Ok, I want to say this, but I don't want to get banned

[Slick_Rick]

How about we put a line in front of the guy? Going on three years and no real improvement in the middle of the line. Donald Thomas looked good in what little he played last year. We can't afford to wait for the guy to get healthy. That hit early in the game could have easily led to an injury.

[1yrdandacloudofdust]

A great Saints team? Saonts will be 10-6 @ best

[Blackhawk4]

So just let me ask this vague question. How can I say someone is overrated without being accused of trolling?

State why you think the someone is overrated and show proof to support your point. Simply saying someone is overrated because you think think they're overrated doesn't cut it. No real point of taking it seriously if someone goes "I think this player is overrated because I said so". If it's something ludicrous then you're likely going to get called a troll or not be taken seriously regardless of what proof you show to support your argument. Just show you actually have a point in your opinion and it might be taken seriously for a decent discussion. 

[Drew1023]

There is a thread on the front page of this message board that has Luck as the #4 best quarterback in the league.  Lots of people obviously think he's one of the best in the league.  I think based on that it's fair to say he is overrated.  No one could legitimately argue that he isn't a good quarterback but the definition of overrated is that people think he is better than he actually is and that seems to be pretty true especially on these forums.  He's a good quarterback but he's not a great quarterback and certainly not a top 5.

[Drew1023]

If you want facts what about a QB rating of 87 last year, 8 interceptions in 3 playoff games, a 23-18 TD-interception ratio.  Yes I know that you can't blame him for all of that and he is playing behind a team with several deficiencies but you can't be considered great and have stats like that.  You can't be considered number 4 in the league with stats like that. Hence he is overrated.  Would he be better if he was playing with a Seahawks team absolutely he would.  Do I think he is better than Russell Wilson, absolutely but do I think that he is one of the best quarterbacks in the league no, of course not and for that reason he is overrated.  It doesn't mean he is a bad quarterback it just means he doesn't quite live up to his hype and what people perceive him as. Seriously, look at this...

 

http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/14874/andrew-luck

 

and tell me if that's representative of a top 5 quarterback and if not than Andrew Luck is overrated.  It shouldn't be a capitol offense to say that Luck is not a top 5 quarterback, to say that he is good but not great and it's sad that is the case and the OP was attacked so viciously.

[Superman]

There is a thread on the front page of this message board that has Luck as the #4 best quarterback in the league.  Lots of people obviously think he's one of the best in the league.  I think based on that it's fair to say he is overrated.  No one could legitimately argue that he isn't a good quarterback but the definition of overrated is that people think he is better than he actually is and that seems to be pretty true especially on these forums.  He's a good quarterback but he's not a great quarterback and certainly not a top 5.

 

That thread is from an article. In that thread, most people disagree with that ranking.

[Superman]

 And D'Qwell Jackson cannot cover Jimmy Graham.

 

That is very, very true. And kind of a simple principle that everyone should accept.

[Drew1023]

That thread is from an article. In that thread, most people disagree with that ranking.

 

Yes but just the fact that it is a discussion should be prove he is overrated.  Could we just agree he is a good quarterback but not a great quarterback, that the truth lies somewhere in between?  I'm aware I'll probably be attacked by both sides for saying or suggesting this.

[Superman]

Yes but just the fact that it is a discussion should be prove he is overrated.  Could we just agree he is a good quarterback but not a great quarterback that the truth lies somewhere in between?  I'm aware I'll probably be attacked by both sides for saying or suggesting this.

 

Why come here preaching about how he's overrated because of a media ranking? Like I said, most people here wouldn't rank him in the top five. It's silly to pin media rankings on this fan base, especially on this site.  (EDIT: As a matter of fact, the first person in that thread to be remotely supportive of that ranking isn't even a Colts fan.)

 

Yet, he is special. He's a really good QB with a high ceiling, who is just entering his third year in the league. It's okay that he's not top five. Yet.

 

And what's really weird is that the posters here, like the OP, rail against everything this team is and does. The coaching sucks, the front office sucks, the roster sucks... Yet the team has won 11 games the past two seasons. Some give all the credit for that to the QB, but now we're talking about how overrated he is? Some people are impossible to please, and then they make weak arguments against straw men.

[Synthetic]

Everyone is entitled to their opinions,, but with all he has done for this team he's definitely not overrated in my opinion (assuming you're referring to Luck). He was a little off tonight I i will give you that.

 

 

Only most people think their opinions are fact, and they don't understand that when someone is making fun of it, it's meant to be taken lightly, as the internet isn't always something you can take seriously.

