MNF- Bills vs Pats

ViriLudant · November 24, 2015

Well I'm sure the guys whose jobs it's been to interpret the rules would say you were wrong as well. Kickoff and punt returners go backwards all the time.

The guys whose jobs are to interpret those rules say that he gave himself up. Both the head judge and the line judge .

dw49 · November 24, 2015

Bottom line, you and Pereria are incorrect imo.

1) He caught the ball,
2) And subsequently intentionally went out of bounds, and sadly for him he did so backwards. Rules are rules.

Textbook Rule 7, sec.2 art. 1, subpart (e).

As a side note, I really do not appreciate your comments. I spend time drafting my posts so folks can understand more the rule in question. In the future, I would appreciate you leave such comments to yourself. Thank you.

To you and yours that don't understand why it's a bad call , here's what Peria was trying to say when he said it's malarkey ...Also we understand that you are an attorney but you really don't know more than Mike Pereria about NFL officiating . Let's not be ridiculous here.

Steratore says Watkins “gave himself up” on final play

Posted by Mike Florio on November 24, 2015, 9:24 AM EST

Getty Images

Thanks to last night’s inadvertent whistle at Gillette Stadium, another potentially significant officiating gaffe has received far less attention.

It came on what turned out to be the last play of regulation, with the Bills down by seven and trying to get in position for a last-ditch, Hail Mary heave to the end zone. It appeared they’d get it, with quarterback Tyrod Taylorcompleting a 16-yard pass to receiver Sammy Watkins, who hit the deck and rolled out of bounds at the Buffalo 48, apparently with two seconds on the clock.

But then an official did the arm-crank thing, keeping the clock running and ending the game.

It was, from ESPN’s perspective, another poorly-discussed, late-game snafu, with Mike Tirico pointing out the curiosity before the broadcast ended, but with no explanation from Gerry Austin or anyone else regarding why it was or wasn’t the appropriate decision to end the game.

Afterward, referee Gene Steratore addressed the decision to keep the clock running through the rarely-seen creature known as a “pool report.”

“What we had as far as the last play with Buffalo’s reception was that the receiver gave himself up voluntarily in the field of play,” Steratore said. “When that occurs and we deem that the runner, which he would have been after he maintained possession after his reception, he was now a runner, had given himself up in the field of play. Then fact that he scoots out of bounds is not as important. We wound the clock. It was a judgment call by that head linesman that he felt like he gave himself up in the field of play. It’s not a reviewable play. So winding the clock or stopping the clock is not something we review. So, in his judgment, he deemed that the runner gave himself up in the field of play voluntarily, which does put him down by contact in the field, so he wound [the clock].”

Steratore’s explanation makes sense, as long as the circumstances of the play are ignored. Watkins wasn’t “giving himself up”; he was trying to get out of bounds before being touched. Without the time to stand up and step over the white line, he did the best he could to get out of the field of play.

While it may have been a “judgment call” by the official, the end result reflected poorly-formulated judgment. Which means that this is the kind of call that should be reviewable for a clear error in the exercise of that judgment.

And not through a five-minute, product-placement, dog-and-pony show. This is precisely the kind of situation where an official calling the game in real time from a box above the field should have the power to buzz Steratore and say, “Your guy screwed up. Fix it. Now.”

Until the NFL embraces such fundamental changes to the way a game is officiated, the divide between the folks at home who know what happened and the people in black-and-white stripes who don’t will only get wider and wider.

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ViriLudant · November 24, 2015

Well I'm sure the guys whose jobs it's been to interpret the rules would say you were wrong as well. Kickoff and punt returners go backwards all the time.

Except the moment they go down, they're giving themselves up. Just like Watkins.

