Grigson: "2013 draft picks are work in progress"

[HtownColt]

“They’re works in progress,” Colts GM Ryan Grigson said. “I think we were in a different place in 2013 than we were in 2012. In 2012 it was kind of, the more the merrier. It was throw everybody in a bottle and see what comes out. In Year 2, we had players who had earned their spots, we had more guys established at positions. So, it's a good problem to have.”

“Training camp is when you see where your rookies are,” Grigson said. “If we have players who have established themselves who we can trust more or are better at the present time, it’s hard to tell where they’re at. So this upcoming training camp is going to be huge. Our team as a whole, it’s Year 3. It’s time for everybody to bring their A game. So, everybody’s got to be at the top of their game this offseason because we have high expectations.”

http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=indianapolis-colts&i=TWT&id=4242&w=1drru

[GwinnettColt]

I'm hoping this is true for Holmes, Werner, and Thornton.

[TKnight24]

That doesn't surprise me. This was a "project" draft when you looked at it. But due to that hateful injury bug who despises Indianapolis so much these project player's were FORCED into the fire early. It's bad when Adongo even got activated

I have no animosity towards Mr. Grigson's draft choices last year cause you could tell he had a plan but hey; thing's happen.

Let's get some mixed players this year and learn from it. Get a few projects but also some guys who could help us immediately

#InGrigsonITrust

[B-B]

A first round "Work in progress" isn't very confidence inducing

[Modern]

Project draft ??? The whole draft ?

Richardson is a project player, the draft selections are project players, yet we have an owner who wants to win now ....

Seems fishy.

We didn't have no project players in 2012, amazing how the whole draft selection switches gears when you didnt manage to draft a starter.

[IndyScribe]

Project draft ??? The whole draft ?

Richardson is a project player, the draft selections are project players, yet we have an owner who wants to win now ....

Seems fishy.

We didn't have no project players in 2012, amazing how the whole draft selection switches gears when you didnt manage to draft a starter.

In 2012, it was about getting the base down with our QB. In 2013, Grigson kept rebuilding. Irsay does want to win, but he never stated he wanted to win now. I think he's fine with this rebuild.

[21isSuperman]

It's still too early to judge the 2013 draft picks.  I say give them next year and possibly one more after that.  If you look at the 2012 draft, we went mostly offense.  We threw those guys into action almost immediately, with Fleener, Luck, Hilton, Ballard, Brazill, and Allen all making contributions in their first year.  In 2013, we went with more project players.  We had signed several free agents to fill the holes on the team and we took guys who mostly were project guys.  They have good physical tools, but they need to develop more.  I have no problem with that.  The problem arises if these guys don't show some improvement next year.  But for now, nothing to worry about, in my opinion

[Modern]

I am glad you guys cleared that up for me, now I see how stupid those teams who take players who contribute right away are ...... What fools .....

Grigson would claim Satele was a project player if you asked him I bet.

It was a bad draft, maybe something can be salvaged from it eventually, but to pretend that it was all planned is foolish. Nobody goes into the draft looking for players for 2 or 3 years down the road.

[DougDew]

Yes...a project draft. Even a 1st rounder can be a project. Its fine

Round 1. Werner. Not much football experience but physically gifted with a good attitude and ethic. Lots of talent, not much football skill, but would not have lasted until the colts pick in the 3rd round. Were any rookie OLB's taken after Werner better?

Round 2. No Pick

Round 3. Thornton. 3rd round OL's are always projects

Round 4. Holmes. Ditto

Round 5. Hughes. Undisciplined in college, but physically talented. Project.

Round 6. Boyett. Safety with two bad knees but, apparently, more beer muscles.

I guess some will slam Grigson for saying what he said, but what draft isn't about projects unless you're picking in the top 20, IMO.

[IndyScribe]

I am glad you guys cleared that up for me, now I see how stupid those teams who take players who contribute right away are ...... What fools .....

Grigson would claim Satele was a project player if you asked him I bet.

