AR vs Young vs Stroud vs Levis

[ShuteAt168]

3 hours ago, NFLfan said:

 

Did you watch the Combine? Richardson's arm was on display. He looked great.

AR has a great arm too but I don’t know if he slings it like Levis. It doesn’t even really matter — both have enough arm strength, but stuff like accuracy, decision making, health, etc will determine their careers. 

[colts89]

6 hours ago, NFLfan said:

 

They are rookies. Fans are too critical of players, especially QBs. They will get better with practice and play.

I just said that his stat line was bad this week, and it's what I expect from him going forward. Supposed Colts fans on here were acting like he had a good week somehow. He could improve for sure, but his clock is already shorter than ARs due to his age.

 

This forum always gets weird when the Colts are on a losing streak(not you in particular). Half this thread read like Titans fans the way they support Mr.Mayo over AR, so pardon me for defending the Colts player on the Colts forum in a thread comparing QBs lmao.

[Zoltan]

26 minutes ago, colts89 said:

I just said that his stat line was bad this week, and it's what I expect from him going forward. Supposed Colts fans on here were acting like he had a good week somehow. He could improve for sure, but his clock is already shorter than ARs due to his age.

 

This forum always gets weird when the Colts are on a losing streak(not you in particular). Half this thread read like Titans fans the way they support Mr.Mayo over AR, so pardon me for defending the Colts player on the Colts forum in a thread comparing QBs lmao.

 

Yeah, it gets to the grass is always greener on every other team. It was the same when Chase Claypool and more recently Pickens was making plays in Pittsburgh and we had our WR situation here, and now its All the other rookie QBs in the draft that AR. I think there's the problem that highlights are seen and people overreact to them and getting mad we didn't have the player in said highlight.

[husker61]

Just watched the 2nd half of the tenn game. After watching the first half yesterday a said I would absolutely trade Richardson for Levi’s, now I would trade Richardson and a first round pick for him! And I am pretty sure tenn wouldn’t make that trade. He made some incredible throws under heavy pressure. He impressed the heck out of me!! Richardson is a risk, could be good or could be a bust, I just have doubts he will ever be that polished passer. I hope I am wrong!

[Zoltan]

1 hour ago, husker61 said:

Just watched the 2nd half of the tenn game. After watching the first half yesterday a said I would absolutely trade Richardson for Levi’s, now I would trade Richardson and a first round pick for him! And I am pretty sure tenn wouldn’t make that trade. He made some incredible throws under heavy pressure. He impressed the heck out of me!! Richardson is a risk, could be good or could be a bust, I just have doubts he will ever be that polished passer. I hope I am wrong!

 

We watched different games then

[Richie_ScottishColt]

Saw this on twitter earlier,

Anthony Richardson through 2.5 games:

577 passing yards
3 passing TDs
1 INT
59.5% completion percentage
ADJ % 71.1%
7 sacks
136 rushing yards  
4 rushing TDs

Will Levis through 2 games:

500 passing yards
4 passing TDs
1 INT
60.3% completion percentage
ADJ % 69.4%
6 sacks

13 rushing yards

[compuls1v3]

Did anyone notice Levis's jersey after the game?  Damn that boy took a beating, and seemed like he could take a hit.  He looked good on some throws, and questionable on on others.  On the other hand, his game ending interception was notable as well.

[husker61]

12 minutes ago, compuls1v3 said:

Did anyone notice Levis's jersey after the game?  Damn that boy took a beating, and seemed like he could take a hit.  He looked good on some throws, and questionable on on others.  On the other hand, his game ending interception was notable as well.

he did, and he made some throws that a lot of veteran qb’s couldn’t make as he was being hit. He made one throw sidearm to just avoid watt’s hand. He had two plays to throw a touchdown in the last 20 seconds. You have to take a chance with Pitt knowing he has to throw into the end zone from 25 yards away, he did and threw an int. We absolutely saw the game differently.

 

what throws was he questionable on? I didn’t see any.

 

[NFLfan]

8 hours ago, colts89 said:

I just said that his stat line was bad this week, and it's what I expect from him going forward. Supposed Colts fans on here were acting like he had a good week somehow. He could improve for sure, but his clock is already shorter than ARs due to his age.