ViriLudant · November 24, 2015

To you and yours that don't understand why it's a bad call , here's what Peria was trying to say when he said it's malarkey ...Also we understand that you are an attorney but you really don't know more than Mike Pereria about NFL officiating . Let's not be ridiculous here.
Steratore says Watkins “gave himself up” on final play
Posted by Mike Florio on November 24, 2015, 9:24 AM EST
Getty Images
Thanks to last night’s inadvertent whistle at Gillette Stadium, another potentially significant officiating gaffe has received far less attention.
It came on what turned out to be the last play of regulation, with the Bills down by seven and trying to get in position for a last-ditch, Hail Mary heave to the end zone. It appeared they’d get it, with quarterback Tyrod Taylorcompleting a 16-yard pass to receiver Sammy Watkins, who hit the deck and rolled out of bounds at the Buffalo 48, apparently with two seconds on the clock.
But then an official did the arm-crank thing, keeping the clock running and ending the game.
It was, from ESPN’s perspective, another poorly-discussed, late-game snafu, with Mike Tirico pointing out the curiosity before the broadcast ended, but with no explanation from Gerry Austin or anyone else regarding why it was or wasn’t the appropriate decision to end the game.
Afterward, referee Gene Steratore addressed the decision to keep the clock running through the rarely-seen creature known as a “pool report.”
“What we had as far as the last play with Buffalo’s reception was that the receiver gave himself up voluntarily in the field of play,” Steratore said. “When that occurs and we deem that the runner, which he would have been after he maintained possession after his reception, he was now a runner, had given himself up in the field of play. Then fact that he scoots out of bounds is not as important. We wound the clock. It was a judgment call by that head linesman that he felt like he gave himself up in the field of play. It’s not a reviewable play. So winding the clock or stopping the clock is not something we review. So, in his judgment, he deemed that the runner gave himself up in the field of play voluntarily, which does put him down by contact in the field, so he wound [the clock].”
Steratore’s explanation makes sense, as long as the circumstances of the play are ignored. Watkins wasn’t “giving himself up”; he was trying to get out of bounds before being touched. Without the time to stand up and step over the white line, he did the best he could to get out of the field of play.
While it may have been a “judgment call” by the official, the end result reflected poorly-formulated judgment. Which means that this is the kind of call that should be reviewable for a clear error in the exercise of that judgment.
And not through a five-minute, product-placement, dog-and-pony show. This is precisely the kind of situation where an official calling the game in real time from a box above the field should have the power to buzz Steratore and say, “Your guy screwed up. Fix it. Now.”
Until the NFL embraces such fundamental changes to the way a game is officiated, the divide between the folks at home who know what happened and the people in black-and-white stripes who don’t will only get wider and wider.
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So NOW Florio is a good source?

Even though he says that Brady is innocent?

You are inconsistent when it comes to Florio.

Yehoodi · November 24, 2015

You said his butt landed in bounds so he was down. That isn't the rule, this isn't college ball. You aren't down until someone touches you down or you surrender by taking a knee or sliding.

Taking a knee and sliding are separate acts from what I am discussing, and also find themselves as separates acts in the rule with sliding being in subpart (d) and kneeling in subpart (e).

Separate from these two items is the one that I am talking about, and does not require a slide or knee to be effectuated by the player, and is a separate and third act.

All one needs, in the opinion of the ref, is the following:

1) declaring himself down by going to the ground, and

2) making no effort to advance the ball.

Item (1) is covered by his actions to go out of bounds (which he did not accomplish prior to first landing in the field of play)

Item (2) is covered by his actions of not going forward.

This portion of the rule does NOT require a slide or knee, or any kind of fair catch signal or surrender signal sent in the direction of the ref. Bottom line he caught the ball and went to the ground in a effort to kill the play by trying to get out of bounds, before the clock when to 0:00. So his actions was to down himself. That my find colt friend is an action that is text book declaring yourself down.

dw49 · November 24, 2015

So NOW Florio is a good source?
Even though he says that Brady is innocent?
You are inconsistent when it comes to Florio.

http://deadspin.com/report-bad-call-at-end-of-patriots-bills-game-was-beca-1744420521?sidebar_promotions_icons=testingoff&utm_expid=66866090-67.e9PWeE2DSnKObFD7vNEoqg.1&utm_referrer=http%3A%2F%2Fdeadspin.com%2Freport-bad-call-at-end-of-patriots-bills-game-was-beca-1744420521

jvan1973 · November 24, 2015

Grannie already referenced it, not me.
Or are you unfamiliar with that well known infamous event?
Wouldn't surprise me.

