What is it with these guys?!

[csmopar]

First Marv 2.0 skips all his scheduled interviews yesterday, now Caleb Williams, through his dad who is his agent, is doing some crazy stuff: 

 

so far, Williams is demanding, not asking, for the following:

 

1. NOT to have to sign the standard rookie contract (not allowed under the CBA and Draft rules)

2. A percentage of ownership stakes for whatever team drafts him(not allowed under league rules and the CBA)

3. A fully guaranteed contract (not allowed under the CBA for rookies)

 

and then he skips his medical examine AND refuses to turn over any medical records, something also against the CBA AND the first time ever a combine invitee has done such actions. 
 

I don’t know if all this works itself out and he still goes 1 overall but I’m seeing some very serious character and ego issues. I said last October I thought the kid was egotistical and would shut out. That was just based on some comments he was making, but man his actions now fully support the egotistical view.

 

[John Hammonds]

1 hour ago, csmopar said:

First Marv 2.0 skips all his scheduled interviews yesterday, now Caleb Williams, through his dad who is his agent, is doing some crazy stuff: 

 

so far, Williams is demanding, not asking, for the following:

 

1. NOT to have to sign the standard rookie contract (not allowed under the CBA and Draft rules)

2. A percentage of ownership stakes for whatever team drafts him(not allowed under league rules and the CBA)

3. A fully guaranteed contract (not allowed under the CBA for rookies)

 

and then he skips his medical examine AND refuses to turn over any medical records, something also against the CBA AND the first time ever a combine invitee has done such actions. 
 

I don’t know if all this works itself out and he still goes 1 overall but I’m seeing some very serious character and ego issues. I said last October I thought the kid was egotistical and would shut out. That was just based on some comments he was making, but man his actions now fully support the egotistical view.

 

The red flags are beginning to pile up on Caleb Williams.  If I were a GM, I'd go looking elsewhere for my QB.  If he's gonna behave like this right now, just wait for what he'll be like when he's on your team.

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 hour ago, John Hammonds said:

The red flags are beginning to pile up on Caleb Williams.  If I were a GM, I'd go looking elsewhere for my QB.  If he's gonna behave like this right now, just wait for what he'll be like when he's on your team.

I may be in the minority but if I was Chicago, I would keep Fields and draft Marvin. Fields has a few years under his belt now (experienced) and would be getting a generational WR if they did that. 

[VikingsFanInChennai]

3 hours ago, csmopar said:

First Marv 2.0 skips all his scheduled interviews yesterday, now Caleb Williams, through his dad who is his agent, is doing some crazy stuff: 

 

so far, Williams is demanding, not asking, for the following:

 

1. NOT to have to sign the standard rookie contract (not allowed under the CBA and Draft rules)

2. A percentage of ownership stakes for whatever team drafts him(not allowed under league rules and the CBA)

3. A fully guaranteed contract (not allowed under the CBA for rookies)

 

and then he skips his medical examine AND refuses to turn over any medical records, something also against the CBA AND the first time ever a combine invitee has done such actions. 
 

I don’t know if all this works itself out and he still goes 1 overall but I’m seeing some very serious character and ego issues. I said last October I thought the kid was egotistical and would shut out. That was just based on some comments he was making, but man his actions now fully support the egotistical view.

 

I forgot the scenario, I think Chargers' Joey Bosa also had some unique demand in his rookie contract that delayed signing for a couple of months and I think he missed rookie training camp and some schedule.

 

But, agree what Caleb Williams demands is not gonna happen, so I hope he ends up in a team where he later feels for his actions, LOL 

 

BTW, is there a link to read all those demands you've listed here? 

[2006Coltsbestever]

When it comes to Caleb Williams, he is a great talent, but I am not sold on him like many are. Something doesn't seem right between the ears with him IMO. I watched him go up against elite teams this past season as well and he failed every time = against ND, Washington, Oregon, and Utah. I would be shocked if he came in and had a season like Stroud had in 2023. 

[csmopar]

11 minutes ago, VikingsFanInChennai said:

I forgot the scenario, I think Chargers' Joey Bosa also had some unique demand in his rookie contract that delayed signing for a couple of months and I think he missed rookie training camp and some schedule.

 

But, agree what Caleb Williams demands is not gonna happen, so I hope he ends up in a team where he later feels for his actions, LOL 

 

BTW, is there a link to read all those demands you've listed here? 

