Jonathan Taylor comments on his contract/Request trade (Merge)

[Solid84]

18 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

If he is looking for 13 Mill a year by your guess, that is reasonable. He has played 5 seasons and has had 1 season where he suffered a year ending injury, that was in year 2. The other 2 years you speak of where he did miss games, he still played in 13 games so it wasn't like he wasn't durable.

 

All I know is this, if Taylor doesn't get re-signed because he only wants a couple of more Mill than what we are offering, I will look at our FO as a joke and really start wondering if we want to win or not. If I was a Giants fan right now I would be livid.

That’s where we disagree though. I wouldn’t want to pay $13+m/year to a guy you could only count on 13 games a season. If another player at another position only played 13 games a season you would certainly start questioning their durability. That’s especially if you could just play the next man up for rookie money only to lose maybe 1 more game over a season. 
 

If our FO were to come out tomorrow and give JT a contract worth $14m/year with what he has shown so far I’d start questioning their sanity. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

17 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

That’s where we disagree though. I wouldn’t want to pay $13+m/year to a guy you could only count on 13 games a season. If another player at another position only played 13 games a season you would certainly start questioning their durability. That’s especially if you could just play the next man up for rookie money only to lose maybe 1 more game over a season. 
 

If our FO were to come out tomorrow and give JT a contract worth $14m/year with what he has shown so far I’d start questioning their sanity. 

That is a gamble your FO has to decide on because Barkley played in 16 games last year and was real durable. JT was injured last season but it wasn't a career threatening injury and really playing him injured would have made no sense anyway after we fell to 4-8-1. The season was over at that point. In 2021, JT was actually mentioned by many in the media as possibly being the MVP when we were 9-6. Mcaffrey is making 16 Mill a year and in 2020 he only played in 3 games, in 2021 he only played in 7 games. Barkley has been more durable than he is as a whole. It is funny how nobody seems to have a problem with Mcaffrey making 16 mill though but if Barkley or Taylor wanted 14 mill a year, they would think it was insane. Being durable in football is tough to begin with. How durable has Hopkins been the last 2 years, not at all but should he get a pass for just signing a nice deal worth 13 Mill a year at the age of 31 because he is a WR? 

[Solid84]

8 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

That is a gamble your FO has to decide on because he played in 16 games last year and was real durable. JT was injured last season but it wasn't a career threatening injury and really playing him injured would have made no sense anyway after we fell to 4-8-1. The season was over at that point. In 2021, JT was actually mentioned by many in the media as possibly being the MVP when we were 9-6. Mcaffrey is making 16 Mill a year and in 2020 he only played in 3 games, in 2021 he only played in 7 games. Barkley has been more durable than he is as a whole. It is funny how nobody seems to have a problem with Mcaffrey making 16 mill though but if Barkley or Taylor wanted 14 mill a year, they would think it was insane. Being durable in football is tough to begin with. How durable has Hopkins been the last 2 years, not at all but should he get a pass for just signing a nice deal worth 13 Mill a year at the age of 31 because he is a WR? 

I for one wouldn’t want to pay CMC that kind of money and neither did the Panthers. I wouldn’t want to pay Kamara either or Barkley and JT. It’s just not worth the investment in my opinion. 
 

I mean, there’s big difference between a 31 year old and however old Barkley and JT are, no matter the position. That’s a completely different situation. But I’d ten times rather pay a WR than a RB. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

8 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

I for one wouldn’t want to pay CMC that kind of money and neither did the Panthers. I wouldn’t want to pay Kamara either or Barkley and JT. It’s just not worth the investment in my opinion. 
 

I mean, there’s big difference between a 31 year old and however old Barkley and JT are, no matter the position. That’s a completely different situation. But I’d ten times rather pay a WR than a RB. 

