Getting Barkley and Nelson possible

[horseshoecrabs]

23 hours ago, Indy Fan said:

How many rings do Peyton and James have together?

 Bob Griese  won rings with Larry czonka  &  Jim Kick  & Mercury Morris. How Many did Dan Marino win

[horseshoecrabs]

12 hours ago, bleed blue 4 life said:

Barkley is the highest rated player in the draft per Kipper , I think with the cap money we have in place we can address some of what we need in free agency , Lets see what happens there first and then we can see where we stand . Ballard will be after o lineman I am sure and maybe a linebacker before the draft gets here , I just think Barlley gives us a threat we don't have now and desperately need , In my opinion TY is not a number one , more of a slot man . We need another playmaker 

Kipper & Polian have the Browns picking a  QB 1,  & Barkley at 4  with us passing on Barkley and taking an edge rusher (Chubb) at 3 the giants a QB at 2 

[Lucky Colts Fan]

On 1/17/2018 at 7:36 PM, Nesjan3 said:

I have been thinking a lot about these two, both great players and both would fill huge gaping holes on our team (assuming Gore is gone). I dont believe drafting a Guard in the top 10 is realistic, which got me thinking what if we were to use our #3 pick on Barkley and somehow trade back up in to the first round to aquire Nelson, do you think if he is still available at say..20-25, we try to make a move, that would be a huge boost for the team if we could get both of these guys. What would it take?

 

Unfortunately, this year the two elite blue-chip guys are a RB and a G.  Any other year, when there are blue-chip QBs, WRs, and Offensive Tackles, guys like Barkley and Nelson might fall far enough that the Colts could pick up both.

 

But traditional logic says we try to get one of them and continue accumulating draft-capital for the future.  Trading down to get Nelson and extra picks over the next few drafts would be ideal.

 

As much as I like Barkley, he's like the sports car we can't afford yet.  We need to get that solid pick-em-up truck in Nelson and build the foundation.

[Bleedin Blue]

1 hour ago, Andrew Luck fan club said:

How many rings did Adrian and the Vikings get? How many playoff wins did they get? David Johnson was picked in the 3rd round?  Terrible example. 

 

I'm not talking about DJ...and this isn't tennis, this is football.  One player doesn't equal Superbowls.  Not even a quarterback can do that.  Case in point, Peyton Manning.   My point is that teams should pick the BPA regardless of the position.  It's laughable to think that talent should be skipped because it might be had in later rounds.  

 

We may disagree on who BPA is at #3 but great defensive players can be found in later rounds also.  Making it out that drafting a RB in RD1 means that the defense has to be neglected is just misdirection.

[Andrew Luck fan club]

Just now, Bleedin Blue said:

 

I'm not talking about DJ...and this isn't tennis, this is football.  One player doesn't equal Superbowls.  Not even a quarterback can do that.  Case in point, Peyton Manning.   My point is that teams should pick the BPA regardless of the position.  It's laughable to think that talent should be skipped because it might be had in later rounds.  

 

We may disagree on who BPA is at #3 but great defensive players can be found in later rounds also.  Making it out that drafting a RB in RD1 means that the defense has to be neglected is just misdirection.

Our defense is bad. We need to start adding blue chip players.  Im taking the great pass rusher over the great RB. The need is bigger and the value is more. 

 

I’d take Joey Bosa over Zeke Elliott. I guess we can just agree to disagree. 

[BleedBlu8792]

8 minutes ago, Bleedin Blue said:

 

I'm not talking about DJ...and this isn't tennis, this is football.  One player doesn't equal Superbowls.  Not even a quarterback can do that.  Case in point, Peyton Manning.   My point is that teams should pick the BPA regardless of the position.  It's laughable to think that talent should be skipped because it might be had in later rounds.  

 

We may disagree on who BPA is at #3 but great defensive players can be found in later rounds also.  Making it out that drafting a RB in RD1 means that the defense has to be neglected is just misdirection.

 

This was exactly Matt Millens approach when he was GM with the Lions.. I'm surprised he made it out alive when he was canned in Detroit.

[jcwcoltsfan]

54 minutes ago, BleedBlu8792 said:

 

This was exactly Matt Millens approach when he was GM with the Lions.. I'm surprised he made it out alive when he was canned in Detroit.

 

Except Matt Millen never picked the best player available lol.  Most GM's go by this rule and by "best player available" they still mean within reason.  Obviously, you wouldn't draft a QB with a young healthy Andrew Luck.

[Surge89]

1 hour ago, Andrew Luck fan club said:

Our defense is bad. We need to start adding blue chip players.  Im taking the great pass rusher over the great RB. The need is bigger and the value is more. 

 

I’d take Joey Bosa over Zeke Elliott. I guess we can just agree to disagree. 

 

I strongly disagree with this first sentence. The ILB are bad.  Laughable bad.  But the rest of the defense is very good save the average to below average OLB.

 

Also your Bosa over Elliot is nonsensical as your are making a projection without any real data.  For example Barkley might be the next Ladanian Tomlinson and Chubb might be the next Dee Ford (just examples).  In that scenario are you still taking the pass rusher no matter what?  

 

I'm very high on Barkley but if Chubb tests even close to elite athleticism I'm taking Chubb mainly due to proof the quality is equal between the players.  If he doesn't I'm still thinking long and hard about taking Fitzpatrick, or Barkley since most likely that will be the other prospect who will have elite measurable as well.

 

The point of the draft is to take players of special talent.  I'm against this notion of must take this position because it's coveted when scouting says that player isn't a blue chip player.  Is Chubb a blue chip player?  We don't know yet because we need data on his athleticism. 

