Who would you add?

[Gavin]

Revis

[IndyTrav]

75 divided by 8 is 9.3 yards a catch also he played some other very good to great wide receivers

Dez Bryant

Brandon Marshall

Vincent Jackson

Dwayne Bowe

Jeremy Macklin

Desean Jackson

its not just about the players he goes up against in his division, also if a team is going to devote an entire week to studying a Corner then I'd say your elite

Im not saying he's not elite. He's the best CB in the league. But overrated.

Of those 6 WR you listed, they had a total of 17 100yd games between all of them. 9 of them from Marshall/Vincent..

Once again, Revis is the best CB in the league, but give guys a chance to see him more than once in there career, and you will see very different outcomes...Marshall and Johnson have proven that, and its with horrid QB play.....If Revis played in the NFC North/South/East, I am willing to bet he wouldn't be held in such high regard......

[Slick_Rick]

Troy Polamalu or Ed Reed. Pairing either with Antoine Bethea would be so much fun to watch. If I could choose one player to help our team though, Arian Foster. I know he's a Texan, but he could take a lot of pressure off Andrew Luck.

[Andy]

Haloti Ngata, hands down. He makes their defense so much better. He draws double teams, and that gives Suggs a lot of 1 on 1s. He's also the most underrated player in the league.

[Captain Americolt]

Suh....he's younger than Ngata.

I'm in the extreme minority here, but Revis is vastly overrated. When playing against #1s n his own division he actually gives up significant yards/plays. Stevie, Randy,Marshall. All put him in his place. It's the 2nd tier guys he plays once every 4 years that he "locks down".

If I were to go CB I'd go after the younger guys, someone like Flowers or Carr. But I think my first pick may be Patrick Peterson. He's the new Calvin Johnson of the CB position. Big. Strong. Fast.

His 09 season was pretty impressive. I remember that year he was matched up against some of the games best at WRs at did a good job of keeping them in check. Other than that I havent watched him much. He may be overrated, but he's better than the rest

[Captain Americolt]

Haloti Ngata, hands down. He makes their defense so much better. He draws double teams, and that gives Suggs a lot of 1 on 1s. He's also the most underrated player in the league.

I don't think he's underrated by any means. Everyone knows how much of a monster he is. I think he came in at #9 in the top 100. Pretty good spot for a D-lineman

[Gavin]

Im not saying he's not elite. He's the best CB in the league. But overrated.

Of those 6 WR you listed, they had a total of 17 100yd games between all of them. 9 of them from Marshall/Vincent..

Once again, Revis is the best CB in the league, but give guys a chance to see him more than once in there career, and you will see very different outcomes...Marshall and Johnson have proven that, and its with horrid QB play.....If Revis played in the NFC North/South/East, I am willing to bet he wouldn't be held in such high regard......

The best give up yards sometimes and Johnson had the best game of the year against him (3 receptions, yes Revis got burned once but I wonder if it was a misscommunication with the safety), I dont get the overrated opinion especially in this passing league, might as well say Dwight Freeney is overrated because out of all the snaps he has ever been on the field......which of course I havent counted but its a ton....thats like saying he is overrated because out of all those snaps he has been on the field he only has I believe the number is 102.5 sacks, then again I would take a Revis like Corner over a Freeney like Defensive End and here is why, Freeney averages 11.3 sacks per season so far in his career which is a very good number but once you take into account how many snaps he large amount of snaps he has been in on thats not nearly enough snaps compared to a Corner, so therefore in my opinion an elite Corner has more of an impact on the game, he forces that quarterback to throw away from there best wide receiver, besides having another very good pass rusher draws some attention away from Freeney

[Superman]

I'd add a nose tackle, a corner, or a stud receiver, in that order.

1) Ngata

2) Asomugha / Haden

3) Calvin Johnson / Larry Fitzgerald

[FightLikeSin]

Having a guy that can single handedly take on an opponent's best receiver, without Safety help, is not overrated. It's a passing league, you roll more help over to your lesser talents, and holding your opponent in check is made that much easier.

