Ty Law: How to stop Peyton

[amfootball]

Cool read on ESPN on Ty Law and how he was able to stop Peyton over the years.

 

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9982910/secrets-success-peyton-manning-tom-brady

[Superman]

This was a great article. It was about more than Manning, it was about Brady as well. And points out that he worked extra hard in the film room before playing either guy. 

[amfootball]

This was a great article. It was about more than Manning, it was about Brady as well. And points out that he worked extra hard in the film room before playing either guy. 

Yeah just realized that. The tease in from the home page said "Ty: How to stop Peyton."  I hate when they do that.

 

Good analysis on him though for both Peyton and Tom.

[Valpo2004]

Weird that the CB was talking about doing a pick 6 on Brady because he knew his signals and the LB was talking about how you shouldn't pay too close attention to their signals.  

[Jules]

More people should just study the Colts/Broncos game film which I am sure the Pats will be doing. I felt a lot of the late yardage/plays by the Broncos was because a few of our starting DBs left the game too.

 

We did an excellent job IMO even though we let them come back in the game.

 

I also felt we did not care if they ran it on us and honestly they could not do much in the run game........

 

And on offense go for the big plays in the passing game. I felt the Chiefs played small ball way too often......then again I still don't trust Alex Smith all too much. Not a bad QB but overall completely meh......

 

 

[amfootball]

More people should just study the Colts/Broncos game film which I am sure the Pats will be doing. I felt a lot of the late yardage/plays by the Broncos was because a few of our starting DBs left the game too.

 

We did an excellent job IMO even though we let them come back in the game.

 

I also felt we did not care if they ran it on us and honestly they could not do much in the run game........

 

And on offense go for the big plays in the passing game. I felt the Chiefs played small ball way too often......then again I still don't trust Alex Smith all too much. Not a bad QB but overall completely meh......

I think it is a simple game to beat a Peyton Manning team to be honest. It is why Belichick has had so much success against him over the years. He runs the same offense every game but the key is being able to disrupt it. The Colts did an excellent job of pressure and coverage. I have my doubts that the Pats will be able to stay with the Broncs receivers but Manning being hurt may help them as they may just have to cover short and then try to get to Manning when he holds the ball longer. If Welker does not play then it is a big advantage to the Pats along with the weather which is supposed to be cold (30's) and windy (15-20 mph).

[Superman]

I think it is a simple game to beat a Peyton Manning team to be honest. It is why Belichick has had so much success against him over the years. He runs the same offense every game but the key is being able to disrupt it. The Colts did an excellent job of pressure and coverage. I have my doubts that the Pats will be able to stay with the Broncs receivers but Manning being hurt may help them as they may just have to cover short and then try to get to Manning when he holds the ball longer. If Welker does not play then it is a big advantage to the Pats along with the weather which is supposed to be cold (30's) and windy (15-20 mph).

 

Simple and easy aren't the same thing, though. I do think it's simple. You cover well, get physical with receivers to disrupt timing, and get pressure up the middle, and then you have a chance. Problem is you can't get beat off the line, you can't make mistakes on play action, you have to stop the run, and you have to get pressure up the middle without blitzing. All of that is easier said than done.

[amfootball]

Simple and easy aren't the same thing, though. I do think it's simple. You cover well, get physical with receivers to disrupt timing, and get pressure up the middle, and then you have a chance. Problem is you can't get beat off the line, you can't make mistakes on play action, you have to stop the run, and you have to get pressure up the middle without blitzing. All of that is easier said than done.

Yes, simple but hardly easy. Manning is too good pre and post snap. But the scheme does not change. You just have to disguise well and be able to get to him. The Colts played a beautiful game and still at the end Manning had the game won if not for the fumble.

[Superman]

Yes, simple but hardly easy. Manning is too good pre and post snap. But the scheme does not change. You just have to disguise well and be able to get to him. The Colts played a beautiful game and still at the end Manning had the game won if not for the fumble.

 

We gave up 33 points and a lot of yards. I liked that we were disciplined and hung in there, and we got pressure in crucial spots, but it wasn't a flawless defensive game by any stretch of the imagination.

