No matter how good hakeem does he is only 1 year

[crazycolt1]

The other teams didn't want that much more for him. He thought the Colts were the best fit because he is the missing piece and won't be double covered too much with Wayne and Hilton. He signed a one year deal so he can try and cash in next year.

Is that any different than any other player in that position? I guess you know what he is thinking? 

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

So, if Nicks has a great year, we should keep Whalen, Rogers and Brazill, and let Nicks walk?

 

I always thought the idea was to put together the best team you can, not to romanticize average players.

 

I agree

 

Please someone kiss me I swear I'll turn into a prince .

 

[YOUR GM]

Not that I am intending to speak for Superman but I think when he said "we already know what they are" he meant that we already know what there skill set is, such as for example: deep threat, posession receiver and so on , In that regard we know what Rogers and Brazill is, We know they can beat ya deep, we know Rogers is a physical receiver, Raw skills we know what they are. We dont know what they will become, Just like Nicks, We know what he is.

I didn't read it that way at all. The first post I responded to of his, he called them average. My only issue with that is, he's being critical of 2nd year receivers, as if they can't develop anymore, all the while backing the notion of a completely inexperienced center being the signal caller for the unit that is supposed to protect our most valuable player next year. I don't understand that rationale

[Bluefire4]

Is that any different than any other player in that position? I guess you know what he is thinking? 

I never said he was wrong for doing it. I said we shouldn't resign him.

[crazycolt1]

I never said he was wrong for doing it. I said we shouldn't resign him. 

So let me get this right. If he plays like he did before being injured and earns a top receiver pay the Colts shouldn't resign and keep him? I thought keeping good players was kind of important to win. 

[Tsarquise]

I'm pretty sure the Colts will choose to keep Nicks if he plays like an elite receiver. I don't get some of the posters and the infatuation with Brazil, Whalen and Rogers. They are just guys. 

[Superman]

I don't think you can draw any definitive conclusions on how good Rogers, Brazill and Nicks will be for multiple reasons. The main ones being, Nicks is coming off an injury plagued season and did not play like he did in seasons prior, and Rogers/Brazill have only seen spotty work on the field towards the end of last season. To say you know what they (which are essentially a couple of rookie receivers) ARE is every bit as presumptive as you would claim anyone's assessment of Holmes would be without seeing him actually play first.

And Holmes is a center/guard combo who could've easily been in the rotation last season, even if it weren't at his natural position of center. For us to believe he's progressed to the point of being starter level without so much as taking a single snap from that position last year (with injuries to Satele and McGlynn, mind you) is not impossible but certainly an ambitious proposition

And your last statement isn't fair to Rogers or Brazill at all. You only know what they WERE in a handful of games at the end of last season. You don't know what they ARE with a full off-season removed from their last game. Rogers can be every bit the physical talent that Nicks WAS a few seasons ago. It usually takes receivers 2 seasons to make that leap to the next level, so maybe it clicks with Brazill and Rogers, maybe it doesn't. To say they basically "are what they are" isn't at all accurate, IMO. If that's the case, Nicks is only as good as his last season played, which wasn't too impressive

 

Nicks is a really good receiver. If injuries hold him back, that's one thing, but the talent is there and his ability to produce like a #1 receiver is proven. Projecting him to have a good season is reasonable. (If he doesn't have a good season, the point is moot.)

 

Rogers is talented, but hasn't proven his ability to produce in the pros. Brazill is an average talent -- has speed, but is a limited route runner, has decent but not great hands, and has average size. I can only say about half the good things about Whalen as I did about Brazill. Both of them can play, but neither of them seem to have the physical talent to be anything more than average in the league. And both of them have had plenty of games, reps and opportunity to show what they can do. 

 

I don't know why you're comparing any of these guys to Holmes, who played 13 snaps last year. We have no NFL evaluation of him at this point, particularly at his position. And it puzzles me doubly that so many people struggle to understand that him not being in the rotation last year doesn't mean that he can't play. It is an ambitious proposition to project him to starter without any real reps, and as I've said before, I'd prefer to have a contingency to him, and someone better than Phil Costa. 