I would rather pay a WR that is great compared to a RB that is great as well if both are in their primes with the way the game is today. That has never been my debate. Not a 30 year old WR though compared to a 25 year old RB regarding that. What great WR's do the Giants have or do we have is the key question? I can answer that, it is none. Both teams have a couple of good WR's, Pittman is good but not great. So taking that into account, if a RB is your best player and in his prime (not old) and is a playmaker, one would think your FO would pay him for at least 3 years on nice deal. That is just my thinking.

 

RB by committee is marvelous if you have a great QB and at least 1 great WR. Giants or the Colts have either.

[Solid84]

4 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I would rather pay a WR that is great compared to a RB that is great as well if both are in their primes with the way the game is today. That has never been my debate. Not a 30 year old WR though compared to a 25 year old RB regarding that. What great WR's do the Giants have or do we have is the key question? I can answer that, it is none. Both teams have a couple of good WR's, Pittman is good but not great. So taking that into account, if a RB is your best player and in his prime (not old) and is a playmaker, one would think your FO would pay him for at least 3 years on nice deal. That is just my thinking.

 

RB by committee is marvelous if you have a great QB and at least 1 great WR. Giants or the Colts have either.

Us lacking a great WR isn’t really a reason to spend our salary cap on a RB though. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

 

[Peter Nova]

3 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

 

 

 

So much for the holdout and RB Pickett lines.  It's unfortunate to be forced to provide for a family on only $10M. lol

[2006Coltsbestever]

4 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

 

He went for 11 Mill because 10.1 of it is guaranteed. After he makes that kind of money this year, he can retire and never run out of money. He knows what he is doing 

[Nickster]

19 hours ago, Solid84 said:

Us lacking a great WR isn’t really a reason to spend our salary cap on a RB though. 

Kinda the opposite to me.

[2006Coltsbestever]

Just now, Nickster said:

Kinda the opposite to me.

I agree, we also have the money to pay Taylor a reasonably great contract. I wouldn't give Taylor anything crazy but 13 or 14 Mill over 3 years at his age is not going to make or break our Salary Cap.

[Nickster]

8 minutes ago, Nickster said:

Kinda the opposite to me.

@2006Coltsbestever I want to give you a chance to renounce your like because you must misunderstand what I’m saying.  I think not having a great WR is a reason NOT to give big money to a RB.  Double and triple down on finding pass catchers and run a committee RB unit.  
 

The Bengals were able to pay a ton to a RB because they had young stud receivers in Higgins and Boyd not making much, then they drafted Chase.  Since their WR unit is spectacular and nit eating much cap as a function of their production, they were able to avoid cutting Mixon with the big number.

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, Nickster said:

@2006Coltsbestever I want to give you a chance to renounce your like because you must misunderstand what I’m saying.  I think not having a great WR is a reason NOT to give big money to a RB.  Double and triple down on finding pass catchers and run a committee RB unit.  
 

The Bengals were able to play a ton to a RB because they had young stud receivers in Higgins and Boyd not making much then they drafted Chase.  Since their WR unit is spectacular they were able to avoid cutting Mixon with the big number.

You agree then with Solid unless I am slow today or missing something lol.

[Nickster]

Just now, 2006Coltsbestever said:

You agree then with Solid unless I am slow today or missing something lol.

I was but I think solid is disagreeing with your premise that we should pay our stud RB because we don’t have great catchers.

[2006Coltsbestever]

Just now, Nickster said:

I was but I think solid is disagreeing with your premise that we should pay our stud RB because we don’t have great catchers.

Yeah he was. I just don't have faith in us getting a great WR. Tee Higgins will be a free agent next season. That would be a sweet signing. Bengals are going to start losing players after Burrow gets paid. They have took advantage of his rookie contract to be able to keep almost everyone but that is about to come to end. If they don't win the SB this year, they are going to look back at the last 2 years as blown golden opportunities to win it all.

[2006Coltsbestever]

Pittman is good but not great, put a player like Tee Higgins aside him and use Pierce as a 3, we may have something dangerous brewing then. I am all for keeping Taylor in the fold though, he is a great RB.

