Caldwell/coaching (Merge)

[Jaric]

yeah how do people know who has passion and who doesn't? do they expect everyone to be foaming at the mouth and yelling all game?

Yes...yes they do because that is how you show you have passion. To me it just shows someone who is loud and abrasive...

:scared:

Yes. Because clearly those who are fed up with the catatonic stare can want no other alternative than a coach who does nothing but scream and foam at the mouth. There can be no middle ground. It's either robotic stare (which appears to be contagious) or hellfire and brimstone.

[Jaric]

corrupt fans

I keep seeing you use that word. I do not think it means, what you think it means.

[number28]

I keep seeing you use that word. I do not think it means, what you think it means.

FAILED. You are the corrupt fan. You backstabbed this franchise.

[Jaric]

FAILED. You are the corrupt fan. You backstabbed this franchise.

Sure sport. Whatever you say.

[BIGugly]

http://profootballta...o-dolphins-job/

You're harping on the word exclusive is overblown at the absolute very least. His "exclusivity" could be little more than he is exclusive to MNF and no other sports program.

He can get out at any time he wants.

Any NFL team that wants him bad enough can afford to buy out THAT contract.

[Daniel Bogh]

Dude do you not know who the 49ers have in the middle of that defense? you should acquaint yourself to their MLB, they have a pretty good defense not to mention a stellar run game.... Hence Jim's job wasnt hard... all they did was simplify the playbook for Alex smith and BAM you have a QB thats completing passes.

This cracks me up. Just that easy huh? Never coached or been around coaching, have you?

Coaching makes a huge difference. A team takes on the identity and passion, or discipline, coolnes, or what have you...for good or ill, of their coach. Players call into various radio shows, TV shows, and respond to interviews every week saying just this.

Not just any coach would have turned San Fran around. Same with Buffalo. Detroit I'll give you somewhat just due to the sheer number of first round picks they've had, but it still takes a certain coach to get the guys together, disciplined, etc and I think ultimately we'll see if Schwartz is that guy.

Having coached I will absolutely agree that talent and player character make a huge difference, but in the end how you respond to the players, how you prepare them, and, most importantly, how you motivate them makes or breaks you.

The Colts are a heartless team right now. I don't know if I'm quite ready to blame Caldwell just yet, but I do know there are other coaches I'd rather have. My beef with his fire goes back to the forfeiture of the undefeated season. Now, admittedly. it could be assistant coaches as well, and we have definitely had defensive struggles of one kind or another for years, and our special teams has been, well, very special.

I fully realize a lot of this comes down to the type of players we get, but there are teams out there similar to us in talent that are not 0-7.

[BIGugly]

This cracks me up. Just that easy huh? Never coached or been around coaching, have you?

Coaching makes a huge difference. A team takes on the identity and passion, or discipline, coolnes, or what have you...for good or ill, of their coach. Players call into various radio shows, TV shows, and respond to interviews every week saying just this.

Not just any coach would have turned San Fran around. Same with Buffalo. Detroit I'll give you somewhat just due to the sheer number of first round picks they've had, but it still takes a certain coach to get the guys together, disciplined, etc and I think ultimately we'll see if Schwartz is that guy.

Having coached I will absolutely agree that talent and player character make a huge difference, but in the end how you respond to the players, how you prepare them, and, most importantly, how you motivate them makes or breaks you.

The Colts are a heartless team right now. I don't know if I'm quite ready to blame Caldwell just yet, but I do know there are other coaches I'd rather have. My beef with his fire goes back to the forfeiture of the undefeated season. Now, admittedly. it could be assistant coaches as well, and we have definitely had defensive struggles of one kind or another for years, and our special teams has been, well, very special.

I fully realize a lot of this comes down to the type of players we get, but there are teams out there similar to us in talent that are not 0-7.

Exactly. So says Daniel, so it is.....

[Case]

FAILED. You are the corrupt fan. You backstabbed this franchise.

I'm not sure why you are calling people backstabbers. Have u been watching the games this year? Do you know that we just IR a guy we gave 4 mill to so he could play a few games and look terrible even though we had a qb on the team who could manage this offense better I know i know Caldwell took us to a super bowl and we hsve been to the playoffs like every year and that is awesome but we just got 62 puts scored on us and are 0-7 and this defense had been bad for awhile and nobody is seeming to do anything about it. Colts fans have the right to be angry. Every "expert" I've heard on espn has said that our defense is full of players who wouldn't make the team on a cfl roster. It really sucks to hear that it might not be true idk but the fact that they are saying that has to raise some questions. We aren't backstabbing anybody I will still watch every game and go to the home games I just want this team to play like a NFL team and be prepared. It's hardly backstabbing. If anything the FO has stabbed us in the back for not putting a team on the field that actually can hang with other teams.