 

How you take my opinion on Holmes and spin it having any relevance pertaining to the young receivers on our roster is strange. Holmes hasn't played, and I think it makes sense to give him an opportunity to do so. Whalen and Brazill have played -- plenty enough to have an idea of what they can and can't do in the NFL. Sure, they can get better, but they're never going to be as physically gifted as Nicks, and Nicks has already shown that he use his physical gifts to produce as a pro, unlike Rogers. Two completely opposite situations.

 

So, like I originally said, if Nicks has a good year ("if" being a key word), it doesn't make sense to say that Whalen or Brazill (or even Rogers) are more important than he is to building our team in the future. We should put together the best team we can, and being that Nicks is better than these guys we're talking about -- and he is, there's no question about it -- saying "I'd rather let Nicks walk and keep Whalen and Brazill" just doesn't make sense to me. Especially if Nicks produces the way we hope he will.

[Bluefire4]

So let me get this right. If he plays like he did before being injured and earns a top receiver pay the Colts shouldn't resign and keep him? I thought keeping good players was kind of important to win. 

Well we'll be in salary cap trouble after the Constanzo, Luck, TY, and maybe Fleener and/or Allen deals.

[Superman]

Well we'll be in salary cap trouble after the Constanzo, Luck, TY, and maybe Fleener and/or Allen deals.

 

That's not necessarily true, but it is a concern. Still, has nothing to do with Whalen and Brazill. If you can, you keep your best players.

[Bluefire4]

That's not necessarily true, but it is a concern. Still, has nothing to do with Whalen and Brazill. If you can, you keep your best players.

Whalen and Brazill are developmental projects who are on low level deals and help us. As long as they remain on the roster and we look to the draft to find a number one receiver, we won't need Nicks. I'd try to keep him, but in the end I think it'll be too costly if he plays well.

[ColtStronger]

I'm not on one side or another, because it's a situation we'll just have to wait and see.  However, I do believe Nicks will play exceptionally well with the talent that's on the Colts staff/roster.  He wanted a 1 year deal with the Colts because he knows his abilities and value, but no team would give him a huge contract this year.   He definitely has the potential to be a #1 WR, and will want to be paid as one if he performs well this season.  After analyzing that, I would say if (and ONLY IF) Reggie is ready to leave, do we pay him the money he would want, because we've all seen the big play ability of Rogers.  Yeah, he is unproven, but wasn't TY before this season?  Can some of you not see talent right in front of you?  Let me remind you he only played half of the season and still made huge plays in a few games when given opportunities.  The kid is 22 years old, and he stepped up when the ball was thrown his direction.  First team All-SEC in 2011 and a 2 TD, 10 reception, 100+ yd game in one of his first appearances on the Colts.

 

T.Y. (especially Rogers and Brazill) will also be losing snaps now that Nicks was brought in.  Not to mention Whalen probably wont even be on the active roster unless one of them go down.  Im not saying Rogers will be better than Nicks, but I am saying the money wouldn't be justified if Hakeem got the contract, and we have Reggie/TY while Rogers is still cheap.  Anyway, Reggie and Hakeem are our starting WR's at this point.  So lets end all the speculation and see how everything will play out!!

[ColtStronger]

Well we'll be in salary cap trouble after the Constanzo, Luck, TY, and maybe Fleener and/or Allen deals.

Don't forget Ballard and Richardson in the same year.  Sometimes I think people just don't understand there is a salary cap. 

[gacker65]

three wr's can be rotated to keep them fresh. wayne is still a question mark until he proves he's back to form. i would rather have one too many, than one too less.

I agree with you about rotation, though I would have preferred our young WRs rather than bringing in a FA WR.

[gacker65]

There is nothing negative about TY being on the sidelines in a 2 receiver set if it works. It could be any 2 receivers on the field if it works and the matchup are in the Colts favor. 

Yes there is.  This means instead of getting the snaps to help TY to continue to improve chemistry with Luck, he is giving the snaps to Nicks.

[Valpo2004]

You realize that holding the rights on Nicks does give us the first crack to re-sign him once the season is over correct?

 

We can extend him any time during the season or after until free agency starts in March 2015.  

[YOUR GM]

Nicks is a really good receiver. If injuries hold him back, that's one thing, but the talent is there and his ability to produce like a #1 receiver is proven. Projecting him to have a good season is reasonable. (If he doesn't have a good season, the point is moot.)

