Rank QB's / Elite QB's (merge)

[Thewholefnshow28]

Where is Bradford?

 

Whoops.  I would put Bradford under the hmmm section.  The guy looked pretty solid at times this season and the Rams have failed miserably to get him any help on the outside.  The fact he has not been attrocious with the lack of help makes you think he can at least be a solid QB. 

[Superman]

Whoops.  I would put Bradford under the hmmm section.  The guy looked pretty solid at times this season and the Rams have failed miserably to get him any help on the outside.  The fact he has not been attrocious with the lack of help makes you think he can at least be a solid QB. 

 

Our lists are very, very similar. I have a couple more categories than you, specifically separating Newton and Bradford from the other young guys. But we're pretty well on the same wavelength.

[ColtsBlueFL]

I think the word "elite" is well defined. I just think some people -- particularly John Clayton -- are ignoring the meaning of the word.

 

And again with the "as many road playoff games as he's won" argument. When Clayton made that comment two years ago, Flacco was a passenger on the Ravens Express, including the 4/10, 34 yards and one pick game, on the road, to beat the Patriots. Flacco didn't win that game, and it's bogus that he gets credit for winning it.

 

You are free to disagree and even give a veiled backhand of his stance to John, but I'd like to point out, Mr. Clayton was is renowned in his industry and he has knowledge and credentials to back him.  His opinion and choices carries weight and affects the NFL and Hall of Fame inductees directly, as he has an MVP vote.  I'm sure other writers listen to his reasoning, which is sure to be more substantial than the soundbytes he's asked to provide, when they are at their HOF selection meetings too. We who discuss this here are just bloviating at best and whining at worst.  It doesn't affect anything, just taking a position.  We can do that.  But I take those that have shown to be a cut above by relevant peers in their industry a little more seriously.

 

I'd point out he saw things in Flacco even back then that he never elaborated on and are just now becoming apparent now.  Flacco's last two years have been major strides forward, and with Cameron gone and a new contract (or franchise tag) in place, he will be asked to deliver the goods with Caldwell's help.  It would gather that unless Flacco fails epically, he might have his first HOF supporter on board already.

 

But should I begin to research the clunkers Peyton and Brady have suffered through the years to show that even the all time greats have to be carried now and again?

[Superman]

You are free to disagree and even give a veiled backhand of his stance to John, but I'd like to point out, Mr. Clayton was is renowned in his industry and he has knowledge and credentials to back him.  His opinion and choices carries weight and affects the NFL and Hall of Fame inductees directly, as he has an MVP vote.  I'm sure other writers listen to his reasoning, which is sure to be more substantial than the soundbytes he's asked to provide, when they are at their HOF selection meetings too. We who discuss this here are just bloviating at best and whining at worst.  It doesn't affect anything, just taking a position.  We can do that.  But I take those that have shown to be a cut above by relevant peers in their industry a little more seriously.

 

I'd point out he saw things in Flacco even back then that he never elaborated on and are just now becoming apparent now.  Flacco's last two years have been major strides forward, and with Cameron gone and a new contract (or franchise tag) in place, he will be asked to deliver the goods with Caldwell's help.  It would gather that unless Flacco fails epically, he might have his first HOF supporter on board already.

 

But should I begin to research the clunkers Peyton and Brady have suffered through the years to show that even the all time greats have to be carried now and again?

 

Well, pardon me while I bloviate (I was wondering what that smell was...)

 

I'm not trying to discredit John Clayton; he is who is, and he does what he does. (It's not like he's never been wrong before; like everyone else, he picked the Colts to finish last in the division in 2012.) But this is the primary topic on which his peers disagree with him most vocally. And it's not specific to Flacco. He includes guys like Matt Schaub among the elite. Does Matt Schaub meet his "wins in the playoffs" criteria? No, but Matt Schaub threw for almost 4,800 yards a couple years ago, and since then, Clayton calls him "elite."

 

Just because he has a HOF vote doesn't mean he's above reproach in this regard. And my disagreement over Schaub and Flacco or the overly-inclusive nature of Clayton's list of elite quarterbacks has nothing to do with any of these players eventual HOF credentials. We have a long way yet before we need to talk about Flacco and the HOF.

