Training Camp Begins..

[Golfr]

I think Colt's fan should brace themselves. For the next 5-6 weeks or so -- until the season actually begins (if no longer) -- the team is going to receiver A LOT of disrespect. We are going to get bad-mouthed both on and off the record.

There is no reason why anyone not associated with the program should be overly optimistic about us. Not as of now.

We've got question marks everywhere. We have two known quantities on defense Angerer and Bethea. Both Freeney and Mathis are seen as question marks until (A) they prove they can handle OLB, and (B) Manusky shows it can use them both effectively. Until then, they're unknown.

We've got question marks everywhere on offense as well. Every position group is unknown right now until they show it on the field.

We released a ton of talent and replaced some of it with 3 OK players from Baltimore where Pagano was, and some OK players from Philly where Grigson came from. To outside people, those players are suspect until they prove themselves as starters for us.

We should all grow some much thicker skin. Until we show we can win an actual NFL game, we are among the pre-season leaders for low expectations and disrespect.

If you think you've seen a lot of it up to now, prepare yourself, because a whole LOT more is coming.

I'm just sayin....

Who are you to be making all of these predictions? I think we will be fine. Im just sayin.............

[Golfr]

I think Colt's fan should brace themselves. For the next 5-6 weeks or so -- until the season actually begins (if no longer) -- the team is going to receiver A LOT of disrespect. We are going to get bad-mouthed both on and off the record.

There is no reason why anyone not associated with the program should be overly optimistic about us. Not as of now.

We've got question marks everywhere. We have two known quantities on defense Angerer and Bethea. Both Freeney and Mathis are seen as question marks until (A) they prove they can handle OLB, and (B) Manusky shows it can use them both effectively. Until then, they're unknown.

We've got question marks everywhere on offense as well. Every position group is unknown right now until they show it on the field.

We released a ton of talent and replaced some of it with 3 OK players from Baltimore where Pagano was, and some OK players from Philly where Grigson came from. To outside people, those players are suspect until they prove themselves as starters for us.

We should all grow some much thicker skin. Until we show we can win an actual NFL game, we are among the pre-season leaders for low expectations and disrespect.

If you think you've seen a lot of it up to now, prepare yourself, because a whole LOT more is coming.

I'm just sayin....

What are you talking about? Have you ever played the game? Have you ever been in a fight? Disrespect? The Colts could lose every game this year and still get RESPECT!! Respect is earned not from just winning but from playing hard and smackin someone in the mouth. Respect comes from playing with hart. Where do you get this crap from? Are you serious? Everybody is going to make fun of the Colts? Let em. Do you think that other teams QBs and O linemen are going to criticize Freeny and Mathis when they sack and force a fumble. I have played sports and games all my life and I respect more opponents I have beaten then have beaten me or my team. This is the NFL dude. We have professionals on this team. There is no way in heck we are disrespected this year more then last. Quit spittin out this * until you see what a well coached, non undersized OL/DL can do. I believe you will be surprised.

You say 2 known quanities on D? Freeny and Mathis are question marks? Its football dude..........either you can play or not. Freeny and mathis are ballers. Angerer and Conner are football players. Redding, Nevis, Chapman are not a bunch of wimps. This D will play with attitude speed and be well coached.................give em a chance.

Offensively................I have no idea what you are talking about but if this line can block a little we have play makers all over the place. The O line may not be the best but we can scheme...............we can get Luck out of the pocket.............this kid is an athelete.

As much as you can throw out that we will suck and be disrespected I can throw back.

It cant be no worse then last year. Sorry for the rant but GD chill.

Just sayin.......

[Gavin]

What are you talking about? Have you ever played the game? Have you ever been in a fight? Disrespect? The Colts could lose every game this year and still get RESPECT!! Respect is earned not from just winning but from playing hard and smackin someone in the mouth. Respect comes from playing with hart. Where do you get this crap from? Are you serious? Everybody is going to make fun of the Colts? Let em. Do you think that other teams QBs and O linemen are going to criticize Freeny and Mathis when they sack and force a fumble. I have played sports and games all my life and I respect more opponents I have beaten then have beaten me or my team. This is the NFL dude. We have professionals on this team. There is no way in heck we are disrespected this year more then last. Quit spittin out this * until you see what a well coached, non undersized OL/DL can do. I believe you will be surprised.

You say 2 known quanities on D? Freeny and Mathis are question marks? Its football dude..........either you can play or not. Freeny and mathis are ballers. Angerer and Conner are football players. Redding, Nevis, Chapman are not a bunch of wimps. This D will play with attitude speed and be well coached.................give em a chance.

Offensively................I have no idea what you are talking about but if this line can block a little we have play makers all over the place. The O line may not be the best but we can scheme...............we can get Luck out of the pocket.............this kid is an athelete.

As much as you can throw out that we will suck and be disrespected I can throw back.

It cant be no worse then last year. Sorry for the rant but GD chill.

Just sayin.......

