Mark Brunell haha

[thedude]

 Andrew's victory over the 'Hawks is the most impressive h-2-h stat we can reference.  The fact Luck solved Seattle's defensive dominance speaks volumes about his skills.  RW on the other hand faced our defense and failed.  Conclusions?

The game against Seattle was possibly Luck's most impressive performance, but that was more about Hilton continually burning Brandon Browner than it was about Luck. In fact Browner lost his starting job after that game. Hilton was the MVP in that game.

[Gabriel Alexander Morillo]

It's all about the context of their respective situations, and Luck is in a far worse situation to extract efficient stats. Often times playing from behind results in a lot of forced throws which leads to a hit in the efficiency department. Bluntly put, put Luck in Seattle and his current numbers would increase across the board, the inverse would be true with respect to RW. As the situation stands, RW's efficiency is directly correlated with not being asked to put the team on his shoulders, a very different scenario than Andrew currently finds himself in.

Luck is in that place you speak of, unfortunately his teammates are not. Andrew's victory over the 'Hawks is the most impressive h-2-h stat we can reference. The fact Luck solved Seattle's defensive dominance speaks volumes about his skills. RW on the other hand faced our defense and failed. Conclusions?

I wonder if Blaine gabbert is a top 5qb. His situation is crappy

[Clem-Dog]

Wilson played a lot of games from behind last season. Several times the Seahawks came back from double digit deficits to win. He was pressured consistently all season long as the Seahawks had O line issues from the start. I don't recall one time where Seattle lost a game because their QB made a huge mistake with the game on the line.

This just isn't the case, more like a fantasy.

 

In 13 wins Seattle led from beginning to end eight times and from the 2nd quarter till the end once.  Many of these 9 victories can be directly attributed to the defense, ST, kicking game, or Lynch.  One of the remaining five victories was tied going into the fourth before Lynch and Hausauka finished off the Titans.  Two of the remaining four victories were the direct result of Sherman, Lynch, and Hausuka scoring late. 

 

The only comebacks attributable to RW were in weeks 1 and 9.  In week 1 he overcame a whopping one point 4th quarter deficit and threw a touchdown, and in week 9 he overcame a ten point deficit by contributing another TD pass. 

 

To sum it up I count one double digit deficit he directly impacted, not several like you claim. 

 

By viewing Seattle's results his insignificance is further revealed.

[Clem-Dog]

I wonder if Blaine gabbert is a top 5qb. His situation is crappy

Definitely not.  The difference between Luck and Gabbert is that Luck is capable of turning a crappy situation into a good one, while Gabbert steadily regresses. 

[Gabriel Alexander Morillo]

Definitely not. The difference between Luck and Gabbert is that Luck is capable of turning a crappy situation into a good one, while Gabbert steadily regresses.

We'll never know until gabbs is on a better roster then the jags.

[ColtsLegacy]

^How I feel about this thread.

[Flash7]

Where is that poll? I would like to see it.

Here's an article on that poll. You can also Google "Who would you choose to start an NFL franchise?"

 

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10303066/peyton-manning-denver-broncos-most-respected-nfl-espn-survey

[thedude]

 

By viewing Seattle's results his insignificance is further revealed.

That comment alone proves you are completely clueless.

[Clem-Dog]

That comment alone proves you are completely clueless.

You said RW had multiple double-digit comebacks this past season, when in fact he had one.  Talk about clueless, you are the one making false claims to boost your pov.

 

 

^How I feel about this thread.

 

  Agreed.  It's last years RG3 debate reincarnated. 

[Beauregarde]

Here's an article on that poll. You can also Google "Who would you choose to start an NFL franchise?"

 

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10303066/peyton-manning-denver-broncos-most-respected-nfl-espn-survey

Thank you

[Surge89]

 

...lol

 

For what its worth Colts fans in general tend to harshly diminish what Russell Wilson has done in SEA.  Better team or not Russell has shown he is a great QB and far above average.  On the other hand, while I love Luck and I think he has the potential to be one of the greatest, he does have a gunslinger mentality and needs to tone those turnovers down, or he will not be considered great.  

 

For RG3 and Kap I have not seen anything from these 2 that says "Great QB".  RG3 is highly overrated always has been and Kap is talented but for some reason tends to be heavily team reliant... not sure why, but he just doesn't show the "IT" to me.