 

I'm not even that high on trying to disguise. If you're going to play two deep, then just play two deep. Let him check into a run, that's why you have linemen. I understand disguising a robber or something to go Cover 1, but play your man and play your zone, and just do it well. 

[amfootball]

We gave up 33 points and a lot of yards. I liked that we were disciplined and hung in there, and we got pressure in crucial spots, but it wasn't a flawless defensive game by any stretch of the imagination.

 

I'm not even that high on trying to disguise. If you're going to play two deep, then just play two deep. Let him check into a run, that's why you have linemen. I understand disguising a robber or something to go Cover 1, but play your man and play your zone, and just do it well. 

Good points. A good run game helps too to keep him off the field. What was the time of possession in the Colts game? Seemed like Colts had the ball longer but that may have been from the TOs. I expect the Pats to run early and stick with it all game unless they get behind big.

[Superman]

Good points. A good run game helps too to keep him off the field. What was the time of possession in the Colts game? Seemed like Colts had the ball longer but that may have been from the TOs. I expect the Pats to run early and stick with it all game unless they get behind big.

 

28:32. Not that big of an advantage.

 

We didn't give up a lot of big plays, we shut down the run, and we were good on third down (5/16, including third and short). Forced three turnovers. Things just kind of went our way.

[The Fish]

Watched the 03 Colts Pats regular season game today on a replay. It's amazing how different Peyton is as a player today, where Tom is kinda the same guy. Ty Law gave Peyton fits, for sure. 

 

The way Peyton plays currently, it would be surprising to me if the Pats D don't crowd the line, safeties down, CB's man coverage. 

Bill will have a scheme. 

[21isSuperman]

Anyone else think these kinds of articles are a little pointless?  "You can beat Brady by getting pressure to him"..."Peyton gets flustered when his receivers aren't where they should be"...can't you say that for any QB in the league?

 

One thing I found interesting (and something I disagree with) is this part: "Manning usually throws to his main targets, whether they are covered or not."  I don't buy that.  In 2004, Stokley, Harrison, and Wayne all had 1000+ yards, and 10+ TDs.  Even with a guys like Reggie Wayne and Dallas Clark on the team, I believe Austin Collie was leading the league in receiving before his injury in 2010.  In the playoff game against the Jets in 2011, Reggie Wayne had 1 reception for 1 yard because Revis was covering him all game.  I don't think Peyton will blindly throw to a favourite target just because he is covered.  That's part of what make Peyton and Brady so great; they don't lock in on one receiver.  They find the open man.

 

The one guy I've seen have continual success against Peyton has been Romeo Crennel.  He's the only guy I've seen that has been able to continually disrupt Peyton's offense.

[Superman]

Watched the 03 Colts Pats regular season game today on a replay. It's amazing how different Peyton is as a player today, where Tom is kinda the same guy. Ty Law gave Peyton fits, for sure. 

 

The way Peyton plays currently, it would be surprising to me if the Pats D don't crowd the line, safeties down, CB's man coverage. 

Bill will have a scheme. 

 

If it's windy, they can bring their safeties down within 12 yards. Manning wants to shorten up the passing concepts as much as possible, a) because their game is built on high percentage passes, and b) he doesn't want to allow the pass rush to get to him. The Pats might show single coverage on the outside practically all game long.

[Superman]

Anyone else think these kinds of articles are a little pointless?  "You can beat Brady by getting pressure to him"..."Peyton gets flustered when his receivers aren't where they should be"...can't you say that for any QB in the league?

 

One thing I found interesting (and something I disagree with) is this part: "Manning usually throws to his main targets, whether they are covered or not."  I don't buy that.  In 2004, Stokley, Harrison, and Wayne all had 1000+ yards, and 10+ TDs.  Even with a guys like Reggie Wayne and Dallas Clark on the team, I believe Austin Collie was leading the league in receiving before his injury in 2010.  In the playoff game against the Jets in 2011, Reggie Wayne had 1 reception for 1 yard because Revis was covering him all game.  I don't think Peyton will blindly throw to a favourite target just because he is covered.  That's part of what make Peyton and Brady so great; they don't lock in on one receiver.  They find the open man.

 

The one guy I've seen have continual success against Peyton has been Romeo Crennel.  He's the only guy I've seen that has been able to continually disrupt Peyton's offense.

