Possible mutual interest between colts and Josh Mcdaniels

[chad72]

10 minutes ago, #12. said:

So which is preferable - McDaniels with head coaching experience and little success or Nagy and Toub with no experience?

 

 

 

 

To be honest, McDaniels started 8-0 or something like that as Broncos HC with Orton as QB. His issues came with control of personnel, that he abruptly got rid of Cutler, Marshall etc., drafting Tebow too.

 

So while focusing on his maturity issues, people are overlooking some levels of success he has with the Broncos results. I was surprised that Bowlen gave McDaniels GM level control considering Mike Shanahan’s downfall Prior to that was giving him GM Powers.

[Coltsman1788]

1 minute ago, chad72 said:

 

Caldwell would be a decent candidate if he weren’t fired here. Plus, Arians, I don’t think may want to coach again. However if his style of offense is part of the package, I’d stay away.

Not saying I want either Caldwell or Arians but making a point.  We don’t want Caldwell because he failed here before but Josh is ok because he failed in Denver? 

[#12.]

3 minutes ago, Coltsman1788 said:

If we go with McDaniels...what makes him any better than Arians or Caldwell? Both have head coaching experience and more head coaching success than McDaniels comparatively speaking. They just haven’t coached under a Belichick or had Tom Brady under center. 

As far as I know, we're not interviewing either of them, but are interviewing Nagy and Toub.  That's why I asked the question.

[chad72]

1 minute ago, Coltsman1788 said:

Not saying I want either Caldwell or Arians but making a point.  We don’t want Caldwell because he failed here before but Josh is ok because he failed in Denver? 

 

I never said we don’t want him, you assumed that. I said because he was fired here, Irsay and Caldwell may not want to do an interview for personal pride reasons.

 

 

[#12.]

6 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

To be honest, McDaniels started 8-0 or something like that as Broncos HC. His issues came with control of personnel.

I think it was 6-0(too lazy to check).

 

Of course the flip side to that is how McDaniels finished in his final 22 in Denver.

[Coltsfanforlife12]

2 minutes ago, Coltsman1788 said:

Not saying I want either Caldwell or Arians but making a point.  We don’t want Caldwell because he failed here before but Josh is ok because he failed in Denver? 

He didn’t have a ton of talent in Denver and was very immature according to reports.  Some of the best coaches in the NFL have failed their first job and went on to win multiple Super Bowls.

[Coltsman1788]

Just now, #12. said:

As far as I know, we're not interviewing either of them, but are interviewing Nagy and Toub.  That's why I asked the question 

Well if it were me and my choices were limited to those three then I would rather give Nagy or Toub a chance than someone who I don’t think is a good head coach. At least they are unknown quantities as opposed to someone who has proven to bomb away from New England.  I agree that it’s a risk either way.  

[Mr. Irrelevant]

The main issue with McDaniels is that we want his offense. Doesn’t this technically mean that we would rather have him as an OC than HC, if we could?

 

I fully understand that is not possible, but people needs to keep that in mind. Is he really great HC material, or is that the price we just have to pay to get him?

[Restored]

5 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

To be honest, McDaniels started 8-0 or something like that as Broncos HC with Orton as QB. His issues came with control of personnel, that he abruptly got rid of Cutler, Marshall etc., drafting Tebow too.

 

So while focusing on his maturity issues, people are overlooking some levels of success he has with the Broncos results.

 

Agreed. I’ll link this article again so people can read and gain some insight on how McDaniels has changed.

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2666428-the-redemption-of-josh-mcdaniels-failure-taught-pats-oc-how-to-pick-his-spots

[Coltsman1788]

2 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

I never said we don’t want him, you assumed that. I said because he was fired here, Irsay and Caldwell may not want to do an interview for personal pride reasons.

 

 

Ok gotcha.

 

 But I’m pretty sure a lot of Colts fans would feel differently about giving Caldwell or even Arians another chance here than they do about giving Josh another chance. Both coaches have failed before but Caldwell/Arians have superior resumes compared to Josh. 

[BlueShoe]

10 hours ago, Coltsfanforlife12 said:

This will get some backlash but, what about Fisher as our DC?  He’s always run a good defense and his downfall was having a strongOC. 

 

That's not even logical. Why would Jeff take a lesser role than a HC? He hasn't been a coordinator since 1994.

[chad72]

Just now, Mr. Irrelevant said:

The main issue with McDaniels is that we want his offense. Doesn’t this technically mean that we would rather have him as an OC than HC, if we could?

 

I fully understand that is not possible, but people needs to keep that in mind. Is he really great HC material, or is that the price we just have to pay to get him?

 

Same thing with Matt Nagy. Sean McVay’s success is prompting these kind of looks.

[chad72]

7 minutes ago, #12. said:

I think it was 6-0(too lazy to check).

 

Of course the flip side to that is how McDaniels finished in his final 22.

 

Yeah, Orton had a limited ceiling and that’s why he went after Tebow. He got Demaryius Thomas too who needed a Peyton to flourish. Again, take the GM powers out of the equation, you might see a different HC.

