Vontae Davis

[trueblueblood]

Sorry if there's been another topic like this, but I've been thinking a lot about our secondary, particularly Davis. I know he was average to above average for the first part of the season, but towards the end, this guy played lights. Out. It seemed like he was in on every tackle, flying around, constantly stopping runners and receivers in the backfield or for very little gain. Not to mention his int's (should have had 3 in one game!) He played like a top 5 cb those last couple games, which was when it really mattered because we were making a playoff push. As for the rest of our secondary, I'm going to go out on a limb and say we are one more good cb away from being the best secondary in football. You have two pro bowl safeties in laron Landry and Antoine bethea, Greg toler, who, I'm hearing, is a more than serviceable cb, and Darius butler, who made a lot of plays for us last year (I loved that we resigned him. Great move.) now just the guys we have now makes for a very good secondary. But if we were to draft a guy like Xavier Rhodes or johnathan banks in the first round... We would possibly have the best secondary in the nfl. But I guess the best question is, should we draft a safety just in cAse we don't get bethea signed next year or Landry or bethea get injured this season? Either way, adding another first round talent to the secondary would be magical.

[schwamm]

The Colts might need to have one of the best secondaries in football... if Walden heralds a shift from pass pressure to run stopping, and he is as bad as some (or Nobody) say... that might significantly increase the pressure on that secondary to make up the difference.

I'm game for grabbing another solid CB, and a solid OLB to groom, in case Walden busts.

[Gavin]

The Safety class is pretty deep this year in my opinion, you could draft a Safety in the 6th round or 7th and come away with a very good one who could develop into a very solid starter if we parted with Bethea soon (Which I have my doubts we do)

 

1.Robert Lester(4th round potential option, we pick at bottom of the 4th)

2.Jordan Kovacs(4th round potential option)

3.Brandan Bishop(extremely underrated in my opinion, 7th round to undrafted)

4.Ray Ray Armstrong (could go higher depending on teams view his growth in maturity or lack of it)

5.Bradley Mcdougald(4th round potential option)

6.Cooper Taylor(7th round potential option)

7.Duke Williams (4th round potential option)

8.Baccari Rambo(4th round potential option and in my opinion would be an absolute steal if he fell to us here)

 

 

Just my opinion

 

Also, Rhodes in the 1st or Tharold Simon at bottom of 3rd or DJ Hayden at bottom of the 3rd would be good in my book or Sheldon Price at bottom of 4th 

[coltsfanatic24]

I would draft a CB over a safety Toler and Davis were hurt for some of last year.

[Insert Colts Pun Here]

The Safety class is pretty deep this year in my opinion, you could draft a Safety in the 6th round or 7th and come away with a very good one who could develop into a very solid starter if we parted with Bethea soon (Which I have my doubts we do)

 

1.Robert Lester(4th round potential option, we pick at bottom of the 4th)

2.Jordan Kovacs(4th round potential option)

3.Brandan Bishop(extremely underrated in my opinion, 7th round to undrafted)

4.Ray Ray Armstrong (could go higher depending on teams view his growth in maturity or lack of it)

5.Bradley Mcdougald(4th round potential option)

6.Cooper Taylor(7th round potential option)

7.Duke Williams (4th round potential option)

8.Baccari Rambo(4th round potential option and in my opinion would be an absolute steal if he fell to us here)

 

 

Just my opinion

 

Also, Rhodes in the 1st or Tharold Simon at bottom of 3rd or DJ Hayden at bottom of the 3rd would be good in my book or Sheldon Price at bottom of 4th 

I'm with you. Draft a CB in the first or third and a safety late on.

[Narcosys]

And here it is again. A topic started one way and turned into a draft topic. But this time it turned in the opening post!!

[In Luck We Trust]

The Colts might need to have one of the best secondaries in football... if Walden heralds a shift from pass pressure to run stopping, and he is as bad as some (or Nobody) say... that might significantly increase the pressure on that secondary to make up the difference.

I'm game for grabbing another solid CB, and a solid OLB to groom, in case Walden busts.

Arthur Brown with our 24th pick. OLB from KState.

[TKnight24]

Vontae is the Man. It's only 2 guys on this team who's last name or 1st name starts with a V that's actually good

*slowly walks away*

[inviolable]

I would love to draft Rhodes, he is huge and his wing span is ridiculous, but I don't think he will make it to us. I wouldn't mind taking Banks but I think there will be a better player on the board at 24 than him. I suspect Grigson is going for BPA this year. My dream scenario is if Rhodes is gone then we trade down, grab Banks and Barrett Jones then Baccari Rambo later.

