Giants Fire Ben McAdoo

[2006Coltsbestever]

7 minutes ago, Jules said:

I could never stand this guy, he always looked kinda sleazy too......

His slick back hair wasn't cutting it I agree. Ben McAdont has hit the bricks.

[mikey287]

Ben McAdieu*

[Gramz]

8 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

His slick back hair wasn't cutting it I agree. Ben McAdont has hit the bricks.

 

8 hours ago, mikey287 said:

Ben McAdieu*

   Cute.

[B~Town]

17 hours ago, IinD said:

Good move by them, they know the season is obviously over. 

 

Wish we'd do the same honestly. Only 2 home games left, not like Jim will lose much money at this point. I'd fire Chuck and tell the interim guy to give young guys extended play time.

 

It really doesn't matter anymore. Season is in the final 25% phase.

Isray said mid season firings scare off future coaches knowing they may not be able to finish what they started . The chances Chuck gets fired before seasons end and slim to none .

[Gramz]

3 minutes ago, B~Town said:

Isray said mid season firings scare off future coaches knowing they may not be able to finish what they started . The chances Chuck gets fired before seasons end and slim to none .

Or it could send the message:   Do Your Job....and you can keep your job.  

 

It's time.

[Myles]

17 hours ago, dgambill said:

 Once they decided they were giving up on Eli than clearly they gave up on the season. .

 

Eli gave them the best chance to win and that is unquestioned. ..

 

they are tanking...and its obvious.

How can you not see how wrong you are?

They were 2-9, that is time to give up on the season.   They were already eliminated from the playoffs.

 

Eli was 2-9.   Not really your best chance of winning. 

 

Trying something new in order to win is tanking?

[oldunclemark]

Trying Geno is tanking

[IinD]

3 hours ago, B~Town said:

Isray said mid season firings scare off future coaches knowing they may not be able to finish what they started . The chances Chuck gets fired before seasons end and slim to none .

Oh yeah I'm definitely aware Jim has never fired a HC in season, I'm just making conversation.

 

I don't think it would affect the team only because they've given Chuck a fair amount of time (years).

 

Giants canned their HC a year after 10+ wins. Granted there are other circumstances there, but with only a few games left, I don't think it's a case of being a bad, short tempered owner.

 

I think from the outside and inside, it looks like Chuck is out of bullets and he's simply surviving right now.

 

I don't think pulling the plug is mean or anything at this point. The Colts aren't even relevant right now in the nfl scheme.

[HarryTheCat]

I'm kinda encouraged. I kept scrolling through, looking for the first "OMG! I want him! Should the Colts take a look at him?" post...and it wasn't here! 

 

[dgambill]

8 hours ago, Myles said:

How can you not see how wrong you are?

They were 2-9, that is time to give up on the season.   They were already eliminated from the playoffs.

 

Eli was 2-9.   Not really your best chance of winning. 

 

Trying something new in order to win is tanking?

The reason they were 2-9 wasn't because of the qb play. Eli gives them the best chance to win and if you disagree than that's fine that is your right...I won't say your wrong...I just believe I'm right. He is a better leader on the field, in the huddle, and making decisions, and in talent....by a wide margin. I'm not saying he hasn't struggled but that is more a result of his 3 starting WRs being injured, his OL being the worst in the NFL, and having no run game. Add to that a disappointing defensive performance this year and he was having to play catch up with a team and OC/HC that isn't good enough to do that with. If you think they were just trying something new or wanted to know what Geno is capable of then that's fine....I do not believe that...I believe the administration wanted to prepare for next year...and losing ball games would give them the best chance to do that by ensuring a high pick and a replacement for Eli.

[mikey287]

Just skimmed these last few...if the idea is that Geno Smith gives a team...any team...a better chance to win than Eli Manning there is one other person in the history of civilization that thought that once and he was fired less than 24 hours after thinking it and the guy that agreed with him was too despite being in the organization for 24 years...it's not a good thought and it is objectively wrong to think that.

[buccolts]

4 hours ago, HarryTheCat said:

I'm kinda encouraged. I kept scrolling through, looking for the first "OMG! I want him! Should the Colts take a look at him?" post...and it wasn't here! 

 

 

But, but, if Chuck really is the worst coach of all time, this could be nothing but a step up, right?

