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No we don't and the fact Brackett is the one we've kept should tell you something about him. Ray Lewis type linebackers don't grow on trees and sure as heck don't last to the end of round one where we have been picking. We have much bigger issues on this team than the linebacking spot, like the o-line, D-line, cornerback, and special teams.

I certainly agree, which is why I think this might be a good year to take advantage of the fact that we're most likely going to wind up with a higher draft pick than we're used to (probably in the 8-14 range) and grab a monster MLB type guy that could become the new anchor of our defense.

I think that it's too early to be looking for Manning's replacement unless his injury could wind up shortening his career.

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I certainly agree, which is why I think this might be a good year to take advantage of the fact that we're most likely going to wind up with a higher draft pick than we're used to (probably in the 8-14 range) and grab a monster MLB type guy that could become the new anchor of our defense.

I think that it's too early to be looking for Manning's replacement unless his injury could wind up shortening his career.

Enh we have our Middle linebacker of the future in Angerer. Frankly if we use that pick high on something other than a QB it would be better used on a WR, CB, DT, or Center. Honestly linbacker has become one of the Colts stranger areaes on defense. Freeney and Mathis are still the best guys we have on defense and Bullit and Bethea are one of the best safety combos in the NFL but I would put the linebackers right after them.

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That's not true, he has never commented on regretting not signing Peterson. I even remember the quote when they did not sign him, Polian told Dungy, "Mike has always been a good LB for us." To which Dungy replied, "At these prices you need them to be great." Now if you meant to say Thornton, he (Polian) has mentioned that several times, but he states it was out of his control. That the NFL miscalculated some bonuses for Manning and Harrison that showed the Colts were over the cap. By the time they got it all straightened out, Thornton had signed with the Titans.

Thank you for the correction, and you are spot-on. I was thinking of Thornton.

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bracket is a flat out playmaker and the colts draft extraordinary linebackers....i don't know which statement is more hilarious.

Just Sunday Brackett was making plays. How many times does that guy have to bail us out with INT's before people recognize his talent?

Coryatt, Thornton and Peterson successively. While not cut from the 'Ray Lewis' cloth, they were all very talented LB's and they were all released early in their career. This cyclic LB parade had to end, and I for one am glad that we decided to end this trend with Brackett.

It is strange how one fan can have a completely different opinion than another regarding specific players, as if they're watching two different men on Sunday. In regard to Brackett, it seems the forum is split 50/50.

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Enh we have our Middle linebacker of the future in Angerer. Frankly if we use that pick high on something other than a QB it would be better used on a WR, CB, DT, or Center. Honestly linbacker has become one of the Colts stranger areaes on defense. Freeney and Mathis are still the best guys we have on defense and Bullit and Bethea are one of the best safety combos in the NFL but I would put the linebackers right after them.

Agree on Angerer. It is hard to watch rookies and conceive of what they might become. Last year I thought Angerer might not wash out as a starter. Through preseason and spilling over into week 1, that cat can prowl.

I feel we should search FA for our center needs. Saturday is about finished. As we know all to well, rookie O-lineman take years to mesh and we need protection like yesterday, nevermind years from now.

The proverbial window is closing, and the recent issues with Manning bolster this point. Manning needs a new toy, a wide out. I hope the point of drafting 2 O-lineman early in the draft was Polian's way of saying we're done selecting O-lineman early for a few years so we can concentrate on other areas.

Being that Manning's career is down to only a few years, I would seriously hope that free agency will be a tool we utilize heavily next year. The Manning era hasn't the time for a flock of rookies with nothing to offer but future promise.

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Enh we have our Middle linebacker of the future in Angerer. Frankly if we use that pick high on something other than a QB it would be better used on a WR, CB, DT, or Center. Honestly linbacker has become one of the Colts stranger areaes on defense. Freeney and Mathis are still the best guys we have on defense and Bullit and Bethea are one of the best safety combos in the NFL but I would put the linebackers right after them.

