Ground and pound vs. 'the new NFL'

[Gavin]

Clearly we have some people who love to air it out more then ya should and havent learned from the past, Im gonna make a prediction and I think its a pretty accurate one considering I saw fourteen years of proof to back it up, if the Colts get into the habit of throwing 40+ times a game the teams that are good will figure us out (think the Patriots of old), you run to set up the pass and then nail a team with playaction, sure we will beat the lesser teams down the road after we grow as a team but if you cant run in the playoffs and stop the run your >>>ed, think 65-35 pass run, as for the run game dont win games ever heard of the 4 minute offense? an offenses best weapon is the ability to keep a defense guessing and off guard, what happened when the best teams figured out Manning and realized the Colts couldnt run? it put our defense on the field and the best teams figured out put a tight end and a tackle on Freeny or Mathis and problem solved teams could throw and run all day on us, sure we can air it out but I dont recommend it, we have a better running blocking offensive line now, use it and Luck can throw it, we got Reggie Wayne but that dont mean throw it to him 40 times a game

[basketballsteve]

I would like to have a team built around a defense like the 1970 SB Colts. Every time that defense took the field I relaxed because I believed they would either stop the other team or create a turnover and a short field for the offense When the offense was on the field I was nervous and keyed up.. The offense wasn't really very good and lost their 2 best runners Hill and Matte by the end of the first game of the season but they could throw the ball a bit and they really didn't have to be that good. That's the style of team that I'd like the Colts to become over the next 2-3 years and in a few years when Luck become the best QB in the NFL then offense will surge and we will rule the NFL.

[Jay305]

Ground & Pound is a method for Failure in todays NFL.

The playoff win over the Ravens that someone mentioned would have been a sure Loss if the opposing QB wasn't average like Flacko.The reason the Ravens lost that game & KC the week before was they both thought they would easily run it down our throat,even though we sold out against the run and were very vulnable to the pass.

The Best Teams have the Best QBs and the best qb's out pass/score mediocore qb's.

WE WILL have one of the Best QBs in football for the next 15 years and we need to take advantage of his skills not have him handoff all day.

All he did at Stanford was hand it off all day though?

[Gavin]

hes here so support him

[Creekside]

Actually, in the Super Bowl, both the Pats and Giants were averaging over 4 yards per carry. And without their strong running game going all throughout the playoffs, the Giants wouldn't have won. I think you need to be able to pass well more than you need to be able to run well, but you shouldn't sacrifice one for the other. Offenses work best when they can rely on both. A good running game forces the defense to stack the box and bite on play action; a good passing game will spread the defense out and make them drop back into coverage

..............nobody is saying "sacrifice one for the other"....nobody is saying you don't need to run the ball.....of course you do!....but when builing a team, or even maintaining a good team, every GM, every coach must make choices in regards to priorities.....

[21isSuperman]

..............nobody is saying "sacrifice one for the other"....nobody is saying you don't need to run the ball.....of course you do!....but when builing a team, or even maintaining a good team, every GM, every coach must make choices in regards to priorities.....

Yeah, but you still need a solid running game to win a Super Bowl. You don't need to lead the league in rushing, but you want a reliable running game to keep the defense honest, in my opinion

[dgambill]

..............nobody is saying "sacrifice one for the other"....nobody is saying you don't need to run the ball.....of course you do!....but when builing a team, or even maintaining a good team, every GM, every coach must make choices in regards to priorities.....

Yes...the priority should be to build a BALANCED team. I don't want avg players at every position but I don't need 3 pro bowl receivers and TE either. Mostly...I want an offensive line and defensive line that DOMINATE the line of scrimmage. Wether that means we can run on other teams with just a solid back, gives our franchise qb time to throw the ball, puts pressure on opposing qbs and shuts down run games. If you win at the point of attack...you are on your way to winning the game. Give me pro bowlers up front on both sides and an elite qb that will manage the game but has the ability to carry a team if they have to and that is what I want.

