Did Pats Make a Mistake Paying Gronk all those millions?

[Qwiz]

That explains why I'm indifferent towards the Texans ;)

Not for long

[Colts_Fan12]

Sigh...lol

Not shaking the opponents coaches hand disrespectful bill has done not playing the pro bowl cause you crying about losing in the playoffs many pats players do disrespectful cheating that's just low

[Qwiz]

Not shaking the opponents coaches hand disrespectful bill has done not playing the pro bowl cause you crying about losing in the playoffs many pats players do disrespectful cheating that's just low

I'll have to look up the alleged handshaking but I remember quite a few here overreacting because Bill didn't want a camera in his face after an embarassing playoff loss. I also recall plenty of fans saying how worthless the Pro Bowl is as well. What if the Patriots think the same? Besides, they aren't particularly known for doing extracurricular activities, be it the Pro Bowl or going out to parties and dragging attention to themselves. Just my theory on the matter lol.

[Colts_Fan12]

I'll have to look up the alleged handshaking but I remember quite a few here overreacting because Bill didn't want a camera in his face after an embarassing playoff loss. I also recall plenty of fans saying how worthless the Pro Bowl is as well. What if the Patriots think the same? Besides, they aren't particularly known for doing extracurricular activities, be it the Pro Bowl or going out to parties and dragging attention to themselves.

Who cares if its worthless your fans voted for you to go so represent your team and fans if your hurt fine if not go play don't cry like Brady does after a loss and just skip cause its not convenient for him

[Qwiz]

Who cares if its worthless your fans voted for you to go so represent your team and fans if your hurt fine if not go play don't cry like Brady does after a loss and just skip cause its not convenient for him

You just said it yourself. If you're hurt don't go. Hurt isn't just physical. Brady is the ultimate competitor and I'm sure the Pro Bowl is the last thing on his mind after a loss. Besides, if the fans voted for Brady to dance and sing in a ballet should he have to do that too, just to appease us? Lol.

[Colts_Fan12]

You just said it yourself. If you're hurt don't go. Hurt isn't just physical. Brady is the ultimate competitor and I'm sure the Pro Bowl is the last thing on his mind after a loss. Besides, if the fans voted for Brady to dance and sing in a ballet should he have to do that too, just to appease us? Lol.

A hurt ego is not and injury Brady is good but he is a child

And if he can't play cause of a hurt ego then don't let ppl vote for him take him off the ballot

[Qwiz]

A hurt ego is not and injury Brady is good but he is a child

Whose saying it is ego? How do you know Brady isn't genuinely hurt after every playoff loss? I don't think its childish not wanting to mingle with opponents and risk injury in a pointless game. It's like all the hugging and kissing between "rivals" after NBA and NFL games and joking and laughing after you just lost. Some guys aren't down with being friendly like that so soon, and I'm glad some like to keep it old school.

[House]

No such thing as running up the score. The offense is paid to score and the defense is paid to stop them. Not the offense's fault if the defense isn't earning their money...

There is such a thing as running up the score, but its also as you say D gotta come up with a stop.

But I run up the score on my best friend in Madden all the time. Trust me it exists lol.

[Qwiz]

There is such a thing as running up the score, but its also as you say D gotta come up with a stop.

But I run up the score on my best friend in Madden all the time. Trust me it exists lol.

on Madden I agree. You're rubbing it in your friend's face on Madden and showing him how much better you are. Kind of like a brotherly rivalry. Same with other video games. I'm usually the victim of this treatment, so I too know it exists

[House]

on Madden I agree. You're rubbing it in your friend's face on Madden and showing him how much better you are. Kind of like a brotherly rivalry. Same with other video games. I'm usually the victim of this treatment, so I too know it exists

My best friend, I don't have any brothers but for all purposes he's blood to me, served one tour in Afghanistan and one in Iraq.