 

Rogers is talented, but hasn't proven his ability to produce in the pros. Brazill is an average talent -- has speed, but is a limited route runner, has decent but not great hands, and has average size. I can only say about half the good things about Whalen as I did about Brazill. Both of them can play, but neither of them seem to have the physical talent to be anything more than average in the league. And both of them have had plenty of games, reps and opportunity to show what they can do. 

 

 

Brazill has the physical talent to be a solid 2nd-3rd option, if given the opportunity. I don't know how anyone who watched the Cincy game or the New England playoff game last year (or even his TD grab against the Lions in 2012) could honestly say he doesn't have the physical talent to be a solid receiver in this league. His ability to generate YAC is perfect for a WCO scheme. His route running and hands need improving, but that typically comes with experience. The only way one can obtain experience is reps. Even without Nicks, he wouldn't be asked to be anything more than our 3rd receiver, at best, with Reggie, T.Y. and Da'Rick already in the mix. Da'Rick obviously has the physical tools to be a potentially dominant receiver if he develops. The flashes are there. The fact that these guys aren't proven shouldn't be considered an indictment, as they will be 2nd year receivers. I guess we should've wrote Reggie off as unproven with a lack of physical talent after his rookie season as well? 

 

Nicks is here, so what's done is done, but I just don't feel like another receiver was needed for a team that is supposedly gonna be run-oriented, and will be featuring more 2 TE sets next season with the return of Dwayne Allen. Our actions suggest we're going to be a spread attack again.

 

 

I don't know why you're comparing any of these guys to Holmes, who played 13 snaps last year. We have no NFL evaluation of him at this point, particularly at his position. And it puzzles me doubly that so many people struggle to understand that him not being in the rotation last year doesn't mean that he can't play. It is an ambitious proposition to project him to starter without any real reps, and as I've said before, I'd prefer to have a contingency to him, and someone better than Phil Costa. 

 

 

I'm not comparing them to Holmes, nor am I saying the reason Holmes didn't play last year was because he wasn't capable. What I am saying is, it baffles me how people are so worried about inexperience hurting our offense in the receiving game, unwilling to give the players (who have flashed potential) time to develop, but are totally gung-ho about letting our franchise QB be protected by a unit (that struggled last year with a VETERAN center making calls) that will now, apparently, feature a starting center who literally has NO pro experience at the position. The offensive line, by far, will feel the affects of inexperience greater than almost any other unit in the sport. Solid line play is all about chemistry and experience.

 

 

How you take my opinion on Holmes and spin it having any relevance pertaining to the young receivers on our roster is strange. Holmes hasn't played, and I think it makes sense to give him an opportunity to do so. Whalen and Brazill have played -- plenty enough to have an idea of what they can and can't do in the NFL. Sure, they can get better, but they're never going to be as physically gifted as Nicks, and Nicks has already shown that he use his physical gifts to produce as a pro, unlike Rogers. Two completely opposite situations.

 

 It's not a comparison between our young receivers and our young center, it's merely an observation of the selective reasoning that goes on around here. How can you be worried about the inexperience of the receiving corps (even with all the raw, young talent at the position) and at the same time NOT be at least a bit worried about the fact that we'll probably be starting a center with no professional experience at the position? Also, the flaw in your argument against the likes of Brazill and Whalen assumes that we'd be asking them to be receivers of Hakeem Nicks caliber, when that is not the case at all. Between Reggie (coming off injury or not) T.Y., Rogers, Fleener, Allen and Brazill, I was more than comfortable with the overall depth of our receiving corps, even before the Nicks trade. The need for a "#1" receiver in today's league is way overblown. New England has featured one of the top passing offenses of the past few years WITHOUT a true #1 receiver. They did it with a balanced passing attack, featuring the tight ends and a slot receiver. 

 

 

So, like I originally said, if Nicks has a good year ("if" being a key word), it doesn't make sense to say that Whalen or Brazill (or even Rogers) are more important than he is to building our team in the future. We should put together the best team we can, and being that Nicks is better than these guys we're talking about -- and he is, there's no question about it -- saying "I'd rather let Nicks walk and keep Whalen and Brazill" just doesn't make sense to me. Especially if Nicks produces the way we hope he will.

