Very small, minor Andrew Luck update

[Superman]

39 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

 

\OK....     point noted....

 

But I don't understand this comment from you from the previous post.....

 

"Which is another notch in the "Chud needs to get his act together" column." 

 

Why the knock on Chud?   When he was the OC for Hasselbeck down the stretch,  I thought he did a masterful job.      What was your objection to the offense that Chud ran with Hazzelbeck, Whitehurst,  and Lindsay and Freeman?

 

Or, am I misunderstanding  your meaning?

 

 

My objection isn't with the offense he ran for those backups; like you, I thought Chud did a good job with them. My objection is that he doesn't run that same offense -- which, for one thing, had more quick throws -- for Luck. 

[Jason_]

30 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

To the bolded, I remember Pagano and Luck making comments about audibles after the 2015 opener, when the offense got beat up by the Bills. At the time, I felt they were disingenuous. The issue has never been with the Colts passing too much, not running enough, IMO. 

 

I agree with most everything else but definitely do disagree with this.  I remember when they made those comments and it had been after at least a few games in a row where they gave up on the run very early in games.  I specifically remember because I'd been thinking the same thing...a lot of people on here were blaming the OC and/or chuck for giving up on the run, but I'd been questioning whether it was truly on them or Luck audibling at the LOS.  Then both Pagano and Luck made the same comments about how he needs to not be so quick to check out of run plays and I specifically remember thinking, "good...hopefully they actually stick with this."

 

 

I tried actually finding a link to either of the interviews where they made those comments to get a better idea of the timing but couldn't find it.

[Superman]

6 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

I agree with most everything else but definitely do disagree with this.  I remember when they made those comments and it had been after at least a few games in a row where they gave up on the run very early in games.  I specifically remember because I'd been thinking the same thing...a lot of people on here were blaming the OC and/or chuck for giving up on the run, but I'd been questioning whether it was truly on them or Luck audibling at the LOS.  Then both Pagano and Luck made the same comments about how he needs to not be so quick to check out of run plays and I specifically remember thinking, "good...hopefully they actually stick with this."

 

 

I tried actually finding a link to either of the interviews where they made those comments to get a better idea of the timing but couldn't find it.

 

I would have bet $14.50 that it was after the Bills game which was the 2015 opener. 

[Jason_]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

I would have bet $14.50 that it was after the Bills game which was the 2015 opener. 

 

too rich for my blood

 

 

lol

[Jason_]

seriously though, I was thinking the same thing until I looked up the schedule and that Buffalo game was the first game of the season.  I am 95% sure that these comments came at least 2-3 weeks into the season.  It's possible it was said multiple times and I'm thinking of a few weeks later when it was reiterated.  Not really sure unfortunately.

[BR-549]

4 hours ago, Superman said:

 

The expectations aren't relevant at this point, only the performance. And the performance was bad, which hurt the team and directly cost us at least two wins at the end of games.

 

 

The offense is pulling its weight, any way you look at it. The disparity between the offense (top ten by any metric, top five in some) and the defense (bottom ten by any metric, bottom three in some) last season is glaring. 

 

To an extent, I understand if you were saying 'the defense is bad, so we need the offense to be even better than they've been to make up for it.' But you're saying 'the defense is bad, and the offense didn't make up for it, so the offense failed the team,' and that's just absurd. The defense failed the team. You can't lay their failures at the feet of the offense.

 

 

It doesn't excuse it, but it does explain it. Any analysis of the offensive play calling explains almost every issue with the offense last season, at any point in the game. 

 

 

Nah, we need to fix the defense above anything else. It's also very important to fix the offensive play calling, which should make the offense more efficient and effective, but the offense, even with its current warts, isn't the primary issue. 

Thanks for this.  It is organized and well written.  Above all else it makes sense.  I won't add anymore than that.

[braveheartcolt]

My first marriage was a nightmare. My wife was a nightmare. This was most definitely on me.

[Restored]

17 hours ago, Superman said:

 

I don't think Pagano is interfering with the offense, but I don't know that for sure.

 

Pagano's very first hire was Bruce Arians, a Coryell coordinator. They rushed out and hired Pep, but he ran some sort of hybrid of Arians' stuff and his own stuff. Pagano brought in Chud as an assistant, and then made him the coordinator when Pep was fired. Chud is also a Coryell coordinator. Pagano also hired Brian Schottenheimer as the QB coach, and Schottenheimer is a Coryell guy. Pagano seems to clearly prefer the Coryell offense, and that's reflected in his choices for coordinators. 

 

To that extent, the issues with the offense can be laid at Pagano's feet, but I don't think there's any evidence of Pagano interfering with the offense, beyond setting a general tone for the gameplans. He's probably influenced the coordinators to be more conservative than I think they should be, but even that's gotten loose at times. 

 

As for what Chud and Pep ran with Luck and MH, there weren't really that many similarities, IMO. I think they both drastically changed the gameplans when Luck was out. And I think that's good coaching. It's too bad they didn't do the same for Luck. 

 

That's more of what I'm alluding to. I think he's likely to have influenced the offense to come out conservative (which had lead to a number of slow starts), only to have to open up the offense once the team is down a couple of scores or more. You and I could never really know for sure but its something that I believe has been going on since Pagano's tenure began.

[Jason_]

2 hours ago, Restored said:

 

That's more of what I'm alluding to. I think he's likely to have influenced the offense to come out conservative (which had lead to a number of slow starts), only to have to open up the offense once the team is down a couple of scores or more. You and I could never really know for sure but its something that I believe has been going on since Pagano's tenure began.

 

well here's the thing, I don't really buy that either because there were a number of times they came out trying to air it out (the opposite of conservative) but that didn't work either.

 

honestly, it seems as though at least Chud and possibly Pagano have bought into the Luck hype.  It seems to me at least like they feel like he's already an elite level QB that they don't have to worry about things like adjusting the playcalling to try to get him into a rhythm.  Typically you'll see in the playcalling at the beginning of games/halves/etc that the OC will intentionally call some shorter, higher percentage throws to get the QB a few easy completions to get him into a rhythm.  It's talked about in almost every game that is ever broadcast.  But you don't see that from the Colts when Luck is on the field.  It's like they feel like he hits the field already warmed up, already in his groove and they don't have to modify playcalling to help him with that, even when he's clearly struggling.  

[Restored]

1 hour ago, J@son said:

 

well here's the thing, I don't really buy that either because there were a number of times they came out trying to air it out (the opposite of conservative) but that didn't work either.

