Do You Keep Or Toss Your "cheap" Gold?

[Deano1818]

I am happy the Colts have made some moves on some holes on their roster

It does make one think though..... If these players were great, why did they let them go?

Imagine for a second that you were a GM

I can see letting an average or poor player with a high cap player go.

What i cant see is letting a low cap, high potential, or even average potential player off my squad.

If the cap hit is low...... Whats the risk? (unless you KNOW) the player isnt going to cut it.

We may be picking up some very average players and expecting them to fill some major holes.

I realize that you cannot have stars at every position..... But you dont throw out your "low cost Gold"

I hope that i am wrong, and these players all turn out to be all-pros, but counting on castoffs, usually doesnt pan out

[MAC]

No team has stars at every position, but good teams need contributors at EVERY position. The hope is simply that management is stocking the team for "their" system with suitable depth (and that Pagano and Grigson have a better idea of the potential of someone whom they used to work closely with than the rest of the league does, and that the players in question WERE desired by others but came here because they value Pagano and Grigson). Many players are average in one place, but excel in another depending on what they are asked to do.

In other words, nobody here thinks that we just pulled in a bunch of superstars, but we are reasonably confident that we have a competent 3-4 defensive end at this point, which we probably didn't have before, etc. This all comes down to how well the new management can evaluate talent - just like with any organization. Right now we are all optimistic, but only time will tell.

[ColtJ82]

I am happy the Colts have made some moves on some holes on their roster

It does make one think though..... If these players were great, why did they let them go?

Imagine for a second that you were a GM

I can see letting an average or poor player with a high cap player go.

What i cant see is letting a low cap, high potential, or even average potential player off my squad.

If the cap hit is low...... Whats the risk? (unless you KNOW) the player isnt going to cut it.

We may be picking up some very average players and expecting them to fill some major holes.

I realize that you cannot have stars at every position..... But you dont throw out your "low cost Gold"

I hope that i am wrong, and these players all turn out to be all-pros, but counting on castoffs, usually doesnt pan out

Who are you referring to? We haven't thrown out any low cost gold. If anything, we have purged inflated silver.

Ask Dan Snyder and the Skins how well signing high priced players has worked out.

[Deano1818]

Who are you referring to? We haven't thrown out any low cost gold. If anything, we have purged inflated silver.

Ask Dan Snyder and the Skins how well signing high priced players has worked out.

We havent

I am simply referring to our pickups

And seeing some of the "we are set" comments

We STILL have holes on this OL, even with our pickups.

[ColtJ82]

We havent

I am simply referring to our pickups

And seeing some of the "we are set" comments

We STILL have holes on this OL, even with our pickups.

Oh, we still have major holes.....CB, OL, RB, WR, TE

[chelsea_fc]

I agree that we still have problems on the OL, but considering from what we had last year to this year you'd have to agree it's better. I mean atleast we have guys that were actual starters in the nfl at some point in time, rather than guys we grabbed off of the practice squad.

And with the rest of our pick ups, yes maybe they aren't stars, and no this is far from a complete team, but from what I can tell they are all improvements from what we had last year, and with the limited cap space we had this year, I think thats all you can really ask for.

[Deano1818]

Oh, we still have major holes.....CB, OL, RB, WR, TE

You are correct on OL CB,

I wouldnt view the others as major holes, a need yes but not major holes

To me, its sort of like having your house and the tool shed both on fire.

Which fire do you put out first?

IMHO, you put the house fire out first.

If you are banking your future on a Rookie QB, you protect that asset, first and foremost.

At WR, with Wayne coming back we have a much smaller problem(for now) as I see Collie coming back into form.

The "MUST ADDRESS NOW" list (in order and IMHO)

OL (2 positions). Dont count on career OTs becoming great guards.