That is a nice, 1 out of 4 solution for a passing defense that usually exposes itself to the run. If it were as big of a deal as people make it around here, Revis would have plenty of rings. The Pats killed the Jets 37 - 16 without running hardly at all. Brady passed for over 300 yards because his two TE sets made Revis vs Welker totally irrelevant.

A shutdown CB is only taking one option away. As long as you have more than one option to throw to, you don't have much to worry about. Actually, it makes it really easy to run slants and screen passes with those guys covered in man to man. It's over-rated, no team has won a championship because of their shutdown CB. I'd actually be interested to find a championship team within the last decade that has had a shutdown CB on the roster.

Back to the original argument as to who we'd have on our team...I'd much rather have a someone in the trenches on D-line. We need help there and it's a critical part of the 3-4.

[The Peytonator]

It's over-rated, no team has won a championship because of their shutdown CB. I'd actually be interested to find a championship team within the last decade that has had a shutdown CB on the roster.

Charles Woodson is one of the best in the league. Two years ago he won DPOY and the Super Bowl.

I can see your perspective on wanting to add more to the trenches, as it does start up front, but the purpose of this thread was to add someone to our team. I think we're a lot closer to set on the D-Line than we are at CB, thus the Revis pick for me.

But I do not begrudge someone wanting to add Haloti Ngata or Justin Smith to the roster.

[Gavin]

That is a nice, 1 out of 4 solution for a passing defense that usually exposes itself to the run. If it were as big of a deal as people make it around here, Revis would have plenty of rings. The Pats killed the Jets 37 - 16 without running hardly at all. Brady passed for over 300 yards because his two TE sets made Revis vs Welker totally irrelevant.

A shutdown CB is only taking one option away. As long as you have more than one option to throw to, you don't have much to worry about. Actually, it makes it really easy to run slants and screen passes with those guys covered in man to man. It's over-rated, no team has won a championship because of their shutdown CB. I'd actually be interested to find a championship team within the last decade that has had a shutdown CB on the roster.

Back to the original argument as to who we'd have on our team...I'd much rather have a someone in the trenches on D-line. We need help there and it's a critical part of the 3-4.

Look no further then who they have at Quarterback to see why they dont have rings, hes got the good Sanchez bad Sanchez in him going on, put Revis on our team this year and we are an instant contender

[adfisher870]

ngata, patrick willis, megatron, von miller, arian foster, andre johnson

[FightLikeSin]

Charles Woodson is one of the best in the league. Two years ago he won DPOY and the Super Bowl.

Woodson is a good CB, but hardly a shutdown. Definitely not THE reason why the Packers won the Superbowl. You have to give the offense the nod there in my opinion. Unstoppable.

[FightLikeSin]

Look no further then who they have at Quarterback to see why they dont have rings, hes got the good Sanchez bad Sanchez in him going on, put Revis on our team this year and we are an instant contender

No. The Jets allowed 22 points per game through the air last season. Please explain to me how that warrants praise to the shutdown corner and how Sanchez has anything to do with that. It's an over-rated position. For a reference, the Colts allowed 26 points per game through the air. Is 4 points per game worth Revis' contract if that is indeed the factor?

[Gavin]

No. The Jets allowed 22 points per game through the air last season. Please explain to me how that warrants praise to the shutdown corner and how Sanchez has anything to do with that. It's an over-rated position. For a reference, the Colts allowed 26 points per game through the air. Is 4 points per game worth Revis' contract if that is indeed the factor?

Actually counting extra points they allowed....

119 on the ground for 7.4 per game

105 through the air or 6.5 points per game or roughly a touchdown

now they were 31.6 percent when passing for a 1st down or good for 23rd

did I mention Sanchez threw 18 picks any number of which would have been a first down, Im sure most of them were enough yards to be for a First Down if I went and looked at the games

On the ground Jets First Down percentage was 20th

the Jets had 25 fumbles with 18 interceptions and I bet many of those 25 fumbles came on the 40 sacks 39 of which were on Sanchez

[IndyTrav]

Actually counting extra points they allowed....

119 on the ground for 7.4 per game

105 through the air or 6.5 points per game or roughly a touchdown

So the jets only allowed 13.9pts a game eh?