 

Its like a monkey on his back, his immaturity in Denver hurting him in PR circles. I’ve heard everyone from fans to even scouts that haven’t ever dealt with him giving scathing assessments. We all love to judge, I’ll give you that.

[aaron11]

2 hours ago, Mr. Irrelevant said:

The main issue with McDaniels is that we want his offense. Doesn’t this technically mean that we would rather have him as an OC than HC, if we could?

 

I fully understand that is not possible, but people needs to keep that in mind. Is he really great HC material, or is that the price we just have to pay to get him?

you could say something similar about any candidate 

 

they are either going to be unproven or have some type of baggage 

[Mr. Irrelevant]

3 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

Same thing with Matt Nagy. Sean McVay’s success is prompting these kind of looks.

 

Just now, aaron11 said:

you say something similar about any canidate

 

they are either going to be unproven or have some type of baggage 

 

Fair enough. I think Ballard will be great to keep in check, so Iøm not ruling out a success at all.

 

We desperately needs a new approach to running the offense to keep Luck alive, so Iøm ready to gamble.

[BOTT]

10 minutes ago, Coltsman1788 said:

Not saying I want either Caldwell or Arians but making a point.  We don’t want Caldwell because he failed here before but Josh is ok because he failed in Denver? 

 

Mcdaniels was 31 and had Kyle Orton and Tim Turdbow as his quarterbacks.  Caldwell was in his 50s and had Peyton Manning in Indy and a very talent albeit underachieving Mathew Stanford in Detroit.

[Coltsman1788]

I will just say this. I believe Ballard should pick his man. Thus far, I think he is a really competent GM.  I’m glad he is finally getting the chance to fill our coaching position. Now if he hires McDaniels I will stand behind him because I respect his judgment. I would hope for the best and that we get this Bradyesque offense that you guys think he will deliver.  However,  as a fan I would still have concerns and watch very closely and if the hire went sour it would be a the first serious mark against Ballard going forward in my eyes. 

[Mr.Debonair]

24 minutes ago, Coltsman1788 said:

Since we are giving second chances...both Bruce Arians and Jim Caldwell have better head coaching track records than this unproven McDaniels guy.  Lol. 

Caldwell has proved twice that he’s unfit to be a head coach

[Restored]

3 minutes ago, Mr.Debonair said:

Caldwell has proved twice that he’s unfit to be a head coach

 

And Arians is retiring

so the point is moot.

[Coltsman1788]

13 minutes ago, BOTT said:

 

Mcdaniels was 31 and had Kyle Orton and Tim Turdbow as his quarterbacks.  Caldwell was in his 50s and had Peyton Manning in Indy and a very talent albeit underachieving Mathew Stanford in Detroit.

True.

 

In Caldwell’s defense though when he had a healthy Peyton he did coach the team to an AFC Championship and Super Bowl appearance.  The year he really sucked was the season when Peyton missed the entire season. He didn’t survive that unlike Pagano who was allowed to go through several mediocre seasons with a damaged Luck.  Can’t believe I’m actually trying to defend Caldwell.  Lol. He really didn’t do a bad job in Detroit by their standards. Getting that team into the playoffs once every blue moon is pretty much all their fans expect.  

[Coltsfanforlife12]

35 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

 

That's not even logical. Why would Jeff take a lesser role than a HC? He hasn't been a coordinator since 1994.

If he wants to get back into coaching it might be his only way.  No one is going to give him a HC job... 

[BlueShoe]

1 minute ago, Coltsfanforlife12 said:

If he wants to get back into coaching it might be his only way.  No one is going to give him a HC job... 

 

That is nonsense!

 

If Jeff Fisher takes a coordinator position then I will drive to your house and hand you 100 bucks! 

[Coltsman1788]

Maybe make Josh a glorified offensive coordinator with the added title of Assistant to the Head Coach.  That would be a step up from his current New England position. We could up his salary to boot.  I could get behind that. 

[Mr. Irrelevant]

28 minutes ago, Coltsman1788 said:

Maybe make Josh a glorified offensive coordinator with the added title of Assistant to the Head Coach.  That would be a step up from his current New England position. We could up his salary to boot.  I could get behind that. 

 

 

... but who should be the HC then?

[Coltsfanforlife12]

33 minutes ago, Coltsman1788 said:

Maybe make Josh a glorified offensive coordinator with the added title of Assistant to the Head Coach.  That would be a step up from his current New England position. We could up his salary to boot.  I could get behind that. 

He’s not leaving New England for anything less than a HC job. 

[Coltsman1788]

1 minute ago, Mr. Irrelevant said:

 

 

... but who should be the HC then?

Not sure I have a clear cut preference as yet. I still have to study up on the current names and wait to see if any others emerge.

 

After reading a good article that Chad72 posted on Josh McDaniels and some of the lessons he learned from his previous failure I don’t dislike him as much as I initially did. He still isn’t my first choice as head coach though. But if he is the hire then I will support and hope it pans out. 

[Coltsfanforlife12]

35 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

 

That is nonsense!

 

If Jeff Fisher takes a coordinator position then I will drive to your house and hand you 100 bucks! 

