O-line prospects

Track Guy · January 7, 2015

While we have needs on defense that we could consider taking in round 1 of the draft after this season, O-line is probably the only offensive position that the Colts could pick that wouldn't shock this forum right? Seeing as the experts (well, Todd McShay anyways http://espn.go.com/blog/san-diego-chargers/post/_/id/9329/mcshay-o-line-sweet-spot-is-back-half-of-first-round) believe the back half of the 1st round is the sweet spot for O-linemen and that we could certainly use an upgrade in this position let's talk some O-line prospects. If we were to use our first rounder on an O-lineman, who would you say "yay" or "nay" to and why?

I count 7 first round pick candidates:

Brandon Scherff, Iowa

La'El Collins, LSU

T.J. Clemming, Pittsburgh

Cedric Ogbuehi, Texas A&M

Ronnie Stanley, Notre Dame

Andrus Peat, Stanford

Ereck Flowers, Miami

IMO any of them really could be gone or still on the board when we pick. The reason why the back half of the draft is the "sweet spot" is because there's no guy who seems like a lock to be a franchise LT in the group. A lot of capable and talented guys, but none who have no questions about them.

These are the guys I think will most likely be gone by our pick and how I feel about them as of 1/8:

Ronnie Stanley - I like him as a player a lot, especially the way he played one of the most (if not the most) dominant players in college football in Leonard Williams. He's young and has only played LT for 1 season but ultimately as well as he's played combined with the fact that he's 6' 5 1/2" and 318 lbs so he has the size to stay at LT, I think he's gone by our pick. Honestly I think he has a chance at top 5 if he tests well, and even if he doesn't he's likely gone by our pick.

Andrus Peat - Peat has decided to declare for the draft, and he should be a first round pick. He's long enough and probably athletic enough to stay at LT in the pros. His aggression on the field has been brought into question, but he's still pretty likely to be a top 15 pick.

Brandon Scherff - I think he's almost certainly going to be a good player in the pros, but the biggest knock on him is that he's probably going to have to play guard or possibly right tackle, but not left tackle. His ceiling is probably one of the last couple picks in the top 10, but more likely I see him picked in the teens.

Now the guys I think we have a fair shot at (a few probably be gone by our pick, a few will probably not) and how I feel about them as of 1/8:

Ereck Flowers - He's kind of grown on me. I actually would feel pretty good about it if he ended up a Colt. He's a few injury hiccups here and there but he's pretty athletic for his size and had a really nice season. I could see him being our RT of the future. He may or may not even be the sort of blocker who teams view as having franchise LT potential, so he could be on the board for us or long gone.

La'El Collins - I went back and forth on just how good La'El is a few times. I guess ultimately, even though he's I think he's a guy who has to learn to play with more balance, his skill set wins me over in the end. I think he could be a plug and play at guard, but I also think he's got the athleticism to play tackle at the NFL level with a little more refinement. As a tackle I see starting him on the right side rather than the left, although a nice bonus with him is that (if he develops into the kind of player that I hope he can) you could probably live with him playing LT in a pinch.

T.J. Clemmings - He's a defensive convert who is only in his second year as an O-lineman. He's raw, stands about 6' 5" and is athletic. Even though he's not that polished or experienced, Clemmings had a really good season playing RT for Pitt. He was good in pass protection and probably even better as a run blocker. Teams will have to be really careful in evaluating him. He could easily turn out to be the best O-lineman of this class... But he could also struggle to ever see the field. If the Colts took him, I'd be cautiously optimistic about the former possibility and pleased with the pick.

Cedric Ogbuehi - He was projected before the season to be one of the top draft picks this year, but has played himself out of that conversation. He's clearly got nice athleticism and has done some pretty good things at the college level on the right side, but the fact that he got abused at LT in a few games would scare me off him. Still, his success on the right side and pure athleticism keep him in the conversation for first round pick. I wouldn't want the Colts to burn one on him, though.

Yoshinator · January 7, 2015

The option for me is La'el Collins. If he falls to us, he should be the pick, no questions asked unless someone really good takes a big fall in the 1st. Flowers would be someone I'd love to get in the 2nd, but I don't see him falling that far and it would bite us in the backside if we tried to get cute in that respect. Ogbuehi I have 0 interest in, I think he will be a major bust and just hasn't completely fallen off the cliff yet. I think he declared while he could get decent money still and hasn't been fully exposed. T.J. Clemmings is solid, he's my 2nd favorite pick that we could get. Think he would be a great RT, not sure if he could play G though.

Gavin · January 7, 2015

Clemmings and its not close for me.....love his athleticism. Collins like Track mentioned above has some athleticism but I sure don't see him as a LT......Struggles with balance way to much, LG or RT probably is where he will fit best and I would not touch him in the first, Entirely to much bust factor do to his inability to play balanced for any lengthy amount of time, I could see him as a backup by the end of his first contract wherever he goes

southwest1 · January 7, 2015

While we have needs on defense that we could consider taking in round 1 of the draft after this season, O-line is probably the only offensive position that the Colts could pick that wouldn't shock this forum right? Seeing as the experts (well, Todd McShay anyways http://espn.go.com/blog/san-diego-chargers/post/_/id/9329/mcshay-o-line-sweet-spot-is-back-half-of-first-round) believe the back half of the 1st round is the sweet spot for O-linemen and that we could certainly use an upgrade in this position let's talk some O-line prospects. If we were to use our first rounder on an O-lineman, who would you say "yay" or "nay" to and why?