 

honestly, it seems as though at least Chud and possibly Pagano have bought into the Luck hype.  It seems to me at least like they feel like he's already an elite level QB that they don't have to worry about things like adjusting the playcalling to try to get him into a rhythm.  Typically you'll see in the playcalling at the beginning of games/halves/etc that the OC will intentionally call some shorter, higher percentage throws to get the QB a few easy completions to get him into a rhythm.  It's talked about in almost every game that is ever broadcast.  But you don't see that from the Colts when Luck is on the field.  It's like they feel like he hits the field already warmed up, already in his groove and they don't have to modify playcalling to help him with that, even when he's clearly struggling.  

 

I think the latter has happened more frequently.

 

That's just a product of the offense itself. The offense has very little designed short/quick throws or even "rub" routes to get WR's open for easy completions. That has to change going forward or we will be sitting here having this discussion year after year.

[southwest1]

On July 11, 2017 at 8:34 AM, crazycolt1 said:

For you to assume that if Chuck was fired he would go back to a DC or a head coach for a lowly franchise IMO is wrong. With Chucks record and the fact players love playing for him he wouldn't be long to land another head coaching position. There have been ex head coaches who didn't come close to Chucks record that have landed another head coaching position. Mr. God (Belichick) himself had a losing record and landed with a pretty good gig. As of right now Chuck has a better record than he did.

You have let your personal dislike for Pagano to cloud reality.

What does BB in Cleveland have to do with how well the Colts will perform in 2017? 

 

Why do you defend Pagano so darn much? Just curious.

 

Zealousness works on both ends: His detractors & his supporters. You don't see me questioning your mental state just because you want to retain Chuck do ya? 

 

Look, I realize you're joking my friend. I'm aware of that, but it's not hatred CC1 it's playoff production that has declined over the past couple of seasons & Luck isn't making strides forward under Pagano's leadership if you can call it that. 

 

I don't care how quickly Chuck would find NFL employment some place else. All I care about is whether INDY moves forward or not. You really Chuck would be half as successful in a new city without Chewbacca carrying him? Now that's funny. 

[southwest1]

On July 11, 2017 at 2:34 PM, J@son said:

 

doesn't matter what you want, or what SW1 wants or anyone else.  Irsay and Ballard will decide what THEY want and THAT is what will be used to determine whether he's kept or not.

 

BTW, anyone who thinks that Irsay only extended Pagano into 2017 because of the bout with cancer is seriously delusional.

 

PS.  As of now, the Raiders are a one year wonder.  Let's see them repeat that 12-4 record +/- for a few years before adding them to the same discussion as the pats/steelers.  That's not to say that I don't think they can...but let's see them actually do it first.

Jason, 

 

I realize that you & CC1 are President Of The Pagano Fanclub, but knock it off. 

 

If we miss the Playoffs again, Chuck is gone. Stop perpetuating the myth that Pags is the best available coach out there so therefore, we must stand pat & not alter the status quo. 

 

I love this notion that Ballard & Irsay alone have the final say not the fans. Of course, that's true right now yes. However, you remember what happened after our disastrous 2011 season right? Translation: Jimmy's not stupid if a product is on the field that cannot win or advance against upper echelon AFC teams late in the year & fans start to get discouraged & think twice about watching home games in person, you don't Jimmy's gonna shake things up? We both know the answer to that question. 

[crazycolt1]

2 hours ago, southwest1 said:

What does BB in Cleveland have to do with how well the Colts will perform in 2017? 

 

Why do you defend Pagano so darn much? Just curious.

 

Zealousness works on both ends: His detractors & his supporters. You don't see me questioning your mental state just because you want to retain Chuck do ya? 

 

Look, I realize you're joking my friend. I'm aware of that, but it's not hatred CC1 it's playoff production that has declined over the past couple of seasons & Luck isn't making strides forward under Pagano's leadership if you can call it that. 

 

I don't care how quickly Chuck would find NFL employment some place else. All I care about is whether INDY moves forward or not. You really Chuck would be half as successful in a new city without Chewbacca carrying him? Now that's funny. 

 

2 hours ago, southwest1 said:

Jason, 

 

I realize that you & CC1 are President Of The Pagano Fanclub, but knock it off. 

 

If we miss the Playoffs again, Chuck is gone. Stop perpetuating the myth that Pags is the best available coach out there so therefore, we must stand pat & not alter the status quo. 

 

I love this notion that Ballard & Irsay alone have the final say not the fans. Of course, that's true right now yes. However, you remember what happened after our disastrous 2011 season right? Translation: Jimmy's not stupid if a product is on the field that cannot win or advance against upper echelon AFC teams late in the year & fans start to get discouraged & think twice about watching home games in person, you don't Jimmy's gonna shake things up? We both know the answer to that question. 

Your obsession with the firing of Pagano has you now hijacking threads?

 

[Jason_]

5 hours ago, southwest1 said:

Jason, 

 

I realize that you & CC1 are President Of The Pagano Fanclub, but knock it off. 

 

 

How about you knock off calling anyone who doesn't agree with your view of Pagano is the president of his fan club.  Not true.

Quote

If we miss the Playoffs again, Chuck is gone.

 

Believe that all you want, but it's not going to be that cut and dry no matter how much you want it to be.  It would depend on why they didn't make the playoffs.  If Luck goes down in week 1, goes on IR, and the Colts don't make the playoffs, should Pagano be fired for that?  

 

Stop perpetuating the myth that Pags is the best available coach out there so therefore, we must stand pat & not alter the status quo. 

 

Quote

I love this notion that Ballard & Irsay alone have the final say not the fans. Of course, that's true right now yes.

 

And I love the notion that some people have that the fans opinion matters. lol  If you stop buying tickets to games, someone else will.  It's as simple as that.  This is just me theorizing, but the Colts would have to have Browns-esque records for at least 5-6+ years before they'd start having difficulty selling out home games.  So yes, Ballard & Irsay do have final say, alone, and it's not just true right now but it's true until the day Ballard is fired or retires.

 

Quote

However, you remember what happened after our disastrous 2011 season right?

 

I remember exactly what happened.  Irsay fired Bill Polian and then tried to keep Caldwell for 2012.  Grigson was hired, and then both Grigson and Jim Caldwell met with Steven Spagnuolo to interview him for the vacant DC position.  Spags presumably laughed in their faces at the thought of working for Caldwell, and only after that happened did they fire Jim Caldwell.  

 

Irsay fired Polian because he knew the mess that the Colt roster had become was his fault, and not Caldwell's.  Just like he knew the recent roster mess was due to Grigson and not Pagano.  Hence, Grigson was fired and replaced but Pagano was not.  