[Drew1023]

Why come here preaching about how he's overrated because of a media ranking? Like I said, most people here wouldn't rank him in the top five. It's silly to pin media rankings on this fan base, especially on this site. 

 

Yet, he is special. He's a really good QB with a high ceiling, who is just entering his third year in the league. It's okay that he's not top five. Yet.

 

And what's really weird is that the posters here, like the OP, rail against everything this team is and does. The coaching sucks, the front office sucks, the roster sucks... Yet the team has won 11 games the past two seasons. Some give all the credit for that to the QB, but now we're talking about how overrated he is? Some people are impossible to please, and then they make weak arguments against straw men.

 

I thought the argument is whether Andrew Luck is overrated.  The definition of overrated is "to have a higher opinion of (someone or something) than is deserved."  No one said Luck was a horrible quarterback unless I missed something but some fans on here talk like Luck is the next Manning and that just isn't the case. He's a good quarterback that might win a championship if the team gets its act together and assembles a decent team around him.  I don't know what statistic you would use to say whether the board thinks he is overrated maybe you can find one and if you do good job but I'm basing my opinion on the fact that there's a debate going on over whether he is a top 5 quarterback and based on that he is overrated cause he should be nowhere near that debate.

[GoColts8818]

Why come here preaching about how he's overrated because of a media ranking? Like I said, most people here wouldn't rank him in the top five. It's silly to pin media rankings on this fan base, especially on this site.  (EDIT: As a matter of fact, the first person in that thread to be remotely supportive of that ranking isn't even a Colts fan.)

 

Yet, he is special. He's a really good QB with a high ceiling, who is just entering his third year in the league. It's okay that he's not top five. Yet.

 

And what's really weird is that the posters here, like the OP, rail against everything this team is and does. The coaching sucks, the front office sucks, the roster sucks... Yet the team has won 11 games the past two seasons. Some give all the credit for that to the QB, but now we're talking about how overrated he is? Some people are impossible to please, and then they make weak arguments against straw men.

i was going to say for a team that stinks at everything and has nothing but over rated players at every position the Colts sure do win a lot of football games. I think some here need to go back and watch the 80's and early 90's Colts to truly understand what a poorly run team looks like. Since 2002 the Colts have had one bad season. Just about any team in the league fanbase would die to have that. Btw this is clearly meant to add on to what you were saying just for the record,

[Deathiltis]

Did someone seriously make an Andrew Luck is overrated thread due to what he saw in a pre-season game.... seriously....

Some people just don't have the mental capacity to not say dumb things all the time.

[Superman]

I thought the argument is whether Andrew Luck is overrated.  The definition of overrated is "to have a higher opinion of (someone or something) than is deserved."  No one said Luck was a horrible quarterback unless I missed something but some fans on here talk like Luck is the next Manning and that just isn't the case. He's a good quarterback that might win a championship if the team gets its act together and assembles a decent team around him.  I don't know what statistic you would use to say whether the board thinks he is overrated maybe you can find one and if you do good job but I'm basing my opinion on the fact that there's a debate going on over whether he is a top 5 quarterback and based on that he is overrated cause he should be nowhere near that debate.

 

There's really no debate in that thread. The vast majority of fans here don't think he's top five. And then the thread spiraled into a bunch of nonsense.

 

The fact that some Internet writer somewhere called him top five doesn't have anything to do with what Colts fans, in general, think. If we're going to talk about every opinion that's ever been stated, then every QB is overrated and underrated at the same time.

 

In my opinion, we'd be better served talking about what Luck can do and what he needs to improve on, rather than griping about the fact that some people are giving him more credit than he deserves at this time. And it's especially nonsensical to have this discussion on the basis of a sloppy preseason game, under the guise of preempting unrealistic expectations heading into the season. I don't care what ESPN says about Luck. I just care about his role on this team, and whether he helps us win football games.

[GoColts8818]

I thought the argument is whether Andrew Luck is overrated. The definition of overrated is "to have a higher opinion of (someone or something) than is deserved." No one said Luck was a horrible quarterback unless I missed something but some fans on here talk like Luck is the next Manning and that just isn't the case. He's a good quarterback that might win a championship if the team gets its act together and assembles a decent team around him. I don't know what statistic you would use to say whether the board thinks he is overrated maybe you can find one and if you do good job but I'm basing my opinion on the fact that there's a debate going on over whether he is a top 5 quarterback and based on that he is overrated cause he should be nowhere near that debate.

hes two years in. Even Peyton Manning didn't play like Peyton Manning in his prime two years in. So to say he is going to be as good or not as good as Peyton in his prime is way too soon. All you can do is look at their numbers two years into their careers and when you do that they are extremely close outside of wins (which is a team number) and INTs which are both in Luck's favor. Now does that mean he's the next Peyton? No, but you can see why people think he could develop into something pretty darn good.

