An ignorant mans opinion on Luck

[dw49]

Come one now. You know Brady led those charges especially the second two when he was a pro bowler. But my overall point was that Brady took Bledsoe's team which we thought was not very good and won titles with them. Transformed Belichick from a below .500 HC into "the genius."

 

I suppose time with tell with Luck. I see tendencies there that are part of who he is not the team around him. He has a very good offense around him this year and he as reverted back into the turnovers that plagued him his rookie year. And the defense has not been horrible this year. It has performed well given no Mathis, no? And your STs have been the best in the league.

 

In terms of Dalton. Yes, Luck is better. But their careers and stats have been similar to this point which is what I think Brown was getting at.

 

 

Often teams do jell and get better. But Brady no doubt better than Beldsoe. I guess if you say 19 TDs 17 Ints is similar to 40 and 16 .. I have to buy that one ?

[hawkeyes]

QBs are only as good as their teams!   Haven't seen any win a game all on their own - its impossible!

[dw49]

To have blown that lead goes squarely on Reid. I am not taking anything away from Luck's comeback, it was great. But really, throwing the ball with a three score lead and a quarter to go? Just horrible, horrible coaching.

 

 

What in the world does Andy Reid coaching have to do with this thread ?

[amfootball]

Often teams do jell and get better. But Brady no doubt better than Beldsoe. I guess if you say 19 TDs 17 Ints is similar to 40 and 16 .. I have to buy that one ?

Luck is better. But career wise, they are similar with Dalton having a better completion percentage and Luck more Tds and yards. I am not sure though if Dalton has a ceiling any higher but he has a lousy coach. I think Luck has a higher ceiling and may need new coaching as well.

[amfootball]

What in the world does Andy Reid coaching have to do with this thread ?

We were talking about the KC playoff game from last year ...

[dw49]

We were talking about the KC playoff game from last year ...

 

 

No we were comparing  Dalton's post season games to Andrew Lucks

[amfootball]

No we were comparing  Dalton's post season games to Andrew Lucks

Right.

[ColtsBlueFL]

When I read your first paragraph I think about Bledsoe and how we used to same those same exact things about him. IF he just had a better Oline, better run game, better receivers. And like Luck, he liked to hang on to the ball, get it down field, take hits and force throws. It was who he was. Then we saw Brady step on the field with the same group and move the offense, not take negative plays, take what the defense gave him and lead the team to multiple championships.

 

The knocks against Luck are the same ones he had in college. The question is can he change who he is? I think he is a fine QB but far from elite and I am not sure if that has to do as much with the team around him as you may believe. I am not saying this Colts team is great but his issues are less about the players than his approach to the position IMO.

 

So Brady steps on the field and does wonder,  and Luck does what?  Here's a quiz-   Which stat line belongs to which QB?, first three full seasons in the NFL:

 

  W    -     L           TD             INT       Avg Rate

 

 34          12          70              38           86.0

 

 33          15          86              43           86.6

 

Very important numbers for a QB.   Who is who?  Who is incredibly superior over the other?

[dw49]

Come on now. You know Brady led those charges especially the second two when he was a pro bowler. But my overall point was that Brady took Bledsoe's team which we thought was not very good and won titles with them. Transformed Belichick from a below .500 HC into "the genius."

 

I suppose time with tell with Luck. I see tendencies there that are part of who he is not the team around him. He has a very good offense around him this year and he as reverted back into the turnovers that plagued him his rookie year. And the defense has not been horrible this year. It has performed well given no Mathis, no? And your STs have been the best in the league.

 

In terms of Dalton. Yes, Luck is better. But their careers and stats have been similar to this point which is what I think Brown was getting at.

 

 

How good is that offense ?

 

1) Offensive line is horrible at running the ball . So not only no ground game but no play action.]

 

2) OL horrible at pass protection

 

3) Trent Richardson is terrible. Bradshaw only played around 7 games and Herron is small and not much

 

4) Nicks gets no separation and Wayne shouldn't even be on the field . Fleener is good and Allen also when on the field.

 

When Bradshaw was playing and Wayne before the triceps tear .. yes they had "weapons." But not an elite offense as the O line was bad. The defense held up only against the lesser teams. Pats , Steelers , Broncos and Cowboys brutalized them. So when and if Luck gets a running game and defense equal to say what Tom Brady has , all that criticism needs to be put on hold IMO.

[amfootball]

How good is that offense ?

 

1) Offensive line is horrible at running the ball . So not only no ground game but no play action.]

 

2) OL horrible at pass protection

 

3) Trent Richardson is terrible. Bradshaw only played around 7 games and Herron is small and not much

 

4) Nicks gets no separation and Wayne shouldn't even be on the field . Fleener is good and Allen also when on the field.

 

When Bradshaw was playing and Wayne before the triceps tear .. yes they had "weapons." But not an elite offense as the O line was bad. The defense held up only against the lesser teams. Pats , Steelers , Broncos and Cowboys brutalized them. So when and if Luck gets a running game and defense equal to say what Tom Brady has , all that criticism needs to be put on hold IMO.