It was a bad draft, maybe something can be salvaged from it eventually, but to pretend that it was all planned is foolish. Nobody goes into the draft looking for players for 2 or 3 years down the road

You're not going to find many impact players who can contribute right away at the bottom of the draft. In a few years, sure, or if the player just comes out ready(like Dwayne Allen). Grigson would not claim Satele is a project player. Why would it be a bad draft? Give them a year or two to develop, and see how they do. Reggie and Harrison both took a few years before they broke out. Teams do go into the draft looking for players for 2-3 years down the road. Later picks are not going to contribute immediately, and they're going to take a few years before they play well.

[Modern]

Polian had a lot of project drafts I guess. In fact he has projects that are still out there developing somewhere.

[DougDew]

Reggie and Harrison both had a few years before they broke out.

Great point, although Harrison was pretty good as a rookie. Reggie was always nicked up injured and didn't contribute hardly at all until the final year of his rookie contract, which may have been his 4th year. There were debates as to whether or not he should be signed to a new contract. He was taken with the 25th pick his rookie year.

[HtownColt]

I saw it as (whether you agree with Grigson or not, most don't) was that he felt he had players in place that had proven/earned their spot in 2012 that they have more trust in at the time. Which is why Satele and McGlynn never lost their job due to their lack of production.

Grigson saw it as he had more guys who were solidified at their positions this year than in 2012 when pretty much every rookie had a shot to play.

Still should have benched Satele and McGlynn during the season from their inability to perform at a satisfactory level. Grigson was too loyal to those two

[Boiler_Colt]

Yes...a project draft. Even a 1st rounder can be a project. Its fine

Round 1. Werner. Not much football experience but physically gifted with a good attitude and ethic. Lots of talent, not much football skill, but would not have lasted until the colts pick in the 3rd round. Were any rookie OLB's taken after Werner better?

Round 2. No Pick

Round 3. Thornton. 3rd round OL's are always projects

Round 4. Holmes. Ditto

Round 5. Hughes. Undisciplined in college, but physically talented. Project.

Round 6. Boyett. Safety with two bad knees but, apparently, more beer muscles.

I guess some will slam Grigson for saying what he said, but what draft isn't about projects unless you're picking in the top 20, IMO.

 

I agree, I look at this as about an average draft for a team drafting late in the round. Also, this draft was not a deep one at all and all the pundits said as much leading up to it.

 

Werner played significant minutes and showed flashes and improvement as the season went on. If he hadn't been hurt for that stretch of games he probably would have had at least another sack or two and would have had comparable numbers to the top DE/OLBers taken in this draft.

 

Thornton was a starter. He had his ups and downs but he started and the team still won 11 games.

 

Every player taken beyond the first three rounds is usually a project. I think we've just been spoiled on getting production from later rounders in the past. Again, the depth of the 2013 draft was considered poor.

 

Holmes is a mystery but Hughes showed flashes of his athleticism that he was drafted for in a limited sample size.

 

6th and 7th rounders are always longshots to make the team.

 

However, if you consider Rogers and McNary extensions of this draft class, the 2013 haul looks a little better.

 

Overall, yes we need to see improvement out of these guys and I think we will. I think we just got a little too spoiled on the 2012 draft, you're not going to knock it out of the park every single year, the draft can be a crapshoot at times.

[DougDew]

I agree, I look at this as about an average draft for a team drafting late in the round. Also, this draft was not a deep one at all and all the pundits said as much leading up to it.

 

Werner played significant minutes and showed flashes and improvement as the season went on. If he hadn't been hurt for that stretch of games he probably would have had at least another sack or two and would have had comparable numbers to the top DE/OLBers taken in this draft.

 

Thornton was a starter. He had his ups and downs but he started and the team still won 11 games.

 

Every player taken beyond the first three rounds is usually a project. I think we've just been spoiled on getting production from later rounders in the past. Again, the depth of the 2013 draft was considered poor.

 

Holmes is a mystery but Hughes showed flashes of his athleticism that he was drafted for in a limited sample size.

 

6th and 7th rounders are always longshots to make the team.

 

However, if you consider Rogers and McNary extensions of this draft class, the 2013 haul looks a little better.

