Colts offseason discussion / Ballard Grievances (merge)

[AKB]

4 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Sadly the colts arw probably going to have to take a corner at 15 instead a WR or TE. I guess Ballard could always circle back after the draft for a corner if he goes offense at 15. Listening to the blue zone podcast much better hit rate with offensive pass catchers on first round then corners.

nothing new here, he usually uses his 1st round picks to fill whatever spot he couldn't or didn't in FA

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 minutes ago, AKB said:

nothing new here, he usually uses his 1st round picks to fill whatever spot he couldn't or didn't in FA

Passing on bowers or a 1st round WR for a corner makes me ill.

[Jason_]

Just now, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Passing on bowers or a 1st round WR for a corner makes me ill.

 

maybe wait until it happens before getting ill over it

[AKB]

1 minute ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Passing on bowers or a 1st round WR for a corner makes me ill.

ballard's mediocrity makes me ill

[AKB]

2 minutes ago, Jason_ said:

 

maybe wait until it happens before getting ill over it

im with chloe on this one, with the way this FA has shaped up, if we take a TE rd 1 I would be incredibly surprised.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Just now, AKB said:

ballard's mediocrity makes me ill

Rhe entire offensive staff is at Texas pro day. Could be looking at their WR which is being rumored to be a first round pick. They had a lot of people interviewing bowers. Maybe Ballard will surprise and go offense. I don’t think Ballard is as worried about corner. I think he is more worried about safety.  Hopefully they can get Blackmon back.

[AKB]

Just now, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Rhe entire offensive staff is at Texas pro day. Could be looking at their WR which is being rumored to be a first round pick. They had a lot of people interviewing bowers. Maybe Ballard will surprise and go offense. I don’t think Ballard is as worried about corner. I think he is more worried about safety.  Hopefully they can get Blackmon back.

im with you, he sure does not seem interested in corner. 

[jvan1973]

5 hours ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Shefty was flat out lying.

 

 

Some folks got some bad info.  We will never know who

[stitches]

18 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Yeah, the answer to Gus Bradley's defense having a good pass rush is to have amazing edge rushers. Rumor has it that they were trying for Hunter, and maybe that clues us in on what happens in the draft, but I don't know.

 

But I don't know if Bradley would come back again if the defense continues to struggle. Ballard took the blame for the secondary, but we all know that Bradley had no answers in coverage. 

Sorry to come back to this(this might be my pet theory of this draft season, so you will have to bear with me until we draft him or until he goes elsewhere...), but do you know what pass-rusher looks shockingly similar to Danielle Hunter coming out of college? Dallas Turner

 

Dallas Turner vs Danielle Hunter

Height: 6'3" vs 6'5" 

Weight: 247lbs vs 252lbs

Arm: 34 3/8" vs 34 2/8" (both SUPER LONG...)

40: 4.46 vs 4.57

vertical: 40.5" vs 36.5"

broad: 10'7" vs 10'10"

 

Just... food for thought.... Oh and Hunter was thought of as a raw not polished edge rusher in the draft too. 

 

18 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Again, trying to stay within the realm of reality, because we know we're not trading up to draft a top WR. I really like several of the other guys. Day 2 WRs hit every year, and Day 1 WRs bust every year. People hate on the RAS stuff, but this is the position where I think there's the most correlation with success in the NFL. And while I don't think it will happen, Brian Thomas at #15 scratches the itch, for me.

Brian Thomas is very intriguing... I think he'd be my WR 4 in the draft... or thereabout... I wouldn't mind us picking him at 15. Greg Cosell seems to really like him too... and Chris Simms has him higher than MHJ (that's kind of shocking but... the point is... he really likes him too). 

 

18 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Another thing that I know people don't want to hear, but I believe: We need to see Alec Pierce with a QB who doesn't hate the deep ball. Let him run his go routes, posts, curls, and crosses; those are the routes that beat zone coverage, and we're going to see a ton of zone coverage as long as Richardson is a threat to run the ball. I still want another prospect in the draft, but I'm not writing Pierce off yet.

 

 

I don't mind giving Alec Pierce another shot... but I don't want us to enter the year when we need to support our young QB with everything we can, with AP as our WR2/3... or at the very least without a significant draft pick invested in challenging him as the WR2/3. We cannot continue entering every season with the hope that this or that player will develop. Sure... have that hope... but don't rely on it. And if he's good... and the new WR is good... then GREAT! We have a few cheap WRs for a few years... 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

5 minutes ago, AKB said:

im with you, he sure does not seem interested in corner. 

I do think safety is much bigger of an issue then corner.  I feel bad for Bradley.

[Jason_]

3 minutes ago, AKB said:

im with chloe on this one, with the way this FA has shaped up, if we take a TE rd 1 I would be incredibly surprised.