Behind a paywall but it starts here

 

https://theathletic.com/5301341/2024/02/28/caleb-williams-quarterback-nfl-draft-ownership/?source=user_shared_article

 

then

 

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/caleb-williams-red-flags-explained-father-agent/ebdb755e7ba9096db47e46a2

 

and here

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/chicago/news/caleb-williams-bears-nfl-combine/

 

and here

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/caleb-williams-isnt-throwing-at-nfl-combine-but-another-decision-he-made-may-tell-us-even-more-000348415.html

[w87r]

3 hours ago, csmopar said:

3. A fully guaranteed contract (not allowed under the CBA for rookies)

This isn't true. Pretty standard procedure for fully guaranteed contracts for 1st round picks. Even last pick in 1st round last year had a fully guaranteed contract.

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/carolina-panthers/bryce-young-82278/

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/houston-texans/cj-stroud-82279/

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/houston-texans/will-anderson-82280/

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/indianapolis-colts/anthony-richardson-82281/

 

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/kansas-city-chiefs/felix-anudike-uzomah-82309/

 

[csmopar]

18 minutes ago, w87r said:

This isn't true. Pretty standard procedure for fully guaranteed contracts for 1st round picks. Even last pick in 1st round last year had a fully guaranteed contract.

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/carolina-panthers/bryce-young-82278/

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/houston-texans/cj-stroud-82279/

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/houston-texans/will-anderson-82280/

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/indianapolis-colts/anthony-richardson-82281/

 

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/kansas-city-chiefs/felix-anudike-uzomah-82309/

 

Thanks I was under the impression rookie deals weren’t fully guaranteed. 
 

then why the heck is his dad demanding one if it’s already such a case? Confusjng

[Defjamz26]

40 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

When it comes to Caleb Williams, he is a great talent, but I am not sold on him like many are. Something doesn't seem right between the ears with him IMO. I watched him go up against elite teams this past season as well and he failed every time = against ND, Washington, Oregon, and Utah. I would be shocked if he came in and had a season like Stroud had in 2023. 

The way he’s conducted himself has been really weird. Every answer to the questions he was asked seemed weird. His body language was off too. If I’m an NFL GM I would be terrified of drafting him high. Something about him from a character standpoint is off.

[2006Coltsbestever]

2 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

The way he’s conducted himself has been really weird. Every answer to the questions he was asked seemed weird. His body language was off too. If I’m an NFL GM I would be terrified of drafting him high. Something about him from a character standpoint is off.

I agree 100%. Something just seems off but then again, I have been wrong before. I thought Bryce Young would be good  . - I do have an out there though, the Panthers are ran like dog Doo Doo.

[VikingsFanInChennai]

12 minutes ago, csmopar said:

Thanks I was under the impression rookie deals weren’t fully guaranteed. 
 

then why the heck is his dad demanding one if it’s already such a case? Confusjng

That could mean that his dad isn't good as an agent, and reflects the QB's poor choice there.

 

I read here that Marvin Harrison Jr also doesn't have an agent.

 

Usually the guys that don't have an agent do stupid things. Or those who want to do stupid stuff don't like to have agents trying to give them some sound advice. 

 

Richard Sherman at the end of his career choose not to have agents but he perused the contracts stuff in detail to stand for himself and understood the trends to get him a contract with SF, but that didn't last long enough as his career was at its very tail end.

 

These rookies don't do such deligent and thorough research and they think their name and college career would carry them through. I recall Baker Mayfield was haughty for that time, and he's become much more humble now and coincidentally he's got a career resurgence.

 

I expect Caleb Williams to have a similar trajectory in the NFL, that there's my prediction for him. 

[VikingsFanInChennai]

6 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I agree 100%. Something just seems off but then again, I have been wrong before. I thought Bryce Young would be good  . - I do have an out there though, the Panthers are ran like dog Doo Doo.

These are totally different situations, when you sense something off, NFL teams - at least good ones and non-desperate ones - sniff afar from miles. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

Just now, VikingsFanInChennai said:

These are totally different situations, when you sense something off, NFL teams - at least good ones - sniff afar from miles. 

Oh no doubt because Young said all the right things IMO and is highly intelligent. Maybe his size may be the reason why he never pans out? I didn't think it would matter but playing for the Panthers doesn't help.