 

Just to make it clear, I, in no way, agree with the premise of the OP. If Nicks has a solid year next season, it would be stupid to let him walk. So don't lump our arguments together. My only argument is, Nicks was not a necessary acquisition AT ALL. It was yet another reactionary move by our GM, just like the Trent trade. I don't have a problem with this move overall, because it wasn't near as costly as the Trent trade, but it still was not needed. Even more so if we truly plan to commit more to the run this season, with more 2 receiver sets.

[husker61]

 

 

 

Just to make it clear, I, in no way, agree with the premise of the OP. If Nicks has a solid year next season, it would be stupid to let him walk. So don't lump our arguments together. My only argument is, Nicks was not a necessary acquisition AT ALL. It was yet another reactionary move by our GM, just like the Trent trade. I don't have a problem with this move overall, because it wasn't near as costly as the Trent trade, but it still was not needed. Even more so if we truly plan to commit more to the run this season, with more 2 receiver sets.

 

 

i don't think wr was a pressing need ether, but the nicks signing is advantageous because it gives the colts options next year and insurance this year at a cheap price with no long term ramifications. if nicks performes, the colts don't have to spend a top pick on a reciever to take wayne's place. being able to draft the best player instead of for need is the best way to draft, that almost always gets teams in trouble and keeps them there. all this is more important long term than worrying about 2 receiver sets this season.

 

[ProblChld32]

Its pretty Much a 1 year prove it deal, seeing as he has had health concerns you dont wanna invest long term in him and have it come back to hurt you. If he performs well they may very well resign him if not then well this season could be his audition for other suitors for next season. Personally i think he is going to perform well and will re-sign here. There is a reason he didnt sign with Carolina there GM advised him that Indy is the best place for him. 

[YOUR GM]

 

i don't think wr was a pressing need ether, but the nicks signing is advantageous because it gives the colts options next year and insurance this year at a cheap price with no long term ramifications. if nicks performes, the colts don't have to spend a top pick on a reciever to take wayne's place. being able to draft the best player instead of for need is the best way to draft, that almost always gets teams in trouble and keeps them there. all this is more important long term than worrying about 2 receiver sets this season.

 

 

 

 

It was still a luxury signing at this point. I really don't feel like we have to find the next Reggie this off-season. Even if he's not the same anymore, not having a clear cut top receiver is not going to set the franchise back several years. Farting around every off-season about seriously addressing the O-line, and constantly putting a crappy product on the field WILL eventually set us back

[Superman]

Brazill has the physical talent to be a solid 2nd-3rd option, if given the opportunity. I don't know how anyone who watched the Cincy game or the New England playoff game last year (or even his TD grab against the Lions in 2012) could honestly say he doesn't have the physical talent to be a solid receiver in this league. His ability to generate YAC is perfect for a WCO scheme. His route running and hands need improving, but that typically comes with experience. The only way one can obtain experience is reps. Even without Nicks, he wouldn't be asked to be anything more than our 3rd receiver, at best, with Reggie, T.Y. and Da'Rick already in the mix. Da'Rick obviously has the physical tools to be a potentially dominant receiver if he develops. The flashes are there. The fact that these guys aren't proven shouldn't be considered an indictment, as they will be 2nd year receivers. I guess we should've wrote Reggie off as unproven with a lack of physical talent after his rookie season as well?

Brazill looks like a third option at best. Yes, he can improve with experience, but that's not a reason not to upgrade the position now. (His catch in the Lions game was a huge play for the team, but there was nothing special about it.) And the problem with Brazill is that you can't rely on him. One more drug violation and he's out for 8 games. He's a limited player who has a lot of work to do before he's even able to produce like a #3. You don't neglect a chance to make your team better because of him. Also, he wasn't a rookie; he played in 15 games last year.

Rogers is the one who I think has the kind of talent and ability that are worth taking a longer view on. But his off the field issues make him a risk as well.

And then there's Reggie's health, which isn't a given.

I'm not indicting anyone, nor am I writing them off; as I've said, I like our young guys. But all things considered, the players we already had aren't good enough or reliable enough to put off making a considerable upgrade.

 

Nicks is here, so what's done is done, but I just don't feel like another receiver was needed for a team that is supposedly gonna be run-oriented, and will be featuring more 2 TE sets next season with the return of Dwayne Allen. Our actions suggest we're going to be a spread attack again.

You're saying two different things here. Are we going to be run-oriented, or are we going to rely on our receivers more? Either way, having better play from that position is important, because the way our guys played after Reggie got hurt just wasn't good enough.