I count 7 first round pick candidates:

Brandon Scherff, Iowa
La'El Collins, LSU
T.J. Clemming, Pittsburgh
Cedric Ogbuehi, Texas A&M
Ronnie Stanley, Notre Dame
Andrus Peat, Stanford
Ereck Flowers, Miami

IMO any of them really could be gone or still on the board when we pick. The reason why the back half of the draft is the "sweet spot" is because there's no guy who seems like a lock to be a franchise LT in the group. A lot of capable and talented guys, but none who have no questions about them.

These are the guys I think will most likely be gone by our pick and how I feel about them as of 1/8:

Ronnie Stanley - I like him as a player a lot, especially the way he played one of the most (if not the most) dominant players in college football in Leonard Williams. He's young and has only played LT for 1 season but ultimately as well as he's played combined with the fact that he's 6' 5 1/2" and 318 lbs so he has the size to stay at LT, I think he's gone by our pick. Honestly I think he has a chance at top 5 if he tests well, and even if he doesn't he's likely gone by our pick.

Andrus Peat - Peat has decided to declare for the draft, and he should be a first round pick. He's long enough and probably athletic enough to stay at LT in the pros. His aggression on the field has been brought into question, but he's still pretty likely to be a top 15 pick.

Brandon Scherff - I think he's almost certainly going to be a good player in the pros, but the biggest knock on him is that he's probably going to have to play guard or possibly right tackle, but not left tackle. His ceiling is probably one of the last couple picks in the top 10, but more likely I see him picked in the teens.

Now the guys I think we have a fair shot at (a few probably be gone by our pick, a few will probably not) and how I feel about them as of 1/8:

Ereck Flowers - He's kind of grown on me. I actually would feel pretty good about it if he ended up a Colt. He's a few injury hiccups here and there but he's pretty athletic for his size and had a really nice season. I could see him being our RT of the future. He may or may not even be the sort of blocker who teams view as having franchise LT potential, so he could be on the board for us or long gone.

La'El Collins - I went back and forth on just how good La'El is a few times. I guess ultimately, even though he's I think he's a guy who has to learn to play with more balance, his skill set wins me over in the end. I think he could be a plug and play at guard, but I also think he's got the athleticism to play tackle at the NFL level with a little more refinement. As a tackle I see starting him on the right side rather than the left, although a nice bonus with him is that (if he develops into the kind of player that I hope he can) you could probably live with him playing LT in a pinch.

T.J. Clemmings - He's a defensive convert who is only in his second year as an O-lineman. He's raw, stands about 6' 5" and is athletic. Even though he's not that polished or experienced, Clemmings had a really good season playing RT for Pitt. He was good in pass protection and probably even better as a run blocker. Teams will have to be really careful in evaluating him. He could easily turn out to be the best O-lineman of this class... But he could also struggle to ever see the field. If the Colts took him, I'd be cautiously optimistic about the former possibility and pleased with the pick.

Cedric Ogbuehi - He was projected before the season to be one of the top draft picks this year, but has played himself out of that conversation. He's clearly got nice athleticism and has done some pretty good things at the college level on the right side, but the fact that he got abused at LT in a few games would scare me off him. Still, his success on the right side and pure athleticism keep him in the conversation for first round pick. I wouldn't want the Colts to burn one on him, though.

I appreciate the time you took to write this response Track Guy. It is well laid out I like how you broke down each potential prospect on the line. I'm far from a scout & can only assess players we draft in game action, but your attention to detail here is to be commended.

I like what you said about Clemmings with good skills in both run & pass protection. But, my skills at evaluating college prospects is far from a masterpiece. I leave that handy work to guys like Gavin, Dustin, & BrentMc11.

Despite how well INDY's protection looked for Luck last weekend vs the Bengals, I'd still like to see our GM go after a lineman or 2. I say that because the Cowboys & Patriots kicked our cabooses this year & until we generate holes up front our running backs are still going to struggle.

Track Guy · January 7, 2015

I appreciate the time you took to write this response Track Guy. It is well laid out I like how you broke down each potential prospect on the line. I'm far from a scout & can only assess players we draft in game action, but your attention to detail here is to be commended.

I like what you said about Clemmings with good skills in both run & pass protection. But, my skills at evaluating college prospects is far from a masterpiece. I leave that handy work to guys like Gavin, Dustin, & BrentMc11.

Yes, I'm glad you liked it and thanks for reading. While I'd definitely say there are people who can evaluate O-line talent (or any position for that matter) better than I can it is my second favorite position to evaluate after QB so I try.

southwest1 · January 7, 2015

Yes, I'm glad you liked it and thanks for reading. While I'd definitely say there are people who can evaluate O-line talent (or any position for that matter) better than I can it is my second favorite position to evaluate after QB so I try.

I just respect guys like yourself who write such detailed entries because it means 2 things: You do not ignore our weaknesses pretending they do not exist & darn it you wanna win Championships plural. I like that. Major props man!

It's just cool to see a person like yourself who cares so much about QB protection upfront & winning. Thank you.

Please feel free to discuss & post about linemen as often as you see fit Track Guy. I might even learn something valuable. LOL! I'm mocking my own evaluation skills or lack thereof in this Dept. not yours BTW.