NT

CB

Then..... The rest of the team

(i actually like our current RBs)

We may be viewing this list differently, because I view this coming season as a "throwaway" season

We are not going to be great, we are not going to be good........ We will be learning a new offense and a new defense

Lets build for the long haul........ Protect that franchise QB with a good OL (which sparks a decent

running game) and limits the Number of times he gets hammered

When we draft in the top 10 next year we can look for the gamechanger WR or NT

[ColtsPRIDE11]

And I'd like to add that Redding may turn out to be gold...if you are Baltimore and you have to choose to play Ed Reed--proven greatness--or a young guy like Cory Redding, who are you going to choose? You choose Reed everytime, until Reed shows signs of age and/or injury. Redding could end up to be a great asset. I trust that Pagano knows what he is doing there.

Agreed that we have many more holes to fill, but I do think there are people getting more optimistic with the resignings and the guys we have brought in. I like seeing the optimism as opposed to the overwhelming negativity we had been seeing. I'm glad fans are starting to get excited again.

I can't wait to see who Grigson and Pagano want to get to fill in the rest of our team--either in FA or in the draft...hoping our two guys keep their noses to the ground and sniff out talent...

[Deano1818]

And I'd like to add that Redding may turn out to be gold...if you are Baltimore and you have to choose to play Ed Reed--proven greatness--or a young guy like Cory Redding, who are you going to choose? You choose Reed everytime, until Reed shows signs of age and/or injury. Redding could end up to be a great asset. I trust that Pagano knows what he is doing there.

Agreed that we have many more holes to fill, but I do think there are people getting more optimistic with the resignings and the guys we have brought in. I like seeing the optimism as opposed to the overwhelming negativity we had been seeing. I'm glad fans are starting to get excited again.

I can't wait to see who Grigson and Pagano want to get to fill in the rest of our team--either in FA or in the draft...hoping our two guys keep their noses to the ground and sniff out talent...

I hope you are right about Redding.

I am sad the "old guard" is changing, but i am very excited to see the team build around A great potential QB.

I just dont expect it to happen overnight.

[Deano1818]

It is about time for Chris Rucker and Kevin Thomas to start playing some football.......

That might help the cause

And what the heck happened to Antonio Johnson And Fila Moala?

These two bombed this year..... If they could get back to prior form,

They could help as well

[ColtsPRIDE11]

I hope you are right about Redding.

I am sad the "old guard" is changing, but i am very excited to see the team build around A great potential QB.

I just dont expect it to happen overnight.

No one in Colts nation did, but alas we find ourselves here. I've come to realize that we will always have the memories of the great years the "old guard" has given us. I have also realized that by embracing our new franchise QB and the newbies we are bringing in I am in no way disrepecting those memories or those guys--I think this is something many Colts fans are struggling with.

It is sad, but a reality that I have come to realize (albeit over more time than most due to the conversations I've had on Colts.com throughout last season) is for the best for our team--the Colts.

[Deano1818]

No one in Colts nation did, but alas we find ourselves here. I've come to realize that we will always have the memories of the great years the "old guard" has given us. I have also realized that by embracing our new franchise QB and the newbies we are bringing in I am in no way disrepecting those memories or those guys--I think this is something many Colts fans are struggling with.

It is sad, but a reality that I have come to realize (albeit over more time than most due to the conversations I've had on Colts.com throughout last season) is for the best for our team--the Colts.

Nothing goes on forever.

We had a great ride for many years...... Should have had more SB wins.... But in the past.

I was giving grief to some of my pats fan friends.... They are 1-2 years from where we are now.....

They dont get it.....

[betheafan41]

Pags and Grigs are building this team up for their 3-4 defensive scheme and bringing in offensive players to welcome luck into the NFL in a comftorble way. i like how they brought in Redding, means mathis is moving to OLB. which would be very good. Mathis against a TE is scary for a QB. lookout brady, here comes mathis. ijust wish the colts would make a run at McClain the LB from baltimore. bring him in and the colts would only need to find a NT for the front 7. Garay would be good too

[ColtsPRIDE11]

Nothing goes on forever.

We had a great ride for many years...... Should have had more SB wins.... But in the past.

