Luck 9 INTs Manning 10 INTs

[danlhart87]

That's at least one aspect I am very happy Luck improved on. I am very happy with Luck. Happy Manning is doing so well though too.

[Andy]

Manning has 659 attempts this season and 10 INTS. That's a 1.51% INT percentage.

 

Luck has 570 attempts this season and 9 INTS. That's a 1.57% INT percentage.

 

Not technically true, and even then, it's only one pick. 

[danlhart87]

Those 9 INTs are a HUGE improvement from last years 18

[Andy]

Those 9 INTs are a HUGE improvement from last years 18

 

Yessir, more efficient, less aggressive offense. Makes sense.

[danlhart87]

He made a lot of throws that werent needed in his rookie year. Luck will only get better. Colts will be good for years. Broncos better hope they win with Manning next couple years cause if not they are screwed.

[dw49]

Manning has 659 attempts this season and 10 INTS. That's a 1.51% INT percentage.

 

Luck has 570 attempts this season and 9 INTS. That's a 1.57% INT percentage.

 

Not technically true, and even then, it's only one pick. 

 

 

Thread and post was fine (nothing "not true") , he didn't say anything other than Luck had 9 and Manning had 10 . He added that both did well in that department. 

[Gabriel Alexander Morillo]

Luck>Manning?

Luck=Goat?

[IndyScribe]

He made a lot of throws that werent needed in his rookie year. Luck will only get better. Colts will be good for years. Broncos better hope they win with Manning next couple years cause if not they are screwed.

Agreed. A lot of Broncos fans were bashing us for letting Peyton go after he broke both records, but I think getting Luck was the right choice. Also, I think Peyton might be done after this year. He's 37, and playing at an unbelievable level. If he doesn't retire this year, he probably will next year.

[House]

Manning has 659 attempts this season and 10 INTS. That's a 1.51% INT percentage.

Luck has 570 attempts this season and 9 INTS. That's a 1.57% INT percentage.

Not technically true, and even then, it's only one pick.

Errr. Yes it technically is true. Nothing was said about interception to passes percentage.

No bonus points for throwing the ball more.

[GoColts8818]

Errr. Yes it technically is true. Nothing was said about interception to passes percentage.

No bonus points for throwing the ball more.

Yes but those things matter.  I mean Hasselbeck has less than Manning and Luck too but there is clearly a reason for that. 

[Coltivated]

55 touchdowns, how many did luck have

[House]

Yes but those things matter. I mean Hasselbeck has less than Manning and Luck too but there is clearly a reason for that.

Matter to what ends though? If this was a thread discussing how they each achieved a low number of INTs that would be relevant. Obviously there is a story to how these numbers were achieved. No one is questioning that.

But the fact that Luck had one less than Peyton can't really be disputed.

[House]

55 touchdowns, how many did luck have

56.

[nburgmei]

I feel like Luck's interceptions could be MUCH higher. He's made some pretty terrible throws and have had defenders just drop passes that hit them square in the hands. He's certainly improved, but he still has some trouble giving up on plays when he should just throw it away. 

 

That being said, and so I don't look like a complete kill joy, he's still improved considerably and I'm glad we've got him over all of the other young QBs in the league.

[Superman]

I feel like Luck's interceptions could be MUCH higher. He's made some pretty terrible throws and have had defenders just drop passes that hit them square in the hands. He's certainly improved, but he still has some trouble giving up on plays when he should just throw it away.

That being said, and so I don't look like a complete kill joy, he's still improved considerably and I'm glad we've got him over all of the other young QBs in the league.

That's true of every quarterback in the league.

[House]

I feel like Luck's interceptions could be MUCH higher. He's made some pretty terrible throws and have had defenders just drop passes that hit them square in the hands. He's certainly improved, but he still has some trouble giving up on plays when he should just throw it away.

That being said, and so I don't look like a complete kill joy, he's still improved considerably and I'm glad we've got him over all of the other young QBs in the league.

Insert most any QBs name into this first paragraph and it's still 100% accurate.