Track Guy · January 7, 2015

I didn't include this but maybe I should've... If I had to personally rank the 4 guys I listed as guys we have a fair shot at I go with

Clemmings... Highest ceiling IMO, go big or go home. He needs NFL coaching but at the end of the day he's the one guy on this list I think could warrant actively trading up a few spots for if our team people think he's a good teammate with a winners mentality.
Toss up between Collins and Flowers... Depending on how I feel on a particular day. I think they're both pretty good players who are fair value as a late 1st or early 2nd. Not a steal, but a decent pick in an area of need.
Ogbuehi... I don't really think he deserves to be off the board before late 2nd round - early 3rd at best. But some still like him.

NewColtsFan · January 7, 2015

While we have needs on defense that we could consider taking in round 1 of the draft after this season, O-line is probably the only offensive position that the Colts could pick that wouldn't shock this forum right? Seeing as the experts (well, Todd McShay anyways http://espn.go.com/blog/san-diego-chargers/post/_/id/9329/mcshay-o-line-sweet-spot-is-back-half-of-first-round) believe the back half of the 1st round is the sweet spot for O-linemen and that we could certainly use an upgrade in this position let's talk some O-line prospects. If we were to use our first rounder on an O-lineman, who would you say "yay" or "nay" to and why?

I count 7 first round pick candidates:

Brandon Scherff, Iowa
La'El Collins, LSU
T.J. Clemming, Pittsburgh
Cedric Ogbuehi, Texas A&M
Ronnie Stanley, Notre Dame
Andrus Peat, Stanford
Ereck Flowers, Miami

IMO any of them really could be gone or still on the board when we pick. The reason why the back half of the draft is the "sweet spot" is because there's no guy who seems like a lock to be a franchise LT in the group. A lot of capable and talented guys, but none who have no questions about them.

These are the guys I think will most likely be gone by our pick and how I feel about them as of 1/8:

Ronnie Stanley - I like him as a player a lot, especially the way he played one of the most (if not the most) dominant players in college football in Leonard Williams. He's young and has only played LT for 1 season but ultimately as well as he's played combined with the fact that he's 6' 5 1/2" and 318 lbs so he has the size to stay at LT, I think he's gone by our pick. Honestly I think he has a chance at top 5 if he tests well, and even if he doesn't he's likely gone by our pick.

Andrus Peat - Peat has decided to declare for the draft, and he should be a first round pick. He's long enough and probably athletic enough to stay at LT in the pros. His aggression on the field has been brought into question, but he's still pretty likely to be a top 15 pick.

Brandon Scherff - I think he's almost certainly going to be a good player in the pros, but the biggest knock on him is that he's probably going to have to play guard or possibly right tackle, but not left tackle. His ceiling is probably one of the last couple picks in the top 10, but more likely I see him picked in the teens.

Now the guys I think we have a fair shot at (a few probably be gone by our pick, a few will probably not) and how I feel about them as of 1/8:

Ereck Flowers - He's kind of grown on me. I actually would feel pretty good about it if he ended up a Colt. He's a few injury hiccups here and there but he's pretty athletic for his size and had a really nice season. I could see him being our RT of the future. He may or may not even be the sort of blocker who teams view as having franchise LT potential, so he could be on the board for us or long gone.

La'El Collins - I went back and forth on just how good La'El is a few times. I guess ultimately, even though he's I think he's a guy who has to learn to play with more balance, his skill set wins me over in the end. I think he could be a plug and play at guard, but I also think he's got the athleticism to play tackle at the NFL level with a little more refinement. As a tackle I see starting him on the right side rather than the left, although a nice bonus with him is that (if he develops into the kind of player that I hope he can) you could probably live with him playing LT in a pinch.

T.J. Clemmings - He's a defensive convert who is only in his second year as an O-lineman. He's raw, stands about 6' 5" and is athletic. Even though he's not that polished or experienced, Clemmings had a really good season playing RT for Pitt. He was good in pass protection and probably even better as a run blocker. Teams will have to be really careful in evaluating him. He could easily turn out to be the best O-lineman of this class... But he could also struggle to ever see the field. If the Colts took him, I'd be cautiously optimistic about the former possibility and pleased with the pick.

Cedric Ogbuehi - He was projected before the season to be one of the top draft picks this year, but has played himself out of that conversation. He's clearly got nice athleticism and has done some pretty good things at the college level on the right side, but the fact that he got abused at LT in a few games would scare me off him. Still, his success on the right side and pure athleticism keep him in the conversation for first round pick. I wouldn't want the Colts to burn one on him, though.

Tremendous post. Really appreciate you taking the time for the write-up.

Collins is my dream pick. His problems are all things that are correctable and he could start at RG for a year and then slide to RT to replace Cherilous when we don't let him finish his final two years of his contract.

I'd like to add a possible 8th name. Cameron Erving, the Center of Florida State. He started two years at LT and was good, but not great. But this past year, in the summer, they moved him to Center and he took to it like a duck to water. He's the top rated Center in the class.

McShay and his crew (both of which played OL in college) have him around 50th (middle of the 2nd round).... but Kiper has him 25th overall. So, he's got talent. And it may be first round talent. I'd like to see more. But he had a very good year in his first year at Center and he may have enough overall skill to play somewhere on the line at a high level...

Track Guy · January 7, 2015

Tremendous post.    Really appreciate you taking the time for the write-up.

Collins is my dream pick.   His problems are all things that are correctable and he could start at RG for a year and then slide to RT to replace Cherilous when we don't let him finish his final two years of his contract.

I'd like to add a possible 8th name.    Cameron Erving, the Center of Florida State.   He played a year or two at LT and was good, but not great.    But this past year, in the summer, they moved him to Center and he took to it like a duck to water.   He's the top rated Center in the class.