 

Agreed all around.

 

To your first point, the difference between Brady and Manning and everyone else (mostly Manning, to be honest) is that everyone tried for years to figure out the silver bullet. And now, people are realizing that there is no silver bullet. Maybe in 2003, when he was less experienced. But now? Nah, it's all about execution. You're not going to trick him with a blitz, you're not going to force him to make a mistake with coverage. I believe all six of his picks this year were the result of tips and poorly thrown balls, not surprise coverage or mistakes.

 

So it's true, if you disrupt timing and pressure up the middle, you influence these quarterbacks just like you influence other quarterbacks. The difference is that you don't spend fifteen years trying to beat the other guys.

[Superman]

 

One thing I found interesting (and something I disagree with) is this part: "Manning usually throws to his main targets, whether they are covered or not."  I don't buy that.  In 2004, Stokley, Harrison, and Wayne all had 1000+ yards, and 10+ TDs.  Even with a guys like Reggie Wayne and Dallas Clark on the team, I believe Austin Collie was leading the league in receiving before his injury in 2010.  In the playoff game against the Jets in 2011, Reggie Wayne had 1 reception for 1 yard because Revis was covering him all game.  I don't think Peyton will blindly throw to a favourite target just because he is covered.  That's part of what make Peyton and Brady so great; they don't lock in on one receiver.  They find the open man.

 

 

Just came across this on MMQB.com:

 

 

Peyton Manning is an equal-opportunity passer. Look at his four main targets through 10 games. He’s thrown to the four between 62 and 92 times, and completed between 45 and 61 balls to each. The details:

Receiver Targets Completions Completion % TDs Demaryius Thomas 92 60 65.2 9 Wes Welker 88 61 69.2 9 Eric Decker 81 54 66.7 3 Julius Thomas 62 45 72.5 10

 

Forgive the formatting, but here's a link: http://mmqb.si.com/2013/11/18/peyton-manning-denver-broncos-kansas-city-chiefs-monday-morning-quarterback/6/

[21isSuperman]

Just came across this on MMQB.com:

 

 

Peyton Manning is an equal-opportunity passer. Look at his four main targets through 10 games. He’s thrown to the four between 62 and 92 times, and completed between 45 and 61 balls to each. The details:

Receiver Targets Completions Completion % TDs Demaryius Thomas 92 60 65.2 9 Wes Welker 88 61 69.2 9 Eric Decker 81 54 66.7 3 Julius Thomas 62 45 72.5 10

 

Forgive the formatting, but here's a link: http://mmqb.si.com/2013/11/18/peyton-manning-denver-broncos-kansas-city-chiefs-monday-morning-quarterback/6/

I'm surprised Decker has so few TDs.  But those guys could all easily surpass 100 receptions and 1000 yards.  Current yard totals are:

DT - 914

Decker - 792

Welker - 648

Thomas - 590

However, it should be noted that offenses tend to slow down a lot towards the end of the year.  So while Julius Thomas may be on pace for slightly more than 1000, I could see him missing the mark and getting in the 850-950 range.

[Synthetic]

More people should just study the Colts/Broncos game film which I am sure the Pats will be doing. I felt a lot of the late yardage/plays by the Broncos was because a few of our starting DBs left the game too.

 

We did an excellent job IMO even though we let them come back in the game.

 

I also felt we did not care if they ran it on us and honestly they could not do much in the run game........

 

And on offense go for the big plays in the passing game. I felt the Chiefs played small ball way too often......then again I still don't trust Alex Smith all too much. Not a bad QB but overall completely meh......

 

 

 

I totally agree.

 

The Colts put pressure all over him and played hard ball with those wide receivers.

 

 

I would like to see Denver play Seattle and San Francisco's defenses. Regardless all the controversy in the Superdome Sunday, I still hold my word that the Niners have one of the best defenses in the entire league.

 

 

K.C. didn't play aggressive with them at all. They dropped back and didn't even rush him. The Saints blitzed him in the Super Bowl and forced him to make decisions quicker than he normally does. The key to really stopping Manning is to get pressure on him. The Steelers in 2005 did an excellent job at it.

 

 

I wish Ty Law still played. He was a classic CB like Darren Sharper and Rod Woodson. One of those lethal guys that could really give you panics knowing he's on the other side of the field.