We should have the qb with Luck. I hope to give him the best offensive line in football. Counter with a great d-line, solid lbs and an opportunistic saftey and I think you can win that way. I don't need all pro receivers on both sides or pro bowl back. I would be very happy running the ball 30 times a game...as long as my qb can wing it when we have to and can bring us back then I am happy. If we are balanced that means we run on teams we have an advantage on and we throw the same way. If he can move us down the field on a 2min drill then thats all I care. I would much rather have the Patriots of 6 years ago (before they went pass happy) then the new ones or the Saints now. I'm sorry. Give me that balance..its much harder to game plan for and much easier to make in game adjustments.

[oldunclemark]

I think Ground and Pound is the mentality NFL teams want to have ("we're tougher than you, you're going to get punched in the mouth, you can't tackle us"), but without a solid passing game, you won't get far. However, if you don't have a reliable running game to keep the defense honest and to run out the clock, you won't go very far in the playoffs either.

But the recent championship teams threw the ball a lot

This ground and pound....thats not reality..

the NYGs ran 411 times last season and passed 589 times

NE ran 438 times and threw 611...

Pitt is a running team..right?

Wrong...they passed 539 and ran 434..last year

..surely the filtyhy, nasty mena old Monstare of the Midway run more than they pass.

Their QB was out the last 6 games....right?

Wrong...They ran 456 times and passed 473

This balanced attack is NOT something you want.

Its not the way you win now...

My point is that while some here blame our playoff failures on the old country boy and his desire to pass 2 out of every three plays.....Indy actually won because they thre 60% of the time..and we didnt lose as m,any playof games as some would suggest

Bottom line.... Andrew Luck will come out of the gate throwing..and he should...that's the 21st Century NFL.

.,.,because that's what the rules and the conditions give you now...

[Jules]

Balance.

After the WC playoffs in the NFL this year:

Winners. 164.5 yards rushing, 304 yards passing

Losers. 82.0 yards rushing, 281 yards passing

The Saints held the Lions in the WC loss to 32 rushing yards.

[oldunclemark]

Balance.

After the WC playoffs in the NFL this year:

Winners. 164.5 yards rushing, 304 yards passing

Losers. 82.0 yards rushing, 281 yards passing

The Saints held the Lions in the WC loss to 32 rushing yards.

Those numbers say it all,..win OR lose..you pass more than you run

..The Lions gained 32 yards becausr they feel behind and had to pass..

..and that's just one game..

///I just dont want our offensive focus to change under Luck's QB-ing..

...because the 'Indy-NE-NOLA" style is the way the game is going.

Lets not get confused and take a U-turn

[21isSuperman]

But the recent championship teams threw the ball a lot

This ground and pound....thats not reality..

the NYGs ran 411 times last season and passed 589 times

NE ran 438 times and threw 611...

Pitt is a running team..right?

Wrong...they passed 539 and ran 434..last year

..surely the filtyhy, nasty mena old Monstare of the Midway run more than they pass.

Their QB was out the last 6 games....right?

Wrong...They ran 456 times and passed 473

This balanced attack is NOT something you want.

Its not the way you win now...

My point is that while some here blame our playoff failures on the old country boy and his desire to pass 2 out of every three plays.....Indy actually won because they thre 60% of the time..and we didnt lose as m,any playof games as some would suggest

Bottom line.... Andrew Luck will come out of the gate throwing..and he should...that's the 21st Century NFL.

.,.,because that's what the rules and the conditions give you now...

A good passing attack is a good way to win in the regular season. You don't restrict yourself. In the playoffs, you want to be able to run the ball so you can keep the opposing QB on the sidelines. Every drive is important and time of possession is more important than in the regular season. Hold onto the ball, make your drives take a lot of time off the clock, and end with a TD. Sure, those championship teams didn't run well during the regular season, but in the playoffs, they elevate their running games.

[Jay305]

Those numbers say it all,..win OR lose..you pass more than you run

..The Lions gained 32 yards becausr they feel behind and had to pass..

..and that's just one game..

///I just dont want our offensive focus to change under Luck's QB-ing..

...because the 'Indy-NE-NOLA" style is the way the game is going.

Lets not get confused and take a U-turn

Oh it will have to change early on atleast he comes from a run heavy offense and I dont expect him to throw us to victory with 35-40 attempts

[Warhorse]

A dominant run game is nice......but I'll pass.