We don't have a SB winning QB to bench, so that's not in play.

Funny how dream coaches drop in your lap sometimes.

[NFLfan]

On 12/4/2017 at 1:06 PM, dgambill said:

Yeah.....I guess...to me that seems like a ruse....its pretty clear from their statements that they are not moving forward with Eli next year (even though they back tracked on that some) and Geno is what Geno is...there is plenty of tape on the guy...really what they are doing is tanking in the disguise of evaluating young talent. They want to ensure they keep as high a pick as possible in the draft...and are one step closer to the #2 pick. As things go I think the Giants are pretty much assuring themselves they get 1 of the 2 big name qbs that are in the coming draft.

 

So, why do you think they are going back to Eli now?

 

My friend is a long time Giants season ticket holder. He has attended 4 of the Giants 5 Super Bowl appearances. We attended this year's Chiefs game together. He loves Eli but he wants to see Davis Webb start. He wants to see what they have in Webb to determine whether they should draft a QB next year. I was surprised that it was Geno who started last week and not Webb. 

 

With a new GM coming in, I see the Giants drafting a QB. 

[Myles]

16 hours ago, dgambill said:

The reason they were 2-9 wasn't because of the qb play. Eli gives them the best chance to win and if you disagree than that's fine that is your right...I won't say your wrong...I just believe I'm right. He is a better leader on the field, in the huddle, and making decisions, and in talent....by a wide margin. I'm not saying he hasn't struggled but that is more a result of his 3 starting WRs being injured, his OL being the worst in the NFL, and having no run game. Add to that a disappointing defensive performance this year and he was having to play catch up with a team and OC/HC that isn't good enough to do that with. If you think they were just trying something new or wanted to know what Geno is capable of then that's fine....I do not believe that...I believe the administration wanted to prepare for next year...and losing ball games would give them the best chance to do that by ensuring a high pick and a replacement for Eli.

 

That theory falls apart because we are back to Eli starting. 

I think the McAdoo wanted to try something different.   Yes the team is bad, but without doing something different the 2-9 pace would continue.  I can't fault him for that even if it hurt Eli's feelings.   Webb wasn't ready yet.  Geno played pretty well, except for his 2 fumbles.  They lost by 7, so it is easy to say his idea was a failure, but they averaged losing by over 12 points in the other losses.   Geno is not a good QB, but to stay with the 2-9 method would be insane.  

[crazycolt1]

29 minutes ago, Myles said:

 

That theory falls apart because we are back to Eli starting. 

I think the McAdoo wanted to try something different.   Yes the team is bad, but without doing something different the 2-9 pace would continue.  I can't fault him for that even if it hurt Eli's feelings.   Webb wasn't ready yet.  Geno played pretty well, except for his 2 fumbles.  They lost by 7, so it is easy to say his idea was a failure, but they averaged losing by over 12 points in the other losses.   Geno is not a good QB, but to stay with the 2-9 method would be insane.  

Devil's advocate-  Had Luck been healthy and the Colts still had a losing season how do you think benching him would have went over?

IMO Eli has earned the right to be the starter no matter what the Giants record is. (as long as he is healthy)

[mikey287]

So, Eli Manning gets blamed for the 2-9 start...not the coach that has done nothing in his life? No matter how you slice it, Geno Smith is an indefensible move. The kid from Cal or where ever, that I can at least buy because you're trying to figure out whether you need to draft anyone in four months...Geno Smith doesn't belong in the league. You sat Eli Manning for him - effectively blaming Eli for the 2-9 record. Even though he was 11-5 last year and had a winning record for his career...

 

Geno Smith, loser extraordinaire, 12-19 in his career. 29 passing TDs to 36 Ints (+19 fumbles)...just not smart. 

[dgambill]

12 hours ago, NFLfan said:

 

So, why do you think they are going back to Eli now?

 

My friend is a long time Giants season ticket holder. He has attended 4 of the Giants 5 Super Bowl appearances. We attended this year's Chiefs game together. He loves Eli but he wants to see Davis Webb start. He wants to see what they have in Webb to determine whether they should draft a QB next year. I was surprised that it was Geno who started last week and not Webb. 

 

With a new GM coming in, I see the Giants drafting a QB. 