[number28]

I'm not sure why you are calling people backstabbers. Have u been watching the games this year? Do you know that we just IR a guy we gave 4 mill to so he could play a few games and look terrible even though we had a qb on the team who could manage this offense better I know i know Caldwell took us to a super bowl and we hsve been to the playoffs like every year and that is awesome but we just got 62 puts scored on us and are 0-7 and this defense had been bad for awhile and nobody is seeming to do anything about it. Colts fans have the right to be angry. Every "expert" I've heard on espn has said that our defense is full of players who wouldn't make the team on a cfl roster. It really sucks to hear that it might not be true idk but the fact that they are saying that has to raise some questions. We aren't backstabbing anybody I will still watch every game and go to the home games I just want this team to play like a NFL team and be prepared. It's hardly backstabbing. If anything the FO has stabbed us in the back for not putting a team on the field that actually can hang with other teams.

the problem is the shallowness of you and other people who think that FIRING Caldwell and Polian will make all the problems go away.

[number28]

our defense is full of players who wouldn't make the team on a cfl roster.

and why is that Caldwell fault?

I wanna fire the whole coaching staff and the whole front office because we have no talent on our team. Nice!

[doogansquest]

Freeney, Mathis, and Bethea would start on any team. Nevis would as well, but he's injured, and his loss is having a bigger impact than some people realize.

We do need CB help, and probably a NT. The scheme works ( as evidenced by the fact that a 1-win Jacksonville absolutely blanked the Ravens and their 8th ranked offense while using mostly the Tampa 2), but we are missing some pieces, and a coordinator who can adjust.

[Case]

and why is that Caldwell fault?

I wanna fire the whole coaching staff and the whole front office because we have no talent on our team. Nice!

I thought the team got to pick their players. Hmmmmm my bad.

[dn4192]

I thought the team got to pick their players. Hmmmmm my bad.

Well actually the final decision on whom is picked in the Colts case comes down to Polian, now both of them. The coaches have a chance for input, but when it's all said and done, the picks are by the Polians.

[Case]

Well actually the final decision on whom is picked in the Colts case comes down to Polian, now both of them. The coaches have a chance for input, but when it's all said and done, the picks are by the Polians.

I know this Andddddddddddddddd?

So when I said team that means polian because well he is apart of the team

Edited October 26, 2011 by Colts1

[Jaric]

Well actually the final decision on whom is picked in the Colts case comes down to Polian, now both of them. The coaches have a chance for input, but when it's all said and done, the picks are by the Polians.

So you agree it's entirely reasonable to place some blame on the coaching staff and front office for the state of the team. Good, we're all in agreement then.

[dn4192]

So you agree it's entirely reasonable to place some blame on the coaching staff and front office for the state of the team. Good, we're all in agreement then.

No question there is blame for the poor coaching, some bad drafting and assembling of the team for this season. What I don't agree with is that wholesale changes need to be done as there is no present pattern of horrible play outside of this season. Before I advocate wholesale changes I want more evidence then just 1 season. When you have 9+ consecutive seasons of winning then wholesale changes based off of 1 bad is not prudent.

[Jaric]

No question there is blame for the poor coaching, some bad drafting and assembling of the team for this season. What I don't agree with is that wholesale changes need to be done as there is no present pattern of horrible play outside of this season. Before I advocate wholesale changes I want more evidence then just 1 season. When you have 9+ consecutive seasons of winning then wholesale changes based off of 1 bad is not prudent.

And here I'm going to have to disagree with you. Overall we've been winning, but it's been more or less entirely because of our passing game.

Our defense has been mediocre at best the entire time Manning has been here. Recently our offensive line play and running game took a nosedive (although it "appears" to have gotten better this year, but it's hard to tell since the team as a whole is playing so badly) The less said about our special teams the better.

Looking at the situation in isolation, you're right, one bad year is not cause for wholesale change. However, we cannot look at this in isolation. Many of these issues have been going on for years, but have been covered up because of our passing game. Well, now Manning isn't here to cover it up and all those problems we've known about but didn't want to aknowledge have lead us to our current situation.

We cannot expect Manning to bail us out forever. Even if he does come back, his time in this league is running out. We have to look for the long term stability of this team. We have to build a defense that can stop people. We have to build an offensive line that can block people. We have to build a running game that can run on people.

I am all for giving people time to correct mistakes, but at what point to we accept that it's not going to happen? How many years has our defense failed? At some point we have to look at reality and accept that this is what we're going to get if we continue to do the same thing year in and year out.

[dn4192]

And here I'm going to have to disagree with you. Overall we've been winning, but it's been more or less entirely because of our passing game.