You have never seen a guy gone through so much major stuff, totally lose it when we play game lol. We yell and cuss at each other. So much fun

[Qwiz]

My best friend, I don't have any brothers but for all purposes he's blood to me, served one tour in Afghanistan and one in Iraq.

You have never seen a guy gone through so much major stuff, totally lose it when we play game lol. We yell and cuss at each other. So much fun

Hahaha yep...video games can be the perfect escape from real life, just like football. I don't have any brothers either, but gradually grew one in high school after we met freshman year lol. Now it's time to ship that no-football-watching sister off somewhere

[southwest1]

Look, Gronk is a great TE who has had a bout of bad luck. Is he brittle or injury prone? Sometimes, bones just break in a peculiar way, need to be reset, & complications arise. It's too soon to make that call just yet. When a guy is supremely talented on the field, you wanna lock him up & secure his services. The kid is a workout warrior, a gym rat, & he loves football. I'm not ready to cut him loose yet. He's big, he's tall, & he has a nose for catching the ball.

 

My approach: Stay in the holding pattern & ride it out. Brighter days are ahead for Gronk in NE. We are not talking Bob Sanders injury territory here over a prolonged period yet. 

[southwest1]

This has been something I have been meaning to post for awhile but I think the Pats may have made a huge mistake signing Gronk to that huge contract last year. The guy had injury issues in college and now has missed significant time this past season coupled with his ankle injury two seasons ago costing the Pats a chance at another ring. He seems like he is not that committed to his off-season work program which may be why he keeps getting dinged up.

 

I really wish they went and got a legit big boy on the outside like a Julio Jones and not a TE. I think this one may really cost them down the line.

 

Thoughts?

I respect your analysis amfootball, but I disagree with you on what I bolded. I get what you're saying....Part of winning championships means not acting foolish, childish, & dumb resulting in a devastating team injury & Tom Brady can't depend on Gronk to help win vital games down the stretch of a season. I get it. Look, I've said before that a veteran like Vince Wilfork needs to sit down & have a heart to heart conversation with him. But, I would be cautious about claiming that his injuries display a cavalier attitude toward winning a franchise Championship.

 

Are these dancing bear injury acts kind of stupid? Yes. But, that's part of every NFL locker room. You have your adereline junkies, your lady chasers, your complete professionals, & your class clowns. You can instill discipline without killing Gronk's fun loving spirit. It depends who delivers the Championship message & how they deliver it.  

[Flying Elvis]

No, nobody would be saying that you should've had Gronkowski out there. Because you shouldn't have.

If you're saying Gronk should not be on special teams, you may have an argument but if you're saying he should have been substituted for then there is no argument. No team has backups for special teams. They have emergency replacements in case of injury but they don't practice for it.

[southwest1]

The Vince Wilfork conversation should go something like this. Vince Wilfork calls Gronk on his cell phone.

VW: Gronk, can we meet tonight? What's your favorite resteraunt in town I'm buying BTW.

G: Sure. What's this about?

VW: Team direction & priorities...

G: Sounds mysterious...Are we cool?

VW: Just need to clear the air on a few things...See you at 7 & don't be late please. Thanks...

The 2 meet & sit down...

VW: Okay, no more beating around the push. I like your relaxed, jovial carefree spirit & there is a time to let your hair down & celebrate...When we hoist a Lombardi Trophy above our heads not before. Do you have any idea what NFL immortality feels like Gronk? You've been to the Big Dance before, but you haven't won it yet. I'm not getting any younger & neither is Tom Brady & our window of opportunity to win another title is...Lets just say that we aren't exactly young rookie pups anymore & neither are you. I'm busting my caboose out there on defense to get Tom the ball back & if I do that in enough games we might get to the AFC Championship Game. The Pats need all hands on deck & we have each others back. But if you keep goofing around & getting hurt....You cost your NE brothers a Championship...I'm not trying to scold you like a disobedient child just make you see how rare SB appearances are & when we get there I expect to win. Now, if you aren't on the field you jepordize [spelling] a confetti drop in our favor & that really upsets me. Does that upset you?