McShay and his crew (both of which played OL in college) have him around 50th (middle of the 2nd round).... but Kiper has him 25th overall.     So, he's got talent.    And it may be first round talent.    I'd like to see more.    But he had a very good year in his first year at Center and he may have enough overall skill to play somewhere on the line at a high level...

Yeah I think Erving's future in the NFL is probably at center, it really seems to be his best position. There are a few other good center prospects in this year's draft class - Hroniss Grasu, Reese Dismukes, and Andy Gallik come to mind but Erving has got more versatility than the others do do which raises his value and I think makes him the first drafted. I think he'll likely be a second round pick.

NewColtsFan · January 7, 2015

Clemmings and its not close for me.....love his athleticism. Collins like Track mentioned above has some athleticism but I sure don't see him as a LT......Struggles with balance way to much, LG or RT probably is where he will fit best and I would not touch him in the first, Entirely to much bust factor do to his inability to play balanced for any lengthy amount of time, I could see him as a backup by the end of his first contract wherever he goes

For whatever it's worth to you, here's the profile write-up for Collins from the McShay crew... he's got two associates, both of whom played OL in college..... I'm sure this will be updated after the Combine and Pro Days....

Overall Football Traits

Production 1 2011: Played seven games (0 starts) as a true freshman. 2012: Started all 13 games at LOG. 2013: Played and started 12 games at LOT

Height-Weight-Speed 2 A ROT/OG tweener. Height is slightly below average but well within range for NFL OT. Better than average bulk with broad shoulders and a big bubble. Outstanding straight-line speed for size. Has massive hands (11'). Also Appears on tape to have long arms, but his 33 ½-inch arm length measurement in spring does not match up.

Durability 2 Did not play versus Furman in 2013 due to a minor undisclosed injury. Led team in 2012 with total snaps played.

Intangibles 2 Is well-respected and liked by teammates and coaches. A Person of high character who is mature and handles his business. No off-the-field issues. Was raised in a single-parent home by mother Loyetta Collins.

1 = Exceptional 2 = Above average 3 = Average 4 = Below average 5 = Marginal

Offensive Tackle Specific Traits

Pass Protection 3 Is light on his feet and usually gets set quickly with a solid base under him (only few times where elite speed got him off-balance in set). Shows strong anchor in pass protection. Has strong hands and does a good job of sustaining block once locked out, but needs more aggressiveness at times in pass protection punch. Gets in trouble when pads rise and he becomes straight-legged. Can be a bit of a waist-bender after initial contact, which leads to him lunging and falling off some blocks.

Run Blocking 1 Has massive frame. Fires off the ball with very good straight-line burst for his size. Has very good lower-body strength and strong hands to drive and steer defenders off the line. Strong drive-blocker that consistently generates movement. Can reach second level easily but is not a natural bender and has a difficult time hitting moving targets.

Awareness 2 Knows his assignments. Has experience at OT and OG. Studies tape and can transfer what he learns to the field. Shows adequate-to-good awareness in pass protection.

Toughness 2 Flashes mean streak and finishes plays through the whistle.

1 = Exceptional 2 = Above average 3 = Average 4 = Below average 5 = Marginal

Gavin · January 7, 2015

For whatever it's worth to you, here's the profile write-up for Collins from the McShay crew... he's got two associates, both of whom played OL in college.....      I'm sure this will be updated after the Combine and Pro Days....

Overall Football Traits

Production 1 2011: Played seven games (0 starts) as a true freshman.   2012: Started all 13 games at LOG.               2013: Played and started 12 games at LOT

Height-Weight-Speed 2   A ROT/OG tweener. Height is slightly below average but well within range for NFL OT. Better than average bulk with broad shoulders and a big bubble. Outstanding straight-line speed for size. Has massive hands (11'). Also Appears on tape to have long arms, but his 33 ½-inch arm length measurement in spring does not match up.

Durability 2 Did not play versus Furman in 2013 due to a minor undisclosed injury. Led team in 2012 with total snaps played.

Intangibles 2 Is well-respected and liked by teammates and coaches. A Person of high character who is mature and handles his business. No off-the-field issues. Was raised in a single-parent home by mother Loyetta Collins.

1 = Exceptional   2 = Above average   3 = Average   4 = Below average   5 = Marginal

Offensive Tackle Specific Traits

Pass Protection 3 Is light on his feet and usually gets set quickly with a solid base under him (only few times where elite speed got him off-balance in set). Shows strong anchor in pass protection. Has strong hands and does a good job of sustaining block once locked out, but needs more aggressiveness at times in pass protection punch. Gets in trouble when pads rise and he becomes straight-legged. Can be a bit of a waist-bender after initial contact, which leads to him lunging and falling off some blocks.

Run Blocking 1 Has massive frame. Fires off the ball with very good straight-line burst for his size. Has very good lower-body strength and strong hands to drive and steer defenders off the line. Strong drive-blocker that consistently generates movement. Can reach second level easily but is not a natural bender and has a difficult time hitting moving targets.

Awareness 2 Knows his assignments. Has experience at OT and OG. Studies tape and can transfer what he learns to the field. Shows adequate-to-good awareness in pass protection.

Toughness 2 Flashes mean streak and finishes plays through the whistle.