 

This forum always gets weird when the Colts are on a losing streak(not you in particular). Half this thread read like Titans fans the way they support Mr.Mayo over AR, so pardon me for defending the Colts player on the Colts forum in a thread comparing QBs lmao.

 

I think that is what @2006Coltsbesteverwas doing too -- supporting a Colts player. I was a bit surprised how angry some became when some Colts fans said anything half-way negative about Levis. One would believe they would have that same level of emotion defending a player on the team they root for, not someone on an opposing team.

 

I thought Levis played well despite ilthe interception. I thought Richardson played well in all his games. I have not seen Stroud. I have seen Young; he has not looked as good as the others but I believe he will improve. I hope my rookie QB (Jaren Hall) will show as much poise as the top four QBs taken. But he is a rookie.

[DougDew]

1 hour ago, NFLfan said:

 

I think that is what @2006Coltsbesteverwas doing too -- supporting a Colts player. I was a bit surprised how angry some became when some Colts fans said anything half-way negative about Levis. One would believe they would have that same level of emotion defending a player on the team they root for, not someone on an opposing team.

 

I thought Levis played well despite ilthe interception. I thought Richardson played well in all his games. I have not seen Stroud. I have seen Young; he has not looked as good as the others but I believe he will improve. I hope my rookie QB (Jaren Hall) will show as much poise as the top four QBs taken. But he is a rookie.

I think it was about some of the pro AR folks exaggerating negatives about Levis.  I'm not a Levis supporter in wishing at this point he was on the Colts, but I don't think its fair to type misleading things about Levis just to support AR.   At least that's what my posts were point out.

[RollerColt]

14 hours ago, coltsblue1844 said:

I dunno if his pocket awareness is that good...or if he just runs if his 1st read isn't open, making it appear that he's getting away from a sack

If you study his games in detail, you can clearly see him make multiple reads with his head turning. 
 

I recommend The QB School on YouTube. He gives you all the tape you need to evaluate AR. 

[RollerColt]

10 hours ago, colts89 said:

I just said that his stat line was bad this week, and it's what I expect from him going forward. Supposed Colts fans on here were acting like he had a good week somehow. He could improve for sure, but his clock is already shorter than ARs due to his age.

 

This forum always gets weird when the Colts are on a losing streak(not you in particular). Half this thread read like Titans fans the way they support Mr.Mayo over AR, so pardon me for defending the Colts player on the Colts forum in a thread comparing QBs lmao.

It’s very much an us vs. them mentality. Except in this case people have put their stock in either Levis or AR and supporting or detracting the other is offensive. 
 

Egos are way too inflated around here nowadays.

[NFLfan]

44 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I think it was about some of the pro AR folks exaggerating negatives about Levis.  I'm not a Levis supporter in wishing at this point he was on the Colts, but I don't think its fair to type misleading things about Levis just to support AR.   At least that's what my posts were point out.

 

Isn't that what fans of teams do? Aaron Rodgers is one of the best QBs. He will be a first ballot NFL Hall of Fame inductee. Vikings fans always seemed to highlight the negatives in his game (which were/are very few, if any) and find every reason to knock him or how he plays. It is what fans do. If I was vociferously defending him, other Vikings fans might wonder what is behind my reaction.

 

My having said that does not mean that I agree with those who did not think Levis played well. I actually think they thought he played well. What was not to like? An interception at the end of the game does not affect my impression that he played well.

[cdgacoltsfan]

The Colts have their guy. It will be refreshing to go into next year not having to worry about who will be QB1 .

[NFLfan]

41 minutes ago, RollerColt said:

It’s very much an us vs. them mentality. Except in this case people have put their stock in either Levis or AR and supporting or detracting the other is offensive. 
 

Egos are way too inflated around here nowadays.

 

Exactly. You and I see it the same way, probably because our work involves working with people. (Part of my work involves studying human behavior.)

 

What you wrote is what people often do and they look for evidence/stats/information to support what they believe and ignore what does not.

 

[RollerColt]

6 minutes ago, NFLfan said:

 

Exactly. You and I see it the same way, probably because our work involves working with people. (Part of my work involves studying human behavior.)

 

What you wrote is what people often do and they look for evidence/stats/information to support what they believe and ignore what does not.