[Creekside]

Yes...the priority should be to build a BALANCED team. I don't want avg players at every position but I don't need 3 pro bowl receivers and TE either. Mostly...I want an offensive line and defensive line that DOMINATE the line of scrimmage. Wether that means we can run on other teams with just a solid back, gives our franchise qb time to throw the ball, puts pressure on opposing qbs and shuts down run games. If you win at the point of attack...you are on your way to winning the game. Give me pro bowlers up front on both sides and an elite qb that will manage the game but has the ability to carry a team if they have to and that is what I want.

We should have the qb with Luck. I hope to give him the best offensive line in football. Counter with a great d-line, solid lbs and an opportunistic saftey and I think you can win that way. I don't need all pro receivers on both sides or pro bowl back. I would be very happy running the ball 30 times a game...as long as my qb can wing it when we have to and can bring us back then I am happy. If we are balanced that means we run on teams we have an advantage on and we throw the same way. If he can move us down the field on a 2min drill then thats all I care. I would much rather have the Patriots of 6 years ago (before they went pass happy) then the new ones or the Saints now. I'm sorry. Give me that balance..its much harder to game plan for and much easier to make in game adjustments.

.....who is saying you don't need balance?....This post began with the notion that you don't need a DOMINATE running attack to win it all....I agree with that....of COURSE you still need a good O-line and a good D line...who is saying you don't?...not me....you seem to be interpreting what I'm saying is "all you need is a QB and some receivers"....I'm not...of course you need a complete team..what's wrong with say, an Addai and a Rhodes?....nothing.

[Creekside]

Balance.

After the WC playoffs in the NFL this year:

Winners. 164.5 yards rushing, 304 yards passing

Losers. 82.0 yards rushing, 281 yards passing

The Saints held the Lions in the WC loss to 32 rushing yards.

.....those numbers don't say it all...and are misleading....the leaders of the games run to burn clock and preserve leads. The teams that are behind abandon the run and pass TO CATCH UP before time runs out.....we've all seen it hundreds of times (well, I have)...

[Jules]

A good passing attack is a good way to win in the regular season. You don't restrict yourself. In the playoffs, you want to be able to run the ball so you can keep the opposing QB on the sidelines. Every drive is important and time of possession is more important than in the regular season. Hold onto the ball, make your drives take a lot of time off the clock, and end with a TD. Sure, those championship teams didn't run well during the regular season, but in the playoffs, they elevate their running games.

This.

BTW I don't really think there is much of an argument here. Everyone wants balance. I don't want a crappy passing game and elite run game only. I would prefer to have both be effective when needed in an ideal world. The Saints in recent years have had one of the top passing games in the league but the run game has not been too far behind at times for a few of those seasons.

[Jules]

///I just dont want our offensive focus to change under Luck's QB-ing..

...because the 'Indy-NE-NOLA" style is the way the game is going.

Lets not get confused and take a U-turn

Except that NOLA can run the ball as well as pass it in a few of their recent most successful seasons.

2011: Saints 1st ranked passing game and 6th ranked run game.....13-3 and nearly a trip to the title game if their D could stop Alex Smith in the end.

2009: Saints 4th ranked passing game and 6th ranked run game.....result was 13-3 and a SB title.

BTW in terms of you saying you don't want our offensive focus to change..well let the new era and Luck create their own identity and style with time. I am hoping they DO want to create more balance. And I think they will try.

[cmgww]

I think balance is important for several reasons...a lot have been mentioned already. The threat of the run opens up play action, sometimes weather dictates running a bit more. But I also think a good running game is key late in games. You just mentally and physically defeat the opposing defense, meanwhile chewing clock. Remember NE throwing it late against us in 2009? Incompletes stopping the clock. Or in this year's SB? The pass to Welker that should have been caught, should have been a run. Or the infamous 3rd and 5 Garcon drop against the Saints in 2009??? If we weren't ranked dead last in rushing that year and had a decent ground game, we probably run the ball in that situation. Having the ABILITY to "ground and pound" is key in certain situations (i.e. milking a 7 point lead with 5 minutes left), but we don't need to be a "ground and pound" team. We need balance on offense and DEFENSE!!

[Coach_Clancy]

In many discussions...many of you suggest you hated our old style of play.

Some say they want a balanced attack for the 2012 Colts.

One where we establish the run and dont pass so much like the old country boy did.

