Luck Just Makes Me Feel Confident

[AntonMcG]

Yes, no need to rehash past arguments. But the fact is this Manning had three TOs which is a putrid performance from a QB of his caliber in a playoff game. His special teams also gave him 14 points. I believe had Luck been gifted 14 points early in his playoff game vs. the Ravens, the Colts win IMO.

 

Now, I do think there have been other playoff games where you could make a better argument. Sure. But not all fourth quarter comebacks are because the defense played bad, many are because the offense did or the QB turned the ball over. Play better earlier and no need for comebacks. Moore's bad play never has a chance to happen if Manning takes care of the ball and at $20 mil that is what you are expecting from him.

 

I stick to my original point which is the fact that more is expected of Manning in the playoffs because he has been one of the best players of his generation and paid as the best player in football for most of his career. That is why it is not unfair to criticize him in this regard. 20 games is a large sampling of games as well.

 

Yes, singlehandedly. There is only one player on a football team afterall.

[Superman]

I know what you are saying and I don't disagree. I am a big fan of Arians and can understand why Big Ben was so irate when he left. I think Arians would have modified things this year to better suit Luck and the Oline. He started to do that at the end of last season as far as I could tell anyways. Not sure if you agree. When I watched the playoff game without him, Luck and the O looked completely lost. I think what is often overlooked with him is his play calling which I think is pretty good.

 

I am anxious to see how Luck does with this new OC. I really think he is a stud and it was not hyperbole when he was compared to Elway coming out of college. His intangibles are impressive. Hopefully the team around him will be good enough to get back to the post-season.

 

Why should it take until Year 2 for you to adjust to the weaknesses of your roster? The hope should be that your roster has improved by Year 2. The adjustments should come week to week, not year to year. Not this kind of adjustment, anyways.

 

He made very few modifications throughout the season last year. The biggest gameplan adjustment came in the second game against the Texans, and we can't be sure that wasn't Pagano's directive. Either way, 15 weeks of one style of offense doesn't go away just because the 16th week seems different. Nor do the previous several seasons of Arians' gameplanning and play calling. He is what he is, and when he got hired in Arizona, he doubled down on his offensive philosophy. I find it hard to believe that he would have made any significant adjustments here, at least not of his own volition.

[amfootball]

Why should it take until Year 2 for you to adjust to the weaknesses of your roster? The hope should be that your roster has improved by Year 2. The adjustments should come week to week, not year to year. Not this kind of adjustment, anyways.

 

He made very few modifications throughout the season last year. The biggest gameplan adjustment came in the second game against the Texans, and we can't be sure that wasn't Pagano's directive. Either way, 15 weeks of one style of offense doesn't go away just because the 16th week seems different. Nor do the previous several seasons of Arians' gameplanning and play calling. He is what he is, and when he got hired in Arizona, he doubled down on his offensive philosophy. I find it hard to believe that he would have made any significant adjustments here, at least not of his own volition.

Any yet both your GM and Pagano wanted to keep him. Why?

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000121917/article/colts-gm-ryan-grigson-wants-to-keep-oc-bruce-arians

[Superman]

Any yet both your GM and Pagano wanted to keep him. Why?

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000121917/article/colts-gm-ryan-grigson-wants-to-keep-oc-bruce-arians

 

They both wanted to hire him in the first place. I disagreed then. That's not really the point.

 

You always run back to that, as if I'm arguing against Bruce Arians' merits. He obviously brings a lot of positives to the table. I just don't like his offensive philosophy or his stubborn refusal to adjust based on the team's strengths and weaknesses.

[The Old Crow]

Herman Munster ?

[amfootball]

They both wanted to hire him in the first place. I disagreed then. That's not really the point.

 

You always run back to that, as if I'm arguing against Bruce Arians' merits. He obviously brings a lot of positives to the table. I just don't like his offensive philosophy or his stubborn refusal to adjust based on the team's strengths and weaknesses.

I am not running back but pointing out that the very people making the decisions in the Colts org not only hired the guy after his contract expired in Pitt but wanted him back. If Luck's health or ability to succeed was in as much jeopardy as you seem to believe, I would think they would have said good-bye. To not think a coach of Arians caliber who helped take Pitt to two Super Bowls would not have been able to adjust to both Luck and the Colts personnel is asinine. He had Luck in the running for ROY in year one when he was unexpedectly moved to HC.