 

For what its worth that is my opinion and I'm sticking to it! ;)

[thedude]

You said RW had multiple double-digit comebacks this past season, when in fact he had one. 

You are wrong.

[thedude]

Against the Texans, Bucs and 49ers, they were down by ten or more points, but came back and won That's just off the top of my head. There might be more.

[Dustin]

Wilson played a lot of games from behind last season. Several times the Seahawks came back from double digit deficits to win. He was pressured consistently all season long as the Seahawks had O line issues from the start. I don't recall one time where Seattle lost a game because their QB made a huge mistake with the game on the line.

 

By the way didn't you used to post under the handle tahuyman?

[Flash7]

By the way did you used to post under the handle tahuyman?

This is probably one of the best responses I've seen to an argument....undeniable evidence. Well done, sir.

[Dustin]

This is probably one of the best responses I've seen to an argument....undeniable evidence. Well done, Dustin.

 

Think that's good? Here's another:

 

 

Terrible, low throw to a wide-open receiver leads to an interception in the last few minutes of the Hawks-Cardinals game in week 17. If you can blame Luck for the INTs that bounced off of Hilton and Havili, then I don't see how you can't blame this one on Wilson.

 

I have no idea how thedude can claim to be a Seahawks fan and claim that Wilson has never made a mistake that has led to a loss. 

[Flash7]

Think that's good? Here's another:

Terrible, low throw to a wide-open receiver leads to an interception in the last few minutes of the Hawks-Cardinals game in week 17. If you can blame Luck for the INTs that bounced off of Hilton and Havili, then I don't see how you can't blame this one on Wilson.

I have no idea how thedude can claim to be a Seahawks fan and claim that Wilson has never made a mistake that has led to a loss.

You absolutely can blame this INT on RW. He was late on the throw and then greatly under threw it. You can't blame the receiver for attempting to catch the pass. It was a bad throw.

So far, that's two cases of undeniable visual evidence that RW has thrown INTs with the game on the line.

[Shane Bond]

Wilson is the new Brady. Luck is the new Manning.

 

Wilson will win championships with overall better team aka Brady.

 

Luck will drag himself as hard as he can aka Manning.

[amfootball]

Wilson is the new Brady. Luck is the new Manning.

 

Wilson will win championships with overall better team aka Brady.

 

Luck will drag himself as hard as he can aka Manning.

I have seen this comment a few times now and each time it leaves me baffled. Wasn't the whole point of getting rid of Polian to build a team like Seattle has that wins rings with not expecting the QB to carry everything? When I watched the Colt this year they asked a lot less of Andrew then they did last year for sure and he excelled and so did the team as they had less come from behind wins and more impressive wins as well beating Seattle, Niners, Denver. The playoffs were a different story as due to injuries, Luck had to do more then what was asked of him in the regular season. Why after two seasons would this type of statement be made? Not to mention the fact that neither QB plays anything like Manning or Brady.

[Shane Bond]

I have seen this comment a few times now and each time it leaves me baffled. Wasn't the whole point of getting rid of Polian to build a team like Seattle has that wins rings with not expecting the QB to carry everything? When I watched the Colt this year they asked a lot less of Andrew then they did last year for sure and he excelled and so did the team as they had less come from behind wins and more impressive wins as well beating Seattle, Niners, Denver. The playoffs were a different story as due to injuries, Luck had to do more then what was asked of him in the regular season. Why after two seasons would this type of statement be made? Not to mention the fact that neither QB plays anything like Manning or Brady.

They dont have to play like Brady or Manning. 

 

Read carefully. Point was their career will resemble like them.

 

Sure, the whole idea was to build the monster. I dont see it yet. Did you see Colts OL?. Lot to be desired.

 

And compare both Colts and Seattle TODAY. Which is a better team and which team has better QB?.

[amfootball]

They dont have to play like Brady or Manning. 

 

Read carefully. Point was their career will resemble like them.

 

Sure, the whole idea was to build the monster. I dont see it yet. Did you see Colts OL?. Lot to be desired.

 

And compare both Colts and Seattle TODAY. Which is a better team and which team has better QB?.

For their careers to resemble them they will have to play like them and honestly I don't see much of either QB in either of them. Brady and Manning are once in a lifetime IMO.