The inference is that all our failures (not our successes) over the last decade were due to an over-reliance on the pass.'

..and the theme seems (to me) to be a school of thought that NOW as we have good coaching and a more conventional QB that we will be more of a classic NFL team, a 66-33%, 1970s run-pass team.

I would contend that those days are gone...and we will lose trying to establish the run

Andrew Luck will, indeed throw 30 - 40 times a game and we will like the results.

My thought is that unless Tim Tebow is the QB, nobody wins when they 'ground and pound'

Fans like physical football and physical is the nature of the game...but we cant turn back the clock.

Pundits seem to hate on the Colts...in my mind..because the Colts of the last decade were a finesse team...but pundits are old people.

No one has won recently with ground and pound...and I'd predict no one will.

The kind of offense Indy built spawned what New England did and what New Orleans and Detroit do. Spread the field. throws the ball and run when the defense spreads.

Since we play indoors (a big factor late in the year) and in warm weather sites every year (Houston Jacksonville and Tennesse) 11 games of 16 every year and since we have the talent at QB.

We MUST continue to be an air force. To do anything else wastes our talent.

We can ride that type of attack to the Super Bowl.

We have done it before and everybody does it now.

How many want a stronger run game than a passing game?

How many want us to run fron conventional two-back and double tight end sets most of the game?

How many want us to 'protect Andrew Luck' by not having him throw as much as that other guy we used to have...or those new agers like Drew Brees.?

Your thoughts..

so lets suppose we have luck throw 30-40 times a game just like the pass happy peyton days. luck gets injured just like peyton. you're telling me that stanton or whover is going to come in and make an effective offense without a strong running attack? hmmm. seems like we have'nt learned a darn thing. and i think irsay and now grigson/pagano recognize that, let's hope so anyway. you don't win with a finesse/lightweight OL that can't pound the ball. we need to get bigger and more physical upfront on both sides of the ball. run the ball. stop the run. win.

[dgambill]

.....who is saying you don't need balance?....This post began with the notion that you don't need a DOMINATE running attack to win it all....I agree with that....of COURSE you still need a good O-line and a good D line...who is saying you don't?...not me....you seem to be interpreting what I'm saying is "all you need is a QB and some receivers"....I'm not...of course you need a complete team..what's wrong with say, an Addai and a Rhodes?....nothing.

What I'm saying is build a dominate line on both sides of the ball. Focus on that. If we do we don't need elite receivers or an number 1 running game. We control the line of scrimmage we will be able to do both. Dominate games with our running game when we need to and pass on others when we have the advantage. Build the trenches. I don't want a ground and pound or a pass happy system. I prefer to be able to do both when we need it. I just don't want to invest in superstars at the skilled positions. I think with an elite qb (which hopefully we will have) he will make avg guys better and if we have the best offensive and defensive line in football and an elite qb managing the game we should be very hard to beat. If we just load up on a passing attack teams can game plan to shut that down. If we just focus on running teams will stack the box. What I say is focus on being the most aggressive and dominate up front and we can pass whenever we want and run the ball down teams throats too.

[oldunclemark]

A good passing attack is a good way to win in the regular season. You don't restrict yourself. In the playoffs, you want to be able to run the ball so you can keep the opposing QB on the sidelines. Every drive is important and time of possession is more important than in the regular season. Hold onto the ball, make your drives take a lot of time off the clock, and end with a TD. Sure, those championship teams didn't run well during the regular season, but in the playoffs, they elevate their running games.

I dont think the game changes in the playoffs....if you are playing indoors as we do

Sometimes when we lost we lost to better teams.......like the Patriots......

I think that actually...playoff games get to be aerial showcases like SF-NOLA last year...

If we dont fly the friendly skies....we'll be at the back of the bus...

[oldunclemark]

so lets suppose we have luck throw 30-40 times a game just like the pass happy peyton days. luck gets injured just like peyton. you're telling me that stanton or whover is going to come in and make an effective offense without a strong running attack? hmmm. seems like we have'nt learned a darn thing. and i think irsay and now grigson/pagano recognize that, let's hope so anyway. you don't win with a finesse/lightweight OL that can't pound the ball. we need to get bigger and more physical upfront on both sides of the ball. run the ball. stop the run. win.