G: Look, I hate losing SBs too & I didn't intentionally try to hurt myself.

WV: At this point in my career, I'm going be selfish & say so what Gronk. Part of becoming an adult & an NFL professional means no late nights drinking & partying with your brothers. Go home, get a good night's rest, & stay heathy. Don't put yourself in situations that makes the possibility of an injury more likely to happen. I love your class clown persona but this is business. This is your job. Hades it's my job too. I practice what I preach & follow my own advice. If we win another Championship, display your clown mystique in all it's splendid glory. I will welcome that. I don't expect you to be a saint but I do expect common sense. Look before you leap & think before you act. That's all I ask brother. Thanks man.

G: I appreciate your honesty & you have given me a lot to think about.

VW: I'm here for you man. I'm only saying this because I see the greatness in you & I don't want to see it wasted. You're too darn talented for that. We need you at full strength man.

[southwest1]

Maybe Gronk needs a Patriots mentor on & off the field. Some guys are great football players, but sadly they always seem to find unwarranted distractions. Not an indictment against Gronk per say; Some guys just have distractions & bad decisions stick to them like glue.

I have a relative like that. Trouble always seems to follow or accompany him. He's not a bad person; He just can't stay quiet & content for very long...Sigh...A checkered past doesn't equate to a discarded future in my book.

That's the beauty of growing up with a physical disability...It teaches you the importance of patience, redemption, determination, & how short sighted & blind some people truly are simply because they are too lazy to get off their caboose & do something constructive/productive to fix the situation or improve it.

[amfootball]

My issue with Gronk is not his ability or even his injures perse but that fact that in the off-season after having TWO surgeries on his forearm, he was videotaped at a club body slamming another man about his size. I mean that has dumb written all over it. And of course just weeks later the media reports he has a staph infection. I question the guys off-season program as what a player does in the off-season is key to his ability to staying healthy for 16 games and the playoffs. Just this past week it was reported that Aaron Hernandez has changed his workout routine for the expressed purpose of staying healthy during the season, http://www.yardbarker.com/nfl/articles/aaron_hernandez_trains_with_tom_brady_changes_regimen_to_try_to_get_through_16_games_this_season/13373416

 

This is the type of committment I am looking for from Gronk. I agree players need to have downtime and like to party but I think he and his brothers are taking it to another level. I mean he is in discussions right now about getting his own reality TV show, http://www.yardbarker.com/nfl/articles/report_rob_gronkowski_in_talks_with_talent_agency_to_develop_tv_show_with_family/11298880?linksrc=home_rg_discuss_11298880

 

He is fast becoming like Chad Ochocinco and turning into a clown. This may end up being a terrible signing for the Pats in the long term.

[amfootball]

A hurt ego is not and injury Brady is good but he is a child

And if he can't play cause of a hurt ego then don't let ppl vote for him take him off the ballot

Right because Brady is the only one that does not go to the pro bowl. They were in discussions just this year about cancelling the game altogether because players are injured at the end of the season and completely spent and the game is an unnecessary risk for injury. A terrible example all around.

[Colts_Fan12]

Right because Brady is the only one that does not go to the pro bowl. They were in discussions just this year about cancelling the game altogether because players are injured at the end of the season and completely spent and the game is an unnecessary risk for injury. A terrible example all around.

No Brady's the one that's hasn't gone to multiple pro bowls and idc if its worthless to you maybe the ppl vote for him want to see him maybe he is there favorite and the injury thing is dumb it's not like its a rough game it never has been its fun to play with fellow players the D isn't going to kill him in the pro bowl but who knows maybe its a good thing he don't go or he would just try to take the D out with his ninja kick to the groin

And the talk of stopping it was cause its not as competitive as Goodell wants it to be

[Valpo2004]

so does being disrespectful and unsportsmanlike

 

And video taping opponents signals.  

