the mvp race

[Dustin]

And Jim defended why he picked Brady pretty articulately. I don't agree with him but he had his reasons. He was not trying to sabotage a unanimous vote given he did not know how the other 49 were going to vote.

 

The one vote from Favre in 2007 was a writer from GB, right?

 

He should have his ability to vote for MVP taken away. 

[Superman]

It wasn't a New England writer. It was Jim Miller, who now does Sirius radio and I believe the pre/post game shows for the Bears. Miller was a backup here for one season. He's a Chicago guy, not a Boston writer.

Same thing happened in 2007, by the way. One guy voted for Favre.

It's not a big deal.

Manning was one vote shy in 2004. That's not really the point.

[GoPats]

Manning was one vote shy in 2004. That's not really the point.

Actually, given the way Shane framed it, that's very much the point. I didn't agree with Miller's vote but he has absolutely nothing to do with the New England media. Biased as a former teammate? Probably. But not one of "us."

[GoPats]

And Jim defended why he picked Brady pretty articulately. I don't agree with him but he had his reasons. He was not trying to sabotage a unanimous vote given he did not know how the other 49 were going to vote.

The one vote from Favre in 2007 was a writer from GB, right?

Yeah, GB guy, can't recall the name.

[GoPats]

Yes, I agree 100% with what I bolded in your reply GP. However, I still say your most lethal offensive weapon is WR Julian Edelman because he's small, catches everything like velco, is easy to lose in DB traffic, & he's a stud on special teams. Gronk doesn't scare me, but Edelman gives me down & distance nightmares man. He's like death by a thousand paper cuts.

Sorry to go off script there buddy. Even as a kid, I often colored outside the lines & I still do apparently. LOL!

Edeltron is a key guy for sure! ...

[GoPats]

He should have his ability to vote for MVP taken away.

Even as a Pats fan...

How many records would a guy need to break? It was a ridiculously contrarian vote in a season where there's never been a clearer choice.

[Superman]

Actually, given the way Shane framed it, that's very much the point. I didn't agree with Miller's vote but he has absolutely nothing to do with the New England media. Biased as a former teammate? Probably. But not one of "us."

Okay. Maybe Shane's point. It wasn't my point, though. My point is that a biased voter took a dump on the entire process, and doesn't deserve to have a vote.

And again, I don't care about unanimous MVP. The trophy is the same size. People hardly remember that Manning shared the 2003 MVP with Steve McNair.

[southwest1]

Edeltron is a key guy for sure! ...

That nickname does have a nice ring to it GP. I like it better than that Motown Motor City WR in Michigan named Calvin something...This dude right? Yeah, that's what I thought you meant. 

 

[Dark Superman]

I'm actually all for Watt winning MVP..

[amfootball]

He should have his ability to vote for MVP taken away. 

I don't disagree so shouldn't the guy from GB who voted for Favre in 2007.

[amfootball]

Okay. Maybe Shane's point. It wasn't my point, though. My point is that a biased voter took a dump on the entire process, and doesn't deserve to have a vote.

And again, I don't care about unanimous MVP. The trophy is the same size. People hardly remember that Manning shared the 2003 MVP with Steve McNair.

Speaking of imperfect voting, lots of discussion this week here on the baseball HoF. How some of those people get to vote every year with the choices they make and the reasons they state for making them is stunning to me.

[MJD42]

And Jim defended why he picked Brady pretty articulately. I don't agree with him but he had his reasons. He was not trying to sabotage a unanimous vote given he did not know how the other 49 were going to vote.

 

The one vote from Favre in 2007 was a writer from GB, right?

Miller felt Brady was more valuable to his team than Manning. He said Manning was offensive player of the year but not more valuable than Brady to his team. Hard to not see his point if we are talking about a player's value to his team vs the guy who puts up the most stats/records. I am not defending his selection but his reasoning based on the definition of the award has merit.

[amfootball]

Miller felt Brady was more valuable to his team than Manning. He said Manning was offensive player of the year but not more valuable than Brady to his team. Hard to not see his point if we are talking about a player's value to his team vs the guy who puts up the most stats/records. I am not defending his selection but his reasoning based on the definition of the award has merit.

Sure, kind of like the discussion we are having here about this year. The MVP is generally awarded to the player who puts up the most stats and not necessarily the guy who is most valuable to his team. If we are to do it based on that then it would be hard not to have Watt and DeMarco Murray as 1 and 2. IMO they have the most value to their teams.