Peyton did not get injured becaues he threw 30-40 times a game..

We DID win with a finesse team.....

Many would rather 'ground and pound' and lose but the rules beg you to pass.

You cant change the way the rules are

[21isSuperman]

I dont think the game changes in the playoffs....if you are playing indoors as we do

Sometimes when we lost we lost to better teams.......like the Patriots......

I think that actually...playoff games get to be aerial showcases like SF-NOLA last year...

If we dont fly the friendly skies....we'll be at the back of the bus...

Of course, I can't say any of this for sure because I haven't been a part of a team planning for or playing in the NFL playoffs. However, I imagine it would make a difference. In the regular season, there's always a next week. In the playoffs, it's different; one loss and your entire season is over. So teams are more careful; you want to hold on to the ball as much as possible and limit the other team's possessions as much as you can. You can't get pass happy and throw the ball everywhere risking picks. Once you have a lead, you can't go crazy and throw the ball around to increase your lead and rack up points while risking picks. Instead, you want to run the ball and keep the opposing offense on the sidelines

[21isSuperman]

Peyton did not get injured becaues he threw 30-40 times a game..

We DID win with a finesse team.....

Many would rather 'ground and pound' and lose but the rules beg you to pass.

You cant change the way the rules are

Our regular season team was finesse since we didn't have much luck running the ball. But in the playoffs, we ran the ball well and ran for over 100 yards against the vaunted Bears defense. Against KC, Peyton threw 3 picks and Addai and Rhodes combined for almost 200 yards rushing and both had over 4 yards per carry. Against the vaunted Ravens defense, Peyton only threw for 170 yards, no TDs, and 2 picks, but again Rhodes and Addai combined for almost 100 yards. Against the Pats, we again ran for over 100 yards and averaged over 4 yards per carry and won despite Peyton throwing a pick 6 to Samuel.

[oldunclemark]

Of course, I can't say any of this for sure because I haven't been a part of a team planning for or playing in the NFL playoffs. However, I imagine it would make a difference. In the regular season, there's always a next week. In the playoffs, it's different; one loss and your entire season is over. So teams are more careful; you want to hold on to the ball as much as possible and limit the other team's possessions as much as you can. You can't get pass happy and throw the ball everywhere risking picks. Once you have a lead, you can't go crazy and throw the ball around to increase your lead and rack up points while risking picks. Instead, you want to run the ball and keep the opposing offense on the sidelines

I will say this:

Offensive linemen want to run the ball and they seem to better when they do...

Plus...in the post-season...you do tedn to be more conservative...

But there has been such a drastic swing in what you are allowed to do from 10 years ago..

..and more teams are playing indoors...which takes away the 12th pass defender (rain, snow and cold)

Its easy to cite peyton....because we have just one title (as if that's not a lot)

but Tom Brady throws the ball all over creation as well...and NOLA is also winning this way

This way being (4 recivers sets on most downs, 66% passing 33% running)

...I dont belivee peole dont look at the numbers for Brady and Brees and even rookie like Cam Newton and

conclude that the game begs you to thrown the ball and rewards you if you do

[BleedingBlue]

I agree that the game begs the ball to be thrown down the field.

and...if you don't have a top 5 QB in this league you have no chance of winning.

[John Waylon]

Balance? Eh, not necessarily. If we're picking up the next prolific passer, how, or why would it make sense to turn into a ground and pound team?

Play to your strengths.

That's what we've been doing for years. The problem is when we tried to run it was awful.

Balance isn't the key, being good at both is. We haven't been good at running for a long, long time.

[pacolts56]

But the recent championship teams threw the ball a lot

This ground and pound....thats not reality..

the NYGs ran 411 times last season and passed 589 times

NE ran 438 times and threw 611...

Pitt is a running team..right?

Wrong...they passed 539 and ran 434..last year

..surely the filtyhy, nasty mena old Monstare of the Midway run more than they pass.

Their QB was out the last 6 games....right?

Wrong...They ran 456 times and passed 473

This balanced attack is NOT something you want.

Its not the way you win now...

My point is that while some here blame our playoff failures on the old country boy and his desire to pass 2 out of every three plays.....Indy actually won because they thre 60% of the time..and we didnt lose as m,any playof games as some would suggest

Bottom line.... Andrew Luck will come out of the gate throwing..and he should...that's the 21st Century NFL.