[Gavin]

Robert Mathis 83.5 sacks for career

Dwight Freeney 102.5 sacks for career

2011-493 pass attempts against us

2010-535 pass attempts against us

2009-583 pass attempts against us

2008-481 pass attempts against us

2007-498 pass attempts against us

2006-415 pass attempts against us

2005-509 pass attempts against us

2004-509 pass attempts against us

2003-445 pass attempts against us

2002-468 pass attempts against us

2001-509 pass attempts against us

Thats 5445 taken against us over that time period of which we have two of the best pass rushers in the game

thats 29.2 percent of time they got a sack

70.8 percent of the time they didnt

I will take the elite Corner over elite Pass rusher

2011-351 completions against Colts

2010-356 completions against

2009-372 completions against

2008-329 completions against

2007-325 completions against

2006-266 completions against

2005-343 completions against

2004-364 completions against

2003-277 completions against

2002-288 completions against

2001-311 completions against

we had 3582 pass attempts completed against us of those 5445 attempts

5.3 percent of the time Freeney got a sack

6.5 for Mathis

for total of 11.8 percent of the time, I figured out all my information using NFL.com stats

[Gavin]

So the jets only allowed 13.9pts a game eh?

My math could be wrong Im not real good at math but Im sure some of the turnovers they had went for 6 points

[southwest1]

Robert Mathis 83.5 sacks for career

Dwight Freeney 102.5 sacks for career

2011-493 pass attempts against us

2010-535 pass attempts against us

2009-583 pass attempts against us

2008-481 pass attempts against us

2007-498 pass attempts against us

2006-415 pass attempts against us

2005-509 pass attempts against us

2004-509 pass attempts against us

2003-445 pass attempts against us

2002-468 pass attempts against us

2001-509 pass attempts against us

Thats 5445 taken against us over that time period of which we have two of the best pass rushers in the game

thats 29.2 percent of time they got a sack

70.8 percent of the time they didnt

I will take the elite Corner over elite Pass rusher

2011-351 completions against Colts

2010-356 completions against

2009-372 completions against

2008-329 completions against

2007-325 completions against

2006-266 completions against

2005-343 completions against

2004-364 completions against

2003-277 completions against

2002-288 completions against

2001-311 completions against

we had 3582 pass attempts completed against us of those 5445 attempts

5.3 percent of the time Freeney got a sack

6.5 for Mathis

for total of 11.8 percent of the time, I figured out all my information using NFL.com stats

Nice information there Gavin. Thank you also for informing everyone where you tabulated your figures from. Covers & pass rushers both have value & 1 could easily make the argument that the now pass happy NFL dictates the necessity for quality corners. I just love seeing fear in an opposing QB's eyes. It always brings a smile to my face every single time I see a fumble or a sack. Call me old school I guess.

[FireJimCaldwell]

Robert Mathis 83.5 sacks for career

Dwight Freeney 102.5 sacks for career

2011-493 pass attempts against us

2010-535 pass attempts against us

2009-583 pass attempts against us

2008-481 pass attempts against us

2007-498 pass attempts against us

2006-415 pass attempts against us

2005-509 pass attempts against us

2004-509 pass attempts against us

2003-445 pass attempts against us

2002-468 pass attempts against us

2001-509 pass attempts against us

Thats 5445 taken against us over that time period of which we have two of the best pass rushers in the game

thats 29.2 percent of time they got a sack

70.8 percent of the time they didnt

I will take the elite Corner over elite Pass rusher

2011-351 completions against Colts

2010-356 completions against

2009-372 completions against

2008-329 completions against

2007-325 completions against

2006-266 completions against

2005-343 completions against

2004-364 completions against

2003-277 completions against

2002-288 completions against

2001-311 completions against

we had 3582 pass attempts completed against us of those 5445 attempts

5.3 percent of the time Freeney got a sack

6.5 for Mathis

for total of 11.8 percent of the time, I figured out all my information using NFL.com stats

Not sure what you got going on here, but a couple of corrections.

• 2002 was Freeney's first year.
  
• 2003 was Mathis' first year.
  
• The key would be passing plays(pass attempts + sacks).
  
• Each player missed a # of games.
  