 

As for Peyton and Brady, you'll notice a couple things with them: 1) No one dissents when it comes to their status as "elite" quarterbacks, and no one has over the last six years, and 2) you won't see any playoff wins from their teams in games where they were absolute non-factors (like Flacco in 2009). You and Clayton want to give Flacco credit for wins that he didn't make happen, and I disagree with that.

 

You'll also notice that Brady has more playoffs losses on his record over the past half decade than he did in the first half of his career, but he's absolutely a better quarterback now than he was then. So I absolutely don't care about his playoff record. He and Manning, and Brees and Rodgers, make their teams go. Regular season, playoffs, doesn't matter, they are the catalyst for their team's success. And when the team fails, they get the scrutiny (especially Manning; everyone else seems to get more excuses). In Flacco's case, he deserves credit for leading his team over the course of the last five playoff games -- which includes last season's loss to the Patriots -- but that doesn't undo the previous years of mediocrity.

 

If you and Clayton see elite potential in Flacco, that's a different discussion. But his resume doesn't support this claim of elite status, not yet.

 

All deference to the Professor, but his list of elite quarterbacks is a joke, specifically because he hands out this elite tag like a press credential at the Super Bowl.

[Vance]

Is it an eye-test or Tebow is really missing Your list???

 

Tebow ain't no starting QB.

[HungarianColtsFan]

Tebow ain't no starting QB.

 

And many question he was a QB at all...

[hawkeyes]

I'd take Tebow over many on that list - oh and that would be at QB!!!

[RGIII]

I'd take Tebow over many on that list - oh and that would be at QB!!!

 

You probably wouldn't last very long as a GM.

[ColtsBlueFL]

Well, pardon me while I bloviate (I was wondering what that smell was...)

I'm not trying to discredit John Clayton; he is who is, and he does what he does. (It's not like he's never been wrong before; like everyone else, he picked the Colts to finish last in the division in 2012.) But this is the primary topic on which his peers disagree with him most vocally. And it's not specific to Flacco. He includes guys like Matt Schaub among the elite. Does Matt Schaub meet his "wins in the playoffs" criteria? No, but Matt Schaub threw for almost 4,800 yards a couple years ago, and since then, Clayton calls him "elite."

Just because he has a HOF vote doesn't mean he's above reproach in this regard. And my disagreement over Schaub and Flacco or the overly-inclusive nature of Clayton's list of elite quarterbacks has nothing to do with any of these players eventual HOF credentials. We have a long way yet before we need to talk about Flacco and the HOF.

As for Peyton and Brady, you'll notice a couple things with them: 1) No one dissents when it comes to their status as "elite" quarterbacks, and no one has over the last six years, and 2) you won't see any playoff wins from their teams in games where they were absolute non-factors (like Flacco in 2009). You and Clayton want to give Flacco credit for wins that he didn't make happen, and I disagree with that.

You'll also notice that Brady has more playoffs losses on his record over the past half decade than he did in the first half of his career, but he's absolutely a better quarterback now than he was then. So I absolutely don't care about his playoff record. He and Manning, and Brees and Rodgers, make their teams go. Regular season, playoffs, doesn't matter, they are the catalyst for their team's success. And when the team fails, they get the scrutiny (especially Manning; everyone else seems to get more excuses). In Flacco's case, he deserves credit for leading his team over the course of the last five playoff games -- which includes last season's loss to the Patriots -- but that doesn't undo the previous years of mediocrity.

If you and Clayton see elite potential in Flacco, that's a different discussion. But his resume doesn't support this claim of elite status, not yet.

All deference to the Professor, but his list of elite quarterbacks is a joke, specifically because he hands out this elite tag like a press credential at the Super Bowl.