I was giving grief to some of my pats fan friends.... They are 1-2 years from where we are now.....

They dont get it.....

They will in time...and we'll be well on our way to a SB

[MAC]

And I'd like to add that Redding may turn out to be gold...if you are Baltimore and you have to choose to play Ed Reed--proven greatness--or a young guy like Cory Redding, who are you going to choose? You choose Reed everytime, until Reed shows signs of age and/or injury. Redding could end up to be a great asset. I trust that Pagano knows what he is doing there.

It certainly looks like Redding is exactly what our Dline needs as it transitions to a 3-4, but what does that have to do with Reed?

We have no choice but to trust the GM and coach - as always - until they give us reason not to. There is very little basis to come to any conclusion based on their track records. The one that we're really trusting is Irsay. Lets hope he did all his homework.

[schwamm]

And I'd like to add that Redding may turn out to be gold...if you are Baltimore and you have to choose to play Ed Reed--proven greatness--or a young guy like Cory Redding, who are you going to choose? You choose Reed everytime, until Reed shows signs of age and/or injury. Redding could end up to be a great asset. I trust that Pagano knows what he is doing there.

Agreed that we have many more holes to fill, but I do think there are people getting more optimistic with the resignings and the guys we have brought in. I like seeing the optimism as opposed to the overwhelming negativity we had been seeing. I'm glad fans are starting to get excited again.

I can't wait to see who Grigson and Pagano want to get to fill in the rest of our team--either in FA or in the draft...hoping our two guys keep their noses to the ground and sniff out talent...

Prolly just nitpicking, but Redding and Reed play different positions. You prolly meant choice between Zibs and Reed.

[Corndog]

Getting average free agent players is part of rebuilding. The thing about the Colts, as most of us know, there are alot of holes on this team. They need to fill alot of holes, that the draft just won't fill or will take time. So we need these type of players to fill the gaps until better players are available or drafted players are ready. Also as others have said, no team has superstars on every position. Hopefully this team can draft some quality players to fill the gaps left by Saturday, Clark, Bullitt, Garcon and the other handful of players that are gone. This may not look like anything to get excited about, but these days all good all around teams win championships, not the team with the most star players. It is why the Eagles failed and Redskins consistently fail, they like to sign star players while not focusing as much on building a complete team. Luck probably won't be as good as Manning, but I atleast would like to see a better all around team this time around. It will give this team more of a chance to consistently compete.

[ColtsPRIDE11]

Schwamm, you are right, I found myself confused this morning. Thx for the correction. That is something I know, but my St Patty's day celebrating seems to have had me fuzzy this morning.

MAC, yes we have to trust that Irsay did his homework in making the decision to hir Grigson and Pagano, but as of right now I am trusting Grigson and Pagano to know what they're doing b/c they're the ones making roster calls, not Irsay.

[WoolMagnet]

We havent

I am simply referring to our pickups

And seeing some of the "we are set" comments

We STILL have holes on this OL, even with our pickups.

RELAX!

free agency just started, better deals will come after the initial rush.

PS, you do realize we have the draft coming soon, don't you.

And we'll have opportunities later when cuts are made around the league.

Rome wasn't built in a day. What more do you think could have been done. Really.

[ColtsPRIDE11]

Prolly just nitpicking, but Redding and Reed play different positions. You prolly meant choice between Zibs and Reed.

It certainly looks like Redding is exactly what our Dline needs as it transitions to a 3-4, but what does that have to do with Reed?

Ok, so I had myself all confused this morning, but I have since refamiliarized myself with the Ravens roster. You are right, Reed and Zbikowski (whom we have now picked up) are Safeties, whereas Redding is a DE. I do apologize for the incorrect reference. The point I was trying to make is that w/ how awesome the Ravens defense is, just b/c Redding isn't a household name does not mean that he is not a good defensive player. I suspect that the Ravens have a deep defensive roster. I also have liked what I have seen Pagano do w/ the defense while in Baltimore, and if he says Redding is worth bringing onto our team, then I will trust his judgement and hope that Redding does good things for us. Just like I will trust him in bringing in Zbikowski.