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Pittman is good but not great, put a player like Tee Higgins aside him and use Pierce as a 3, we may have something dangerous brewing then. I am all for keeping Taylor in the fold though, he is a great RB.

To add to this, I love Josh Downs potential. We will see if he pans out though. 

[TimetobringDfence!]

On 7/20/2023 at 10:15 PM, NFLfan said:

 

Regardless of profession, for those making millions, they can always make more.

 

True but it is a business's and sometimes it just doesn't make sense to dump money at the easiest positions to fill. NFL running back might be the easiest position to find great talent at a fair price.

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Pittman is good but not great, put a player like Tee Higgins aside him and use Pierce as a 3, we may have something dangerous brewing then. I am all for keeping Taylor in the fold though, he is a great RB.

Honestly, I don’t think any of us knows how good Pitt really is?    I think Pitt was badly impacted last year by our disastrous offense.   He went from 22.3 YPC, down to 9.3.   He lost 3 yards per catch.   That’s not normal.   I don’t know how he’ll do this year,  I’m just saying Pitt might be better than anyone even knows.   

 

1 hour ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

 

[2006Coltsbestever]

2 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Honestly, I don’t think any of us knows how good Pitt really is?    I think Pitt was badly impacted last year by our disastrous offense.   He went from 22.3 YPC, down to 9.3.   He lost 3 yards per catch.   That’s not normal.   I don’t know how he’ll do this year,  I’m just saying Pitt might be better than anyone even knows.   

 

 

I hope he is, he had a solid season last year despite the team being bad. We will see how it goes this season. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 hour ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Pittman is good but not great, put a player like Tee Higgins aside him and use Pierce as a 3, we may have something dangerous brewing then. I am all for keeping Taylor in the fold though, he is a great RB.

Higgins and Pittman are the exact same player. He  has more opportunities because of Chase on the other side.

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Higgins and Pittman are the exact same player. He  has more opportunities because of Chase on the other side.

Point is, if we had both, opponents can't double team Pittman anymore. Both WR's are pretty equal as in good but together they would be hard to stop. 

[Superman]

2 hours ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

 

 

 A couple things stand out about this, to me. First, they were able to do a new deal after the franchise tag deadline because it's only for one year. I don't remember ever seeing this happen before.

 

Second, if he hits incentives and maxes out his 2023 compensation, it raises his 2024 franchise tag number by a couple million. 

 

It's an interesting compromise, but it obviously favors the team, not the player. Still, kind of sets a value for a top tier RB at around $13m, at best. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

Just now, Superman said:

 

 A couple things stand out about this, to me. First, they were able to do a new deal after the franchise tag deadline because it's only for one year. I don't remember ever seeing this happen before.

 

Second, if he hits incentives and maxes out his 2023 compensation, it raises his 2024 franchise tag number by a couple million. 

 

It's an interesting compromise, but it obviously favors the team, not the player. Still, kind of sets a value for a top tier RB at around $13m, at best. 

Taylor has never said but I wonder how much he thinks he is worth. He may be happy with 13 Mill over 3 or 4 years if a lot of it is guaranteed. 

[NFLfan]

4 hours ago, TimetobringDfence! said:

True but it is a business's and sometimes it just doesn't make sense to dump money at the easiest positions to fill. NFL running back might be the easiest position to find great talent at a fair price.

 

True, but there is a lot more to a person than just value at the position. What does he mean to his teammates? What kind of a person is he -- can you depend on him to do the right thing? Do you have another person to do what he does? And so on...

 

I would pay JT. JMO

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

It seems these running backs want more guaranteed money. Wonder if Taylor would take a shorter 2 year deal that has more guaranteed.

[Dunk]

11 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Honestly, I don’t think any of us knows how good Pitt really is?    I think Pitt was badly impacted last year by our disastrous offense.   He went from 22.3 YPC, down to 9.3.   He lost 3 yards per catch.   That’s not normal.   I don’t know how he’ll do this year,  I’m just saying Pitt might be better than anyone even knows.   