While I do think Angerer would be an upgrade over Brackett at MLB, I'm not sure he's who I'd like to be become the anchor of the middle of our defense for the future. He probably is who the Colts FO believes will be the successor for Brackett and if he proves he can be stout against the run as well as good against the pass then I'm all for it. I'm just not convinced just yet that he can become that force in the run defense that I think we need at MLB.

I'm not saying MLB should be our first round pick but I do think it should be addressed. I also agree that DT, CB and OL are positions of need as well but I also think we could very well wind up picking up a SS in the draft as well. From what I've seen the Colts FO tends to put a higher priority on safeties as opposed to CB's. I'd love to pick up a guy like Dre Kirkpatrick but I don't know the Colts would use a first round pick (which would likely be required) to get him.

WR is the one offensive position I wouldn't be terribly upset if we used a first round pick on. Even though I think our defense by far needs to be addressed over the offense, I'd also like to see us pick up an elite #1 WR talent such as an Alshon Jeffery (6'4" 229 lbs) or Michael Floyd (6'3" 224 lbs). These guys both have great size, great hands and can definitely wind up being elite WR's in the NFL. I don't want to see us use a first round pick on someone ala Gonzalez who was brought in to be a slot WR and maybe the #2. Don't get me wrong though, I know that picking at the end of the first round doesn't afford us the opportunity to pick an elite #1 WR but that's why I'm saying if we did that this coming year (assuming we have a much higher draft pick than we're used to which most of us agree on) then we would have that opportunity. I still think we could get a quality guy in a later round though so I'm not convinced yet that we need to go after a first round WR.

Just Sunday Brackett was making plays. How many times does that guy have to bail us out with INT's before people recognize his talent?

Coryatt, Thornton and Peterson successively. While not cut from the 'Ray Lewis' cloth, they were all very talented LB's and they were all released early in their career. This cyclic LB parade had to end, and I for one am glad that we decided to end this trend with Brackett.

It is strange how one fan can have a completely different opinion than another regarding specific players, as if they're watching two different men on Sunday. In regard to Brackett, it seems the forum is split 50/50.

How about when he proves he's not a liability against the run. :P Don't get me wrong, I never said the guy wasn't a talented coverage LB, that's why I have said I think he should be moved to WILL. We could play him situationally and only bring him in on passing downs but that would be telegraphing the defense we're going to run and teams will try to check to run to take advantage just like they do when Freeney and Mathis are in.

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How about when he proves he's not a liability against the run. :P Don't get me wrong, I never said the guy wasn't a talented coverage LB, that's why I have said I think he should be moved to WILL. We could play him situationally and only bring him in on passing downs but that would be telegraphing the defense we're going to run and teams will try to check to run to take advantage just like they do when Freeney and Mathis are in.

True nuff.

In my opinion, our whole defense is a liability against the run. Nevis is one of the few solid run defenders we have and he didn't even get the start Sunday.

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True nuff.

In my opinion, our whole defense is a liability against the run. Nevis is one of the few solid run defenders we have and he didn't even get the start Sunday.

Nevis was getting handled by the longer armed offensive linemen he faced. I looked it over again and this could be a problem all season for him. reference: NFL Scouting report on him unfortunately. I still think he's better than what we had.

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it means he's going to be questionable on the injury report all week and probably called a game time decision and when asked about it the rest of the week Coach Caldwell will say "if it were a playoff game he could play for sure." :)

Wouldnt be surprised if those were caldwells exact words.

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angerer is average at best. But it's like the movie hall pass, when you have a bunch of stute-fish surrounding you, it makes you look better!!!!

Pat is not "average at best" they guy is a good LB he tackles better than most of the linebackers the colts have, only other person that can tackle like him is ernie sims.. he's stronger than brackett and much quicker id much rather see im in the middle than brackett.

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Brackett is a flat-out playmaker. Time and time again, the dude makes big plays when we need them. Thats why he gets paid. We have a sad history of drafting extraordinary LB's and then letting them go when contract time arrives. One of Polian's biggest regrets was letting Mike Peterson go, another in a line of LB's that should've been retained. He (Polian) wasn't going to let that happen again, hence the big money contract to Brackett. Fans would've beat Polian to pieces for letting him go as well.