 

If the team as a whole plays poorly during the season, then Pagano likely gets fired after this season.  Not making the playoffs (without examining why they didn't) will not get Pagano fired.  Now, it is entirely possibly that whatever reason there might be for the Colts missing the playoffs could get him fired, but again, that takes an examination of the reason why.

[Jason_]

5 hours ago, southwest1 said:

Zealousness works on both ends: His detractors & his supporters. You don't see me questioning your mental state just because you want to retain Chuck do ya? 

 

 

No, but you have no problem sarcastically calling people Mr fan club president. 

 

Quote

Look, I realize you're joking my friend. I'm aware of that, but it's not hatred CC1 it's playoff production that has declined over the past couple of seasons &

 

Yes playoff production has declined over the past 2 years...but for the 3 years prior to that it improved every single year.  And if you can't figure out that the reasons they've missed the past 2 years are not entirely on Chuck then it absolutely is hatred.  Luck missed 9 games in 2015.  Was that Pagano's fault?  Was it Pagano's fault that the team had better performance and a better record withOUT Luck that season than they did WITH him?  No, that's because Luck was injured.  The fact that they still went 6-3 after losing Luck is to Pagano's credit, not the other way around.  

 

Last year Luck played, but the offensive playcalling was severely lacking most of the time and they simply did not have the defensive talent on the roster to be able to hang with the more potent offenses in the NFL.  When your entire secondary consists of just 1 of your projected starters plus guys like Darryl Morris, Rashaan Melvin, Chris Milton and the incredibly raw and obviously not ready to play yet TJ Green...and your best pass rusher is Erik Walden...I mean seriously?  That kind of defense is going to help take a team to the playoffs?

 

Quote

Luck isn't making strides forward under Pagano's leadership if you can call it that. 

 

now we're just making stuff up out of thin air now aren't we?  Perhaps you didn't notice, but since Luck came to the Colts, his completion percentage has gradually increased each year (save for 2015), his TD:INT ratio has mostly improved, and his Passer Rating has improved.  I do know that there are a lot of people that don't pay any attention to Passer rating, but they should...it's not a perfect stat (none are) and it won't tell the full story (none do) but it does give a pretty good indication of how the QB played from purely from a passing standpoint.  Long story short, Luck absolutely has improved in many ways since coming to the Colts, so your comment about him not making strides is completely false.

 

Quote

 You really Chuck would be half as successful in a new city without Chewbacca carrying him? Now that's funny. 

 

Chuck didn't need Chewbacca in 2015 now did he?  Without Chewbacca, Pagano still managed to come away with a 6-3 record, better than the record WITH Chewbacca...so if anything it could be said that it was Chewbacca holding Pagano back that season and not the other way around. 

[southwest1]

3 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

 

Your obsession with the firing of Pagano has you now hijacking threads?

 

Because I don't throw rose pedals at Pagano, I'm high jacking threads now? A disagreement with maybe 2 individuals on that longevity of status after this season is hardly "highjacking" CC1. 

 

Do I start fire Pagano threads routinely or almost everyday? No, I do not. I'm hardly railroading the guy or assembling people with pitchforks & torches to run Chuck out of INDY. He's been here since 2012 & you can't place all the blame at Ryan Grigson's doorstep. I know that what Chuck supporters are thinking that Chuck was derailed or impeded by our former GM. I'll give you say 45% of that as an excuse but no more than that. 

 

If Pags is still here next yr, I'll deal with it, but we won't be competing for a championship for at least 4 more yrs. I'm convinced on that. Pagano is not the answer to Lombardi glory. 

[southwest1]

1 minute ago, J@son said:

 

No, but you have no problem sarcastically calling people Mr fan club president. 

 

You seem to defend Pagano no matter what he does Jason. That's a fact which has nothing to do with sarcasm. The world doesn't revolve around you. I hate to break it to you. 

 

Yes playoff production has declined over the past 2 years...but for the 3 years prior to that it improved every single year.  And if you can't figure out that the reasons they've missed the past 2 years are not entirely on Chuck then it absolutely is hatred.  Luck missed 9 games in 2015.  Was that Pagano's fault?  Was it Pagano's fault that the team had better performance and a better record withOUT Luck that season than they did WITH him?  No, that's because Luck was injured.  The fact that they still went 6-3 after losing Luck is to Pagano's credit, not the other way around.  

Part of the head coaches job is to protect the quarterback from injury correct? I am reasonable here in terms of sometimes injuries just happen in the course of a game, but a coach's #1 job is to keep the face of the francise

 

1 minute ago, J@son said:

 

Last year Luck played, but the offensive playcalling was severely lacking most of the time and they simply did not have the defensive talent on the roster to be able to hang with the more potent offenses in the NFL.  When your entire secondary consists of just 1 of your projected starters plus guys like Darryl Morris, Rashaan Melvin, Chris Milton and the incredibly raw and obviously not ready to play yet TJ Green...and your best pass rusher is Erik Walden...I mean seriously?  

What like Pagano is the only coach that's played with a less than stellar secondary? Please. Isn't Chuck's calling card the defense when he arrived here from Baltimore? Did we see INDY LBs play with their hair on fire under Chuck's guidance? Nope. 

 

1 minute ago, J@son said:

 

 

 

now we're just making stuff up out of thin air now aren't we?  Perhaps you didn't notice, but since Luck came to the Colts, his completion percentage has gradually increased each year (save for 2015), his TD:INT ratio has mostly improved, and his Passer Rating has improved.  I do know that there are a lot of people that don't pay any attention to Passer rating, but they should...it's not a perfect stat (none are) and it won't tell the full story (none do) but it does give a pretty good indication of how the QB played from purely from a passing standpoint.  Long story short, Luck absolutely has improved in many ways since coming to the Colts, so your comment about him not making strides is completely false. Can I see your journalistic credentials since you clearly masquerade as a sports reporter for either USA Today in the Sports Section or INDY Star Or so you think anyway. Who's to say LUCK wouldn't have improved under any other HC with the same exact completion percentage Jason? 

 

1 minute ago, J@son said:

 

 

Chuck didn't need Chewbacca in 2015 now did he?  Without Chewbacca, Pagano still managed to come away with a 6-3 record, better than the record WITH Chewbacca...so if anything it could be said that it was Chewbacca holding Pagano back that season and not the other way around. 

 

Again, head coaches are supposed to protect QBs & does 6-3 win the division Jason or get us into the Playoffs? Hades no. 

[crazycolt1]

27 minutes ago, southwest1 said:

Because I don't throw rose pedals at Pagano, I'm high jacking threads now? A disagreement with maybe 2 individuals on that longevity of status after this season is hardly "highjacking" CC1. 