1 = Exceptional   2 = Above average   3 = Average   4 = Below average   5 = Marginal

He certainly has some athleticism and has a massive frame and shows straight line burst to get to the 2nd level and strong hands.

http://draftbreakdown.com/video/lael-collins-vs-wisconsin-2014/

Waist bender

2:19

Mirrors Well (Shows ability)

2:24

Ability to drive defender off LOS

2:34

Balance issues

4:12....I know that its correctable....But for me IF Im an O Line coach I don't want to spend time trying to teach this guy how play Guard standing on two feet...I'd expect my 1st or 2nd round draft pick to be able to do that already.....and hoping that he learns to do that is a very dangerous game one is playing if you plan on picking him in the 1st round....let alone if you plan to make him an immediate starter

I didn't go into a full on breakdown here but I have watched enough to say I wouldn't be comfortable picking him in the 1st round if I was a GM who had to nail my first round pick, 2nd round yes because he does show enough athleticism and skills that can be molded, I think he has Pro Bowl caliber potential at Guard who can slide over and play LT in a pinch if he has to and certainly RT, I think if he figures out the balance issue he has the ability to play LG or RT in our scheme.......But I like Clemmings better

riftastic28 · January 7, 2015

Collins at guard is a probowler .. He's not a tackle atleast not yet

Valpo2004 · January 7, 2015

Can anyone tell me why Scherff is being sold as a guard or right tackle only? I know he's known more for his run blocking but I'm an Iowa fan and he played LT this year and I don't remember much pressure coming from Scherff's way the entire season. The only time I remember him giving up a sack was when he decided to play literally the weekend after he had surgery and was not at 100%. (I'm honestly surprised that our coach even let him play.)

Honestly I think the guy could play guard or tackle on either side.

I doubt he would fall to us but I'd love to see him on the Colts. He would be a huge boost to our running game.

akcolt · January 7, 2015

Collins PLEASE fall to us I agree a yr at G kick him out to RT. This O Line isn't as far away as it looks some Sunday's IMO we are getting close to being where we want to be

Would love Schreff but he is going early he is a LT

Defjamz26 · January 7, 2015

I've been a Brandon Scherf fan since last year when I thought he was going to come out. The guy is simply amazing. I'd take him in a heartbeat in the 1st round. He'd be an instant starter at RT or RG. I think his natural position in the NFL is RT though, but it's possible he'll play guard first at the next level.

I also like Jake Fisher late.

Valpo2004 · January 7, 2015

I've been a Brandon Scherf fan since last year when I thought he was going to come out. The guy is simply amazing. I'd take him in a heartbeat in the 1st round. He'd be an instant starter at RT or RG. I think his natural position in the NFL is RT though, but it's possible he'll play guard first at the next level.

I also like Jake Fisher late.

If he fell to us I would agree that we put him in at RG and play him there for a year while Cherilus holds down the RT spot. I just don't think he or really anyone could come in their rookie year and beat out Cherilus right away.

But I would love to have him.

hoosierhawk · January 7, 2015

For whatever it's worth to you, here's the profile write-up for Collins from the McShay crew... he's got two associates, both of whom played OL in college.....      I'm sure this will be updated after the Combine and Pro Days....

Overall Football Traits

Production 1 2011: Played seven games (0 starts) as a true freshman.   2012: Started all 13 games at LOG.               2013: Played and started 12 games at LOT

Height-Weight-Speed 2   A ROT/OG tweener. Height is slightly below average but well within range for NFL OT. Better than average bulk with broad shoulders and a big bubble. Outstanding straight-line speed for size. Has massive hands (11'). Also Appears on tape to have long arms, but his 33 ½-inch arm length measurement in spring does not match up.

Durability 2 Did not play versus Furman in 2013 due to a minor undisclosed injury. Led team in 2012 with total snaps played.

Intangibles 2 Is well-respected and liked by teammates and coaches. A Person of high character who is mature and handles his business. No off-the-field issues. Was raised in a single-parent home by mother Loyetta Collins.

1 = Exceptional   2 = Above average   3 = Average   4 = Below average   5 = Marginal

Offensive Tackle Specific Traits

Pass Protection 3 Is light on his feet and usually gets set quickly with a solid base under him (only few times where elite speed got him off-balance in set). Shows strong anchor in pass protection. Has strong hands and does a good job of sustaining block once locked out, but needs more aggressiveness at times in pass protection punch. Gets in trouble when pads rise and he becomes straight-legged. Can be a bit of a waist-bender after initial contact, which leads to him lunging and falling off some blocks.

Run Blocking 1 Has massive frame. Fires off the ball with very good straight-line burst for his size. Has very good lower-body strength and strong hands to drive and steer defenders off the line. Strong drive-blocker that consistently generates movement. Can reach second level easily but is not a natural bender and has a difficult time hitting moving targets.

Awareness 2 Knows his assignments. Has experience at OT and OG. Studies tape and can transfer what he learns to the field. Shows adequate-to-good awareness in pass protection.

Toughness 2 Flashes mean streak and finishes plays through the whistle.

1 = Exceptional   2 = Above average   3 = Average   4 = Below average   5 = Marginal

I have been fascinated by Tomlinson, G, Duke in 3rd or 4th round. does McShay have a write up on him yet?

Track Guy · January 7, 2015

Can anyone tell me why Scherff is being sold as a guard or right tackle only? I know he's known more for his run blocking but I'm an Iowa fan and he played LT this year and I don't remember much pressure coming from Scherff's way the entire season. The only time I remember him giving up a sack was when he decided to play literally the weekend after he had surgery and was not at 100%. (I'm honestly surprised that our coach even let him play.)