.,.,because that's what the rules and the conditions give you now...

THAT COMMENT IS INACCURATE

Question to you Mark..... what do teams do late in games, especially in playoff games.... to preserve their leads at critical times?

1. The Colts lost a playoff game to the Chargers when we led with barely over 2 minutes left and couldn't convert a 3rd and 2.... which would have allowed us to bleed out the clock and advance in those playoffs. The Chargers out-toughed us with physical superiority and puked us right out of the playoffs.

2. In the closing minutes of the 1st half against the Saints in the Super Bowl.... we faced a similar situation and failed again on a 3rd and short rushing attempt to extend a drive that could very well have resulted in at least a FG and possibly a TD. We instead punted and the Saints scored a FG to close the half. Their 2nd half on-side kick then turned the tide.... the result of ANOTHER chronic and pathetic area.... our special teams.

My point about having a balanced attack is directly traced to these two key chronic failures in critical playoff situations. Failures that were rooted not only in the lack of talent to execute them after the loss of Tarik Glenn and Jake Scott.... but an offensive philosophy that never put a premium on running the ball in the first place. Pretty inexplicable since the year we won the Super Bowl was the year our offense actually showed greater balance.

After the greatest passing QB of all time was able to win just one Super Bowl in 14 years when, arguably, 2 more were VERY possible.... don't you think we should balance our offense so that we can wear down defenses over the course of the game and smash mouth the clock away, just as we've watched Peyton super-glued to the sidelines on several occasions as the very same thing was done to us?

Wake up..... this "passing league" mentality is being way too overemphasized and Colts fans have two sickening, pathetic and SOFT playoff failures to point to as concrete proof. Not to mention our perennial spot at or near the bottom of the NFL in rushing.

Peyton Manning is the greatest passer in NFL history.... but we got addicted like heroin addicts to his ability to pull our sorry butts out of the fire and ring up 12 wins a year for most of the decade. The problem is that against playoff level defenses, even he fell short when our inability to execute the most basic function in this game of keep-away reared its head.

Now.... if Peyton Manning's time as a Colt, with all of his unbelievable record setting accomplishments as a passer, left him with a string of 12-win seasons but just 1 Super Bowl win.... what on earth makes you think it will be any different with Andrew Luck under the same approach?

[Balzer40]

THAT COMMENT IS INACCURATE

Question to you Mark..... what do teams do late in games, especially in playoff games.... to preserve their leads at critical times?

1. The Colts lost a playoff game to the Chargers when we led with barely over 2 minutes left and couldn't convert a 3rd and 2.... which would have allowed us to bleed out the clock and advance in those playoffs. The Chargers out-toughed us with physical superiority and puked us right out of the playoffs.

2. In the closing minutes of the 1st half against the Saints in the Super Bowl.... we faced a similar situation and failed again on a 3rd and short rushing attempt to extend a drive that could very well have resulted in at least a FG and possibly a TD. We instead punted and the Saints scored a FG to close the half. Their 2nd half on-side kick then turned the tide.... the result of ANOTHER chronic and pathetic area.... our special teams.

My point about having a balanced attack is directly traced to these two key chronic failures in critical playoff situations. Failures that were rooted not only in the lack of talent to execute them after the loss of Tarik Glenn and Jake Scott.... but an offensive philosophy that never put a premium on running the ball in the first place. Pretty inexplicable since the year we won the Super Bowl was the year our offense actually showed greater balance.

After the greatest passing QB of all time was able to win just one Super Bowl in 14 years when, arguably, 2 more were VERY possible.... don't you think we should balance our offense so that we can wear down defenses over the course of the game and smash mouth the clock away, just as we've watched Peyton super-glued to the sidelines on several occasions as the very same thing was done to us?

Wake up..... this "passing league" mentality is being way too overemphasized and Colts fans have two sickening, pathetic and SOFT playoff failures to point to as concrete proof. Not to mention our perennial spot at or near the bottom of the NFL in rushing.

Peyton Manning is the greatest passer in NFL history.... but we got addicted like heroin addicts to his ability to pull our sorry butts out of the fire and ring up 12 wins a year for most of the decade. The problem is that against playoff level defenses, even he fell short when our inability to execute the most basic function in this game of keep-away reared its head.