I'm somewhere between you two. I see both points. Flacco's next 5 years will show if he is truly elite and HOF material or not. Peyton showed he was at that stage, 2003 forward. Flacco's high price tag will drive the OC to demand more of him, and the GM to provide more weapons for him. Then, in time, we shall see where the chips fall, as the vaunted Ravens cap hit D dwindles and their O potentially flourishes and he has to carry them on his back to get the wins that used to be so easy. So where is Flacco in his career about now time line wise, Peyton in 2002? Joe has plenty of time to accrue regular season numbers. But post season isn't even close at their stages in their careers! After 5 years in league-

ATT Comp Yds TD IN W-L

2008

9 23 135 0 0 W
11 22 161 1 0 W
13 30 141 0 3 L


2009

* 410 3401 W (Ray Rice over 150 rushing!)
20 35 189 0 2 L


2010


25 34 265 2 0 W
16 30 125 1 1 L

2011

14 27 176 2 0 W
22 36 306 2 1 L

2012

12 23 282 2 0 W
18 34 331 3 0 W
21 36 240 3 0 W
22 33 287 3 0 W



1999

19 42 227 0 0 L

2000

17 32 194 1 0 L

2002

14 31 137 0 2 L
_________________________________________

So I see that clunker that Ray Rice won that makes you so unhappy. But why pass when Rice is getting 8 yds per carry? Peyton didn't tear up the playoffs the 3 out of the 5 years he got in either. He did the next 5, and this will tell the tale for Flacco, I think he does well for himself. He does have 18 TD's and just 2 picks in the playoffs the last 3 years while going 6-2.  That's pretty elite IMHO.

[hawkeyes]

You probably wouldn't last very long as a GM.

The kid would be in the ProBowl every year.

[Superman]

I'm somewhere between you two. I see both points. Flacco's next 5 years will show if he is truly elite and HOF material or not. Peyton showed he was at that stage, 2003 forward. Flacco's high price tag will drive the OC to demand more of him, and the GM to provide more weapons for him. Then, in time, we shall see where the chips fall, as the vaunted Ravens cap hit D dwindles and their O potentially flourishes and he has to carry them on his back to get the wins that used to be so easy. So where is Flacco in his career about now time line wise, Peyton in 2002? Joe has plenty of time to accrue regular season numbers. But post season isn't even close at their stages in their careers! After 5 years in league-

ATT Comp Yds TD IN W-L

2008

9 23 135 0 0 W

11 22 161 1 0 W

13 30 141 0 3 L

2009

* 410 3401 W (Ray Rice over 150 rushing!)

20 35 189 0 2 L

2010

25 34 265 2 0 W

16 30 125 1 1 L

2011

14 27 176 2 0 W

22 36 306 2 1 L

2012

12 23 282 2 0 W

18 34 331 3 0 W

21 36 240 3 0 W

22 33 287 3 0 W

1999

19 42 227 0 0 L

2000

17 32 194 1 0 L

2002

14 31 137 0 2 L

_________________________________________

So I see that clunker that Ray Rice won that makes you so unhappy. But why pass when Rice is getting 8 yds per carry? Peyton didn't tear up the playoffs the 3 out of the 5 years he got in either. He did the next 5, and this will tell the tale for Flacco, I think he does well for himself. He does have 18 TD's and just 2 picks in the playoffs the last 3 years while going 6-2.  That's pretty elite IMHO.

 

I don't know how else to express that I don't think postseason wins are indicative of a player's status in the league. You keep on comparing these postseason wins and stats, and I keep saying that there's a difference between being on a winning team and being the reason your team wins, especially in the playoffs against the best teams in the league. I think Flacco has mostly been the former; this postseason, he was more of the latter.

 

As for Peyton pre-2003, I think most everyone would have considered him less than elite at that point. He'd still done more statistically than Flacco has so far, and was much more important to his team. But I think the "elite" at that point were Brett Favre and maybe Rich Gannon. Brady and Manning were right behind them, but not quite there yet. Steve McNair and Trent Green, even Daunte Culpepper was in the hierarchy at the time. The year before would have included Kurt Warner. The distinction between the top three or so and the following four or five was much more nebulous then than it is now, but I think Manning was still on his way.

 

The picture began to crystallize a lot more the next season, with Manning winning MVP and finally getting a playoff win, the Pats won another Super Bowl, Trent Green had the Chiefs on a roll, even guys like Culpepper, Jake Plummer and Kerry Collins were on the map. McNabb and Bulger were coming up.

 

And all I'm really saying is that I believe "elite" is more exclusive than you do. Certainly more than Clayton does. I don't know why that matters in Flacco's case; he's obviously good enough, and he's about to get paid at an elite level. I just disagree with that categorization of him.

[Gavin]

Why rank Schaub above Ryan?