 

 

One thing I noticed last year.

Ryan"s timing with Pitt stunk. He threw  a lot of passes that the defender in the trail position could get a hand on, If he had lead him more, it looked like an easy completion. 

Was this just me, or did anyone else see this?

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, Dunk said:

One thing I noticed last year.

Ryan"s timing with Pitt stunk. He threw  a lot of passes that the defender in the trail position could get a hand on, If he had lead him more, it looked like an easy completion. 

Was this just me, or did anyone else see this?

I don’t have a vivid memory of this, but not saying you’re wrong.   
 

My vivid memory is that the offense never looked very well coordinated to me.   It always seemed a little out of synch….  Sometimes way out of synchronized.  Overall, the offense struck me as not very well coached, no matter who was the HC.  

[colts89]

I don't understand how Ballard wouldn't pay Taylor a higher end RB  contract for the next 2-3 years. The man has been trying to carry an entire offense for the last two years. Frank basically said # it to the pass game in 2021. Teams got the hint last year and stacked the box all the time but Frank didn't care lmao.

 

Even Taylor's supposed 'down' and 'injury riddled' year last year was pretty good lol.

 

It's not like RBs get payed a ton compared to their offensive peers anyways... Pay the man. I'm pretty sure we're paying close to double in dead cap for some awful QBs then we would pay for a potential 2-3 years of elite Taylor play. He has great character, great work ethic, and is obviously a smart guy and makes the locker room better. He got hurt last year, but that was his first major injury he's ever had in his football career I believe. Seems like a no brainer for Ballard to pay one of the few guys who made him look at least somewhat decent in the last three years.

[NewColtsFan]

34 minutes ago, colts89 said:

I don't understand how Ballard wouldn't pay Taylor a higher end RB  contract for the next 2-3 years. The man has been trying to carry an entire offense for the last two years. Frank basically said # it to the pass game in 2021. Teams got the hint last year and stacked the box all the time but Frank didn't care lmao.

 

Even Taylor's supposed 'down' and 'injury riddled' year last year was pretty good lol.

 

It's not like RBs get payed a ton compared to their offensive peers anyways... Pay the man. I'm pretty sure we're paying close to double in dead cap for some awful QBs then we would pay for a potential 2-3 years of elite Taylor play. He has great character, great work ethic, and is obviously a smart guy and makes the locker room better. He got hurt last year, but that was his first major injury he's ever had in his football career I believe. Seems like a no brainer for Ballard to pay one of the few guys who made him look at least somewhat decent in the last three years.

1.   How do you know Ballard hasn’t offered a 2-3 year contract?   Maybe he has and it’s been rejected?

 

2.   Maybe Taylor is expecting a 4-5 year contract at dollars that are no longer realistic? 
 

 

What I’m stressing, is that the only we know is that JT is unhappy.   What we don’t know is what has been offered and rejected.   It takes both sides to make an agreement. 

[AwesomeAustin]

Saw this holdout coming and why I thought they should have traded JT before the draft of someone was willing to give us a good package like CMC. Doubt anyone was offering much.  JT deserves to be paid but I don’t think we should bc we have the franchise tag. It’s unfair for these top RBs right now.  
 

Proposed contract to replace JTs immediately. 4yrs 48m with 30m guaranteed. 6m signing bonus and 12m the next two years  paid with roster bonus and game checks. Last two years are basically voidable but keep a small roster bonus on those so we have time to evaluate him and work a trade or cut him. Doubt his agent will go for that bc this will allow us to cut him after the draft if no takers and most teams starting rosters will be set. 

[GoColts8818]

4 hours ago, AwesomeAustin said:

Saw this holdout coming and why I thought they should have traded JT before the draft of someone was willing to give us a good package like CMC. Doubt anyone was offering much.  JT deserves to be paid but I don’t think we should bc we have the franchise tag. It’s unfair for these top RBs right now.  
 