Agree Agree Agree

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Just Sunday Brackett was making plays. How many times does that guy have to bail us out with INT's before people recognize his talent?

Coryatt, Thornton and Peterson successively. While not cut from the 'Ray Lewis' cloth, they were all very talented LB's and they were all released early in their career. This cyclic LB parade had to end, and I for one am glad that we decided to end this trend with Brackett.

It is strange how one fan can have a completely different opinion than another regarding specific players, as if they're watching two different men on Sunday. In regard to Brackett, it seems the forum is split 50/50.

well i guess i just had a problem using the term extraordinary. while i liked thornton, peterson, washington, etc..i don't think they were worth the contracts they got from other teams.

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Pat is not "average at best" they guy is a good LB he tackles better than most of the linebackers the colts have, only other person that can tackle like him is ernie sims.. he's stronger than brackett and much quicker id much rather see im in the middle than brackett.

Just adding on 13 tackles and a fumble recovery on Sunday for angered before someone rips bracket he had 6 and an int. They are two of the better players on our defense.

I have no idea where I got 11 from the first time it was six I just looked it up.

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well i guess i just had a problem using the term extraordinary. while i liked thornton, peterson, washington, etc..i don't think they were worth the contracts they got from other teams.

Coryatt dropped like a rock in Dallas just after leaving here as well. Yes, they were overpaid.

By "extraordinary" I meant above average, highly effective. I guess my choice of words might have been a touch inflating, but you get my point. They were solid.

Admittedly, I wouldn't cry a single tear if Brackett went elsewhere in lew of Angerer. That kid is in beast mode.

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Just adding on 13 tackles and a fumble recovery on Sunday for angered before someone rips bracket he had 11 and an int. They are two of the better players on our defense.

Cato June was at one time one of our better players on defense...that still doesn't mean he was good. He was just the best out of a steaming pile. IMO the same is true of Brackett. He's improved somewhat from say 3-4 years ago but still not what I want to see as our MLB.

Angerer on the other hand I do like and am more than willing to still give him time to see exactly how good he can become. I'd still rather see a monster MLB be brought in and keep Angerer as an OLB but I'd take Angerer over Brackett any day of the week at MLB.

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Cato June was at one time one of our better players on defense...that still doesn't mean he was good. He was just the best out of a steaming pile. IMO the same is true of Brackett. He's improved somewhat from say 3-4 years ago but still not what I want to see as our MLB.

Angerer on the other hand I do like and am more than willing to still give him time to see exactly how good he can become. I'd still rather see a monster MLB be brought in and keep Angerer as an OLB but I'd take Angerer over Brackett any day of the week at MLB.

I disagree Brackett has made plays time and time again for this team. He was one of the few players who can say he made a play on Sunday. Also a lot of people who are "in the know" IE spend their lives studying this stuff respect Brackett.

No he's not Ray Lewis and he's never going to be but we could be a lot worse at MLB than Brackett. Also, when I grade out problems on the defense the linebacking core is near the bottom. We have bigger fish to fry.

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I disagree Brackett has made plays time and time again for this team. He was one of the few players who can say he made a play on Sunday. Also a lot of people who are "in the know" IE spend their lives studying this stuff respect Brackett.

No he's not Ray Lewis and he's never going to be but we could be a lot worse at MLB than Brackett. Also, when I grade out problems on the defense the linebacking core is near the bottom. We have bigger fish to fry.

Brackett is another one-trick pony. He's great against the pass but a liability against the run. If we ever want to get better at stopping the run we need to look at not only our DL but our LB's as well. It's great that he's well respected by the "in the know" people but being respected doesn't make you a good defender. No amount of respect is going to cover his deficiencies in run defense. You are correct that we could be a lot worse than with Brackett, but we could also be a lot better.

I do think our LB core is better this year than in many years past but that's not saying much of anything because in years past the LB core has been simply awful. The truth of the matter is, at least imo, we're never going to be a good defense against the run with Brackett at MLB.