[Warhorse]

The Colts might need to have one of the best secondaries in football... if Walden heralds a shift from pass pressure to run stopping, and he is as bad as some (or Nobody) say... that might significantly increase the pressure on that secondary to make up the difference.

I'm game for grabbing another solid CB, and a solid OLB to groom, in case Walden busts.

Like has been mentioned in may other threads...Colt fans in particular seemed to be so trained to key sacks and pressures as the way you define nearly any defensive position, that opinions can be somewhat misinformed. There really is no way to say how Walden will do until we see him behind this D-line, in this scheme, and beside our own LB corp.

 

Dwight Freeney was heralded when BP selected him as "too small" to effectively stop the run from an every down DE position and was said to have been chosen too high and paid too much money for what he was being asked to do. On some levels...they were right. But he was still highly effective and a game changer with the rest of the pieces.

[lollygagger8]

I think we draft Cyprien if he falls to #24. If not, we'll draft a CB.

 

I love Bethea, but his time here might be numbered unfortunately since he is a Na'Polian era find 

 

Plus we'll need somebody waiting if Landy doesn't stay heathy <- which I wouldn't bet all my chips on.

[IAColtsFan]

Vontae is the Man. It's only 2 guys on this team who's last name or 1st name starts with a V that's actually good

*slowly walks away*

 

So is it Vick Ballard or Adam Vinatieri that's the second guy?? 

[TKnight24]

So is it Vick Ballard or Adam Vinatieri that's the second guy??

Ahh, I forgot about old Vinny.

Okay, 3 out of 4 are good.

Four: Vick, Vinny, Vontae, Vaughn

Three who are good: Vick, Vontae, & Vinny

[TKnight24]

I think we draft Cyprien if he falls to #24. If not, we'll draft a CB.

I love Bethea, but his time here might be numbered unfortunately since he is a Na'Polian era find

Plus we'll need somebody waiting if Landy doesn't stay heathy <- which I wouldn't bet all my chips on.

Once again, Landry's only injury came on the Skins. Played all 16 & made the pro bowl last year

[lollygagger8]

Once again, Landry's only injury came on the Skins. Played all 16 & made the pro bowl last year

 

I hope he stays healthy too.....definitely not trying to jinx him.

 

 

Maybe it's the whole Glass Sanders thing in the back of my mind.

[TKnight24]

I hope he stays healthy too.....definitely not trying to jinx him.

Maybe it's the whole Glass Sanders thing in the back of my mind.

Sanders was a RB height hitting guys 6'0+ . Landry's body is actually fit for him to be a big hitter. And the difference is Landry wraps up majority of the time & is a bit more "disciplined" with his tackles. And with Pagano teaching him now, even more discipline is going to happen

[Kenny]

Sanders was a RB height hitting guys 6'0+ . Landry's body is actually fit for him to be a big hitter. And the difference is Landry wraps up majority of the time & is a bit more "disciplined" with his tackles. And with Pagano teaching him now, even more discipline is going to happen

 

 

This. Sanders BODY itself wasn't fit for his style of play. Landry is taller and a little more disciplined in his tackling. Plus an achilles injury does not make a man injury prone.

[will426]

This. Sanders BODY itself wasn't fit for his style of play. Landry is taller and a little more disciplined in his tackling. Plus an achilles injury does not make a man injury prone.

I agree but landry does not really wrap which is why he was described as "hit or miss" by others. I think he'll be healthy. though shouldn't call him injury prone since the skins field isn't very ideal for playing just ask rg3.

[GoodLuck]

I remember thinking Vontae was going to be Revis good after watching him his rookie yr. I just hope he continues to work and don't go back to the Vontae during preseason of last yr.

[Kenny]

I agree but landry does not really wrap which is why he was described as "hit or miss" by others. I think he'll be healthy. though shouldn't call him injury prone since the skins field isn't very ideal for playing just ask rg3.

 

True but he will wrap up more than Sanders who pretty much never did .

[TKnight24]

I agree but landry does not really wrap which is why he was described as "hit or miss" by others. I think he'll be healthy. though shouldn't call him injury prone since the skins field isn't very ideal for playing just ask rg3.

That play where he speared that Cowboys WR was an example of how hard his wrap up hits are

[Insert Colts Pun Here]

I would love to draft Rhodes, he is huge and his wing span is ridiculous, but I don't think he will make it to us. I wouldn't mind taking Banks but I think there will be a better player on the board at 24 than him. I suspect Grigson is going for BPA this year. My dream scenario is if Rhodes is gone then we trade down, grab Banks and Barrett Jones then Baccari Rambo later.