 

Am I odd in that I actively look for things to prove my theories wrong instead of right sometimes? 
 

I enjoy challenging my believes and perceptions, and when provided good evidence I’m not shy to change my stance. 

[NFLfan]

46 minutes ago, RollerColt said:

Am I odd in that I actively look for things to prove my theories wrong instead of right sometimes? 
 

I enjoy challenging my believes and perceptions, and when provided good evidence I’m not shy to change my stance. 

 

I love it. Some are so set in what they believe and no matter what you present to them, they still believe what they believe is true. Nuance is often not something they appreciate. I cannot get along with folks like that. You and I would be friends.

[DougDew]

1 hour ago, NFLfan said:

 

Isn't that what fans of teams do? Aaron Rodgers is one of the best QBs. He will be a first ballot NFL Hall of Fame inductee. Vikings fans always seemed to highlight the negatives in his game (which were/are very few, if any) and find every reason to knock him or how he plays. It is what fans do. If I was vociferously defending him, other Vikings fans might wonder what is behind my reaction.

 

My having said that does not mean that I agree with those who did not think Levis played well. I actually think they thought he played well. What was not to like? An interception at the end of the game does not affect my impression that he played well.

Either you're missing my point or you're glossing over it. 

 

 In this convo, I said exaggerating the negatives about Levis, and you change it by responding about knocking the negatives. 

 

In our previous convo, I asked if claiming that Levis' pick was "losing the game" was sincere.  You changed it by responding that you agreed it was not accurate.  

 

Exaggerate vs knock

Insincere vs inaccurate

 

My words detect an intention to mislead by the Levis haters, if not crossing the line into lying.  OTOH, knocking actuaI negatives or innocently getting it wrong has no malice to it.  Some of the criticisms of Levis get close to telling lies to support their position than what I read about AR. 

 

And criticizing Levis over the Mayo SM punk stunt would be the same as someone criticizing Rodgers over his continual changes of facial hair and haircuts.  A bit beyond the line, IMO.

 

 

[NFLfan]

11 hours ago, husker61 said:

Just watched the 2nd half of the tenn game. After watching the first half yesterday a said I would absolutely trade Richardson for Levi’s, now I would trade Richardson and a first round pick for him! And I am pretty sure tenn wouldn’t make that trade. He made some incredible throws under heavy pressure. He impressed the heck out of me!! Richardson is a risk, could be good or could be a bust, I just have doubts he will ever be that polished passer. I hope I am wrong!

 

Name checks out. You are more of a Huskers fan than a Colts fan.

[NFLfan]

36 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Either you're missing my point or you're glossing over it. 

 

 In this convo, I said exaggerating the negatives about Levis, and you change it by responding about knocking the negatives. 

 

In our previous convo, I asked if claiming that Levis' pick was "losing the game" was sincere.  You changed it by responding that you agreed it was not accurate.  

 

Exaggerate vs knock

Insincere vs inaccurate

 

My words detect an intention to mislead by the Levis haters, if not crossing the line into lying.  OTOH, knocking actuaI negatives or innocently getting it wrong has no malice to it.  Some of the criticisms of Levis get close to telling lies to support their position than what I read about AR. 

 

And criticizing Levis over the Mayo SM punk stunt would be the same as someone criticizing Rodgers over his continual changes of facial hair and haircuts.  A bit beyond the line, IMO.

 

 

 

I don't know. You may be right that we don't understand each other. Many don't seem to understand me because I am not an "all or nothing" thinker; I see the gray/nuance. 

 

I said I thought Levis's critics (or whatever you want to call it) were inaccurate in their thinking. I disagreed with their assessment of his game on Thursday. I also wrote that I think they actually believe he did well. The word "knock" was used with Aaron Rodgers to make a point. Vikings fans knock him (or exaggerate negatives) to put him down despite knowing that he is really great at what he does.

 

If you don't understand me now, I don't know how else to say it. I'm done with explaining the way I see it.

[DougDew]

10 minutes ago, NFLfan said:

I don't know. You may be right that we don't understand each other. Many don't seem to understand me because I am not an "all or nothing" thinker; I see the gray/nuance. 