Our defense has been mediocre at best the entire time Manning has been here. Recently our offensive line play and running game took a nosedive (although it "appears" to have gotten better this year, but it's hard to tell since the team as a whole is playing so badly) The less said about our special teams the better.

Looking at the situation in isolation, you're right, one bad year is not cause for wholesale change. However, we cannot look at this in isolation. Many of these issues have been going on for years, but have been covered up because of our passing game. Well, now Manning isn't here to cover it up and all those problems we've known about but didn't want to aknowledge have lead us to our current situation.

We cannot expect Manning to bail us out forever. Even if he does come back, his time in this league is running out. We have to look for the long term stability of this team. We have to build a defense that can stop people. We have to build an offensive line that can block people. We have to build a running game that can run on people.

I am all for giving people time to correct mistakes, but at what point to we accept that it's not going to happen? How many years has our defense failed? At some point we have to look at reality and accept that this is what we're going to get if we continue to do the same thing year in and year out.

Given the salary cap structure for which the Colts work under and the amount of monies paid to very important and key offensive players, that left very little left for defense and when you spend the limited resources you have on players like Mathis, and Freeney and Sanders it even leaves you less to spend on those other positions. So...what exactly did you want Bill to do? I mean I guess they could have not resigned Peyton on his contract before the one he just signed and that would have freed up monies to improve the defense and gone with a lesser QB. I wonder how that would have gone over with fans. I don't have the exact numbers but I am willing to bet that overall the Colts payroll was about 60-65% towards a small handfull of players leaving the rest to cover and with that system you are going to have issues at some point.

[LUVTHESHOE]

No question there is blame for the poor coaching, some bad drafting and assembling of the team for this season. What I don't agree with is that wholesale changes need to be done as there is no present pattern of horrible play outside of this season. Before I advocate wholesale changes I want more evidence then just 1 season. When you have 9+ consecutive seasons of winning then wholesale changes based off of 1 bad is not prudent.

Have you noticed that our record in the last 25 games. The cald is doing to us what he did at Wake, changing the culture.

[Case]

Have you noticed that our record in the last 25 games. The cald is doing to us what he did at Wake, changing the culture.

Just wondering Whst is our record in the last 25 games

[dn4192]

Have you noticed that our record in the last 25 games. The cald is doing to us what he did at Wake, changing the culture.

I have also noticed that during those games for the most part he has been hampered by a high number of injuries and injuires to key personal on this team. How did he do when everyone was healthy?

[Jaric]

Just wondering Whst is our record in the last 25 games

Since we tanked the Jets game I'm pretty sure it's well under .500

[dn4192]

Just wondering Whst is our record in the last 25 games

10 regular season wins

13 regular seasons losses

1 post season loss.

His overall record while colts coach

24 regular season wins

2 wins in the post season

15 regular season losses

2 post season losses

so overall under Jim Caldwell is 26-17, which is a winning record by anyone standards.

[Case]

I have also noticed that during those games for the most part he has been hampered by a high number of injuries and injuires to key personal on this team. How did he do when everyone was healthy?

We were a perfect 127 out of 127 games and all was well in Indy and everything polian touched turned to gold

[chad72]

Things that need to change on offense - prolonged drives by Painter to protect the defense and/or to keep them rested. 2 scoring drives and several 3 and outs is not going to help. He was doing fine on the turnover aspect till he faced a team that rushed 5 or more consistently, he needs to adjust to that and Clyde needs to expect teams to do that and have plays ready for the same.

Things that need to change on D - if your young first and second year starters do not understand their zones well, then just go man coverage with as many capable ones as possible, change the LB corp with Moten and/or Sims consistently who are better with pass coverage, IMO, and send blitzes from the edge rotating coverage to the direction of the blitzer. Maybe play 5 man fronts, do something different that will make our opponents' O think more instead of hoping they will do better at the things they could not do right in the previous 7 games.

Edited October 26, 2011 by chad72

[dn4192]

Lets Compare...

Jim Caldwell first 2 seasons

24 regular season wins

2 wins in the post season

8 regular season losses

2 post season losses

3rd season 0-7 so far

Coach X who most consider DA Man

16 wins regular season

3 post season wins

16 regular season losses

0 post seasons losses...

3rd season 9-7 no playoff appearance...

[Case]

I have also noticed that during those games for the most part he has been hampered by a high number of injuries and injuires to key personal on this team. How did he do when everyone was healthy?

Having injuries doesn't mean we should lose games and especially every game in one season. The packers had the most players on IR last year not just any players we are talking key players. Guess what their coach got them to the super bowl. It doesn't end there. In the super bowl they lost shields driver and their defensive captain woodsen to injuries and they still won the super bowl. Injuries are apart of football and great teams can keep it going after injuries. Steelers won 3 out of 4 without ben and patriots won 11 games without Brady. Why were they able to win with injuries?