This.

[Insert Colts Pun Here]

I think we draft Cyprien if he falls to #24. If not, we'll draft a CB.

 

I love Bethea, but his time here might be numbered unfortunately since he is a Na'Polian era find 

 

Plus we'll need somebody waiting if Landy doesn't stay heathy <- which I wouldn't bet all my chips on.

Why does that matter?

He's still a quality player. Grigson isn't going to get rid of him just because Polian drafted him.

[Superman]

Like has been mentioned in may other threads...Colt fans in particular seemed to be so trained to key sacks and pressures as the way you define nearly any defensive position, that opinions can be somewhat misinformed. There really is no way to say how Walden will do until we see him behind this D-line, in this scheme, and beside our own LB corp.

 

Dwight Freeney was heralded when BP selected him as "too small" to effectively stop the run from an every down DE position and was said to have been chosen too high and paid too much money for what he was being asked to do. On some levels...they were right. But he was still highly effective and a game changer with the rest of the pieces.

 

To add to that, I think it's sad that some Colts fans can't fathom having a defense that's good at stopping the run and pressuring the quarterback at the same time. It's like we're conditioned to think that you have to sacrifice one in order to gain the other. That's a myth. We can be both good against the run and good at rushing the passer. Adding a guy like Walden who is better against the run than he is at pass rushing isn't an indication that the coaches aren't going to prioritize pass rushing.

[lollygagger8]

Why does that matter?

He's still a quality player. Grigson isn't going to get rid of him just because Polian drafted him.

 

I think he's good too, but Grigs has no ties to him.....thus making it easier to cut him. It's a business.

[Superman]

I think he's good too, but Grigs has no ties to him.....thus making it easier to cut him. It's a business.

 

Bethea will be a free agent. No need to cut him. Unless he has a really strong season, I doubt we franchise him, but it's a possibility, given the relatively low cost of tagging a safety.

 

You're right, it is a business. And I would hope that Grigson is just as quick to move on from one of his own draftees as he would be from Polian's. Those decisions should be made based on how the player is performing, not the "ties" or attachment the GM has to the player because he drafted him.

[Insert Colts Pun Here]

I think he's good too, but Grigs has no ties to him.....thus making it easier to cut him. It's a business.

I think that statement is contradictory. If it's a business, like you say, then "ties" to players don't matter and Grigson could cut a player that he drafted just as easily as he could any other. Right?

[mvbighead]

I think we draft Cyprien if he falls to #24. If not, we'll draft a CB.

 

I love Bethea, but his time here might be numbered unfortunately since he is a Na'Polian era find 

 

Plus we'll need somebody waiting if Landy doesn't stay heathy <- which I wouldn't bet all my chips on.

 

I have a problem with this idea.  We have Bethea and Landry.  While Landry may be a risk for injury, his starting spot is without question given the money he is being paid.

 

CB, on the other hand, outside of Davis and perhaps Toler, has 2-3 scrubs fighting for nickel and potential backup CB.  Butler is the leader of the group, but he is by no means a lock to remain with the team for more than the two seasons he is signed for.

 

All that said, I could see us take a corner in round 1 to eventually replace Toler and pair with Davis.  He can fight for the nickel/dime back position now, and be given quite a few more opportunities to contribute.  If we draft for a our secondary, I'd like to see corner earlier than safety.  All that said, I think we can find a solid safety later in the draft.

 

One safety who could be there well later in the draft is Damian Stafford.  He was one of the Huskers better players this past year, and he's dropped a bit in the draft due to the lack of any real studs in NU.

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2013/profiles/daimion-stafford?id=2539266

 

I'd like to think he could be found in the 6th or 7th.  http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1824332

 

All that said, i think he could contribute as a backup S and on ST.  He does have a nose for the ball, and could be a roamer like Landry.

[GabbertHeartsBlackmon]

Sorry if there's been another topic like this, but I've been thinking a lot about our secondary, particularly Davis. I know he was average to above average for the first part of the season, but towards the end, this guy played lights. Out. It seemed like he was in on every tackle, flying around, constantly stopping runners and receivers in the backfield or for very little gain. Not to mention his int's (should have had 3 in one game!) He played like a top 5 cb those last couple games, which was when it really mattered because we were making a playoff push. As for the rest of our secondary, I'm going to go out on a limb and say we are one more good cb away from being the best secondary in football. You have two pro bowl safeties in laron Landry and Antoine bethea, Greg toler, who, I'm hearing, is a more than serviceable cb, and Darius butler, who made a lot of plays for us last year (I loved that we resigned him. Great move.) now just the guys we have now makes for a very good secondary. But if we were to draft a guy like Xavier Rhodes or johnathan banks in the first round... We would possibly have the best secondary in the nfl. But I guess the best question is, should we draft a safety just in cAse we don't get bethea signed next year or Landry or bethea get injured this season? Either way, adding another first round talent to the secondary w

You must not know about that Seahawks secondary. Even if we get Rhodes, and he turns out to be great, we still can't match up to... Sherman, earl, chancellor, and browner.