Schaub is near identical with Ryan statistically (7 career passing td's less in a balanced offense), Schaub has a better completion percentage and he has not had the type of weapons to pass to, Schaub also has more yards, its not a clear cut better but to me I give the edge to Schaub although not a significant one

[Dustin]

Schaub is near identical with Ryan statistically (7 career passing td's less in a balanced offense), Schaub has a better completion percentage and he has not had the type of weapons to pass to, Schaub also has more yards, its not a clear cut better but to me I give the edge to Schaub although not a significant one

 

Ryan has 7 more passing touchdowns in 40 less career games than Schaub does. He also only has 3,000 less yards. 

 

I'm not sure you can use the "balance" argument against Ryan when has averaged 36.5 passes over the past 3 season compared to 28.2 for Schaub.

 

And I would say that Andre Johnson and Arian foster are comparable weapons to Roddy White, Julio Jones and an aged Tony -G. 

 

Not to mention the defense that Schaub has had over the past two season to alleviate pressure from the offense.

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

Where is Bradford?

 

Posting on CBS

[dw49]

I posted this yesterday in another thread:

 

If you ask John Clayton, there are as many as 13 elite quarterbacks

in the NFL, and that has included Joe Flacco for at least the past two

seasons.

 

As you can tell, I think that's ridiculous. Not just the inclusion of

Flacco, but specifically including almost half the starting

quarterbacks in the NFL in the "elite" category. That word means "the

best of a group or category." To me, there are four guys that are above

the rest: Brady, Brees, P. Manning and Rodgers (alphabetical order ;)). They are the "elite" to me.

 

Then Group 2, in whatever order you want, there's Roethlisberger, Eli

Manning, Ryan, Flacco (after this year's playoffs). I want to include

the young guys in this category, but I think there's still a separation

for now, so my third category specifically is made up of young players

that don't have a long enough resume, but appear to be well on their

way: Luck, Griffin, Wilson and Kaepernick, in whatever order. I'd take

all those young guys in Group 3 ahead of anyone else on this list, even

the next group of good veterans.

 

Group 4 is Schaub, Rivers, Cutler, Romo, Stafford, and Vick, all

veterans with large bodies of work, and they are good, but haven't

proven to be really good, or have consistently come up short.

Their teams sometimes win because they play their role well, not because

of them. Or if the team does rely on them in big situations, they prove

to be limited. Two months ago, Flacco was here.

 

Group 5 is Bradford, Newton and Freeman, young guys with tons of

promise and potential, but still haven't really put it together. Group 6

is limited young guys: Locker, Ponder, Sanchez, Dalton, Gabbert, Foles.

Group 7 is limited veterans: Palmer, Fitzpatrick, Cassel, Kolb, Smith.

Group 8 is young guys that I'm very unsure about: Tannehill, Weeden.

Group 9 is fringe guys and backups.

 

Anyways, I think "elite" is, by definition, very exclusive. It should

be restricted to the very best of the best, and to me, there's a clear

separation between the top four and everyone else. Doesn't mean I

wouldn't take any of those other guys, especially in Groups 2 and 3.

 

 

 

Guess what.... We agree on something. I like your list . As far as Flacco , he could be elite but IMO I can see the argument to leave him just out or just in. I do think there is a bit more to the idea of some QB's playing better in big games than others. That's a long and "brutal" discussion.you can argue all day long on some thing like Manning threw something like 6 TD's and 9 Ints in the 2006 Colt SB and compare that to the numbers Flacco just put up. It's an agruement that IMO is impossible to win. So if you put that aside , it's OK to say Flacco is not elite. If you believe that some QB's are just better than others in big games , then you can make a case for Flacco.

[Qwiz]

Ryan has 7 more passing touchdowns in 40 less career games than Schaub does. He also only has 3,000 less yards. 

 

I'm not sure you can use the "balance" argument against Ryan when has averaged 36.5 passes over the past 3 season compared to 28.2 for Schaub.

 

And I would say that Andre Johnson and Arian foster are comparable weapons to Roddy White, Julio Jones and an aged Tony -G. 

 

Not to mention the defense that Schaub has had over the past two season to alleviate pressure from the offense.

Ha, Schaub wishes he had two more weapons to take the pressure off of AJ. The defense suffered injuries and played poorly not only toward the middle/end of this season but last season as well. Ryan is good but there is no doubt he has more weapons than Schaub does, even though I would still take Johnson over Roddy White.