Just to give you an idea what were up against cause I dont think you fully realize what we are up against

1.A brand new scheme on both sides of the ball

2.3 new offensive linemen, 2 of which has been no better then a bench player (Justuce) another player who was bullied last year in his 4 starts (Mcglynn), the 3rd one is our best pick up (Satele)

3.Two defensive ends who are playing a new position for the first time one of which should be fine (Freeney) since it seems he will be asked to do what he has always done most of the time and thats rush the passer, Mathis will be asked to drop more which means that defenses wont have to worry about blocking both as much which could lead to Freeney being double teamed more.

4.Powers is ok at best at Corner but is an actual #2, what else do we have?

Josh Chapman looks like he will start the season on the PUP list, hopefully Mckinney will do a decent job for us

5.a first time head coach

sure all those things are fixable and they may surprise us but the history of many of these players with a couple exceptions says that we have some backups playing as starters, Primarily Justice and Mcglynn

[unitaswestand]

Honestly, in this modern age of free agency and teams having almost no depth or quality teams across the board, it is hard to predict much of anything. The Colts might go 4-12, but they might go 9-7. The Colts still have some very good players on their team. The NFL shows now a good QB can make a mediocre team play much better. And rookie QBs can perform better than anticipated. I think alot of it comes down to coaching and gameplanning. I really like what both Arians and Pagano bring to the table. I expect them to offset maybe pure talent with keeping the other teams off guard.

Shot in the dark, but I am guessing the Colts go 8-8 or 9-7. I think the team is better than what people think, and Luck having two potentially good TEs is going to surprise a lot of teams. I also think Freeney and Mathis will have monster years.

[NewColtsFan]

Golfr...

No disrespect to you, or anyone else here, or the Colts. None.

You don't have to pay any attention to me. I was only trying to address negative comments about the Colts from both the media and from those in the NFL. And the very likelihood that we're going to be getting more negative comments about us leading up to the regular season.

I'm completely chill. You read my black and white text as some kind of rant. Sorry, it was not intended that way. But, I was a member of the media for 30 years. I've followed the NFL for 45 years. If I'm wrong about what's coming for the next month or so -- great. No harm done. But, if I'm right, then we as colts fans know what's coming.

Bottom line: We've got to prove ourselves on the field. And in the NFL, the only way to do that is to win.

Just my two cents.... for what little it may be worth to you or anyone else...

Again, no disrespect intended...

[Superman]

I don't think you have a thin skin either... you might have the thickest skin here... and I'm not saying i agree with these negative predictions. But people who cover the NFL have to cover 32 teams. There's no way they're going to know the team as well as someone who only covers one team can.

So, are their predictions often inaccurate... yes... are the predictions of those who work in the NFL inaccurate.... yes to that too. But some of them are right... and some are based on pretty good reasoning....

Hey, we all have opinions... experts, so-called experts, and fans alike... but at some point, the games are played...

I still think we're going to be a surprising team this year... I think we'll sneak up on lots of teams and be better than they expect.

I look forward to that....

Okay, so like you said, let's separate the talking heads from the actual NFL personnel. I think we can all agree that the talking heads aren't very informative. They don't cover one team; they have to find something to say about every team. So when it comes to the Colts, it's easy to say "they started 0-13 last year, they have a rookie GM, a rookie head coach and a rookie quarterback, they got rid of some mainstays, and they didn't add any marquee free agents --- they're gonna be bad again." I think plenty of us on this message board have effectively refuted that line of reasoning.

Sidebar: I don't have anything against talking heads, but they often betray their lack of perspective. They are put on the spot and made to formulate opinions that will drive ratings. Like Polian often said, what they say and how they feel has zero effect on what happens on the field. When it comes to guys like Trent Dilfer, who spend all their time evaluating quarterbacks, you can learn a little something here and there.

When it comes to NFL personnel, that's different. An NFL scout could be a college scout, or a CFL scout, or a pro scout. Let's take a pro scout: his job is to familiarize himself with the personnel of other teams, so that when someone is available for trade or on waivers, he can give an informed opinion to the coaches and management about whether a player would be a good fit or patch a hole on his team. That scout probably knows other NFL rosters intimately, especially in March when almost everyone on a roster has played in the NFL. I respect his opinion.

We don't know whether the unnamed scout in question was a pro scout, but let's say he was, which would make his opinion worthy of consideration. Two things come to my mind immediately: 1) The Colts roster at the time he considered it the worst or least talented roster he's ever seen is not the same roster we're opening camp with. His comment was before the draft, and I believe before a lot of our free agent signings. Some people thought we were losing Reggie Wayne and Robert Mathis, two of our best players. We hadn't added the defensive linemen yet. We were rumored to be in the middle of a transition to a 3-4 defense, and there were questions about who would play what roles. A lot of uncertainty. Fast forward to July, and our roster is different, positions have been better settled, etc. The scout's comment is out of date.