I knew what you were talking about, but as the norm, you only report part of the story. Topical. Don't you have some more terrible threads to start with inaccurate info?

dw49 · November 24, 2015

Taking a knee and sliding are separate acts from what I am discussing, and also find themselves as separates acts in the rule with sliding being in subpart (d) and kneeling in subpart (e).

Separate from these two items is the one that I am talking about, and does not require a slide or knee to be effectuated by the player, and is a separate and third act.

All one needs, in the opinion of the ref, is the following:

1) declaring himself down by going to the ground, and
2) making no effort to advance the ball.

Item (1) is covered by his actions to go out of bounds (which he did not accomplish prior to first landing in the field of play)
Item (2) is covered by his actions of not going forward.

This portion of the rule does NOT require a slide or knee, or any kind of fair catch signal or surrender signal sent in the direction of the ref. Bottom line he caught the ball and went to the ground in a effort to kill the play by trying to get out of bounds, before the clock when to 0:00. So his actions was to down himself. That my find colt friend is an action that is text book declaring yourself down.

You are so full of yourself. There are about 10 explanations of that call available on the internet. Every one of them ridicules that call. It by no means a "rule" as you state. Ignorer for what you say to be correct. staying that Mile Periera doesn't know the correct ruling on that and you do is laughable. The guy served as vice president of officiating for the NFL. At best this is a judgement call that rather than just a blown call.

dw49 · November 24, 2015

Bottom line, you and Pereria are incorrect imo.

1) He caught the ball,
2) And subsequently intentionally went out of bounds, and sadly for him he did so backwards. Rules are rules.

Textbook Rule 7, sec.2 art. 1, subpart (e).

As a side note, I really do not appreciate your comments. I spend time drafting my posts so folks can understand more the rule in question. In the future, I would appreciate you leave such comments to yourself. Thank you.

Another former NFL official.

I mean your kidding .. right ? There are about 20 sources on the internet that discuss that play and not one states it's "NFL Rule" as you do.

Jim Daopoulos @RefereeJimD

If a player is trying to get out of bounds and goes sideways., backwards or forward at that point in game....you stop the clock!

9:09 PM - 23 Nov 2015

dw49 · November 25, 2015

Bottom line, you and Pereria are incorrect imo.

1) He caught the ball,
2) And subsequently intentionally went out of bounds, and sadly for him he did so backwards. Rules are rules.

Textbook Rule 7, sec.2 art. 1, subpart (e).

As a side note, I really do not appreciate your comments. I spend time drafting my posts so folks can understand more the rule in question. In the future, I would appreciate you leave such comments to yourself. Thank you.

Here ya go.. if you search this on the internet ... heres what you find. There isn't any source that appears to think you and that dumbo that made the call was going by rule.

WATCH: Sammy Watkins Ruled in Bounds to End Game vs. Patriots

Heavy.com‎ - 19 hours ago

Monday night's contest between the Bills and Patriots ended with a ... Watch the play. ... Taylor connected with Sammy Watkins, who got out of bounds with two seconds left.

Officiating mistakes hurt Patriots early, Bills at the end

Yahoo Sports‎ - 18 hours ago

Did the refs cost the Bills an extra play at the end of 'Monday Night Football'?

SB Nation‎ - 18 hours ago

More news for wakins out of bounds play at end of bills pat game

Did the refs cost the Bills an extra play at the end of 'Monday ...

www.sbnation.com/.../did-the-refs-cost-the-bills-an-extra-play-...