 

that has nothing to do with my post.  I simply suggested waiting until that actually happens before getting ill over it.  

[AKB]

Just now, Jason_ said:

 

that has nothing to do with my post.  I simply suggested waiting until that actually happens before getting ill over it.  

i doubht chloe is physically vomitting, but i'm sure there are more than a few fans who are displeased with ballards routine. 

[Superman]

2 minutes ago, stitches said:

Sorry to come back to this(this might be my pet theory of this draft season, so you will have to bear with me until we draft him or until he goes elsewhere...), but do you know what pass-rusher looks shockingly similar to Danielle Hunter coming out of college? Dallas Turner

 

Dallas Turner vs Danielle Hunter

Height: 6'3" vs 6'5" 

Weight: 247lbs vs 252lbs

Arm: 34 3/8" vs 34 2/8" (both SUPER LONG...)

40: 4.46 vs 4.57

vertical: 40.5" vs 36.5"

broad: 10'7" vs 10'10"

 

Just... food for thought.... Oh and Hunter was thought of as a raw not polished edge rusher in the draft too. 

 

Did Hunter play mostly OLB in college? I don't remember. The rawness and the way he was used at Alabama is what makes me think he's not a scheme fit. But you could be right. I still haven't gotten back to watch him more closely.

 

Quote

Brian Thomas is very intriguing... I think he'd be my WR 4 in the draft... or thereabout... I wouldn't mind us picking him at 15. Greg Cosell seems to really like him too... and Chris Simms has him higher than MHJ (that's kind of shocking but... the point is... he really likes him too). 

 

I like MHJ. I don't think the separation between him and the others is as great as everyone thinks. I kind of like Thomas better than Odunze...

 

Quote

I don't mind giving Alec Pierce another shot... but I don't want us to enter the year when we need to support our young QB with everything we can, with AP as our WR2/3... or at the very least without a significant draft pick invested in challenging him as the WR2/3. We cannot continue entering every season with the hope that this or that player will develop. Sure... have that hope... but don't rely on it. And if he's good... and the new WR is good... then GREAT! We have a few cheap WRs for a few years... 

 

Agreed. I don't want to put off adding another good prospect because we need to give Pierce another shot. And even if he has a great year, now he's looking at a new contract, so having the next guy lined up would be good.

 

I'm just saying I think there's still opportunity for him to be a contributor in the passing game, specifically for the explosiveness that we all want to see.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Colts could probably get Rock back pretty cheap. 

[GoColts8818]

13 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

Some folks got some bad info.  We will never know who

I think we know who but some don’t want to accept it.  Regardless we’ve reached the point no one’s mind is going to be changed.  Time to let it go and move on.

[stitches]

4 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Did Hunter play mostly OLB in college? I don't remember. The rawness and the way he was used at Alabama is what makes me think he's not a scheme fit. But you could be right. I still haven't gotten back to watch him more closely.

 

I think he was a more traditional DE, not OLB. 

4 minutes ago, Superman said:

I like MHJ. I don't think the separation between him and the others is as great as everyone thinks. I kind of like Thomas better than Odunze...

 

 

Have you had the chance to watch the Texas guys yet? Mitchell looks very intriguing to me, too... 

[richard pallo]

5 hours ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Shefty was flat out lying.

 

 

He sure was.  I’m guessing the Colts wanted to ice this for awhile to bring the temperature down and Shefty was the chosen one.  I still think Sneed winds up a Colt.  

[richard pallo]

8 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Colts could probably get Rock back pretty cheap. 

That is probably not to far fetched.  The other good news is there’s nothing coming out of Buffalo so far saying they are signing Blackmon.  I’m starting to think he might wind up returning.  I hope so anyway.

[AKB]

3 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

That is probably not to far fetched.  The other good news is there’s nothing coming out of Buffalo so far saying they are signing Blackmon.  I’m starting to think he might wind up returning.  I hope so anyway.

we haven't seen ballard go back and sign anyone he let walk . right?

[BlackTiger]

1 hour ago, DougDew said:

And trading back is generally NOT the way to directly get "more explosive".  You do that by trading up.  JMO.

Yeah we need play makers somewhere.  

 

We got schooled last year by the Falcons and Bengals because they had play makers and we didnt.  Colts were arguably more well rounded than both but they won.  

 

I thought the colts should have beat the Bengals but they were strong at WR and we were thin at corner.  They exploited that and won.  We were all playing backup caliber qbs

[OLD FAN MAN]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

I asked you about the offense because it seemed like you were going after the Colts for not properly supporting Richardson. But it seems like that's not a real issue for you.