[amfootball]

I guess this board will do anything to prop Luck up. Nice job on his INTs this year but honestly that is the only area where is comparable to Manning this season with a lot less attempts to boot. I just wish Manning had stayed in longer to beat Brees yardage by more then one yard.

[GoColts8818]

Matter to what ends though? If this was a thread discussing how they each achieved a low number of INTs that would be relevant. Obviously there is a story to how these numbers were achieved. No one is questioning that.

But the fact that Luck had one less than Peyton can't really be disputed.

It matters when one QB threw significantly more passes than the other.  That's why that stat is kept.  With that said it doesn't mean Luck's numbers are unimpressive they are. 

 

With that said Luck did throw less INTs than Manning but like I said Hasselbeck threw less than both too but if someone start a thread over that people would very quickly point out the number of passes thrown for Hasselbeck in his backup role vs. the other two as starters.  Manning threw roughly 100 more passes than Luck going into this weekend.  To not factor that in when looking at the INT numbers isn't giving you an honest gage on which QB did a better job protecting the football which I think matters a lot more than which one threw more INTs than the other.

 

With that said just about any team would take what Peyton Manning or Andrew Luck did this season in terms of not throwing an INT this season.

[House]

It matters when one QB threw significantly more passes than the other. That's why that stat is kept. With that said it doesn't mean Luck's numbers are unimpressive they are.

With that said Luck did throw less INTs than Manning but like I said Hasselbeck threw less than both too but if someone start a thread over that people would very quickly point out the number of passes thrown for Hasselbeck in his backup role vs. the other two as starters. Manning threw roughly 100 more passes than Luck going into this weekend. To not factor that in when looking at the INT numbers isn't giving you an honest gage on which QB did a better job protecting the football which I think matters a lot more than which one threw more INTs than the other.

With that said just about any team would take what Peyton Manning or Andrew Luck did this season in terms of not throwing an INT this season.

"With that said", none of that has to do with what the thread was started as. It's not a "Andrew is better than Peyton" thread. OP gave credit to both guys. Andrew has one less. It's a fact.

Your Hasselbeck comparison isn't apples to apples, or even valid to the argument you're trying to make. Both Andrew and Peyton slung the ball all over this year. Peyton more so than Andrew, but Andrew's small sample size isn't exactly small. Quite easy to work with. It's significant enough to make a comparison, without having to qualifying it.

Obviously Peyton's lower Int to pass ratio tells the story of how accurate he's been and how he got to that number. But like I said before. You don't get bonus points for volume.

[GoColts8818]

"With that said", none of that has to do with what the thread was started as. It's not a "Andrew is better than Peyton" thread. OP gave credit to both guys. Andrew has one less. It's a fact.

Your Hasselbeck comparison isn't apples to apples, or even valid to the argument you're trying to make. Both Andrew and Peyton slung the ball all over this year. Peyton more so than Andrew, but Andrew's small sample size isn't exactly small. Quite easy to work with. It's significant enough to make a comparison, without having to qualifying it.

Obviously Peyton's lower Int to pass ratio tells the story of how accurate he's been and how he got to that number. But like I said before. You don't get bonus points for volume.

and I am saying that's not looking at the whole picture.  Hasselback has less than both should we start a thread over that too because it's fact or should be tell the whole story? That's my point with the Hasselbeck thing.  You can say point out the fact he's thrown less than Manning and Luck but if you don't include the fact he's a back up you aren't telling the whole story.  That's all I am saying here you can say Manning threw one more than Luck this year and you are right it's fact.  However, if you don't include the fact that Manning threw the ball almost 100 more times this season than Luck then you aren't telling the whole story. 

 

Again, like I said both Luck and Manning had very good seasons in terms of not throwing INTs and any coach would gladly take either one of their seasons in that department so no it's not Luck vs. Manning.  I am just saying tell the whole story and saying why he brought up the INT rate and why it matters and why you can't just look at number of INTs only. 

[BOTT]

Great thread

[Jules]

Colts beat the Broncos this year.