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

Sure, kind of like the discussion we are having here about this year. The MVP is generally awarded to the player who puts up the most stats and not necessarily the guy who is most valuable to his team. If we are to do it based on that then it would be hard not to have Watt and DeMarco Murray as 1 and 2. IMO they have the most value to their teams.

 

MVP Murray 

[weslo1812]

Thing is, if your team isn't winning many games, are you really carrying them?

There's no question that Watt is the best defensive player in the league, and without him, the Texans would be worse. But it doesn't get much worse than 2-14, and they're below .500 this year. This is the reason why defenders and RBs and WRs don't MVP, because they don't carry teams. Even great players at those positions. When they do, like AP in 2012, then they get MVP.

The player's value to the team should be clearly demonstrated in the win/loss column. They don't have to be the best team, but they shouldn't be below .500. If the player really is the most valuable in the league, he'd help his team win more games. Not every game, not even necessarily a playoff berth, but not bottom ten, either.

They are 7-6 and now. May very well get 9-10 wins with very avg QB play.Texans are not doing that bad at all. They have been right there in basically every game. And WATT is is playing very well. I really wouldn't be supprised if they win out and take the division tbh. And right now the Colts are real good at being consistently inconsistent.

[King Colt]

RGIII hands down!

-RGIII's mother

[rsrobinson]

JJ Watt may be the best player in the game but that doesn't necessarily make him the most valuable player. The Texans' defensive unit is very average overall. If they were an '85 Bears type of dominating defense with Watt leading the way he would have a much better shot at winning it, but they aren't.

I think Rodgers will win it if he closes the season out strong.

[Superman]

They are 7-6 and now. May very well get 9-10 wins with very avg QB play.Texans are not doing that bad at all. They have been right there in basically every game. And WATT is is playing very well. I really wouldn't be supprised if they win out and take the division tbh. And right now the Colts are real good at being consistently inconsistent.

People vote how they want to vote. I'm mostly fine with that. And I think Watt will get some votes. I don't think he's the MVP, though.

[PickFor6]

Well I think Manning has basically eliminated himself from this conversation at this point with some average to poor performances over the last several weeks

The Broncos are winning despite him, not because of him

Luck has continued to make some bad decisions and certainly hasn't made up any ground.

Rodgers is still the clear cut favorite, with Brady in second and then take your pick between Watt, Murray

[amfootball]

Brady may have edged ahead of Rodgers with his poor performance vs the Bills - 17 for 42, under 200 yards passing, 2 picks, no TDs.

[Moose Of Woe]

Brady may have edged ahead of Rodgers with his poor performance vs the Bills - 17 for 42, under 200 yards passing, 2 picks, no TDs.

One bad game. Rodgers has had a better overall season while on a much less impressive team than NE. Including a performance where he played lights out in a victory over NE.

 

A for effort, but Rodgers is the MVP and aside from Watt there is nothing to discuss.

[John Dee]

Brady?   Luck just did...       Look at what every one has around them...   

 

AL is hands down the ONLY choice at this point.        yes only one all you Russel Wilson fan boys.

Brady may have edged ahead of Rodgers with his poor performance vs the Bills - 17 for 42, under 200 yards passing, 2 picks, no TDs.

[John Dee]

Maybe Peyton ....   again..  >>>  ???? ;)

[amfootball]

One bad game. Rodgers has had a better overall season while on a much less impressive team than NE. Including a performance where he played lights out in a victory over NE.

 

A for effort, but Rodgers is the MVP and aside from Watt there is nothing to discuss.

Brady has a better record and has had more impressive wins vs better opponents than Rodgers. I think it will be close. GB could lose another one to Detroit.

[Moose Of Woe]

Brady has a better record and has had more impressive wins vs better opponents than Rodgers. I think it will be close. GB could lose another one to Detroit.

Rodgers helped GB beat the best team in the league by a mile. NE.

 

Take Rodgahs off GB and Brady off NE. Replace both QB's with mediocre ones. (Not GENO SMITH bad, just mediocre.)  I see GB in serious trouble and NE  being the second best overall team next to Seattle.

 

Kinda like Arizona...only they have a better D than NE at the expense of a BAD QB.

[amfootball]

Brady?   Luck just did...       Look at what every one has around them...   

 

AL is hands down the ONLY choice at this point.        yes only one all you Russel Wilson fan boys.

Pick six today which makes 20 turnovers this season? He is not a serious candidate for MVP on anyone's list outside of Indiana.