SB Nation

18 hours ago - The Bills went out of bounds with two seconds left. ... The Buffalo Billsneeded one score to tie the New England Patriots. ... Sammy Watkins caught a pass inbounds and fell backwards ... But the referee over the play eventually ran in windmilling his arm, restarting the clock and essentially ending the game.

Referees in Bills-Patriots Monday Night Football game were ...

www.buffalorumblings.com/bills...notes/.../bills-patriots-mnf-referees-bl...

10 hours ago - Both the Patriots and the Bills were the victims of terrible calls by referees ... falling backwards out of bounds, untouched, to try to stop the clock. The referees ruled that Watkins "gave himself up" on the play, even though he was ... and the Bills should have been given one more play at the end of the game.

Officiating mistakes hurt Patriots early, Bills at the end ...

sports.yahoo.com/.../officiating-mistakes-on-inadvertent-w...

Yahoo! Sports

18 hours ago - What would a Monday night NFL game, or a New England Patriots ... But the whistle had blown so play stopped. ... On the final play, Bills receiver Sammy Watkins caught a pass and got out of bounds before he was touched.

Officials finish awful Bills-Patriots game with questionable ...

www.sportingnews.com/.../4661958-bills-patriots-bad-offi...

Sporting News

19 hours ago - Bills vs. Patriots highlights. Loading video. PLAY. 0. 5:33. 5:33 5:33 / 5:33 ... Bills receiver Sammy Watkins caught the ball and rolled out of bounds near midfield with ... The officials, however, ruled him to be still in bounds, and the final seconds ticked off. ... Not a good end of the game for the head linesman.

Steratore says Watkins “gave himself up” on final play ...

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/.../steratore-says-watki...

Profootballtalk.com

10 hours ago - It came on what turned out to be the last play of regulation, with the ... receiver Sammy Watkins, who hit the deck and rolled out of bounds ... why it was or wasn't the appropriate decision to end the game. .... Bills did not play well enough on offense to win , but but this was certainly a clinic in poor officiating .

How the Buffalo Bills were robbed on 'Monday Night Football'

ftw.usatoday.com/.../buffalo-bills-patriots-robbed-sammy-wa...

USA Today

9 hours ago - Sammy Watkins was never touched and rolled out of bounds, they should ... Bills wide receiver Sammy Watkins catching one of those late-game sideline ... determined Watkins had given himself up on the field of play, like a ...

Bills vs. Patriots - Game Recap - November 23, 2015 - ESPN

espn.go.com/nfl/recap?gameId=400791717

18 hours ago - Tom Brady extends mastery of Bills as Patriots move to 10-0 ... refereeing blunder , with Sammy Watkins crawling out of bounds untouched near midfield but ... As the receiver broke for the end zone, the play was whistled dead ...

Report: Bad Call At End Of Patriots-Bills Game Was ...

deadspin.com/report-bad-call-at-end-of-patriots-bills-game-was...

Deadspin

6 hours ago - Report: Bad Call At End Of Patriots-Bills Game Was Because Official Forgot ... Here's the play, a pass to Sammy Watkins that saw the Buffalo receiver roll backward toward the sideline in an attempt to get out of bounds to stop ...

Patriots-Bills Live Blog: Pats Now 10-0 After 20-13 Win Over ...

boston.cbslocal.com/.../patriots-bills-monday-night-football-live-bl...

WBZ

21 hours ago - Watkins got a knee and his elbow down before rolling out of bounds, ... The next play, Taylor scrambled for three yards, a first down and stopped the clock. ... End 3rd Quarter — Patriots 20, Bills 10: The third quarter comes to an ... He had been doing a lot of talking throughout the game, mostly aimed at No.

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buffalo34 · November 25, 2015

Hilarious. .
I'm starting to really like you.
Diamond earrings, eh? I'm going to have to look for those.

