday hadn’t accepted the job. Which Irsay offered over the phone during the Patriots game….

   I’m confident Reich would’ve been fired at the end of the season if Saturday hadn’t accepted. I agree Irsay was very frustrated with him and had been since the end of last year. 
 

Besides impulsively offering Saturday the job over the phone, there’s the lack of consideration of us not having a playcaller with both Brady and Reich gone.

Also, I think, it’s very telling about Ballard’s future that we haven’t heard squat from him all season and that Irsay has gone over his head on major decisions all season. Purely my opinion of course. 

[DynaMike]

4 hours ago, Superman said:

 

The reporter quotes Reich directly. Assuming no one calls this quote a lie, I'm fine with accepting it.

Thanks for the info!

[AKB]

@Superman nice thread

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, DougDew said:

I would say that it depends on how authoritative he has been recently.  Before Wentz, it may have been more sunshine and roses and the intimidation vibes weren't there.  Now that he seems to be public about his dissatisfaction (since the reported blow up after that JAX game) the intimidation and deference level is higher.

 

Maybe he is in charge and wants people to know it.  He addresses the media like he is.  If he doesn't want to be, I think less visibility would be helpful.  

Less visibility?   This year, Ballard has practically put himself in the witness protection program.  
 

In 17 thru 20, Ballard face quarterly seasonal updates.  Last year there were just two.   This year, will be just one— the year ender.    The only other time he’s been in front of cameras and microphones was the Saturday introduction.   CB used the occasion to blame the media for him doing a poor job. 
 

Ballard couldn't have much less visibility.