Explain this to me

[Jules]

Chud is a cooler name then Pep.

[will426]

Forget the scheme forget comparing the two both of them are trash because they lack common sense...where are OUR crossing routes OUR bunch Formations SLANTS...biggest question WHY DONT WE RUN THE HURRY UP EVERY GAME BEFORE WE ARE DOWN and also WHY DOESNT LUCK MAKE HIS OWN CALLS  I swear he's an a awesome guy but he needs to make his own calls at the line know your playbook make an audible don't run a running play when you see 8 men in the box...call a hot route when you see them getting ready to blitz..RUN THE DAMN BALL ON 4th/1 WHEN THE foolish COACH CALLS FOR A SCREEN WITH THE GAME ON THE LINE

[AZColt11]

30 minutes ago, LockeDown said:

Polian, Dungy and Manning knew what to do and how to do it.  It was a matter of execution which they eventually excelled at.   This group is a far cry from that. 

Sadly I don't think we're ever going to see that type of personnel here again.  We had the once in a generation QB, a 5-time GM of the year, a HC players could play hard for, coordinators who knew what they were doing, and a fairly sober owner who stayed the hell outta their way.  Never again will the stars align so well for the Colts.  Doesn't mean they still can't win, just that they may not have it so good, which only adds to the disappointment that they didn't win more rings.

[Surge89]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

This is also not true. 

 

Chud's play calling, especially in the passing game, has been incomprehensible, especially today. Until they give Luck clear throwing lanes and quick hitters, there's no real way to judge Luck's throwing across the middle. There's constant pressure up the middle, affecting Luck's throwing motion. 

 

I don't understand why they can't run some simple rhythm plays to get the offense going. Almost everything Luck threw today was high difficulty, into tight coverage, through small windows...

 

The McKinney tip basically illustrates the shortcomings of the passing game. They're playing deep zone coverage, blitzing up the middle, leaving the middle of the field wide open -- like they did most of the game. When your middle linebacker is sagging 15 yards back, it's a sin to not work the middle. 

 

I officially hate this offense.

 

 

I agree with with you on playcalling.  But to say we haven't seen enough of Luck to know that he throws high and behind across the middle is questionable.  He's literally been doing that since he was drafted and one of his biggest Criticisms regardless of the play caller.  

[McGrit]

Just now, Superman said:

And at this point, Pagano has to own the offensive issues, because this is obviously his preferred offense. The Colts don't have the OL to run it. Good coaching would mandate a philosophical change in the meantime. It's been five years. 

 

 

it would be nice if he owned any issues the team has. Hell will freeze over before Chuck Pagano ever gives an accurate assessment of the Colts and a clear, realistic plan of how to improve.

 

I think back to week 8 of the 2014 season. On Tuesday Mike Tomlin gave his weekly  press conference to talk about the team and the opponent for the week. He gave a very detailed (and highly accurate) analysis of the various strengths of the Colts -- who were looking like an offensive juggernaut at the time -- and what the Steelers needed to focus on to win. For those who don't remember, this is the game that the Steelers won 51-34 with Big Ben going 40/49 for 522 yards and 6TDs.

 

If only we had a coach that was capable of giving such an assessment and then executing a gameplan built to suit the team we have. Instead we have a cliche spouting machine who literally thinks that a positive mental attitude can solve any problem.

[McGrit]

Just now, Superman said:

And at this point, Pagano has to own the offensive issues, because this is obviously his preferred offense. The Colts don't have the OL to run it. Good coaching would mandate a philosophical change in the meantime. It's been five years. 

 

Whoops, double post. Mods please delete this comment.

 

[Superman]

3 hours ago, Surge89 said:

I agree with with you on playcalling.  But to say we haven't seen enough of Luck to know that he throws high and behind across the middle is questionable.  He's literally been doing that since he was drafted and one of his biggest Criticisms regardless of the play caller.  

 

Not really. And it's difficult to throw across the middle with accuracy when you can't step up in the pocket. 