 

I'm not comparing them to Holmes, nor am I saying the reason Holmes didn't play last year was because he wasn't capable. What I am saying is, it baffles me how people are so worried about inexperience hurting our offense in the receiving game, unwilling to give the players (who have flashed potential) time to develop, but are totally gung-ho about letting our franchise QB be protected by a unit (that struggled last year with a VETERAN center making calls) that will now, apparently, feature a starting center who literally has NO pro experience at the position. The offensive line, by far, will feel the affects of inexperience greater than almost any other unit in the sport. Solid line play is all about chemistry and experience.

It's not a comparison between our young receivers and our young center, it's merely an observation of the selective reasoning that goes on around here. How can you be worried about the inexperience of the receiving corps (even with all the raw, young talent at the position) and at the same time NOT be at least a bit worried about the fact that we'll probably be starting a center with no professional experience at the position? Also, the flaw in your argument against the likes of Brazill and Whalen assumes that we'd be asking them to be receivers of Hakeem Nicks caliber, when that is not the case at all. Between Reggie (coming off injury or not) T.Y., Rogers, Fleener, Allen and Brazill, I was more than comfortable with the overall depth of our receiving corps, even before the Nicks trade. The need for a "#1" receiver in today's league is way overblown. New England has featured one of the top passing offenses of the past few years WITHOUT a true #1 receiver. They did it with a balanced passing attack, featuring the tight ends and a slot receiver.

Solid line play starts with talent. Our talent, particularly at center and right guard, wasn't very good. It's hard to take seriously, I know, but I really mean it when I say almost anyone would be better than Satele was. Chemistry and experience don't totally make up for substandard talent.

And like I've said, I'm NOT gung-ho about starting Holmes. If it were up to me, I'd have brought in a veteran center. But I understand the approach with Holmes, because you can't gradually work a young center into the rotation. At a certain point, you have to give him a chance to play, and that involves going all-in. It's the most questionable aspect of Grigson's plan this offseason, but I understand why he's doing it.

We have Reggie coming back from a serious injury at 35 years old, Allen coming back from a serious injury, and all three of our backs have question marks regarding their health. The young guys got extensive playing time last season, and didn't perform very well, outside of half a game here or there. Doesn't mean they're finished products, but whatever potential they have isn't reason enough to put off a reasonable opportunity to improve the position. Nicks is exactly that -- a low cost, high potential player with proven NFL ability. Has nothing to do with having a #1 receiver (and I disagree with your opinion on the value of the position).

 

Just to make it clear, I, in no way, agree with the premise of the OP. If Nicks has a solid year next season, it would be stupid to let him walk. So don't lump our arguments together. My only argument is, Nicks was not a necessary acquisition AT ALL. It was yet another reactionary move by our GM, just like the Trent trade. I don't have a problem with this move overall, because it wasn't near as costly as the Trent trade, but it still was not needed. Even more so if we truly plan to commit more to the run this season, with more 2 receiver sets.

Don't lump me in with people who aren't concerned about our interior line situation.

Adding Nicks on a low cost, low risk deal is nothing like the Richardson trade. It costs the team a little bit of money, and if it doesn't work for any reason, or proves to be unnecessary, it doesn't hurt the team's ability to add other players now or in the future.

Nor is it reactionary. It's the most pro-active move he made this year, rather than waiting to see if Reggie and Allen would be 100%, waiting to see how the young receivers look, risking having only Hilton as a proven producer, he instead made sure we have a proven veteran who can play right away. And the biggest weapon we have -- Andrew Luck -- deserves to have reliable players to throw the ball to. Adding a playmaker isn't a bad thing, even if it costs us Brazill or Whalen outright. You don't ignore opportunities to improve just so you can hold on to the hope that one of your "just-a-guy" youngsters develops into something more than "just-a-guy."

[crazycolt1]

Well we'll be in salary cap trouble after the Constanzo, Luck, TY, and maybe Fleener and/or Allen deals.

You bring up 5 players out of 53 players so your point is really not a point. Salary cap issues are a concern for every NFL team. If Nicks does turn out to be a top WR then the Colts will need him reguardless of other players on the roster. If the Colts are expected to make and advance into the playoffs good players will have to be retained.

[crazycolt1]

Yes there is.  This means instead of getting the snaps to help TY to continue to improve chemistry with Luck, he is giving the snaps to Nicks.