Since I think you get my point, I'll simply say that the reason some of the pushback is taking place against the Levis critics is because I detect (not an all or nothing statement) a dishonest bent to how the Levis critics write comments about the two QBs. 

 

I don't think it helps discussion.

[RollerColt]

33 minutes ago, NFLfan said:

 

I love it. Some are so set in what they believe and no matter what you present to them, they still believe what they believe is true. Nuance is often not something they appreciate. I cannot get along with folks like that. You and I would be friends.

 

We already are friends! LOL

[NFLfan]

24 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Since I think you get my point, I'll simply say that the reason some of the pushback is taking place against the Levis critics is because I detect (not an all or nothing statement) a dishonest bent to how the Levis critics write comments about the two QBs. 

 

I don't think it helps discussion.

 

I don't think so. Check out what Husker wrote. He wrote that he would give a #1 and Richardson for Levis. I have not read anything as offensive or similarly critical of Levis as Husker intimated about Richardson in his post. It is quite telling that you did not sense the same. Given the way you defend Levis, I expected you to post something like, "Come on. I like Levis, but Richardson is not that bad" or something like that. I guess my being a fan of another team allows me see the matter in a different way. To me, it is more likely to see fans supporting their own players than opposing players at the same position.

[DougDew]

1 hour ago, NFLfan said:

 

I don't think so. Check out what Husker wrote. He wrote that he would give a #1 and Richardson for Levis. I have not read anything as offensive or similarly critical of Levis as Husker intimated about Richardson in his post. It is quite telling that you did not sense the same. Given the way you defend Levis, I expected you to post something like, "Come on. I like Levis, but Richardson is not that bad" or something like that. I guess my being a fan of another team allows me see the matter in a different way. To me, it is more likely to see fans supporting their own players than opposing players at the same position.

Unlike what some are doing to Levis, he’s not misrepresenting the magnitude of ars negatives to prefer Levis.   It’s simply a sincere opinion that people don’t like. .  

[NFLfan]

2 hours ago, DougDew said:

Unlike what some are doing to Levis, he’s not misrepresenting the magnitude of ars negatives to prefer Levis.   It’s simply a sincere opinion that people don’t like. .  

 

That is an interesting take. So, someone cannot have a negative opinion of Levis's play? I doubt it would have been okay with you if someone wrote, "After that display, so glad we took AR." There is no misrepresation; it is just a similar opinion to Husker's except it is about a different player. Both statements do not back up the reason behind the opinion. Husker did not give reasons for his negative opinions on AR; therefore, it is hard to tell whether those opinions are based on "misrepresenting the magnitude of AR's negatives".

 

Anyway, you seem incensed with Colts fans for criticizing Levis but seem to have no problem with someone criticizing the Colts QB.

 

 

[GoColts8818]

Levis being good or bad isn’t going to matter if AR turns into the player the Colts hope he will when they drafted him.

[NewColtsFan]

3 hours ago, DougDew said:

Unlike what some are doing to Levis, he’s not misrepresenting the magnitude of ars negatives to prefer Levis.   It’s simply a sincere opinion that people don’t like. .  

Just out of curiosity, have you mentioned anywhere that you’re not a fan of AR and opposed the Colts drafting him?   In the interest of fairness, that would be Full Disclosure.   
 

 

[Myles]

20 hours ago, cdgacoltsfan said:

Ok:

Levis QBR 46.3

AR QBR 47.6

Those stats?

Those and being available to play.  AR has missed too many games already.   Hopefully that changes.

[DougDew]

2 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Just out of curiosity, have you mentioned anywhere that you’re not a fan of AR and opposed the Colts drafting him?   In the interest of fairness, that would be Full Disclosure.   
 

 

You have this habit of telling me what my opinion is.   I guess you wish it.  
 

I am a fan of ar. and not opposed to the colts drafting him.   As I’ve said many times.  I was indifferent when stroud went off the board between ar, Levis, and trade down.  And whatever Ballard did I’d be fine with as a fan because I had no defined opinion about what to do with pick four this year.  
 

it was young who I did not want the colts to draft.  But that became a nonissue very quickly 

 

if there was a series of posts or one poster that persistently misrepresents the magnitude what ar did to the negative, I would point that out too. 