Because of the backlash...plain and simple. They are taking a beating in the public arena and they are caving. It was horribly mishandled. Honestly I don't need to see Geno Smith to know he is not the answer to any qb quandary. If they want to start Webb to access him then fine. I don't think he is ready and there is not much you would gain from live action this year to know he would be your qb going forward. That's the thing. Webb isn't ready...and won't be ready this year. Throwing him in won't do much for evaluating him and there is nothing left to evaluate on Geno. It was a ruse...maybe I'm wrong but nothing will change that for me. At this point they should just commit to it though. I think the only reason it is happening that they are going back to Eli is what if the new GM and HC wants Eli to stay next year and they groom his replacement?? He has an affordable contract.....maybe they are trying to mend fences....Peyton spent a lot of time with his backups in Denver. Perhaps Eli would be willing to finish out his career and tudor a young qb because staying in NY might meant that much to him. I don't think they talked this out with him at all...and it was all horribly mismanaged. Its a mess now...nothing they do makes any sense to me...but I think they were doing everything possible to throw the rest of the season when they benched him...and that's my take.

[dgambill]

1 hour ago, Myles said:

 

That theory falls apart because we are back to Eli starting. 

I think the McAdoo wanted to try something different.   Yes the team is bad, but without doing something different the 2-9 pace would continue.  I can't fault him for that even if it hurt Eli's feelings.   Webb wasn't ready yet.  Geno played pretty well, except for his 2 fumbles.  They lost by 7, so it is easy to say his idea was a failure, but they averaged losing by over 12 points in the other losses.   Geno is not a good QB, but to stay with the 2-9 method would be insane.  

If you think any of this was McAdoo's idea to try to win games then we are on very very different pages. No way humanly possible did he make that decision on his own or under the guise that it was to WIN games. Was it done to evaluate the other qbs on the roster.....possibly...unlikely but possible....was it done to give the team the best chance to win on Sunday....heck no. That's my take...we obviously think differently but that's where we are. They went back because it made the Mara's look like @ssclowns. The Giants looked awful in the media, with other players in the league who someday might have to decide between the Giants and another team in free agency and remember how they treated Eli, and with the fans. It was not handled properly and they are trying to backtrack...its no longer about on the field issues...now its about the franchise optics.

 

Oh and just because you stay with the best qb on your roster doesn't mean your insane! Doing the same gameplan over and over and running the same offense without 3 of your best wrs out and after watching an OL that can't keep anyone in front of them would be insane. So we are 3-9...why are we playing Brissett....we should go back to Tolzien...its insane to keep starting Brissett on this horrible team...we should try something different. Sometimes a team is so bad no matter what you do the result is they are going to lose if they don't give the qb more help. Just look at Denver...tried all 3 qbs and it hasn't changed a thing. Maybe the problem isn't the qb. I'm going to give a HOF qb the benefit of the doubt here...maybe the Giants losing isn't all Eli's fault. Maybe the team around him is just bad.

 

In the end none of this is to say that I think them not trying to win every game left is bad. Its ok to evaluate your players...but they are not trying their hardest to win....they are prioritizing other things over that....that's fine that's their decision...I want us to play our young guys too...but lets just be honest about what we are doing.

[Myles]

4 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

Devil's advocate-  Had Luck been healthy and the Colts still had a losing season how do you think benching him would have went over?

IMO Eli has earned the right to be the starter no matter what the Giants record is. (as long as he is healthy)

Good question, but there are some major differences.   Luck is locked up for the future.  Eli probably won't be a Giant next year.  

 

I've never bought into a player "earning" the right to play at the detriment of the team.

[Myles]

2 hours ago, dgambill said:

 

 

Oh and just because you stay with the best qb on your roster doesn't mean your insane! Doing the same gameplan over and over and running the same offense without 3 of your best wrs out and after watching an OL that can't keep anyone in front of them would be insane. So we are 3-9...why are we playing Brissett....we should go back to Tolzien...its insane to keep starting Brissett on this horrible team...we should try something different.

 

 

The better analogy would have been if we stuck with Tolzien even though we kept losing.   

 

[crazycolt1]

1 minute ago, Myles said:

Good question, but there are some major differences.   Luck is locked up for the future.  Eli probably won't be a Giant next year.  

 

I've never bought into a player "earning" the right to play at the detriment of the team.

Good point but Eli hasn't been the one detriment to the Giants. He has no running game or receivers.