 

Do I start fire Pagano threads routinely or almost everyday? No, I do not. I'm hardly railroading the guy or assembling people with pitchforks & torches to run Chuck out of INDY. He's been here since 2012 & you can't place all the blame at Ryan Grigson's doorstep. I know that what Chuck supporters are thinking that Chuck was derailed or impeded by our former GM. I'll give you say 45% of that as an excuse but no more than that. 

 

If Pags is still here next yr, I'll deal with it, but we won't be competing for a championship for at least 4 more yrs. I'm convinced on that. Pagano is not the answer to Lombardi glory. 

Whining about Pagano at this time of year is useless. Pagano is the Colts head coach for this year. Irsay has already said the win-loss record would not be the determining factor in Pagano's firing or being retained. This constant bringing up the firing of Pagano from you has become an obsession with you.

Do I think Pagano will be the future head coach for the Colts? Yes I do. But if he is not it's on to the next. I don't sit around antagonizing over something I don't control. This is the NFL.

It is an insult for you to say that Pagano wouldn't get another head coaching job with the record he has. You harp on how bad he is but he has yet to have a losing season. You may throw in he wouldn't be nothing without Luck but where would any winning head coach be without their winning QB?

So wouldn't it be easier and much less argumentative to wait and see how all this plays out without this back and forth nonsense that neither one of us control?

[southwest1]

1 hour ago, J@son said:

 

How about you knock off calling anyone who doesn't agree with your view of Pagano is the president of his fan club.  Not true.

Why do you feel the need to act like your the premier authority on football? Just curious. Yes, I know you're completely innocent. Okay, fine. Good to know you're a moderator now keeping the peace on the forum. LOL! 

 

1 hour ago, J@son said:

Believe that all you want, but it's not going to be that cut and dry no matter how much you want it to be.  It would depend on why they didn't make the playoffs.  If Luck goes down in week 1, goes on IR, and the Colts don't make the playoffs, should Pagano be fired for that?  

Beautiful job of deflecting Jason & creating a far fetched argument just to create a scenario that's like a billion to one. An astroid might hit earth tomorrow so let's just leave Chuck alone right? Oh brother. 

1 hour ago, J@son said:

 

Stop perpetuating the myth that Pags is the best available coach out there so therefore, we must stand pat & not alter the status quo. 

 

 

And I love the notion that some people have that the fans opinion matters. lol  If you stop buying tickets to games, someone else will.  It's as simple as that.  This is just me theorizing, but the Colts would have to have Browns-esque records for at least 5-6+ years before they'd start having difficulty selling out home games.  So yes, Ballard & Irsay do have final say, alone, and it's not just true right now but it's true until the day Ballard is fired or retires.

Under what circumstances then would any NFL HC be let go then? Because you clearly think Chuck is the best INDY can do. I disagree. Why do you think Caldwell was fired in INDY after the 2011 season? A lousy product on the field that struggled to win & the wheels fell off. BTW, do teams with poor records like the Browns or now the Jets sell out stadiums with pathetic losses in a given yr? The answer is no because the product is a joke. 

1 hour ago, J@son said:

 

 

I remember exactly what happened.  Irsay fired Bill Polian and then tried to keep Caldwell for 2012.  Grigson was hired, and then both Grigson and Jim Caldwell met with Steven Spagnuolo to interview him for the vacant DC position.  Spags presumably laughed in their faces at the thought of working for Caldwell, and only after that happened did they fire Jim Caldwell.  

I know you're trying to be cute here with your response. Caldwell got fired in INDY because we played like crap in 2011 & before you go on & on about how we didn't having Manning that yr Polian did say he make a mistake thinking that Painter could carry the load & he didn't. Both HCs, OC's, QB coaches are supposed to make sure the backup is at least capable & competent of completing passes & not throwing picks. 

1 hour ago, J@son said:

 

Irsay fired Polian because he knew the mess that the Colt roster had become was his fault, and not Caldwell's.  Just like he knew the recent roster mess was due to Grigson and not Pagano.  Hence, Grigson was fired and replaced but Pagano was not.  

Funny how I never even mentioned Polian at all & yet you accuse me of making things up earlier or creating things out of thin air. LOL! 

1 hour ago, J@son said:

 

If the team as a whole plays poorly during the season, then Pagano likely gets fired after this season.  Not making the playoffs (without examining why they didn't) will not get Pagano fired.  Now, it is entirely possibly that whatever reason there might be for the Colts missing the playoffs could get him fired, but again, that takes an examination of the reason why.

The only problem with that statement is this: Like Presidents, the buck stops with the head coach or his performance late in the yr as a squad presuming we make the Playoffs. That's not a foregone conclusion either. INDY has a tendency to hold onto players & coaches too long--Bob Sanders, Antoine Bethea, Jim Caldwell, & now Chuck. Dungy I was cool with because he had proven himself defensively in Tampa Bay. 

[Jason_]

16 minutes ago, southwest1 said:

 know you're trying to be cute here with your response. Caldwell got fired in INDY because we played like crap in 2011 

 

before I waste my time responding point by point, I really need to see your answer to the following question(s).  If Jim Caldwell got fired in Indy because they played like crap in 2011, then why was he not fired as soon as the offseason started like Polian was?  Why was Caldwell present when Steve Spagnuolo was interviewed to be the team's Defensive coordinator for 2012?

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/17/before-firing-caldwell-colts-interviewed-spagnuolo/

 

Quote

 

Here’s a weird twist on the news today that the Colts have fired head coach Jim Caldwell: Before the firing, the Colts were beginning the process of assembling a coaching staff for 2012 — and Caldwell was involved in that process.

Jay Glazer of FOX Sports reports that former Rams head coach Steve Spagnuolo interviewed for the Colts defensive coordinator position, and Caldwell was one of the people Spagnuolo interviewed with, along with other team officials.

 

 

[southwest1]

39 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Whining about Pagano at this time of year is useless. Pagano is the Colts head coach for this year. Irsay has already said the win-loss record would not be the determining factor in Pagano's firing or being retained. This constant bringing up the firing of Pagano from you has become an obsession with you.

Do I think Pagano will be the future head coach for the Colts? Yes I do. But if he is not it's on to the next. I don't sit around antagonizing over something I don't control. This is the NFL.

It is an insult for you to say that Pagano wouldn't get another head coaching job with the record he has. You harp on how bad he is but he has yet to have a losing season. You may throw in he wouldn't be nothing without Luck but where would any winning head coach be without their winning QB?