Is he the fourth best QB in the NFL right now? No. Manning. Brady, Brees, and Rodgers are all better for sure but I do think Luck is moving into that group below the top elite QBs in the game and for a guy two years in that's pretty good, if you want to call him overrated because some magazine article said he's the fourth best QB in the game right now go right a head. In the end I think Colts fans will have the last laugh because a lot of Colts have lived through the growth of a great QB before and they are seeing Luck showing a lot of the same traits so sure Andrew might not be the fourth best QB in the game right now in a handful of years he could very well be the best in the NFL.

[Drew1023]

There's really no debate in that thread. The vast majority of fans here don't think he's top five. And then the thread spiraled into a bunch of nonsense.

 

The fact that some Internet writer somewhere called him top five doesn't have anything to do with what Colts fans, in general, think. If we're going to talk about every opinion that's ever been stated, then every QB is overrated and underrated at the same time.

 

In my opinion, we'd be better served talking about what Luck can do and what he needs to improve on, rather than griping about the fact that some people are giving him more credit than he deserves at this time. And it's especially nonsensical to have this discussion on the basis of a sloppy preseason game, under the guise of preempting unrealistic expectations heading into the season. I don't care what ESPN says about Luck. I just care about his role on this team, and whether he helps us win football games.

 

That makes sense to me.  It sounds reasonable.  If you want to make the argument that whether he is overrated means anything I'll agree with you it probably doesn't but it doesn't mean it isn't true.  Why should we discuss what Luck can do or what he needs to improve on though?  What is the benefit of that or any discussion on the forum?  Maybe I am missing the larger point but isn't the idea to come here and try to understand the team better or at least use it as a source to vent displeasure or cheer for a team I'm assuming at least most of us care about.  So coming here to vent about it being upsetting that the media and some fans hold luck up as some great quarterback when in reality he's just good seems like a perfectly legitimate excuse to post.  Maybe you could enlighten me as to why that isn't a proper use of the forums but discussing what Luck can do and what he needs to improve on is. 

[Drew1023]

hes two years in. Even Peyton Manning didn't play like Peyton Manning in his prime two years in. So to say he is going to be as good or not as good as Peyton in his prime is way too soon. All you can do is look at their numbers two years into their careers and when you do that they are extremely close outside of wins (which is a team number) and INTs which are both in Luck's favor. Now does that mean he's the next Peyton? No, but you can see why people think he could develop into something pretty darn good.

Is he the fourth best QB in the NFL right now? No. Manning. Brady, Brees, and Rodgers are all better for sure but I do think Luck is moving into that group below the top elite QBs in the game and for a guy two years in that's pretty good, if you want to call him overrated because some magazine article said he's the fourth best QB in the game right now go right a head. In the end I think Colts fans will have the last laugh because a lot of Colts have lived through the growth of a great QB before and they are seeing Luck showing a lot of the same traits so sure Andrew might not be the fourth best QB in the game right now in a handful of years he could very well be the best in the NFL.

 

Yes and so could a myriad of other quarterbacks.  What's the point of discussing what could happen years down the line? If we are going to do that let's just create a lot of threads on how it would be awesome if in a few years Luck threw for 70 touchdowns or how it would suck if Luck got injured and never played again.  I don't understand the point of discussing what could happen years from now as anything is possible.  Does that make sense?

[GoColts8818]

Yes and so could a myriad of other quarterbacks.  What's the point of discussing what could happen years down the line? If we are going to do that let's just create a lot of threads on how it would be awesome if in a few years Luck threw for 70 touchdowns or how it would suck if Luck got injured and never played again.  I don't understand the point of discussing what could happen years from now as anything is possible.  Does that make sense?

it makes more sense to talk about what a guy can become and is showing signs of becoming than trying to pretend like a guy entering his third season is done developing and will never ever get any better and thus can never be a top player in the NFL.

[Drew1023]

it makes more sense to talk about what a guy can become and is showing signs of becoming than trying to pretend like a guy entering his third season is done developing and will never ever get any better and thus can never be a top player in the NFL.

 

I'm sorry if you misunderstood me and thought that I was saying anything about Luck's ultimate potential.  I agree that's pretty silly to do with a third year quarterback.  I was just saying right now he isn't as great as the media and some fans of this forum make him out to be and it's kind of silly to talk about what he could become instead of what he is now. As I said he could become the greatest quarterback ever or sustain an injury that makes him never able to play again, which isn't that unlikely with this O-line lol.  Right now he's not a great quarterback though, that's all I was saying.

