Something I think the Colts should copy

[ColtsHappy]

I must admit I like this suggestion a lot - but even better to  me - is that Seattle spends a huge block of time every wednesday just doing tackling drills and working on their tackling fundamentals. Yeah, that is EVERY wednesday.

 

Talk about something that our team desperately needs......

[Gavin]

I must admit I like this suggestion a lot - but even better to  me - is that Seattle spends a huge block of time every wednesday just doing tackling drills and working on their tackling fundamentals. Yeah, that is EVERY wednesday.

 

Talk about something that our team desperately needs......

Instead half our defense is on twitter often

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

The Seahawks thought the trade was necessary and thought the risk was worth the reward. The same could be said of the Richardson trade. Doesn't mean it was a good one.

 

As for the "you never know about a drafted player" reasoning, why are we so upset with giving up a first rounder for Richardson?

 

You draft based on the information you have at the time, and you hope it works out. You acquire veteran players based on the information you have, just the same. Problem is the cost is much higher, and if you're also giving up picks, it's double the risk. 

 

Again, not trying to be critical of the Seahawks. I'm only saying that they made a bad trade, just like we did, only theirs was arguably worse considering the cost and the production. If it were up to me, I wouldn't have done either deal. But that doesn't mean I think either front office is doing a bad job. Their respective records suggest otherwise.

The Seahawk trade is BETTER than ours because they have a guy who is a PROVEN QUALITY PLAYER. Richardson to this point with what I saw may not be all he was suppose to be. Only time will tell, but certainly Cleveland's quick trigger of letting him go could be an indicator. Double risk? Only if he gets hurt, or you don't get return on the investment. I believe our trade was done out of desperation honestly, never the best time to do a trade. My hope is Richardson comes in next year & just balls so we will all be happy.

[Superman]

The Seahawk trade is BETTER than ours because they have a guy who is a PROVEN QUALITY PLAYER. Richardson to this point with what I saw may not be all he was suppose to be. Only time will tell, but certainly Cleveland's quick trigger of letting him go could be an indicator. Double risk? Only if he gets hurt, or you don't get return on the investment. I believe our trade was done out of desperation honestly, never the best time to do a trade. My hope is Richardson comes in next year & just balls so we will all be happy.

 

Richardson could be an All Pro next year, and I still wouldn't really like the trade, personally. The production from a great RB is easily replaced, even if his dynamic play making is not. Richardson is not and probably never will be a dynamic playmaker, even if he winds up being highly productive.

 

What I disagree with you about is Harvin being proven vs. Richardson. Yes, Harvin is a better player, but the Seahawks gave up significantly more for him, both in terms of picks and money. That's why it's a double risk. (By the way, the word risk implies that you don't know what return you're going to get on the investment. And Seattle's investment was two-fold, picks and money.) You adjust to compensate for what they gave up, and you adjust to acknowledge that Richardson produced more for us than Harvin did for Seattle, and I don't see how our trade was worse. They paid a ton more, and got considerably less.

 

And if history is any indicator, Harvin will continue to get hurt in the future. Not only has he been impacted by injuries every year of his career, it's not common for a player with injury concerns to suddenly turn into an ironman. It usually gets worse, not better.

[Superman]

Instead half our defense is on twitter often

 

Where does "instead" come from? That word implies that their being on Twitter prevents them from doing something else, like working on their tackling.

[Coffeedrinker]

The Seahawk trade is BETTER than ours because they have a guy who is a PROVEN QUALITY PLAYER. Richardson to this point with what I saw may not be all he was suppose to be. Only time will tell, but certainly Cleveland's quick trigger of letting him go could be an indicator. Double risk? Only if he gets hurt, or you don't get return on the investment. I believe our trade was done out of desperation honestly, never the best time to do a trade. My hope is Richardson comes in next year & just balls so we will all be happy.

I'm coming late to this conversation so I apologize but I just wanted to point out a few things.

 

Seahawks paid top dollar for a guy that had "proven" to be a below average WR and a good returner.  The Colts gave up a high draft pick but is paying very little for a guy who, in his rookie season, proved to be an average running back with flashes of being dominant.

 

No matter how you try to play it the trade for Harvin was not good in 2013, Harvin did not help them get to the SB although he did show in the SB why the Seahawks felt the trade made be beneficial, the Colts got more production from TRich than the Hawks got from Harvin.

