Jim Harbaugh protests non-call: 'There was a hold'

[bayone]

San Francisco’s final offensive play of a most heartbreaking, frustrating 34-31
loss to Baltimore. On a fourth-and-goal play from the 5 with 1:50 remaining ......

 

Although the Niners’ coach said he wanted to handle the situation with “class
and grace,” his postgame words reflected his actions on the sideline.

 

Harbaugh thought the coverage was a little too tight and made his best holding
gestures toward the officials after the ball fell to the ground and there was no
flag.

“There was no question in my mind there was a hold on Crabtree on that last
one,” Harbaugh said. “In my opinion, I thought that the drive should have
continued.” 

 

Crabtree took a more diplomatic approach than his coach. “If somebody grabs me,
you always expect the call, but you can’t whine to the referee,” Crabtree said.
“You just have to take it like a man, take the ill.”

 

 

Harbaugh also had issues with two plays involving 49ers nickel cornerback
Chris Culliver. On the first, an incomplete deep pass for Ravens wide receiver
Torrey Smith late in the first half, Harbaugh thought Smith should have been
flagged for offensive interference. (On the following play, Flacco hit Jacoby
Jones for a 56-yard touchdown.) Then in the fourth quarter, Harbaugh was unhappy
about a pass interference call against Culliver on a pass for Anquan Boldin,
extending a Baltimore drive that ended in a field goal. 

 

http://aol.sportingnews.com/nfl/story/2013-02-04/super-bowl-2013-jim-harbaugh-holding-non-call-crabtree-jimmy-smith-ravens-49ers?icid=maing-grid7%7Cmain5%7Cdl1%7Csec1_lnk3%26pLid%3D265778

[Dustin]

You can't throw a flag in that scenario. If you do, you're basically handing San Fran the Super Bowl on an iffy call.

[Jules]

It pains me to say this but I have lost plenty of respect for Captain Comeback. There were some questionable calls against the Broncos too but did you hear Manning complain? No, maybe now I can truly see why Peyton turned down the better team on paper in the 49ers. I am not a huge Fox fan but he at least seems like he will take a loss with dignity.

 

How can the 49ers even complain IMO? If not for that blackout period I feel they were in position to maybe get beaten down in embarrassing historical fashion, they were already.......

 

 

I am glad John Harbaugh won now. He handled this entire season and postseason and Super Bowl run with nothing but poise and dignity.

[RGIII]

You can't throw a flag in that scenario. If you do, you're basically handing San Fran the Super Bowl on an iffy call.

 

I wouldn't call that an iffy call.  It seemed like a pretty clear example of holding.  However, I think it's more important for the refs to be consistent than it is for them to follow the rule to the letter and they were letting those plays go all night.

 

It's a little unfortunate and Harbaugh is technically right... but there are routinely much worse calls and non-calls made in the NFL.  This one was at least understandable.

[southwest1]

You can't throw a flag in that scenario. If you do, you're basically handing San Fran the Super Bowl on an iffy call.

As much as I was pulling for the 49ers last night, you are exactly right Dustin. You gotta let the players play. What killed San Fran was that pathetic lack of preparation on that Safety. Great Game! Baltimore won fair & square. Jim Harbaugh just needs to cool his jets & accept the loss like a man.

 

Oh yeah, FG Kicker David Aikers wasn't exactly money last night either. I'm happy for Ed Reed & bummed for Mr. "Straight Cash Homie" Randy Moss. Hey, somebody had to lose last night right? 

[Dustin]

I wouldn't call that an iffy call.  It seemed like a pretty clear example of holding.  However, I think it's more important for the refs to be consistent than it is for them to follow the rule to the latter and they were letting those plays go all night.

 

It's a little unfortunate and Harbaugh is technically right... but there are routinely much worse calls and non-calls made in the NFL.  This one was at least understandable.

 

Here's a breakdown of the play: http://imgur.com/a/SGoSi#3

 

It's written by a Ravens fan though so take it for what it's worth.

[ruksak]

You can't throw a flag in that scenario. If you do, you're basically handing San Fran the Super Bowl on an iffy call.

Yep. 

 

If Crabtree doesn't push back, he gets the call. At best, it could've been called as offsetting, replay the down. At best....

 

NEVER have the refs made a call like that in the last minutes of the SB. They always let the players play and only make a call if it was egregious in nature and the call MUST be made. 