[csmopar]

2 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Oh no doubt because Young said all the right things IMO and is highly intelligent. Maybe his size may be the reason why he never pans out? I didn't think it would matter but playing for the Panthers doesn't help.

Young was a one year wonder who went to a coach who was said to be a QB whisperer but in actuality, wasn’t. He might turn it around without Reichs outdated offense

[VikingsFanInChennai]

Williams says

 

Quote

Not 32 teams can draft me,” Williams said Friday morning. “There is only one of me. So the teams that I go to for my visit, those teams will have the medical and that'll be it. 

So, it looks like he could choose the teams he'd like to visit and he'd like to take away evaluations like medical from the teams that he'd not like to draft him. So far, he's had interviews with Bears, Commanders and Patriots, including possible others and he's not forbidden any teams to interview him. He's even expressed excitement in hometown Commanders drafting him.

 

He's said Patriots interview room was not as packed as other two. Uh-oh!

 

He's also said,

Quote

 

I don't think I'm not going to be No. 1,” Williams said. “I put in all the hard work. All of the time, effort, energy into being that. I don't think of a Plan B. That's kind of how I do things in my life. I don't think of a Plan B.

 

“Stay on Plan A and then when things don't work out find a way to make Plan A work

 

That is very identical to his scouting reports, that he tends to make the plays work and tend to hold on to the ball longer in his final season. Which is weird, as he was earlier known for his ability to create plays outside the structure! 

 

I think some NFL pass rushers would be salivating at such prospects! 

[w87r]

I don't have a problem with a supposed top 5 pick(presumable #1), not feeling the need to let all 32 teams be part of his medical evaluations and records. 

 

 

Why do the Chiefs need to see his evaluation? I mean seriously? Just used them as an example with last pick in round 1.

 

 

Being a USC fan, I am little disappointed in the sense of entitlement he seems to feel, and some of these others for that matter.

 

I don't care about this part of it though.

[throwing BBZ]

1 hour ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I may be in the minority but if I was Chicago, I would keep Fields and draft Marvin. Fields has a few years under his belt now (experienced) and would be getting a generational WR if they did that. 

 

 I watched Fields some in their last few games. He was making some high end pin point throws. There was a lot to like.

 Getting a future 1 plus is juicy imo.

 

 

[richard pallo]

The way I look at it is it's the tip of the iceberg.  A lot of these guys are making very good money coming out of college.  Why work out.  I don't need to test.  I know I'm a high draft pick.  Teams can make their decision on my tape.  If that's not good enough too bad.  I think they will realize there is more downsize than upside in working out.  Just so you can have the fastest time.  That didn't work out for one CB yesterday.  Do the interviews fine.  But I think a combine where players do a lot of drills and physical testing is going to shrink and get scaled back.  Athletes are starting to object and with agents supporting them it could fall by the wayside.  It will take little time but it's heading that way I think.  

[VikingsFanInChennai]

6 hours ago, richard pallo said:

The way I look at it is it's the tip of the iceberg.  A lot of these guys are making very good money coming out of college.  Why work out.  I don't need to test.  I know I'm a high draft pick.  Teams can make their decision on my tape.  If that's not good enough too bad.  I think they will realize there is more downsize than upside in working out.  Just so you can have the fastest time.  That didn't work out for one CB yesterday.  Do the interviews fine.  But I think a combine where players do a lot of drills and physical testing is going to shrink and get scaled back.  Athletes are starting to object and with agents supporting them it could fall by the wayside.  It will take little time but it's heading that way I think.  

That will be few top prospects anyway..

 

Like 10 out of 400 invited or so..

 

It's all good what they choose to do and not to, as NFL already makes it optional and a players' choice.

 

The problem is the way they present themselves during the Combine, or in Harrison Jr case not showing up for interviews he promised to attend. 

[NewColtsFan]

7 hours ago, csmopar said:

Young was a one year wonder who went to a coach who was said to be a QB whisperer but in actuality, wasn’t. He might turn it around without Reichs outdated offense

FWIW:

 

Young started two full seasons for Alabama.   27 starts in all going 23-4. 
 

As for Reich…. He got the best year out of Luck who wasn’t close to 100 percent.   And got good years out of Brissett, Wentz and even Ryan who suffered due to a terrible OL in front of him. 
 