[gacoop1]

The play calling is atrocious.  You don't try to kick a field goal from 55, when the kicker has been inconsistent the last few weeks.  Perhaps, we need to start think about drafting a kicker for the future. And what about Allen, not only he got man handled by Clowney, but he didn't learned from training camp that you pounce on the ball instead of picking it up and ended up fumbling.  Allen is a liability, cut your losses Colts and get rid of this Guy.....

[19colt]

58 minutes ago, gacoop1 said:

The play calling is atrocious.  You don't try to kick a field goal from 55, when the kicker has been inconsistent the last few weeks.  Perhaps, we need to start think about drafting a kicker for the future. And what about Allen, not only he got man handled by Clowney, but he didn't learned from training camp that you pounce on the ball instead of picking it up and ended up fumbling.  Allen is a liability, cut your losses Colts and get rid of this Guy.....

 

This play call was worse than the game ending play call. Trips right, max protection - didn't stress the defense AT ALL hence why Luck had to hold on to the ball and Clowney had time to make the play against someone that should never have been blocking him 1 on 1. For every good play call by Chud, he comes up with absolute head scratchers such as this. 

[Surge89]

9 hours ago, Superman said:

 

Not really. And it's difficult to throw across the middle with accuracy when you can't step up in the pocket. 

 

Yes really.

 

Plenty have done it.  And we have a legitimate center now.

[Superman]

14 hours ago, McGrit said:

 

 

it would be nice if he owned any issues the team has. Hell will freeze over before Chuck Pagano ever gives an accurate assessment of the Colts and a clear, realistic plan of how to improve.

 

I think back to week 8 of the 2014 season. On Tuesday Mike Tomlin gave his weekly  press conference to talk about the team and the opponent for the week. He gave a very detailed (and highly accurate) analysis of the various strengths of the Colts -- who were looking like an offensive juggernaut at the time -- and what the Steelers needed to focus on to win. For those who don't remember, this is the game that the Steelers won 51-34 with Big Ben going 40/49 for 522 yards and 6TDs.

 

If only we had a coach that was capable of giving such an assessment and then executing a gameplan built to suit the team we have. Instead we have a cliche spouting machine who literally thinks that a positive mental attitude can solve any problem.

 

I don't think what coaches say in pressers has anything to do with what happens on the field. I don't need Pagano to give a detailed analysis of anything during a press conference. He can spout all the cliches he wants in public. I just want him to put together a good gameplan and have the team ready to run it, and to do so consistently.

[Rally5]

21 hours ago, csmopar said:

What is the upgrade from Pep to Chud?  Now, before you go too far, I myself wanted Pep gone, but to me, it looks like the exact same garbage play calling we had with Pep.  Yeah, Luck's INT rate is down a tad but is that really on Chud?  

 

So seriously, someone legitimately explain what the upgrade is? Cause I ain't seeing it.

 

 

I don't think I can answer properly / thoroughly in a thread so here's a fly-by of my thoughts.  Pep was an F and I was big on his hiring.  I've wrote about this before.  Pep ran a far too complex offense in which we literally didn't run the same play more than once per game, same can be said for his sets.  It was discombobulated and ineffective we had become masters of nothing and in the NFL having and identity matters and that identity leads to your ability to execute.  I don't have a big problem with Chud, is he the best? no.  Like everyone else, I would like to see more short passes etc, etc. but it's not bad. We have one of the best deep threat games in the league and I see the run game getting better.  Players matter.....Dwayne Allen cost us points yesterday all by his lonesome.  You could pin another 6-14 pts on his ineptitude yesterday.  That's another story.  I see Chud has a philospohy that makes this a high scoring offense (#2 most of the year I think, I'm sure we dropped after yesterday) but Luck does hold the ball too long, I don't love our Wide Receiver coaching, and I'm over Dwayne Allen at this point.  Coaches put players in a position to succeed but ultimately they need to make plays and yesterday we didn't make plays.  I'm surprised more people don't call out Monachino for having a bottom 5 defense most of the year.  We fixate on the offense but if our d showed up we would have clinched already. Anyway, I'm way more concerned about personnel: pass rush, CB's that can stay healthy, still need to improve the oline and WR's that fight for the ball and don't quit on routes (TY and Doyle excluded).  