Look , I am not here to argue but it takes a team to win games and that includes any and every player on the roster. If the Colts put Nicks and Wayne out on the field at the same time it will not effect TY as a team player. I think your just being a little short sighted in the bigger picture.

[throwing BBZ]

So why are you willing to give Holmes and our mediocre interior line the benefit of the doubt, while all but write off our young receivers? I think Rogers and Brazill have more potential than Holmes and Costa do on the O-line. I'm not saying that to suggest that we should let Nicks walk if he has a good season, just don't understand why you're so certain our 2nd and 3rd year receivers are a finish product and nothing more than average...

 

The guy isn`t so Clueless to think Griff & Brazill are finished products like you suggest, but one Can Sense they don`t have star upsides like Nicks has already shown.

Don`t see Griff EVER being a solid NFL Starter, and Brazill is still mystified by the art of route running. I wonder what he does in practice and if he ever studies.

You know Nothing of Holmes who may be a Pro Bowler someday soon, as Costa is at best a mediocre backup.

 

[throwing BBZ]

And when we are in a 2 WR set, that means TY is on the sidelines and not on the field.  Think about it.

 

TY is a specialty type receiver who has a number of limitations. There is a nice article about that on here today.

[Valpo2004]

Wayne is defeinetly in his last, or second to last season. Him getting injured actually brought some important things to light. The offense sputtered when he went down, but look at how we performed in the playoffs.  Luck needs to cut down the INT's but he was clearly able to spread the ball around and find the end-zone without him. A better run game and a consistent defense and the loss wouldn't have appeared as big.

 

That's where Nicks comes in. He's only 26 (been in the league just as long as Vontae) so if he performs you have a replacement. You can sign him to a long term deal and you have a top 5 receiving core with Hilton, Nicks, and Rodgers. Don't count out Fleener and Allen though. I don't think we need Reggie as bad as people think. If anything, it's his leadership that was missed the most. But all good things must come to an end.

 

I wouldn't be surprised to see him retire after this season.  I know everyone here loves Reggie and thinks the world of him but the guy is 35 and going to be turning 36 during the 2014 season.

 

A 35 year old guy just coming off ACL surgery . . . it's pretty questionable as to how effective he will be on the field.  Honestly it would not surprise me if Reggie is the #3 or even #4 receiver.  

 

I agree his leadership is what is going to be missed the most.  I'd sign the guy up to be the WR coach after he retires as a player if we have the room for him.  

[YOUR GM]

Brazill looks like a third option at best. Yes, he can improve with experience, but that's not a reason not to upgrade the position now. (His catch in the Lions game was a huge play for the team, but there was nothing special about it.) And the problem with Brazill is that you can't rely on him. One more drug violation and he's out for 8 games. He's a limited player who has a lot of work to do before he's even able to produce like a #3. You don't neglect a chance to make your team better because of him. Also, he wasn't a rookie; he played in 15 games last year.

 

Brazill is not the reason there was no need to upgrade the position now, Wayne, Hilton, Rogers, Fleener and Allen are. Brazill is good depth and a capable 3rd option/2nd option in a pinch. 

 

And since we're dealing in hypotheticals now, one can be applied to my argument as well. One more injury and Nicks may be out for the year. Brazill is basically a 2nd year receiver, having been suspended the 1st portion of the season, and having another chunk of the season wasted in an offense trying to feature Trent Richardson and DHB as it's main weapons. He really only got work real work as a 2nd/3rd receiver in the playoff game, and was able to produce, despite his hiccups in the game as well. 

 

 

Rogers is the one who I think has the kind of talent and ability that are worth taking a longer view on. But his off the field issues make him a risk as well.

And then there's Reggie's health, which isn't a given.

 

This is all a moot point considering Nicks has just as many red flags with his health concerns as well. So our insurance is another player who needs insurance behind him, potentially?

 

 

 

I'm not indicting anyone, nor am I writing them off; as I've said, I like our young guys. But all things considered, the players we already had aren't good enough or reliable enough to put off making a considerable upgrade.

 

 

That's where we disagree. I think the sum of our receiving corps is fine. Are there question marks? Sure. But certainly not as many as there are with our interior line and secondary. An immediate move wasn't needed

 

You're saying two different things here. Are we going to be run-oriented, or are we going to rely on our receivers more? Either way, having better play from that position is important, because the way our guys played after Reggie got hurt just wasn't good enough.