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I think Brackett is the main problem with this D. Get him out of there and we will be able to stop the run.

agree....hes small and slow.....the only time he looks good is when nobody blocks him and he can make an open feild tackle. if theres a body on him heck never make a play (aside from a couple years ago where he broke up a screen play after shedding a block but thats 1/2034982394823948)

hes a veteran, yes, and a smart player, but hes a liability just like jeff saturday.

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Brackett is a flat-out playmaker. Time and time again, the dude makes big plays when we need them. Thats why he gets paid. We have a sad history of drafting extraordinary LB's and then letting them go when contract time arrives. One of Polian's biggest regrets was letting Mike Peterson go, another in a line of LB's that should've been retained. He (Polian) wasn't going to let that happen again, hence the big money contract to Brackett. Fans would've beat Polian to pieces for letting him go as well.

This.

Do you remember when he came back after his injury last year? He was making play after play after play. I love Brackett.

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Just adding on 13 tackles and a fumble recovery on Sunday for angered before someone rips bracket he had 6 and an int. They are two of the better players on our defense.

I have no idea where I got 11 from the first time it was six I just looked it up.

Brackett has great awareness but the thing is he's getting old... if he was any taller he would have had 2ints in that game one in the redzone. I rather Pat playing his true position though i think it would benefit the colts.

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Brackett has great awareness but the thing is he's getting old... if he was any taller he would have had 2ints in that game one in the redzone. I rather Pat playing his true position though i think it would benefit the colts.

Yes Gary is getting up there. That's why I said in another post that Angerer is the MLB of the future. Till then though Gary is still making plays. Frankly our defense benfits more from having him and Pat out there than they would taking Gary out of poistion or starting another linebacker and moving Pat to the middle. Pat is doing just fine on the outside and frankly Brackett did fine at middle linebacker. We have much bigger issues on the defense than the linebacking poistion. Frankly of the three areas D-line, LBs, and secondary they are the only one that is pretty well set on starters.

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I like Brackett for his heart. He comes up with big plays, is a good leader on our D, and is a good, respectable person. He's also a smart player and quite possibly the best tackler on our team. His form and drive on tackles is very good when he's got the right angle.

HOWEVER, he's too small. Too slow. Too old. He is not a good run defender for those reasons. He gets caught in traffic too easily and cannot shed blocks because he lacks the strength. He is able to diagnose plays and make the tackle when he can get to the gap, but too often gets blocked out of the play. This is why Bob Sanders was so crucial to our D. The LBs would get blocked and Sanders was able to fly in unblocked and make the tackles the LBs should have been making. We always said Sanders "played like an extra" LB. That's because we NEEDED another LB.

I don't believe we'll have the #1 pick in the upcoming draft, but I would guarantee a top 15, and I think we might be in the top 10. If we don't take Luck with the #1, then we better go defense. All you guys who want another WR for Manning are fooling yourselves. When Peyton comes back healthy, he'll have Garcon, Collie, Addai, and Clark at least. I think Wayne will stay as well. If you can't see that the defense is just ungodly incompetent and needs addressed first, second, and third, then you must not understand football.

There are three college linebackers that I'm going to watch this season. Burfict, Te'o, and Luke Kuechly from Boston College. Kuechly isn't as fast, but he's very good in traffic and very strong. Also, a very solid tackler. Burfict is explosive and violent. I'd love to see that on the Colts defense because we've all seen the difference that Bob Sanders made. However, Burfict plays with emotion first, and it causes him to get some bonehead penalties. Now, once you get to the NFL, a lot of times those things iron out and especially within the Colts' organization, he could be mentored to play smarter.

Manti Te'o from Notre Dame, in my opinion, will be the best LB in the bunch. He hits like a truck, good in traffic, in every play, sideline-to-sideline speed, pretty good in coverage, and seems to be a smart player. Add to it that Notre Dame is an Indiana school, and you've really got a solid draft choice.

In the mid and later rounds (and I haven't researched who yet), we should be able to get a quality SS or CB, and some big uglies to fill in the OG spots for the future.