 

The 2nd thing I wanted to point out was your comment about how quickly Cleveland traded him.  It is a concern but it would be more concerning if it was done by the FO that drafted him but it wasn't, it was done by a new staff that was trying to build up some draft picks to implement their 5 year plan (of course as it turns out they were just gathering draft picks for the next FO)

[Gavin]

Where does "instead" come from? That word implies that their being on Twitter prevents them from doing something else, like working on their tackling.

well I never tried to tackle someone while talking on twitter...Not anywhere near impossible......But very hard to say the least

[Superman]

well I never tried to tackle someone while talking on twitter...Not anywhere near impossible......But very hard to say the least

 

So do you have a picture in your mind of players using Twitter while they're on the practice field? They're tweeting instead of doing their drills? Or while doing their drills?

 

The picture in my mind is of players going to practice and working their butts off, then using Twitter in their leisure time. Your premise sort of suggests that they should have no leisure time.

[pacolts56]

The Seahawk trade is BETTER than ours because they have a guy who is a PROVEN QUALITY PLAYER. Richardson to this point with what I saw may not be all he was suppose to be. Only time will tell, but certainly Cleveland's quick trigger of letting him go could be an indicator. Double risk? Only if he gets hurt, or you don't get return on the investment. I believe our trade was done out of desperation honestly, never the best time to do a trade. My hope is Richardson comes in next year & just balls so we will all be happy.

If Richardson becomes the consistent, effective "chain mover" he's supposed to be...I'll be happy too, and our passing attack will benefit from that....hopefully spelling a legitimate Super Bowl run. But I refuse to accept anyone's final analysis of the trade until next season, at the earliest, is in the books.

 

Percy Harvin's situation is kind of an offensive version of Bob Sanders.

 

A uniquely gifted, and now a VERY WELL-PAID player who can't stay healthy, but managed to at just the right time to display those talents. Why Matt Prater....who can kick the ball to Pluto....was told to do what he did is inexplicable, and Harvin might be the last guy I'd ever try that against. But the draft picks and salary $$$ Seattle gave up are still a high price to pay for a "cherry-on-top" kickoff return and little else.

 

The jury is still out on these two trades....but thanks to a solid, physical and deep 53-man roster, the Seahawks now have the salve of a Super Bowl ring, even if Harvin remains the injured pain in the neck he's been for most of his entire career.

[Gavin]

So do you have a picture in your mind of players using Twitter while they're on the practice field? They're tweeting instead of doing their drills? Or while doing their drills?

 

The picture in my mind is of players going to practice and working their butts off, then using Twitter in their leisure time. Your premise sort of suggests that they should have no leisure time.

Of course they should but do you think great players became great by studying the latest fad or discussing on twitter something about some movie/music star....By no means am I saying they dont practice hard.......Although one has to wonder if they practice smart with the way they tackle on most Sundays........Practice hard a concern? No......Putting in the EXTRA time and practicing part...Definitly is a concern to me...Of course they should have some free time, They just went through a full season plus post season...But that dont mean you just wait till next season starts to get better

[Superman]

Of course they should but do you think great players became great by studying the latest fad or discussing on twitter something about some movie/music star....By no means am I saying they dont practice hard.......Although one has to wonder if they practice smart with the way they tackle on most Sundays........Practice hard a concern? No......Putting in the EXTRA time and practicing part...Definitly is a concern to me...Of course they should have some free time, They just went through a full season plus post season...But that dont mean you just wait till next season starts to get better

 

That's a separate discussion. Everyone needs leisure time. Doesn't matter if it's reading books, watching movies, playing video games, raising honeybees, whatever. Twitter is just another form of recreation in a tech-friendly world. 

 

I understand people having a problem with Twitter from a PR standpoint, even though I disagree with the overall criticism (athletes don't need Twitter to get in trouble, just ask Riley Cooper). But you're basically suggesting that players should spend every waking moment working, and that's just not realistic. Especially when it comes to the physically taxing aspects of their profession.

[Gavin]

That's a separate discussion. Everyone needs leisure time. Doesn't matter if it's reading books, watching movies, playing video games, raising honeybees, whatever. Twitter is just another form of recreation in a tech-friendly world. 

 

I understand people having a problem with Twitter from a PR standpoint, even though I disagree with the overall criticism (athletes don't need Twitter to get in trouble, just ask Riley Cooper). But you're basically suggesting that players should spend every waking moment working, and that's just not realistic. Especially when it comes to the physically taxing aspects of their profession.

