FA WRs

[Imgrandojji]

3 hours ago, Smoke317 said:

I understand what you’re saying but if we keep Wentz we have to give him somebody that he’s comfortable throwing the ball to.  

If Pittman can't become that guy we have problems Ertz won't fix.

 

However, not to worry.  Irsay wiil force the issue just like he did with bringing in Rivers and Wentz, for all the good they did us.  And we'll all grow familiar with Ertz's flaws and despise his softness within the year.

 

I hate to say it but we're not 1-2 FA away from contending.  We have good pieces but the Irsay-Ballard dichotomy is creating an inconsistent and discordant team vision that will prevent us from ever contending seriously

 

Irsay wants a high flying offense like the ones he was used to years ago, like the one that helped him bring home a ring in 09.  Ballard wants a more conventional rebuild based on physical toughness and wants to develop internally, a process that requires that you DON'T try to force the team to develop an identity (which Irsay is trying to do) and instead let one develop naturally. 

 

The result?  Six of one, half dozen of the other, but never a dozen of either one.  A team that's never good enough to contend and never bad enough to rebuild.  A harbinger of perpetual mediocricy.

 

A team with two visions is like a house divided on itself.  And Irsay won't stay in the owner's box when his team is going through growing pains so this is going to keep happejning.

 

The signs are obvious.  a team that tries to have a great quarterback AND a great run game, and as a result, has half the pieces required to accomplish either one and no coordination between the two. 

 

Not committing to a rebuild when Luck retired turns out to have been a mistake.  A forgivable one, since we seemed close, but still a mistake.  We should have broken up the Luck core in 2019 and put ourselves in the running for one of the elite QB talents last year.  We might have been the ones with Jones or Fields if we had.

 

I think at this point the only sensible move is to step back, sell off some expensive talent and try to draft a QB.  We need to crack the cycle of mediocricy if we ever want to be a prime contender again and that won't happen with a patchwork of mercenary QBs under center.

 

I also think we can count on Irsay (and a large number of fans) refusing to be sensible so i predict that what will happen instead is that we grasp after the fable of becoming a fringe contender in FA year after year until our young core is old and broken down and we've accomplished nothing.  Just like all the other teams that try this.

 

I have a horrible sinking feeling that Ballard will be proved right by tragedy, and it's probably going to cost him his job at some point.  Irsay is so desperate to be Jerry Jones that he's blind to what Jones' interference is costing his franchise, and Ballard and Irsay will eventually be at loggerheads and lose us a quality GM in the name of short term gain.

[Indeee]

3 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

I live Michael Gallup.   Would be thrilled to sign him.   But I don’t see where the money is coming from?  
 

Spotrac projects him getting $11.6 mill per over four years.    I don’t see where that money is coming from?    As for MVS….  Terrible?   He’s averaged between 15-17 yards per catch every year for 4 years.   If that’s terrible, please sign me up!   I hope Patmon and Strachan become that terrible for the Colts!   
 

I know what you want.  I’m looking for realistic.   What’s affordable?  Maybe it’s Wilson for the Cowboys?  He’s looked good down the stretch. 

Average is different than consistent. he is a 30 catch per season guy. Thats terrible. I don't believe this team needs that type of receiver. We need a receiver who can give you 6-7 on 9+ targets guy every week. MVS never caught more than 5 balls a game in 2021 and only did that once. He can get you a quick strike from time to time, but just not enough for my liking

[NewColtsFan]

41 minutes ago, Indeee said:

Average is different than consistent. he is a 30 catch per season guy. Thats terrible. I don't believe this team needs that type of receiver. We need a receiver who can give you 6-7 on 9+ targets guy every week. MVS never caught more than 5 balls a game in 2021 and only did that once. He can get you a quick strike from time to time, but just not enough for my liking

Huh?

 

I stopped arguing for MVS when you said you didn’t like him.  Fine.   But I added where are we getting the money for what you want?  I don’t believe we have that kind of money.   
 

If we sign someone, I think he will be low to mid-priced.   Today, Ballard pretty much ruled out spending a lot on any free agent, including wide receiver.  I’m only trying to be realistic.   Find a reasonably priced guy.   Maybe we will agree on him. 

[Moosejawcolt]

14 hours ago, Smoke317 said:

Godwin & Gallup are both coming off ACL tears late in the season.  I just don’t know if it’s receiver where Wentz needs help.  He needs a tight end.  He can’t read the field very well. He needs that big body target that can get open right in front of him.  So go get Ertz.  And draft a receiver in the draft (I know that hasn’t been CB’s strong suit).  That puts the pressure on Carson, Frank, & CB to all get it right. No more excuses for Carson & Frank.  And no more Banogu’s & Campbell over AJ Brown, Metcalf, & McLaurin for CB.

