Peyton Manning Voted No.1 By The Players

[Shane Bond]

I don't get what you mean by "sure it was injuries." Are you saying his numbers didn't drop because of injuries? Like I said the averages stayed the same, but the volumes dropped because of lack of play.

Going to a Super Bowl isn't a career revival. Darius Butler is the example of a career revival. Failed in New England but is succeeding in Indy. Branches career didn't turn around after his second stint with Brady. And I bet Brady is the best quarterback he had played with. There is no doubt Brady is great. Doesn't change the fact he seems to fail to utilized #1 threats when trying to implement a vertical offense if they aren't named Moss, the catching of anything machine.

What happens when Dobson and Thompkins "fail to live up to potential" under Brady? What if they go to be deep threats for another team? I just find it strange most WRs career dies in New England. Don't think there has been a single unsuccessful WR in Indy the past decade.

Exactly my point. The lack of weapon is really a garbage point.

[21isSuperman]

I like this one, too:

 

Another excellent one to have for public forums

[Jules]

Brady vs Manning, you guys ever get bored of this?

 

 

Be grateful, I sometimes get to hear it in real life too.

 

It's like this sometimes.....or I will feel like this.....

 

[Shane Bond]

Be grateful, I sometimes get to hear it in real life too.

It's like this sometimes.....or I will feel like this.....

Lol she looks miserable

[amfootball]

Be grateful, I sometimes get to hear it in real life too.

 

It's like this sometimes.....or I will feel like this.....

 

I feel like this a lot in my life actually.

[Blue_Is_The_Colour]

seems like a great choice.  Luck will be the consensus choice in a very short time.

[Fx Stryker]

Brady vs Manning, you guys ever get bored of this?

Be grateful, I sometimes get to hear it in real life too.

It's like this sometimes.....or I will feel like this.....

[Superman]

I think some Colts fans are stuck in 2004, when Brady was more of a Russell WIlson type QB that came through in the clutch but didn't put up great stats, had a great team around him and wasn't as accomplished of a passer.

...

 

Edit: "Brady vs Manning, you guys ever get bored of this?"

 

I think people on both sides, but especially on the Colts/Broncos side of things, want to be able to say their participant is the best.  They feel insecure that there is someone else out there.  Both sides are guilty of this, but it seems a lot of Peyton fans can't just admit that there's another all-time great (and IMO two other all-time greats in Rodgers and Brees) out there.

 

Brady vs Manning, you guys ever get bored of this?

 

I swear, if I didn't know any better, I'd say some of you live just for the sake of that argument. I feel like I'm in my 70's when I read this crap, probably cause I've heard it a million times before. People walking in circles arguing about the same thing over and over until they are the tiniest little difference in similarity. Just go ahead and say they are great players, you like one, you hate the other cause, well screw it, I don't even care at this point.

 

 

Are you guys going to still be arguing this 20 years down the road when they're both senior citizens?

This would make a great sitcom!

 

What's so annoying about these two posts is that a) they are devoid of perspective, b) they completely ignore the arguments that are actually be presented in this thread, and c) if you have a problem with the topic or content of the thread, you could easily just ignore the thread.

 

So kindly excuse the rest of us as we have a discussion we want to have, for as long as we wish to have it.

[Superman]

Exactly my point. The lack of weapon is really a garbage point.

 

Not really. In comparison with Manning, prior to 2007, Brady never had really good offensive weapons. He had some guys, but not four first rounders -- Harrison, Wayne, Clark, Edge -- like Manning did. 

 

And on the other side of the argument, Manning's teams didn't have a lot of highly ranked talent on the defensive end. As a matter of fact, the Colts let a lot of critical defensive players walk in free agency.

 

Two different team building philosophies, both with their merits and their shortcomings. There's no reason to ignore the differences.

[BloodyChamp]

Brady did have 1 thing - an all time great head coach. Now think Manning fans before you jump up and down screaming "nooooo" because in the end that just gives Brady another point in the debate. I personally think Manning's best coach was Jim Mora. Dungy is so dang overrated.

I never tire of the Brady/Manning debate. The debate is the biggest thing that keeps the intangibles and the unmeasurables alive in football. When Brady and Manning are gone, comparing quarterbacks will go no further than that statsheet because of the new rules.

[Jules]

Here is a quick breakdown:

 

Once upon a time Brady had the rings and Manning had the stats. And many put the stats ahead of the rings. You know the "Marino vs. Bradshaw" argument. And people said Brady had the coach. You know as if Dungy was horse manure or something......

 

Then in 2006 Manning got the ring and the head to head win in the AFCCG.