Every waking moment is an exaggeration dont ya think......Im saying an hour...maybe 2 a day or every other day....Great players dont become great by taking almost 6 months off

[Superman]

Every waking moment is an exaggeration dont ya think......Im saying an hour...maybe 2 a day or every other day....Great players dont become great by taking almost 6 months off

 

I don't know what you're talking about anymore. I don't think any player takes 6 months off, and I don't know what gives you that impression. 

 

Your initial comment was that our players sit on Twitter rather than practicing tackling. All I'm saying is that that's not true, it's a logical fallacy. If you think they should handle practice differently, that's one thing. But it has nothing to do with Twitter or any of their other leisure activities. 

[Jason_]

Every waking moment is an exaggeration dont ya think......Im saying an hour...maybe 2 a day or every other day....Great players dont become great by taking almost 6 months off

 

Your last several posts have been an exaggeration...don't ya think?

[Gavin]

Your last several posts have been an exaggeration...don't ya think?

Har har har......Dying of laughter here. I explained what I meant in my last post

[BBColts]

Who said anything about an ankle sprain having the same effect as a torn ACL?  Oh, I see you can't really make a point so you have to make something up and make a point about that.  Nice try but that doesn't work on this forum. And I'm pretty sure T Rich has never had a torn ACL.  As far as how it equates, the Seahawks have proven they can find probowl players in the 4th and 5th rounds, so they gave up quite a bit to get him.

 

Two comments about the rest; one I've never defended the trade with Richardson, I was only pointing out how your comment lacked knowledge of the situation.  Two, you comment about "based on current time playing in the NFL...: also shows some ignorance, before Lynch went to Seattle there was nothing in is playing time in the NFL that indicated he would be a probowl back, yet that is what he became.

 

What a dumb post that fails to address anything I mentioned in mine. You compared a 4th and 5th round pick for a back who never had any major injury to a first round draft pick to a guy who had knee surgery.       

As for the ACL comment, that was an error on my part. I meant cartilage surgery, which is serious in itself. That I will own up to.

[Jason_]

Har har har......Dying of laughter here. I explained what I meant in my last post

 

If you'd explained what you meant in your first post instead of the last, and left Twitter completely out of the conversation, then perhaps that would have avoided a lot of the confusion.

[Coffeedrinker]

What a dumb post that fails to address anything I mentioned in mine. You compared a 4th and 5th round pick for a back who never had any major injury to a first round draft pick to a guy who had knee surgery.     

 

I am pretty sure I did not compare a 4th and 5th round pick to a first round draft pick to a guy who had knee surgery.  You commented that the Seahawks did not trade a 1st round pick for RB that blah blah blah and I stated that what they did was trade two draft picks for a Rb that was considered a bust, lacks break away speed and coming off an ankle injury.  Anything else that you have added to that is on you.

 

It was someone else that pointed out the Seahawks traded a lot more for Harvin than the Colts did for Richardson and that the Colts got more production from Richardson than the Seahawks got from Harvin.

[Gavin]

If you'd explained what you meant in your first post instead of the last, and left Twitter completely out of the conversation, then perhaps that would have avoided a lot of the confusion.

Refer to my last post...I have moved on

[Jason_]

Refer to my last post...I have moved on

Congratulations

[thedude]

When Seattle built this current team, do you think they copied anyone? No, that owner found a coach who sold him on his philosophy and they built a team which fit that philosophy.

Pete Carroll doesn't force players to fit into a particular scheme.

[BOTT]

What a dumb post that fails to address anything I mentioned in mine. You compared a 4th and 5th round pick for a back who never had any major injury to a first round draft pick to a guy who had knee surgery.       

As for the ACL comment, that was an error on my part. I meant cartilage surgery, which is serious in itself. That I will own up to.

Arthroscopic surgery to clean up some lose cartilage isn't serious

[thedude]

has he been impacted by injuries every year of his career,

Not true.  Check his complete history. 

[Superman]

Not true.  Check his complete history. 

 

What, you want to distinguish between injuries and migraines? He has missed games every year but 2011 due to being physical unavailable. And he missed weeks of practice at a time in 2011, so he was impacted by injuries that year as well.

 

What's troubling is that it's gotten worse the past two years. He's played in 11 out of a possible 35 games the past two seasons, including the playoffs, and had two very significant injuries in those two seasons. It's kind of hard to say "if he's healthy," because the odds don't favor him suddenly not being an injury concern.

 

And what's ironic about this is how much complaining Colts fans do about our players missing practice and games due to injury, but are so willing to ignore the injury impact of players from other teams.

[Dustin]

Not true.  Check his complete history. 