I didn't want to use skirt, because that's just cliché at this point. I wanted to use the women's clothing that is generally worn under skirts, but didn't know if it would fly here, lol

-JJ- · November 25, 2015

A lot of sour grapes in this thread. People can argue about any little thing, I swear. It was a good game, and I know no one here believes the Bills were actually gonna do anything with two seconds on the clock, blown call or not.

yeah right. Seems most just don't enjoy football games for what they are.

6-3 and it's too boring. Too many points on one side- still boring or said team is running up the score. Players ask for flags, they're crybabies (particularly one specific QB..hmm) - even though all receivers, defenders, and QBs do as they should. That's what you do in sports.

REFS? LOL - that's over half the conversation of games. Not like anyone can change it. More wine please

Pure football discussion is a rarity and a dying breed. With all internet fans. Not so much face to face fans. hmm...think that tells something.

dw49 · November 25, 2015

A lot of sour grapes in this thread. People can argue about any little thing, I swear. It was a good game, and I know no one here believes the Bills were actually gonna do anything with two seconds on the clock, blown call or not.

If you mean me , I'm not at all sour grapes. It just annoys me that a certain poster comes on with these monster post that are often wrong and a bit condescending . I've posted from the former VP of officiating , other officials and numerous other sources that say at best this was a bad judgement call that that official may have had a right to make. He still is sticking by his bad post with that "i'm smarter than you" demeanor .

As for the play and the game , it meant nothing . IMO not even a 1% chance the Bills score with the one more play they should have had. The officiating in no way cost the Bills that game. Furthermore , it's better for my team that the bills lost. It's still possible that the Colts could lose the division and get 1 of the 2 wild cards. So better for teams like the Bills , Jets and Steelers lose. Not that I could really "root" for the Pats but I was at least "neutral " on that game. The officiating play I was upset at was the one that was blown dead. It cost my son and I around 3500 in fan draft.

Gramz · November 25, 2015

This thread has been very entertaining.

Laughter is so good for the soul...

Grannie's gonna clean this place up. haha

dw49 · November 25, 2015

This thread has been very entertaining.

Laughter is so good for the soul...

Grannie's gonna clean this place up.

Maybe you could ask VirLudant over for a possum dinner ?

bluebombers87 · November 25, 2015

Except the moment they go down, they're giving themselves up. Just like Watkins.

At this point I'm starting to think you're doing this on purpose. No way can someone ignore the facts like you've been. Of course considering the audience I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

Tom Brady could say the sky is green and his legion would be on here showing scientific studies done by "wicked smaht guys from all these science type places" proving the sky is in fact green. All the while commenting how lovely the green sky is.

Superman · November 25, 2015

As for the play and the game , it meant nothing . IMO not even a 1% chance the Bills score with the one more play they should have had. The officiating in no way cost the Bills that game.

Right. Taylor could hardly even hold his arm up, let alone throw it into the end zone. Maybe they would have brought in Manuel, but we're talking about a true Hail Mary. I would think probability would place the Bills' odds at less than 1%, like you said. Never say never, but pretty much, the game was over.

I'm not even remotely upset about the decision to run the clock. The end of that game was excruciating. However, it was the wrong call. Watkins was NOT giving himself up, if you're willing to apply even a little bit of logic to the situation. He was clearly trying to get out of bounds without being touched. He was already on the ground as a part of making the catch. There's just NO WAY he was trying to give himself up, and that's a really stupid conclusion to reach, both live and with the benefit of hindsight.

This is the same official that ruled Watkins 4th down catch as incomplete earlier in the drive. Maybe he was cold and just wanted the game to end. But maybe he needs to see his eye doctor. And maybe he just sucks as an official.

dw49 · November 25, 2015

Right. Taylor could hardly even hold his arm up, let alone throw it into the end zone. Maybe they would have brought in Manuel, but we're talking about a true Hail Mary. I would think probability would place the Bills' odds at less than 1%, like you said. Never say never, but pretty much, the game was over.