You might want to consider the dysfunctional franchise that Frank worked for… 

[csmopar]

21 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

FWIW:

 

Young started two full seasons for Alabama.   27 starts in all going 23-4. 
 

As for Reich…. He got the best year out of Luck who wasn’t close to 100 percent.   And got good years out of Brissett, Wentz and even Ryan who suffered due to a terrible OL in front of him. 
 

You might want to consider the dysfunctional franchise that Frank worked for… 

Yeah… Reich wasn’t bad but he’s not good either

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, csmopar said:

Yeah… Reich wasn’t bad but he’s not good either

Im very happy Steichen is our HC and play caller.   VERY!!  
 

See, we can find some common ground!   

[csmopar]

15 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Im very happy Steichen is our HC and play caller.   VERY!!  
 

See, we can find some common ground!   

Never said we couldn’t haha. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

21 hours ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 I watched Fields some in their last few games. He was making some high end pin point throws. There was a lot to like.

 Getting a future 1 plus is juicy imo.

 

 

Yeah, I think Fields can be good if you give him a very good or great WR. Bears won 7 games last year with really a weak roster. Fields was 5-8.

[throwing BBZ]

On 3/2/2024 at 7:19 AM, csmopar said:

First Marv 2.0 skips all his scheduled interviews yesterday, now Caleb Williams, through his dad who is his agent, is doing some crazy stuff: 

 

so far, Williams is demanding, not asking, for the following:

 

1. NOT to have to sign the standard rookie contract (not allowed under the CBA and Draft rules)

2. A percentage of ownership stakes for whatever team drafts him(not allowed under league rules and the CBA)

3. A fully guaranteed contract (not allowed under the CBA for rookies)

 

and then he skips his medical examine AND refuses to turn over any medical records, something also against the CBA AND the first time ever a combine invitee has done such actions. 
 

I don’t know if all this works itself out and he still goes 1 overall but I’m seeing some very serious character and ego issues. I said last October I thought the kid was egotistical and would shut out. That was just based on some comments he was making, but man his actions now fully support the egotistical view.

 

 

 It is the first time an invite hasn't done the medical perhaps. The rest is exaggeration if not fabrication.

[csmopar]

9 hours ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 It is the first time an invite hasn't done the medical perhaps. The rest is exaggeration if not fabrication.

It’s what’s being reported by multiple credible and national sources. Even Rapport has talked about these very thing.

 

now there are some satire type reports out there but those are very easy to spot. The worst is the one that says he wants to wear a Viking helmet instead of a football helmet. Them people be crazy yo

[Superman]

On 3/2/2024 at 4:19 AM, csmopar said:

First Marv 2.0 skips all his scheduled interviews yesterday, now Caleb Williams, through his dad who is his agent, is doing some crazy stuff: 

 

so far, Williams is demanding, not asking, for the following:

 

1. NOT to have to sign the standard rookie contract (not allowed under the CBA and Draft rules)

2. A percentage of ownership stakes for whatever team drafts him(not allowed under league rules and the CBA)

3. A fully guaranteed contract (not allowed under the CBA for rookies)

 

and then he skips his medical examine AND refuses to turn over any medical records, something also against the CBA AND the first time ever a combine invitee has done such actions. 
 

I don’t know if all this works itself out and he still goes 1 overall but I’m seeing some very serious character and ego issues. I said last October I thought the kid was egotistical and would shut out. That was just based on some comments he was making, but man his actions now fully support the egotistical view.

 

I don't know why I'm even posting this, because I think people who dislike Caleb Williams have their minds made up, and it won't matter. But I feel compelled to address some of this.

 

First, where has Caleb Williams been shown to be "demanding" anything? Second, how has it been concluded that his dad is his agent? 

 

From the Athletic article you later linked, the reasoning for not hiring an agent is tied to the three points you listed above, and it tracks logically. Fans ask the same questions every year: Why do top NFL draft prospects hire agents to negotiate their contracts, if the terms of the contracts are determined by the CBA and are largely not negotiable?

 

The top picks in the draft will receive a set contract, it will be fully guaranteed, and it will not have offset language. That's established for more than a decade, going back to the beginning the 2011 CBA. What else is there to negotiate? Why give away 3% of the contract value for something that's already set in stone? So what the article states is that Williams and his family decided there's no need for an agent. He's going to go near the top of the draft -- probably #1 -- and there's not much an agent can do that his group/team can't handle. And Williams is not the first player not decide against hiring an agent.