 

Then Manning was better. Finally. No doubt. Stats plus ring. Universe complete.

 

So then in 2007 Brady shook up the universe and got some super cool toys on offense. Brady broke records. Brady didn't get the ring though. So people said "If Brady always had these weapons he would have the rings AND stats."

 

Then as time went by Manning won a few more MVPs. Brady snagged a few too.

 

But, neither won more rings. In fact, both lost two more Super Bowls each. So in comes the "team is not good enough around them arguments and especially on defense".

 

So now it's just an argument about two men who play QB who really are not that much different in the end. Neither can no longer seem to win the ring and both seem to sometimes have the big stats.

 

Oh and then you have dudes like Brees and even Rodgers who are often labeled as "the next tier" for some reason because they are not at the level of being able to carry their teams and be the awesomes that Brady and Manning are despite both having rings and often playing at MVP caliber levels.

[BloodyChamp]

Brees and Rodgers are overrated. They only got to their "tier" (and their SBs in a roundabout way) because Favre and Warner suddenly came down with Oesteoperosis.

[Superman]

Here is a quick breakdown:

 

Once upon a time Brady had the rings and Manning had the stats. And many put the stats ahead of the rings. You know the "Marino vs. Bradshaw" argument. And people said Brady had the coach. You know as if Dungy was horse manure or something......

 

Then in 2006 Manning got the ring and the head to head win in the AFCCG.

 

Then Manning was better. Finally. No doubt. Stats plus ring. Universe complete.

 

So then in 2007 Brady shook up the universe and got some super cool toys on offense. Brady broke records. Brady didn't get the ring though. So people said "If Brady always had these weapons he would have the rings AND stats."

 

Then as time went by Manning won a few more MVPs. Brady snagged a few too.

 

But, neither won more rings. In fact, both lost two more Super Bowls each. So in comes the "team is not good enough around them arguments and especially on defense".

 

So now it's just an argument about two men who play QB who really are not that much different in the end. Neither can no longer seem to win the ring and both seem to sometimes have the big stats.

 

Oh and then you have dudes like Brees and even Rodgers who are often labeled as "the next tier" for some reason because they are not at the level of being able to carry their teams and be the awesomes that Brady and Manning are despite both having rings and often playing at MVP caliber levels.

 

Actually, the thread was a simple congratulations to Manning before Bogie decided that he hated it.

 

I'm also not sure where people come up with this "Brees and Rodgers are next tier" stuff. Most people agree that Brees and Rodgers are right there with Manning and Brady, despite not quite having as extensive a resume. Me personally, Rodgers is the most valuable commodity in the NFL, and Brees is right there with the others at the top of the mountain.

[Shane Bond]

Not really. In comparison with Manning, prior to 2007, Brady never had really good offensive weapons. He had some guys, but not four first rounders -- Harrison, Wayne, Clark, Edge -- like Manning did.

And on the other side of the argument, Manning's teams didn't have a lot of highly ranked talent on the defensive end. As a matter of fact, the Colts let a lot of critical defensive players walk in free agency.

Two different team building philosophies, both with their merits and their shortcomings. There's no reason to ignore the differences.

Wasn't there a WR called branch who was a SB MVP?.

Point is Peyton creates his receiver to his needs better than NE. We have discussed in detail in this thread.

[Superman]

Wasn't there a WR called branch who was a SB MVP?.

Point is Peyton creates his receiver to his needs better than NE. We have discussed in detail in this thread.

 

Did you miss the 'not like Manning did' part? Or are you ready to put Deion Branch on the same level as Marvin Harrison or Reggie Wayne?

 

I also disagree with the thought that Manning "creates" his receivers. The Colts -- and now the Broncos -- have done a good job of surrounding Manning with talented and capable receivers. Manning works his butt off and tries to maximize everyone's talent, but the Patriots have rarely devoted the resources to offensive weapons that Manning's teams have.

[Shane Bond]

Did you miss the 'not like Manning did' part? Or are you ready to put Deion Branch on the same level as Marvin Harrison or Reggie Wayne?

I also disagree with the thought that Manning "creates" his receivers. The Colts -- and now the Broncos -- have done a good job of surrounding Manning with talented and capable receivers. Manning works his butt off and tries to maximize everyone's talent, but the Patriots have rarely devoted the resources to offensive weapons that Manning's teams have.

You clearly didn't read the posts. Not typing them again.

[Superman]

You clearly didn't read the posts. Not typing them again.

Just because you posted something earlier doesn't make it factual. I read those posts. I disagree with them.