[Daniel Bogh]

Exactly. So says Daniel, so it is.....

C'mon now, I won't claim it's gospel or fact. I know my opinions are opinions like everyone else's, but I do have experiences to draw on ;-)

[dn4192]

Having injuries doesn't mean we should lose games and especially every game in one season. The packers had the most players on IR last year not just any players we are talking key players. Guess what their coach got them to the super bowl. It doesn't end there. In the super bowl they lost shields driver and their defensive captain woodsen to injuries and they still won the super bowl. Injuries are apart of football and great teams can keep it going after injuries. Steelers won 3 out of 4 without ben and patriots won 11 games without Brady. Why were they able to win with injuries?

Did the Pack lose Aaron Rogers? Well they did for 1 game I believe and how did they do? Pitts won because their team wasn't centered around their QB, he was a piece of the puzzle but not the main piece. NE got lucky and had a pretty decent backup QB we don't.

[dn4192]

Having injuries doesn't mean we should lose games and especially every game in one season. The packers had the most players on IR last year not just any players we are talking key players. Guess what their coach got them to the super bowl. It doesn't end there. In the super bowl they lost shields driver and their defensive captain woodsen to injuries and they still won the super bowl. Injuries are apart of football and great teams can keep it going after injuries. Steelers won 3 out of 4 without ben and patriots won 11 games without Brady. Why were they able to win with injuries?

Well the Packers went 10-6 I believe and got into the playoffs due to a fluke...

[Case]

Well the Packers went 10-6 I believe and got into the playoffs due to a fluke...

they won the super bowl. With key players on IR. Let me explain it a little easier. You said it yourself Pitt won because their team wasn't centered around 1 player. Should any team depend so much on one player like we do. Get over it man injuries aren't an excuse. But I'm sure you will continue to propose the same argument u have 137 times since Sunday.

[dn4192]

they won the super bowl. With key players on IR. Let me explain it a little easier. You said it yourself Pitt won because their team wasn't centered around 1 player. Should any team depend so much on one player like we do. Get over it man injuries aren't an excuse. But I'm sure you will continue to propose the same argument u have 137 times since Sunday.

If you don't believe injuries have an impact on a teams ability to win, especially when the loss is to the lone KEY person that your whole team is built around doesn't matter, then good for you...everyone should be able to believe in what they want weather it is based in fact or fiction....

[The Peytonator]

I hate it when people say that we have so much money tied up in key players. How do you think any other team is built. You pay good money for your proven guys, let the ones walk that think they're better than what you're offering, and you fill your other spots with valuable cheaper players. It's not too difficult a concept. Also this notion that the offense makes way more than the defense is false.

Highly payed O players:

Manning

Wayne

Clark

Highly payed D players

Brackett

Bethea

Mathis

Freeney

You could add Saturday and Addai to the O list but they really don't hurt much cap wise. Also don't forget Hayden's ridiculous contract and Bob 'The Glass Man' Sanders.

[dn4192]

I hate it when people say that we have so much money tied up in key players. How do you think any other team is built. You pay good money for your proven guys, let the ones walk that think they're better than what you're offering, and you fill your other spots with valuable cheaper players. It's not too difficult a concept. Also this notion that the offense makes way more than the defense is false.

Highly payed O players:

Manning

Wayne

Clark

Highly payed D players

Brackett

Bethea

Mathis

Freeney

You could add Saturday and Addai to the O list but they really don't hurt much cap wise. Also don't forget Hayden's ridiculous contract and Bob 'The Glass Man' Sanders.

It would be intersting to see a break down of say how the dollars are divided up for the Colts, Pats, Steelers, Cowboys, Eagles and such. I don't have any data but I have a feeling the Colts have more money tied up in fewer "greats" over the othes.

[KyFan18]

Lets Compare...

Jim Caldwell first 2 seasons

24 regular season wins

2 wins in the post season

8 regular season losses

2 post season losses

3rd season 0-7 so far

Coach X who most consider DA Man

16 wins regular season

3 post season wins

16 regular season losses

0 post seasons losses...

3rd season 9-7 no playoff appearance...

Coach X coached his team to a Super Bowl victory. Caldwell coached his team out of one. Also, Coach X took over for a team that was not good and had just fired its coach. Caldwell took over a perennial contender. Also, I don't know why you don't just put Belichick instead of "Coach X."

Edited October 26, 2011 by KyFan18

[BIGugly]

C'mon now, I won't claim it's gospel or fact. I know my opinions are opinions like everyone else's, but I do have experiences to draw on ;-)

Wasn't being fascetious. What you said is exactly the case. Coaching Counts ! ! !