 

Overall, yes we need to see improvement out of these guys and I think we will. I think we just got a little too spoiled on the 2012 draft, you're not going to knock it out of the park every single year, the draft can be a crapshoot at times.

Also, in 2012, the colts had the first pick in each round. TE's tend to have less value than some other positions, so getting two productive ones at the beginning of round 2 and 3 is not really that much of a surprise.

The big surprise was Hilton. Getting a lot of production out of the first two years of a late 3rd round WR is pretty rare. Grigson saw the potential and traded up to get him.

[Beauregarde]

“They’re works in progress,” Colts GM Ryan Grigson said. “I think we were in a different place in 2013 than we were in 2012. In 2012 it was kind of, the more the merrier. It was throw everybody in a bottle and see what comes out. In Year 2, we had players who had earned their spots, we had more guys established at positions. So, it's a good problem to have.”

“Training camp is when you see where your rookies are,” Grigson said. “If we have players who have established themselves who we can trust more or are better at the present time, it’s hard to tell where they’re at. So this upcoming training camp is going to be huge. Our team as a whole, it’s Year 3. It’s time for everybody to bring their A game. So, everybody’s got to be at the top of their game this offseason because we have high expectations.”

http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=indianapolis-colts&i=TWT&id=4242&w=1drru

Sure they are. What did you expect him to say? "I screwed the pooch on last year's draft?" Well, he did. But, he was great the year before. It will be tough to go without a one or four but we will see how he does this year.

[Superman]

I'll say again, I like the 2013 draft. Werner isn't my favorite pick, but he'll work out at Rush backer. Thornton is a future starter at guard. Holmes is the question mark, and I don't know what he'll do. Hughes will work out as a rotational five-tech DE, and when he did play, he played well. The late picks didn't work out, but those aren't the picks you grade a draft on.

[MTC]

[DougDew]

Got to remember the situation too....The Colts had just let Freeney go, and had only one real pass rusher under contract...Mathis. Do you wait until the 3rd round to draft one? Which is what would've happened if they took a guard or CB in round 1.

Its easier to find a reasonably priced starting guard or a #2 corner in round 3 or in free agency than a pass rushing OLB, IMO.

[TKnight24]

Yes...a project draft. Even a 1st rounder can be a project. Its fine

Round 1. Werner. Not much football experience but physically gifted with a good attitude and ethic. Lots of talent, not much football skill, but would not have lasted until the colts pick in the 3rd round. Were any rookie OLB's taken after Werner better?

Round 2. No Pick

Round 3. Thornton. 3rd round OL's are always projects

Round 4. Holmes. Ditto

Round 5. Hughes. Undisciplined in college, but physically talented. Project.

Round 6. Boyett. Safety with two bad knees but, apparently, more beer muscles.

I guess some will slam Grigson for saying what he said, but what draft isn't about projects unless you're picking in the top 20, IMO.

2 round pick was Vontae Davis. The BEST CB in that draft class

[Dark Superman]

Is project the new word for bust?

[dudeski]

A first round "Work in progress" isn't very confidence inducing

its pretty common if you actually pay attention to the nfl

[dudeski]

I saw it as (whether you agree with Grigson or not, most don't) was that he felt he had players in place that had proven/earned their spot in 2012 that they have more trust in at the time. Which is why Satele and McGlynn never lost their job due to their lack of production.

Grigson saw it as he had more guys who were solidified at their positions this year than in 2012 when pretty much every rookie had a shot to play.

Still should have benched Satele and McGlynn during the season from their inability to perform at a satisfactory level. Grigson was too loyal to those two

satele and mcglynn should not have been on the team

[Jaric]

satele and mcglynn should not have been on the team

Who should they have signed instead?

[Gavin]

Draft picks are signed to 4 years for a reason folks, Midway or through Year 3 is the year when you should be concerned about a player...Unless the GM flat out drafts a players that does not fit what we do and doesn't do things that fit his skill set then thats not the players fault, thats on the GM for trying to fit a square peg into a round hole

[Naptown Lifer]

Draft picks are signed to 4 years for a reason folks, Midway or through Year 3 is the year when you should be concerned about a player...Unless the GM flat out drafts a players that does not fit what we do and doesn't do things that fit his skill set then thats not the players fault, thats on the GM for trying to fit a square peg into a round hole

Unless your Trent Richardson and you just can't see the hole period

[dudeski]

Who should they have signed instead?

people with talent that don't have a track record of being jokes

[theanarchist]

Project draft ??? The whole draft ?