[Poster X]

Here is a quick breakdown:

 

Once upon a time Brady had the rings and Manning had the stats. And many put the stats ahead of the rings. You know the "Marino vs. Bradshaw" argument. And people said Brady had the coach. You know as if Dungy was horse manure or something......

 

Then in 2006 Manning got the ring and the head to head win in the AFCCG.

 

Then Manning was better. Finally. No doubt. Stats plus ring. Universe complete.

 

So then in 2007 Brady shook up the universe and got some super cool toys on offense. Brady broke records. Brady didn't get the ring though. So people said "If Brady always had these weapons he would have the rings AND stats."

 

Then as time went by Manning won a few more MVPs. Brady snagged a few too.

 

But, neither won more rings. In fact, both lost two more Super Bowls each. So in comes the "team is not good enough around them arguments and especially on defense".

 

So now it's just an argument about two men who play QB who really are not that much different in the end. Neither can no longer seem to win the ring and both seem to sometimes have the big stats.

 

Oh and then you have dudes like Brees and even Rodgers who are often labeled as "the next tier" for some reason because they are not at the level of being able to carry their teams and be the awesomes that Brady and Manning are despite both having rings and often playing at MVP caliber levels.

The ring does funny things to people once they have held it. I can't wait until the current group of ring bearers retire, and then when they are on ESPN... and they see it then freak out live on air.

[John Dee]

Aaron Rodgers IMO is VERY over rated...

Why?  he is not CLUTCH...  

Aaron Rodgers.   87 career starts     all of 6 FQC, and  10 GWD's

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=LuckAn00

 

Andrew Luck    32 career starts  8 FQC and 11 GWD's

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=LuckAn00

 

Peyton Manning   240 career starts      40 FQC and 51 GWD's  

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=MannPe00

 

Tom Brady    191 career starts      31 FQC and 42 GWD's   

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=BradTo00

 

Russell Wilson    32 career starts       8 FQC abd 10 GWD's     The best D in the NFL helps here...  but   

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=WilsRu00

 

Rodgers is NOT the MVC in the NFL.       

Actually, the thread was a simple congratulations to Manning before Bogie decided that he hated it.

 

I'm also not sure where people come up with this "Brees and Rodgers are next tier" stuff. Most people agree that Brees and Rodgers are right there with Manning and Brady, despite not quite having as extensive a resume. Me personally, Rodgers is the most valuable commodity in the NFL, and Brees is right there with the others at the top of the mountain.

[John Dee]

And Brees..    I am a bit surprised here.. guess there is a reason they are tier 2

 

185 CS     23 FQC  and  34 GWD's     

[Superman]

Aaron Rodgers IMO is VERY over rated...

Why?  he is not CLUTCH...  

Aaron Rodgers.   87 career starts     all of 6 FQC, and  10 GWD's

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=LuckAn00

 

Andrew Luck    32 career starts  8 FQC and 11 GWD's

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=LuckAn00

 

Peyton Manning   240 career starts      40 FQC and 51 GWD's  

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=MannPe00

 

Tom Brady    191 career starts      31 FQC and 42 GWD's   

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=BradTo00

 

Russell Wilson    32 career starts       8 FQC abd 10 GWD's     The best D in the NFL helps here...  but   

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=WilsRu00

 

Rodgers is NOT the MVC in the NFL.       

 

That's not a good way of determining which QBs are good in the clutch. An anecdote which illustrates why I say that is the 2012 game with the Colts and Packers. Aaron Rodgers throws the go-ahead TD with 4 minutes in the game. Luck leads the Colts back down for the game winner with 30 seconds left. 

 

Second, IMO, Rodgers is the MVC because I personally would trade any other player in the league for Rodgers.

[John Dee]

right on...

 

You can have him..  I'll roll with Luck,... 

That's not a good way of determining which QBs are good in the clutch. An anecdote which illustrates why I say that is the 2012 game with the Colts and Packers. Aaron Rodgers throws the go-ahead TD with 4 minutes in the game. Luck leads the Colts back down for the game winner with 30 seconds left. 

 

Second, IMO, Rodgers is the MVC because I personally would trade any other player in the league for Rodgers.

[Shane Bond]

Just because you posted something earlier doesn't make it factual. I read those posts. I disagree with them.

If you did, it covered everything. I don't post for you to agree. I post my opinion.

[Shane Bond]

right on...

You can have him.. I'll roll with Luck,...

I agree. Rodgers is overrated. He got manhandled 2 straight years by Kap. Will take Luck any day.

[BloodyChamp]

We've done Rodgers to death. He's not clutch. He's not alot of other valuable things either but just see the thread outside about him being clutch (and not being clutch!).