 

Another player I'd like to mention is Smith.  As per the usual of this forum everyone sees ILB and says no way but he may be one of the very few true blue chip prospect in this draft.  Especially if Chubb happens to not test well and Fitzpatrick looks to be more safety than corner.  But an ILB who is a 3 down player and can play those 3 downs at an elite level is worth any pick to me. 

 

All in all unless the players are equal in quality, position shouldn't have any say on draft stock. 

[Andrew Luck fan club]

11 minutes ago, Surge89 said:

 

I strongly disagree with this first sentence. The ILB are bad.  Laughable bad.  But the rest of the defense is very good save the average to below average OLB.

 

Also your Bosa over Elliot is nonsensical as your are making a projection without any real data.  For example Barkley might be the next Ladanian Tomlinson and Chubb might be the next Dee Ford (just examples).  In that scenario are you still taking the pass rusher no matter what?  

 

I'm very high on Barkley but if Chubb tests even close to elite athleticism I'm taking Chubb mainly due to proof the quality is equal between the players.  If he doesn't I'm still thinking long and hard about taking Fitzpatrick, or Barkley since most likely that will be the other prospect who will have elite measurable as well.

 

The point of the draft is to take players of special talent.  I'm against this notion of must take this position because it's coveted when scouting says that player isn't a blue chip player.  Is Chubb a blue chip player?  We don't know yet because we need data on his athleticism. 

 

Another player I'd like to mention is Smith.  As per the usual of this forum everyone sees ILB and says no way but he may be one of the very few true blue chip prospect in this draft.  Especially if Chubb happens to not test well and Fitzpatrick looks to be more safety than corner.  But an ILB who is a 3 down player and can play those 3 downs at an elite level is worth any pick to me. 

 

All in all unless the players are equal in quality, position shouldn't have any say on draft stock. 

We don’t have any ILBs. Our corners are question marks. Our safeties are question marks from injury. Our best pass rusher had 5.5 sacks and is 29 years old. I wouldn’t call it a good defense. 

 

And those are bad examples lol. The most important trait for a RB is vision, and Barkley’s sure isn’t elite. Calling him LT is laughable. Dee Ford is an off ball backer lol. 

 

Chubb is a blue chip player, same as Joey Bosa was. I use Bosa because they’re similar.  The combine doesn’t tell you how good a player is... .  The tape does, his hand usage, power and bend at his size is why he’s gonna be special. 

 

Smith isn’t going top 3. Barkley is bad draft strategy. 

 

Just wrong. Position does matter. If Luck never got hurt, and a QB was BPA at 3, do you take the QB? No obviously not. If Chubb and Barkley are ranked at all similar, you take the *way* more valuable position. 

[Indy Fan]

11 hours ago, horseshoecrabs said:

 Bob Griese  won rings with Larry czonka  &  Jim Kick  & Mercury Morris. How Many did Dan Marino win

That’s a good point considering majority of Marino’s days in Miami his defense was poorly ranked. He never had a great defense best they ever assembled was middle of the pack. In the current state of the league you need to have a great defense in order to get the ring. Offense heavy teams could do it in the 20th century but in the 21st century the odds are heavily against you.

[BleedBlu8792]

13 hours ago, jcwcoltsfan said:

 

Except Matt Millen never picked the best player available lol.  Most GM's go by this rule and by "best player available" they still mean within reason.  Obviously, you wouldn't draft a QB with a young healthy Andrew Luck.

That was his (Millens) evaluation. He believed WR's were his "BPA" 2 out of 3 years picking from the top spot. He obviously didn't consider the state of his team when making those picks. I'm well aware of the "thinking" behind the evaluation of players during draft time, and again in my opinion, utility players (WR's and RB's) should have little consideration early on. 

[Track Guy]

Unless something medical happens with Nelson, it's really hard for me to envision him falling out of the top 15. Barkley will be a good NFL player imo but #3 is a bit rich for a running back in today's NFL.

[LJpalmbeacher2]

On 1/17/2018 at 7:36 PM, Nesjan3 said:

I have been thinking a lot about these two, both great players and both would fill huge gaping holes on our team (assuming Gore is gone). I dont believe drafting a Guard in the top 10 is realistic, which got me thinking what if we were to use our #3 pick on Barkley and somehow trade back up in to the first round to aquire Nelson, do you think if he is still available at say..20-25, we try to make a move, that would be a huge boost for the team if we could get both of these guys. What would it take?

I dont know where Nelson will fall too, But any idea to get the Best Player in the Draft (Barkley) sounds good to me.

[LJpalmbeacher2]

On 1/18/2018 at 9:34 PM, horseshoecrabs said:

Kipper & Polian have the Browns picking a  QB 1,  & Barkley at 4  with us passing on Barkley and taking an edge rusher (Chubb) at 3 the giants a QB at 2 

Wel now that takes all the drama out of watching. I guess I'll watch reruns of Big Bang Theory on draft night  

[CopenhagenColt]

Barkley is still only a human. Unless we improve our O-line significantly, it doesn't matter who our RB is.

With the depth of this RB class, I would be unhappy if they pick Bradley.

I still hope they trade down and pick Nelson, who's also "a generational talent". Unless our O-line get fixed, we won't turn things around.

Make Norwell the best paid lineman in the league and draft Nelson, and we'll be set for a long time, and Luck won't get killed. Then pick up a good RB prospect in the second round (remember we'll have traded down, and gotten an extra second rounder for certain).

[horseshoecrabs]

9 hours ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

Wel now that takes all the drama out of watching. I guess I'll watch reruns of Big Bang Theory on draft night  

You probably watch sitcoms anyway judging from your perspicacity & incite.

[Maniac]

Getting Barkley and Nelson but not Chubb.

 

I don't like that.