Honestly I think the guy could play guard or tackle on either side.

I doubt he would fall to us but I'd love to see him on the Colts. He would be a huge boost to our running game.

I think the reason why most scouts feel Scherff is not a left tackle at the next level is because they don't think he'll be able to handle elite NFL pass rushers as well as he needs to if he was going to protect the blindside. He's obviously a fantastic run blocker, and looks like he could transition to guard very easily.

NewColtsFan · January 7, 2015

I have been fascinated by Tomlinson, G, Duke in 3rd or 4th round. does McShay have a write up on him yet?

I'm interested in Tomlinson too, but there's no profile on him yet.

Only a grade, and right now, it's a mid-3rd round grade, which for a guard is very good.

Tomlinson is listed as the 2nd pure guard, behind only Cann of South Carolina who has a low 1st or high 2nd round grade.

General Luck · January 7, 2015

While we have needs on defense that we could consider taking in round 1 of the draft after this season, O-line is probably the only offensive position that the Colts could pick that wouldn't shock this forum right? Seeing as the experts (well, Todd McShay anyways http://espn.go.com/blog/san-diego-chargers/post/_/id/9329/mcshay-o-line-sweet-spot-is-back-half-of-first-round) believe the back half of the 1st round is the sweet spot for O-linemen and that we could certainly use an upgrade in this position let's talk some O-line prospects. If we were to use our first rounder on an O-lineman, who would you say "yay" or "nay" to and why?

I count 7 first round pick candidates:

Brandon Scherff, Iowa
Ronnie Stanley, Notre Dame
Andrus Peat, Stanford
Ereck Flowers, Miami

These are the only sure-fire first round draft picks, IMO. I expect Flowers to be one of the late comers after the combine.

Here's how I'd rank them (based on potential, not on pro-readiness):

01. Andrus Peat

02. Ronnie Stanley

03. Brandon Scherff

04. Ereck Flowers

You're taking a risk on Flowers, being that he isn't as polished as Scherff or Peat, but I think he might end up being the best of the bunch when all is said done.

Superman · January 7, 2015

I've only watched Collins and Flowers, so far. I found both impressive. I think Collins is better suited to play guard, and Flowers would struggle with speed rushers and so should probably move to RT rather than LT.

General Luck · January 7, 2015

I've only watched Collins and Flowers, so far. I found both impressive. I think Collins is better suited to play guard, and Flowers would struggle with speed rushers and so should probably move to RT rather than LT.

I don't know... I think Flowers could be a very serviceable LT, but could be a Pro Bowl RT.

Collins is definitely a guard only, IMO.

Manning1887 · January 8, 2015

If we had a shot at Brandon Scherff, he would be tough to pass on, even in a trade up. He could be an elite right guard. He could be a Steve Hutchinson caliber right guard. Plus, given that JJ Watt lines up on the left side more often than not, a high quality right side of the line is imperative,

I am not sure what to think of Cedric Ogbuehi, Is he Tyron Smith or Winston Justice? He has good size and great athleticism, but needs to improve his technique and strength.

I also like Jake Fisher from Oregon in the 2nd or 3rd round.

Track Guy · January 8, 2015

If we had a shot at Brandon Scherff, he would be tough to pass on, even in a trade up. He could be an elite right guard. He could be a Steve Hutchinson caliber right guard. Plus, given that JJ Watt lines up on the left side more often than not, a high quality right side of the line is imperative,

I am not sure what to think of Cedric Ogbuehi, Is he Tyron Smith or Winston Justice? He has good size and great athleticism, but needs to improve his technique and strength.

I also like Jake Fisher from Oregon in the 2nd or 3rd round.

I agree about Scherff. I think he's going to be a guy who comes in and immediately plays guard at a high level and will only get better with time and become dominant at the position. I'm expecting him to be a top 15 pick but if he slips into the 20s, man, that would be tempting to trade up for. He gets to the second level really well, he has good footwork, and he should be able to do a good job pass blocking on the interior at the NFL level.

Superman · January 8, 2015

I don't know... I think Flowers could be a very serviceable LT, but could be a Pro Bowl RT.

Collins is definitely a guard only, IMO.

I watched the Miami/FSU game, Flowers' first game after his meniscus surgery. (By the way, that's a serious concern, IMO. If they removed a portion of his meniscus -- which they probably did -- then he'll probably have a degenerative knee condition, and wind up needing micro-fracture and Regenokine. Like Cherilus. Especially since he came back so quickly. There could be even more damage now.) He played very well, but the few times he was tested around the edge, he looked slow. That could very easily be a function of him playing so quickly after surgery. Maybe he didn't want to extend as much, and so his kick step wasn't as wide as it would be normally. I want to watch some of his pre-injury film, but like you said, I think he'd be best at RT. And that's fine for the Colts; we have a very good LT.

Collins is a guard right now. I think he has RT potential, though.

a06cc · January 8, 2015

Can anyone tell me why Scherff is being sold as a guard or right tackle only? I know he's known more for his run blocking but I'm an Iowa fan and he played LT this year and I don't remember much pressure coming from Scherff's way the entire season. The only time I remember him giving up a sack was when he decided to play literally the weekend after he had surgery and was not at 100%. (I'm honestly surprised that our coach even let him play.)

Honestly I think the guy could play guard or tackle on either side.

I doubt he would fall to us but I'd love to see him on the Colts. He would be a huge boost to our running game.