 

Pat's are 0 - 2 in the SB after they got caught doing that.  

[Colts_Fan12]

And video taping opponents signals.

Pat's are 0 - 2 in the SB after they got caught doing that.

I agree with you I can't stand them lol but there are alot of pats fans here on the colts forum who don't agree I'll agree they cheat ill always believe it

[Yehoodi]

I don't get wat you are trying to say I just mean if the pats are up big in the 4th take the starters out but they don't they just lay it on teams like AZ BUF NYJ in the past just sayin my point is just they have been known to run the score up on teams and that causes more football fans to strongly dislike the pats there have been quite a few times the pats have been very unsportsmanlike

 

What I was saying was "what do you mean by your words 'running up the score'"? . . . translation = what do you define as running up the score and show me examples . . . otherwise it is just a lot of hot air and references to media who are worst than hot air . . . but if your definition is what I think it is, which is a team that is up big late in the game and has their starters in playing the game, then EVERYBODY does it, not just the Pats, which what people who cry about, but those people are applying double standards to the words "running up the score" . . . if a team is up by 28 points in the 4th qtr, and are they are defined as running up the score, than one must use this SAME standard when applying it to others teams, and not have an agenda and use a double standard towards a single team, the pats . . .

 

If you where to decide on a yard stick to measure the point of no return in which a team should pulled its starters in your opinion, and you define this, and then use it consistently across the NFL and blind to the color of the teams jeresy, you will find any yard stick you pick to define the Pats running up the score in games, will apply to 2012 Broncos, 2012 Ravens, 2004 Colts, the Giants, the Packers and the Saints to name a few . . .  

 

So it doesn't matter to me how you defined the pats or what you come to a conclusion as for running up the score, if you want to define the pats as running up the score, then you must do the same with the teams mentioned in the last paragraph . . . for me the few possession in which these teams had their starters is not running up the score in my opinion . . . your opnion might differ which is fine, but I for one am consistent in my analysis of all of the teams . . . that is all . . .

 

I find that 90% of these discussions end when you ask one to come up with a figure and ask people what they define as running up the score and lets apply it to others teams and the other person knows he cant as he would equally be incriminating many others teams and end up not wanting to get into the discussion . .. perhaps you will be different . . .   

[Valpo2004]

I agree with you I can't stand them lol but there are alot of pats fans here on the colts forum who don't agree I'll agree they cheat ill always believe it

 

I don't know if they cheat now, I don't have evidence of such.  But the evidence seems to indicate that they cheated up until the point they where caught which means IMO they won their 4 SB's through cheating.

 

So in terms of legit, non cheating SB's they have won precisely 0.  2 time AFC champs though. . . Good job.   

[Colts_Fan12]

What I was saying was "what do you mean by your words 'running up the score'"? . . . translation = what do you define as running up the score and show me examples . . . otherwise it is just a lot of hot air and references to media who are worst than hot air . . . but if your definition is what I think it is, which is a team that is up big late in the game and has their starters in playing the game, then EVERYBODY does it, not just the Pats, which what people who cry about, but those people are applying double standards to the words "running up the score" . . . if a team is up by 28 points in the 4th qtr, and are they are defined as running up the score, than one must use this SAME standard when applying it to others teams, and not have an agenda and use a double standard towards a single team, the pats . . .

If you where to decide on a yard stick to measure the point of no return in which a team should pulled its starters in your opinion, and you define this, and then use it consistently across the NFL and blind to the color of the teams jeresy, you will find any yard stick you pick to define the Pats running up the score in games, will apply to 2012 Broncos, 2012 Ravens, 2004 Colts, the Giants, the Packers and the Saints to name a few . . .

So it doesn't matter to me how you defined the pats or what you come to a conclusion as for running up the score, if you want to define the pats as running up the score, then you must do the same with the teams mentioned in the last paragraph . . . for me the few possession in which these teams had their starters is not running up the score in my opinion . . . your opnion might differ which is fine, but I for one am consistent in my analysis of all of the teams . . . that is all . . .