2) Saying that anyone's roster is the worst you've ever seen is a pretty heavy comment. Even when we lost to the Saints, which was one of the lowest points of the season, we were obviously the worst team in the league. But the worst roster EVER? Let's say this scout hasn't been around long enough to remember some of the terrible Rams or Bucs teams. But over the last five years, we had two teams flirt with 0-16, one of them actually finishing with that record. Like I said, it's a very sensational comment to make, and it's hard to take seriously. It wasn't even one of the worst rosters, but THE WORST? Ever??? Come off it, ducky.

And then, after thinking about it, I realize that this guy provided no analysis to support his conclusion. You mention that sometimes wrong conclusions are based on good reasoning, but what's the reasoning behind this? We can't determine that, because we don't even know who this guy is.

It strikes me as a comment from someone talking out of their butt. I don't mean to spend a bunch of time dwelling on it, but I just want to stress that I'm not being dismissive for the sake of being dismissive. When Pete Prisco says the Colts are going 1-15, I at least looked at the way he arrived at that conclusion. I have to admit, there's a certain amount of respect for someone who went through the entire season to figure out what the results are going to be. I disagree, vehemently, but there's a method to his madness. There have been several other articles and comments that suggest that the Colts have no chance this season. I disagree, but I take them into consideration.

What it all comes down to is this: I'm fully prepared for the Colts to suck this season. But I think that we can be better than expected, as long as our coaches are better than last year's coaches. I'm optimistic, but I'm not out here trying to pump rainbows up anyone's rear end. It's not often that a team goes from 2-14 to contending for a playoff spot. But it's happened before, and it's not that big of a stretch. So when people start shooting down any optimism, it makes me wonder whether they are just trying to mentally prepare themselves for a bad season. That's fine, but I don't want to be treated like I'm a myopic dimwit for embracing a little ray of sunshine here and there.

[NewColtsFan]

Okay, so like you said, let's separate the talking heads from the actual NFL personnel. I think we can all agree that the talking heads aren't very informative. They don't cover one team; they have to find something to say about every team. So when it comes to the Colts, it's easy to say "they started 0-13 last year, they have a rookie GM, a rookie head coach and a rookie quarterback, they got rid of some mainstays, and they didn't add any marquee free agents --- they're gonna be bad again." I think plenty of us on this message board have effectively refuted that line of reasoning.

Sidebar: I don't have anything against talking heads, but they often betray their lack of perspective. They are put on the spot and made to formulate opinions that will drive ratings. Like Polian often said, what they say and how they feel has zero effect on what happens on the field. When it comes to guys like Trent Dilfer, who spend all their time evaluating quarterbacks, you can learn a little something here and there.

When it comes to NFL personnel, that's different. An NFL scout could be a college scout, or a CFL scout, or a pro scout. Let's take a pro scout: his job is to familiarize himself with the personnel of other teams, so that when someone is available for trade or on waivers, he can give an informed opinion to the coaches and management about whether a player would be a good fit or patch a hole on his team. That scout probably knows other NFL rosters intimately, especially in March when almost everyone on a roster has played in the NFL. I respect his opinion.

We don't know whether the unnamed scout in question was a pro scout, but let's say he was, which would make his opinion worthy of consideration. Two things come to my mind immediately: 1) The Colts roster at the time he considered it the worst or least talented roster he's ever seen is not the same roster we're opening camp with. His comment was before the draft, and I believe before a lot of our free agent signings. Some people thought we were losing Reggie Wayne and Robert Mathis, two of our best players. We hadn't added the defensive linemen yet. We were rumored to be in the middle of a transition to a 3-4 defense, and there were questions about who would play what roles. A lot of uncertainty. Fast forward to July, and our roster is different, positions have been better settled, etc. The scout's comment is out of date.

2) Saying that anyone's roster is the worst you've ever seen is a pretty heavy comment. Even when we lost to the Saints, which was one of the lowest points of the season, we were obviously the worst team in the league. But the worst roster EVER? Let's say this scout hasn't been around long enough to remember some of the terrible Rams or Bucs teams. But over the last five years, we had two teams flirt with 0-16, one of them actually finishing with that record. Like I said, it's a very sensational comment to make, and it's hard to take seriously. It wasn't even one of the worst rosters, but THE WORST? Ever??? Come off it, ducky.

And then, after thinking about it, I realize that this guy provided no analysis to support his conclusion. You mention that sometimes wrong conclusions are based on good reasoning, but what's the reasoning behind this? We can't determine that, because we don't even know who this guy is.

It strikes me as a comment from someone talking out of their butt. I don't mean to spend a bunch of time dwelling on it, but I just want to stress that I'm not being dismissive for the sake of being dismissive. When Pete Prisco says the Colts are going 1-15, I at least looked at the way he arrived at that conclusion. I have to admit, there's a certain amount of respect for someone who went through the entire season to figure out what the results are going to be. I disagree, vehemently, but there's a method to his madness. There have been several other articles and comments that suggest that the Colts have no chance this season. I disagree, but I take them into consideration.