So injuries have derailed your season?

[ColtsBlueFL]

lol. Right his FIRST Int. How many did he have again? And aren't Qbs supposed to play well regardless of the score, not add to the deficit?

 

When you and amfootball are done with the nitpicking Luck vs Chiefs game (which Luck did win!), I'd like to discuss the Brady versus the Bills game in 2003.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/recap?gameId=230907002

[dw49]

Right.

 

 

And there is no comparison as Dalton has been terrible vs three stinky wild card teams. Luck on the other hand was OK vs a SB Raven team. He couldn't help 7-8 dropped passes. Played what most football fans thought was a great game vs KC and did have a tough game vs NE. Never mind the fact that his receivers were Hilton , Brazil and Whalen and the Pats ran wild vs the Colt defense. I think a lot of 2nd year QB's would have trouble trying to keep up with a BB team that was scoring at will throwing to practice squad WR's running wrong routes . But so you have 3 horrible games no wins by Dalton. A very good game , an average game and a bad game vs WAY WAY tougher competition. Plus all both Colt losses on the road and 2 or 3 Cinn losses at home. 

 

THERE IS NO SIMILAR COMPARISON. 

[John Dee]

Anyone who pays attention and watches the Colts and Bengals know that the difference between the two is night and day.     The Bengals ask Dalton NOT to lose the game for them, the Colts ask Andrew Luck to WIN the game for them.   Huge difference.  

 

In fact Mike Chappell went as far as saying a couple days ago that THIS Colt staff is asking Luck to do more with less than Manning was EVER asked to do.     And I think the same.    That is why I just don't get hung up on his turnovers and inconsistent play.    Get the guy some help.     He has been the most hit QB in the NFL over the last 3 years.    Most mortals would have cracked by now.

 

Stupid is as stupid says....

[braveheartcolt]

Come on now. You know Brady led those charges especially the second two when he was a pro bowler. But my overall point was that Brady took Bledsoe's team which we thought was not very good and won titles with them. Transformed Belichick from a below .500 HC into "the genius."

 

I suppose time with tell with Luck. I see tendencies there that are part of who he is not the team around him. He has a very good offense around him this year and he as reverted back into the turnovers that plagued him his rookie year. And the defense has not been horrible this year. It has performed well given no Mathis, no? And your STs have been the best in the league.

 

In terms of Dalton. Yes, Luck is better. But their careers and stats have been similar to this point which is what I think Brown was getting at.

You do know Brady had more turnovers in his first 3 (full) years than Luck has had? He's doing fine.

[Everyone]

When you and amfootball are done with the nitpicking Luck vs Chiefs game (which Luck did win!), I'd like to discuss the Brady versus the Bills game in 2003.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/recap?gameId=230907002

That was when Brady was young and early in his career, it's not fair to compare the 2 hahahahahaha

[peytonmanning18]

Luck is closer to Andy Dalton than to the elite guys like Brady and Manning. Luck is better than Dalton but to this point in his career, he has been overrated.

[House]

Luck is closer to Andy Dalton than to the elite guys like Brady and Manning. Luck is better than Dalton but to this point in his career, he has been overrated.

Yeah I remember my first beer too.

[dw49]

So injuries have derailed your season?

 

 

Never said that . Just keep inciting. What I said is Wayne has been horrible since he tore his triceps and Bradshaw was our best running back. Where is this good offense you talk about ? Wayne is done , Richardson rushed for 519 yards , 3 TDs and 3.3 average per rush. The o line is no doubt terrible. Nicks never gets open... like I said we did have pretty good weapons and now we really don't. SWhy do you think we are 3 point favorites over a Cinn team that we actually match up good against ?

[peytonmanning18]

Yeah I remember my first beer too.

I constantly hear how Luck is too 5, he's elite, hell I've even heard that he's the best QB in the NFL on ESPN. He is none of those thing YET=overrated

[House]

I constantly hear how Luck is too 5, he's elite, hell I've even heard that he's the best QB in the NFL in ESPN. He is non of those thing YET=overrated

And nothing like Andy Dalton because Andrew is superior to him.

[peytonmanning18]

And nothing like Andy Dalton because Andrew is superior to him.

That's exactly what I said. But in the scale of quarterbacks in the NFL, Luck is closer to Dalton than to the top guys like Rodgers, Manning, and Brady

[dw49]

Anyone who pays attention and watches the Colts and Bengals know that the difference between the two is night and day.     The Bengals ask Dalton NOT to lose the game for them, the Colts ask Andrew Luck to WIN the game for them.   Huge difference.  

 

In fact Mike Chappell went as far as saying a couple days ago that THIS Colt staff is asking Luck to do more with less than Manning was EVER asked to do.     And I think the same.    That is why I just don't get hung up on his turnovers and inconsistent play.    Get the guy some help.     He has been the most hit QB in the NFL over the last 3 years.    Most mortals would have cracked by now.