I'm not even remotely upset about the decision to run the clock. The end of that game was excruciating. However, it was the wrong call. Watkins was NOT giving himself up, if you're willing to apply even a little bit of logic to the situation. He was clearly trying to get out of bounds without being touched. He was already on the ground as a part of making the catch. There's just NO WAY he was trying to give himself up, and that's a really stupid conclusion to reach, both live and with the benefit of hindsight.

This is the same official that ruled Watkins 4th down catch as incomplete earlier in the drive. Maybe he was cold and just wanted the game to end. But maybe he needs to see his eye doctor. And maybe he just sucks as an official.

For sure and that was Periera's point when he ridiculed the call. I think where they can keep the clock moving is if the receiver is moving backward and is shoved out of bounds by a defender .. no?

And yes it probably does suck. But almost all sports other than bowling and golf are often too much effected by a bad call. I've seen so many times in baseball where a missed ball or strike changes an AB and turns the whole game around. It's just part of sports nd always will be. Unless of coarse you want to just turn it all over to technology.

Superman · November 25, 2015

For sure and that was Periera's point when he ridiculed the call. I think where they can keep the clock moving is if the receiver is moving backward and is shoved out of bounds by a defender .. no?

And yes it probably does suck. But almost all sports other than bowling and golf are often too much effected by a bad call. I've seen so many times in baseball where a missed ball or strike changes an AB and turns the whole game around. It's just part of sports nd always will be. Unless of coarse you want to just turn it all over to technology.

Yeah, stopping forward progress only happens if he's engaged with a defender. I can run backwards and out of bounds in that situation, and the ball is placed at the spot where I ran out of bounds, so I don't get my forward progress, but that's not the same as ending the play because I ran backwards.

Even if he got pushed out of bounds when he was running backward, they'll only call forward progress if he's still engaged with the defender and his forward progress is actually stopped. If he subsequently goes out of bounds, the play stops because he went out of bounds, not because his forward progress stops.

If he's on the ground, it's different. But it's all irrelevant because he was never engaged with a defender, so his forward progress never stopped. The play stopped when he went out of bounds, and there was still time left on the clock.

Qwiz · November 25, 2015

yeah right. Seems most just don't enjoy football games for what they are.
6-3 and it's too boring. Too many points on one side- still boring or said team is running up the score. Players ask for flags, they're crybabies (particularly one specific QB..hmm) - even though all receivers, defenders, and QBs do as they should. That's what you do in sports.
REFS? LOL - that's over half the conversation of games. Not like anyone can change it. More wine please
Pure football discussion is a rarity and a dying breed. With all internet fans. Not so much face to face fans. hmm...think that tells something.

Yep. Whenever ones team is doing bad or a team they don't like is doing well, then the season is boring or not as good as others. Ay caramba. I'm just enjoying the season while it's here. Spring is too long.

bluebombers87 · November 25, 2015

Yep. Whenever ones team is doing bad or a team they don't like is doing well, then the season is boring or not as good as others. Ay caramba. I'm just enjoying the season while it's here. Spring is too long.

You always have the option to not involve yourself in these conversations.

Qwiz · November 25, 2015

If you mean me , I'm not at all sour grapes. It just annoys me that a certain poster comes on with these monster post that are often wrong and a bit condescending . I've posted from the former VP of officiating , other officials and numerous other sources that say at best this was a bad judgement call that that official may have had a right to make. He still is sticking by his bad post with that "i'm smarter than you" demeanor .
As for the play and the game , it meant nothing . IMO not even a 1% chance the Bills score with the one more play they should have had. The officiating in no way cost the Bills that game. Furthermore , it's better for my team that the bills lost. It's still possible that the Colts could lose the division and get 1 of the 2 wild cards. So better for teams like the Bills , Jets and Steelers lose. Not that I could really "root" for the Pats but I was at least "neutral " on that game. The officiating play I was upset at was the one that was blown dead. It cost my son and I around 3500 in fan draft.