• They didn't play 100% of the snaps in a game.
  
• Your %'s are way off.
  

These are team totals.

Year Pass Plays Team Sacks % Sacks
2011 522 29 5.6%
2010 565 30 5.3%
2009 617 34 5.5%
2008 511 30 5.9%
2007 526 28 5.3%
2006 440 25 5.7%
2005 555 46 8.3%
2004 602 45 7.5%
2003 476 31 6.5%
2002 504 36 7.1%
Total 5318 334 6.3%

So I'm trying to decipher it, but it's not quite clear.

2002-2011 the Colts allowed opposing QB's complete 65.6 % of their passes.

Year ATT CMP %
2011 493 351 71.2%
2010 535 356 66.5%
2009 583 372 63.8%
2008 481 329 68.4%
2007 498 325 65.3%
2006 415 266 64.1%
2005 509 343 67.4%
2004 557 364 65.4%
2003 445 277 62.2%
2002 468 288 61.5%
Total 4984 3271 65.6%

[Gavin]

My bad I think where I >>>ed up is I added 2001 instead of stopping at 2002

[FireJimCaldwell]

My bad I think where I >>>ed up is I added 2001 instead of stopping at 2002

It's all good.. I was reading it and I was like there is no way there is 29% sacks... 10 % would likely be an NFL record.

[Gavin]

It's all good.. I was reading it and I was like there is no way there is 29% sacks... 10 % would likely be an NFL record.

add one wrong number or miss one and its all thrown off, my point I was trying to make was clearly Freeney and Mathis have been excellent almost devasting at times pass rushers for us but given the passing league and number of pass attempts over a season and over the years, the number is far smaller then what a shut down Corner would make, obviously you want both if you can but I would take the Corner, I got my info from NFL.com I probably just added something or missed something along the line

[Camio]

I'm amazed on most of the replies, sorry to say. A dominant D starts with a great DL.

Ray Lewis himself, about 6-7 years ago, while mic'ed up (during SNF I think), whined non-stop, during a game, about lack of DT play (or quality) on the Ravens. He was whining non-stop (was quite easy to hear) about how he was double and triple-teamed on every plays (ok, he wasnt but hey, he was trying to get a point accross). Ravens ended up drafting Ngata. The Ravens had a very nice group of DBs and LBs but it was all useless without a dominant DL.

I fail to see the relevance of comparing Freeney/Mathis stats with Revis honestly to try to prove a point. Neither of Mathis or Freeney were ever as dominant as Revis or Ngata. If you want to compare Revis to other top DL players to prove a point, use complete DEs (Peppers for example, who actually is a factor vs the run, not a liability) or dominant DTs.

The Giants, few years ago, have proven, without a doubt, that a dominant DL can carry a whole defense (and team) to the SB, and win it. That right there proves whats the driving force of a dominant D. Ask any Pats fan what was the main issue during that game (referring here to the first SB loss the Giants, besides the fact Giants had the better QB ) and they'll tell you it was the fact the Giants could generate pressure with their front 4 only.

Bears D in 05-06 was based on a certain DT. When this DT was injured the following year (years actually), that D was never the same. The Buccs dominant D (late 90s, early 00s) stopped being dominant the minute that lost Sapp. He was the main piece of that D. Buccs brought the heat with only 4 rushing, non-stop. Heck, it got them tons of picks in the SB against Gannon who was known to not turn the ball over. When Dungy got in Indy, the plan was to rush 4 and get heat that way. The main issue was always the very very poor DT play which was never really fixed, besides a year or so.

The Panthers of 04 (SB vs Pats) got there based on the play of a dominant DL led by Peppers, Jenkins and another, while not as good but still very good DE.

Bears and Panthers too could generate pressure with 4 only, especially the Panthers. The Bears D was better as a whole than the Panthers, thanks to a nice LBs groups. Harris was the Bears main cog on D tho.

The Pats D was never the same the minute they lost Seymour. There was a year too where he missed the first part of the year (while with the Pats) and they were gonna miss the playoffs. He got back and they instantly turned it around and made the playoffs. He was their MVP for all that time. They made a big mistake by not signing him long-term and haven't recovered since.