Overall, we have just begun FA and many more players will be brought in. (I'm gonna preface my next statement by saying that this in no way is directed at either of you two guys.) It gets under my skin when people say "what are we doing bringing in someone elses leftovers or cast offs." We haven't seen what these players can do with our team, with our system. We don't know how they are in practice. We don't know their work ethic. We don't know their capabilities. But we should trust that our Head Coach and our GM would have a better idea about these things than we do. I hope that Redding comes in and meshes with Mathis and Angerer along with our other defensive players and puts our opponents on their backsides. I want to see a defense that ATTACKS!

I am excited about the moves we are making and the direction we are taking. Can't wait to see what moves are next.

[Scott Pennock]

The important thing to remember about sports and structuring a team is that sometimes players "click" with a group of guys better...........or under certain coaches better..........it's not that they were not talented, sometimes they just needed the right situation to finally "get it"!

Look at our very own Jeff Saturday...............went undrafted, was cut and we picked him up off the scrap heap. I am sure you recognize that he turned out to be pretty darn good for A LOT of years here in Indy!

The moral of the story is, just because they didn't work out in someone else's system, or with that coaching staff.............that doesn't mean they can't work in ours!

[MAC]

Ok, so I had myself all confused this morning, but I have since refamiliarized myself with the Ravens roster. You are right, Reed and Zbikowski (whom we have now picked up) are Safeties, whereas Redding is a DE. I do apologize for the incorrect reference. The point I was trying to make is that w/ how awesome the Ravens defense is, just b/c Redding isn't a household name does not mean that he is not a good defensive player. I suspect that the Ravens have a deep defensive roster. I also have liked what I have seen Pagano do w/ the defense while in Baltimore, and if he says Redding is worth bringing onto our team, then I will trust his judgement and hope that Redding does good things for us. Just like I will trust him in bringing in Zbikowski.

Overall, we have just begun FA and many more players will be brought in. (I'm gonna preface my next statement by saying that this in no way is directed at either of you two guys.) It gets under my skin when people say "what are we doing bringing in someone elses leftovers or cast offs." We haven't seen what these players can do with our team, with our system. We don't know how they are in practice. We don't know their work ethic. We don't know their capabilities. But we should trust that our Head Coach and our GM would have a better idea about these things than we do. I hope that Redding comes in and meshes with Mathis and Angerer along with our other defensive players and puts our opponents on their backsides. I want to see a defense that ATTACKS!

I am excited about the moves we are making and the direction we are taking. Can't wait to see what moves are next.

I wasn't trying to bring attention to your very minor misstatement, I was just curious whether there was something I was missing (couldn't pay Redding because had to pay Reed or whatever). Otherwise I would have just assumed you meant guy from Notre Dame whose name I'm not going to bother looking up, and ignored it.

And I agree with your second paragraph, and have defended the same point myself. I'm not interested in seeing the Colts bring in an overpaid collection of "stars", they just need to find reasonably talented people who fit the system and work hard.

[braveheartcolt]

You are correct on OL CB,

I wouldnt view the others as major holes, a need yes but not major holes

To me, its sort of like having your house and the tool shed both on fire.

Which fire do you put out first?

IMHO, you put the house fire out first.

If you are banking your future on a Rookie QB, you protect that asset, first and foremost.

At WR, with Wayne coming back we have a much smaller problem(for now) as I see Collie coming back into form.

The "MUST ADDRESS NOW" list (in order and IMHO)

OL (2 positions). Dont count on career OTs becoming great guards.

NT

CB

Then..... The rest of the team

(i actually like our current RBs)

We may be viewing this list differently, because I view this coming season as a "throwaway" season

We are not going to be great, we are not going to be good........ We will be learning a new offense and a new defense

Lets build for the long haul........ Protect that franchise QB with a good OL (which sparks a decent

running game) and limits the Number of times he gets hammered

When we draft in the top 10 next year we can look for the gamechanger WR or NT

Hey Deano, you seem to have an over-active space bar.......