 

Stupid is as stupid says....

 

 

They are just over here trying to aggravate Colt fans. 

[dw49]

Luck is closer to Andy Dalton than to the elite guys like Brady and Manning. Luck is better than Dalton but to this point in his career, he has been overrated.

  

 

Brady and Manning are no longer elite. That belongs to just Rodgers. We saw how Brady fared when his RB's weren't running wild and he had a little pressure. Ughhh .

 

Manning is pretty much done. He really needs those freaks he has for receivers to run like heck with his pop gun throws.

[Colts_Fan12]

Valid points Come on AM in Lucks 3 years he has out shined Peyton Mannings first 3 years inspite of the team around him , Bad teams huh you mean like Seattle Denver & San Fran & Daltons Bengals who were not bad teams , 3 seasons on a 11-5 team yeah Luck sucks to a former Patriot " Shocker " your insight is awesome as a homer your ignorance will last longer than your career as a analyst.

I'd love to see luck with the D dalton had

[House]

That's exactly what I said. But in the scale of quarterbacks in the NFL, Luck is closer to Dalton than to the top guys like Rodgers, Manning, and Brady

Not really.

He's second tier, not 3rd or 4th like Dalton.

[dw49]

So Brady steps on the field and does wonder,  and Luck does what?  Here's a quiz-   Which stat line belongs to which QB?, first three full seasons in the NFL:

 

  W    -     L           TD             INT       Avg Rate

 

 34          12          70              38           86.0

 

 33          15          86              43           86.6

 

Very important numbers for a QB.   Who is who?  Who is incredibly superior over the other?

 

 

I'd say the first set of #'s belong to Andrew Luck ? 

[ColtsBlueFL]

They are just over here trying to aggravate Colt fans. 

and they know

the window on P Manning and T Brady is shutting and soon A Luck will be one of the few elite QB's in the NFL as he develops and gets more experience.

[peytonmanning18]

Not really.

He's second tier, not 3rd or 4th like Dalton.

Thanks for making my point

[dw49]

and they know

the window on P Manning and T Brady is shutting and soon A Luck will be one of the few elite QB's in the NFL as he develops and gets more experience.

 

 

Agree with that one

[House]

Thanks for making my point

You're point is that he's closer to Dalton. But he's not. He's closer to the top tier guys.

Thanks for not understanding my point, and most likely your own.

[Everyone]

You're point is that he's closer to Dalton. But he's not. He's closer to the top tier guys.

Thanks for not understanding my point, and most likely your own.

This list is pretty agreeable imo

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000452624/article/qb-index-yearend-rankings

[Fire Pagano]

First, you completely missed my point.

Second, your argument for Brown's ability is lacking.

clearly you are too smart to explain yourself, ill bow out

[Cynjin]

Thanks for making my point

 

He didn't make your point, not that you actually have one.

[peytonmanning18]

He didn't make your point, not that you actually have one.

It's hard to argue that Andrew Luck is not the greatest quarterback of all time on a Colts message board

[Everyone]

It's hard to argue that Andrew Luck is not the greatest quarterback of all time on a Colts message board

Nobody said he was the greatest, they are arguing with you that he is more than an average QB. You and the others can't stand the fact that he is almost as good as Manning and Brady in only his 3rd year.

[House]

It's hard to argue that Andrew Luck is not the greatest quarterback of all time on a Colts message board

Does calling him second tier translate into greatest of all time in your language?

[ColtsBlueFL]

ColtsBlueFL, on 01 Jan 2015 - 2:26 PM, said:

So Brady steps on the field and does wonder,  and Luck does what?  Here's a quiz-   Which stat line belongs to which QB?, first three full seasons in the NFL:

 

  W    -     L           TD             INT       Avg Rate

 

 34          12          70              38           86.0

 

 33          15          86              43           86.6

 

Very important numbers for a QB.   Who is who?  Who is incredibly superior over the other?

 

I'd say the first set of #'s belong to Andrew Luck ? 

 

Believe it or not, the top number is Tom Brady's stats his first 3 years in the league as a starter.  The bottom number is Andrew Lucks numbers in his first 3 years as a starter in the league. I'm very happy with our QB.  I'm less happy with our offensive line protecting him, OTOH.

[John Dee]

I wish Brady, Manning, and Rodgers had to put up with the OL circus and RB situation Luck has had to endure early in his career.

 

That comment is just ...    silly.   Heck if Manning and Brady were hit as much as Luck they would have already retired. 

That's exactly what I said. But in the scale of quarterbacks in the NFL, Luck is closer to Dalton than to the top guys like Rodgers, Manning, and Brady

[peytonmanning18]

Nobody said he was the greatest, they are arguing with you that he is more than an average QB. You and the others can't stand the fact that he is almost as good as Manning and Brady in only his 3rd year.

He's not almost as good. He turned the ball over 22 times this year. Most of them on boneheaded decisions.

[John Dee]

Oh I know.. but I love making trolls look silly.

 

They are just over here trying to aggravate Colt fans.