Yep Scherff is a good LT. I've watched him to scout him. His footwork is tremendous, has strength, and good hand placement. Fits our "power blocking" scheme.

Gavin · January 8, 2015

Cant really say at this point I'd take an O Lineman high at this point because those are positions you absolutely have to have right away nailed or your stuck in a situation like we have been in hoping our rookies develop at some point, Im all for taking an O Lineman later or some cant miss O Lineman but I don't think Scherff or Collins are cant miss.

John Dee · January 8, 2015

EVERY position is hit or miss.. NOT ONE is safe.

Cant really say at this point I'd take an O Lineman high at this point because those are positions you absolutely have to have right away nailed or your stuck in a situation like we have been in hoping our rookies develop at some point, Im all for taking an O Lineman later or some cant miss O Lineman but I don't think Scherff or Collins are cant miss.

Gavin · January 8, 2015

EVERY position is hit or miss.. NOT ONE is safe.

Which is why BPA is best and not reaching for need, There are positions in college that are harder to translate to the NFL, O Linemen is one of them I think(Do to the speed of the game and different blitzes an O Lineman might not see in college that he will see in the NFL....plus most O Linemen don't have NFL caliber strength) and if ya miss on an O Lineman you feel you need to play right away your setting your team back a year at least. you can miss high on a pass rusher, That position I think is much easier to evaluate for example

NewColtsFan · January 9, 2015

Which is why BPA is best and not reaching for need, There are positions in college that are harder to translate to the NFL, O Linemen is one of them I think(Do to the speed of the game and different blitzes an O Lineman might not see in college that he will see in the NFL....plus most O Linemen don't have NFL caliber strength) and if ya miss on an O Lineman you feel you need to play right away your setting your team back a year at least. you can miss high on a pass rusher, That position I think is much easier to evaluate for example

Gavin.....

There are clear candidates for first round picks at o-line in the upcoming draft. Guys like that go in the first round every year.

They don't always pan out and play at a high level in their first year, but eventually, most eventually develop. But you can't pass up first round talent.

On the NFL level, every single player drafted every year -- including Andrew Luck -- needs NFL coaching.

So, passing on a guy because you think he needs too much coaching is likely not an option. Just go back two years to the Lions and Ansah, the big DE from BYU. You wanted no part of him because he was too raw and needed too much coaching.

Detroit took him at 5 and he's played very well for him.

Guys fail for all sorts of reasons. They're not smart enough, mature enough, dedicated enough, they're rushed too soon into the starting line-up.... they're on bad teams and don't have enough talent around them.... all sorts of reasons why guys don't work out.

But if you can draft a good character kid, who is coachable and has the talent, you take him.

Gavin · January 9, 2015

Gavin.....

There are clear candidates for first round picks at o-line in the upcoming draft.    Guys like that go in the first round every year.

They don't always pan out and play at a high level in their first year,   but eventually, most eventually develop.    But you can't pass up first round talent.

On the NFL level, every single player drafted every year -- including Andrew Luck -- needs NFL coaching.

So, passing on a guy because you think he needs too much coaching is likely not an option.   Just go back two years to the Lions and Ansah, the big DE from BYU.      You wanted no part of him because he was too raw and needed too much coaching.

Detroit took him at 5 and he's played very well for him.

Guys fail for all sorts of reasons.   They're not smart enough, mature enough, dedicated enough, they're rushed too soon into the starting line-up....    they're on bad teams and don't have enough talent around them....    all sorts of reasons why guys don't work out.

But if you can draft a good character kid, who is coachable and has the talent, you take him.

Again an O Lineman panning out in the NFL is really usually harder to decipher then pass rushers and pass rushers you can usually wait a couple years to get a return on your investment but with O Linemen you plan on playing right away you cant....Unless you just want to take the chance of your QB becoming a human whoopee cushion. As to Ansah I thought he was going to take time to develop but I did see the potential that he would but just not quite as quick as he did but the raw talent was easy to see

Gavin · January 12, 2015

If I had to go O Line in the 1st I'd go with TJ Clemmings, OT Pittsburgh or trade down and go Jake Fisher OT/OG Oregon. Love there athleticism and footwork, They have to continue to gain strength

Valpo2004 · January 12, 2015

Which is why BPA is best and not reaching for need, There are positions in college that are harder to translate to the NFL, O Linemen is one of them I think(Do to the speed of the game and different blitzes an O Lineman might not see in college that he will see in the NFL....plus most O Linemen don't have NFL caliber strength) and if ya miss on an O Lineman you feel you need to play right away your setting your team back a year at least. you can miss high on a pass rusher, That position I think is much easier to evaluate for example

Trust me if Scherff falls to us late in the first round he would almost certainly be the BPA. Especially after having advanced to the AFC championship game, that puts our draft position at no higher then 29.

coltsfanatic24 · January 12, 2015

I doubt we draft o-line within the 1st 3 rounds, Grigson has already invested so much into. Redding will probably retire, Mathis is coming back from an injury, Jackson has 1 year left on his deal, and health and inconsistency is always a concern with Toler.

The defense was great against Peyton but they're still too inconsistent in the regular season. I think we'll draft defense in the 1st 3 rounds. Some prospects that could be available.