How is it nonsense that no one will give him a HC job?  He’s failed everywhere he’s been.  The only time he succeed was when he had a strong OC.  Which he’s proven since he can’t find.  

[Coltsman1788]

1 minute ago, Coltsfanforlife12 said:

He’s not leaving New England for anything less than a HC job. 

You’re probably right. 

[Shive]

9 minutes ago, Coltsman1788 said:

You’re probably right. 

He's getting the pick of the litter for a HC job. There's no way he'd entertain being an OC/Asst. HC anywhere outside of NE.

[BlueShoe]

13 minutes ago, Coltsfanforlife12 said:

How is it nonsense that no one will give him a HC job?  He’s failed everywhere he’s been.  The only time he succeed was when he had a strong OC.  Which he’s proven since he can’t find.  

 

It is nonsense that you believe Jeff Fisher would be willing to accept a coordinator role after being a head coach since 1994. You have some seriously flawed logic.

[Coltsfanforlife12]

59 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

 

It is nonsense that you believe Jeff Fisher would be willing to accept a coordinator role after being a head coach since 1994. You have some seriously flawed logic.

Ok whatever you say.  It really depends on how bad he wants to get back into coaching.  No one is going to give him a HC though.  I personally don’t think my logic is flawed.  He’s failed as a head coach if he wants to coach then he’s got to be a coordinator or start there again.  Fairly logical to me.  

[Superman]

2 hours ago, Coltsman1788 said:

Not saying I want either Caldwell or Arians but making a point.  We don’t want Caldwell because he failed here before but Josh is ok because he failed in Denver? 

 

Each candidate has his own strengths and weaknesses. I don't think Caldwell has any particular strengths as a head coach, beyond being a nice guy. I don't think he's a good tactician, game planner, or play caller, despite being an offensive coach. I don't think he's a good game manager, despite having been a head coach for a total of 7 years now (the Lions had just 9 players on the field on a critical third down this year). 

 

I do think McDaniels is a good game planner and play caller. The way he runs his offense makes me think he's a good tactician. Small sample size from many years ago, but I think he did a good job as a game manager in Denver, and he's been with Belichick for a total of 14 years so I think it's reasonable to assume he knows how to manage a game. 

 

Despite them both having failed at previous stops, Caldwell and McDaniels are very different candidates, with different strengths (and weaknesses, to be sure). It's obviously not as simple as you're suggesting.

[Steamboat_Shaun]

13 hours ago, Nesjan3 said:

I dont know.. he has been "groomed" by the best, but last time he ventured off on his own without BB and Brady he failed miserable. One has to think he may be just another product of the Patriots system..

 

 

He wasn't great in Denver, but I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt considering his QBs were Kyle Orton and Jay Cutler.

[BlueShoe]

14 minutes ago, Coltsfanforlife12 said:

Ok whatever you say.  It really depends on how bad he wants to get back into coaching.  No one is going to give him a HC though.  I personally don’t think my logic is flawed.  He’s failed as a head coach if he wants to coach then he’s got to be a coordinator or start there again.  Fairly logical to me.  

 

 

Imagine you have a lot of money. So much that you're set for life, and then some. You have been the boss for over 20 years. Are you going to take a job not being the boss anymore?

 

Like I said, your logic is completely flawed. 

[Colts_Fan12]

4 hours ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

Schefter just said the Giants are the only team who have put in a request to interview McDaniels (as well as Patricia but the Lions have also reached out to him) so far. Said there could/will be more.

In fact, I've seen a lot of teams other than the Colts putting in requests for interviews. The only thing I've seen for us from guys like Rapaport are things like the Colts are "expected" to interview so and so.

 

Hopefully Colts rumors are just not leaking but you'd think interview requests would be pretty public knowlege, at least to guys like Schefty and RapSheet.

No he said we are going to interview him as well 

[LockeDown]

There's very little doubt about JMcD as an OC, but is he a leader of men?  He's so boyish looking, it's hard to see him physically commanding the attention of everyone.  That's the kind of stuff I would be interested in. Does he command respect?  He may be gifted in that area as well, but I've not read anything about that. 

[Superman]

3 minutes ago, LockeDown said:

There's very little doubt about JMcD as an OC, but is he a leader of men?  He's so boyish looking, it's hard to see him physically commanding the attention of everyone.  That's the kind of stuff I would be interested in. Does he command respect?  He may be gifted in that area as well, but I've not read anything about that. 

 

How much of a consideration was that for the Rams last year? 

 

I don't think the way a candidate looks should be a high priority.

[Colts_Fan12]

7 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

How much of a consideration was that for the Rams last year? 

 

I don't think the way a candidate looks should be a high priority.

Who is your #1 candidate? 

[Restored]

Imagine for a moment a Colts offense with Luck, Hilton, Landry and Barkley with McDaniels running the system.

[Superman]

1 minute ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

Who is your #1 candidate? 

 

McDaniels.

 

I'm coming around on Toub, if he's the last man standing. I'm okay with Shurmur or Reich, more hesitant on DeFillippo and Nagy. Wilks is an interesting candidate, but it's hard for me to get behind a defensive guy when I don't know what kind of offense he wants. If we bring in another Coryell coordinator, I'm going to scream.