 

I don't see how i'm saying 2 different things? What i'm saying is, if we're truly going to be run oriented, our depth at receiver can be considered sufficient as it was, considering there will be less snaps with more than 2 receivers on the field anyways. The way our guys played after Reggie went down IMPROVED once we actually started throwing the ball before the game was already out of hand. I think the experience gained when we went to a spread attack the last few games of the season yielded positive results, and only strengthened the unit. Once we ditched the DHB project and gave the young receivers an opportunity, we were able to put up points

 

Solid line play starts with talent. Our talent, particularly at center and right guard, wasn't very good. It's hard to take seriously, I know, but I really mean it when I say almost anyone would be better than Satele was. Chemistry and experience don't totally make up for substandard talent.

 

And with Holmes we don't know if we have either. Well, we know we don't have experience but we also don't know if he's a significant improvement talent-wise to Satele. 

 

And like I've said, I'm NOT gung-ho about starting Holmes. If it were up to me, I'd have brought in a veteran center. But I understand the approach with Holmes, because you can't gradually work a young center into the rotation. At a certain point, you have to give him a chance to play, and that involves going all-in. It's the most questionable aspect of Grigson's plan this offseason, but I understand why he's doing it.

 

Why can't you gradually work him in? Can he not play snaps at guard until he's ready to man the duties of center? It's not like he has to play center exclusively in order to gain any experience

We have Reggie coming back from a serious injury at 35 years old, Allen coming back from a serious injury, and all three of our backs have question marks regarding their health. The young guys got extensive playing time last season, and didn't perform very well, outside of half a game here or there. Doesn't mean they're finished products, but whatever potential they have isn't reason enough to put off a reasonable opportunity to improve the position. Nicks is exactly that -- a low cost, high potential player with proven NFL ability. Has nothing to do with having a #1 receiver (and I disagree with your opinion on the value of the position).

 

I don't know if I agree with your use of the word "extensive." Rogers got starters reps in 2 or 3 games and Brazill had his 1st career start in the playoff game. And while i don't have a problem acquiring cheap talent when available, i don't feel like it's low risk in the sense that we may potentially be stunting the growth of either T.Y. or Rogers by acquiring Nicks. For all we know, one or both of them could end up being better than him (And do not twist my words to make it seem as if i'm suggesting they already are) 

 

 

 

Don't lump me in with people who aren't concerned about our interior line situation.

 

Fair enough.

 

 

Adding Nicks on a low cost, low risk deal is nothing like the Richardson trade. It costs the team a little bit of money, and if it doesn't work for any reason, or proves to be unnecessary, it doesn't hurt the team's ability to add other players now or in the future.

Nor is it reactionary. It's the most pro-active move he made this year, rather than waiting to see if Reggie and Allen would be 100%, waiting to see how the young receivers look, risking having only Hilton as a proven producer, he instead made sure we have a proven veteran who can play right away. And the biggest weapon we have -- Andrew Luck -- deserves to have reliable players to throw the ball to. Adding a playmaker isn't a bad thing, even if it costs us Brazill or Whalen outright. You don't ignore opportunities to improve just so you can hold on to the hope that one of your "just-a-guy" youngsters develops into something more than "just-a-guy."

 

I didn't say acquiring Nicks is like the Richardson deal. I said it was reactionary like the Richardson deal. What happened to trusting your evaluation process and allowing the coaches to do their jobs? If the sum of our receiving core was older and lacked potential, I would have no issue with looking at a big name in free agency. We're not even giving our receivers the normal amount of growth period required to start reaping the fruits of their collective potential. If Reggie didn't get hurt, I doubt we would be looking at receiver this agressively right now. That's why I feel it was reactionary. 

 

Also, i'm ok with having "just-a-guy" as my 3rd and 4th receivers. I'm not ok with having "just-a-guy" as my starting guards and center

[YOUR GM]

The guy isn`t so Clueless to think Griff & Brazill are finished products like you suggest, but one Can Sense they don`t have star upsides like Nicks has already shown.

Don`t see Griff EVER being a solid NFL Starter, and Brazill is still mystified by the art of route running. I wonder what he does in practice and if he ever studies.