[Qwiz]

The kid would be in the ProBowl every year.

I'm surprised he wasn't voted in when he was playing in Denver...I'm sure a lot of America would have given him a look lol.

[Dustin]

Ha, Schaub wishes he had two more weapons to take the pressure off of AJ. The defense suffered injuries and played poorly not only toward the middle/end of this season but last season as well. Ryan is good but there is no doubt he has more weapons than Schaub does, even though I would still take Johnson over Roddy White.

 

Matt Ryan was putting up good numbers before he had Julio Jones though. He even averaged around 8 YPA in his rookie season when his only valuable weapon was Roddy White who up until that point had led the league in dropped passes every year he had been in the league.

 

Plus Ryan plays in the "hard hitting NFC" whereas Schaub plays in the "soft" AFC. 

[Qwiz]

Matt Ryan was putting up good numbers before he had Julio Jones though. He even averaged around 8 YPA in his rookie season when his only valuable weapon was Roddy White who up until that point had led the league in dropped passes every year he had been in the league.

 

Plus Ryan plays in the "hard hitting NFC" whereas Schaub plays in the "soft" AFC. 

It was also a year where a fresh Turner put up 1700 yards rushing and Michael Jenkins averaged 15.5 yards a catch as well. Their defense also had 34 sacks, so they weren't too shabby either. Matt Ryan is still a good quarterback though, no doubt about that.

[Dustin]

It was also a year where a fresh Turner put up 1700 yards rushing and Michael Jenkins averaged 15.5 yards a catch as well. Their defense also had 34 sacks, so they weren't too shabby either.

 

Are those guys worth 7 more touchdowns in 40 less games?

[Qwiz]

Are those guys worth 7 more touchdowns in 40 less games?

Mike Mularkey took the reigns off of his rookie quarterback after that first season where he didn't really have to throw the football with the second-best rushing attack in the league. Ryan has attempted more and more passes each year, and having Tony Gonzalez along for the ride doesn't hurt him either. Schaub, who has only played 3 full seasons since coming under conservative Gary Kubiak's wing, has been throwing to one weapon: Andre Johnson. Pretty impressive if you ask me, considering that defenses know we only have one guy and they still can't stop the connection. Heck, when Schaub was injured in Ryan's rookie season he only completed one less touchdown than him, and he missed five games. He also threw for more in 09 and 10, again, with less than stellar receiving options.

[Dustin]

Mike Mularkey took the reigns off of his rookie quarterback after that first season where he didn't really have to throw the football with the second-best rushing attack in the league. Ryan has attempted more and more passes each year, and having Tony Gonzalez along for the ride doesn't hurt him either. Schaub, who has only played 3 full seasons since coming under conservative Gary Kubiak's wing, has been throwing to one weapon: Andre Johnson. Pretty impressive if you ask me, considering that defenses know we only have one guy and they still can't stop the connection. Heck, when Schaub was injured in Ryan's rookie season he only completed one less touchdown than him, and he missed five games. He also threw for more in 09 and 10, again, with less than stellar receiving options.

 

 

You still haven't addressed the fact that Ryan plays in the "hard hitting NFC" (your words) and Schaub plays in the AFC which you said was the inferior conference. Wouldn't Ryan putting up better numbers in a tougher conference make Ryan's accomplishment that much better?

 

Not to be rude or anything, but I think your kind of just being a homer here. I doubt there are very many people outside of Houston that would take Schaub over Ryan.

[Qwiz]

You still haven't addressed the fact that Ryan plays in the "hard hitting NFC" (your words) and Schaub plays in the AFC which you said was the inferior conference. Wouldn't Ryan putting up better numbers in a tougher conference make Ryan's accomplishment that much better?

 

Not to be rude or anything, but I think your kind of just being a homer here. I doubt there are very many people outside of Houston that would take Schaub over Ryan.