 

It was terrible play-calling by SF, period. Why throw a fade in that situation? Terrible idea.

[southwest1]

CK had plenty of opportunities in the red zone that they settled for in FG's. When you get in the red zone, you can't turn the ball over & you must score 6 not 3 points. That questionable interference call meant nothing. 

[RGIII]

Here's a breakdown of the play: http://imgur.com/a/SGoSi#3

 

It's written by a Ravens fan though so take it for what it's worth.

 

The problem is that the contact by Crabtree was necessitated by the hold by Smith.  I don't think it's reasonable to expect an NFL player to flop in that situation just to try to get the refs to make the right call.

 

Screenshots are a poor way to show what happened, IMO.

[Dustin]

Yep. 

 

If Crabtree doesn't push back, he gets the call. At best, it could've been called as offsetting, replay the down. At best....

 

NEVER have the refs made a call like that in the last minutes of the SB. They always let the players play and only make a call if it was egregious in nature and the call MUST be made. 

 

It was terrible play-calling by SF, period. Why throw a fade in that situation? Terrible idea.

 

They went with the fade with the sole intention of getting the flag IMO. And even if your going to try a fade, throw it to the self declared "greatest of all time" and not Michael Crabtree.

[Dustin]

The problem is that the contact by Crabtree was necessitated by the hold by Smith.  I don't think it's reasonable to expect an NFL player to flop in that situation just to try to get the refs to make the right call.

 

Screenshots are a poor way to show what happened, IMO.

 

Interference doesn't incorporate intent into it though. He was forced to do it to make a play on the ball, but if Crabtree doesn't push-off then they probably get the first down.

[RGIII]

They went with the fade with the sole intention of getting the flag IMO. And even if your going to try a fade, throw it to the self declared "greatest of all time" and not Michael Crabtree.

 

That's a major reach.  You don't call plays to draw penalties although you do enjoy the possibility of a defensive penalty on that play.  Smith is an inexperienced and inconsistent CB and Crabtree was hauling in nearly everything in reach.  It was a good go-to matchup, particularly considering that Randy Moss is not what he once was.

[Dustin]

That's a major reach.  You don't call plays to draw penalties although you do enjoy the possibility of a defensive penalty on that play.  Smith is an inexperienced and inconsistent CB and Crabtree was hauling in nearly everything in reach.  It was a good go-to matchup, particularly considering that Randy Moss is not what he once was.

 

Well I mean obviously they were trying to get the TD as well, but I felt that Jim thought that Crabtree would either catch the pass or there would be some type of penalty on it and that's why he went with the fade instead of another play.

[ruksak]

They went with the fade with the sole intention of getting the flag IMO. And even if your going to try a fade, throw it to the self declared "greatest of all time" and not Michael Crabtree.

Yeah....that fade call is something you call on 1st, 2nd or 3rd down......NOT in an all-or-nothing 4th down, last try scenario. Not with Kaep. 

[RGIII]

Interference doesn't incorporate intent into it though. He was forced to do it to make a play on the ball, but if Crabtree doesn't push-off then they probably get the first down.

 

Which is why it was a bad no-call if you isolate it from the context of the rest of the game (again, they were letting those go all game so they had to let this one go, too).  Intent has nothing to do with it, the hold precipitated the contact so the hold should have been called.  This wasn't a situation where both players were jockeying for position down the field which would be a no-call situation, the refs just appeared to miss Smith's grab.

 

Well I mean obviously they were trying to get the TD as well, but I felt that Jim thought that Crabtree would either catch the pass or there would be some type of penalty on it and that's why he went with the fade instead of another play.

 

Well, yeah.  You throw the fade when you think your man can beat their man.  That's all it comes down to in the end.

[Dustin]

Which is why it was a bad no-call if you isolate it from the context of the rest of the game (again, they were letting those go all game so they had to let this one go, too).  Intent has nothing to do with it, the hold precipitated the contact so the hold should have been called.  This wasn't a situation where both players were jockeying for position down the field which would be a no-call situation, the refs just appeared to miss Smith's grab.

 

 

Well, yeah.  You throw the fade when you think your man can beat their man.  That's all it comes down to in the end.