[GoColts8818]

I'm sorry if you misunderstood me and thought that I was saying anything about Luck's ultimate potential.  I agree that's pretty silly to do with a third year quarterback.  I was just saying right now he isn't as great as the media and some fans of this forum make him out to be and it's kind of silly to talk about what he could become instead of what he is now. As I said he could become the greatest quarterback ever or sustain an injury that makes him never able to play again, which isn't that unlikely with this O-line lol.  Right now he's not a great quarterback though, that's all I was saying.

the media gushes over him because they see him becoming a super star it's the same reason Colts fans love him. No he's not there yet but he's showing the signs of becoming one which is why he gets the attention he does. Also if you look back at some of the things Luck us done in just two years it's pretty impressive rather he's a superstar yet or not. This isn't an older QB catching lighting in a bottle this is maybe the birth of the next great QB in the NFL that's why he gets the attention he does,

[Jason_]

A great Saints team? Saonts will be 10-6 @ best

Yes a great saints team. They have one of the most explosive offenses in the league and didn't they say during the broadcast that they also had the 4th ranked team defense last year? And that was before adding byrd.

[SteelCityColt]

A great Saints team? Saonts will be 10-6 @ best

Elite QB... Check

Top 5 defense... Check

Best TE in league... Check

Decent rushing attack (comparatively)... Check

I'd say they are pretty good, factor in a division with teams all having issued I'd say 10-6 should be there minimum.

Please don't get banned, laughter is the best medicine after all.

[Gavin]

I think everyone should breathe and relax..Its the 3rd game of whats going to be a long season...Losses will happen...There will be more where this came from, The team simply has to get better and for the most part I expect they will. Lets look at some of the positives as well:

 

1.The combo of Tipton and Herron ran for 101 yards on 16 carries.....That's 6.3 ypc!

 

2.Only 3 penalties tonight on the Colts

[colts8718]

I think everyone should breathe and relax..Its the 3rd game of whats going to be a long season...Losses will happen...There will be more where this came from, The team simply has to get better and for the most part I expect they will. Lets look at some of the positives as well:

 

1.The combo of Tipton and Herron ran for 101 yards on 16 carries.....That's 6.3 ypc!

 

2.Only 3 penalties tonight on the Colts

6.3 against 2nd and 3rd D of Saints

[colts8718]

After watching our D last night my hopes for the season are gone same old Colts D 

[rsrobinson]

Luck is being rated by a lot of people as a top five quarterback right now despite the fact he has yet to crack a 90 passer rating and the Colts have been 18th and 14th in points scored his first two seasons guiding the offense. On that basis I think it's fair to say he has been somewhat overrated. The "he took over a 2-14 team" narrative has helped his reputation so far but it won't for much longer unless he actually starts producing at something approaching an elite level which he hasn't come close to doing yet. The third season is generally when quarterbacks can be fairly evaluated for their long-term potential so perhaps this will be the season that he breaks through.

[TKnight24]

A great Saints team? Saonts will be 10-6 @ best

Looking at their schedule, they can easily be 4-1 or 5-0 when they hit their Bye Week

10-6 is a bit of an insult to a team that has a Top 5 Offense & Defense don't you think?

[chrisfarley]

Manning's true capabilities were not written in his 3rd season.  Peyton Manning was getting exponentially better from about his 3rd to 4th season and going forward.  Once he learned all the mechanics of the game (I would argue), how to "Play" the game mentally and physically with synchronicity and as a player who gained knowledge, muscle memory, and poise, he then learned more elaborate cadences and tactics.  Tactics like attacking a blitz better, throwing off the defense by hesitations, spoof play calling, hard counts, reading everything there is to read on a defensive battle field. And of course, knowing everything there is to know about every little capability and weakness of his own offense.  I am telling you that no 3rd year player is that far along, not luck, not Manning in his 3rd year, no one.  Luck may NEVER rise to Manning's level, in fact, that's pretty much impossible.  We should give him time to get there, in the mean time, he has helped take us to two straight playoffs, winning the first game of his 2nd.  Pretty impressive and IMO, not overrated.

[Nadine]

So just let me ask this vague question. How can I say someone is overrated without being accused of trolling?

 

Who was banned for saying someone was over rated?  Answer: no one

People get banned for the reasons in the rules.

 

Sometimes they cannot accept their responsibility for their own behavior and blame the moderators for disliking their opinion.

 

Don't start threads that take veiled shots at moderation.  If you want to talk about something, then talk about it within the rules.

 

I'm closing this thread because it's not actually about anything.  The OP doesn't ask anything related to the colts or any real discernible question.

 

The title takes a shot at moderation though and that's against the rules.