Exactly. The hard hitting NFC. I'm not backing down from the statement, either. The NFC has better teams than the AFC...I actually see the Falcons as the NFC version of the Texans. They are just much more loaded on offense and are much more open and pass happy with their play calling. That is why Ryan really began to blossom and the Falcons really exploded to their potential. Another reason they drafted Jones and gave up so much for him. They pass a ton and the Texans just don't...we have Arian Foster and Andre Johnson whereas they have Snelling, Jones, White, Rodgers, Gonzalez, Turner, the list goes on and on. They are a more talented team and play against the likes of the Panthers, Saints defense, and Bucs defense six times a year. I'm just pointing out that having Johnson and Foster does not equate to having the aforementioned Falcons players, I'm not putting Schaub on a pedestal.

[Superman]

I have Matt Ryan clearly ahead of Matt Schaub.

[Vance]

I have Matt Ryan clearly ahead of Matt Schaub.

 

I do too, Matt Ryan is a poor man's Peyton Manning. Matt Schaub is a poor man's...Matt Schaub. I don't know. His lack of improvisation kills me.

[Thewholefnshow28]

Our lists are very, very similar. I have a couple more categories than you, specifically separating Newton and Bradford from the other young guys. But we're pretty well on the same wavelength.

 

I also forgot the disaster in Arizona, but we all know that they go in the not going to win crap with that poo poo platter. I put Newton in with the other young guys because to me even with his extra year he really has not distinguished himself yet.  The guy shows signs of greatness, but then because of his maturity level he really falls apart at times.  On sheer physical talent I think Newton of all the youngs has the highest upside, but like I said in my post it is all about what is between his ears.

 

 

The kid would be in the ProBowl every year.

 

Hawkeyes what did we tell you abnout mixing booze together and then posting?

[Superman]

I do too, Matt Ryan is a poor man's Peyton Manning. Matt Schaub is a poor man's...Matt Schaub. I don't know. His lack of improvisation kills me.

 

He's a very dangerous passer, and he's not necessarily going to hold you back. But I don't think he has the ability to carry the team -- weapons notwithstanding. I do agree with Qwiz that Ryan has more weapons, even before Julio Jones got there.

 

I also think Schaub has shown more than Flacco has. Before this postseason, I had Flacco behind Schaub. But a lot has changed over the past two months.

[Superman]

I also forgot the disaster in Arizona, but we all know that they go in the not going to win crap with that poo poo platter. I put Newton in with the other young guys because to me even with his extra year he really has not distinguished himself yet.  The guy shows signs of greatness, but then because of his maturity level he really falls apart at times.  On sheer physical talent I think Newton of all the youngs has the highest upside, but like I said in my post it is all about what is between his ears.

 

Yeah, Newton hasn't done what those other young guys have done -- produce wins. And it's not all on him, but that's a distinction at this point. Luck took over a pretty unsettled situation and his team won 11 games, and in several of those wins, Luck made the deciding plays. Newton is an absolute specimen, and I'm not writing him off, but he just hasn't been able to help his team win yet.

[-JJ-]

Well, pardon me while I bloviate (I was wondering what that smell was...)

 

I'm not trying to discredit John Clayton; he is who is, and he does what he does. (It's not like he's never been wrong before; like everyone else, he picked the Colts to finish last in the division in 2012.) But this is the primary topic on which his peers disagree with him most vocally. And it's not specific to Flacco. He includes guys like Matt Schaub among the elite. Does Matt Schaub meet his "wins in the playoffs" criteria? No, but Matt Schaub threw for almost 4,800 yards a couple years ago, and since then, Clayton calls him "elite."

 

Just because he has a HOF vote doesn't mean he's above reproach in this regard. And my disagreement over Schaub and Flacco or the overly-inclusive nature of Clayton's list of elite quarterbacks has nothing to do with any of these players eventual HOF credentials. We have a long way yet before we need to talk about Flacco and the HOF.

 

As for Peyton and Brady, you'll notice a couple things with them: 1) No one dissents when it comes to their status as "elite" quarterbacks, and no one has over the last six years, and 2) you won't see any playoff wins from their teams in games where they were absolute non-factors (like Flacco in 2009). You and Clayton want to give Flacco credit for wins that he didn't make happen, and I disagree with that.