[Superman]

I am not running back but pointing out that the very people making the decisions in the Colts org not only hired the guy after his contract expired in Pitt but wanted him back. If Luck's health or ability to succeed was in as much jeopardy as you seem to believe, I would think they would have said good-bye. To not think a coach of Arians caliber who helped take Pitt to two Super Bowls would not have been able to adjust to both Luck and the Colts personnel is asinine. He had Luck in the running for ROY in year one when he was unexpedectly moved to HC.

 

 

I never suggested Luck's health or ability to succeed was in jeopardy. I said I don't like Arians' offense.

 

And maybe it's asinine to think that a coach with Arians' resume is incapable of adjusting, but I didn't say he wasn't capable. I said he stubbornly refuses to. What's asinine is to think that Arians' couldn't have adjusted to our roster weaknesses over the course of a four month season.

 

It's also asinine to think that Arians' is going to suddenly change what he does after one year with the Colts. This is how he runs his offense, and when he went to the Cardinals, a team with similar offensive line issues, he doubled down on his offensive philosophy. 

 

I don't know why you can't separate these two issues. I'm not questioning Arians' capability as a coach or coordinator. I'm saying I don't like his offense or his playcalling. And by the way, he was fired in Pittsburgh, after all the success they had with him. So I'm not the only one who doesn't like his offense and/or playcalling.

[amfootball]

I never suggested Luck's health or ability to succeed was in jeopardy. I said I don't like Arians' offense.

 

And maybe it's asinine to think that a coach with Arians' resume is incapable of adjusting, but I didn't say he wasn't capable. I said he stubbornly refuses to. What's asinine is to think that Arians' couldn't have adjusted to our roster weaknesses over the course of a four month season.

 

It's also asinine to think that Arians' is going to suddenly change what he does after one year with the Colts. This is how he runs his offense, and when he went to the Cardinals, a team with similar offensive line issues, he doubled down on his offensive philosophy. 

 

I don't know why you can't separate these two issues. I'm not questioning Arians' capability as a coach or coordinator. I'm saying I don't like his offense or his playcalling. And by the way, he was fired in Pittsburgh, after all the success they had with him. So I'm not the only one who doesn't like his offense and/or playcalling.

This is why I call you the fence pole dancing man. You waffle on every issue. You don't like his offensive phil. yet you think he is a good coordinator? What!? 

[BOTT]

[Gramz]

To lighten the mood, here...

 

 

[Superman]

Yes, singlehandedly. There is only one player on a football team afterall.

 

I especially appreciate that line of reasoning. Luck's offense scored 9 points on the Ravens defense. Manning's offense scored 21. Even with two gift touchdowns, the Colts still would have lost to the Ravens by one point.

[Superman]

This is why I call you the fence pole dancing man. You waffle on every issue. You don't like his offensive phil. yet you think he is a good coordinator? What!? 

 

It's really not that difficult. I didn't call him a good coordinator. I acknowledged that he's capable as a coordinator. I also said I think he did a good job as the head coach.

 

But I think his offensive philosophy is flawed, for several reasons, and I think his playcalling is lacking. I've given specific examples in the past.

 

You're acting like this is the Penrose Steps. 

[amfootball]

It's really not that difficult. I didn't call him a good coordinator. I acknowledged that he's capable as a coordinator. I also said I think he did a good job as the head coach.

 

But I think his offensive philosophy is flawed, for several reasons, and I think his playcalling is lacking. I've given specific examples in the past.

 

You're acting like this is the Penrose Steps. 

Splitting hairs I think - "good"; "capable." If you think the guys philosophy is flawed then by extension that makes him not good or capable. I am not sure why you can't just take a position and defend it. It makes debating ridiculous because you toe both sides.

[Superman]

Splitting hairs I think - "good"; "capable." If you think the guys philosophy is flawed then by extension that makes him not good or capable. I am not sure why you can't just take a position and defend it. It makes debating ridiculous because you toe both sides.

 

I guarantee you no one else I've debated Arians' merits with has that issue. Just you.