[mvbighead]

Why are we collecting these players you ask? Simple. We're changing to a new scheme, so we have very little to start from.

If you think Baltimore let Corey Redding go, I have news for you. His contract ended. At that point, he is free to negotiate with whomever he wants. As the Colts hired his former DC to be their head coach, and the defensive system will match what he just played, it would make plenty of sense for him to follow that coach. There are opportunities galore on this roster for people to take starting positions. Not so much on the Ravens.

In any case, I disagree with the logic some people have in reference to a bottom dwellar team that is rebuilding acquiring veterans. We need to a veteran presence. Young players and rookies especially need to see what others have experienced in the NFL. We're not going to start winning over night, but there is a legitimate chance that we could win 5 or more games next year. The team needs to produce a profit, and they won't do that by sitting on their thumbs and watching all the free agents go elsewhere. If they were to do that, many fans would be displeased, and likely show that with their wallets.

What I am seeing is a team that is trying to get back in it. It won't happen instantly, but the moves they have made are solid ones. Moves that add talent to the roster and competition at various spots. It sets us up to improve in the future.

What are you seeing that is so wrong?

[ruksak]

Hey Deano, you seem to have an over-active space bar.......

That's Oldunclemark's posting style. No paragraphs, straight sentences only. I'll take it over the guys that never use a period or capitalization.

[MR. Blueblood]

The patience of some people amaze me. Can't wait long enough to see this process through.

I for one have liked the moves made so far and it's encouraging to me to see what Grigson and Pagano are starting to put together. They aren't trying to take square players and force them into a round hole, they're trying to get the right guys for the right positions. Whether they are another teams "cheap gold" or not, if they can play in our system that's all that matters to me. Really excited to see what we do in the draft in about a month!

On a slightly different note, has anybody heard of any offers made to any of our "not so cheap gold" we tossed away (Brackett, Clark, Bullitt, or Addai)? I haven't seen or heard anything about them so I was just wondering

[braveheartcolt]

That's Oldunclemark's posting style. No paragraphs, straight sentences only. I'll take it over the guys that never use a period or capitalization.

i totally agree i like fast moving bullet point type responses rather a than lack of fulls stops etc but i also get a bit narky when the post takes up a full a3 know what i mean anyway off topic sorry

[ruksak]

On a slightly different note, has anybody heard of any offers made to any of our "not so cheap gold" we tossed away (Brackett, Clark, Bullitt, or Addai)? I haven't seen or heard anything about them so I was just wondering

Sure haven't. Addai will command a good deal and will likely have the clout to chose between a few offers. Same for Clark. Brackett I see going to a 4-3 team (bears?) in need of a cover-2 LB, but at a far cheaper price than he garnered on his last contract.

Bullit? That guy is wearing the scarlet letter of 'injury prone'. Any team would be a fool to sign him. I threw a fit when we signed him last year after his injury issues, especially considering whom he was replacing. That right there was stoooopid. He won't be in the league in 2 years, I assure you.

[Deano1818]

RELAX!

free agency just started, better deals will come after the initial rush.

PS, you do realize we have the draft coming soon, don't you.

And we'll have opportunities later when cuts are made around the league.

Rome wasn't built in a day. What more do you think could have been done. Really.

I actually am relaxed..... My post is responding to others post

I like what has happened so far for rebuilding......

After so many years of a disaster of an OL...... Covered up by manning....

[Deano1818]

Hey Deano, you seem to have an over-active space bar.......

LOL........ I dont know about you, but I hate when people block everything together..... It takes longer to pickout the key points.

I WILL promise to make everything in one runon sentence paragraph type

[Deano1818]

So i really like the colts they are very good, and did you see how they played footballlast year, wasnt that grand i alsovery much like our coaching staff theywill be very good this year have you noticed that the new turf is actually less green than regular turff the bears are going to bea good football this year i bet we take luck with the first pick

Better?