I find that 90% of these discussions end when you ask one to come up with a figure and ask people what they define as running up the score and lets apply it to others teams and the other person knows he cant as he would equally be incriminating many others teams and end up not wanting to get into the discussion . .. perhaps you will be different . . .

My point is just when the pats are playing say AZ or BUF in the past they would be destroying them but in the 4th they are still hammering them with there starters when other teams would be giving the backups reps like say Flynn in GB or Foles in PHI the steelers have pulled starters the colts have as well that's my point about running up the score you may disagree with me that's fine I don't mind

[Colts_Fan12]

I don't know if they cheat now, I don't have evidence of such. But the evidence seems to indicate that they cheated up until the point they where caught which means IMO they won their 4 SB's through cheating.

So in terms of legit, non cheating SB's they have won precisely 0. 2 time AFC champs though. . . Good job.

I agree nothing says they do now but as I've said before there SB are tainted

Lol but the pats fans don't like me cause I put Brady down I agree he is good wont take that away but he has no manhood he is a girl lol

[southwest1]

My issue with Gronk is not his ability or even his injures perse but that fact that in the off-season after having TWO surgeries on his forearm, he was videotaped at a club body slamming another man about his size. I mean that has dumb written all over it.

 

He is fast becoming like Chad Ochocinco and turning into a clown. This may end up being a terrible signing for the Pats in the long term.

I understand what you are saying amfootball, but comparing WR Chad Johnson to Gronk is not an entirely accurate comparison. Why? Because Chad was a model citizen who toned down his comedic antics and he was too simple minded to grasp both the sophistication of NE's playbook & his multiple responsibilities as a WR. Clearly, Gronk grasps the playbook & he can execute plays on the field. Otherwise, the front office wouldn't have offered Gronk such a large contract. Plus, contracts are always written in such a way to release the franchise of fiscal commitment if necessary. There is no way around guaranteed though. 

 

You can bet that both HC Bill Belichick & owner Robert Kraft have had a private conversation with him about distractions off the field & spreading his concentration too thin. 

[Valpo2004]

I agree nothing says they do now but as I've said before there SB are tainted

Lol but the pats fans don't like me cause I put Brady down I agree he is good wont take that away but he has no manhood he is a girl lol

 

Meh I'm not worried about how much of a man Tom Brady is.  But I think the whole basis of their dynasty is tainted by spygate which makes one wonder if they win all those games without spygate.  

[Colts_Fan12]

Meh I'm not worried about how much of a man Tom Brady is. But I think the whole basis of their dynasty is tainted by spygate which makes one wonder if they win all those games without spygate.

They aren't a dynasty in my eyes if they win all the SBs without SPYGATE then yeah they are but with SPYGATE no way are they a dynasty to me

[Fx Stryker]

Is Hernandez hurt too?

[amfootball]

I understand what you are saying amfootball, but comparing WR Chad Johnson to Gronk is not an entirely accurate comparison. Why? Because Chad was a model citizen who toned down his comedic antics and he was too simple minded to grasp both the sophistication of NE's playbook & his multiple responsibilities as a WR. Clearly, Gronk grasps the playbook & he can execute plays on the field. Otherwise, the front office wouldn't have offered Gronk such a large contract. Plus, contracts are always written in such a way to release the franchise of fiscal commitment if necessary. There is no way around guaranteed though. 

 

You can bet that both HC Bill Belichick & owner Robert Kraft have had a private conversation with him about distractions off the field & spreading his concentration too thin. 

Yes, I have no issue with Gronk on field. But off-field, huge concerns. Chad is the only other football that came to mind that had his own reality show and he did not do that until toward the end of his career. Gronk seems to like the show and the attention and it has become a distraction. If he goes ahead with this reality show, I really hope the Pats cut him. He will be a complete joke. Imagine after one great year doing a reality show?