 

I am not sure if you want to be that hard on the Colts org just yet after two years. Carroll has been building his monster in Seattle for a few years and found his QB in Wilson in the third round. You are projecting an awful lot if you think the Seahawks are going to win 2 of the next 3 SBs like the Pats did their first four years with Brady. I am not sure they even win their division next year much less get back to the bowl and win it. And by the same token you are projecting an awful lot of futility for the Colts if you think they will be solely reliant on Luck for the next decade.

 

This prisoner of the moment thing has to stop at some point. Seattle does not have all the answers despite their recent championship. And other teams still have just as much chance to win next year as they did before this season. The off-season will go along way in determine which teams contend.

[Shane Bond]

For their careers to resemble them they will have to play like them and honestly I don't see much of either QB in either of them. Brady and Manning are once in a lifetime IMO.

I am not sure if you want to be that hard on the Colts org just yet after two years. Carroll has been building his monster in Seattle for a few years and found his QB in Wilson in the third round. You are projecting an awful lot if you think the Seahawks are going to win 2 of the next 3 SBs like the Pats did their first four years with Brady. I am not sure they even win their division next year much less get back to the bowl and win it. And by the same token you are projecting an awful lot of futility for the Colts if you think they will be solely reliant on Luck for the next decade.

This prisoner of the moment thing has to stop at some point. Seattle does not have all the answers despite their recent championship. And other teams still have just as much chance to win next year as they did before this season. The off-season will go along way in determine which teams contend.

What answer Seattle doesn't have?. It's absolutely normal to think they have the potential to win a bunch of them.

Don't undermine Luck and Wilson. They are extremely good QBs for their age. They only get better. They are very easily comparable to Brady and Manning after 2 years into their career.

[amfootball]

What answer Seattle doesn't have?. It's absolutely normal to think they have the potential to win a bunch of them.

Don't undermine Luck and Wilson. They are extremely good QBs for their age. They only get better. They are very easily comparable to Brady and Manning after 2 years into their career.

How do you feel about the Colts FO? I think they are moving in the same direction as Seattle or at least trying to. Carroll did get awfully lucky with some of his late round picks with Sherman and Wilson being the two biggest scores.

 

Also, many thought GB would rip off a few after 2010 but then they had some poor drafts, had to pay Rodgers and now can't seem to beat the Niners. It is just tough to win championships is my main point but I do agree that Seattle has potential.

[thedude]

 

By the way didn't you used to post under the handle tahuyman?

Heavy sigh......

[thedude]

For their careers to resemble them they will have to play like them and honestly I don't see much of either QB in either of them. Brady and Manning are once in a lifetime IMO..

And now in just his second year, Wilson has led a team to the same amount of NFL championships as Peyton Manning.

[thedude]

Think that's good? Here's another:

Terrible, low throw to a wide-open receiver leads to an interception in the last few minutes of the Hawks-Cardinals game in week 17. If you can blame Luck for the INTs that bounced off of Hilton and Havili, then I don't see how you can't blame this one on Wilson.

I have no idea how thedude can claim to be a Seahawks fan and claim that Wilson has never made a mistake that has led to a loss.

When did I say Wilson has "never" made a mistake? I said that he minimizes mistakes. And that's a fact. You don't see him make the same mistakes over and over. In other words, he minimizes his mistakes.

[Dustin]

When did I say Wilson has "never" made a mistake?

 

When did I say you said that? Maybe you should read the last line of the post you just quoted over a few times.

[Dustin]

Heavy sigh......

 

So i'll take that as a yes. 

[thedude]

When did I say you said that? Maybe you should read the last line of the post you just quoted over a few times.

In the post I quoted. That's why I responded and quoted you.

[thedude]

So i'll take that as a yes.

You'll think what you want no matter what, so think what you want. It's nothing I'll worry about.

[Dustin]

In the post I quoted. That's why I responded and quoted you.

 

You said:

 

When did I say Wilson has "never" made a mistake?

 

I said in the post you quoted:

 

I have no idea how thedude can claim to be a Seahawks fan and claim that Wilson has never made a mistake that has led to a loss.

 

See now?

[JoKeR]

Wilson is a great, young QB but it seems like the Seahawks offense dominates mostly because of the run game. The Seahawks have a more well rounded offense and a dominate D. In no way am I saying Wilson isn't a top QB, I just don't think they depend on him as much as Indy depends on Luck. Indy is still figuring it out while Seattle is complete, obviously.