[adfisher870]

Vontae was going into a brand new system he was going to have some growing pains and with chuck back in full force i expect him to have that secondary as one of the best. I wouldnt be apposed to drafting rhodes or cyprien in the 1st rd if they are available but I would like it more if they picked up an o-lineman(is god willing warmack or cooper fall or even moving fluker into a rg spot would be nice.)

I remember thinking Vontae was going to be Revis good after watching him his rookie yr. I just hope he continues to work and don't go back to the Vontae during preseason of last yr.

[Qwiz]

You must not know about that Seahawks secondary. Even if we get Rhodes, and he turns out to be great, we still can't match up to... Sherman, earl, chancellor, and browner.

Yeah, I think about the Seahawks and the 49ers when it comes to best secondaries in the NFL.

[Tracy Denton]

The Safety class is pretty deep this year in my opinion, you could draft a Safety in the 6th round or 7th and come away with a very good one who could develop into a very solid starter if we parted with Bethea soon (Which I have my doubts we do)

 

1.Robert Lester(4th round potential option, we pick at bottom of the 4th)

2.Jordan Kovacs(4th round potential option)

3.Brandan Bishop(extremely underrated in my opinion, 7th round to undrafted)

4.Ray Ray Armstrong (could go higher depending on teams view his growth in maturity or lack of it)

5.Bradley Mcdougald(4th round potential option)

6.Cooper Taylor(7th round potential option)

7.Duke Williams (4th round potential option)

8.Baccari Rambo(4th round potential option and in my opinion would be an absolute steal if he fell to us here)

 

 

Just my opinion

 

Also, Rhodes in the 1st or Tharold Simon at bottom of 3rd or DJ Hayden at bottom of the 3rd would be good in my book or Sheldon Price at bottom of 4th

I agree, No need to use our first pick on a safety, Bethea himself was a 6th round pick. We still have Lefeged and Larry Asante under contract, I think Asante might be another cast away/under the radar gem that Grigson has found. But, If the BPA at #24 happens to be a safety, I wouldn't be upset with it but I doubt that will happen.

[ALuck>RG3]

Yeah, I think about the Seahawks and the 49ers when it comes to best secondaries in the NFL.

9ers secondary is not the best in the league. At least not anymore. They lost goldson which may not be too bad but their cbs were abused in the playoffs.

[Qwiz]

9ers secondary is not the best in the league. At least not anymore. They lost goldson which may not be too bad but their cbs were abused in the playoffs.

Goldson will be easily replaced and they just signed Asomugha. Plus they are loaded in the Draft.

[Dustin]

Goldson will be easily replaced and they just signed Asomugha. Plus they are loaded in the Draft.

 

He's been pretty terrible the past few years. Like, really bad.

[Qwiz]

He's been pretty terrible the past few years. Like, really bad.

Nothing Harbaugh can't fix.

[trueblueblood]

You must not know about that Seahawks secondary. Even if we get Rhodes, and he turns out to be great, we still can't match up to... Sherman, earl, chancellor, and browner.

Thank you

[TKnight24]

Nothing Harbaugh can't fix.

Not even so much Harbaugh "fixing" it. Nnamdi is a man to man CB. All that zone he ran in PHI is what made him bad. Watch he goes to SF and becomes the Shutdown CB he was back in OAK.

Man I hate the 49ers . It should be illegal for all that talent to be on the same team!!

[Dustin]

Not even so much Harbaugh "fixing" it. Nnamdi is a man to man CB. All that zone he ran in PHI is what made him bad. Watch he goes to SF and becomes the Shutdown CB he was back in OAK.

Man I hate the 49ers . It should be illegal for all that talent to be on the same team!!

 

That's actually a common mis-conception. Nnamdi actually played man coverage 54.5% of the time. 4th highest in the league.

[Qwiz]

Not even so much Harbaugh "fixing" it. Nnamdi is a man to man CB. All that zone he ran in PHI is what made him bad. Watch he goes to SF and becomes the Shutdown CB he was back in OAK.

Man I hate the 49ers . It should be illegal for all that talent to be on the same team!!

I know right. They're like an NBA team