 

For backup QB, I would have wanted someone who better fit the Richardson offense, but before free agency I looked at the guys available, and I just don't like them. Tyrod Taylor or Tyler Huntley would have been okay, but still not good. Steichen has already shown that he can flip the offense for a backup, if necessary. And after last year, I think Flacco was probably the best veteran backup on the market. I'm not over the moon about it, but I think we can make it work with him for a few weeks if we have to.

 

 

I mostly agree with you about the defense. I don't mind the RAS prospects in the draft, I think the shortcoming has been with coaching and development. Bigger picture, I'm not a Bradley fan, and I think our defensive output is capped with him anyway, but that doesn't mean we can't keep acquiring good players for the time when we hopefully make a change at DC.

 

Ultimately, I didn't expect Ballard to go take big swings for defensive playmakers in free agency. I'm more disappointed that he spent cap space on players that don't improve the defense, in the name of maintaining the status quo. I think maintaining on offense makes a lot more sense because we need to see the offense with Richardson, bottom line. But on defense, we're not set up right, and now that we spent more money on Stewart, Franklin, etc., we're not going to be set up right any time soon.

does signing your own without adding game changers mean we will finish like we did last season? Third place in our division

[AKB]

2 minutes ago, OLD FAN MAN said:

does signing your own without adding game changers mean we will finish like we did last season? Third place in our division

what has it gotten us so far OFM? 

 

less than .500 and no division titles, with nothing but highest-paid at position players who have won absolutely nothing. our biggest achievement is beating the chiefs in the years they win the SB

 

sad

[AKB]

Do you know what Ballard supports LOVE to say? be patient, its a process, lets see what he does in the draft.. lets see what...

 

 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

5 minutes ago, AKB said:

we haven't seen ballard go back and sign anyone he let walk . right?

I think Blackmon thought he would get a bigger contract so Ballard let him go test the market.  Well he probably is not getting what he wanted so hopefully we can get him back. Does make sense why we haven’t made a move at safety yet.

[DougDew]

9 minutes ago, BlackTiger said:

Yeah we need play makers somewhere.  

 

We got schooled last year by the Falcons and Bengals because they had play makers and we didnt.  Colts were arguably more well rounded than both but they won.  

 

I thought the colts should have beat the Bengals but they were strong at WR and we were thin at corner.  They exploited that and won.  We were all playing backup caliber qbs

Howie Rosman traded up for WR Smith.  That worked out pretty well.  Not saying that I have a specific player in mind, but trading a pick to move up 7 slots seems reasonable.

 

Its the trading of 2 number 1s and more for the QB spot that is the costly mistake.

[AKB]

Just now, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

I think Blackmon thought he would get a bigger contract so Ballard let him go test the market.  Well he probably is not getting what he wanted so hopefully we can get him back. Does make sense why we haven’t made a move at safety yet.

i mean like Rock for example. a guy who leaves and signs elsewhere, ballard doesn't usually bring them back after that

Just now, DougDew said:

Howie Rosman traded up for WR Smith.  That worked out pretty well.  Not saying we should trade up for any player, but trading a pick to move up 7 slots seems reasonable.

 

Its the trading 2 number 1s and more for the QB spot that is the costly mistake.

the eagles probably have the best FO in the league, and ballard could learn something from them

[DougDew]

Just now, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

I think Blackmon thought he would get a bigger contract so Ballard let him go test the market.  Well he probably is not getting what he wanted so hopefully we can get him back. Does make sense why we haven’t made a move at safety yet.

I think he's gone. 

[BlackTiger]

3 minutes ago, AKB said:

i mean like Rock for example. a guy who leaves and signs elsewhere, ballard doesn't usually bring them back after that

the eagles probably have the best FO in the league, and ballard could learn something from them

They are really aggressive pretty much year.  It doesn't always work but they are a fun team to follow

 

If he stays in the game Barkley to the Eagles could one of the bigger moves of the year

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Colts haven’t had a CB that has been multi year starter here in a long time.

2 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I think he's gone. 

He isn’t getting what he wanted.

[AKB]

1 minute ago, BlackTiger said:

They are really aggressive pretty much year.  It doesn't always work but they are a fun team to follow

 

If he stays in the game Barkley to the Eagles could one of the bigger moves of the year

they are better at than us at almost every single position. and it might not always work, but what works all the time? they've accomplished much more than we have in the last 7 years with ballard

[BlackTiger]

I still want Blackmon back.  He might be our best safety and they are pretty thin right now

[AKB]

Just now, BlackTiger said:

I still want Blackmon back.  He might be our best safety and they are pretty thin right now

them singing Bryan before Blackmon makes me think he isn't coming back, but I too would've liked Blackmon to resign, especially if we arent signing a S in FA

[BlackTiger]

1 minute ago, AKB said:

they are better at than us at almost every single position.