So wouldn't it be easier and much less argumentative to wait and see how all this plays out without this back and forth nonsense that neither one of us control?

First off, let me just say that on a personal level I really do like you & hold no animosity toward you at all. We're just at opposite ends of Pagano spectrum that's all. 

 

I get it Pagano is who with ride with for the 2017 season. That is true. On the 1 hand, even though I think your loyalty to Pagano is extremely misplaced, I do admire your resolve. I'm the same way when I dig in too. What's that quote from Hoffa directed by Danny Devito? "Everybody is telling me I'm wrong, but God darn it, I know I'm right!" Even when people are wrong, I revere tenacity & stubbornness on both sides of the aisle because sooner or later something's gotta give. Pressure busts pipes man & only 1 side emerges on top. 

 

I never said Pagano wouldn't get another job CC1. What I said was were else is he going go & have such a talented offense as INDY? I also said the Browns or Jets might hire him for no more than 1 contract meaning 4-5 yrs. 

 

My biggest issue with Pags is that defense was his calling card with the Ravens & in his first press conference he said let's hunt. Not much hunting going on even with our LBs. Yes, he deserves credit for getting to the AFC Championship Game vs the Pats. I won't take that accolade away from him. He earned that. A myriad of coaches would be successful with Luck. I'm not letting Pagano get away with that one. 

 

Yeah, all we can do is let the season unfold. No argument there. I've been wrong before. I know that, but I also know that change can be good a la Jack Del Rio in Oakland. Yes, I know Derek Carr is awesome. My point is this: Jack had proven his defensive credentials in Denver & he brought a tougher defensive mentality to the Bay area as a player for the Vikings & former coach of the Jags. It's not always about athleticism in the draft room, but the mental fortitude to change the locker room culture.  

[southwest1]

18 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

before I waste my time responding point by point, I really need to see your answer to the following question(s).  If Jim Caldwell got fired in Indy because they played like crap in 2011, then why was he not fired as soon as the offseason started like Polian was?  Why was Caldwell present when Steve Spagnuolo was interviewed to be the team's Defensive coordinator for 2012?

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/17/before-firing-caldwell-colts-interviewed-spagnuolo/

 

 

I looked at your link Jason. 

 

"Before the firing, the Colts were beginning the process of assembling a coaching staff for 2012 — and Caldwell was involved in that process." 

 

So what? Jimmy wanted to involve Caldwell in taking a run at Spags former DC for the NY Giants. What like Irsay thought let's bring in Steve, generate a pass rush in INDY, & Tom Brady gets vanquished by the mastermind of the 2007 season as Caldwell & the Colts march onward toward another SB? 

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Jim was still fired right? He's no longer coaching in INDY right? He's running the show in Detroit as we speak right? Wow Jason, you're crazy. So because Spags wasn't hired as our new DC after the 2011 season that proves to you that Caldwell didn't suck? Please tell me your not that naive or foolish Jason. 

[Jason_]

12 minutes ago, southwest1 said:

I looked at your link Jason. 

 

"Before the firing, the Colts were beginning the process of assembling a coaching staff for 2012 — and Caldwell was involved in that process." 

 

So what? Jimmy wanted to involve Caldwell in taking a run at Spags former DC for the NY Giants. What like Irsay thought let's bring in Steve, generate a pass rush in INDY, & Tom Brady gets vanquished by the mastermind of the 2007 season as Caldwell & the Colts march onward toward another SB? 

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Jim was still fired right? He's no longer coaching in INDY right? He's running the show in Detroit as we speak right? Wow Jason, you're crazy. So because Spags wasn't hired as our new DC after the 2011 season that proves to you that Caldwell didn't suck? Please tell me your not that naive or foolish Jason. 

 

Sea kelp

[southwest1]

2 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

Sea kelp

That's your reply? A misspelled word. 

 

So, according to your logic, being in the same room interviewing Spags for a job Caldwell no longer has means that Caldwell is a good coach? That's like saying by virtue of being in a room serving in a position I no longer have means that I'm brilliant then? Being in a room means nothing. It's like saying so & so was in the war room when Bin Laden was killed so therefore this person is a shoe in to become the next President simply because he was seated at the adult table. 

 

Did you ever consider the possibility that Irsay was just being nice to Caldwell throwing him 1 final gesture as HC in symbolism only while he started the screening process for Jim's replacement? Hmmm...

[Jason_]

21 minutes ago, southwest1 said:

That's your reply? A misspelled word. 

 

So, according to your logic, being in the same room interviewing Spags for a job Caldwell no longer has means that Caldwell is a good coach? 

 

2 Things. First, where did I say caldwell was a good coach?  Quote me. 

 

Second, "a job Caldwell no longer has" .  what could you possibly mean? At the time of that interview, Jim caldwell had not been fired. He was still under contract as the head coach of the Indianapolis Colts. And he was interviewing spagnuolo to be his (Jim caldwell's) defensive coordinator in 2012. 

 

 

"Did you ever consider the possibility that Irsay was just being nice to Caldwell throwing him 1 final gesture as HC in symbolism only while he started the screening process for Jim's replacement? Hmmm..."

 

Are you seriously suggesting that Jim irsay, knowing that he was going to fire Caldwell the next day, let Jim caldwell interview Steve spagnuolo to be the colts DC thinking he was doing Caldwell a favor? That is one of the dumbest things I have ever read. 

 

Irsay: "hey Jim (caldwell), how would you like to see if Steve spagnuolo would like to work for you here next year? I mean, YOU wont be working here, but you could see if Steve would have been willing to work for you...you know, if I wasnt planning on firing you tomorrow."

 

Is that how it went down? If not, then how did it?  

[ColtsBlueFL]

On 7/10/2017 at 3:53 PM, IinD said:

I think this is a case of us being REALLY careful with his rehab. I get it though, that's a lot of money tied up and he's literally our future.

 

They've left the fans and media in the dark with this injury though.

 

Two reasons, they don't have to and it's too detailed and 'fluid' for non medical personnel to discuss.

 

On 7/10/2017 at 5:41 PM, life long said:

It is good news to me. Getting the stability back is more important long term. If I was a Panther fan, I would be a little concerned with how quick Cam started throwing. He is becoming known as a guy who rushes back from injury too quickly IMO. I prefer the patient route the Colts are taking.

 

Cam and Luck had operations on different parts of the shoulder, for one, and Lucks procedure was much more invasive than the one Cam Newton had. Newton had a partially torn rotator cuff. It's important to make a distinction between a complete rotator cuff tear, a condition where the tendon is completely detached from the bone, and a partial tear that results in a frayed tendon. Cam needed only a debridement and some rehab.  Andrew had a tear of the labrum which requires extensive recovery (healing) and rehab.