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There are three college linebackers that I'm going to watch this season. Burfict, Te'o, and Luke Kuechly from Boston College. Kuechly isn't as fast, but he's very good in traffic and very strong. Also, a very solid tackler. Burfict is explosive and violent. I'd love to see that on the Colts defense because we've all seen the difference that Bob Sanders made. However, Burfict plays with emotion first, and it causes him to get some bonehead penalties. Now, once you get to the NFL, a lot of times those things iron out and especially within the Colts' organization, he could be mentored to play smarter.

I 100% agree with pretty much everything you said. I also read about the penalties from Burfict but like you said, that can be helped with coaching. Plus I also briefly saw something about several NCAA referees being fired for making bogus or "iffy" personal foul calls. Were some of those in relation to Burfict?

Regardless, what a guy like that would bring to our defense would far outweigh a penalty here and there. We need a guy with that kind of attitude and impact. Right now he's ranked #47 overall so we might even be able to pick him up in the second round but I'd have no problem using a first round pick for what I think he would bring to the table.

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I 100% agree with pretty much everything you said. I also read about the penalties from Burfict but like you said, that can be helped with coaching. Plus I also briefly saw something about several NCAA referees being fired for making bogus or "iffy" personal foul calls. Were some of those in relation to Burfict?

Regardless, what a guy like that would bring to our defense would far outweigh a penalty here and there. We need a guy with that kind of attitude and impact. Right now he's ranked #47 overall so we might even be able to pick him up in the second round but I'd have no problem using a first round pick for what I think he would bring to the table.

You "think" we could get him in the 2nd round but you would be ok with spending a top 10 pick on a LB when we need either a SOlid DT or RT/RG for the team? You sir may need some medication to help your possible condition.

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You "think" we could get him in the 2nd round but you would be ok with spending a top 10 pick on a LB when we need either a SOlid DT or RT/RG for the team? You sir may need some medication to help your possible condition.

We know things aren't going well when there's so much talk about next years draft after week one.

:burnout:

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when we need either a SOlid DT or RT/RG for the team

I don't think we need another RT/RG pick till later rounds, that is why we drafted Ijalana, we just need him to progress, IMO. O-linemen do not see as much rotation, so once you have picked high in a particular year like we did in 2011, you develop them for a few before deciding to go high again. BPA always has intersected with need for us most of the time.

With Wayne, Garcon and Gonzo in their contract years, we may have to draft a WR depending on where we pick. Normally nose tackles are not picked high recently, ever since the league became more of a passing league, disruptive UTs like Ndamokung Suh or other UTs like Gerald McCoy, Corey Liuget etc. are drafted higher. We have invested in UTs in Moala and Nevis, let us see how the rest of the year goes once Nevis gets used to the speed of the NFL.

Going by those, I expect us to go with a playmaking CB or WR or QB if Kirk Cousins' stock goes up and he becomes a middle of round 1 prospect where I anticipate us to pick, LB would be the other defensive choice, IMO. Who would have thought Locker and Ponder were top/middle of round 1 picks when the draft started? Not me, at least.

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Yes Gary is getting up there. That's why I said in another post that Angerer is the MLB of the future. Till then though Gary is still making plays. Frankly our defense benfits more from having him and Pat out there than they would taking Gary out of poistion or starting another linebacker and moving Pat to the middle. Pat is doing just fine on the outside and frankly Brackett did fine at middle linebacker. We have much bigger issues on the defense than the linebacking poistion. Frankly of the three areas D-line, LBs, and secondary they are the only one that is pretty well set on starters.

Yea it is better to have both of them on the field, but i also agree with pizza guy when it comes to run downs Pat is the better defender.

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Yea it is better to have both of them on the field, but i also agree with pizza guy when it comes to run downs Pat is the better defender.

Yes he is but to me the question is is our fourth linebacker (Wheeler) better than Brackett? I don't think so which is why I think we start the three we do. Also I think the things Angerer does well he can do at either poistions where as the things Brackett does well (the pass defense and calling out the front seven assignments) are easier for him to from the middle spot which is why he plays the middle and Angerer plays the outside.