What it all comes down to is this: I'm fully prepared for the Colts to suck this season. But I think that we can be better than expected, as long as our coaches are better than last year's coaches. I'm optimistic, but I'm not out here trying to pump rainbows up anyone's rear end. It's not often that a team goes from 2-14 to contending for a playoff spot. But it's happened before, and it's not that big of a stretch. So when people start shooting down any optimism, it makes me wonder whether they are just trying to mentally prepare themselves for a bad season. That's fine, but I don't want to be treated like I'm a myopic dimwit for embracing a little ray of sunshine here and there.

Supe....

I didn't say **the** worst -- ever. I said his comment was ONE OF the worst ever. Big, big difference.

Also, a writer should never use an outdated quote. So, it's not likely that he got a quote prior to the draft and then used it in late July, 3 months later. That would be inappropriate to use. I'd be very surprised.

But, honestly, I'm not sure why we're having this debate. To the outside, we lost all the good players we cut/released (I don't need to list them for you) and replaced them with..... what? With not very much, at least, to most people. Which is why we're picked for last in the division, and to have a top-5 pick in the draft again, but seemingly everyone, and to have THE top pick by at least one draft follower.

Now you know I don't believe that. I'm just saying what other people are saying... That's what it looks like from the outside in.

We're looking at it from the inside out. We're closer to it. Which is better in some cases. But for some, perhaps we're looking at this as much with our hearts as we are with our heads. Maybe my prediction of 5-7 wins is completely full of it? Maybe not.

And I hope nothing I've written would make you ever feel like some myopic dimwit... I want you embracing every ray of sunshine you can find. I'll be standing right next to you hoping for 5-7 wins.

Sorry if I somehow managed to offend you... That was definitely not my intention...

p.s. -- for goodness sake! Get some sleep!!!

[jimirsaysdog]

Some act as if I dont want the team to win and grow, which is crazy I simply see holes especially on the O Line, Justice has been benched more then once in Philly by Howard Mudd, and Mcglynn gets knocked back a ton when blocking even to the point where he winds up on his butt quite a bit

your horse is dead. you can stop beating it. mcglynn and justice will be just fine. have a little faith in the front office. i'm sure they know much much more than any of us here.who cares what howard mudd did ? he took a playoff teams o -line, changed three starters and they went 8-8. mudds philosophies didn't play to the strengths of the guys he replaced. that doesn't make them bad players. you constantly rag on these guys and they have yet to even play for the colts. again, a little faith that the powers that be know what they're doing more than any of us.

[Golfr]

your horse is dead. you can stop beating it. mcglynn and justice will be just fine. have a little faith in the front office. i'm sure they know much much more than any of us here.who cares what howard mudd did ? he took a playoff teams o -line, changed three starters and they went 8-8. mudds philosophies didn't play to the strengths of the guys he replaced. that doesn't make them bad players. you constantly rag on these guys and they have yet to even play for the colts. again, a little faith that the powers that be know what they're doing more than any of us.

Well said dawg. I have been thinking the same thing.....................just could not get it from my tiny brain to my fingertips.

[krunk]

They were in that game because New England took their foot off the gas and experimented some after building a big lead.

Historically means nothing at this point. This team is presently nothing like the team has been historically within the time frame of the Texans' existance. Last season marks the end of long-running trends for this team. This coming season may mark the beginning of new trends. The past has no relationship to the future at this point, though.

The trend has not ended as of yet, so I can not throw it out until it happens. However I can respect and also agree with the point you make in saying the Texans are a vastly improved team. But my belief about this years Colts team is they will not be anywhere near as bad as last years team. I believe we have enough talent on the current team to win at least one of those games

[Golfr]

Some act as if I dont want the team to win and grow, which is crazy I simply see holes especially on the O Line, Justice has been benched more then once in Philly by Howard Mudd, and Mcglynn gets knocked back a ton when blocking even to the point where he winds up on his butt quite a bit

I do not think some feel you do not want the team to win............I think some can see your pessimism. I have some friends who have no optimism at all..............its pretty annoying being around them at times.

[Malakai432]

That's some good points being made right there.

The reason I can't take these talking head types seriously is because they just don't follow the team. They look at some numbers, see all the names of people we got rid of, and think 'oh my, they went 2-14 last year, now they don't have Gary Brackett, they'll be lucky to win a game!!!!' What they don't look at are the solid offseason acquisitions, the complete ineptitude of the coaches we dumped, the change in coverage scheme, and obviously the change in total team philosophy.

No chance in heck we win less than 5 games. I'm predicting 10.

You forgot the most important person, Jacob Lacey! Come on man, without him this team has no chance of winning more than 2 games... Pppffttt some people are just SOOOO unrealistic, I think we will win 1 game, tie another and win a half of another game. If we had Jacob Lacey however, the Colts would probably win 10+ games easily!

[Superman]

Supe....