 

You'll also notice that Brady has more playoffs losses on his record over the past half decade than he did in the first half of his career, but he's absolutely a better quarterback now than he was then. So I absolutely don't care about his playoff record. He and Manning, and Brees and Rodgers, make their teams go. Regular season, playoffs, doesn't matter, they are the catalyst for their team's success. And when the team fails, they get the scrutiny (especially Manning; everyone else seems to get more excuses). In Flacco's case, he deserves credit for leading his team over the course of the last five playoff games -- which includes last season's loss to the Patriots -- but that doesn't undo the previous years of mediocrity.

 

If you and Clayton see elite potential in Flacco, that's a different discussion. But his resume doesn't support this claim of elite status, not yet.

 

All deference to the Professor, but his list of elite quarterbacks is a joke, specifically because he hands out this elite tag like a press credential at the Super Bowl.

Well stated and that IS the crux!

[Jules]

So, it's the playoffs. You can choose ONE starting QB currently in the entire league to get a game winning drive if you need it. Not 3, you need a TD.

 

Who do you choose?

 

 

With all the rankings of "elite QBs" and who they are......who would you have the most faith in to lead a team to get that game winning TD in the final few minutes of a big postseason game. Would it be one of the big 4 universally accepted elite QBs; Manning/Brady/Rodgers/Brees. Or would you go for someone else based on other factors?

 

Who do you want or trust the most to pull out the magic in the clutch and do whatever it takes to get that game winning drive?

 

 

 

Sometimes to me the elite QBs are not even the guys I would want in the big games. It's odd how that can work out........

[Jules]

I do too, Matt Ryan is a poor man's Peyton Manning. Matt Schaub is a poor man's...Matt Schaub. I don't know. His lack of improvisation kills me.

 

 

Joe Flacco. ;)

[Vance]

Joe Flacco. ;)

 

[Jules]

 

 

 

Look on the bright side. Schaub is the next likely in line of the AFC QBs to get dragged through the mud for not taking the next step. Either this is very good or we will see the same old Matt Schaub in the end and he truly is hopeless and magic-less. I guess the other one might be Rivers?

 

This is a big year Vance! This is the year Matt Schaub stays Matt Schaub or becomes the legend we all know he can become!!!

[ColtsBlueFL]

So, it's the playoffs. You can choose ONE starting QB currently in the entire league to get a game winning drive if you need it. Not 3, you need a TD.

 

Who do you choose?

 

 

With all the rankings of "elite QBs" and who they are......who would you have the most faith in to lead a team to get that game winning TD in the final few minutes of a big postseason game. Would it be one of the big 4 universally accepted elite QBs; Manning/Brady/Rodgers/Brees. Or would you go for someone else based on other factors?

 

Who do you want or trust the most to pull out the magic in the clutch and do whatever it takes to get that game winning drive?

 

 

 

Sometimes to me the elite QBs are not even the guys I would want in the big games. It's odd how that can work out........

 

Intriguing!  and it occurs to me that Eli and now, Flacco could very well top my list because of their recent proven successes and unflappable (almost dull) nature. I'll be monitoring them in big games to see if it is fluke or something substantial there. Followed closely by Rodgers and Brady.  Then Manning and Brees.  In short order, I hope Andrew Luck tops my list.  Hard to believe I'm saying this. Oh well...

[chad72]

So, it's the playoffs. You can choose ONE starting QB currently in the entire league to get a game winning drive if you need it. Not 3, you need a TD.

 

Who do you choose?

 

It still is defined by whether the team, once the QB gives them the game winning drive, makes a defensive stop even if it only a minute or two to go.

 

Brady - SB 42, gives the Pats the lead but Eli makes a comeback with a TD with 35 seconds to go

 

Peyton - 2006 AFCCG, gives the Colts the lead with less than a minute to go and the Colts hold on with a Marlin Jackson INT

 

Eli - SB 46, gives the Giants the lead with less than a minute to go and the Giants hold on to the lead

 

Kurt Warner in SB 43, Peyton in the recent Broncos game and 2010 Jets game, all give leads to their teams that the team needed to hold on to and the teams failed.

 

Ultimately, did the QB do enough to win the playoff game? Did his team do enough to help out the QB? Playoff records end up being determined based on team help eventually.

 

We loosely attach the "clutch" moniker around QBs that dont lose the game for the first 3 quarters but step it up in the last few minutes of the 4th qtr and ignore everything that has happened until those minutes leading to the last few minutes in the 4th qtr. Such is life for a QB in the playoffs.