Richardson is a project player, the draft selections are project players, yet we have an owner who wants to win now ....

Seems fishy.

We didn't have no project players in 2012, amazing how the whole draft selection switches gears when you didnt manage to draft a starter.

I don't totally disagree with you but Werner was never going to start in year one. He was drafted to eventually take over for Mathis or be a 3rd down pass rusher. Thornton did a fair job coming in as a rookie and filling in for an injured Thomas and he'll probably be the starter on the right side this year.

[Jaric]

people with talent that don't have a track record of being jokes

Names or STHU

[gacker65]

Yes...a project draft. Even a 1st rounder can be a project. Its fine

Round 1. Werner. Not much football experience but physically gifted with a good attitude and ethic. Lots of talent, not much football skill, but would not have lasted until the colts pick in the 3rd round. Were any rookie OLB's taken after Werner better?

Round 2. No Pick

Round 3. Thornton. 3rd round OL's are always projects

Round 4. Holmes. Ditto

Round 5. Hughes. Undisciplined in college, but physically talented. Project.

Round 6. Boyett. Safety with two bad knees but, apparently, more beer muscles.

I guess some will slam Grigson for saying what he said, but what draft isn't about projects unless you're picking in the top 20, IMO.

If we had a 1st round pick this year, would you spend it on another "project" player?  This is after knowing you still need starters in certain positions.

 

I agree with the 3-7 rounds, but not the 1st or 2nd. 

 

Yes, I will slam Grigson for drafting a project player in the 1st round when you needs.  IMO, you only draft project players in the 1st round if you could just as easy trade down and do not have a needs.

[Gavin]

Names or STHU

Pretty simple:

 

http://www.spotrac.com/free-agents/nfl/2012/center/

 

 

Todd Mcclure

Jeff Faine

Matt Birk

 

all went for less or not at all

[Jaric]

Pretty simple:

http://www.spotrac.com/free-agents/nfl/2012/center/

Todd Mcclure

Jeff Faine

Matt Birk

all went for less or not at all

Thank you Gavin. It's nice to see some people are interested in more than just complaining.

Re: Matt Birk. Not sure he belongs on this list. First he was 36 when he signed that contract and retired after the 2012 season. He also had played for the Ravens the previous 3 years so there's no real way to know if we could have actually signed him if we wanted to. Satele btw is 10 years younger which I'm guessing would have been a large part of any internal discussions if Birk was a real possibility.

I'm not very familiar with the other two guys you mentioned, so bear with me while I do a little looking before I respond to that part.

Also, before anyone gets things twisted, I'm not arguing Satele is a good center. IMO this was a sort of "any port in the storm" situation.

[Jaric]

Whoa, looks like McClure is just as old as Birk is and also retired after the 2012 season.

Faine didn't even last the whole season with the Bengals in 2012 and didn't play in 2013.

Those guys you listed might have been cheaper than Satele, but they're all on the wrong side of 30 and none of them played last year.

[Jaric]

Draft picks are signed to 4 years for a reason folks, Midway or through Year 3 is the year when you should be concerned about a player...

Ahhh the voice of reason.

[lollygagger8]

[DougDew]

If we had a 1st round pick this year, would you spend it on another "project" player?  This is after knowing you still need starters in certain positions.

 

I agree with the 3-7 rounds, but not the 1st or 2nd. 

 

Yes, I will slam Grigson for drafting a project player in the 1st round when you needs.  IMO, you only draft project players in the 1st round if you could just as easy trade down and do not have a needs.