That is the time to sign them coming off tears. A little bit of a gamble but get them maybe cheaper and guys are healing well coming off ACL tears

 

[Smoke317]

1 hour ago, Imgrandojji said:

If Pittman can't become that guy we have problems Ertz won't fix.

 

However, not to worry.  Irsay wiil force the issue just like he did with bringing in Rivers and Wentz, for all the good they did us.  And we'll all grow familiar with Ertz's flaws and despise his softness within the year.

 

I hate to say it but we're not 1-2 FA away from contending.  We have good pieces but the Irsay-Ballard dichotomy is creating an inconsistent and discordant team vision that will prevent us from ever contending seriously

 

Irsay wants a high flying offense like the ones he was used to years ago, like the one that helped him bring home a ring in 09.  Ballard wants a more conventional rebuild based on physical toughness and wants to develop internally, a process that requires that you DON'T try to force the team to develop an identity (which Irsay is trying to do) and instead let one develop naturally. 

 

The result?  Six of one, half dozen of the other, but never a dozen of either one.  A team that's never good enough to contend and never bad enough to rebuild.  A harbinger of perpetual mediocricy.

 

A team with two visions is like a house divided on itself.  And Irsay won't stay in the owner's box when his team is going through growing pains so this is going to keep happejning.

 

The signs are obvious.  a team that tries to have a great quarterback AND a great run game, and as a result, has half the pieces required to accomplish either one and no coordination between the two. 

 

Not committing to a rebuild when Luck retired turns out to have been a mistake.  A forgivable one, since we seemed close, but still a mistake.  We should have broken up the Luck core in 2019 and put ourselves in the running for one of the elite QB talents last year.  We might have been the ones with Jones or Fields if we had.

 

I think at this point the only sensible move is to step back, sell off some expensive talent and try to draft a QB.  We need to crack the cycle of mediocricy if we ever want to be a prime contender again and that won't happen with a patchwork of mercenary QBs under center.

 

I also think we can count on Irsay (and a large number of fans) refusing to be sensible so i predict that what will happen instead is that we grasp after the fable of becoming a fringe contender in FA year after year until our young core is old and broken down and we've accomplished nothing.  Just like all the other teams that try this.

 

I have a horrible sinking feeling that Ballard will be proved right by tragedy, and it's probably going to cost him his job at some point.  Irsay is so desperate to be Jerry Jones that he's blind to what Jones' interference is costing his franchise, and Ballard and Irsay will eventually be at loggerheads and lose us a quality GM in the name of short term gain.

That’s a good post.  I personally thought Ballard wanted a QB in last year’s draft. Be it Fields or Jones.  But Frank wanted Wentz and Irsay sided with his choice at coach Frank.  That’s why Irsay is saying the buck stops with him.  Because he ultimately forced Ballard’s hand on Wentz.

 

Notice how long it took to get the trade done.  I think Ballard was holding out hope that the Bears would make an offer for Wentz.  So Carson’s team announced that he did not want to play for the Bears and that left Ballard with no choice but to make the deal.

 

The signs are all there.  If Ballard brings in a rookie QB and we struggled (most likely) then he would’ve been justified in going out and choosing his own head coach to coach up his new rookie QB.  But Irsay vetoed that by re-upping Ballard & Reich and ensuring that they’d be attached at the hip.

 

You noticed at his press conference CB talked about this team “figuring out how to win” and going on a run mid-season. In other words Frank finally realized to lean on Taylor and the run game.  But what happens, Frank let’s Carson go pass happy vs the Bucs & we blow a lead and lose a big game.  Then his hand picked QB chokes away the last 2 games.  Not to mention the Titans collapse.  The failures to convert in goal to go nonsense Rams multiple times.  Frank & his hand picked QB came up short.

[Smoke317]

5 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

That is the time to sign them coming off tears. A little bit of a gamble but get them maybe cheaper and guys are healing well coming off ACL tears

 

If we had to sign one I’d take Godwin.  But with Wentz accuracy issues we may have to go Golloday with his wide catch radius. 

[Indeee]

1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

Huh?

 

I stopped arguing for MVS when you said you didn’t like him.  Fine.   But I added where are we getting the money for what you want?  I don’t believe we have that kind of money.   
 