Now.... if Peyton Manning's time as a Colt, with all of his unbelievable record setting accomplishments as a passer, left him with a string of 12-win seasons but just 1 Super Bowl win.... what on earth makes you think it will be any different with Andrew Luck under the same approach?

Absolutely great post, but good luck trying to convince Oldunclemark.

I have been saying this for yrs.. Yes, the Colts have been a great regular season team, but their style of play simply did not translate well into the playoffs, and thats because in the playoffs, you face much more physical teams.

Fans in Indy have just fell in love with the arial show that Manning would display week in and week out. The Manning era Colts never put emphasis on the trenches of the team. Weak O-line and DT's have killed the Colts over the yrs. when the playoffs came around. Like you said, the one yr. we finally won the superbowl just happened to be the one yr. that the Colts finally figured out how to run the ball and stop the run. Just imagine if they had figured out this formula and stuck with it the entire time Manning was here. We would probably be displaying a few more Lombardi's and superbowl banners in Lucas oil.

[BleedingBlue]

THAT COMMENT IS INACCURATE

Question to you Mark..... what do teams do late in games, especially in playoff games.... to preserve their leads at critical times?

1. The Colts lost a playoff game to the Chargers when we led with barely over 2 minutes left and couldn't convert a 3rd and 2.... which would have allowed us to bleed out the clock and advance in those playoffs. The Chargers out-toughed us with physical superiority and puked us right out of the playoffs.

2. In the closing minutes of the 1st half against the Saints in the Super Bowl.... we faced a similar situation and failed again on a 3rd and short rushing attempt to extend a drive that could very well have resulted in at least a FG and possibly a TD. We instead punted and the Saints scored a FG to close the half. Their 2nd half on-side kick then turned the tide.... the result of ANOTHER chronic and pathetic area.... our special teams.

My point about having a balanced attack is directly traced to these two key chronic failures in critical playoff situations. Failures that were rooted not only in the lack of talent to execute them after the loss of Tarik Glenn and Jake Scott.... but an offensive philosophy that never put a premium on running the ball in the first place. Pretty inexplicable since the year we won the Super Bowl was the year our offense actually showed greater balance.

After the greatest passing QB of all time was able to win just one Super Bowl in 14 years when, arguably, 2 more were VERY possible.... don't you think we should balance our offense so that we can wear down defenses over the course of the game and smash mouth the clock away, just as we've watched Peyton super-glued to the sidelines on several occasions as the very same thing was done to us?

Wake up..... this "passing league" mentality is being way too overemphasized and Colts fans have two sickening, pathetic and SOFT playoff failures to point to as concrete proof. Not to mention our perennial spot at or near the bottom of the NFL in rushing.

Peyton Manning is the greatest passer in NFL history.... but we got addicted like heroin addicts to his ability to pull our sorry butts out of the fire and ring up 12 wins a year for most of the decade. The problem is that against playoff level defenses, even he fell short when our inability to execute the most basic function in this game of keep-away reared its head.

Now.... if Peyton Manning's time as a Colt, with all of his unbelievable record setting accomplishments as a passer, left him with a string of 12-win seasons but just 1 Super Bowl win.... what on earth makes you think it will be any different with Andrew Luck under the same approach?

Great post and I even gave you a "like" but I'm going to counter it with 3 words.

Maurice Jones-Drew.

You don't need a great running game in the NFL, you just need a timely running game. To your point- so you can be able to convert that crucial 3rd and 2 against the chargers. The Giants are a perfect example of that. They had a horrid running game all season (ranked 32nd?) but had just enough going for them to help eli out in the playoffs.

I don't think a balanced offense in today's NFL means equality in passing and running, i think a balanced offense in today's nfl is a team that can spread the ball out in the passing game and run for short yards when they need to.

I'd still say Passing is the most important aspect of an NFL team right now and any team without a great QB has no chance.

[southwest1]

You don't need a balance between run and pass, you just need the ability to do both when needed. The run game doesn't win games, the threat of a run loosens defenses and enables gamebreaking passes to happen.

The days of "grind it out ground and pound" are over, now it's an air game that goes back to the great teams in San Diego and "Air Coryell" the first to use a predominant air game instead.