 

The fade on 4th down with the Super Bowl on the line was a bad call regardless of how they matched up though. That's not a throw you make your QB who has only started 10 games make with the biggest game of the season on the line. I know it's easier to say this in hindsight and it may have seemed like a good Idea at the time, but I disagree with the play-call.

[ColtsBlueFL]

I wouldn't call that an iffy call.  It seemed like a pretty clear example of holding.  However, I think it's more important for the refs to be consistent than it is for them to follow the rule to the letter and they were letting those plays go all night.

 

It's a little unfortunate and Harbaugh is technically right... but there are routinely much worse calls and non-calls made in the NFL.  This one was at least understandable.

 

Technically, Jim is right.  However, there are two buts here...

 

but, the refs were essentially letting them play.  There were few penalties all game.

but2, Crabtree ran a horrendous route, straight forwardinto the defender, thus abolishing a penalty in that scenario as he then tried to slip off to the pylon on a fade,  He should have made a juke a quickly inside and then blasted out toward the deep pylon.  Would have made the catch.  

 

Rather than try to get open and make the catch, he tried to engage the defender and draw a penalty at the end of the Super Bowl.  One where refs were letting them play. where there were few flags.  But the play call was suspect too.  Why not Davis or Moss in that scenario?  Why Crabtree?

[hawkeyes]

You can't throw a flag in that scenario. If you do, you're basically handing San Fran the Super Bowl on an iffy call.

 

IF its a foul on the first play of the game its a foul on the last play as well!

 

I think the Ravens got away with PI on an earlier play that series as well ... and if the shoe had been on the other foot the Ravens fans / coaches etc would be crying too!   As would we if that had happened to our Colts!

 

As far as being a horrible call play - they had 2 seconds to make a play the blitz was getting there every down that series.   

 

I said as soon as Gore didnt score a TD that they would be held, I didnt see it as destiny just knew in my heart that would be the case!

[RGIII]

Technically, Jim is right.  However, there are two buts here...

 

but, the refs were essentially letting them play.  There were few penalties all game.

but2, Crabtree ran a horrendous route, straight forwardinto the defender, thus abolishing a penalty in that scenario as he then tried to slip off to the pylon on a fade,  He should have made a juke a quickly inside and then blasted out toward the deep pylon.  Would have made the catch.  

 

Rather than try to get open and make the catch, he tried to engage the defender and draw a penalty at the end of the Super Bowl.  One where refs were letting them play. where there were few flags.  But the play call was suspect too.  Why not Davis or Moss in that scenario?  Why Crabtree?

 

Absolutely agreed on the first 'but', I've said so much already.

 

That said, I don't know that I'd say the playcall was suspect because it was a broken play.  You don't call plays with only one option in the NFL and there were other routes being run.  Crabtree might not have been the best option in that situation (I still like that matchup) because he got jammed up badly but Kaepernick couldn't look at more than one spot before heaving it up there.  Someone screwed up in protection because the Ravens had a free blitzer and the 49ers had Frank Gore blocking no one when they could have picked up everyone.  Davis and Moss were both options, Moss appeared to be running a fade on the other side of the field and Davis a curl on the goal line (although he got shoved hard near the goal line, so it's tough to definitively say where he was going).

 

The fade on 4th down with the Super Bowl on the line was a bad call regardless of how they matched up though. That's not a throw you make your QB who has only started 10 games make with the biggest game of the season on the line. I know it's easier to say this in hindsight and it may have seemed like a good Idea at the time, but I disagree with the play-call.

 

It is easier to say so in hindsight.  If Harbaugh trusted Kaepernick to throw the fade and his receivers to catch it, though, then it was as good a call as any.  The only reason it was so disastrous looking was because of what I said above.

[ruksak]

Jim Harbaugh is off-base here.

 

If I'm a SF fan....I protest not running the ball when you're the 4th best running team in football going against one of the worst run stop defenses in the league, whom were without their best run stopper (Ngata). 

 

4 plays.....10 yards to go......a wasted timeout to spare a delay penalty that tipped the Ravens off to their play-call. 3 throws to a shaky Crabtree on the same side of the field. A QB that predetermined his target, everytime...and a fade route call as their last ditch effort. 

[pacolts56]

I'm curious if anyone asked Jimmy about the "running into the kicker" flag that they DID call....giving Akers a mulligan on his wide-left attempt.