If we sign someone, I think he will be low to mid-priced.   Today, Ballard pretty much ruled out spending a lot on any free agent, including wide receiver.  I’m only trying to be realistic.   Find a reasonably priced guy.   Maybe we will agree on him. 

Sorry, I didn't think we were arguing at all. I understood your point regarding money. I just believe we as a team should stop worrying so much about the money and pay for a player who is just better in terms of skill and production. Teams can make the money work. We need talent, not just guys with experience who fit our budget and fill roster needs. Either way, you could be right about what Ballard will do. We will know in a few months. -Peace

[NewColtsFan]

2 minutes ago, Indeee said:

Sorry, I didn't think we were arguing at all. I understood your point regarding money. I just believe we as a team should stop worrying so much about the money and pay for a player who is just better in terms of skill and production. Teams can make the money work. We need talent, not just guys with experience who fit our budget and fill roster needs. Either way, you could be right about what Ballard will do. We will know in a few months. -Peace

I used arguing as a figure of speech only.  I could’ve used talking, or discussing, or debating.   Almost interchangeable.   I didn’t think we were arguing either.   Sorry, poor word choice by me.    Peace to you as well.

 

[chad72]

1 hour ago, Smoke317 said:

If we had to sign one I’d take Godwin.  But with Wentz accuracy issues we may have to go Golladay with his wide catch radius. 

 

You think the Giants would give up on Golladay after giving him a 5 year contract? I don't think so.

[Smoke317]

2 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

You think the Giants would give up on Golladay after giving him a 5 year contract? I don't think so.

My bad. I meant Gallup. I was rushing to an appointment and confused the two. 

[Imgrandojji]

2 hours ago, Smoke317 said:

 

 

The signs are all there.  If Ballard brings in a rookie QB and we struggled (most likely) then he would’ve been justified in going out and choosing his own head coach to coach up his new rookie QB.  But Irsay vetoed that by re-upping Ballard & Reich and ensuring that they’d be attached at the hip.

 

 

So in other words, literally exactly what Irsay did with Grigson and Pagano.  Proving we have learned literally nothing. 

 

At least Reich and Ballard are competent, but the lack of a coherent vision breeds an incoherent roster and we're seeing that with the product on the field.

[NorthernColt]

Ballard seems to like his WR room. I'm also higher on it then most here as well, although there's definitely room for improvement. He did bring up a good point, the complete lack of balance of our attack being all run all the time, really took an impact on our receivers stats. 

[EastStreet]

6 hours ago, DougDew said:

If designing a WR staff in the perfect world, I agree.

 

Another hybrid like Pittman would work too.  Part of Ballard and Frank's problems are trying to get cute with the analytics, role playing, specific traits and then developing the guy into that role they envision.

 

We want a guy that does this, because we already have a guy that does that.

 

Sometimes you just need to go out and get a guy who is simply better football player than what you have. 

 

Pittman really isn't a hybrid. He's an X that can play big slot, which is the same thing you can say about any X with decent speed. The reason why he's so successful in the seam at times, is simply because we rarely throw there. Also because our slot (Pascal) just isn't that good at pass catching.

 

Just my opinion, but we're too heavy on possession passing, and just too heavy on 1st and 2nd read passing -5.0 to 10.0 yards. If that doesn't change, not sure it matters who we get. 

[GoColts8818]

23 minutes ago, NorthernColt said:

Ballard seems to like his WR room. I'm also higher on it then most here as well, although there's definitely room for improvement. He did bring up a good point, the complete lack of balance of our attack being all run all the time, really took an impact on our receivers stats. 

Well he’s probably going to have to bring in at least one via free agency or the draft even if he’s high on the guys they have because I doubt TY and Pascal are back.  So he will at least need another body.

[MarlySullivan]

Trade Carson for Terry Mclaurin....wishful thinking 

[Hawkeyecolt]

I took CB’s comments as dont blame the WR’s for Wentz missing open receivers. He mentioned they had better stats and YAC under Rivers. He mentioned Wentz needs to get the ball out quicker. I’m sure he knows they need another dynamic receiver and will add a receiver to replace TY and Pascal but also knows Wentz made them look worse than they are in reality. 

[DougDew]

3 hours ago, Hawkeyecolt said:

I took CB’s comments as dont blame the WR’s for Wentz missing open receivers. He mentioned they had better stats and YAC under Rivers. He mentioned Wentz needs to get the ball out quicker. I’m sure he knows they need another dynamic receiver and will add a receiver to replace TY and Pascal but also knows Wentz made them look worse than they are in reality. 

I wonder what the oline grades were under Rivers and then under Wentz,  Especially the oline grades in Wentz' bad games.