To me, the ground & pound will never die out because to truly impose your will your team needs brute force like a German tank to penetrate the offensive line & rip the beating heart out of the field general. See Justin Tuck, Osi, & Michael Strahan against Tom Brady in the 2007 Superbowl victory. By the 4th quarter "Tom Terrific" looked like Bambi & he was petrified of the BIG BLUE Front 4 G-MEN.

If your field general has "a deer in the headlights look" because he has been hit so much, I don't care how good your TE's & WR's are...The game is over & the proverbial fat lady is performing vocal scales in the bathroom right before the grand finale closer IMO.

[Jules]

I don't think anyone ever said we need to become the NY Jets.

Just that if we need a few yards running the football or need to run out the clock with a lead it would be nice to be able to do so on the ground.

Anyone remember the ending to the WC round between Colts/Chargers in 2008? Hmmm.......

[colts8718]

Luck is a big, athletic guy, but Manning was the IRONMAN. We need balance because it is just unreasonable to expect that Luck will go 13 years without missing any playing time due to injury. I'd like to know that, in the middle of a playoff run, we might be able to lose our QB for a couple games without having zero chance against any team. I will accept being dead in the water if our QB goes on IR before the season starts, but not missing the playoffs because we couldn't win 1 of 4 with our backup. I loved watching our offense with #18 at the helm, but I'd like to see some balance... not Chicago/Pittsburgh type of balance, just a little less finesse and a little more swagger.

Good job you hit it right on the nose

[pacolts56]

Great post and I even gave you a "like" but I'm going to counter it with 3 words.

Maurice Jones-Drew.

You don't need a great running game in the NFL, you just need a timely running game. To your point- so you can be able to convert that crucial 3rd and 2 against the chargers. The Giants are a perfect example of that. They had a horrid running game all season (ranked 32nd?) but had just enough going for them to help eli out in the playoffs.

I don't think a balanced offense in today's NFL means equality in passing and running, i think a balanced offense in today's nfl is a team that can spread the ball out in the passing game and run for short yards when they need to.

I'd still say Passing is the most important aspect of an NFL team right now and any team without a great QB has no chance.

That's fair.... I don't mean that we should over correct and etch it in stone that we will have a 50-50 run/pass mix every week.

But recent playoff history shows that we'll darn sure need to be able to smash mouth it when the situation call for it and the Giants are a very good illustration.

It's just frustrating to know that we just witnessed probably the greatest sustained display of passing by an NFL QB and wound up with one Super Bowl to show for it.... in large part because our failure on those key run plays either helped the momentum swing against us or gave life to an opponent we could have finished off.

[Gavin]

you build all areas of the ball run,pass.and defense all to play to your opponents weaknesses ya do what the situation calls for some times its run more sometimes its pass but you have to have both

[subvet]

If your field general has "a deer in the headlights look" because he has been hit so much, I don't care how good your TE's & WR's are...The game is over & the proverbial fat lady is performing vocal scales in the bathroom right before the grand finale closer IMO.

Except that the defense can't keep it at that level for the entire game and eventually will make the first mistake and the offense will take over because the defense is out of gas. At that point the fat lady goes to buy another hot dog and a beer because her song just switched teams.

[southwest1]

Except that the defense can't keep it at that level for the entire game and eventually will make the first mistake and the offense will take over because the defense is out of gas. At that point the fat lady goes to buy another hot dog and a beer because her song just switched teams.

I have always said you were a clever fellow subvet. I will acknowledge that eventually the offense must score to secure a victory. I cannot deny that. However, sometimes the defense can generate points through fumbles & turnovers see the 1985 Bears & the 2000 Ravens.

I love low scoring, smash mouth defensive struggles personally. As far as the fat lady goes, the only 1 hot doging around here will be the LB & DE end scooping & scoring the last touchdown placing the final nail in the battered & bruised offensive lines coffin. Last rites are about to be observed by the exhausted & emotionally spent quarterback in my judgement.

All kidding aside, I do enjoy debating & crackin' jokes with you subvet. Well done my friend!!!

[Gavin]

I think we well learned Manning could put up as many points as he wanted or could and if the defense dont stop somebody then all those yards and points is all for not