[amfootball]

Rodgers helped GB beat the best team in the league by a mile. NE.

MVP is for the entire season though and NE has had a MUCH tougher schedule and several blow out wins vs that schedule.

[Moose Of Woe]

Luck is not the MVP with those turnovers, guys, just stop. It's Rodgers and Watt.

 

Luck is a good QB, but he's not great. Yet. Not in the same breath as Rodgers. He's close to a well past his due date Peyton, but I'd still take Peyton over him even with the noodle along with Brady.

[Moose Of Woe]

MVP is for the entire season though and NE has had a MUCH tougher schedule and several blow out wins vs that schedule.

NE has beat a more impressive array of teams, yes. NE is, overall, a ridiculously loaded team.

 

Rodgers (or Watt) are the best individual players in the game. Gronk is third, though TE isn't as critical a position as QB so you could argue Brady is more valuable than he is. Still, Gronk will probably go down as the best TE to ever play if he stays healthy.

[John Dee]

I really hope in one of the other parallel dimensions we are all living in AL goes down and all us living in the "other" plane understand just how much he really does matter.     

 

This team could not win 4 games without him.  

[MJD42]

I really hope in one of the other parallel dimensions we are all living in AL goes down and all us living in the "other" plane understand just how much he really does matter.     

 

This team could not win 4 games without him.  

So it was Luck that held the Texans to 10 points today? Oh wait he gave them 7 of those 10 ...

[Moose Of Woe]

I really hope in one of the other parallel dimensions we are all living in AL goes down and all us living in the "other" plane understand just how much he really does matter.     

 

This team could not win 4 games without him.  

With him at QB, we always have a shot late in the game while trailing.

 

Often times, the reason we're trailing in the first place is due to poor throws/decision making on his part. He is not a great QB. He's good enough that he always gives us a chance to win, but he also shoots us in the foot.

[John Dee]

No it was the same D that has held Fitz, Heeee, Bortles, Whitehurst, ELI M, McCoy and another second stringer or two..  to not much.    But ALSO the same D that got THRASHED by Foles, The REAL Manning, Rothelisberger, and ....   Tommy B.

 

Just saying...

So it was Luck that held the Texans to 10 points today? Oh wait he gave them 7 of those 10 ...

[John Dee]

I wonder if Bill B would shove Trent R, hurt Reggie W, and slow butt H Nicks down Brady's throat?    And all the while put up with some of the worst interior line play in the NFL at times?

 

I bet not...

 

With him at QB, we always have a shot late in the game while trailing.

 

Often times, the reason we're trailing in the first place is due to poor throws/decision making on his part. He is not a great QB. He's good enough that he always gives us a chance to win, but he also shoots us in the foot.

[Moose Of Woe]

Mind you I'm not saying Luck can't improve and BECOME a great QB, but he is simply not there yet. Close to CURRENT/old Peyton with no arm, but not as good as Brady much less Rodgers.

[John Dee]

Bye the way kids all these turnovers AL and the Colts are committing lately...    they are 4-0 during that run...    

[Moose Of Woe]

I wonder if Bill B would shove Trent R, hurt Reggie W, and slow butt H Nicks down Brady's throat?    And all the while put up with some of the worst interior line play in the NFL at times?

 

I bet not...

I never said Luck's line was good. I loathe our O-line. He's able to do a lot with it with no run game or pass protection to (usually) speak of. I said he's a good QB.

[Moose Of Woe]

Bye the way kids all these turnovers AL and the Colts are committing lately...    they are 4-0 during that run...    

And when we play a team that will capitalize on them (namely, ones with good or better QB's) we'll get killed. NE, DEN, PIT, BAL. That's just the AFC.

 

Actually, three of those teams already have though we at least gave DEN a run for their money.

[Fx Stryker]

As of right now no QB deserves it. Brady has been eh at times. Manning has been eh at times. Rodgers has been eh at times.

 

If there was a season a non-QB won MVP it would be this year. JJ Watt deserves it hands down.

[Moose Of Woe]

As of right now no QB deserves it. Brady has been eh at times. Manning has been eh at times. Rodgers has been eh at times.

 

If there was a season a non-QB won MVP it would be this year. JJ Watt deserves it hands down.

Brady, Manning, and Rodgers are all also on teams ranging from great/the best (NE) to good/above average at worst. (GB/DEN) 

 

Watt is on...the Texans. Not among the worst overall teams, but average at best.