 

Despite noise and rumors, there are no legitimate reports that suggest that Williams or his family have demanded any of the things you listed in your post.

 

Further, it's NOT against the CBA for a player to decline medicals at the Combine. It's unprecedented, but there's nothing in the CBA that says a player must submit to medicals. In fact, Combine invitations are limited, so several players who wind up going to the NFL every year have no opportunity to provide medicals at the Combine. 

 

Caleb Williams definitely has a different personality from what people are used to. There's no point denying it, some teams are going to have a problem with him. But there's also no point in exaggerating it. Some of this stuff doesn't matter, and some of it is completely made up.

 

It's also interesting to me how every year, we talk about how pointless some of the player evaluation stuff is in the big picture, but then when players who have some leverage start pushing back, they get labeled as egotistical. 

 

And then there's the impact of NIL. There's a new landscape in college athletics, and it's going to continue to influence how top rated draft prospects approach their potential NFL careers. We can call it good or bad, talk about what we like and don't like about it, but it's a real thing, and we're just seeing the beginning of it. 

[VikingsFanInChennai]

On 3/4/2024 at 6:49 PM, csmopar said:

. The worst is the one that says he wants to wear a Viking helmet instead of a football helmet. Them people be crazy yo

He can find the middle ground by wearing the Vikings helmet 

[LJpalmbeacher2]

I think this much to do about nothing.......or at least not much. 

 

I think Caleb Williams, if not let down by the historically dysfunction of the Chicago bears the last few decades, he will be one of the Top QBs right away and be elite in a couple years. 

 

Not wanting to Hijack the thread I have a question for colt fans(especially to a few who still aren't so thrilled about AR5 being our QB) 

......Hypothetical, if the colts somehow had a chance to trade AR5 for Caleb Williams would you want them too??? 

So who would you rather have as QB of the colts going forward? Caleb OR AR5 ???

[Blueblood23]

20 hours ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

I think this much to do about nothing.......or at least not much. 

 

I think Caleb Williams, if not let down by the historically dysfunction of the Chicago bears the last few decades, he will be one of the Top QBs right away and be elite in a couple years. 

 

Not wanting to Hijack the thread I have a question for colt fans(especially to a few who still aren't so thrilled about AR5 being our QB) 

......Hypothetical, if the colts somehow had a chance to trade AR5 for Caleb Williams would you want them too??? 

So who would you rather have as QB of the colts going forward? Caleb OR AR5 ???

I’d take Williams for sure. 

[Defjamz26]

 

[Superman]

4 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

 

 

 

[Defjamz26]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

 

For all of that he better live up to the hype. This draft is going to be memorable because there are two other receivers in Nabers and Odunze who are just as good. If he doesn’t become the undisputed best receiver in the class, people are going to remember that he didn’t do any pre draft testing.

[Hawkeyecolt]

He has zero reason to go through the workout. He did the workouts last year.  His game tape is plenty.  The eight teams all said they were fine with it.  

[Superman]

On 3/20/2024 at 1:56 PM, Defjamz26 said:

For all of that he better live up to the hype. This draft is going to be memorable because there are two other receivers in Nabers and Odunze who are just as good. If he doesn’t become the undisputed best receiver in the class, people are going to remember that he didn’t do any pre draft testing.

 

What does one have to do with the other? If he doesn't live up to the hype, it won't be because he didn't do any testing. 

[Defjamz26]

2 hours ago, Superman said:

 

What does one have to do with the other? If he doesn't live up to the hype, it won't be because he didn't do any testing. 

I think it’s connected because I think if there’s any flaws in his games it’s going to be athleticism. While some have just assumed he’s an elite athlete because of how dominant he was in college, there are people who think he’s just an average athlete. You can see on tape that he doesn’t have burner speed like BTJ or A.D. Mitchell, and his 3-cone might not have been what some would thought. Personally I think he might have tested similarly to Michael Pittman.

 

 

A lot of times when players opt out of specific drills, it’s ones where they may not perform well. I just wonder if he just wanted to keep the number 1 receiver hype he’s had since last offseason and so didn’t want to give people any numbers that may open up a conversation. If you look at Nabers, Odunze, and even BTJ stats for last season, they all matched his production or bettered it in every category. Sometimes the things that separate prospects who have similar skill sets and college production is athleticism. Let’s see if Nabers test as well, but I think Odunze is the better athlete.