 

The colts only had one OLB under contract at the time.  More importantly, the first round is reserved for drafting only a few impact POSITIONS, IMO. Those positions are: QB, WR, OLB, CB, LT, and DTorDE (these are the positions that command high salaries in free agency, if you choose that route to find one).   If I have a hole in one of those positions, yes, I would spend a low first round draft pick on one of those positions, expecting the CB, DL's, OLB, to be a player that their talent level dictates they rotate in their rookie year.   I would only draft an ILB, or a S in the first round if he was a rare talent, like Brian Urlacher.  You can get starting S, G, C, ILB's, NT's, RT's and TE's in later rounds, and save your first round picks to replace the positions that are expensive.  (1 LT, 2 CB's, 2 DL's, 2 WR's, 2 OLB's, those your first round picks in the next 9 years as veteran contracts roll off.  If your'e picking low in the round, they won't start their rookie year.)

 

This year, the colts have holes at starting ILB (Angerer is a FA) and a starting S (Bethea is a FA), possibly a starting C.  But neither POSITION is worthy of a first round pick.  I wish the colts had their low first round pick to spend on a disruptive DT/DE.  I would use the second round pick for an ILB, one with coverage skills and pass rushing skills, or my starting S.  But I would expect the DL I chose in low round 1 to be a rotational player their rookie year.

 

I agree about trading down.  If you know you could trade down and still get the same guy, you should do it.  Who knows if Grigson had that option.

[ztboiler]

If we had a 1st round pick this year, would you spend it on another "project" player?  This is after knowing you still need starters in certain positions.

 

I agree with the 3-7 rounds, but not the 1st or 2nd. 

 

Yes, I will slam Grigson for drafting a project player in the 1st round when you needs.  IMO, you only draft project players in the 1st round if you could just as easy trade down and do not have a needs.

Essentially you are saying don't draft a 3-4 OLB in the 1st Round.... ever. They all have to be converted as "projects" by your definition if you want elite physical traits.  Might as well say that you don't want elite pass rushing potential drafted in the 1st round for the scheme we are running.  That is OK if that is what you want.

 

When calling Werner a "project" player, remember that he was drafted as a rush LB skill set, not a Sam, and he is overstated as a "project" in that role.

[Modern]

The division sucks right now and we should easily win it again which means we will be picking late again next year.

I picture it being like when Peyton was here and we consistently make the playoffs, which means we will always be picking late.

Grigson isnt gonna get early picks anytime soon. He has to find players who can contribute right away. You can't have a roster full of projects and mediocre free agents.

If you want a certain position filled and the player isnt there then you trade down or just accept that the highest guy on your board would be too big of a reach and take someone at a different position.

Werner was a reach, maybe he will pan out, but he was still a reach.

This year we won't be picking until almost the 3rd round, so I dont know what Grigson will do. I doubt there will be many starters left by then.

The Richardson trade hurts us, I know some of you think he will be good, which is highly debatable, but either way it hurts the draft.

So if the 2013 players dont come on strong this season then I would consider Grigson a fool. Because that will be back to back drafts where he has dropped the ball.

Grigson has 2 hopes right now, that Richardson somehow becomes something more then the complete failure he was last season and that the 2013 draft players contribute. If neither happens then personally I would like to see them pack up his executive of the year award for him and send him down the road.

Nobody wants a repeat of the Chris Polian years. Grogsons job is to find and sign talent, if he is having a hard time doing it then send him packing. If a player has a great season then 2 lousy ones most fans would call for his head, the same is usually said for coaches, GM's should really be no different.

[Gavin]

Essentially you are saying don't draft a 3-4 OLB in the 1st Round.... ever. They all have to be converted as "projects" by your definition if you want elite physical traits.  Might as well say that you don't want elite pass rushing potential drafted in the 1st round for the scheme we are running.  That is OK if that is what you want.

 

When calling Werner a "project" player, remember that he was drafted as a rush LB skill set, not a Sam, and he is overstated as a "project" in that role.

Well Werner is just never going to be a player thats going to have good hip flexability to make alot of plays in space especially against speedy players,

[Mameluc]

Well Werner is just never going to be a player thats going to have good hip flexability to make alot of plays in space especially against speedy players,

why would we line up him to a speedy player? All i saw last season were he actually dropped in coverage was the same play where he linedup infront of the G/C pretending to be rushing only to fall back and play Zone coverage.