Edited December 12, 2016 by Rally5

[Rally5]

9 minutes ago, Rally5 said:

I don't think I can answer properly / thoroughly in a thread so here's a fly-by of my thoughts.  Pep was an F and I was big on his hiring.  I've written about this before.  Pep ran a far too complex offense in which we literally didn't run the same play more than once per game, same can be said for his sets.  It was discombobulated and ineffective we had become masters of nothing and in the NFL having and identity matters and that identity leads to your ability to execute.  I think he was lost in being a power running game because that's what his coach wanted, the west coast offense which he knows, or the deep threat/screen Arians offense that was previously successful.  So we had an unholy amalgamation of all three which was as ugly as it sounds.  That's my view.

 

 I don't have a big problem with Chud, is he the best? no.  Like everyone else, I would like to see more short passes etc, etc. but it's not bad. We have one of the best deep threat games in the league and I see the run game getting better.  Players matter.....Dwayne Allen cost us points yesterday all by his lonesome.  You could pin another 6-14 pts on his ineptitude yesterday.  That's another story.  I see Chud has a philosophy that makes this a high scoring offense (#2 most of the year I think, I'm sure we dropped after yesterday) but Luck does hold the ball too long, I don't love our Wide Receiver coaching, and I'm over Dwayne Allen at this point.  Coaches put players in a position to succeed but ultimately they need to make plays and yesterday we didn't make plays.  I'm surprised more people don't call out Monachino for having a bottom 5 defense most of the year.  We fixate on the offense but if our d showed up we would have clinched already.

 

Anyway, I'm way more concerned about personnel: pass rush, CB's that can stay healthy, still need to improve the oline and WR's that fight for the ball and don't quit on routes (TY and Doyle excluded).  

1

 

[lollygagger8]

21 hours ago, Flash7 said:

I've said this before, but when we had Arians, we were a down-field throwing team. And then Pep came in and wanted to implement the Stanford, west-Coast-ish type of offense, but we ended up being a down-field throwing team. Now, we have Chud and we are a down-field throwing team. 

 

The constant is Luck. He either does not want to, or is not good at throwing short, timing, and crossing routes. In many ways, Luck has handicapped the OCs.

 

I used to think that Luck would be an offensive coordinator's dream. A big, strong, elusive QB who can make all the throws. But Now I am starting to think that Luck is limited, doesn't want to use roll-outs, and can't consistently throw crossing routes where he hits the receivers in stride. Otherwise, I can't explain why every offense he has been in looks the same.

 

Just consider how different the offense was with Hasselbeck, so it appears that the OC can change their style of play calling, but Luck can't change his style of play.

[McGrit]

Just now, Superman said:

I don't need Pagano to give a detailed analysis of anything during a press conference. He can spout all the cliches he wants in public. I just want him to put together a good gameplan and have the team ready to run it, and to do so consistently.

 

That's the problem though. He hasn't, in 5 years, been able to consistently put forth smart gameplans that are tailored to the team we have. I would agree with you if he showed strong coaching skills during games or if the team consistently showed up looking prepared for their opponents. Then he could say whatever and that would be fine.

 

At this point there is nothing, nothing, to suggest that his coaching acumen goes any further than the moronic cliches that he regurgitates regularly. That is my point. The man thinks in cliches. I am suggesting that those cliches are all there is to him.

[Superman]

20 minutes ago, McGrit said:

 

That's the problem though. He hasn't, in 5 years, been able to consistently put forth smart gameplans that are tailored to the team we have. I would agree with you if he showed strong coaching skills during games or if the team consistently showed up looking prepared for their opponents. Then he could say whatever and that would be fine.