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You "think" we could get him in the 2nd round but you would be ok with spending a top 10 pick on a LB when we need either a SOlid DT or RT/RG for the team? You sir may need some medication to help your possible condition.

Um, no, YOU need to grasp that it's only week 1 of the NFL season and week 2 of the NCAA college season. There is still the majority of the college season left to play. Player performance throughout the rest of the season as well as performance at the combine will go a long way towards determining a player's draft stock and that draft stock can and will fluctuate a great deal between now, the start of the NFL and NCAA seasons, and draft day. I was simply stating that I have no problem spending either a first or second round pick on him, depending on what his draft value warrants on the day of the draft. If his stock has risen to the point where he warrants a first round pick, then use it. If his draft stock slips a little bit or other players have great showings at the combine then it might be possible to get him in the second round. Please try to comprehend that at this point I'm basing statements about what round players may be drafted in based on the overall rankings of 2012 draft prospects by cbssports.com which, again, will fluctuate greatly over the course of the season.

Yes I understand that this was not all spelled out in my previous post and that's what led to the confusion. Based on the way I worded things I could understand where you would be confused. However instead of simply asking me to clarify, you went the route of condescending sarcasm. I can play that game too. ;)

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this is our problem, and why i hate reading or posting in these threads, its week 1, lets talk about the draft, when there is no football and we know where we sit

until than, its playoffs, and a win at home...

There is always going to be speculation about what can be done to fix the problems on the team. I have full faith that the players we have will show great improvement over the course of the season. That still doesn't mean that the OL or defense will be "fixed" so there's no harm in discussing ways that could help whether through FA or the draft.

Look at it this way, at least it's starting to turn into constructive talk about how our problems can be fixed instead of "the sky is falling", "caldwell sucks", "Polian sux" etc that has been going on of late. ;)

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We know things aren't going well when there's so much talk about next years draft after week one.

:burnout:

There was talk about next years draft before the first game was even played. lol Now were talking about cutting players before the season is over. While Saturday is getting older (as we all are) We also know Peyton likes Saturday in front of him. (he has said so) So when Peyton gets back I don't see Saturday leaving unless he retires. Peyton and Jeff work well together and have for many years. That duo has to have a chemistry also. :huthut: JMO of course.

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Yes he is but to me the question is is our fourth linebacker (Wheeler) better than Brackett? I don't think so which is why I think we start the three we do. Also I think the things Angerer does well he can do at either poistions where as the things Brackett does well (the pass defense and calling out the front seven assignments) are easier for him to from the middle spot which is why he plays the middle and Angerer plays the outside.

No Wheeler's not BUT i can remember reading a analysis on wheeler and it mentioned that wheeler is a really good blitzing LB and so far he certainly has shown that... he's the best blitzing LB i think the colts have... hopefully conner can develop into the LB the colts think he is.. i like his size and he looks solid sometimes he just needs to be more consistent.

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No Wheeler's not BUT i can remember reading a analysis on wheeler and it mentioned that wheeler is a really good blitzing LB and so far he certainly has shown that... he's the best blitzing LB i think the colts have... hopefully conner can develop into the LB the colts think he is.. i like his size and he looks solid sometimes he just needs to be more consistent.

We'd have to blitz first to take advantage of that...I am really growing to hate Coyer...I was never crazy about the higher in the first place. At this point there was zero point to firing Meeks it's roughly the same defense.

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We'd have to blitz first to take advantage of that...I am really growing to hate Coyer...I was never crazy about the higher in the first place. At this point there was zero point to firing Meeks it's roughly the same defense.

The one thing I'd want to know before making that determination is who was more responsible in starting to bring in bigger, stronger guys. I think we've both agreed that the Colts have shown they're committed to getting bigger and stronger on both sides of the ball so I'd want to know whether it's Caldwell, Coyer or a combination of both being responsible for this happening. If Coyer had a hand in this then I'm glad Meeks was let go and Coyer took his place. If it was Caldwell alone who made that decision then I agree with you in that it wouldn't have mattered one way or another.

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