 

Read Dr. Chao's article why Andrew is 'way behind' Cam even though he had surgery sooner here-

 

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sports/profootballdoc/quarterbacks/sd-sp-pfd-andrew-luck-surgery-shoulder-throwing-camp-0616-story.html

 

On 7/10/2017 at 7:03 PM, deedub75 said:

They keep throwing the "but could" caveat in there. That bothers me a bit. That's just like saying I can beat Lebron one on one but I just don't want to. 

 

Because they do not have the background and skills to evaluate Luck's progress.  the medical team does. And medical teams never deal in absolutes.  Like an OC that has a game plan and makes in game adjustments as necessary, medical teams have a recovery and rehab plan and make in stride adjustments as necessary.

 

On 7/11/2017 at 7:58 AM, bananabucket said:

R.I.P. original topic

 

This was the epitome of a threadjack...  Hopefully it's back on track again... 

 

{Waiting for the  "Yeah, but... we still have Pagano" crowd and another derail}

[crazycolt1]

4 hours ago, southwest1 said:

First off, let me just say that on a personal level I really do like you & hold no animosity toward you at all. We're just at opposite ends of Pagano spectrum that's all. 

 

I get it Pagano is who with ride with for the 2017 season. That is true. On the 1 hand, even though I think your loyalty to Pagano is extremely misplaced, I do admire your resolve. I'm the same way when I dig in too. What's that quote from Hoffa directed by Danny Devito? "Everybody is telling me I'm wrong, but God darn it, I know I'm right!" Even when people are wrong, I revere tenacity & stubbornness on both sides of the aisle because sooner or later something's gotta give. Pressure busts pipes man & only 1 side emerges on top. 

 

I never said Pagano wouldn't get another job CC1. What I said was were else is he going go & have such a talented offense as INDY? I also said the Browns or Jets might hire him for no more than 1 contract meaning 4-5 yrs. 

 

My biggest issue with Pags is that defense was his calling card with the Ravens & in his first press conference he said let's hunt. Not much hunting going on even with our LBs. Yes, he deserves credit for getting to the AFC Championship Game vs the Pats. I won't take that accolade away from him. He earned that. A myriad of coaches would be successful with Luck. I'm not letting Pagano get away with that one. 

 

Yeah, all we can do is let the season unfold. No argument there. I've been wrong before. I know that, but I also know that change can be good a la Jack Del Rio in Oakland. Yes, I know Derek Carr is awesome. My point is this: Jack had proven his defensive credentials in Denver & he brought a tougher defensive mentality to the Bay area as a player for the Vikings & former coach of the Jags. It's not always about athleticism in the draft room, but the mental fortitude to change the locker room culture.  

All I ask was to let this play out and you still come up with a mini novel trying to make your point over mine.

I brought up the fact of what Belichick started out with and you then ask me what does that have to do with Pagano?

Now it's OK for you to drift into Jack Del Rio? Jack had a history of losing before Oakland and also started out with a record of nothing to write home about at Oakland.

Pagano has been a head coach for 5 years. How many years does Jack Del Rio have?

You completely overlook the fact that Pagano has only been coaching 5 years but all the other coaches you bring up have a lot more years at learning how to be a head coach but Pagano don't get your benefit because of your personal dislike of him.

Your personal opinion does not make things a fact no matter how obsessed your are.

[Buck Showalter]

5 hours ago, southwest1 said:

INDY has a tendency to hold onto players & coaches too long--Bob Sanders, Antoine Bethea, Jim Caldwell, & now Chuck. Dungy I was cool with because he had proven himself defensively in Tampa Bay. 

You're going to use Bethea as an example of the Colts tendency to hold onto players for too long???

 

Wow...

 

Edit: oops I realize peeps trying to get the thread back on track, but I just couldn't help myself...

 

[ColtsBlueFL]

1 hour ago, Buck Showalter said:

You're going to use Bethea as an example of the Colts tendency to hold onto players for too long???

 

Wow...

 

Edit: oops I realize peeps trying to get the thread back on track, but I just couldn't help myself...

 

 

Yeah, I think the debate created here needs to be taken to its own thread.  People will come here for Luck updates/talk and see another Pagano turned into a mess thread and leave before finding out the info they desire.

 

I'm sure Irsay has given the medical team full responsibility and control over Luck and his statrus.  when Andrew reaches a certain point, they will guide the coahes into what he can and cannot do daily as he begins the prep for playing football once he has healed to that point.  Patience from all of us.  His recovery road is long and steep.  Let him navigate to its completion.

[superrep1967]

5 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Yeah, I think the debate created here needs to be taken to its own thread.  People will come here for Luck updates/talk and see another Pagano turned into a mess thread and leave before finding out the info they desire.

 

I'm sure Irsay has given the medical team full responsibility and control over Luck and his statrus.  when Andrew reaches a certain point, they will guide the coahes into what he can and cannot do daily as he begins the prep for playing football once he has healed to that point.  Patience from all of us.  His recovery road is long and steep.  Let him navigate to its completion.

I agree!! What concerns me the most is how long will it takes for him to get his muscle mass back in order. Because right now he doesn't look like much of an athlete.  

[ColtsBlueFL]

1 hour ago, superrep1967 said:

I agree!! What concerns me the most is how long will it takes for him to get his muscle mass back in order. Because right now he doesn't look like much of an athlete.  

 

Indeed, being medically cleared to participate does not mean he is in football shape.  It will take more time for him to get in football shape and develop his timing and accuracy once medically cleared.  That is why so many hope His rehab is either rushed (bad, bad idea) or he heals faster than typical (possible but not likely)  To me, the knee and shoulder are the two joints that are some of the least supported and most susceptible to long term injury/recovery.  Once fixed, the medical team needs the patient to perform their daily grind/job in rehab to make it a successful  operation.

[ColtsBlueFL]

14 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I see a strike coming soon, just a hunch

 

Players strike? Doubt we see anything of substance from either side  before 2020.

 

NFLPA is already prepping players to Save a chunk of cash for the upcoming lockout 2021...

 

https://www.sbnation.com/2017/5/30/15712404/nflpa-cba-nfl-lockout-2021-leverage-negotiations

[ColtsBlueFL]

 

 

I know the NFLPA wants significantly reduced punitive approach to marijuana use (and approved treatment). The league already increased the minimum amount measured to produce a positive along with reduced penalties once in 2014.  But a recent Medical Study on low to moderate recreational users between 18 - 25 years of age showed significant structural changes to the brain, (notably, the Amygdala and Accumbens), and will now lead to studying those in depth that only 'use' 2-4 times a weeks for long term Brain changes.