Malcolm Brown DE, Texas, 6'3 325 lbs

Eddie Goldman DE, Florida State, 6'4 320 lbs

Denzel Perryman, ILB, Miami, 6'0 240 lbs

Erik Kendricks, ILB, UCLA, 6'0 230 lbs

Marcus Peters, CB, Washington, 5'11 195 lbs

Markus Golden, OLB, Missouri, 6'3 260 lbs

Track Guy · January 12, 2015

I doubt we draft o-line within the 1st 3 rounds, Grigson has already invested so much into. Redding will probably retire, Mathis is coming back from an injury, Jackson has 1 year left on his deal, and health and inconsistency is always a concern with Toler.

The defense was great against Peyton but they're still too inconsistent in the regular season. I think we'll draft defense in the 1st 3 rounds. Some prospects that could be available.

Malcolm Brown DE, Texas, 6'3 325 lb.
Eddie Goldman DE, Florida State, 6'4 320 lbs
Denzel Perryman, ILB, Miami, 6'0 240 lbs
Erik Kendricks, ILB, UCLA, 6'0 230 lbs
Marcus Peters, CB, Washington, 5'11 195 lbs
Markus Golden, OLB, Missouri, 6'3 260 lbs

The O-line was way too inconsistent as well during the regular season, but I'm starting to think with our position in the last 4 picks of the draft and how solid of a job Joe Reitz has been doing we might be able to get away with not spending a high pick on the O-line for 1 more season. If a tackle is the BPA I want to pick him because I still consider tackle a very high priority in terms of our long term needs but Reitz is showing he can fill in well. I don't consider anyone on our roster to be the answer at right guard either, but my hope is maybe take care of that before the draft in free agency. I'm hoping the Saints release Ben Grubbs, I think he'd be a definite upgrade over guys like Louis and Thornton and probably come a bit cheaper than Iupati.

As far as those particular prospects go, I'm pretty high on Perryman. I would be pleased with Goldman as well. Another defense guy I like that's not on that list is Eli Harold.

esmort · January 12, 2015

I doubt we draft o-line within the 1st 3 rounds, Grigson has already invested so much into. Redding will probably retire, Mathis is coming back from an injury, Jackson has 1 year left on his deal, and health and inconsistency is always a concern with Toler.

The defense was great against Peyton but they're still too inconsistent in the regular season. I think we'll draft defense in the 1st 3 rounds. Some prospects that could be available.

Malcolm Brown DE, Texas, 6'3 325 lbs
Eddie Goldman DE, Florida State, 6'4 320 lbs
Denzel Perryman, ILB, Miami, 6'0 240 lbs
Erik Kendricks, ILB, UCLA, 6'0 230 lbs
Marcus Peters, CB, Washington, 5'11 195 lbs
Markus Golden, OLB, Missouri, 6'3 260 lbs

IMO assuming any position other than QB, TE, P, and K is off our early draft board is a bad assumption ... I don't think Grigson will hesitate to take OL (or any other position) early if he feels that is where the value is when we pick.

mintor · January 13, 2015

I've only watched Collins and Flowers, so far. I found both impressive. I think Collins is better suited to play guard, and Flowers would struggle with speed rushers and so should probably move to RT rather than LT.

true collins rg, need a rt. rest are . center, lg, lt are fine.

wig · January 15, 2015

If I had to go O Line in the 1st I'd go with TJ Clemmings, OT Pittsburgh or trade down and go Jake Fisher OT/OG Oregon. Love there athleticism and footwork, They have to continue to gain strength

Fisher is going to be a very good pro. He plays a lot like Kyle Long did at Oregon. Fisher has played RT/LT this year and last but guard before that. He's physical, plays mean and really athletic. He was a TE in HS.

Track Guy · January 15, 2015

Fisher is going to be a very good pro. He plays a lot like Kyle Long did at Oregon. Fisher has played RT/LT this year and last but guard before that. He's physical, plays mean and really athletic. He was a TE in HS.

Fisher did was straight up outstanding against FSU. He's gotta be creeping up the draft boards. I almost wonder if he's closing in on late first round stock territory.

Track Guy · January 26, 2015

Post senior bowl update...

Of the original 7 I mentioned of having a shot at the first round:

Brandon Scherff, Iowa
La'El Collins, LSU
T.J. Clemming, Pittsburgh
Cedric Ogbuehi, Texas A&M
Ronnie Stanley, Notre Dame
Andrus Peat, Stanford
Ereck Flowers, Miami

Only 4 still seem to be likely candidates to do so. The three that have not trended upwards are:

Ronnie Stanley, Notre Dame - Simply because he decided to return to school.
Cedric Ogbuehi, Texas A&M - In my opinion never was a round 1 talent. But he's torn his ACL and may or may not even be a day 2 pick now.
T.J. Clemming, Pittsburgh - His showing at the senior bowl didn't help him out. He was exposed as too raw. He reportedly struggled during 1-on-1 drills and gave up a strip sack during the game. Plenty of talent here, but he's likely too much of a project for anyone to invest a 1st in. I believe he's likely to go early on day 2 though.

So we're left with:

Brandon Scherff, Iowa
La'El Collins, LSU
Andrus Peat, Stanford
Ereck Flowers, Miami

As likely first round tackles. Collins had a good showing at the senior bowl, which may have convinced some that he's got what it takes to play tackle (even LT).

Here's how I see the possible day 2 picks...

Highly likely:

T.J. Clemmings
Ty Sambrailo
Jake Fisher
Daryl Williams

Fairly likely:

Jeremiah Poutasi
Cedric Ogbuehi
Tyrus Thompson

Dark horses:

Jamil Douglas
Rob Havenstein
Donovan Smith
Corey Robinson
Sean Hickey
Austin Sheppard
D.J. Humphries

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