[GoPats]

"With Peyton, it's disrupting his timing. When he's not quite sure what the defense is -- maybe 20 percent of the time -- he has to play after the snap. Good defenses work hard to confuse him a little bit by disrupting the flow of his offense. They get their hands on the tight end and the receivers. The term I've been using is roughhousing."

Horton sees the same thing on film.

"Both of these passing games, if you can be physical with them and rough them up at the line of scrimmage, you can beat them," Horton said. "If I can bump you on the line of scrimmage, I can disrupt the timing by making the receiver late. Hits and sacks come from when the defense gets physical."

 

 

Been saying this all week. Don't let those receivers get free releases. Manning is throwing to spots more than guys right now, if you follow me. Make sure the receiver isn't where he's supposed to be, and you can limit the Broncos a bit and possibly hold them to the high 20s in terms of points. 

[Susie Q]

Yes, simple but hardly easy. Manning is too good pre and post snap. But the scheme does not change. You just have to disguise well and be able to get to him. The Colts played a beautiful game and still at the end Manning had the game won if not for the fumble.

Glad that someone else saw that besides myself.    That fumble won the game for the Colts in my opinion.

[bavanlan]

[smittywerb]

Way you beat PM is by having a good enough front where you don't need to blitz and your corners and LB's can stick the opposition.  Chargers did to us numerous times.  That's why they were always able to beat us.  They had a good interior, Phillips/Merrimam (if he was healthy) rushing on the ends, and Cromartie covering like a beast.  PM is better against the blitz.   

[dgambill]

Anyone else think these kinds of articles are a little pointless?  "You can beat Brady by getting pressure to him"..."Peyton gets flustered when his receivers aren't where they should be"...can't you say that for any QB in the league?

 

One thing I found interesting (and something I disagree with) is this part: "Manning usually throws to his main targets, whether they are covered or not."  I don't buy that.  In 2004, Stokley, Harrison, and Wayne all had 1000+ yards, and 10+ TDs.  Even with a guys like Reggie Wayne and Dallas Clark on the team, I believe Austin Collie was leading the league in receiving before his injury in 2010.  In the playoff game against the Jets in 2011, Reggie Wayne had 1 reception for 1 yard because Revis was covering him all game.  I don't think Peyton will blindly throw to a favourite target just because he is covered.  That's part of what make Peyton and Brady so great; they don't lock in on one receiver.  They find the open man.

 

The one guy I've seen have continual success against Peyton has been Romeo Crennel.  He's the only guy I've seen that has been able to continually disrupt Peyton's offense.

I do think Peyton will check to the open receiver no matter who they are...but in crucial situations likes to go to his MAIN receiver...thats what I think Ty means....meaning he will even throw a back shoulder throw if he is covered or like that pick six in the super bowl where he threw to reggie based on the coverage not based on him being open...if you jump a route and have it right...you will catch him....but that is a receipe for disaster as only some of the best corners will guess right. I just think he meant that he will still throw to his main guys ala reggie or demarius and give them a shot at a play even when covered if the defense dictates it....like single man etc.

[21isSuperman]

I do think Peyton will check to the open receiver no matter who they are...but in crucial situations likes to go to his MAIN receiver...thats what I think Ty means....meaning he will even throw a back shoulder throw if he is covered or like that pick six in the super bowl where he threw to reggie based on the coverage not based on him being open...if you jump a route and have it right...you will catch him....but that is a receipe for disaster as only some of the best corners will guess right. I just think he meant that he will still throw to his main guys ala reggie or demarius and give them a shot at a play even when covered if the defense dictates it....like single man etc.

I think that's part of the plan.  Take, for example, the 4th and 2 game against the Pats.  Down on the goalline, needing a TD.  The Pats play tight coverage (obviously) and Reggie runs a slant (I believe).  Peyton hits him for the TD.  Sure, he was covered.  But he wasn't really covered.  Peyton and Reggie have worked on that play so many times in practice that even with the DB there, there's no way to stop perfect timing, perfect placement of the ball, and a WR with some of the best hands in the league.  So if he does throw to a covered receiver who is his main guy, I think that's because he and that receiver have worked on different throws and the such so that they can make plays even when covered.