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, DougDew said:

You have this habit of telling me what my opinion is.   I guess you wish it.  
 

I am a fan of ar. and not opposed to the colts drafting him.   As I’ve said many times.  I was indifferent when stroud went off the board between ar, Levis, and trade down.  And whatever Ballard did I’d be fine with as a fan because I had no defined opinion about what to do with pick four this year.  
 

it was young who I did not want the colts to draft.  But that became a nonissue very quickly 

 

if there was a series of posts or one poster that persistently misrepresents the magnitude what ar did to the negative, I would point that out too. 

Do you know WHY I see you as someone who is NOT an AR fan? 
 

Because you heavily criticized every reason the Colts gave for taking him.   Morocco Brown called him a unicorn, you mocked that.   Brown also said AR got more magical fairy dust to give him Superstar potential and you mocked that as well.   You actually wrote a post that it was Brown and NOT  Ballard who decided to draft Anthony Richardson.   As if Brown has that kind of authority.   And when you were making all these negative comments, I don’t recall anything positive about the Colts taking AR.   If you did, I missed it. 
 

So if I see you as someone who is NOT an AR fan it’s because you’ve given me pretty good reason to think that.   When I talk about you being passive-aggressive and agenda driven, this is just the latest example. 

 

I like you Doug, but this response is a head scratcher for me.  

[DougDew]

48 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Do you know WHY I see you as someone who is NOT an AR fan? 
 

Because you heavily criticized every reason the Colts gave for taking him.   Morocco Brown called him a unicorn, you mocked that.   Brown also said AR got more magical fairy dust to give him Superstar potential and you mocked that as well.   You actually wrote a post that it was Brown and NOT  Ballard who decided to draft Anthony Richardson.   As if Brown has that kind of authority.   And when you were making all these negative comments, I don’t recall anything positive about the Colts taking AR.   If you did, I missed it. 
 

So if I see you as someone who is NOT an AR fan it’s because you’ve given me pretty good reason to think that.   When I talk about you being passive-aggressive and agenda driven, this is just the latest example. 

 

I like you Doug, but this response is a head scratcher for me.  

Do you keep a score card at home?  I mean like a note pad of the posters you don’t like and mark it up with notes and dates and comments you probably convinced yourself they said? 
 

and now you’re trying to derail the thread by telling Dougdew that Dougdew is not a fan of ar.  
 

Obsess much?
 

I just don’t see fandom as something that excuses intentionally  misseeing what opposing players do.  It’s the reason I’ve been active in this thread the past two days.  

 

btw,  who is Morocco Brown?  

[NewColtsFan]

50 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Do you keep a score card at home?  I mean like a note pad of the posters you don’t like and mark it up with notes and dates and comments you probably convinced yourself they said? 
 

and now you’re trying to derail the thread by telling Dougdew that Dougdew is not a fan of ar.  
 

Obsess much?
 

I just don’t see fandom as something that excuses intentionally  misseeing what opposing players do.  It’s the reason I’ve been active in this thread the past two days.  

 

btw,  who is Morocco Brown?  

The Colts executives are in order…

 

Chris Ballard, Ed Dodds, Morocco Brown.  (Did I get Brown’s name wrong?   Entirely possible in my current state, but he’s third) He was charged with following Richardson every week of his last year at Florida. 
 

By the way, that was a nice bit of deflection and making this about me.   I guess part of the reason I remember so many of your posts is that you have VERY unique opinions.  That works for you and against you.   They tend to jump out.   I keep no records, though many times I wish I did.

 

[DougDew]

17 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

The Colts executives are in order…

 

Chris Ballard, Ed Dodds, Morocco Brown.  (Did I get Brown’s name wrong?   Entirely possible in my current state, but he’s third) He was charged with following Richardson every week of his last year at Florida. 
 

By the way, that was a nice bit of deflection and making this about me.   I guess part of the reason I remember so many of your posts is that you have VERY unique opinions.  That works for you and against you.   They tend to jump out.   I keep no records, though many times I wish I did.

 

 

6 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Just out of curiosity, have you mentioned anywhere that you’re not a fan of AR and opposed the Colts drafting him?

 

Dude, you literally engaged me in this thread by making it about me.  