[thedude]

I'm not into to splitting hairs. Carry on....

[Dustin]

I'm not into to splitting hairs. Carry on....

 

You seem to be into being wrong. 

[JoKeR]

I'm sure Wilson was never accused of making some bad decisions or not being accurate at times. Never.

[thedude]

You seem to be into being wrong.

You claimed that I said that Wilson never made a mistake. That was incorrect. I said he minimizes mistakes. Now split hairs any way you wish.

[southwest1]

Wilson is a great, young QB but it seems like the Seahawks offense dominates mostly because of the run game. The Seahawks have a more well rounded offense and a dominate D. In no way am I saying Wilson isn't a top QB, I just don't think they depend on him as much as Indy depends on Luck. Indy is still figuring it out while Seattle is complete, obviously.

 

Well put Joker. 

For their careers to resemble them they will have to play like them and honestly I don't see much of either QB in either of them. Brady and Manning are once in a lifetime IMO.

 

I am not sure if you want to be that hard on the Colts org just yet after two years. Carroll has been building his monster in Seattle for a few years and found his QB in Wilson in the third round. You are projecting an awful lot if you think the Seahawks are going to win 2 of the next 3 SBs like the Pats did their first four years with Brady. I am not sure they even win their division next year much less get back to the bowl and win it. And by the same token you are projecting an awful lot of futility for the Colts if you think they will be solely reliant on Luck for the next decade.

 

This prisoner of the moment thing has to stop at some point. Seattle does not have all the answers despite their recent championship. And other teams still have just as much chance to win next year as they did before this season. The off-season will go along way in determine which teams contend.

I agree amfootball that both Manning & Brady are 1 of kind players not easily duplicated & yes Pete Carroll did get lucky with late round draft picks for their franchise. But, I read Shane's perspective like this: RW is a lot like Tom Brady in 2001. He had a great defense, a reliable ground game, & RW exercised solid ball security making crucial throws at the right time just like Brady did when he won his 1st Championship. All the ingredients are there in the Pacific NW to make another SB run. 

 

Regarding Luck, we need a heathy Bradshaw & some nice new o-linemen & INDY will be just fine. Ballard...What is the status of his rehab anyway? I need an update darn it. LOL! 

[amfootball]

Well put Joker. 

I agree amfootball that both Manning & Brady are 1 of kind players not easily duplicated & yes Pete Carroll did get lucky with late round draft picks for their franchise. But, I read Shane's perspective like this: RW is a lot like Tom Brady in 2001. He had a great defense, a reliable ground game, & Tom exercised solid ball security making crucial throws at the right time just like Brady did when he won his 1st Championship. All the ingredients are there in the Pacific NW to make another SB run. 

 

Regarding Luck, we need a heathy Bradshaw & some nice new o-linemen & INDY will be just fine. Ballard...What is the status of his rehab anyway. I need an update darn it. LOL! 

Hey SW,

 

I see some similarities to Brady but Seattle was a SB fav this year. The Pats in 2001 came out of nowhere to win a SB with a very average defense that played well in the post-season and Brady did not have the run game Wilson had either. I like Wilson a lot as he does have many of the same qualities as Brady in terms of his leadership at a young age, his desire to be great, and not being satisfied with one ring. He said right after he won the SB to the NFL Network guys that he wants more. I like that and that is very Brady-like but their games are also very different. Brady was and is much better from the pocket whereas Wilson is better with his feet. Still though he has the knack for making the critical plays to win like Brady.

 

I honestly don't see any similarities between Luck and Manning. Luck's game is much more like Elway. The draft guys were right when they compared him to being the best QB prospect since Elway. And of course the Colts are trying to put more of a team around him vs what they did with Manning. I don't think we will ever see a QB run the Indy offense. Even though at its core it is a simple offense, it takes a mind like Manning to make it work and I don't think any GM or coach would ask that of his QB.

[Dustin]

You claimed that I said that Wilson never made a mistake. That was incorrect. I said he minimizes mistakes. Now split hairs any way you wish.

 

Denial. Good day sir. 

[BOTT]

I wonder if Blaine gabbert is a top 5qb. His situation is crappy

Post of the year right there