No, I wasn't referring to you in particular. It just seems like people like the Bills fan among others live to pick apart every single game and play the Patriots make. I get hating a team, but it's borderline obsessive to post about them and how lucky they get ad nauseam. Every team gets lucky every now and then. But this is a Colts forum and I do get the reactions. I just think arguing about a call like the Watkins one is kind of silly is all.

bluebombers87 · November 25, 2015

yeah right. Seems most just don't enjoy football games for what they are.
6-3 and it's too boring. Too many points on one side- still boring or said team is running up the score. Players ask for flags, they're crybabies (particularly one specific QB..hmm) - even though all receivers, defenders, and QBs do as they should. That's what you do in sports.
REFS? LOL - that's over half the conversation of games. Not like anyone can change it. More wine please
Pure football discussion is a rarity and a dying breed. With all internet fans. Not so much face to face fans. hmm...think that tells something.

To the flags part; one QB has made a name for himself for yelling at refs (including running after one to yell). Is he the first to do it? Of course not but he's Tom Brady and this is a Colts message board. Gonna have to deal with it.

NFLfan · November 25, 2015

Yeah, I remember. 18-1. Eli-ed in the Super Bowl. Here's hoping they get Cam-ed this year. 18-1, again? A distinct possibility.

I would rather they lose earlier in the playoffs.

Qwiz · November 25, 2015

You always have the option to not involve yourself in these conversations.

And I don't. I'm merely pointing out how petty some people can be.

NFLfan · November 25, 2015

So now I'm Grannie...???

That post by him is enough to have his posting privileges revoked. That is unacceptable.

bluebombers87 · November 25, 2015

That post by him is enough to have his posting privileges revoked. That is unacceptable.

I was under the impression her nickname was an allusion to her street dealing days. Gotta admit that would be a pretty sweet street name.

Gramz · November 25, 2015

That post by him is enough to have his posting privileges revoked. That is unacceptable.

I actually got a kick out of it. Seriously, havn't laughed so hard in a while. It tickled me. haha

He said it was an autocorrect on his phone. It happens.

Gramz · November 25, 2015

I was under the impression her nickname was an allusion to her street dealing days. Gotta admit that would be a pretty sweet street name.

oh my.... this is even funnier. haha No my "nickname" was given to me by my grandkids.

bluebombers87 · November 25, 2015

And I don't. I'm merely pointing out how petty some people can be.

Probably more fickle than petty.

My pointing out possible grammar issues would probably be considered petty.

NFLfan · November 25, 2015

I actually got a kick out of it. Seriously, havn't laughed so hard in a while. It tickled me.
He said it was an autocorrect on his phone. It happens.

I don't believe him.

You are a valued member here. That was disrespectful... Glad you can laugh about it.

Superman · November 25, 2015

You don't know that he would have been. White caught a 2 yard pass in the flat and broke a sure tackle for a TD.

The point is that the defender would have continued playing defense. Sucks for the Pats in that case, but the rule on inadvertent whistles is there because no one knows what actually would have happened.

Yehoodi · November 25, 2015

Well I'm sure the guys whose jobs it's been to interpret the rules would say you were wrong as well. Kickoff and punt returners go backwards all the time.

I covered the second part of your post in my post #142. I would kindly ask you to refer to that post for my response.

As for those whose job it is to interpret the rules, I did a little Google search after dinner and found that head Ref Gene Steratore stated that the WR gave himself up prior to going out of bounds and did so and landed inbounds. So the persons who job it is to interpret the rules in question on the night in question interpreted them in a manner consistent with what I have been saying since last night.