 

Luck>Manning

[House]

and I am saying that's not looking at the whole picture. Hasselback has less than both should we start a thread over that too because it's fact or should be tell the whole story? That's my point with the Hasselbeck thing. You can say point out the fact he's thrown less than Manning and Luck but if you don't include the fact he's a back up you aren't telling the whole story. That's all I am saying here you can say Manning threw one more than Luck this year and you are right it's fact. However, if you don't include the fact that Manning threw the ball almost 100 more times this season than Luck then you aren't telling the whole story.

Again, like I said both Luck and Manning had very good seasons in terms of not throwing INTs and any coach would gladly take either one of their seasons in that department so no it's not Luck vs. Manning. I am just saying tell the whole story and saying why he brought up the INT rate and why it matters and why you can't just look at number of INTs only.

If you think comparing Hasselbeck this season to either of these guys is the same as comparing Andrew to Peyton, that's about as far as this discussion needs to go.

[GoColts8818]

If you think comparing Hasselbeck this season to either of these guys is the same as comparing Andrew to Peyton, that's about as far as this discussion needs to go.

I am not comparing either of them seriously.  I know the Hasselbeck thing is absurd but I am using it to prove my point which is you can't just look at INT numbers by themselves alone or you don't get the full story and that's why the INT per pass rate number matters. 

[House]

I am not comparing either of them seriously. I know the Hasselbeck thing is absurd but I am using it to prove my point which is you can't just look at INT numbers by themselves alone or you don't get the full story and that's why the INT per pass rate number matters.

The difference between Hasselbeck and Luck, and Hasselbeck and Peyton isn't comparable.

The differences between Luck and Peyton however are comparable. And while Peyton does have more throws, it's not so many that Peyton can't be compared to Andrew.

That's like saying you can only compare QBs who are within 10 pass attempts of each other.

[GoColts8818]

The difference between Hasselbeck and Luck, and Hasselbeck and Peyton isn't comparable.

The differences between Luck and Peyton however are comparable. And while Peyton does have more throws, it's not so many that Peyton can't be compared to Andrew.

but it's fact...that's the same line you keep using...Not looking at anything else only looking at which QB threw less INTs than the other...

 

That's my whole point you CAN'T just look at JUST that number.  You need to look at other things like who threw more passes than the other and who was a starter and back up.

 

With that said I go back to what I keep saying BOTH Luck and Manning had great years in terms of protecting the football. 

[House]

but it's fact...that's the same line you keep using...Not looking at anything else only looking at which QB threw less INTs than the other...

That's my whole point you CAN'T just look at JUST that number. You need to look at other things like who threw more passes than the other and who was a starter and back up.

With that said I go back to what I keep saying BOTH Luck and Manning had great years in terms of protecting the football.

I honestly can't tell if you are messing with me at this point.

Nowhere did I say not to make note of the differences in pass attempts. However, the discrepancy between the two isn't large enough to make their stats incomparable.

That number is fact. You can reference the pass attempts, but ultimately that doesn't change much. Who knows if Andrew threw another 100 passes if he would have had another INT. Maybe he would maybe he wouldn't. That discussion however is extraneous to the one that is being had.

[CopenhagenColt]

I fail to see why this should be important. Peyton has thrown way more TD's and yards than Luck, and Peyton is the clearest MVP choice for a very long time.

 

We made the right decision in letting Manning go. We needed to build a new team for the future and Luck is the right man for that job. We all hope that the Colts will win the Super Bowl, but if we don't (realisticly I can't imagine this team winning the SB) I would love to see Peyton with the Lombardi trophy in his hands again.

 

Peyton deserves all the succes he's having and all the records he has smashed this season. He is truly one of the best QB's to ever have played the game.

 

Luck will hopefully only get better and better and when he hangs up his helmet, hopefully he will have had a career comparable to Peyton.

[Warhawk]

6th lowest interception percentage in NFL history.

 

Just saying.

[GoColts8818]

I honestly can't tell if you are messing with me at this point.

Nowhere did I say not to make note of the differences in pass attempts. However, the discrepancy between the two isn't large enough to make their stats incomparable.