I didn't say **the** worst -- ever. I said his comment was ONE OF the worst ever. Big, big difference.

Also, a writer should never use an outdated quote. So, it's not likely that he got a quote prior to the draft and then used it in late July, 3 months later. That would be inappropriate to use. I'd be very surprised.

Wasn't the article in question back in March? I believe it was; I could be wrong. I'm saying that the scout's opinion at that time isn't relevant now, four months later.

And I thought I remembered the quote as "worst ever." Again, I could be wrong.

But, honestly, I'm not sure why we're having this debate. To the outside, we lost all the good players we cut/released (I don't need to list them for you) and replaced them with..... what? With not very much, at least, to most people. Which is why we're picked for last in the division, and to have a top-5 pick in the draft again, but seemingly everyone, and to have THE top pick by at least one draft follower.

Now you know I don't believe that. I'm just saying what other people are saying... That's what it looks like from the outside in.

That's the thing -- I don't believe that. Everyone we released was a complete non-factor last season, and four of the five were ineffective for the past two seasons. Brackett and Bullitt are still free agents. Addai's career might be over. These players have already been replaced with players on the roster, for the most part. Before the draft, we had no tight ends; now we've drafted the two best on the board. Etc.

I firmly believe that, outside of Manning, far too much is made of the players that were released. The only player I would have preferred to keep would be Pierre Garcon, but I don't think he's anything special either, and we're plenty deep at receiver.

We're looking at it from the inside out. We're closer to it. Which is better in some cases. But for some, perhaps we're looking at this as much with our hearts as we are with our heads. Maybe my prediction of 5-7 wins is completely full of it? Maybe not.

Maybe. But on several occasions, I've dissected what happened last season (terrible coaching and quarterbacking), and I think the 2-14 was the extreme worst we could have done. I honestly think that, with a Mark Sanchez and Steve Spagnuolo (an average quarterback and an average coach), we would have won five or six games last year. Considering the changes we've made (coaching and quarterbacking), I don't think it's unreasonable to expect that amount of wins this year. More is icing on the cake.

And I hope nothing I've written would make you ever feel like some myopic dimwit... I want you embracing every ray of sunshine you can find. I'll be standing right next to you hoping for 5-7 wins.

Sorry if I somehow managed to offend you... That was definitely not my intention...

p.s. -- for goodness sake! Get some sleep!!!

You're not the problem. And I don't really take offense. I'm kind of sticking up for the super-optimistic among us who think that we could do the impossible and make the playoffs. It's happened before, to teams that went through similar situations and were similarly projected to be terrible again.

I'm hoping for us to win every single game we play. I always do. I'm prepared for us to suck, given the circumstances. I just don't think there's any legitimate basis for expecting us to be the worst team in the league again.

[Gavin]

I do not think some feel you do not want the team to win............I think some can see your pessimism. I have some friends who have no optimism at all..............its pretty annoying being around them at times.

Hey I want them to do well of course, we obviously have talent but I am looking at it realistically and realistically, neither Mcglynn or Justice were that good in Philly and in Mcglynn's case Cincy as well, I hope they come out and play like Pro Bowlers heck that would be awesome but realistically they have been far from playing like that, I want whats best for the team of course I just have questions about those moves

[Superman]

Hey I want them to do well of course, we obviously have talent but I am looking at it realistically and realistically, neither Mcglynn or Justice were that good in Philly and in Mcglynn's case Cincy as well, I hope they come out and play like Pro Bowlers heck that would be awesome but realistically they have been far from playing like that, I want whats best for the team of course I just have questions about those moves

We've had Linkenbach, Pollak, Richard, Diem, etc., playing guard and tackle for us the past two seasons. The line play, particularly on the interior, has been atrocious. The players we brought in can't be any worse than the nonsense we've been trotting out. And the guys we brought in actually have some promise in some cases.

Beyond them, you're super critical even of Castonzo, who played half the season on one ankle.

I think our offensive line will be better this season than it has been the past two years, but I don't expect it to suddenly be the strength of our offense. I think that this season will make it clear what we have in guys like Castonzo, Reitz, Ijalana, etc., and give newer players like Justice and McGlynn the opportunity to earn a spot here moving forward. It will also clearly identify any weaknesses on the line, which will help our coaches and front office make smart decisions next offseason. I wouldn't be surprised to see us sign a guard in free agency or draft one in the first round.

This is a transitional year, to be sure. We'll have plenty of needs all over the place. But compared to last year, or even the last two years, offensive line is improved. No question about it.

[NewColtsFan]

Wasn't the article in question back in March? I believe it was; I could be wrong. I'm saying that the scout's opinion at that time isn't relevant now, four months later.

And I thought I remembered the quote as "worst ever." Again, I could be wrong.

That's the thing -- I don't believe that. Everyone we released was a complete non-factor last season, and four of the five were ineffective for the past two seasons. Brackett and Bullitt are still free agents. Addai's career might be over. These players have already been replaced with players on the roster, for the most part. Before the draft, we had no tight ends; now we've drafted the two best on the board. Etc.