 

Because if you look at the replay Akers wasn't touched. At all. He flopped like a Euro soccer player.

 

The 49ers lost because of their complete failure to cover and/or tackle Jacoby Jones on two huge plays....not because of officiating.

[Fx Stryker]

The refs didn't have the stones to throw a flag. Only reason it wasn't thrown.

[Nostrils]

I wouldn't call that an iffy call.  It seemed like a pretty clear example of holding.  However, I think it's more important for the refs to be consistent than it is for them to follow the rule to the letter and they were letting those plays go all night.

 

It's a little unfortunate and Harbaugh is technically right... but there are routinely much worse calls and non-calls made in the NFL.  This one was at least understandable.

 

 

exactly how I feel... no consistency anymore in NBA or NFL and it's insane

[ruksak]

exactly how I feel... no consistency anymore in NBA or NFL and it's insane

There never has been consistency. Human error is part of the game. It happens. Though in my opinion is human error wasn't part of this issue. 

 

How many of you young folks actually remember the NFL pre-instant replay? 

 

Some of this contorting is laughable. 

[Dustin]

.

[Nostrils]

There never has been consistency. Human error is part of the game. It happens. Though in my opinion is human error wasn't part of this issue. 

 

How many of you young folks actually remember the NFL pre-instant replay? 

 

Some of this contorting is laughable. 

 

 

very true, def respect that.  Let me start by saying:

 

I respect your opinion.  I am 25 years old so nope, I've always had the luxury of instant replay, you've got me there.

 

But... I just wish they would let them "Play".  No specific game or individual play, just feel both NBA and NFL are pretty soft (Head injuries, legal/illegal hits aside for another day) although, you can EASILY argue yesterday was a pretty badly officiated game.

 

All the rules and definitions of those rules have me confused, I think they confuse themselves as well to be honest... I've officiated Pop-Warner & Freshmen HS football games, so I'll be the first to admit I made mistakes, so not trying to knock the refs, just wish they would let em play... that's all I'm saying.

 

You know???? so it can possibly get to the point where (It will never happen) us as men, or women, who love us some football can watch a play like that last play of the game yesterday, orrrrr even go back two weeks to the similar type of conflict between Niners-Falcons on the play where everyone thought Bowman held/interfered with White to send the NIners to the bowl, and say "oh man that was a good, PHYSICAL play" without looking for a flag or foul (NBA) on everythinggggggggggggg....

 

Now, can you explain to me how being old enough to be around pre-instant replay has ANYTHING to do with this lol???.... must have lost you with all the 'contorting' going on.

[ruksak]

Now, can you explain to me how being old enough to be around pre-instant replay has ANYTHING to do with this lol???.... must have lost you with all the 'laughable contorting' going on.

Because I feel some people are losing track of the human element in this matter. Officials aren't omnipotent. There are only a few of them, charged with watching 22 men at full speed. Things get missed. 

 

Also, historically, the SB witnesses fewer penalties (by far) on average compared to regular season or play-off games. How much experience one has as a fan may be cause for a lack of perspective. 

[Dustin]

Wanna know a crazy fact? The teams the Ravens faced throughout the playoffs were penalized for holding 22 times. The Ravens weren't penalized for holding once.

[dw49]

I wouldn't call that an iffy call.  It seemed like a pretty clear example of holding.  However, I think it's more important for the refs to be consistent than it is for them to follow the rule to the letter and they were letting those plays go all night.

 

It's a little unfortunate and Harbaugh is technically right... but there are routinely much worse calls and non-calls made in the NFL.  This one was at least understandable.

 

 

That play as it happened is holding in the NFL game as it's officiated. It was a more blantant foul than the PI that extended the Ravens 4th quarter drive that made it necessary for the 49ers to score a TD rather than a FG. My question would be to those that say "you can't call that penalty in the spot " would be "how bad does the holding have to be to get called?" IMO , this kind of subjectivity that is left to the officials , makes them even more the determining factor in a game like this. Fact is the officials took the game away from SF by not calling what is holding in approx 525 games that preceded that one in the 2012 season. So the thinking is the referees don't take the game away from Balt on a penalty but what about taking the game away from SF by not calling a penalty. 

[jjcolts]

Yeah....that fade call is something you call on 1st, 2nd or 3rd down......NOT in an all-or-nothing 4th down, last try scenario. Not with Kaep. 