 

As for the Super Bowl pick off Reggie, if I recall correctly, Reggie stopped running his route.  That allowed Porter to stop in front of him and make the pick.  Sure, Collie was open.  But if Reggie doesn't stop his route, he could catch the ball and then who knows what would have happened next?

[dgambill]

I think that's part of the plan.  Take, for example, the 4th and 2 game against the Pats.  Down on the goalline, needing a TD.  The Pats play tight coverage (obviously) and Reggie runs a slant (I believe).  Peyton hits him for the TD.  Sure, he was covered.  But he wasn't really covered.  Peyton and Reggie have worked on that play so many times in practice that even with the DB there, there's no way to stop perfect timing, perfect placement of the ball, and a WR with some of the best hands in the league.  So if he does throw to a covered receiver who is his main guy, I think that's because he and that receiver have worked on different throws and the such so that they can make plays even when covered.

 

As for the Super Bowl pick off Reggie, if I recall correctly, Reggie stopped running his route.  That allowed Porter to stop in front of him and make the pick.  Sure, Collie was open.  But if Reggie doesn't stop his route, he could catch the ball and then who knows what would have happened next?

Oh I agree with you...but I think that was what Ty was getting at...at least in my opinion...that it isn't like he is going to force it over and over to his main guys but he has worked enough with them on back shoulder and timing routes etc that there will be times when covered he will still throw trying to put it into those windows they work on...and what he is saying is if you ready you can exploit that. Few corners can...but we've seen Ty and some others get the best of him. Corners that will take chances and play up close will have opportunities for those plays if they are ready and prepared when they get the right read.

[21isSuperman]

Oh I agree with you...but I think that was what Ty was getting at...at least in my opinion...that it isn't like he is going to force it over and over to his main guys but he has worked enough with them on back shoulder and timing routes etc that there will be times when covered he will still throw trying to put it into those windows they work on...and what he is saying is if you ready you can exploit that. Few corners can...but we've seen Ty and some others get the best of him. Corners that will take chances and play up close will have opportunities for those plays if they are ready and prepared when they get the right read.

Ah, that makes more sense to me.  I guess that goes back to what Ty was saying about putting in extra film room work.  It helps you be ready for what Peyton and his WRs like to do in certain situations

[Sports Central1]

How to stop Peyton Manning?

 

The teams who had success against Peyton have been very aggressive and just went after him.  Chargers did it a couple times.  Cowboys in Dallas a few years ago did it and just blitzed him.  Same way to beat the Pats.  Be very physical and don't turn the ball over.  Keep Peyton and his offense off the field just like how to keep the Pats' offense off the field.  Also, show Peyton different looks the way Rex Ryan's defenses have in Baltimore and with the Jets.

 

You have to have a quality pass rush and blitz.  You got to jam and play man to man.  Peyton picks apart zone defenses, well at least this year at least as this Broncos' offense is good at picking apart zone defenses like they did against the Chargers earlier in the year.

 

"IF" the Pats are going to have any chance to beat Peyton and the Broncos this season then this weekend is their best chance for a few reasons...

 

It's in NE.

 

The weather plays a big role,  It will be between 16 to 20 degrees Sunday into the evening with around 22 mph wind.  We seen Peyton through out his career struggle in bad cold weather conditions.  http://www.weather.com/weather/tenday/Foxboro+MA+02035:4:US

 

Bad cold weather with some wind = Alterations in offensive planning and have to rely more on the run game and keep it on the ground.  That's not the Broncos' style of system and their run game isn't great.  The Pats' run game is better with 3 good backs and can control the ball and keep Peyton off the field.  Pats play well in bad conditions in NE.

 

Bad cold weather with some wind not only can keep the score low and reduce the number of TD's but also effects the field goal attempts.  Less field goal attempts and also better chances of missing field goals.

 

No more Adam Vinatieri.  Colts relied on Adam in the playoffs against the Ravens in 2008 to kick 5 field goals and also many other games to help bail out Peyton and his offenses.

 

Peyton and Welker's health can be a factor.

 

But, like I posted on another thread the Pats have issues with their health too and their defense can't really cover.

[coming on strong]

peyton can't be stopped............