If I had to choose who to get based on the Colts needs, I'd go with Ngata without blinking. First, he's the most dominant defensive player in the league. 2nd, the DT spot has been the main weakness for the Colts for the last well, the whole PM tenure, besides about a year (Simon/Booger).

If CB play was that important (shutdown corner), Bailey would've seen his teams go a bit farther in the playoffs. What was the Broncos main issue in 03-05? DL play. They had 0 pass rush, none. Their DL couldnt generate any pressure. Bottom line? Their top LB and DBs corps (compared to the rest of the league) could do much on defense vs PM and his friends.

And btw, not knocking on Bailey here. He was the best CB for basically a 6-7 years (easily).

[Gavin]

I'm amazed on most of the replies, sorry to say. A dominant D starts with a great DL.

Ray Lewis himself, about 6-7 years ago, while mic'ed up (during SNF I think), whined non-stop, during a game, about lack of DT play (or quality) on the Ravens. He was whining non-stop (was quite easy to hear) about how he was double and triple-teamed on every plays (ok, he wasnt but hey, he was trying to get a point accross). Ravens ended up drafting Ngata. The Ravens had a very nice group of DBs and LBs but it was all useless without a dominant DL.

I fail to see the relevance of comparing Freeney/Mathis stats with Revis honestly to try to prove a point. Neither of Mathis or Freeney were ever as dominant as Revis or Ngata. If you want to compare Revis to other top DL players to prove a point, use complete DEs (Peppers for example, who actually is a factor vs the run, not a liability) or dominant DTs.

The Giants, few years ago, have proven, without a doubt, that a dominant DL can carry a whole defense (and team) to the SB, and win it. That right there proves whats the driving force of a dominant D. Ask any Pats fan what was the main issue during that game (referring here to the first SB loss the Giants, besides the fact Giants had the better QB ) and they'll tell you it was the fact the Giants could generate pressure with their front 4 only.

Bears D in 05-06 was based on a certain DT. When this DT was injured the following year (years actually), that D was never the same. The Buccs dominant D (late 90s, early 00s) stopped being dominant the minute that lost Sapp. He was the main piece of that D. Buccs brought the heat with only 4 rushing, non-stop. Heck, it got them tons of picks in the SB against Gannon who was known to not turn the ball over. When Dungy got in Indy, the plan was to rush 4 and get heat that way. The main issue was always the very very poor DT play which was never really fixed, besides a year or so.

The Panthers of 04 (SB vs Pats) got there based on the play of a dominant DL led by Peppers, Jenkins and another, while not as good but still very good DE.

Bears and Panthers too could generate pressure with 4 only, especially the Panthers. The Bears D was better as a whole than the Panthers, thanks to a nice LBs groups. Harris was the Bears main cog on D tho.

The Pats D was never the same the minute they lost Seymour. There was a year too where he missed the first part of the year (while with the Pats) and they were gonna miss the playoffs. He got back and they instantly turned it around and made the playoffs. He was their MVP for all that time. They made a big mistake by not signing him long-term and haven't recovered since.

If I had to choose who to get based on the Colts needs, I'd go with Ngata without blinking. First, he's the most dominant defensive player in the league. 2nd, the DT spot has been the main weakness for the Colts for the last well, the whole PM tenure, besides about a year (Simon/Booger).

If CB play was that important (shutdown corner), Bailey would've seen his teams go a bit farther in the playoffs. What was the Broncos main issue in 03-05? DL play. They had 0 pass rush, none. Their DL couldnt generate any pressure. Bottom line? Their top LB and DBs corps (compared to the rest of the league) could do much on defense vs PM and his friends.

And btw, not knocking on Bailey here. He was the best CB for basically a 6-7 years (easily).

stopping the run is key no question anyone who watched our run defense would know that over the years I just dont think a Freeney or a Mathis pass rusher trumps a Corner like a run stopper might

[FireJimCaldwell]

add one wrong number or miss one and its all thrown off, my point I was trying to make was clearly Freeney and Mathis have been excellent almost devasting at times pass rushers for us but given the passing league and number of pass attempts over a season and over the years, the number is far smaller then what a shut down Corner would make, obviously you want both if you can but I would take the Corner, I got my info from NFL.com I probably just added something or missed something along the line

I think it is still based on a preference.