They are like a better version of us.  Well rounded but with more proven play makers

[DougDew]

4 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Colts haven’t had a CB that has been multi year starter here in a long time.

He isn’t getting what he wanted.

We don't know numbers.  I think its more than that.  I think Ballard wants to upgrade S position.  Cross and Mr. X will be the new starters next year.  Just a hunch.

[AKB]

Just now, BlackTiger said:

They are like a better version of us.  Well rounded but with more proven play makers

They always have a solid roster, then they get aggressive to get elite at spots. we just have a solid roster, and get mediocre at certain spots. it;s really been the same for years

 

 

[NewColtsFan]

6 hours ago, Solid84 said:

Stop the nonsense. I'm not slamming Steichen at all - I think he's probably the best thing to happen to the Colts since Luck, but if I had only mentioned Ballard you'd have been all "You think only Ballard was in on this decision?!?!", so, ironically, that's my question to you - do you think only Ballard was in on this decision?!?!

 

What you call negative and deeply cynical I call realistic. I don't expect a group that's shown nothing but lacking production to get super charged by a new DL coach. There's not a shred of evidence they'll be a top 5, top 10 or heck even top half of the league unit in pressures created this season - because they have NEVER played to that level.

 

I'm just done trying to find excuses for this team. They need to start producing. From the backup's backup to the top of the brass - they need to start producing.

Your previous post to me was pure nonsense.   I said so.   Now you’ve changed the words around but basically said the same thing.   It’s still nonsense. 
 

From saying you don’t buy the hype of Green Bay and Chicago over the Colts I thought you had a terrible day.   This just continues things.   
 

You think the Colts OL had high level performance last year (false, they had improved play; they went from 30th to 19th on PFF)  to not liking the Partridge hire, I thought your post was filled with ridiculous assertions.  I know people here who are cautious about the Partridge hire, but you trashed it!  And don’t deny it!

 

You want to be able to write what you want with no push back.   So when I said I didn’t agree with a word of your post, don’t come back at me with “stop the nonsense”.   That may work with others here, but not me.   Sorry….  Agree to disagree and take a day off from engaging with me if this is what can I expect from you. 

[Indeee]

16 minutes ago, BlackTiger said:

I still want Blackmon back.  He might be our best safety and they are pretty thin right now

I realize his injury history might befell him getting the money he wants in FA with us and even other suitors, however this is the issue with OUR players. The bolded might be true but again, what does this say about the selections Ballard has made for this team. If Blackmon isn't worth the squeeze, then why would we want him back at any price? Just because he is the best we have?

 

Therin lies the problem. Ballard should have already upgraded the position, not wait around to get another mediocre oft injured player on the cheap just because he can. 

 

 

[AKB]

"What you call negative and deeply cynical I call realistic. " - @Solid84

 

There appears to be a theme on this board where if you have what appears to be a negative, or unpopular opinion you are therefore a cynic, or pessimist, and only need to be enlightened to see the truth.

 

I think its garbage, call it what it is. BBB doing BBB things. No one calls me an optimist when I praise him for a late round steal, but let me complain about anything, and there's a riot. 

 

 

[Solid84]

3 hours ago, Superman said:

 

There are a lot of extremes in this statement. So before I go further, I just want to know how much is hyperbole, and how much you really meant.

 

What's desperate about moving on from a position coach for an underperforming unit? Shouldn't a team hold each position coach accountable? And why do you say there's been nothing to show for what's been invested in the DL? 

"Desperate" is hyperbole, but I do think Ballard & Co expected more from the guys they drafted and this is an attempt to wring that extra production out of them. I don't think coaching is the problem even if that's what they are hoping. I think it's a talent issue.

 

Quote

And why do you say there's been nothing to show for what's been invested in the DL?

2017, 3rd Round Tarrel Basham - not with the team.

2018, 2nd Round Kemoko Turay - not with the team.

2018, 2nd Round Tyquan Lewis - good, but a rotational piece.

2019, 2nd Round Ben Banogu - barely started here and not with the team anymore.

2019, 6th Round Gerri Green - not with the team.

2021, 1st Round Kwity Paye - a run stopper and an edge setter, not a pass rush specialist when that's what we needed.

2021, 2nd Round Dayo Odeyingbo - rotaional piece.

2023, 6th Round Titus Leo - Injured and didn't play his rookie season.

 

These are just the DE/Edge guys. I don't know about you, but looking at that list and then considering we're STILL talking about trying to get more pressure and drafting/signing a guy who can create pressure leaves me sad.

[AKB]

@Solid84

2021, 2nd Round Dayo Odeyingbo - rotaional piece.

 

he is my favorite on breaking out