I firmly believe that, outside of Manning, far too much is made of the players that were released. The only player I would have preferred to keep would be Pierre Garcon, but I don't think he's anything special either, and we're plenty deep at receiver.

Maybe. But on several occasions, I've dissected what happened last season (terrible coaching and quarterbacking), and I think the 2-14 was the extreme worst we could have done. I honestly think that, with a Mark Sanchez and Steve Spagnuolo (an average quarterback and an average coach), we would have won five or six games last year. Considering the changes we've made (coaching and quarterbacking), I don't think it's unreasonable to expect that amount of wins this year. More is icing on the cake.

You're not the problem. And I don't really take offense. I'm kind of sticking up for the super-optimistic among us who think that we could do the impossible and make the playoffs. It's happened before, to teams that went through similar situations and were similarly projected to be terrible again.

I'm hoping for us to win every single game we play. I always do. I'm prepared for us to suck, given the circumstances. I just don't think there's any legitimate basis for expecting us to be the worst team in the league again.

Super...

Think I owe you an apology.... found a quote that I thought was the one I've been citing... except it's not nearly as bad as I thought it was.... so, I don't know if I'm misremembering, or confusing this one with another...

This quote came from the recent CBS sports column that pegged our season at 1-15. (no chance of that happening -- none)

I'm cutting and pasting...

------

AFC scout on Indianapolis: "Might do better than you think. [Andrew] Luck is that good. Scouted him extensively and it can't be said enough how accurate his throws are. When a quarterback is naturally that accurate, he gives his offense a chance to at least function somewhat normally. That's Luck's best hope -- to get to around five or six wins, which would be miraculous. The Colts are the most talentless team, overall, I've seen in this league the last five or six years. ... How quickly they fell apart is like nothing I've seen. Luck is good enough to at least make them respectable for next season. Maybe."

------

So, it's an AFC scout.... and his comment is... the most talentless team, overall, I've seen in the league in the last 5 or 6 years. Far from what I thought I had read... among the worst -- ever. (Honestly, I do think I've read that, but I could be mistaken) But certainly not a very strong endorsement.

Anyway.... this is the one that had been on my mind because it was so recent....

[NewColtsFan]

I do not think some feel you do not want the team to win............I think some can see your pessimism. I have some friends who have no optimism at all..............its pretty annoying being around them at times.

You might want to consider another point of view.... that too much optimism in the face of a probable unpleasant reality can also be pretty annoying. It cuts both ways....

[Superman]

Super...

Think I owe you an apology.... found a quote that I thought was the one I've been citing... except it's not nearly as bad as I thought it was.... so, I don't know if I'm misremembering, or confusing this one with another...

This quote came from the recent CBS sports column that pegged our season at 1-15. (no chance of that happening -- none)

I'm cutting and pasting...

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AFC scout on Indianapolis: "Might do better than you think. [Andrew] Luck is that good. Scouted him extensively and it can't be said enough how accurate his throws are. When a quarterback is naturally that accurate, he gives his offense a chance to at least function somewhat normally. That's Luck's best hope -- to get to around five or six wins, which would be miraculous. The Colts are the most talentless team, overall, I've seen in this league the last five or six years. ... How quickly they fell apart is like nothing I've seen. Luck is good enough to at least make them respectable for next season. Maybe."

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So, it's an AFC scout.... and his comment is... the most talentless team, overall, I've seen in the league in the last 5 or 6 years. Far from what I thought I had read... among the worst -- ever. (Honestly, I do think I've read that, but I could be mistaken) But certainly not a very strong endorsement.

Anyway.... this is the one that had been on my mind because it was so recent....

That sounds like the quote, actually. Looks like we both misremembered it. I looked for the other quote a couple days ago, briefly, and couldn't find it. I thought it was a pre-draft comment, which makes it way out of date. But I could be wrong, obviously.

You don't owe me an apology. I'm making too much out of this. I just don't think anyone should be jumped on because they don't buy the popular perception of a team without a chance.

[Gavin]

We've had Linkenbach, Pollak, Richard, Diem, etc., playing guard and tackle for us the past two seasons. The line play, particularly on the interior, has been atrocious. The players we brought in can't be any worse than the nonsense we've been trotting out. And the guys we brought in actually have some promise in some cases.

Beyond them, you're super critical even of Castonzo, who played half the season on one ankle.

I think our offensive line will be better this season than it has been the past two years, but I don't expect it to suddenly be the strength of our offense. I think that this season will make it clear what we have in guys like Castonzo, Reitz, Ijalana, etc., and give newer players like Justice and McGlynn the opportunity to earn a spot here moving forward. It will also clearly identify any weaknesses on the line, which will help our coaches and front office make smart decisions next offseason. I wouldn't be surprised to see us sign a guard in free agency or draft one in the first round.