 

Maybe you should check his complete history:

 

http://www.kffl.com/player/20748/nfl/injury_history/percy-harvin

[thedude]

What, you want to distinguish between injuries and migraines?

He did not miss games from migraines.  He missed practices. 

[Superman]

He did not miss games from migraines.  He missed practices. 

 

So was he impacted by them? Because that's what I said.

 

And for the record, he did miss games with migraines. Here's one: http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4748583

[sweetsurrender]

When Seattle built this current team, do you think they copied anyone? No, that owner found a coach who sold him on his philosophy and they built a team which fit that philosophy.

Pete Carroll doesn't force players to fit into a particular scheme.

Are you seriously saying Seattle has no scheme?

[OffensivelyPC]

He did not miss games from migraines.  He missed practices. 

No he definitely missed games with migraines.  He missed even more by starting the game and going out after a migraine resurfaced.

[thedude]

So was he impacted by them? Because that's what I said.

 

And for the record, he did miss games with migraines. Here's one: http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4748583

Splitting hairs is your forte?

[thedude]

No he definitely missed games with migraines.  He missed even more by starting the game and going out after a migraine resurfaced.

Nope, he missed practices with migraines. He did get hurt in 2012 late in the season during an MVP year and he did have pre season surgery this year, but prior to the ankle injury of 2012, he missed very few games.

People sometimes see what they want to see in order to justify their view or opinion.

[Superman]

Splitting hairs is your forte?

What's funny is that you're the one splitting hairs. I said he was impacted by injuries every year, and you are trying to find a way to argue that he wasn't. In fact, he has been.

[Superman]

No he definitely missed games with migraines. He missed even more by starting the game and going out after a migraine resurfaced.

Yup. I posted a link above pointing out a specific game he missed because of migraines.

[thedude]

What's funny is that you're the one splitting hairs. I said he was impacted by injuries every year, and you are trying to find a way to argue that he wasn't. In fact, he has been.

I'm impacted by eating a heavy meal. I'm impacted by life. Bottom line, he did not miss games because of headaches. He missed practices. While going through the migraine thing, he played at an MVP level on game day.

[Superman]

I'm impacted by eating a heavy meal. I'm impacted by life. Bottom line, he did not miss games because of headaches. He missed practices. While going through the migraine thing, he played at an MVP level on game day.

 

Did you care to look at the link above? He missed at least one game his rookie year with the migraine issue. Or is looking at a link "splitting hairs"? Between the missed game and the missed practices, it's obvious that he was "impacted." Just like Ahmad Bradshaw was impacted by injuries in 2012, even though he only missed one(?) game. When you miss a bunch of practices, it's worthy of consideration.

 

And he certainly didn't play at an MVP level that year, or any year, IMO. He definitely had a good year in 2012 before he got hurt, and some might call that year MVP level, but I think that's a stretch. Either way, he had the migraines managed by then, and it wasn't really an issue.

 

By the way, all of this is way beside the point. Unless your argument is that Harvin doesn't have a troubling injury history, it's irrelevant. 

[thedude]

Harvin's first three seasons, he missed a total of 3 games. None because of a migraine. Three games out of 48. In 2012 he played nine games and sustained a season ending ankle injury. Stuff like that happens to skill position players this year he has pre-season hip surgery because of a muscle tear. Seattle was very cautious in how quickly they brought him back because they knew he was going to be a game changer when the time came.

[thedude]

I'm done with this one. Minds are made up in spite of the facts.

[John Waylon]

Well fire Pagano and hire Seattle's DC.

Fire Grigson too. Trent Richardson... SMH

 

I read this and saw it's one awful like and then read this

 

1postandyoureonignore

 

And saw all it's likes and I have been rolling on the floor laughing. 

[Superman]

I'm done with this one. Minds are made up in spite of the facts.

 

I'll say.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4748583

 

EDEN PRAIRIE, Minn. -- Minnesota Vikings wide receiver Percy Harvin is still struggling with migraine headaches.

 

The chronic problem forced the rookie from Florida to miss the Vikings' game against theCincinnati Bengals last week. Minnesota coach Brad Childress said Harvin participated in a walk-through with the team on Wednesday morning, but he wasn't at the afternoon practice.

 

Harvin is seeing a specialist for his condition, which Childress called "debilitating."

 

 

How can you continue saying he didn't miss any games due to migraines? Talk about minds being made up in spite of facts...

[Dustin]

I'm done with this one. Minds are made up in spite of the facts.

 

"Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored."