mathis's letter to the team

[husker61]

Great letter.

If he took it for his post ped to get his natural testosterone going why wasn't any ped found as well or before. Doing what he was doing last year at his age I'm sure he was tested more than that one time.

It's not used to coverup peds when used by lifters, it's used when cycling off to keep the natural levels going.

 

exactly, he may not have been tested in the off season before this test. testing is more often during the season (10 players/week/team). i am sure companies have come up with ped's that leave your system very quickly.

[lollygagger8]

Lol. You still buy his "using it for children" excuse?

Even though it's meant for women? If he were trying for a child, there are much better male fertility drugs .

It's a universal drug for PED users. It's unsurprising that he was busted after having his best season ever when he was in his 30s.

 

Rooting for the Patriots is meant for women, but you still do it.

 

(assuming you are a man) 

[ViriLudant]

Rooting for the Patriots is meant for women, but you still do it.

(assuming you are a man)

Children shouldn't be allowed to post on message boards, mods.

[Coffeedrinker]

Lol. You still buy his "using it for children" excuse?

Even though it's meant for women? If he were trying for a child, there are much better male fertility drugs .

It's a universal drug for PED users. It's unsurprising that he was busted after having his best season ever when he was in his 30s.

 

 

While we can all be blind homers at times, anyone buying the baby nonsense really should......well, you fill in the rest!

Clomid is used by males for fertility as well

 

http://txfertility.com/fertility-treatments/clomid-for-men/

 

http://www.infertility-guide.com/clomid-male-infertility.html

 

http://www.babycenter.com/0_fertility-drugs-for-men_4090.bc

 

http://www.fertilityauthority.com/articles/clomid-and-other-therapies-improving-male-fertility

 

And there are numerous other sources as well.  But that doesn't really matter.  But it seems to me that those that just blindly ignore the fact that it could be for fertility are just as ignorant about the situation as those that blindly accept Mathis' explanation.

The ONLY truths of the situation are:  He took clomid, he got suspended by the league.  Everything else put forward by posters on this forum is just speculation based on their own prejudices.

[Jason_]

Sources?? Where did you hear all this inside info? On the appeal, Mathis and his doc gave them their whole entire medical records. If you are going to make such claims, I want it backed up by more than rumors. It's a FACT that Mathis opened the entire medical records to the NFL...and they didn't buy It....and as a father who a year ago was offered it as a drug to "help things" I can attest to it. We have a 2 month old son to prove it.

 

it had nothing to do with the league "not buying it"...the drug was found in his system, and that is a violation that leads to suspension.  If Mathis is telling the truth and if the league were to have let him off, then others who use it for less nefarious reasons could go on using it and just use the "we're trying to have a baby" excuse.  Maybe it was just an excuse from Mathis, and maybe not.  I don't have the information to make that determination, and neither does anyone else on this forum.

[#87WayneFanHe'sTheMan]

Sources?? Where did you hear all this inside info? On the appeal, Mathis and his doc gave them their whole entire medical records. If you are going to make such claims, I want it backed up by more than rumors. It's a FACT that Mathis opened the entire medical records to the NFL...and they didn't buy It....and as a father who a year ago was offered it as a drug to "help things" I can attest to it. We have a 2 month old son to prove it.

 

I 2nd this I was told by my doctor to use clomid to "help things" and now I am the father of a 6 week old girl. I was also asked before hand if multiple childen would be ok because clomid would increase the possiblity by a lot. Not saying Mathis isn't guilty of anything or that he shouldn't have known better but I am saying that clomid can be and is used by men and it does help.

[Warhorse]

it had nothing to do with the league "not buying it"...the drug was found in his system, and that is a violation that leads to suspension.  If Mathis is telling the truth and if the league were to have let him off, then others who use it for less nefarious reasons could go on using it and just use the "we're trying to have a baby" excuse.  Maybe it was just an excuse from Mathis, and maybe not.  I don't have the information to make that determination, and neither does anyone else on this forum.

this.......and if I ever found out Mathis did it for anything football related, he would lose my respect for good.

[lollygagger8]

Children shouldn't be allowed to post on message boards, mods.

 

If that was the case, you would've been a long time ago. 

[Larry Horseman]

Fact: the Mathis' used fertility treatment for their twins so there is a documented fertility issue: http://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2014/05/16/indianapolis-colts-robert-mathis-suspended-performance-enhancing-drugs/9187069/

 

Fact: Mathis tested positive for Clomid during a time period where it would be plausible for him to be taking it as a fertility drug based on when his child was born. 

 

Fact: Mathis tested positive for Clomid and the reason as to why he was taking doesn't matter per NFL rules. A positive test is a positive test; it is black and white and the motivation behind taking the drug doesn't play into the ruling.

 

Everything else is just opinion...so look at the facts and then keep arguing about it fruitlessly, or just move on, but don't ignore the facts to further your opinion. 

 

Robert is a team leader, the letter is cool as long as he didn't lose any respect with his teammates because of his suspension. 

[braveheartcolt]

Clomid is used by males for fertility as well

 

http://txfertility.com/fertility-treatments/clomid-for-men/

 

http://www.infertility-guide.com/clomid-male-infertility.html

 

http://www.babycenter.com/0_fertility-drugs-for-men_4090.bc

 

http://www.fertilityauthority.com/articles/clomid-and-other-therapies-improving-male-fertility

 

And there are numerous other sources as well.  But that doesn't really matter.  But it seems to me that those that just blindly ignore the fact that it could be for fertility are just as ignorant about the situation as those that blindly accept Mathis' explanation.

The ONLY truths of the situation are:  He took clomid, he got suspended by the league.  Everything else put forward by posters on this forum is just speculation based on their own prejudices.

If a forum, Coffee. Truths are not important.....

[esmort]

i believe that goes for women taking fertility drugs not men. if they are fraternal (not identical) it is because of two eggs being released and absolutely nothing to do with robert's fertility.

 

It has never been addressed whether they were doing some sort of fertility treatment the first time she got pregnant, but the twins make me think there was a good chance.  She may have been the one taking Clomid for the first pregnancy, but not have been able to take it for the second for whatever reason (I am not privy to her medical records), which is why Mathis was taking it this time.

 

I don't know if this is the case or that Mathis is definitely telling the complete truth, but IMO there is enough evidence out there for me to give Mathis the benefit of the doubt.  I think that there is a chance he knew he was not allowed to take the drug, but chose to risk it for fertility reasons (not PEDs), because having a baby outweighed the consequences to him, and if that is the case than a 4 game suspension vs. having a baby = easy decision ... IMO.

[southwest1]

you cant put a price on a child

 

 

You swallowed that did you?

Nice literary reference sarcastic joke to Jonathan Swift's "A Modest Proposal" there BHC.   

 

I don't think CR91 is Irish though or promoting an unspeakable cannibalistic solution as a result of a food shortage though. Dark humor there. My apologies everyone. 

 

http://art-bin.com/art/omodest.html

[Coffeedrinker]

If a forum, Coffee. Truths are not important.....

I must admit, I did not take that into account in my post.

 

I guess if truths were important there would be a ton fewer threads on here.

[jvan1973]

double post

[jvan1973]

Nice literary reference sarcastic joke to Jonathan Swift's "A Modest Proposal" there BHC.

I don't think CR91 is Irish though or promoting an unspeakable cannibalistic solution as a result of a food shortage though. Dark humor there. My apologies everyone.

http://art-bin.com/art/omodest.html

uh, um . ... ok

[Nadine]

Well...yes, what he wrote was wrong even though it was right, but because he was wrong he should write about what he did wrong, right?

OWWCH CHARLIE!

[Nadine]

The letter is good advice for life in general.  Show up, be present.

[southwest1]

It has never been addressed whether they were doing some sort of fertility treatment the first time she got pregnant, but the twins make me think there was a good chance.  She may have been the one taking Clomid for the first pregnancy, but not have been able to take it for the second for whatever reason (I am not privy to her medical records), which is why Mathis was taking it this time.

 

I don't know if this is the case or that Mathis is definitely telling the complete truth, but IMO there is enough evidence out there for me to give Mathis the benefit of the doubt.  I think that there is a chance he knew he was not allowed to take the drug, but chose to risk it for fertility reasons (not PEDs), because having a baby outweighed the consequences to him, and if that is the case than a 4 game suspension vs. having a baby = easy decision ... IMO.

That's where on come down on this issue. Robert Mathis has an impeccable record with no history of violating NFL rules or illegal substances. He wants to have a child. I see no slippery slope here. Robert is a good man who made a tiny mistake/miscalculation that's it. 

[southwest1]

Robert does have a point though. Most of us are not doing what we would call our dream job so if you are lucky enough to actually be doing just that be grateful & don't slack off. 

 

Besides, what other legal avenue as a profession, if you excel at it, will set you up for life after 10-15 years of playing? Answer: Nothing. 

[ViriLudant]

That's where on come down on this issue. Robert Mathis has an impeccable record with no history of violating NFL rules or illegal substances. He wants to have a child. I see no slippery slope here. Robert is a good man who made a tiny mistake/miscalculation that's it.

Except that he had his best season last year, which rarely happens naturally when you're in your 30's in the NFL.

[southwest1]

uh, um . ... ok

BHC's post was tailor made for that obscure literary, historical allusion. That's why I said what I said & walked through the wide open door Jvan.

 

I can understand your confusion over my bizarre response. I get that. It's just that BHC set that up so perfectly that I had to take a swing at it.  ;)

[jvan1973]

Except that he had his best season last year, which rarely happens naturally when you're in your 30's in the NFL.

Peyton Manning had the best year of his career in his late thirties

[southwest1]

Except that he had his best season last year, which rarely happens naturally when you're in your 30's in the NFL.

I will grant you VL that seasoned pass rushers typically have a slight dip in production as they age that's true, but that's like saying that Brady has not won a SB since Spygate & therefore illegal videotaping is solely responsible for his 3 Championships. Complete nonsense. Suspicious perhaps. Conclusive evidence? Absolutely not. 

[Jason_]

Except that he had his best season last year, which rarely happens naturally when you're in your 30's in the NFL.

 

he also had that best season playing Rush LB in a 3-4 for the first time in his career.  RushLB is the position that Mathis was projected to play in the pros and many speculated, not only during that draft process but throughout his career, that he might  be a better fit and have better production as a RushLB instead of a 4-3 DE. 

[husker61]

he also had that best season playing Rush LB in a 3-4 for the first time in his career.  RushLB is the position that Mathis was projected to play in the pros and many speculated, not only during that draft process but throughout his career, that he might  be a better fit and have better production as a RushLB instead of a 4-3 DE. 

 

it was his 2nd year as a rush linebacker.

 

as a de, he rushed the passer. as a rush linebacker he rushed the qb. what's the difference? he almost never dropped into coverage, so what is the difference?

[husker61]

Fact: the Mathis' used fertility treatment for their twins so there is a documented fertility issue: http://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2014/05/16/indianapolis-colts-robert-mathis-suspended-performance-enhancing-drugs/9187069/

 

Fact: Mathis tested positive for Clomid during a time period where it would be plausible for him to be taking it as a fertility drug based on when his child was born. 

 

Fact: Mathis tested positive for Clomid and the reason as to why he was taking doesn't matter per NFL rules. A positive test is a positive test; it is black and white and the motivation behind taking the drug doesn't play into the ruling.

 

Everything else is just opinion...so look at the facts and then keep arguing about it fruitlessly, or just move on, but don't ignore the facts to further your opinion. 

 

 

 

http://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2014/05/16/indianapolis-colts-robert-mathis-suspended-performance-enhancing-drugs/9187069/

 

His wife was unable to take the drug because of a medical condition that would make multiple births extremely dangerous, according to White. Multiple births are more likely when

fertility drugs are used; the Mathis' twin two-year-old sons were conceived through such treatments, according to White.

 

lets add another fact that you left out.

 

fact: roberts wife took fertility drugs for the twins (the above statement, and the fact that he didn't have a positive test at the time the twins were conceived).

 

that would lead to the conclusion that there is no fertility issues on his part.

[Jason_]

it was his 2nd year as a rush linebacker.

as a de, he rushed the passer. as a rush linebacker he rushed the qb. what's the difference? he almost never dropped into coverage, so what is the difference?

No last year was his first year at rushlb. The year before he played Sam and freeney played rush.

And the difference is in the interior dline. This defense is designed to get the best one on one match up for the rushlb. There were times last year, because the dline was doing its job, that Mathis was left one on one with a TE or rb.

Mathis and freeney were both good off the edge, but they never had any help from the interior of the dline.

Not only all that but now he has more of a press man secondary behind him instead of a secondary almost exclusively playing soft zone.

[husker61]

No last year was his first year at rushlb. The year before he played Sam and freeney played rush.

And the difference is in the interior dline. This defense is designed to get the best one on one match up for the rushlb. There were times last year, because the dline was doing its job, that Mathis was left one on one with a TE or rb.

Mathis and freeney were both good off the edge, but they never had any help from the interior of the dline.

Not only all that but now he has more of a press man secondary behind him instead of a secondary almost exclusively playing soft zone.

 

i just seem to remember mathis rushing the passer on most passing situations two years ago, no matter what position he was designated as. wasn't many times a d-lineman taken out and freeney made a de and mathis a rush lb'er? if they are on the field rushing the passer, do they really need a name for their position? the same thing can be said about basketball, your official "position" means absolutely nothing in today's game and not worth nitpicking about.

 

everything else i completely agree with you on. to me, the improved d-line is the most exciting part of the colt's defense this year.

[Coffeedrinker]

Except that he had his best season last year, which rarely happens naturally when you're in your 30's in the NFL.

Strahan set the sack record at 22.5 when he was 30.  And then had perhaps his best overall year (when looking at the complete package) two years later at 32.

[Bobbycovert]

The NFL has a therapeutic usage exemption (TUE) in the rules regarding PEDs.  Mathis could have consulted with the league and likely been granted an exemption for clomid.  I can't think of a reasonable explanation for why he didn't consult anyone with the team or league.  I also find it very difficult to believe that a professional athlete would be unaware of clomid's reputation and it's presence on the list of banned substances.  It doesn't take much research at all to find information about clomid and it's role in steroid usage.

 

Also, one of the other posters asked for a source regarding Mathis' doctor not specializing in fertility:

http://deadspin.com/robert-mathis-picks-a-ped-fight-with-the-nfl-hes-not-go-1578394706

 

I'm sure there are more. This is the first article I found.

[JoKeR]

Lol. You still buy his "using it for children" excuse?

Even though it's meant for women? If he were trying for a child, there are much better male fertility drugs .

It's a universal drug for PED users. It's unsurprising that he was busted after having his best season ever when he was in his 30s.

Doctors prescribe it to men often for fertility issues.

[Larry Horseman]

 

 

that would lead to the conclusion that there is no fertility issues on his part.

 

perhaps...also, not sure if him taking it increases chances if it's just his wife...I'm not a doc...