[amfootball]

They aren't a dynasty in my eyes if they win all the SBs without SPYGATE then yeah they are but with SPYGATE no way are they a dynasty to me

You want a cookie?

[amfootball]

I agree nothing says they do now but as I've said before there SB are tainted

Lol but the pats fans don't like me cause I put Brady down I agree he is good wont take that away but he has no manhood he is a girl lol

Maybe two cookies?

[Colts_Fan12]

Maybe two cookies?

We can have our opinions aswell just like you even if you agree or not I was talking with valpo but you can have an opinion all you want no reason to be rude did we quote you and say they aren't a dynasty I don't think so your free to join in with your opinion but its just pointless if your just gonna be cocky

[southwest1]

They aren't a dynasty in my eyes if they win all the SBs without SPYGATE then yeah they are but with SPYGATE no way are they a dynasty to me

You are absolutely entitled to you opinion CF12, but the Patriots won 3 SBs=a dynasty & no conclusive evidence has stripped that franchise of their multiple Lombardi trophies. Suspicious activity does not qualify as definitive proof.

And how come no one ever asks Eric Mangini what his true motives behind mentioning spygate were & whether or not it was worth the backlash in the longrun? What's better? To burn bridges or napalm rivers?

[amfootball]

We can have our opinions aswell just like you even if you agree or not I was talking with valpo but you can have an opinion all you want no reason to be rude did we quote you and say they aren't a dynasty I don't think so your free to join in with your opinion but its just pointless if your just gonna be cocky

Pats dyansty? That was what you were discussing? The post I read you called Brady a girl. Not sure what that has to do with pats being a dynasty...

[amfootball]

You are absolutely entitled to you opinion CF12, but the Patriots won 3 SBs=a dynasty & no conclusive evidence has stripped that franchise of their multiple Lombardi trophies. Suspicious activity does not qualify as definitive proof.

And how come no one ever asks Eric Mangini what his true motives behind mentioning spygate were & whether or not it was worth the backlash in the longrun? What's better? To burn bridges or napalm rivers?

Mangini has said on Boston sports radio here that he regretted the whole spygate saga and he never imagined that it would blow up into the mega story it became. He also said he continueds to work on his relationship with Belichick. Hoping that one day it will be restored. Probably unikely. The ironic thing is he was there during the spygate years so it tarnishes his resume too.

[southwest1]

Mangini has said on Boston sports radio here that he regretted the whole spygate saga and he never imagined that it would blow up into the mega story it became. He also said he continueds to work on his relationship with Belichick. Hoping that one day it will be restored. Probably unikely. The ironic thing is he was there during the spygate years so it tarnishes his resume too.

Please tell me Eric Mangini is not that dumb. That's like your best friend is off serving in Afghanistan & you have intimate relations with his wife while he is gone & he finds out. There is no reset button & some things can never be forgotten or forgiven. Bill gave Eric his 1st NFL job. Without Bill, there is no NY Jets job, no Cleveland Browns job, no ESPN job, & no SB rings. Some fences can never be mended; nor should they be IMO. I'd never bury that hatchet ever & I'm a very forgiving person. Here's an extra pitch fork Eric...Feel that heat sizzle...HaHaHa!  

[ViriLudant]

He's the best TE in football.

The broken arm was a freak accident.

So yes, he's worth the contract.

[amfootball]

He's the best TE in football.

The broken arm was a freak accident.

So yes, he's worth the contract.

He was not close to being the best TE last year. He is still rehabbing that same arm and has a reality show in the works...

[ViriLudant]

I don't know if they cheat now, I don't have evidence of such.  But the evidence seems to indicate that they cheated up until the point they where caught which means IMO they won their 4 SB's through cheating.

 

So in terms of legit, non cheating SB's they have won precisely 0.  2 time AFC champs though. . . Good job.

Yet your own coach and your own GM have stated plainly for all to see that the Patriots did not cheat.

But hey, apparently you know more than both Polian and Dungy.