 

At this point there is nothing, nothing, to suggest that his coaching acumen goes any further than the moronic cliches that he regurgitates regularly. That is my point. The man thinks in cliches. I am suggesting that those cliches are all there is to him.

 

I'm over Pagano and Chud, so don't take this as a defense, but the gameplan in the Green Bay game was good, and the gameplans in some of the Hasselbeck games last year were good. That's what's most frustrating to me, they have shown the ability to do this, but most often they don't. 

 

To the bolded, I don't believe that. His players have basically stated that his cliche speak is mostly for the media.

[Steamboat_Shaun]

21 hours ago, Smoke317 said:

Might be time to get an OC in here who can nurture that kind of growth and development in Luck. 

 

Another new OC... Luck's 4th in 6 years? No thanks. This is Chud's first full season of working with Luck, and it was starting to come together in recent weeks. I think firing him after a divisional loss would be a knee jerk reaction. I'm totally fine with moving on from Pagano and Grigson if that's what Irsay decides to do, but I don't think Chud's the problem.

[Superman]

11 minutes ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

Another new OC... Luck's 4th in 6 years? No thanks. This is Chud's first full season of working with Luck, and it was starting to come together in recent weeks. I think firing him after a divisional loss would be a knee jerk reaction. I'm totally fine with moving on from Pagano and Grigson if that's what Irsay decides to do, but I don't think Chud's the problem.

 

The bolded is not ideal. However, Chud's offense isn't ideal, either. The fact that they've let the QB get battered all season long rather than adjusting their passing attack is a major indictment. 

[Steamboat_Shaun]

Just now, Superman said:

 

The bolded is not ideal. However, Chud's offense isn't ideal, either. The fact that they've let the QB get battered all season long rather than adjusting their passing attack is a major indictment. 

 

I just have to wonder how much of that is Pagano's influence... We've seen coordinators on both sides of the ball come and go during Luck's tenure so far, but the 2 constants have been Pagano/Grigson. I definitely think we've seen their ceiling, so at this point, I'm far more comfortable moving on from them than bringing in another new OC. I guess a new HC would likely bring in a new OC though, so it may be inevitable.

[Superman]

Just now, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

I just have to wonder how much of that is Pagano's influence... We've seen coordinators on both sides of the ball come and go during Luck's tenure so far, but the 2 constants have been Pagano/Grigson. I definitely think we've seen their ceiling, so at this point, I'm far more comfortable moving on from them than bringing in another new OC. I guess a new HC would likely bring in a new OC though, so it may be inevitable.

 

It's obviously Pagano's preferred offense. Arians, Chud (who he grabbed even before a position was available for him), and now Schottenheimer as the QB coach... 

[chrisfarley]

23 hours ago, Superman said:

 

This is also not true. 

 

Chud's play calling, especially in the passing game, has been incomprehensible, especially today. Until they give Luck clear throwing lanes and quick hitters, there's no real way to judge Luck's throwing across the middle. There's constant pressure up the middle, affecting Luck's throwing motion. 

 

I don't understand why they can't run some simple rhythm plays to get the offense going. Almost everything Luck threw today was high difficulty, into tight coverage, through small windows...

 

The McKinney tip basically illustrates the shortcomings of the passing game. They're playing deep zone coverage, blitzing up the middle, leaving the middle of the field wide open -- like they did most of the game. When your middle linebacker is sagging 15 yards back, it's a sin to not work the middle. 

 

I officially hate this offense.

I think this offense officially hates this offense.  You are in good company.

[John Waylon]

Chud is no Pep. That's for sure. In a good way. Cud has only a handful of head scratching play calls a game, whereas pep would make that in a single drive.

But is he the right guy to make this offense a juggernaut?

No, I don't think so.

But that's pretty par for this regime, so whatever. Nothing we can do but buckle in and ride along.

*