This is a transitional year, to be sure. We'll have plenty of needs all over the place. But compared to last year, or even the last two years, offensive line is improved. No question about it.

I dont see how I am critical of Castonzo, the guy was just recently cleared to practice wasn't he, he cant be back to full strength, I never said he would have a bad year, I just said I have concerns about him do to that ankle, I never thought there was anything wrong with having concerns about someone especially when that someone is protecting your hope to be franchise quarterback of the future, I also dont think there is anything wrong with not liking the moves to get Mcglynn and Justice who havent proven to be starter worthy, as I have said I hope they do great, I hope they are future pro bowlers but more often then not the past is foretelling of the future when it comes to a players skills and play in the NFL

[Golfr]

You might want to consider another point of view.... that too much optimism in the face of a probable unpleasant reality can also be pretty annoying. It cuts both ways....

You may be right but I have never been annoyed by anyone who has a positive attitude. On the other hand I am very annoyed by people who are negative about things before they even start. Imagine if all the players had this attitude. My guess is they would not be on the team and probably would not have made it to this level of Football. Continue on with your pessimism if you like but let me tell you it is not attractive in any place in life .................personal or professional. Take the free advice and apply it in your life..... your life and those around you will be better for it. I guarntee it.

Unpleasant reality? The reality is no one can see into the future. I choose to be optimistic and I guess you do not.

[NewColtsFan]

Your views are your views....

You view my comments as pessimistic. I view them as realistic. Big difference.

I've been very public since the day I arrived that I see this team winning 5-7 games this year.

Anything more and I'll be surprised. Anything less and I'll be disappointed.

There are some here who think we won't win that many. They think we'll be drafting in the top 5 next year. I don't see that happening.

And yet, you see me as pessimistic. Sorry you feel that way. I see me as realistic. I'm not always right, (far from it) but I try to be honest with myself and those I'm dealing with.

And, to be clear, I don't expect players -- competitive athletes -- to over have the same view as fans.

Different types of people.... different types of mindsets.

[throwing BBZ]

I was NOT knocking the colts saying they be around .500 (I thought that was a good estimate.) The Colts have a tough schedule UNLIKE the Bengals of last year. Tough as in teams with either a scary good Offense (NE, GB) or a SCARY D (Texans, Steelers).

I see the Colts W here:

Jags (twice)

Titans (Once)

Phins

Vikings

Browns

Chiefs

And make .500 a surprise victory... (Possibly Buffalo or Jets)

This is a POWDER PUFF Schedule.

[MTC]

Reggie Wayne's entrance via StampedeBlue

[throwing BBZ]

Your views are your views....

You view my comments as pessimistic. I view them as realistic. Big difference.

I've been very public since the day I arrived that I see this team winning 5-7 games this year.

Anything more and I'll be surprised. Anything less and I'll be disappointed.

There are some here who think we won't win that many. They think we'll be drafting in the top 5 next year. I don't see that happening.

And yet, you see me as pessimistic. Sorry you feel that way. I see me as realistic. I'm not always right, (far from it) but I try to be honest with myself and those I'm dealing with.

And, to be clear, I don't expect players -- competitive athletes -- to over have the same view as fans.

Different types of people.... different types of mindsets.

The NFL is so EASY huh?

A Rookie Coach, New Co-ordinators/schemes, Half the roster changing, Rookie QB, 4 new starters on the O-Line, do we have 1 decent RB?, That Secondary?

5-7 Wins isn`t REALISTIC.

[throwing BBZ]

Supe....

I didn't say **the** worst -- ever. I said his comment was ONE OF the worst ever. Big, big difference.

Also, a writer should never use an outdated quote. So, it's not likely that he got a quote prior to the draft and then used it in late July, 3 months later. That would be inappropriate to use. I'd be very surprised.

But, honestly, I'm not sure why we're having this debate. To the outside, we lost all the good players we cut/released (I don't need to list them for you) and replaced them with..... what? With not very much, at least, to most people. Which is why we're picked for last in the division, and to have a top-5 pick in the draft again, but seemingly everyone, and to have THE top pick by at least one draft follower.

Now you know I don't believe that. I'm just saying what other people are saying... That's what it looks like from the outside in.

We're looking at it from the inside out. We're closer to it. Which is better in some cases. But for some, perhaps we're looking at this as much with our hearts as we are with our heads. Maybe my prediction of 5-7 wins is completely full of it? Maybe not.

And I hope nothing I've written would make you ever feel like some myopic dimwit... I want you embracing every ray of sunshine you can find. I'll be standing right next to you hoping for 5-7 wins.

Sorry if I somehow managed to offend you... That was definitely not my intention...

p.s. -- for goodness sake! Get some sleep!!!

We didn`t CUT any GOOD Players. We CUT a few average, older, way over priced guys. Manning Should be a Good player, we can look at that at the End of the Season.

[NewColtsFan]

The NFL is so EASY huh?