That number is fact. You can reference the pass attempts, but ultimately that doesn't change much. Who knows if Andrew threw another 100 passes if he would have had another INT. Maybe he would maybe he wouldn't. That discussion however is extraneous to the one that is being had.

and it's also fact that Hasselbeck threw less than Manning and Luck.  I know I am using an absurd comparison I am doing it to prove my point which is just looking at the INT number alone with no context around it doesn't tell you very much.  You need to look at the context around like Manning threw nearly 100 more passes this year than Luck and only one more INTs and that Hasselback is a back up.  Once you do that the number of INTs meaning changes a little bit.  That's the whole reason the INT per pass attempt number is kept to give it some context.

 

Now again, like I said both Manning and Luck had great years in terms of not turning the ball over so it's really splitting hairs rather we look at INTs to pass attempts or INTs in general. 

[House]

and it's also fact that Hasselbeck threw less than Manning and Luck. I know I am using an absurd comparison I am doing it to prove my point which is just looking at the INT number alone with no context around it doesn't tell you very much. You need to look at the context around like Manning threw nearly 100 more passes this year than Luck and only one more INTs and that Hasselback is a back up. Once you do that the number of INTs meaning changes a little bit. That's the whole reason the INT per pass attempt number is kept to give it some context.

Now again, like I said both Manning and Luck had great years in terms of not turning the ball over so it's really splitting hairs rather we look at INTs to pass attempts or INTs in general.

Round and around we go.

[Warhawk]

Round and around we go.

 

He's right y'know, if you're comparing two players based on interceptions, the appropriate measure is interception percentage, not raw interceptions.

[No 1 Manning Fan]

I guess this board will do anything to prop Luck up. Nice job on his INTs this year but honestly that is the only area where is comparable to Manning this season with a lot less attempts to boot. I just wish Manning had stayed in longer to beat Brees yardage by more then one yard.

I'll say it once again to you, this is a Colts forum. We like to praise our players when we feel like it's warranted, even when outsiders might disagree. Luck made great strides in his ability to protect the ball. The OP hit the nail on the head.

[House]

He's right y'know, if you're comparing two players based on interceptions, the appropriate measure is interception percentage, not raw interceptions.

One is the number, and one better explains the number. Nowhere did I say ignore the pass attempts.

The post I initially quoted said that technically Andrew didn't throw less. However, in all technical gauges he did. He just didn't throw as many passes.

[GoColts8818]

He's right y'know, if you're comparing two players based on interceptions, the appropriate measure is interception percentage, not raw interceptions.

Thank you that was the only point I was trying to make.

[MikeVander]

He also had 2 fumbles lost this year compared to 5 last year. 

[MikeVander]

He's right y'know, if you're comparing two players based on interceptions, the appropriate measure is interception percentage, not raw interceptions.

How many times have we seen Brady do dinky passes horizontally rather than down the field? That boosts his attempts without really risking an interception. So maybe percentage isn't the best measure. 

[buccolts]

He also had 2 fumbles lost this year compared to 5 last year. 

 

Oh yeah! Well, how does his fumble percentage match up to Peyton's?

'Cause that seems to be all that's important in this thread.

[Warhawk]

How many times have we seen Brady do dinky passes horizontally rather than down the field? That boosts his attempts without really risking an interception. So maybe percentage isn't the best measure. 

 

The question isn't whether interception percentage is the best measure of a QB in general, but whether it's a better measure than just the number of interceptions in the abstract.  Which it is.  If you're looking for a stat that's just a better measure of a QB... try passer rating.  Because INT% is incorporated in it (along with TD%, YPA, and Completion %).

 

Besides, the only way your comment about Brady is relevant is if you want to make the argument that Manning has been dinking and dunking all year and has boosted his attempts in doing so.  Good luck with that.

[House]

The question isn't whether interception percentage is the best measure of a QB in general, but whether it's a better measure than just the number of interceptions in the abstract. Which it is. If you're looking for a stat that's just a better measure of a QB... try passer rating. Because INT% is incorporated in it (along with TD%, YPA, and Completion %).

Besides, the only way your comment about Brady is relevant is if you want to make the argument that Manning has been dinking and dunking all year and has boosted his attempts in doing so. Good luck with that.

The actual question at hand, in which I raised issue with and you and another poster interjected, was if Peyton's better ratio meant Luck didn't actually throw less picks.