 

http://www.sfn.org/Press-Room/News-Release-Archives/2014/Brain-Changes-Are-Associated-with-Casual-Marijuana-Use-in-Young-Adults

 

The strike (or lockout) will only be as good as the NFL players are prepared financially, especially the lower paid set.

 

The NFLPA also wants-

 

Elimination of Article 46 (Goodell's power) and an independent arbitration system
No increases of on field practices and hitting
no increase in number of regular seasons games played
Higher amount in Guaranteed contracts (years and Dollars)

 

Maybe more.  Now, what do the owners want, and will the NFLPA be willing to barter to that to get some/all of the above?  2021 could well get nasty. We'll see...

[2006Coltsbestever]

22 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Players strike? Doubt we see anything of substance from either side  before 2020.

 

NFLPA is already prepping players to Save a chunk of cash for the upcoming lockout 2021...

 

https://www.sbnation.com/2017/5/30/15712404/nflpa-cba-nfl-lockout-2021-leverage-negotiations

I don't know? I hope you are right but they aren't happy with the salaries they are making or how contracts are done - I did read your link though. Richard Sherman has been spouting off about it all week. When you look at the NBA and have a player like JJ Redick making 23 million dollars and your highest paid player is Derek Carr at 25 per year, then we have a problem. Redick will make more than Luck next season and he is just a Role Player.

[ColtsBlueFL]

On 7/16/2017 at 6:18 PM, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I don't know? I hope you are right but they aren't happy with the salaries they are making or how contracts are done - I did read your link though. Richard Sherman has been spouting off about it all week. When you look at the NBA and have a player like JJ Redick making 23 million dollars and your highest paid player is Derek Carr at 25 per year, then we have a problem. Redick will make more than Luck next season and he is just a Role Player.

 

Who can hold out the longest... owners (revenue stream interrupted) or players (payroll stream interrupted) ?

 

NFLPA is trying to gear up the players for a fight 4 years from now.  I'm certain there is no ability for players to sustain a long term strike at this juncture,  but maybe in 2021 they can.

 

As far as salary thing-

NFL plays 16 regular season games a year
–NBA plays 82.

NFL Roster is 45-53 players +10 P.S.
-NBA Roster is 12-15 players.

 

Huge disparity, what about the TV money?

 

Attendance numbers here-

http://www.espn.com/nfl/attendance

 

http://www.espn.com/nba/attendance

 

A lot to consider, not just dollars per player

 

[crazycolt1]

56 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Who can hold out the longest... owners (revenue stream interrupted) or players (payroll stream interrupted) ?

 

NFLPA is trying to gear up the players for a fight 4 years from now.  I'm certain there is no ability for players to sustain a long term strike at this juncture,  but maybe in 2021 they can.

 

As far as salary thing-

 

NFL plays 16 regular season games a year
–NBA plays 82.

NFL Roster is 45-53 players +10 P.S.
-NBA Roster is 12-15 players.

 

Huge disparity, what about the TV money?

 

Attendance numbers here-

http://www.espn.com/nfl/attendance

 

http://www.espn.com/nba/attendance

 

A lot to consider, not just dollars per player

 

Just the shear total of personnel involved between the NFL and the NBA is huge.

Just traveling to away games for a NFL team compared to a NBA team is huge also.

As it stands right now the NBA does not have to put an X amount of money into a fund for past players.

Has the NBA faced the legal problems the NFL has? 

[Superman]

On 7/16/2017 at 4:22 PM, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Who can hold out the longest... owners (revenue stream interrupted) or players (payroll stream interrupted) ?

 

NFLPA is trying to gear up the players for a fight 4 years from now.  I'm certain there is no ability for players to sustain a long term strike at this juncture,  but maybe in 2021 they can.

 

As far as salary thing-

 

NFL plays 16 regular season games a year
–NBA plays 82.

NFL Roster is 45-53 players +10 P.S.
-NBA Roster is 12-15 players.

 

Huge disparity, what about the TV money?

 

Attendance numbers here-

http://www.espn.com/nfl/attendance

 

http://www.espn.com/nba/attendance

 

A lot to consider, not just dollars per player

 

 

It's almost maddening listening to people talk about how NFL players should get more money / guaranteed contracts with no regard for the facts. 

 

Not to mention the fact that fully guaranteed contracts don't really make any sense. Ask an Angels fan about Albert Pujols contract, or a Laker fan about Luol Deng's contract, and then help me understand why that would be good for the NFL. Why should the Vikings have to pay Adrian Peterson $18m this year, when his production clearly doesn't justify it?

[ColtsBlueFL]

On 7/12/2017 at 5:29 AM, Jared Cisneros said:

I like the long response. That's what we are going to have to do to get to the SB, a solid team and a solid defense. The only problem I have is he shouldn't have to be flawless to win every game, and it seems he has to be. I don't know if the team is that bad, or that's just on Luck. In any case, it'll take a great defense and better playcalling (as you said) to get us to the SB. What's going on now isn't working. This year's improvements on both sides of the ball is a start, but it likely won't be enough this year. Ballard has to give Luck what Manning didn't have, a top defense. Reason being, I don't think Luck has the talent Manning has and the ability to carry a team like him either.

 

 

Bruce Arians, Andrew Lucks 1st NFL Head Coach (and coached Roethlisberger, Peyton Manning, and Carson Palmer) feels differently. Here are some recent quotes-

 

** Arians said that Luck is a combo of Peyton Manning's brain and Ben Roethlisberger's body, adding that he believes Luck has a photographic memory. **

 

"It took Ben a couple years to do no-huddle and call it. Peyton three years. Andrew, three games. He's brilliant. They say he's got a photographic memory. I don't know what the hell it is, but I know you tell him once, and he's got it,"    Arians said.   "And his athletic ability is amazing. When you think of Peyton's brain and Ben's body and toughness and heart, you got Andrew. So much goes into winning. Not just one guy. He probably needed that surgery sooner than he got it."

 

 

On another note, Arians related-

Arians just came out with his new book,

 

The Quarterback Whisperer: How to Build an Elite NFL Quarterback

 

http://amzn.to/2u2JaFs    

 

(Ive just purchased the Kindle edition for the Kindle Reader on my iPad air2)

 

Bruce found out he had Renal Cell Carcinoma (Kidney Cancer) but finished the year, had surgery in February.