A Rookie Coach, New Co-ordinators/schemes, Half the roster changing, Rookie QB, 4 new starters on the O-Line, do we have 1 decent RB?, That Secondary?

5-7 Wins isn`t REALISTIC.

Are you following this thread at all? Are you reading any of the other posts?

The person who I'm responding to rips me for being too pessimistic. You come along and rip me for being too optimistic.

In another thread, one of the moderators and I had a long exchange about people who think we're going to make it to the playoffs this year! Hello?!? And you think ***I'M*** not realistic? What planet do you live on?

You didn't post a single thing that I'm unaware of or haven't talked about in countless other posts. There are plenty of reasons to think we can win at least 5 games. But at this point, I won't go into them. I'll wait to see if you respond here.

Otherwise, no need to waste anyone's time.

[Restored]

The NFL is so EASY huh?

A Rookie Coach, New Co-ordinators/schemes, Half the roster changing, Rookie QB, 4 new starters on the O-Line, do we have 1 decent RB?, That Secondary?

5-7 Wins isn`t REALISTIC.

The same scenario happened in 2008 with the Atlanta Falcons and no one picked them to finish better than 5-11. They finished 11-5.

[throwing BBZ]

Honestly, in this modern age of free agency and teams having almost no depth or quality teams across the board, it is hard to predict much of anything. The Colts might go 4-12, but they might go 9-7. The Colts still have some very good players on their team. The NFL shows now a good QB can make a mediocre team play much better. And rookie QBs can perform better than anticipated. I think alot of it comes down to coaching and gameplanning. I really like what both Arians and Pagano bring to the table. I expect them to offset maybe pure talent with keeping the other teams off guard.

Shot in the dark, but I am guessing the Colts go 8-8 or 9-7. I think the team is better than what people think, and Luck having two potentially good TEs is going to surprise a lot of teams. I also think Freeney and Mathis will have monster years.

You put ZERO VALUE to having played together. Allen as a Solid Blocking TE in his 1st Year. lol

The O-Line as a pass blocking unit. lol

The secondary. lol

Freeney & Mathis LOL

[JCPatriot]

I just don't think anyone should be jumped on because they don't buy the popular perception of a team without a chance.

I don't think anyone should be jumped on either way. There is so much uncertainty with this team right now that you are naturally going to get a very wide range of predictions. A lot of those predictions are going to be influenced by the person's general disposition. If you are generally optimistic, you see all of the coaching changes and roster moves as improvements and expect the Colts to be a formidable team this season. You might end up being right. If you are generally pessimistic, you see a team in turmoil that won't have a chance to gel and cohere as a unit in time to be successful this season (even if it sets the Colts up for success in the long run). You might end up being right. I think either of these predictions is realistic. The final result of this season is going to depend on the summation of a multitude of smaller factors that I don't think anybody can predict with any degree of certainty.

[MTC]

Didn't want to start a new thread about this so I'll post it here. Pagano said that Jeff Likenbach has been moved to guard. He was better at tackle then guard so this is pretty bad news.

[shakedownstreet]

Didn't want to start a new thread about this so I'll post it here. Pagano said that Jeff Likenbach has been moved to guard. He was better at tackle then guard so this is pretty bad news.

any news about linkenbach is bad

[Warhorse]

I think what NewColtsFan is thinking.....as I am also thinking, is not that there needs to be pessimism, but there does seem to be a lack of recognition for just how unproven we are on so many fronts. There is a dang reason why we are listed last place in every preseason ranking......because we changed a historical amount of players and personnel.

Where this lack of recognition will rear its ugly head will be if we win two or three games in a row.....talk of playoffs and SB will immediately appear. Again, there is no need to be a downer, but to change nearly the entire coaching staff, install a new offense, install a new defense with a movement to a new scheme, revamp ST, compleeeeeeeetely rework the oline and talk of playoffs in any other mode than....."wouldn't that be sweet", is silly. Of course, we all get our own opinions. That is mine.

Pads today in camp!

[jvan1973]

Scouts don't say Luck has a weak arm.... They say his arm is not as good as Griffin's. That it's not elite. But it's plenty strong enough and that's what scouts say.

To dismiss all comments from scouts because you can find a few that are wrong isn't a good way to judge things. I've seen lots of quotes from unnamed scouts I thought were wrong. Doesn't mean I don't value them at some level. These guys do this for a living. We don't. They have information none of us here will ever have.

I'm not saying I agree with the scout in this case.... that our roster is that bad. I think there are 5-7 wins on this roster. But I offered it because that's a view from a professional. We had a fan here hoping for the playoffs. That's night and day.

I dont put any value on anyone who chooses to stay "unnamed".

[shakedownstreet]

Indianapolis Colts open camp with 90-minute walkthrough

http://www.indystar....xt|IndyStar.com

nice interview with pagano included

EDIT: enjoy the free access to the indy star while you can. it's going subscription in september

[Hans Moleman]

any news about linkenbach is bad

If it means our tackles are good enough to force him inside, it's great news lol