[Shane Bond]

Actually, the thread was a simple congratulations to Manning before Bogie decided that he hated it.

I'm also not sure where people come up with this "Brees and Rodgers are next tier" stuff. Most people agree that Brees and Rodgers are right there with Manning and Brady, despite not quite having as extensive a resume. Me personally, Rodgers is the most valuable commodity in the NFL, and Brees is right there with the others at the top of the mountain.

I am not sure why people think they belong to tier one.

It's Brady/Manning and the rest.

Stats and performance year after year consistently for 15 years shows that.

Combined 8 SBs. 4 rings. 7 MVPs.

What do we got for Brees/Rodgers ?. Thought so.

[Dustin]

I am not sure why people think they belong to tier one.

It's Brady/Manning and the rest.

Stats and performance year after year consistently for 15 years shows that.

Combined 8 SBs. 4 rings. 7 MVPs.

What do we got for Brees/Rodgers ?. Thought so.

Did you think Brett Favre was a tier 1 QB in 2010?

[BloodyChamp]

Did you think Brett Favre was a tier 1 QB in 2010?

Not sure where you're going with that...every quarterback not named John Elway goes out in shambles. It will happen to Brady and Manning too and that final year won't be held against them very much.

[Dustin]

Not sure where you're going with that...every quarterback not named John Elway goes out in shambles. It will happen to Brady and Manning too and that final year won't be held against them very much.

My point is that things you did in the past have no bearing on how good you are now.

[BloodyChamp]

My point is that things you did in the past have no bearing on how good you are now.

The 2 quarterbacks in question made it to the AFCCG. That's a tad above Favre in 2010.

[Dustin]

The 2 quarterbacks in question made it to the AFCCG. That's a tad above Favre in 2010.

I see your point, but It was just an example to make a point. I didn't say either of them were 2010 Favre.

[BloodyChamp]

What point!?! What do Brady and Manning have in common with 2010 Favre lol!!!!

[Dustin]

What point!?! What do Brady and Manning have in common with 2010 Favre lol!!!!

You're not getting this.

[Shane Bond]

What point!?! What do Brady and Manning have in common with 2010 Favre lol!!!!

Lol

[Shane Bond]

My point is that things you did in the past have no bearing on how good you are now.

Ok let's talk current.

2013 performance - you rank manning/Brady/Brees/Rodgers.

[BloodyChamp]

I get it...you don't measure greatness by either a player's final year or current year, especially when those 2 years are the same like it was for Favre in 2010. So until Manning or Brady get a knocked out of multiple games and throw more INTs than TDs it's assanine to compare anything about them to 2010 Favre.

As for Brees and Rodgers, nothing much was different this year there either. Rodgers was 1 and done like usual and Brees kept up his every other year playoff win streak.

[amfootball]

That's not a good way of determining which QBs are good in the clutch. An anecdote which illustrates why I say that is the 2012 game with the Colts and Packers. Aaron Rodgers throws the go-ahead TD with 4 minutes in the game. Luck leads the Colts back down for the game winner with 30 seconds left. 

 

Second, IMO, Rodgers is the MVC because I personally would trade any other player in the league for Rodgers.

Really? You would rather have Rodgers over Luck?

[The Old Crow]

...except for the Baltimore game that Denver lost 38-35..

I think the effort to find a trend a thread that follow s through losses....is a theory in search of support..

You hit on it...When Manning is rushed and nobody is open he loses. All QBs do.

It bothers me that QBs who don't make the playoffs every year are analyzed differently than Peyton Manning.

I still hear how Eli Manning is so good in the post-season. Well, it helps your post-season record when you don't make the post season every year.

Joe Flacco's post-season record is good. It helps that Baltimore missed the playoffs last season.

See what I mean?

What is Peyton...11-12..How many QBs have 11 playoff wins?

Joe is 9-4. It was the first time he missed the playoffs. In six seasons, the Ravens have been to the playoffs five times, three AFC title games with one win, and a Super Bowl title where he was MVP with 11 touchdowns and no interceptions. He is 2-1 against Brady on New England , and had led his team to many big victories on the road. His ability to throw the ball 70 yards beat the Broncos in Denver. Rodgers is 5-4 in the playoffs by the way.

Not to diminish Peyton because I like and respect him and have no problem with this poll. I just don't think Joe gets enough respect for what he has done.

[Dustin]

Ok let's talk current.

2013 performance - you rank manning/Brady/Brees/Rodgers.

Manning, Brees, Rogers, Brady.

[Dustin]

I get it....

No you don't.