 

"Arians writes in his new book that he got the diagnosis in December and decided to coach the rest of the season. He had surgery to remove the cancer in February and says he’s now doing well and will be healthy enough to coach the team in 2017. "

 

This book should be a good read, and for those that have read this far get this nugget, where he relates a story about Luck he says he forgot to include in it -

 

“You never know in the interview process,” (about a drafted QB) Arians said in studio on CBS Sports Radio’s Tiki and Tierney. “You can get a pretty good feel, but that first mini-camp, you’ll know real quick. With (Andrew Luck), he was there for the rookie minicamp. He comes back and lights our defense up the first practice. I don’t think I even put this story in the book, but I came out the next day wearing black socks, black shirt, black hat, walked over to the defensive backs, walked right through them as they’re warming up. And Antoine Bethea (said), ‘What’s up with all the black, man? You going to a funeral?’ I said, ‘Yeah. y’alls. He kicked your butt yesterday. He killed every one of you.’”

 

LOL!!

 

 

[Yoshinator]

2 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

 

Bruce Arians, Andrew Lucks 1st NFL Head Coach (and coached Roethlisberger, Peyton Manning, and Carson Palmer) feels differently. Here are some recent quotes-

 

** Arians said that Luck is a combo of Peyton Manning's brain and Ben Roethlisberger's body, adding that he believes Luck has a photographic memory. **

 

"It took Ben a couple years to do no-huddle and call it. Peyton three years. Andrew, three games. He's brilliant. They say he's got a photographic memory. I don't know what the hell it is, but I know you tell him once, and he's got it,"    Arians said.   "And his athletic ability is amazing. When you think of Peyton's brain and Ben's body and toughness and heart, you got Andrew. So much goes into winning. Not just one guy. He probably needed that surgery sooner than he got it."

 

 

On another note, Arians related-

Arians just came out with his new book,

 

The Quarterback Whisperer: How to Build an Elite NFL Quarterback

 

http://amzn.to/2u2JaFs    

 

(Ive just purchased the Kindle edition for the Kindle Reader on my iPad air2)

 

Bruce found out he had Renal Cell Carcinoma (Kidney Cancer) but finished the year, had surgery in February.

 

"Arians writes in his new book that he got the diagnosis in December and decided to coach the rest of the season. He had surgery to remove the cancer in February and says he’s now doing well and will be healthy enough to coach the team in 2017. "

 

This book should be a good read, and for those that have read this far get this nugget, where he relates a story about Luck he says he forgot to include in it -

 

“You never know in the interview process,” (about a drafted QB) Arians said in studio on CBS Sports Radio’s Tiki and Tierney. “You can get a pretty good feel, but that first mini-camp, you’ll know real quick. With (Andrew Luck), he was there for the rookie minicamp. He comes back and lights our defense up the first practice. I don’t think I even put this story in the book, but I came out the next day wearing black socks, black shirt, black hat, walked over to the defensive backs, walked right through them as they’re warming up. And Antoine Bethea (said), ‘What’s up with all the black, man? You going to a funeral?’ I said, ‘Yeah. y’alls. He kicked your butt yesterday. He killed every one of you.’”

 

LOL!!

 

 

I appreciate that, but I don't feel any better. They aren't going to publicly say Luck is a bad QB or anything negative about him. I'm giving Luck the benefit of the doubt because he has played hurt and want to see him healthy for now. If he takes a little while to fully recover, I'm fine with that. If he's fully healthy and dominates like 2014 with a slightly better defense now, then everything will be great and I'll eat crow about Luck. If he is fully healthy and continues to get off to slow starts though, then I'm not watching until either Pagano, Chud, or both get fired. Not going through another year of this. Hopefully Luck is still as good as he was in 2014, and will continue to improve. If so, we have a shot at a SB down the road, if not, then we may be one of the pack for the forseeable future.

[NewColtsFan]

4 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

 

Bruce Arians, Andrew Lucks 1st NFL Head Coach (and coached Roethlisberger, Peyton Manning, and Carson Palmer) feels differently. Here are some recent quotes-

 

** Arians said that Luck is a combo of Peyton Manning's brain and Ben Roethlisberger's body, adding that he believes Luck has a photographic memory. **

 

"It took Ben a couple years to do no-huddle and call it. Peyton three years. Andrew, three games. He's brilliant. They say he's got a photographic memory. I don't know what the hell it is, but I know you tell him once, and he's got it,"    Arians said.   "And his athletic ability is amazing. When you think of Peyton's brain and Ben's body and toughness and heart, you got Andrew. So much goes into winning. Not just one guy. He probably needed that surgery sooner than he got it."

 

 

On another note, Arians related-

Arians just came out with his new book,

 

The Quarterback Whisperer: How to Build an Elite NFL Quarterback

 

http://amzn.to/2u2JaFs    

 

(Ive just purchased the Kindle edition for the Kindle Reader on my iPad air2)

 

Bruce found out he had Renal Cell Carcinoma (Kidney Cancer) but finished the year, had surgery in February.

 

"Arians writes in his new book that he got the diagnosis in December and decided to coach the rest of the season. He had surgery to remove the cancer in February and says he’s now doing well and will be healthy enough to coach the team in 2017. "

 

This book should be a good read, and for those that have read this far get this nugget, where he relates a story about Luck he says he forgot to include in it -

 

“You never know in the interview process,” (about a drafted QB) Arians said in studio on CBS Sports Radio’s Tiki and Tierney. “You can get a pretty good feel, but that first mini-camp, you’ll know real quick. With (Andrew Luck), he was there for the rookie minicamp. He comes back and lights our defense up the first practice. I don’t think I even put this story in the book, but I came out the next day wearing black socks, black shirt, black hat, walked over to the defensive backs, walked right through them as they’re warming up. And Antoine Bethea (said), ‘What’s up with all the black, man? You going to a funeral?’ I said, ‘Yeah. y’alls. He kicked your butt yesterday. He killed every one of you.’”

 

LOL!!

 

 

 

 

Regarding Luck's photographic memory......     this is my favorite Luck story....    from his rookie season with the Colts.

 

It was post-draft,  but Luck had not graduated yet,  so he'd come out to Indy for a few days and then go back to the Bay Area to finish school.

 

On one trip,  the coaching staff gave Luck a big chunk of the playbook --- more than half.     It was all situational football.      Luck left and the coaching staff looked at each other....    one of the coaches said....  "we won't hear from him for weeks!"       Luck flew back to SF,  roughly 4 hours...   he drove down to Stanford,  roughly 30 minutes or so and sent a 4 word text to the coaches....

 

:"Got it.    What's next?"

 

If that doesn't tell you how great Luck's mind is,  nothing else will......