I will take it one step farther....the fade play should not be called for Inexperienced QB

 

It pains me to say this but I have lost plenty of respect for Captain Comeback. There were some questionable calls against the Broncos too but did you hear Manning complain? No, maybe now I can truly see why Peyton turned down the better team on paper in the 49ers. I am not a huge Fox fan but he at least seems like he will take a loss with dignity.

 

How can the 49ers even complain IMO? If not for that blackout period I feel they were in position to maybe get beaten down in embarrassing historical fashion, they were already.......

 

 

I am glad John Harbaugh won now. He handled this entire season and postseason and Super Bowl run with nothing but poise and dignity.

You are funny Jules...you sure change your mind a LOT,...no loyalty...LOL 

I am happy for John Harbaugh and feel bad for Jim.

I would have felt the same for the other if it were the other way around.

 

Both great coaches, good off field people and genuine. I don't take offense to Jim's fiery, crazy ways.

I do worry that he will have a heart attack on the sidelines one of these days...

[ruksak]

I will take it one step farther....the fade play should not be called for Inexperienced QB

That's why I said "not with Kaep". That pass isn't his strength. IF.....IF they were gonna call that play, I have to ask, why not leave someone back to block blitzers? That is not a route, out of all routes, that one wants to see thrown under duress. Kaep was getting clocked as he released. 

 

Everything about those 4 plays was suspect and in err. 

[Andy]

I bet you if John Harbaugh were in Jim's shoes, he wouldn't be doing this.

 

What Jim is doing now is quite selfish. What's done is done. They're not going to call the flag now.

[Hans Moleman]

Crabtree was pushing off, as well. In that situation, either the flag gets thrown on both teams resulting in an offsetting penalty, or neither. I think the refs made the right call in letting the players play that out.

 

Calling the fade in that situation was a tactical error on Jim's part. A bigger tactical error was not spreading out wide and isolating Ray Lewis in coverage, because Ray was about as mobile as a statue last night. I think the 49ers gave him far too much respect and didn't capitalize on serious mismatch potential there. Spreading things out more would've also exposed the Ravens' vulnerability to speed- they're big and physical, but not particularly fast. Kaepernick could've ran wild had Jim utilized a smarter gameplan in the first half, and Gore and Davis could've had big days in the receiving game. As it stands, there were too many missed opportunities and John's superior experience showed itself in the lack of glaring errors compared to Jim. 

 

The above shouldn't be taken as me making excuses for SF, but as a criticism of their game plan. Baltimore played better and deserved the W. 

[House]

Wanna know a crazy fact? The teams the Ravens faced throughout the playoffs were penalized for holding 22 times. The Ravens weren't penalized for holding once.

I don't even believe that.

[jjcolts]

I bet you if John Harbaugh were in Jim's shoes, he wouldn't be doing this.

 

What Jim is doing now is quite selfish. What's done is done. They're not going to call the flag now.

He spoke about this right after LOSING the superbowl, he was emotional I am sure. 

 

He just said that facts, he said

""We didn't play our best game, and the Ravens made a lot of plays and

battled back. They competed to win. But there's no question in my mind

that it was a pass interference, and hold on [Michael] Crabtree on the

last one."

[House]

This is a case of, what do you expect him to say/what do you want to hear?

[Dustin]

I don't even believe that.

It's true! Im on my phone now, but I'll pull up a source later.

[House]

It's true! Im on my phone now, but I'll pull up a source later.

wasn't calling you a liar or anything just so you know.

That's just not even realistic.

[Mameluc]

I wouldn't call that an iffy call.  It seemed like a pretty clear example of holding.  However, I think it's more important for the refs to be consistent than it is for them to follow the rule to the letter and they were letting those plays go all night.

 

It's a little unfortunate and Harbaugh is technically right... but there are routinely much worse calls and non-calls made in the NFL.  This one was at least understandable.

wasnt the ball uncatchable? and therefore a penalty couldnt have happened? i really thought that ball was uncatchable but mexican reportes nerver mentioned it lol

[House]

wasnt the ball uncatchable? and therefore a penalty couldnt have happened? i really thought that ball was uncatchable but mexican reportes nerver mentioned it lol

I don't think that ball was uncatchable by any means.

Though it likely would have been a toe drag catch.