 

I'm the guy who says Ballard is responsible for the draft picks.  Unlike some who blame Frank........or blame elves for the 2017 draft (is that you?)

 

God's honest truth.  I have never ever clicked on Colts.com to look at anything Colts related...in my life.  I have this forum bookmarked and I have no reason to care about who works in the FO...other than the GM.

 

As far as the topic.  I believe running QBs need to learn to pass well in order for their teams to succeed in the NFL.  That would be the basis of any criticism of AR....and its sincere.  Also, my observation about Levis in college was that he was excitable and prone to be Wentz 2.0.   So each had their flaws that put them behind Stroud in my eyes and made me indifferent as to who the draft pick was.  Both need work.

 

But, btw, Levis looked impressively un-Wentz like under stress for the most part in his two games.  That's a sincere assessment.

 

[husker61]

11 hours ago, NFLfan said:

 

Name checks out. You are more of a Huskers fan than a Colts fan.

 

Both equal and probably longer than you have been alive.

so I guess anyone that doesn’t like every colt player, coach, or gm isn’t really a colts fan.  That would probably make every person here not a colts fan first. 

[husker61]

I have said this before, I will say it again. I didn’t like Richardson before the draft and would have traded down and seen if a qb fell to draft. Passing and reading defenses are much more important than a running qb, that’s why I wouldn’t have drafted him. In a small nfl sample size, levis is much more of the type of qb that I think will be successful. I hope Richardson turns out to be the best qb in the nfl, but I haven’t seen those qualities yet. 

[husker61]

21 hours ago, compuls1v3 said:

Did anyone notice Levis's jersey after the game?  Damn that boy took a beating, and seemed like he could take a hit.  He looked good on some throws, and questionable on on others.  On the other hand, his game ending interception was notable as well.

I will ask again. What throws did he look questionable on?

[husker61]

23 hours ago, husker61 said:

Richardson is a risk, could be good or could be a bust, I just have doubts he will ever be that polished passer. I hope I am wrong!

so this means I’m not really a colts fan according to nfl fan. 

[Boondoggle]

It's funny what people see.  That game vs Pittsburgh Levis played like a veteran up until the end when he started putting up risky balls.  Which was irritating.  Frankly I was a bit disgusted by how he looked for about 3/4 of the game.  Then very glad to see him rook it up late, because I don't want to see him play like a vet year one.

 

There's no way any Colts fan should be rooting for him now, even in order to say "I told you so."  Because that would never make up for the pain of seeing Tennessee blunder into a top QB addition in round 2. 

 

Best thing we've got going here with him is that he is a bit weird, reminds me of a male cheerleader type moreso than a locker room leader.  So the hope here has to be that he'll struggle and then have trouble managing the pressure and coaching corrections like we saw with Wentz.  But he showed a lot of character vs Pittsburgh.  That's a serious rush and well coordinated defense for a rook to play in their house.

[NewColtsFan]

4 hours ago, DougDew said:

 

 

Dude, you literally engaged me in this thread by making it about me.  

 

I'm the guy who says Ballard is responsible for the draft picks.  Unlike some who blame Frank........or blame elves for the 2017 draft (is that you?)

 

God's honest truth.  I have never ever clicked on Colts.com to look at anything Colts related...in my life.  I have this forum bookmarked and I have no reason to care about who works in the FO...other than the GM.

 

As far as the topic.  I believe running QBs need to learn to pass well in order for their teams to succeed in the NFL.  That would be the basis of any criticism of AR....and its sincere.  Also, my observation about Levis in college was that he was excitable and prone to be Wentz 2.0.   So each had their flaws that put them behind Stroud in my eyes and made me indifferent as to who the draft pick was.  Both need work.

 

But, btw, Levis looked impressively un-Wentz like under stress for the most part in his two games.  That's a sincere assessment.

 

Dude….  I made it about you because you were talking about AR and it was my view that your view would be better if people knew you were not a AR fan.  Now you’re trying to insist that you are.   I simply tried to remind you what you’ve said in the past and now you’re saying this doesn’t add up for you because of how you approach this website.    
 

I don’t know why you felt the need to tell me about Levis, we’ve never mentioned his name in any exchange.   But you did.   So we’ve gotten no where fast. 

[AKB]

theoretically this thread might go for years