[wig]

2 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

I think it’s connected because I think if there’s any flaws in his games it’s going to be athleticism. While some have just assumed he’s an elite athlete because of how dominant he was in college, there are people who think he’s just an average athlete. You can see on tape that he doesn’t have burner speed like BTJ or A.D. Mitchell, and his 3-cone might not have been what some would thought. Personally I think he might have tested similarly to Michael Pittman.

 

 

A lot of times when players opt out of specific drills, it’s ones where they may not perform well. I just wonder if he just wanted to keep the number 1 receiver hype he’s had since last offseason and so didn’t want to give people any numbers that may open up a conversation. If you look at Nabers, Odunze, and even BTJ stats for last season, they all matched his production or bettered it in every category. Sometimes the things that separate prospects who have similar skill sets and college production is athleticism. Let’s see if Nabers test as well, but I think Odunze is the better athlete.

 

If you're going to be the first non qb, why do anything? 

[Superman]

4 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

I think it’s connected because I think if there’s any flaws in his games it’s going to be athleticism. While some have just assumed he’s an elite athlete because of how dominant he was in college, there are people who think he’s just an average athlete. You can see on tape that he doesn’t have burner speed like BTJ or A.D. Mitchell, and his 3-cone might not have been what some would thought. Personally I think he might have tested similarly to Michael Pittman.

 

 

A lot of times when players opt out of specific drills, it’s ones where they may not perform well. I just wonder if he just wanted to keep the number 1 receiver hype he’s had since last offseason and so didn’t want to give people any numbers that may open up a conversation. If you look at Nabers, Odunze, and even BTJ stats for last season, they all matched his production or bettered it in every category. Sometimes the things that separate prospects who have similar skill sets and college production is athleticism. Let’s see if Nabers test as well, but I think Odunze is the better athlete.

 

Well I think he's benefited from being the consensus top guy so far. Him vs Nabers, I'm kind of torn tbh. But in his case, why mess around with the pre draft stuff that we all know has only a loose translation to what happens in the NFL? I still think the film shows an obviously impressive prospect, and unless you think his workout numbers were going to be shockingly pedestrian, I don't think it matters. It's hard to imagine a scenario where he drops out of the top 6, IMO, even if four QBs are in play. 

 

By the way, I think there's some value in not spending a bunch of time training for measurement drills and workouts. I would rather a player focus on improving his real football skills, and maybe even letting his body recover during this "off-season" period. It can potentially get him ready for the season, and maybe even help him avoid the rookie wall. 

 

I love the pre draft stuff, and being able to compare the measurables. But I also think it's fundamentally flawed in certain ways, and I'm interested in new ways of looking at this time of year. For someone like MHJ who can point at the tape and say 'yall know who I am and what I can do,' the pre draft stuff might even be counterproductive. 

[RollerColt]

13 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Well I think he's benefited from being the consensus top guy so far. Him vs Nabers, I'm kind of torn tbh. But in his case, why mess around with the pre draft stuff that we all know has only a loose translation to what happens in the NFL? I still think the film shows an obviously impressive prospect, and unless you think his workout numbers were going to be shockingly pedestrian, I don't think it matters. It's hard to imagine a scenario where he drops out of the top 6, IMO, even if four QBs are in play. 

 

By the way, I think there's some value in not spending a bunch of time training for measurement drills and workouts. I would rather a player focus on improving his real football skills, and maybe even letting his body recover during this "off-season" period. It can potentially get him ready for the season, and maybe even help him avoid the rookie wall. 

 

I love the pre draft stuff, and being able to compare the measurables. But I also think it's fundamentally flawed in certain ways, and I'm interested in new ways of looking at this time of year. For someone like MHJ who can point at the tape and say 'yall know who I am and what I can do,' the pre draft stuff might even be counterproductive. 

Mel Kiper was on with Rich Eisen the other day and talked about how pro days often don’t truly indicate how well a player will be. He said Leaf’s pro day was more impressive than Manning’s, and mentioned how JaMarcus Russell and Zach Wilson had some of the best pro days ever and look how they turned out. He said look for less and less players to even have pro days in the coming years, especially from the top prospects.