 

Good does not equal capable. 

 

And that's really not my point. My point is simple: I don't like Arians' offensive philosophy. Yes, he's gotten some results with it, but that doesn't mean that I have to like it. Neither does the fact that Grigson and Pagano apparently are taken with him; I disagree with their opinion. They are far more qualified than I am to make that kind of decision, but that doesn't mean that a) my opinion is without merit, even if it's irrelevant, or b) that they aren't wrong. How many coaches and GMs hired Mike Martz as coordinator after his system started to lose its effectiveness? 

 

I don't have to hate the man's guts in order to dislike his philosophy. I don't have to think he's a bumbling fool to think that his system is flawed. I like Arians, and I think he did a good job as head coach, even though I didn't like his offense and his playcalling. It's really simple.

[Gavin]

Splitting hairs I think - "good"; "capable." If you think the guys philosophy is flawed then by extension that makes him not good or capable. I am not sure why you can't just take a position and defend it. It makes debating ridiculous because you toe both sides.

Actually, As everybody knows Bruce Arians is and was a push the ball down field "chunk play" kind of coordinator even at the expense of your O Line being crap, His philosophy can work...with a better O Line and I did like some of his play calls but Arians did not adjust alot of his playcalling to compensate for a crap O Line, so in affect...good philosophy, stubborn playcalling, A coordinators play calls do not always have to fit his philosophy, you fit your philosophy around the talent you have, He did it with plenty of success I know...But if Luck wasn't so tough his playcalling would have had a MUCH more drastic affect in a negative way

[Superman]

Actually, As everybody knows Bruce Arians is and was a push the ball down field "chunk play" kind of coordinator even at the expense of your O Line being crap, His philosophy can work...with a better O Line and I did like some of his play calls but Arians did not adjust alot of his playcalling to compensate for a crap O Line, so in affect...good philosophy, stubborn playcalling, A coordinators play calls do not always have to fit his philosophy, you fit your philosophy around the talent you have, He did it with plenty of success I know...But if Luck wasn't so tough his playcalling would have had a MUCH more drastic affect in a negative way

 

I don't particularly like his philosophy even with a great offensive line, although you're right, it's more effective in that case, as the shortcomings aren't as pronounced.

[Blackclouds]

This thread disgusts me. I guess after the Colts go 2-2 or 0-4 to start this season maybe people will wake up

[Susie Q]

This thread disgusts me. I guess after the Colts go 2-2 or 0-4 to start this season maybe people will wake up

Not sure the meaning from this post. ( not too friendly )      Welcome to the forum.

[House]

This thread disgusts me. I guess after the Colts go 2-2 or 0-4 to start this season maybe people will wake up

What was our record after 4 games last year?

[amfootball]

that doesn't mean that a) my opinion is without merit, even if it's irrelevant

[Superman]

 

I'm just a guy on the Internet. I think I'm fairly smart, but the guys who get paid to do this are the ones whose opinions matter.

[DILLIGAFER]

 I think Luck looks more poised than Peyton was years and years into his career. Peyton was a regular season juggernaut and I appreciate everything he did for the city but something about his body language and demeanor that made me a little bit nervous all the time. I don't get that with Luck. It might take us a few years to completely build the team but I am much more confident in really clutch situations than I ever was with Manning at the helm. I know it sounds weird and not meant to be a slight against Manning but it's just the way I feel.

 

Oh my heck.. you cannot be serious. And those of you bashing.. ya'll should be ashamed of yourselves. I know I'm ashamed to be a Colts fan that has so called current fans bashing our former QB Manning. Its sickening.

[BlueRedZone]

I'm not going to respond to any of these replies and I am afraid this thread is going to spiral out of control. However, one of the best traits they have is both Peyton and Luck elevate the players around them to new levels. That in itself will bring this team a championship again.

And anyone who feels #18 was anything short of incredible is incredibly misinformed. I think people often forget his abilities and many of the clutch moments he had himself.

After the 2003 MNF game vs Tampa bay. No matter what the score. I always felt we had a chance with Peyton behind center. That was incredible. So many comebacks from large deficits. We had it real good for a long time. I feel fortunate to be a colts fan in this generation.