-JJ- · November 25, 2015

To the flags part; one QB has made a name for himself for yelling at refs (including running after one to yell). Is he the first to do it? Of course not but he's Tom Brady and this is a Colts message board. Gonna have to deal with it.

deal with it? haha It doesn't even bother me. I just pointed out actual football discussions, strategies etc. lack, not just here but everywhere on the internet and as I said, face to face not remotely. Go figure.

I know the play you refer to and that spiraled into "all the time". typical.

Well Manning "very often" threw his hands up looking for a flag from the refs. Did that bother me? Nope. It's what you're supposed to do. You don't just stand there and take it. lol. When a player yells at the refs in any sport they're going to get one going there way. That's how it works. deal with it.

bluebombers87 · November 25, 2015

I covered the second part of your post in my post #142. I would kindly ask you to refer to that post for my response.
As for those whose job it is to interpret the rules, I did a little Google search after dinner and found that head Ref Gene Steratore stated that the WR gave himself up prior to going out of bounds and did so and landed inbounds. So the persons who job it is to interpret the rules in question on the night in question interpreted them in a manner consistent with what I have been saying since last night.

Oh you mean the same ref who tried to say Watkins 4th down catch earlier in the drive was incomplete?

Because refs never get it wrong. The consensus is that he got it wrong from people (Mike P.) who really do know a lot (more than you).

bluebombers87 · November 25, 2015

deal with it? It doesn't even bother me. I just pointed out actual football discussions, strategies etc. lack, not just here but everywhere on the internet and as I said, face to face not remotely. Go figure.
I know the play you refer to and that spiraled into "all the time". typical.
Well Manning "very often" threw his hands up looking for a flag from the refs. Did that bother me? Nope. It's what you're supposed to do. You don't just stand there and take it. lol. When a player yells at the refs in any sport they're going to get one going there way. That's how it works. deal with it.

Think you might have taken that the wrong way.

And if you honestly think the perception that Brady yells at the ref doesn't exist then I don't know what to say. That one incident that spiraled off I'm pretty sure I specifically said it was one time. And that I agreed he's not the first to do it, meaning I understand that players yell at refs. Brady is just known for it. A Google search would tell you that. Even the huffington post (the bastion of sportswriter that it is) has an article about him yelling at refs.

So keep calm and football on.

Surge89 · November 25, 2015

Bottom line, you and Pereria are incorrect imo.
1) He caught the ball,
2) And subsequently intentionally went out of bounds, and sadly for him he did so backwards. Rules are rules.
Textbook Rule 7, sec.2 art. 1, subpart (e).
As a side note, I really do not appreciate your comments. I spend time drafting my posts so folks can understand more the rule in question. In the future, I would appreciate you leave such comments to yourself. Thank you.

lmao this is hilarious. And I read you are a lawyer which is just more flavoring. I love how you take what you infer as law.

So basically your whole argument is that the ref was absolutely right because he went by the letter of the law. But the letter of the law says "advances" the ball or at least what you posted. Advancing the ball is moving it. Has nothing to do with moving it up field that is just what you infer. So no by the letter of the law you put he "advanced" the ball out of bounds.

Lol. But I don't know why I'm even commenting in response to you 2. Both of you just ignore posts when it gets to a point where there's no argument and then go right back to your right and everyone is just hating lol. Deflate-gate thread all over again.

our_dbs_rock · November 25, 2015

Except the moment they go down, they're giving themselves up. Just like Watkins.

No, learn the rules. Going to the ground is not giving themselves up. If that is the case, how many plays should have been called back over the years from receivers going to the ground untouched and then getting up to advance the ball.

Cynjin · November 25, 2015

Brady telling his teammates to work harder is "dumping in them?"
Someone certainly did not play competitive sports..
Oh, and

Oh I played several competitive sports, but that has nothing to do with the point I was making, which you completely and unsurprisingly missed.

ColtRider · November 25, 2015

I would rather they lose earlier in the playoffs.

(Reference : New England Patriots)

Touche' ... and au revoir!

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