Revis was targeted 85 times.

http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/01/12/cornerbacks-a-glance-at-the-2011-numbers/

Jets opponents threw 507 passes and were sacked 35 times for 542 pass plays.

15.7% of those pass plays were thrown to the receiver/zone covered by Revis.

Cromartie on the other side had 84 passes thrown his way.

With the way Freeney/Mathis played the pass, I would say they were rushing the passer a high % of the time as opposed to truly playing the run.

I'm not sure there is a right or wrong answer. Either way, an elite CB, or an eliite DE can be dangerous but they both can basically be eliminated by a game plan if they are the only weapon.

[Gavin]

I think it is still based on a preference.

Revis was targeted 85 times.

http://www.profootba...e-2011-numbers/

Jets opponents threw 507 passes and were sacked 35 times for 542 pass plays.

15.7% of those pass plays were thrown to the receiver/zone covered by Revis.

Cromartie on the other side had 84 passes thrown his way.

With the way Freeney/Mathis played the pass, I would say they were rushing the passer a high % of the time as opposed to truly playing the run.

I'm not sure there is a right or wrong answer. Either way, an elite CB, or an eliite DE can be dangerous but they both can basically be eliminated by a game plan if they are the only weapon.

one compliments the other, Im just a Corner guy I guess, strangely enough I love watching teams pound run to set up play action

[FireJimCaldwell]

one compliments the other, Im just a Corner guy I guess, strangely enough I love watching teams pound run to set up play action

A solid pass rush can create interceptions, just as tight coverage can force sacks...

Against Revis in 2011 35/85 41.1% 508 yards 1 td 4 int 45.6 QB rating.

Rest of the Jets 240/ 422 56.9% 2906 yards 14td 15 int 74.4 QB rating.

Throwing at Revis or at the rest of the Jets defense is far better than the 71% cmp%, 25-8 Td-int ratio and 103.9 QB rating the Colts gave up last year.

[Superman]

So the jets only allowed 13.9pts a game eh?

You add field goals (29) and defensive scores back in (4 fumbles returned, 3 interceptions returned, 1 safety) , and you're back up to 22/game. I think Gavin's stats only account for offensive touchdowns allowed.

[Gavin]

You add field goals (29) and defensive scores back in (4 fumbles returned, 3 interceptions returned, 1 safety) , and you're back up to 22/game. I think Gavin's stats only account for offensive touchdowns allowed.

yeah I didnt take into account the defensive scores, i didnt go back to look how many they had

[JoKeR]

Having a guy that can single handedly take on an opponent's best receiver, without Safety help, is not overrated. It's a passing league, you roll more help over to your lesser talents, and holding your opponent in check is made that much easier.

I think what he's saying is that Revis and another " shutdown" CB do not truly shut down their assignments.

I'd rather have 2 very good CBs without the title and salary demands.

[Superman]

I think what he's saying is that Revis and another " shutdown" CB do not truly shut down their assignments.

I'd rather have 2 very good CBs without the title and salary demands.

Two very good corners will get the job done, assuming you have at least a decent pass rush. The Jets had pass rush issues last season from time to time.

[indynorth]

Arian Foster,Ray Rice,Jimmy Graham,Victor Cruz

[HtownColt]

Mike Tomlin

[southwest1]

Mike Tomlin

This is an excellent pick HtownColt. Tomlin does have extensive DB & DC experience from his time in Minnesota & Tampa Bay. He makes no excuses and he makes all the players under his command accountable too.

He is also very complementary of whatever competition he faces & he never dismisses any team outright as a cake walk or easy victory either.

[HtownColt]

This is an excellent pick HtownColt. Tomlin does have extensive DB & DC experience from his time in Minnesota & Tampa Bay. He makes no excuses and he makes all the players under his command accountable too.

He is also very complementary of whatever competition he faces & he never dismisses any team outright as a cake walk or easy victory either.

That's my favorite head coach. He just tells it like it is, your always going to get a honest answer out of him. And he is always in control no situation is too big for him