[Myles]

2 hours ago, dgambill said:

If you think any of this was McAdoo's idea to try to win games then we are on very very different pages.

 

I guess we are.   He was a desperate man and took a chance.   Didn't work for him, but I can't blame him.   They needed a shake up.   He should have went with Webb, but it was his choice.  

 

Heck, I see Colts fans saying we need to bench Gore and play Mack more so we can see what we have in him.   I also think that is a good idea because we probably won't have Gore next season so getting Mack some reps is good.   

[Myles]

4 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Good point but Eli hasn't been the one detriment to the Giants. He has no running game or receivers.

I agree.  However trying a different QB is the biggest shake up an NFL team can do.   The Giants needed to do something.   Unfortunately for the coach, it didn't work.   

[crazycolt1]

3 minutes ago, Myles said:

I agree.  However trying a different QB is the biggest shake up an NFL team can do.   The Giants needed to do something.   Unfortunately for the coach, it didn't work.   

I do agree with him needing to shake things up and he should have started Webb. I have no clue if the owner or the new GM will think Webb is their future QB after Eli.

[Myles]

8 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

I do agree with him needing to shake things up and he should have started Webb. I have no clue if the owner or the new GM will think Webb is their future QB after Eli.

I think will be doing the team a disservice if they do not start Webb in a couple games yet this year.  

[crazycolt1]

14 minutes ago, Myles said:

I think will be doing the team a disservice if they do not start Webb in a couple games yet this year.  

That may be true. They need to look at him just to see if they need to draft the QB to replace Eli went that time comes.

[NFLfan]

21 hours ago, dgambill said:

Because of the backlash...plain and simple. They are taking a beating in the public arena and they are caving. It was horribly mishandled. Honestly I don't need to see Geno Smith to know he is not the answer to any qb quandary. If they want to start Webb to access him then fine. I don't think he is ready and there is not much you would gain from live action this year to know he would be your qb going forward. That's the thing. Webb isn't ready...and won't be ready this year. Throwing him in won't do much for evaluating him and there is nothing left to evaluate on Geno. It was a ruse...maybe I'm wrong but nothing will change that for me. At this point they should just commit to it though. I think the only reason it is happening that they are going back to Eli is what if the new GM and HC wants Eli to stay next year and they groom his replacement?? He has an affordable contract.....maybe they are trying to mend fences....Peyton spent a lot of time with his backups in Denver. Perhaps Eli would be willing to finish out his career and tudor a young qb because staying in NY might meant that much to him. I don't think they talked this out with him at all...and it was all horribly mismanaged. Its a mess now...nothing they do makes any sense to me...but I think they were doing everything possible to throw the rest of the season when they benched him...and that's my take.

 

20 hours ago, dgambill said:

If you think any of this was McAdoo's idea to try to win games then we are on very very different pages. No way humanly possible did he make that decision on his own or under the guise that it was to WIN games. Was it done to evaluate the other qbs on the roster.....possibly...unlikely but possible....was it done to give the team the best chance to win on Sunday....heck no. That's my take...we obviously think differently but that's where we are. They went back because it made the Mara's look like @ssclowns. The Giants looked awful in the media, with other players in the league who someday might have to decide between the Giants and another team in free agency and remember how they treated Eli, and with the fans. It was not handled properly and they are trying to backtrack...its no longer about on the field issues...now its about the franchise optics.

 

Oh and just because you stay with the best qb on your roster doesn't mean your insane! Doing the same gameplan over and over and running the same offense without 3 of your best wrs out and after watching an OL that can't keep anyone in front of them would be insane. So we are 3-9...why are we playing Brissett....we should go back to Tolzien...its insane to keep starting Brissett on this horrible team...we should try something different. Sometimes a team is so bad no matter what you do the result is they are going to lose if they don't give the qb more help. Just look at Denver...tried all 3 qbs and it hasn't changed a thing. Maybe the problem isn't the qb. I'm going to give a HOF qb the benefit of the doubt here...maybe the Giants losing isn't all Eli's fault. Maybe the team around him is just bad.

 

In the end none of this is to say that I think them not trying to win every game left is bad. Its ok to evaluate your players...but they are not trying their hardest to win....they are prioritizing other things over that....that's fine that's their decision...I want us to play our young guys too...but lets just be honest about what we are doing.