Proposed contract to replace JTs immediately. 4yrs 48m with 30m guaranteed. 6m signing bonus and 12m the next two years  paid with roster bonus and game checks. Last two years are basically voidable but keep a small roster bonus on those so we have time to evaluate him and work a trade or cut him. Doubt his agent will go for that bc this will allow us to cut him after the draft if no takers and most teams starting rosters will be set. 

JT hasn’t held out.  He reported to camp.

[Nickster]

On 7/25/2023 at 8:41 AM, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Yeah he was. I just don't have faith in us getting a great WR. Tee Higgins will be a free agent next season. That would be a sweet signing. Bengals are going to start losing players after Burrow gets paid. They have took advantage of his rookie contract to be able to keep almost everyone but that is about to come to end. If they don't win the SB this year, they are going to look back at the last 2 years as blown golden opportunities to win it all.

Yep, there are some players that are going to get fat deals too. 

 

I love Higgins, but we have Pittman.  I'd much rather have Higgins.  If the question is do we resign Pittman or get Higgins as a FA, the latter is a no brainer to me. 

[Nickster]

On 7/25/2023 at 10:19 AM, NewColtsFan said:

Honestly, I don’t think any of us knows how good Pitt really is?    I think Pitt was badly impacted last year by our disastrous offense.   He went from 22.3 YPC, down to 9.3.   He lost 3 yards per catch.   That’s not normal.   I don’t know how he’ll do this year,  I’m just saying Pitt might be better than anyone even knows.   

 

 

 

He went from 12.3 to 9.3.  Drop off sure, but not quite as dramatic lol. 

[Nickster]

On 7/25/2023 at 10:33 AM, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Higgins and Pittman are the exact same player. He  has more opportunities because of Chase on the other side.

 

I disagree.  He is a more impactful player than Pitt. He produced roughly the same his Rookie year without Chase than he did his other two years.

 

I think Higgins could be a 1300-1500 yd. receiver with 10-12 TDs with the increased target share of a primary receiver.  

[Nickster]

13 hours ago, Dunk said:

One thing I noticed last year.

Ryan"s timing with Pitt stunk. He threw  a lot of passes that the defender in the trail position could get a hand on, If he had lead him more, it looked like an easy completion. 

Was this just me, or did anyone else see this?

Can't say as I noticed that specifically, but I can say I noticed Ryan stunk lol.   So I would assume he stunk when throwing to  Pittman too lol. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Good point Joel Erickson mentioned on his podcast is these running backs are more likely to get money from their current teams then on the open market.

[Nickster]

10 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

1.   How do you know Ballard hasn’t offered a 2-3 year contract?   Maybe he has and it’s been rejected?

 

2.   Maybe Taylor is expecting a 4-5 year contract at dollars that are no longer realistic? 
 

 

What I’m stressing, is that the only we know is that JT is unhappy.   What we don’t know is what has been offered and rejected.   It takes both sides to make an agreement. 

 

And it's likely that the unhappiness is related to the NFL market determining that RB aren't worth big money contracts.  

[Nickster]

On 7/25/2023 at 8:34 AM, 2006Coltsbestever said:

You agree then with Solid unless I am slow today or missing something lol.

 

Yep.  @Superman is occasionally on the right side of an argument. 

[w87r]

36 minutes ago, Nickster said:

 

He went from 12.3 to 9.3.  Drop off sure, but not quite as dramatic lol. 

He stated it was a 3 yard per catch drop off.

 

Just had a mistyped number.

[Nickster]

17 minutes ago, Nickster said:

 

Yep.  @Superman is occasionally on the right side of an argument. 

@Superman Thought you'd get a kick out of that Supe. 

7 minutes ago, w87r said:

He stated it was a 3 yard per catch drop off.

 

Just had a mistyped number.

 

My bad.  Gracias for the correction.