You know Nothing of Holmes who may be a Pro Bowler someday soon, as Costa is at best a mediocre backup.

 

 

 

I never said Griff or Brazill had Nicks upside like you suggest. I did say they would be sufficient options in the passing game as 3rd and 4th options, if given a chance, however. 

 

You know nothing of Holmes either, which makes your opinion that he  may be a pro bowler no more valid than my opinion that we're in trouble next year on the interior line

[gacker65]

Look , I am not here to argue but it takes a team to win games and that includes any and every player on the roster. If the Colts put Nicks and Wayne out on the field at the same time it will not effect TY as a team player. I think your just being a little short sighted in the bigger picture.

Actually, I am the opposite.  I am looking long term.  This isn't about being a "Team" player, it is about slowing the growth of our WRs.  So if I want our WRs to continue to grow, then I guess I'm not seeing the big picture.

[gacker65]

TY is a specialty type receiver who has a number of limitations. There is a nice article about that on here today.

Thank you for the Information.  I will read it.

[sixfive]

I'm not going to say if.  I'm going to say when Nicks puts up big numbers this year he will be resigned to another contract.  I love Reggie but we need someone to step up and fill his spot when he is gone ACL injuries are tricky, Nicks provides a solid go to guy for luck.  I know TY is really coming on, I just feel when Nicks puts up good numbers we will be seeing him hanging around for a minute.  the WR corp is goiing to be dangerous.

[crazycolt1]

Actually, I am the opposite.  I am looking long term.  This isn't about being a "Team" player, it is about slowing the growth of our WRs.  So if I want our WRs to continue to grow, then I guess I'm not seeing the big picture.

If Nicks does turn out to be the player he is capable of being TY will get his regardless. Nicks is only 25 years old so his presence will help TY. There are 50+ plays a game so receivers getting time is no problem. As far as receivers "growing",part of that is being on the sidelines watching Wayne and Nicks. There will be plays that will have 2 tight end sets also. Do you feel those plays will hamper the "growth" of receivers? I feel you are being too critical in the bigger picture. Different defenses will also dictate what offensive plays are called. 

[gacker65]

If Nicks does turn out to be the player he is capable of being TY will get his regardless. Nicks is only 25 years old so his presence will help TY. There are 50+ plays a game so receivers getting time is no problem. As far as receivers "growing",part of that is being on the sidelines watching Wayne and Nicks. There will be plays that will have 2 tight end sets also. Do you feel those plays will hamper the "growth" of receivers? I feel you are being too critical in the bigger picture. Different defenses will also dictate what offensive plays are called. 

No, matter how Nicks turns out, he is a lose-lose situation for our young WRs (especially TY).  You do not learn any thing on the sidelines, as you have no knowledge of what play was called.  You learn more from doing than watching, fact of life.

 

When you ask about 2 TEs, are you referring to an "Ace" of 2 TEs and 2 WRs with 1 RB.  A set using 2 TEs, 1 WR, FB, and RB.  With the "Ace" set of 2 TEs, 2 WRs and RB, as a WR, as the 2nd WR, you are involved with the play as the 1st WR. 

 

As far as being to critical, maybe I am.  If you look past this year, there are 2 ways this can go;  1- Reggie retires after next season and our young WRs continue to grow or 2- we lose our young WRs in FA and have to start all over again.

[USAFHoosier]

Thinking that no matter how Nicks plays he won't be here is crazy.  If he shows he is back from injury 100% and has a good season he should be brought back since Reggie is almost done.

[adamthyst]

If he plays like he did in 2010-2011, he's worth every penny. He's still a good WR, he's just constantly hurt and that doesn't go well. Depending on how the season goes this year, we'll see if he was worth it.

[Smash Mouth]

Thinking that no matter how Nicks plays he won't be here is crazy.  If he shows he is back from injury 100% and has a good season he should be brought back since Reggie is almost done.

I agree with this.  The Colts have no idea how well or quickly #87 will really recover.  Unless your Adrian Peterson, its usually year 2 that an athlete fully recovers.  That's not good at Reggie's age.  It will be a good problem to have if in 2015 the Colts have to decide whether or not to pay Hakeem big money because he has a good season with us.  Having said this, the Colts have to develop Darrick Rogers if they really believe  in his upside. Someone on the current roister has to be ready to step up in 2015