 

You seem so angry. Why is this so upsetting to you? Serious question.

 

I agree with you about Geno. Nowhere did I say he should start. I wrote that my friend and other Giants fans would like to see Davis Webb play to determine if the team should draft a QB early in the 2018 draft.

 

Eli's benching came as a surprise. I agree with you that it was mismanaged and the whole thing blew in their faces. Usually that is not something that happens to the Giants organization. They have now gone back to Eli.

[shakedownstreet]

Turns out benching Eli was McAdoo about nothing

[dgambill]

23 hours ago, NFLfan said:

 

 

You seem so angry. Why is this so upsetting to you? Serious question.

 

I agree with you about Geno. Nowhere did I say he should start. I wrote that my friend and other Giants fans would like to see Davis Webb play to determine if the team should draft a QB early in the 2018 draft.

 

Eli's benching came as a surprise. I agree with you that it was mismanaged and the whole thing blew in their faces. Usually that is not something that happens to the Giants organization. They have now gone back to Eli.

I didn't mean to come across angry. I know its a sport and in the end everyone gets cut, retires, or loses their job. I don't like how a guy has poured his heart and soul into an organization. Played hurt, been a leader, done everything you've asked him to do, won you two championships and then the team hits adversity and they dump him midseason to "evaluate talent". They obviously didn't sit down and discuss this very well with him. They didn't share their plan for the future and what they would like to see happen. It was demeaning and as someone that appreciates when a guy gives everything he has to a company and they threat him just like a number...that's pretty low. I also think Eli is far and away the best qb on that roster and the best option to win this year and some where acting like he wasn't. This all could have been handled at season end and the Mara's, new GM, coach could have worked out a respectable exit strategy for the face of the franchise. The end happens for everyone but I think he has earned enough respect to finish out his season with his team. They aren't benching the starting LT are they? How about the whole offensive line to see what the backups are capable of? Benching the one actual decent player they have and people are paying to come see so in my mind they can move up a couple of draft positions seemed beneath the organization. I know they say it was evaluation but I still believe those players can and have been evaluated already and playing Webb at the end of the season with no wrs, a horrible ol, and a team that has quit on the Giants....you want to try to evaluate a rookie being thrown into that?? Good luck! The kid is being set up to fail. Start off the next season and evaluate him with a full compliment of players..you're not going to learn anything from these last 4 games on a kid being put in the worst scenario possible. Guess that's my take...and that's why I think they know that too...and its a sham to cover what their real intention is.

[dgambill]

On ‎12‎/‎6‎/‎2017 at 12:53 PM, Myles said:

The better analogy would have been if we stuck with Tolzien even though we kept losing.   

 

What's the difference...we keep losing with Brissett. Should I say we should call up Phillip Walker then to see if that shakes things up? All I'm saying is keeping the same qb when the qb isn't the problem isn't insane on a bad team. There are way worse problems on the Giants roster that a qb switch will not help. When the Chargers started off 0-4 should they have benched Rivers and changed it up? Teams have down years...benching Eli was not going to make the Giants better....even if they win a game with him benched it wouldn't have made them better. They need to fix a whole lot of issues if they want to win games.

[JCPatriot]

On ‎12‎/‎4‎/‎2017 at 8:46 AM, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I just hope we hire a Coach with a solid resume when Chuck does get his walking papers.

 

I hear Ben McAdoo is available.  He might even be able to entice Geno Smith to come with him.

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, JCPatriot said:

 

I hear Ben McAdoo is available.  He might even be able to entice Geno Smith to come with him.

What a nightmare that would be  

[dgambill]

14 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

What a nightmare that would be  

Indeed....for those Chuck haters out there...there are worse options. Just because we get rid of him doesn't mean it will get better. I do think its time to make a move in another direction...but I am under no certainty a new coach will be any better than the last.

[JCPatriot]

On Friday, December 8, 2017 at 1:04 PM, dgambill said:

Indeed....for those Chuck haters out there...there are worse options.

 

Of course there are, and the number of worse options outnumbers the number of better options by far.  That is not a reason to not try to get a better option, though.  Lets say that Luck can't come back and his career is over.  In terms of starting QBs, there are worse options than Brissett.  That doesn't mean that we shouldn't try to find somebody better than Brissett, though.